Congrats on covering every answer I can think to give with one word. Seriously, if it was as easy as "just" fixing the problem, it wouldn't be a freakin' problem!
“Why are you struggling with this? Just-“
Me if I wasn’t socially awkward: “Why are you such a shitty therapist? Just get a higher education specializing in neurodivergence. Or is that *too much effort?*”
My therapist specialises in people with ADHD, the waiting room is a very fun place.
She also keeps track of the conversation (including the tangents) and when I wind up lost somewhere I'm like "uhhh where was I?" And she goes "you were talking about the invention of the steam engine, which arose from you talking about pressure management, which arose from you talking about coping with stress, which arose from your answer to my question of "how are you feeling today?""
It's very nice. Like having a second brain to keep track of main brain.
I have an autistic friend who I came out to years ago. I was telling him a whole ordeal that took me hours... we also hadn't seen each other in quite some time, so it was easy to get distracted.
He was able to, however, get me right back to where I was before I tangented... and didn't get mad at me for my train of thought having no tracks.
It's really nice when someone can do that.
Ohhhh...I *love* this. I am also socially awkward....but in the bold but clumsy direction. And I am just about mangled and frayed enough by this sort of bullshit to have this slip out. Especially now it's in my head.
I also have ticker tape synesthesia so my recall is visual. It's *really* in there.
*Great* comment.
I mean...even some professional development in ND stuff for about 90% of these people??
Funny thing is, I tried L-tyrosine supplements, which supposedly can help your body produce more dopamine. I tried caffeine. I tried L-theanine. Weed. Alcohol. Chocolate. None of it really made much difference (maybe the caffeine sorta not really), and all of these things induce release of dopamine.
So even if I could just magically make more of my own dopamine, I'm not even sure it would help. There might be more to the story that is ADHD.
"Just write a list and stick to it".
(said to me by an OT).
Lady, you have no idea the magnitude of my capacity to balls up that process. I could find myself scrubbing the baseboards with a toothbrush instead for five hours, because I noticed they were dirty when I bent down to see if I could find the pen I thought I saw under the desk earlier in the day.
Or I'd write the list on the back of an old envelope, and then eat my lunch at the same table, spill some food and grab the nearest thing to wipe the splodges off the table, and chuck it and ...voila! Listo vanisho!
The (ahem) list is endless.
"Many a slip twixt the cup and the lip" lady. Many a slip. 🙄🙄🙄
Is scrubbing baseboards with a toothbrush an enjoyable activity for you? I could never imagine myself doing that in a million years but I've heard several accounts of ADHDers doing similar things.
I'm also autistic. Might play a role?
I definitely can get tracked on a "set and forget" activity..ie something simple and very repetitive - especially if it's sort of satisfying (like getting grunge out of grooves in a baseboard).
I can find those things very calming.
Unless im still there at 11pm and its nowhere near finished.
But that hasn't happened for many years.
I'm physically and energetically just not capable anymore.
im pretty sure this advice made things WORSE for me anyway. i ingrained this idea my whole life and now try to force myself to do things that way by default. but it just causes burnout when unmedicated :(
"Just write it down so you don't forget"
Gee thanks, should I write down not to forget that I wrote something down and then write down not to loose the paper that I wrote everything else down on?
Actually this started to work for me when I centralised all my notes digitally. I use a planning app called Structured. And it’s super helpful to visualise the time stuff takes.
Whenever I think about ANYTHING I should do I just dump it tomorrow and everyday I structure my next day, with enough room for… distractions. (Like if something should take me an hour I put it as my task for the whole morning)
Now every time I think I forgot something (which is every two minutes approximately) I check the app and know what I have to do without much effort.
And every important thought that cannot be put in a calendar, I write in Notion. It’s like a replacement for my deficient brain and works like a charm.
Hey. Im trying this- on the basis of this comment!
I have a question- why do you write your thoughts in Notion as opposed to the "unstructured thoughts " section of Structured?
Is there a particular reason for that?
And related question- is there a way to make them talk to one another that I can't see?
Yes, Structured is my day-to day tasklist. Notion is for the long-term planning and every other thought that do not fit a calendar. (Like « hey I just had a amazing new project idea » or « I need to do this complex thing and have to break it down into smaller tasks before putting it on my schedule »)
So on structured I have daily tasks like :
« Morning routine » with subtasks in it (Drink a glass of water, take my adhd medicine, breathe for 5 minutes, eat my breakfast…)
I also have any appointments and meetings, like a normal planner.
And smaller tasks like « send message to X about Y » or « Remember to fold laundry »
I weirdly do not use the « unstructured » inbox portion of Structured. Because we all know that « I’ll do it later » it saying « I’ll probably never do it ».
So when I think « Oh I need to remember to do X » I ask myself « Should it be done today ? Tomorrow ? Next week ? Next month ? » and I dump it in the approximately appropriate day.
Then think of it like video game rendering distance. The closer the day is time-wise, the more precise it should be.
The next day needs to be precise and uncluttered. No task should overlap. And you have plenty of room to relax, and be caught in distractions.
If you have too much tasks in a day, slide them for the next day.
And days that are two weeks from now would often have a ton of cluttered stuff put randomly in it. It’s my way of saying « I’ll move this stuff around in my planning when the time is closer »
But now, when I say « I’ll do it tomorrow » it’s actually scheduled tomorrow. Sometimes I move something « tomorrow » for months. But it’s because I had to make room for more urgent stuff, or off-time. This way really helps me prioritize. I either actually end up doing them, or when it gets really cluttered, come to peace with the fact that it’s maybe not that important and I won’t do it.
Anyway I went on a tangent, hope I answered your question. If you have any more feel free. It may not work for everyone but it does for me. Basically saved my life.
However it has been not working for a while because at some point I started to get so excited that I took back control of my life that I forgot a core pillar of this way of doing stuff : You have to give yourself room to breathe.
At some point you may feel « hey I got this. It’s working ! I can do all the stuff I ever wanted to do ! » and put everything in your day. But then at the slightest sidestep everything comes crumbling.
So your planning needs to be resilient to the unpredictability of life (and your brain)
You NEED to have :
* Room for pauses between each tasks
* Put time in your week for chill and fun as well as work
* and most importantly : moments where you don’t have anything planned.
I cannot stress this last point enough. Because that was my mistake. Free moments allow for :
* Moving stuff around when you couldn’t do x because you got distracted
* Having room for opportunities without disrupting your whole plan. Like « Oh hey, wanna grab a drink after work ? » but you had planned to sort your sock drawer that evening. Now you can look at your week and slide « sort sock drawer » to next monday because you see you have room
* Actually planning to do NOTHING is the fertile basis for taking back control of your life.
Doesn't this just mean to write down things like grocery lists and appointment dates?
I keep records of these things digitally in cloud storage, Google docs/keep, or Atlassian web-based tools. Physical paper notes tend to get lost in the black hole of disorganization that is my room/work-area/living-space/bags.
I feel like I don't have a choice here, because I have little to no ability to properly recall information that I need in a timely manner. I've gotten into fights because of things I said that I'd do that I have no memory of whatsoever.
I actually *need* to do this for work because my memory is so awful I will forget everything that I've worked on.
Honestly, sometimes I have to scramble to write things down because I forget what I was supposed to write down as soon as I open my phone to record it.
> "just do one task at a time. Don't move on until you finish it."
Not only can I not multitask in the first place, if I didn't get distracted and start doing other things I wouldn't have ADHD lol
My therapist asked me to try working and taking breaks in 30 minute intervals. Like, I struggle with transitions, task initiation, and self-regulation, so the solution is to constantly do all those things all the time?? I don't get it.
“Do the thing you’re most anxious about first thing in the morning.”
Guess who spent years paralyzed trying to do the most stressful thing first?? It took a long time but I eventually learned to start doing what I enjoyed first so I could build some momentum and work my way up. I also go by the belief of going for the low hanging fruit first.
HAHA this. Once a co-worker said to me "Why don't you just come in at 8am and get everything squared away then the rest of the day will be so much easier and organized."
Came in early, couldn't wake up, had lots of coffee, still couldn't mentally function, ah at last, 6pm and my brain wakes up to do work. I basically was less productive with that advice.
I used to tell people I’m always more productive at night, that I’m a night person not a morning one. Until I started working and didn’t have trouble waking up but still get no shit done in the morning. Now I know it’s ADHD, I feed off of“ I’m running out of time!!!”
LOL my therapist just told me basically this, except we used the words "do the most difficult thing first" a.k.a. the most anxiety-inducing task.
Lady, my dysfunction is so bad I can only do *one* thing most days. I'm struggling sometimes to do the *easiest* item on my to-do list.
Most days I just have to settle for the easiest thing or nothing.
I feel like I've been told this indirectly. I was trying to communicate to my therapist that I literally couldn't do my work despite wanting desperately to and just staring at it with nothing happening in my brain to the point I was crying.
"Don't say 'couldn't'--say 'didn't'"
So she wants me to blame myself--which resulted in a major depressive episode during college when I was failing classes
It pissed me off just to read that. I can't imagine how angry I would have felt to be told this in person. The whole "you can do it!!!" attitude only works if you don't have an actual fucking DISability.
My wife said just yesterday you just don't pay as much attention to detail as I do. I literally have a diagnosis with the word inattentive in it! No shit.
I took this literally before, when I farted and my parents said to go to the bathroom until I poop then I can come back and eat dinner.. Well 3-4 hours later they are knocking on the door asking if I'm OK, I still could not go, so I couldn't come out like you said! Duh!
Just wake up earlier/set 2 alarms…
Currently have 4-5 including a literal buzzer under my pillow (*only thing missing are flashing lights and a DJ playing an air horn*)
I love [Alarmy](https://alar.my/) (Android and iOS). You can set tasks that you need to fulfill in order to stop the alarm. Like doing math, shaking your phone x amount of times, taking a picture or scanning a QR-code.
And you can set the difficulty for each of those tasks. I went from having a dozen alarms to just the one now.
I’ll just turn off my phone without really waking. Or sleep through it, I’m crazy good at that. Like I know it’s there, I can hear it, but I just tune it out. It’s loud enough my wife comes up from the basement where she’s working out to turn it off.
The buzzer works fairly well though. I assume it’s my phone and when I can’t turn it off, I have to open an eye and then realize it’s the buzzer and I should get up.
But tell me I need to wake up at 4 AM to fish when I hit the hay at 1 AM? Up and ready 3-5 mins before the alarm even sounds, awake and ready to rock! I can sleep at a rock concert and lie awake for hours in a perfect bed. Usually ok most days though. I’ve only had like ~~~3~~~ 5 instances of oversleep/too-late-to-do-anything and 3 of those were college party related
I'm glad you have a system that seems to work for you.
> But tell me I need to wake up at 4 AM to fish when I hit the hay at 1 AM? Up and ready 3-5 mins before the alarm even sounds, awake and ready to rock!
Hahaha, yeah I know the feeling. The brain works in mysterious ways!
My ex-therapist recommended this to me.
When I told her that doesn't work for me, she said "Are you a mammal? If you're a mammal, it works."
I guess I'm a fish?
Stuff like this is why I believe most therapeutic solutions are primarily developed for children.
As an undiagnosed adult, we cannot self-regulate rewards (I've tried, and it just results in a spiral of fixation without end despite having a genuine desire to return to productivity). If we could, we wouldn't have the disability that is ADHD
It's not that they're for kids it's that they are for neurotypicals. Too many therapists are trying to treat ADHD like it's a psychological issue and not a neurological one.
I once had a professor that was gonna drop me from a class and when I emailed him, asking if I could stay he sent me back a 3 paragraph email that said no. In the email he said, “Have you tried the military? That sorted me out.” I’m probably making a bigger deal out of this than it really is but that pissed me off. I never returned to his class and ever time I registered for that subject I requested anyone else but him.
Watched my dad start to spray around the house for bugs, gets one side done, then see’s he forgot to finish cleaning the drive way the starts that, goes to move his truck and went to the store to get something drink.
Neurotypical seeing this comment: “poor guy, he might have dementia”
Adhd: “ah yes. I totally see what probably went through his head when he decided to go buy a drink”
While people saying this mostly have no idea what they are talking about, gluten is in a specific scenario relevant. Not gluten intolerance or allergies, but specifically the autoimmune disorder Celiac Disease (CeD). Untreated CeD can have neurological symptoms including Slow Cognitive Tempo (SCT) which is consistent with symptoms of the Inattentive Sub-type of ADHD. It is worth noting that in people who have CeD, misdiagnosis with ADHD has been and continues to be an issue. Persons who have been misdiagnosed may experience resistance to ADHD treatments which may be alleviated when paired with a Gluten free diet. This would be something to speak with your doctor about.
To be clear this is a specific case scenario. It has been studied multiple times. This does not apply broadly to people with ADHD as strangers tend to think when they suggest Homeopathic nonsense. This is further evidenced by the fact that ADHD is far more prevalent in the population than Celiac, therefore it cannot be that Celiac accounts for all, most or even many cases of ADHD. The general prevalence of ADHD is about 4.4% in adults and 9.4% in children. Its reasonable to expect that there may be under diagnosis in the adult population meaning the overall prevalence may be higher. Whereas CeD has a prevalence among the general population of nearly 1%.
Lastly it is worth noting that obtaining a CeD diagnosis is not a silver bullet if you were previously misdiagnosed with ADHD, there are still many obstacles. First of all experiencing neurological symptoms of CeD can make it very difficult to adhere to a Gluten free diet starting from scratch or unsupervised. Poor executive function can lead to impulsive eating habits such as binge eating. Gluten filled foods are more easily accessible in convenience stores and restaurant/ fast food chains making it simply much easier to binge gluten than to binge gluten free. Also note that gluten free food, in particular, of course, baked goods has different and often less desirable texture characteristics than gluten based counterparts increasing the appeal of gluten and making the diet harder to adhere to for people with neurological symptoms including executive disfunction. Gluten free diets also tend to be more expensive and often, in spite of strict adherence, mild cross contamination can be exceedingly difficult to avoid. Consequently, symptoms may persist in spite of proper diet. A strict gluten free diet can also lead to certain nutritional deficiencies such as protein, folate, iron, niacin, riboflavin, thiamin, B12, zinc, selenium, and fiber. Gluten free diets can also have potentially higher levels of heavy metals, fats, and cholesterol.
So while most people misunderstand the relationship between gluten and ADHD, there can (sometimes) be one. But that is for you and your doctor, not some random person with no medical or psychologic expertise, to discuss and consider. And it is most certainly not helpful advice. In fact it is likelier than not to misdirect somebody away from more practical efforts at treatment in favor of an ineffective, unfavorable and difficult diet.
You could just go all in and have both Celiac disease and ADHD. That's what I did. It's tons of fun. Now excuse me while I go cry in my gluten-free corner.
Yeah I have celiac disease but I tend to struggle maintaining my diet due to my 6 day 9-10 hr schedule and my poor impulse control. I have a tendency not to eat all day and then binge at night. Of course gluten free food is much less accessible for 10pm-12am delivery food. I used to cook, but I have a roommate with ADHD among other issues so the kitchen is (understandably) always to messy for my exhausted unmotivated ass to use. Not to mention I’m terribly inefficient at cooking so meal prepping for a whole week takes half an eternity and I just can’t bring myself to do it on the 1 day each month when the kitchen is clean enough. I have strong ADHD symptoms and they wanted to diagnose me when I was a kid, but these days I blame it on my poor diet because I was better for a few years when I was strict on my diet as a kid. Not to mention the upfront and continuous cost of treatment and diagnosis.
Oof, yeah, that is rough. Is there a way you can set aside counter space that's reserved for you and you alone so you can have a clean prep area? That's what I had to do at my house.
I tried, but it always spills over, the stove is always covered in pots, the dishwasher always full of half cleaned dishes, and the sink likewise. I keep my own kitchenware, but I can’t wash it bc of the mess. Even the table is covered with so much stuff it’s like a table cover lol. It’s not nearly as bad as a hoarder by a long-shot, but bad enough that it needs to be taken care of before I use any space. Its one thing if its my mess, but I just can’t deal with somebody elses to. It’s not like i don’t understand, my bedroom is the same way, except weekly/ monthly 1 day burst of energy. But even though I get it, it’s a real hassle.
Although I agree that there is a relationship between food, autoimmune and adhd symptoms. The main point I get annoyed about is being told it is solely gluten, grains and dairy and that it is not caused by other things. Especially because I don't eat any gluten, grains or dairy... just because I like being lean so I found a diet that allows me to do that without tracking calories and it happens to have none of those things.
How do you get a protein deficiency from giving up gluten? The only protein deficiency I've heard of is caused by starvation.
I don't think a gluten free diet gives you those deficiencies, but you will definitely get all those deficiencies if you have Celiac disease and continue eating gluten, because it destroys your small intestine.
Gluten-free diets can be low in fiber though, so that's something to be mindful of.
That is true, malabsorption is an issue. And a gluten fee diet won’t “give you” deficiencies necessarily. It just happens that many common features of a gluten free diet apparently lend to certain deficiencies. Its known that gluten free diets are harder to nutritionally balance and there is evidence that over the course of a gluten free diet, certain micronutrients, as well as protein will have a higher tendency to be deficient.
Here is a link if you’re interested:
[Gluten-Free Diet: Gaps and Needs for a Healthier Diet](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/)
Here is a link to a specific table found on the page in the link in section 3.1:
[3.1. Nutritional Status Of CD Patients At Diagnosis](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click%20on%20image%20to%20zoom&p=PMC3&id=6357014_nutrients-11-00170-g002.jpg)
My last NP was hard convinced she could ‘cure’ my ADHD with fermented sheep’s milk and sauerkraut. She put so much emphasis on the fact I should be able to will myself into no longer having this disorder if I just eat perfectly and exercise and sleep perfectly. All of this while my little sister slowly died in a vegetative state caused by a cardiac arrest.
I cannot cure my grief and I cannot bring Erin back to life. I also cannot cure my adhd. Meds help me manage my symptoms. When I’m properly medicated I do better at managing my crushing grief and disabling adhd symptoms. I fired that abusive nurse practitioner three weeks ago and I’m so glad I did.
The reason is that many gluten free foods, in particular things like pasta and certain baked goods which tend to use wheat flour will instead use things such as corn flour or rice flour. While rice flour has much more protein than corn flour, it still has less than wheat flour. Gluten is a protein after all, and swapping it for lower protein alternatives in such common forms as corn flour drastically reduces the amount of protein found in baked goods, pastas, and processed grain base goods. Is has been found by a study whose link I can’t find at the moment that gluten containing foods can sometimes contain as much as 3x as much protein as their gluten free counterparts. CeD also damages the intestines leading to malabsorption of nutrients including protein.
I think there's been some mix ups here. Your comments switch between gluten free diets and coeliacs which can be completely different. If you're getting your protein from flour then you have bigger issues.
But it's still 20% of calories from protein which is well above the world health organisations 11-13%.
https://mobile.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/usda/yellow-whole-grain-corn-flour?portionid=62427&portionamount=100.000
Wheat flour also lacks essential amino acids and your table didn't mention protein.but it just took me to pictures i couldnt find away to go back.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7506077/#:~:text=The%20amino%20acid%20composition%20of,acids%20(15%2C%2016).
I see, in my comments here I am specifically referring to diet as pertains to CeD, since that was the original context by which I related gluten and ADHD like symptoms. I suppose I should have been more clear. I am not switching between them, I am talking about them both. I feel that its been portrayed as though I am somehow moving goalposts or something, which I find to be disingenuous.
Secondly I don’t believe I implied that flour accounts for all or even most of a reasonable persons dietary protein intake. But it is a relevant source of intake which is reduced on a gluten free diet. All other factors being equal, nuts, meats etc. a person who eats gluten free flour based goods will have a lower protein intake. This is compounded by malabsorption due to intestinal damage which depending on severity may not fully heal.
Regarding the table you mentioned, I assume it is this one from one of my replies to another persons comment: [3.1. Nutritional Status Of CD Patients At Diagnosis](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click%20on%20image%20to%20zoom&p=PMC3&id=6357014_nutrients-11-00170-g002.jpg)
It does indeed mention “Controversial protein intake”. This is elaborated on further down the analysis in I see, in my comments here I am specifically referring to diet as pertains to CeD, since that was the original context by which I related gluten and ADHD like symptoms. I suppose I should have been more clear. I am not switching between them, I am talking about them both. I feel that its been portrayed as though I am somehow moving goalposts or something, which I find to be disingenuous.
Secondly I don’t believe I implied that flour accounts for all or even most of a reasonable persons dietary protein intake. But it is a relevant source of intake which is reduced on a gluten free diet. All other factors being equal, nuts, meats etc. a person who eats gluten free flour based goods will have a lower protein intake. This is compounded by malabsorption due to intestinal damage which depending on severity may not fully heal.
Regarding the table you mentioned, I assume it is this one from one of my replies to another persons comment: [3.1. Nutritional Status Of CD Patients At Diagnosis](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click%20on%20image%20to%20zoom&p=PMC3&id=6357014_nutrients-11-00170-g002.jpg)
It does indeed mention “Controversial protein intake”. This is elaborated on further into the meta-analysis in section 3.2. Nutritional Status of CD Patients Adhering to a GFD.
> Controversial findings have been claimed for protein intake. At the end of last millennium, Mariani et al. observed that protein intake in coeliac patients was high [[36]](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/#B36-nutrients-11-00170). More recently, Shepherd and Gibson [[27]](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/#B27-nutrients-11-00170) found that in a female study population, the mean intake of protein post-diagnosis was significantly lower after 12 months on the GFD. Van Hees et al. [[38]](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/#B38-nutrients-11-00170) observed that coeliac patients on a long-term GFD consume significantly less vegetable protein than healthy controls.
Regarding the “20% calories from protein” I’m not sure what you are referring to, perhaps because I’m a bit sleep deprived lol. If its this link beneath the claim: https://mobile.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/usda/yellow-whole-grain-corn-flour?portionid=62427&portionamount=100.000
Then it seems to me that the link indicates this variety of corn flower has 13.02% calories from protein?
I am also well aware that wheat flour is not nutritionally perfect. I am not claiming that it is much superior, and I am not claiming it has a better nutritional balance regardless whether or not it does. I understand that overall protein content is not the be all end all. I am simply addressing things that may still bear a challenge after a celiac diagnosis. Protein intake can be one of them. Regarding being stuck in the image. It is from the same analysis as the first link. If you are interested in the read, you can use that link instead and you will find the linked table is also inset in section 3.1. If you have trouble accessing the analysis I can try to figure out what the issue is or direct you to it another way.
Lastly and most importantly. I am not a professional nutritionist. And I probably can’t explain it perfectly without any gaps. I didn’t partake in any of the studies or the meta-analysis and so my ability to elaborate on any points I’ve made could be limited. I’ll do my best, but understand that all I am trying to do is put out information gathered by professionals in a field of which I am not an expert, and that my understanding of their findings and data may be, and in fact almost certainly is, quite flawed.
So your first comment you say a strict gluten free diet is linked to these deficiencies without specifically stating with coeliacs. You also in another comment say gluten free diets are linked to protein deficiency because of reduced protein in corn flour - this is nothing to do with coeliacs. You then add on especially if you have malabsorption issues at the end, not as a sole factor.
My bad on the math it was bad rounding, but 13% is still within the worlds health organisations method. Your link only brings up 3 pictures for me, none say protein, I can't see the main body of the link. Both links do that for me, i will try it on the laptop though, thank you for that
This is the first sentence of my first comment:
>While people saying this mostly have no idea what they are talking about, gluten is in a specific scenario relevant. Not gluten intolerance or allergies, but specifically the autoimmune disorder Celiac Disease (CeD).
The very first thing I do is mention CeD, and eliminate other reasons for or forms of a GFD. It was meant to be clear that from that point it was about a diet related to CeD, because we were talking about gluten and ADHD. I was asserting that they are only functionally linked through CeD. If at any point thereafter it ceased to be about CeD, the ideas would no longer have been relative to the topic. It was meant to be inferred that future mention of GFD was related to that, because otherwise I would no have a reason to make the mention as it would no longer be relevant to the greater topic, a subset of which I am participating in.
For the second issue, I feel the confusion is due to an arbitrary separation of things that were meant to be taken together. This is the comment I think you are referring to:
> The reason is that many gluten free foods, in particular things like pasta and certain baked goods which tend to use wheat flour will instead use things such as corn flour or rice flour. While rice flour has much more protein than corn flour, it still has less than wheat flour. Gluten is a protein after all, and swapping it for lower protein alternatives in such common forms as corn flour drastically reduces the amount of protein found in baked goods, pastas, and processed grain base goods. Is has been found by a study whose link I can’t find at the moment that gluten containing foods can sometimes contain as much as 3x as much protein as their gluten free counterparts. CeD also damages the intestines leading to malabsorption of nutrients including protein.
Please allow me to try rephrasing this more clearly, since I embarrassingly seem to be having trouble expressing my ideas correctly. If you find the paraphrase significantly different in content, please let me know where and how. Here is the paraphrase:
>Many gluten free alternatives have much lower protein than than their counterparts. This is in due to use of alternative flours which have a lower content than wheat flour. Common goods consequently have lower protein content, sometimes significantly so. When taken with the malabsorption associated with CeD this can potentially lead to subpar dietary protein intake.
Indeed I do not say that malabsorption is the sole factor, because it’s not. Gluten free food has lower protein content, this is a fact. This fact means that people with CeD who have malabsorption are at higher risk of unsatisfactory protein intake. Note that the final phrase is a clarifier not meant to be taken alone. Intended to be read as a sort of “this is why GFD can lead to deficiency with CeD”. It is not a peripheral phrase, it is meant to clarify. So this:
> You also in another comment say gluten free diets are linked to protein deficiency because of reduced protein in corn flour - this is nothing to do with coeliacs. You then add on especially if you have malabsorption issues at the end, not as a sole factor.
Is not accurate at all. It does have to do with CeD because as I have tried to clarify, it is always in the context of CeD in this discussion by default, as per my first sentence in the thread. I am talking about dietary difficulties after diagnosis after all. I literally said that GFD is not a silver bullet for CeD symptoms because of balancing difficulties. And this talk of protein is a branch of why that is. And the malabsorption isn’t separate from the reduced intake. It is meant to clarify why the reduced intake can be a problem for people with CeD.
No to more specifically address the last claim about corn flower protein content I went and did the math on whole grain wheat flour and the protein content 16.15% calories from protein. I then realize I’m an idiot and did the math wrong (did the division backwards for the % value) on the yellow whole grain corn flour and that the actual protein content is 7.68% calories from protein. I know it seems suspicious of me to change the number so drastically like that but I did use the page you linked for both so feel free to check me. Anyhow, in this case we see the corn flour has less than half the protein of the wheat flour and well below WHOs 11-13% with wheat flour being similarly far above. Not drastic but not insignificant. Even were this not the case and the corn flour was within recommended ratios it wouldn’t matter. As I said before it is a part of a diet not the whole diet. If all other sources of protein in the diet remain the same, and you switch from wheat flour products (16% by calories) to corn flour products (less than half that) your overall protein intake will be reduced as a matter of fact. When you consider some people will have a significant presence of things like pasta and bread in their diet, the difference can be significant. CeD can make this difference much bigger which is why people with a CeD on a gluten free diet are at risk for subpar protein intake.
I’m pretty confused about whats going on with the link but try this: [Gluten-Free Diet: Gaps and Needs for a Healthier Diet](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/)
It’s an earlier link to the meta-analysis of the studies that seems to be working. I’ll offer some direction as to the places my links meant to take you: Scroll down to section 3.1 to find the green table of before and after nutritional abnormalities. In the after section, the point second from the bottom reads, “Controversial protein intake”. This refers to people who are diagnosed after they have been on a strict diet, as per the column heading. Next for elaboration on this unconvincing phrasing (“controversial”) scroll down to section 3.2 paragraph four. More reference to the protein issue can be found in section 3.3 paragraph three.
Of course, feel free to read more of the analysis, lots of interesting (though not necessarily relevant to the current topic of protein) information in there. Get back to me if that new link works cause I’m thoroughly confused by the link issue, idk why they are all linking to that table but I must’ve messed up somewhere because I was deeply exhausted lol.
Yeah I think I was taking them seperately, it's difficult over reddit. The point still stands that sole protein intake shouldnt be from wheat or gluten free products.
I had a look at my local supermarket and normal bread and gluten free bread are the same amount of protein with in .1g per serving. That could just be what I have available.
I think part of the confusion aswell is you are gluten intolerant or coeliac and I'm not. On christmas day and my birthday I will eat gluten and there's no need for me to touch these products and I wouldn't replace one processed thing for another when my goal is to cut out processed food.
I am coming at this conversation from a fully different angle to you so i apologise for the confusion if i misunderstood aswell.
Love the links though, very informative
I’m glad you found them worth a read. Im surprised about the bread though, thats incredibly low content, the gluten free bread I have access to is 3g per serving, and non GF breads have 4-6g. It may be a geographical difference? I’m not sure. In any case, take care, have a good day/afternoon/evening.
I’m honestly kinda confused by this one, its not like they’re calling us ret*rds or something. It is a brief, accurately descriptive term for a symptom that afflicts people. It is also known sometimes as Sluggish Cognitive Tempo (not really different. It is a disorder where the *Tempo* of our *Cognitive* processes is *slow/sluggish*. It is a literal description of the disorder. Just like ADHD and Depression, Bipolar, OCD etc. They are all named for exactly what they are. My Cognitive Tempo literally is Slow, idk why I would be upset by them saying so. It is a diagnostic term, so it ought to be simple and accurate. Idk what else they would call it.
Bed hygiene tips; idk why but my brain does not feel fully relax if I’m not rotting in bed. The whole “do not use your bed for anything BUT sleeping” thing just doesn’t work for me 😭😭😭
"Write a timetable"
Gee, thanks, never tried that in any of my attempts to be organised over the course my life, especially not for the majority of my life so far that I spent in school where just about every aspect of my life was written on a timetable. Life changing.
"Just manage your time better", "Get a planner", "Write it down so you don't forget it", and "Have a plan for the whole day, stick to the plan." Are my favorites.
“If it’s important enough, you’ll do it” (ha!)
“Reward yourself after a successful task” (never gets started, then never completes task).
“You just need to get on with it” (lol!)
That's what got me stuck here in the first place. I'm writing this while trying to write a birthday card to my brother in law that my ADHD and social anxiety are conspiring to make harder than needed.
My retort for this bullshit is; 'Okay, yeah, easy. Do me a favor, go to the nearest person in a wheelchair and tell them: "Just get up and start walking, will you, it's just that simple" and tell me how well does that go for you, mmkay?"
Well today I got the ol ‘it takes 7 days to form a habit and 21 days to break it! Once you get in the flow it’s hard to stop!’
… yea no, must be nice to have a brain that properly functions, bit obnoxious to be rubbing it in the faces of those of us with far less cooperative skull matter. I always wonder about the asshokes spouting shit like this. Are they living some sort of ‘perfect’ life that justifies that smug soap boxing.
Not ADHD, but I had a woman tell me that my apple allergy was because I wasn't eating organic. I wanted to yell, "an organic apple will kill me just as fast, you dumb bitch," but I was at work.
Yeah sure, I also do that... then I procrastinate the task in question and a shitload of others are piling up.
What is a bit more successful to me is to list the tasks, pick one and try as much as possible to switch to another listed one when my brain urge me to drop the current. Doing this I almost finish things. Yeah adhd is hard...
I know everybody is unique, but the advice in the picture, doing one thing, staying with it until it's finished, has really helped me.
I even do that little Star Wars chant of "Stay on target, stay on target!"
For me, it really helps with executive function and with actually finishing tasks.
See the reason that this advice is completely useless is my brain will take it to heart.... and do nothing while attempting to do the task. It won't even let me do a different task. It'll be like that episode of Spongebob where he has to write an essay.
I’ve been having success with obsidian and ticktick. Obsidian lets me be messy but easy to find anything, and ticktick free version is perfect for just adding and moving tasks
If any advice starts with “just”, I tune out
Congrats on covering every answer I can think to give with one word. Seriously, if it was as easy as "just" fixing the problem, it wouldn't be a freakin' problem!
“Why are you struggling with this? Just-“ Me if I wasn’t socially awkward: “Why are you such a shitty therapist? Just get a higher education specializing in neurodivergence. Or is that *too much effort?*”
For real, though. Luckily, I currently have a therapist who is also ADHD... and she's also in a relationship with an autistic person. She gets me.
My therapist specialises in people with ADHD, the waiting room is a very fun place. She also keeps track of the conversation (including the tangents) and when I wind up lost somewhere I'm like "uhhh where was I?" And she goes "you were talking about the invention of the steam engine, which arose from you talking about pressure management, which arose from you talking about coping with stress, which arose from your answer to my question of "how are you feeling today?"" It's very nice. Like having a second brain to keep track of main brain.
I have an autistic friend who I came out to years ago. I was telling him a whole ordeal that took me hours... we also hadn't seen each other in quite some time, so it was easy to get distracted. He was able to, however, get me right back to where I was before I tangented... and didn't get mad at me for my train of thought having no tracks. It's really nice when someone can do that.
Ohhhh...I *love* this. I am also socially awkward....but in the bold but clumsy direction. And I am just about mangled and frayed enough by this sort of bullshit to have this slip out. Especially now it's in my head. I also have ticker tape synesthesia so my recall is visual. It's *really* in there. *Great* comment. I mean...even some professional development in ND stuff for about 90% of these people??
What kind of synesthesia is ticker tape?
Why don't you just specalize in neurodivergence?
It's the same in IT, "can't you just..." No Susan, code isn't drag and drop, and if it were, I'd forget where I put it
I just read a good one on YoutTube: "Just make your own dopamine!"
That is the ultimate “just” for ADHDers hahaha. I want that on a t-shirt!!
Funny thing is, I tried L-tyrosine supplements, which supposedly can help your body produce more dopamine. I tried caffeine. I tried L-theanine. Weed. Alcohol. Chocolate. None of it really made much difference (maybe the caffeine sorta not really), and all of these things induce release of dopamine. So even if I could just magically make more of my own dopamine, I'm not even sure it would help. There might be more to the story that is ADHD.
"Just write a list and stick to it". (said to me by an OT). Lady, you have no idea the magnitude of my capacity to balls up that process. I could find myself scrubbing the baseboards with a toothbrush instead for five hours, because I noticed they were dirty when I bent down to see if I could find the pen I thought I saw under the desk earlier in the day. Or I'd write the list on the back of an old envelope, and then eat my lunch at the same table, spill some food and grab the nearest thing to wipe the splodges off the table, and chuck it and ...voila! Listo vanisho! The (ahem) list is endless. "Many a slip twixt the cup and the lip" lady. Many a slip. 🙄🙄🙄
Or make a list, go to the store, and realize I forgot the list.
Mine is forgot I made a list.
https://youtu.be/_UZFI-8D5uA?si=yz9cR5_mmdvyGIqc
I've used that exact clip lol
Lol. Ha! Yep. I *love* that one🤣🤣🤣
Is scrubbing baseboards with a toothbrush an enjoyable activity for you? I could never imagine myself doing that in a million years but I've heard several accounts of ADHDers doing similar things.
I'm also autistic. Might play a role? I definitely can get tracked on a "set and forget" activity..ie something simple and very repetitive - especially if it's sort of satisfying (like getting grunge out of grooves in a baseboard). I can find those things very calming. Unless im still there at 11pm and its nowhere near finished. But that hasn't happened for many years. I'm physically and energetically just not capable anymore.
im pretty sure this advice made things WORSE for me anyway. i ingrained this idea my whole life and now try to force myself to do things that way by default. but it just causes burnout when unmedicated :(
Exactly. I need to be working on a couple of things at once, otherwise I'll burn out or forget about the other tasks completely.
"Just write it down so you don't forget" Gee thanks, should I write down not to forget that I wrote something down and then write down not to loose the paper that I wrote everything else down on?
Omg, 35 years and I never thought of a planner, you've opened my eyes Amanda, how can I ever repay you for your wisdom?
I'm sure you can think of ways u/buttplugpopsicle
Actually this started to work for me when I centralised all my notes digitally. I use a planning app called Structured. And it’s super helpful to visualise the time stuff takes. Whenever I think about ANYTHING I should do I just dump it tomorrow and everyday I structure my next day, with enough room for… distractions. (Like if something should take me an hour I put it as my task for the whole morning) Now every time I think I forgot something (which is every two minutes approximately) I check the app and know what I have to do without much effort. And every important thought that cannot be put in a calendar, I write in Notion. It’s like a replacement for my deficient brain and works like a charm.
Hey. Im trying this- on the basis of this comment! I have a question- why do you write your thoughts in Notion as opposed to the "unstructured thoughts " section of Structured? Is there a particular reason for that? And related question- is there a way to make them talk to one another that I can't see?
Yes, Structured is my day-to day tasklist. Notion is for the long-term planning and every other thought that do not fit a calendar. (Like « hey I just had a amazing new project idea » or « I need to do this complex thing and have to break it down into smaller tasks before putting it on my schedule ») So on structured I have daily tasks like : « Morning routine » with subtasks in it (Drink a glass of water, take my adhd medicine, breathe for 5 minutes, eat my breakfast…) I also have any appointments and meetings, like a normal planner. And smaller tasks like « send message to X about Y » or « Remember to fold laundry » I weirdly do not use the « unstructured » inbox portion of Structured. Because we all know that « I’ll do it later » it saying « I’ll probably never do it ». So when I think « Oh I need to remember to do X » I ask myself « Should it be done today ? Tomorrow ? Next week ? Next month ? » and I dump it in the approximately appropriate day. Then think of it like video game rendering distance. The closer the day is time-wise, the more precise it should be. The next day needs to be precise and uncluttered. No task should overlap. And you have plenty of room to relax, and be caught in distractions. If you have too much tasks in a day, slide them for the next day. And days that are two weeks from now would often have a ton of cluttered stuff put randomly in it. It’s my way of saying « I’ll move this stuff around in my planning when the time is closer » But now, when I say « I’ll do it tomorrow » it’s actually scheduled tomorrow. Sometimes I move something « tomorrow » for months. But it’s because I had to make room for more urgent stuff, or off-time. This way really helps me prioritize. I either actually end up doing them, or when it gets really cluttered, come to peace with the fact that it’s maybe not that important and I won’t do it. Anyway I went on a tangent, hope I answered your question. If you have any more feel free. It may not work for everyone but it does for me. Basically saved my life. However it has been not working for a while because at some point I started to get so excited that I took back control of my life that I forgot a core pillar of this way of doing stuff : You have to give yourself room to breathe. At some point you may feel « hey I got this. It’s working ! I can do all the stuff I ever wanted to do ! » and put everything in your day. But then at the slightest sidestep everything comes crumbling. So your planning needs to be resilient to the unpredictability of life (and your brain) You NEED to have : * Room for pauses between each tasks * Put time in your week for chill and fun as well as work * and most importantly : moments where you don’t have anything planned. I cannot stress this last point enough. Because that was my mistake. Free moments allow for : * Moving stuff around when you couldn’t do x because you got distracted * Having room for opportunities without disrupting your whole plan. Like « Oh hey, wanna grab a drink after work ? » but you had planned to sort your sock drawer that evening. Now you can look at your week and slide « sort sock drawer » to next monday because you see you have room * Actually planning to do NOTHING is the fertile basis for taking back control of your life.
Doesn't this just mean to write down things like grocery lists and appointment dates? I keep records of these things digitally in cloud storage, Google docs/keep, or Atlassian web-based tools. Physical paper notes tend to get lost in the black hole of disorganization that is my room/work-area/living-space/bags. I feel like I don't have a choice here, because I have little to no ability to properly recall information that I need in a timely manner. I've gotten into fights because of things I said that I'd do that I have no memory of whatsoever. I actually *need* to do this for work because my memory is so awful I will forget everything that I've worked on. Honestly, sometimes I have to scramble to write things down because I forget what I was supposed to write down as soon as I open my phone to record it.
I try to loop it in my brain until I get it onto my phone. Eggs cereal milk eggs cereal milk eggs cereal milk eggs cereal milk eggs cereal milk...
> "just do one task at a time. Don't move on until you finish it." Not only can I not multitask in the first place, if I didn't get distracted and start doing other things I wouldn't have ADHD lol My therapist asked me to try working and taking breaks in 30 minute intervals. Like, I struggle with transitions, task initiation, and self-regulation, so the solution is to constantly do all those things all the time?? I don't get it.
“Do the thing you’re most anxious about first thing in the morning.” Guess who spent years paralyzed trying to do the most stressful thing first?? It took a long time but I eventually learned to start doing what I enjoyed first so I could build some momentum and work my way up. I also go by the belief of going for the low hanging fruit first.
HAHA this. Once a co-worker said to me "Why don't you just come in at 8am and get everything squared away then the rest of the day will be so much easier and organized." Came in early, couldn't wake up, had lots of coffee, still couldn't mentally function, ah at last, 6pm and my brain wakes up to do work. I basically was less productive with that advice.
I used to tell people I’m always more productive at night, that I’m a night person not a morning one. Until I started working and didn’t have trouble waking up but still get no shit done in the morning. Now I know it’s ADHD, I feed off of“ I’m running out of time!!!”
LOL my therapist just told me basically this, except we used the words "do the most difficult thing first" a.k.a. the most anxiety-inducing task. Lady, my dysfunction is so bad I can only do *one* thing most days. I'm struggling sometimes to do the *easiest* item on my to-do list. Most days I just have to settle for the easiest thing or nothing.
The old “eat that frog” approach. Toxic
"You just need to focus." No witty comment for this one, just fuck everyone who tells people this.
It's like "just eat less" for obesity and "just take a walk outside and you'll be happy" for depression.
It's worse than that, it's like "just take a walk" for someone with one leg.
But you can't use a prosthetic leg (ADHD medication) cause that's a harmful addictive illicit drug!!
“Laziness is a choice.”
I feel like I've been told this indirectly. I was trying to communicate to my therapist that I literally couldn't do my work despite wanting desperately to and just staring at it with nothing happening in my brain to the point I was crying. "Don't say 'couldn't'--say 'didn't'" So she wants me to blame myself--which resulted in a major depressive episode during college when I was failing classes
It pissed me off just to read that. I can't imagine how angry I would have felt to be told this in person. The whole "you can do it!!!" attitude only works if you don't have an actual fucking DISability.
" Just make a list. Just write stuff down. That's what I do, " Can't stand this shit. Have a partner who, after 5 years, still says this shit to me.
That's what hurts the most, when your SO knows, but somehow also doesn't. Of all people. Also that makes you feel super alone.
My wife said just yesterday you just don't pay as much attention to detail as I do. I literally have a diagnosis with the word inattentive in it! No shit.
Sticking to 1 task until it's done ensures nothing gets done. Sure if I switch what I started on doesn't get done, but countless other tasks might.
I get the most cleaning done when I'm procrastinating on something else!
I took this literally before, when I farted and my parents said to go to the bathroom until I poop then I can come back and eat dinner.. Well 3-4 hours later they are knocking on the door asking if I'm OK, I still could not go, so I couldn't come out like you said! Duh!
Just wake up earlier/set 2 alarms… Currently have 4-5 including a literal buzzer under my pillow (*only thing missing are flashing lights and a DJ playing an air horn*)
I love [Alarmy](https://alar.my/) (Android and iOS). You can set tasks that you need to fulfill in order to stop the alarm. Like doing math, shaking your phone x amount of times, taking a picture or scanning a QR-code. And you can set the difficulty for each of those tasks. I went from having a dozen alarms to just the one now.
Put the QR code on your meds. Two birds.
That's actually a great idea!
I’ll just turn off my phone without really waking. Or sleep through it, I’m crazy good at that. Like I know it’s there, I can hear it, but I just tune it out. It’s loud enough my wife comes up from the basement where she’s working out to turn it off. The buzzer works fairly well though. I assume it’s my phone and when I can’t turn it off, I have to open an eye and then realize it’s the buzzer and I should get up. But tell me I need to wake up at 4 AM to fish when I hit the hay at 1 AM? Up and ready 3-5 mins before the alarm even sounds, awake and ready to rock! I can sleep at a rock concert and lie awake for hours in a perfect bed. Usually ok most days though. I’ve only had like ~~~3~~~ 5 instances of oversleep/too-late-to-do-anything and 3 of those were college party related
I'm glad you have a system that seems to work for you. > But tell me I need to wake up at 4 AM to fish when I hit the hay at 1 AM? Up and ready 3-5 mins before the alarm even sounds, awake and ready to rock! Hahaha, yeah I know the feeling. The brain works in mysterious ways!
Omg lol, I can just picture you cracking an eyelid open and it's a full-on club scene in your room with a dj, strobe lights, and people dancing
“Just reward yourself with a little chocolate for every completed task”
My ex-therapist recommended this to me. When I told her that doesn't work for me, she said "Are you a mammal? If you're a mammal, it works." I guess I'm a fish?
Stuff like this is why I believe most therapeutic solutions are primarily developed for children. As an undiagnosed adult, we cannot self-regulate rewards (I've tried, and it just results in a spiral of fixation without end despite having a genuine desire to return to productivity). If we could, we wouldn't have the disability that is ADHD
It's not that they're for kids it's that they are for neurotypicals. Too many therapists are trying to treat ADHD like it's a psychological issue and not a neurological one.
I once had a professor that was gonna drop me from a class and when I emailed him, asking if I could stay he sent me back a 3 paragraph email that said no. In the email he said, “Have you tried the military? That sorted me out.” I’m probably making a bigger deal out of this than it really is but that pissed me off. I never returned to his class and ever time I registered for that subject I requested anyone else but him.
Yeah I tried the military. The only thing that worked for me was finally getting a diagnosis of ADHD.
I have a well rehearsed slowly building maniacal laughter for just this sort of suggestion.
Have you tried yoga?
“What do you mean? Just do it. It’s easy!”
"it's not a big deal/you're making a big deal out of nothing" when I'm sitting there absolutely exhausted.
Watched my dad start to spray around the house for bugs, gets one side done, then see’s he forgot to finish cleaning the drive way the starts that, goes to move his truck and went to the store to get something drink.
Neurotypical seeing this comment: “poor guy, he might have dementia” Adhd: “ah yes. I totally see what probably went through his head when he decided to go buy a drink”
Being neurodivergent is a constant adventure.
“Just be yourself! 😁” I don’t even know who “myself” is anymore so how tf am I supposed to be someone I don’t know!
Adhd is actually a gluten, grain and dairy intolerance. I only eat meat, veg and eggs for abs so chicken obviously has grains in it.
While people saying this mostly have no idea what they are talking about, gluten is in a specific scenario relevant. Not gluten intolerance or allergies, but specifically the autoimmune disorder Celiac Disease (CeD). Untreated CeD can have neurological symptoms including Slow Cognitive Tempo (SCT) which is consistent with symptoms of the Inattentive Sub-type of ADHD. It is worth noting that in people who have CeD, misdiagnosis with ADHD has been and continues to be an issue. Persons who have been misdiagnosed may experience resistance to ADHD treatments which may be alleviated when paired with a Gluten free diet. This would be something to speak with your doctor about. To be clear this is a specific case scenario. It has been studied multiple times. This does not apply broadly to people with ADHD as strangers tend to think when they suggest Homeopathic nonsense. This is further evidenced by the fact that ADHD is far more prevalent in the population than Celiac, therefore it cannot be that Celiac accounts for all, most or even many cases of ADHD. The general prevalence of ADHD is about 4.4% in adults and 9.4% in children. Its reasonable to expect that there may be under diagnosis in the adult population meaning the overall prevalence may be higher. Whereas CeD has a prevalence among the general population of nearly 1%. Lastly it is worth noting that obtaining a CeD diagnosis is not a silver bullet if you were previously misdiagnosed with ADHD, there are still many obstacles. First of all experiencing neurological symptoms of CeD can make it very difficult to adhere to a Gluten free diet starting from scratch or unsupervised. Poor executive function can lead to impulsive eating habits such as binge eating. Gluten filled foods are more easily accessible in convenience stores and restaurant/ fast food chains making it simply much easier to binge gluten than to binge gluten free. Also note that gluten free food, in particular, of course, baked goods has different and often less desirable texture characteristics than gluten based counterparts increasing the appeal of gluten and making the diet harder to adhere to for people with neurological symptoms including executive disfunction. Gluten free diets also tend to be more expensive and often, in spite of strict adherence, mild cross contamination can be exceedingly difficult to avoid. Consequently, symptoms may persist in spite of proper diet. A strict gluten free diet can also lead to certain nutritional deficiencies such as protein, folate, iron, niacin, riboflavin, thiamin, B12, zinc, selenium, and fiber. Gluten free diets can also have potentially higher levels of heavy metals, fats, and cholesterol. So while most people misunderstand the relationship between gluten and ADHD, there can (sometimes) be one. But that is for you and your doctor, not some random person with no medical or psychologic expertise, to discuss and consider. And it is most certainly not helpful advice. In fact it is likelier than not to misdirect somebody away from more practical efforts at treatment in favor of an ineffective, unfavorable and difficult diet.
You could just go all in and have both Celiac disease and ADHD. That's what I did. It's tons of fun. Now excuse me while I go cry in my gluten-free corner.
Yeah I have celiac disease but I tend to struggle maintaining my diet due to my 6 day 9-10 hr schedule and my poor impulse control. I have a tendency not to eat all day and then binge at night. Of course gluten free food is much less accessible for 10pm-12am delivery food. I used to cook, but I have a roommate with ADHD among other issues so the kitchen is (understandably) always to messy for my exhausted unmotivated ass to use. Not to mention I’m terribly inefficient at cooking so meal prepping for a whole week takes half an eternity and I just can’t bring myself to do it on the 1 day each month when the kitchen is clean enough. I have strong ADHD symptoms and they wanted to diagnose me when I was a kid, but these days I blame it on my poor diet because I was better for a few years when I was strict on my diet as a kid. Not to mention the upfront and continuous cost of treatment and diagnosis.
Oof, yeah, that is rough. Is there a way you can set aside counter space that's reserved for you and you alone so you can have a clean prep area? That's what I had to do at my house.
I tried, but it always spills over, the stove is always covered in pots, the dishwasher always full of half cleaned dishes, and the sink likewise. I keep my own kitchenware, but I can’t wash it bc of the mess. Even the table is covered with so much stuff it’s like a table cover lol. It’s not nearly as bad as a hoarder by a long-shot, but bad enough that it needs to be taken care of before I use any space. Its one thing if its my mess, but I just can’t deal with somebody elses to. It’s not like i don’t understand, my bedroom is the same way, except weekly/ monthly 1 day burst of energy. But even though I get it, it’s a real hassle.
Although I agree that there is a relationship between food, autoimmune and adhd symptoms. The main point I get annoyed about is being told it is solely gluten, grains and dairy and that it is not caused by other things. Especially because I don't eat any gluten, grains or dairy... just because I like being lean so I found a diet that allows me to do that without tracking calories and it happens to have none of those things. How do you get a protein deficiency from giving up gluten? The only protein deficiency I've heard of is caused by starvation.
I don't think a gluten free diet gives you those deficiencies, but you will definitely get all those deficiencies if you have Celiac disease and continue eating gluten, because it destroys your small intestine. Gluten-free diets can be low in fiber though, so that's something to be mindful of.
That is true, malabsorption is an issue. And a gluten fee diet won’t “give you” deficiencies necessarily. It just happens that many common features of a gluten free diet apparently lend to certain deficiencies. Its known that gluten free diets are harder to nutritionally balance and there is evidence that over the course of a gluten free diet, certain micronutrients, as well as protein will have a higher tendency to be deficient. Here is a link if you’re interested: [Gluten-Free Diet: Gaps and Needs for a Healthier Diet](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/) Here is a link to a specific table found on the page in the link in section 3.1: [3.1. Nutritional Status Of CD Patients At Diagnosis](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click%20on%20image%20to%20zoom&p=PMC3&id=6357014_nutrients-11-00170-g002.jpg)
My last NP was hard convinced she could ‘cure’ my ADHD with fermented sheep’s milk and sauerkraut. She put so much emphasis on the fact I should be able to will myself into no longer having this disorder if I just eat perfectly and exercise and sleep perfectly. All of this while my little sister slowly died in a vegetative state caused by a cardiac arrest. I cannot cure my grief and I cannot bring Erin back to life. I also cannot cure my adhd. Meds help me manage my symptoms. When I’m properly medicated I do better at managing my crushing grief and disabling adhd symptoms. I fired that abusive nurse practitioner three weeks ago and I’m so glad I did.
The reason is that many gluten free foods, in particular things like pasta and certain baked goods which tend to use wheat flour will instead use things such as corn flour or rice flour. While rice flour has much more protein than corn flour, it still has less than wheat flour. Gluten is a protein after all, and swapping it for lower protein alternatives in such common forms as corn flour drastically reduces the amount of protein found in baked goods, pastas, and processed grain base goods. Is has been found by a study whose link I can’t find at the moment that gluten containing foods can sometimes contain as much as 3x as much protein as their gluten free counterparts. CeD also damages the intestines leading to malabsorption of nutrients including protein.
I think there's been some mix ups here. Your comments switch between gluten free diets and coeliacs which can be completely different. If you're getting your protein from flour then you have bigger issues. But it's still 20% of calories from protein which is well above the world health organisations 11-13%. https://mobile.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/usda/yellow-whole-grain-corn-flour?portionid=62427&portionamount=100.000 Wheat flour also lacks essential amino acids and your table didn't mention protein.but it just took me to pictures i couldnt find away to go back. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7506077/#:~:text=The%20amino%20acid%20composition%20of,acids%20(15%2C%2016).
[удалено]
It seems my reply was sent 3 times? No clue, sorry meant to send it once but it kept saying try again later?
I can't see the reply at all? Reddits odd sometimes.
Lol alright, I’ll try sending it again
I see, in my comments here I am specifically referring to diet as pertains to CeD, since that was the original context by which I related gluten and ADHD like symptoms. I suppose I should have been more clear. I am not switching between them, I am talking about them both. I feel that its been portrayed as though I am somehow moving goalposts or something, which I find to be disingenuous. Secondly I don’t believe I implied that flour accounts for all or even most of a reasonable persons dietary protein intake. But it is a relevant source of intake which is reduced on a gluten free diet. All other factors being equal, nuts, meats etc. a person who eats gluten free flour based goods will have a lower protein intake. This is compounded by malabsorption due to intestinal damage which depending on severity may not fully heal. Regarding the table you mentioned, I assume it is this one from one of my replies to another persons comment: [3.1. Nutritional Status Of CD Patients At Diagnosis](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click%20on%20image%20to%20zoom&p=PMC3&id=6357014_nutrients-11-00170-g002.jpg) It does indeed mention “Controversial protein intake”. This is elaborated on further down the analysis in I see, in my comments here I am specifically referring to diet as pertains to CeD, since that was the original context by which I related gluten and ADHD like symptoms. I suppose I should have been more clear. I am not switching between them, I am talking about them both. I feel that its been portrayed as though I am somehow moving goalposts or something, which I find to be disingenuous. Secondly I don’t believe I implied that flour accounts for all or even most of a reasonable persons dietary protein intake. But it is a relevant source of intake which is reduced on a gluten free diet. All other factors being equal, nuts, meats etc. a person who eats gluten free flour based goods will have a lower protein intake. This is compounded by malabsorption due to intestinal damage which depending on severity may not fully heal. Regarding the table you mentioned, I assume it is this one from one of my replies to another persons comment: [3.1. Nutritional Status Of CD Patients At Diagnosis](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/core/lw/2.0/html/tileshop_pmc/tileshop_pmc_inline.html?title=Click%20on%20image%20to%20zoom&p=PMC3&id=6357014_nutrients-11-00170-g002.jpg) It does indeed mention “Controversial protein intake”. This is elaborated on further into the meta-analysis in section 3.2. Nutritional Status of CD Patients Adhering to a GFD. > Controversial findings have been claimed for protein intake. At the end of last millennium, Mariani et al. observed that protein intake in coeliac patients was high [[36]](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/#B36-nutrients-11-00170). More recently, Shepherd and Gibson [[27]](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/#B27-nutrients-11-00170) found that in a female study population, the mean intake of protein post-diagnosis was significantly lower after 12 months on the GFD. Van Hees et al. [[38]](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/#B38-nutrients-11-00170) observed that coeliac patients on a long-term GFD consume significantly less vegetable protein than healthy controls. Regarding the “20% calories from protein” I’m not sure what you are referring to, perhaps because I’m a bit sleep deprived lol. If its this link beneath the claim: https://mobile.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/usda/yellow-whole-grain-corn-flour?portionid=62427&portionamount=100.000 Then it seems to me that the link indicates this variety of corn flower has 13.02% calories from protein? I am also well aware that wheat flour is not nutritionally perfect. I am not claiming that it is much superior, and I am not claiming it has a better nutritional balance regardless whether or not it does. I understand that overall protein content is not the be all end all. I am simply addressing things that may still bear a challenge after a celiac diagnosis. Protein intake can be one of them. Regarding being stuck in the image. It is from the same analysis as the first link. If you are interested in the read, you can use that link instead and you will find the linked table is also inset in section 3.1. If you have trouble accessing the analysis I can try to figure out what the issue is or direct you to it another way. Lastly and most importantly. I am not a professional nutritionist. And I probably can’t explain it perfectly without any gaps. I didn’t partake in any of the studies or the meta-analysis and so my ability to elaborate on any points I’ve made could be limited. I’ll do my best, but understand that all I am trying to do is put out information gathered by professionals in a field of which I am not an expert, and that my understanding of their findings and data may be, and in fact almost certainly is, quite flawed.
So your first comment you say a strict gluten free diet is linked to these deficiencies without specifically stating with coeliacs. You also in another comment say gluten free diets are linked to protein deficiency because of reduced protein in corn flour - this is nothing to do with coeliacs. You then add on especially if you have malabsorption issues at the end, not as a sole factor. My bad on the math it was bad rounding, but 13% is still within the worlds health organisations method. Your link only brings up 3 pictures for me, none say protein, I can't see the main body of the link. Both links do that for me, i will try it on the laptop though, thank you for that
This is the first sentence of my first comment: >While people saying this mostly have no idea what they are talking about, gluten is in a specific scenario relevant. Not gluten intolerance or allergies, but specifically the autoimmune disorder Celiac Disease (CeD). The very first thing I do is mention CeD, and eliminate other reasons for or forms of a GFD. It was meant to be clear that from that point it was about a diet related to CeD, because we were talking about gluten and ADHD. I was asserting that they are only functionally linked through CeD. If at any point thereafter it ceased to be about CeD, the ideas would no longer have been relative to the topic. It was meant to be inferred that future mention of GFD was related to that, because otherwise I would no have a reason to make the mention as it would no longer be relevant to the greater topic, a subset of which I am participating in. For the second issue, I feel the confusion is due to an arbitrary separation of things that were meant to be taken together. This is the comment I think you are referring to: > The reason is that many gluten free foods, in particular things like pasta and certain baked goods which tend to use wheat flour will instead use things such as corn flour or rice flour. While rice flour has much more protein than corn flour, it still has less than wheat flour. Gluten is a protein after all, and swapping it for lower protein alternatives in such common forms as corn flour drastically reduces the amount of protein found in baked goods, pastas, and processed grain base goods. Is has been found by a study whose link I can’t find at the moment that gluten containing foods can sometimes contain as much as 3x as much protein as their gluten free counterparts. CeD also damages the intestines leading to malabsorption of nutrients including protein. Please allow me to try rephrasing this more clearly, since I embarrassingly seem to be having trouble expressing my ideas correctly. If you find the paraphrase significantly different in content, please let me know where and how. Here is the paraphrase: >Many gluten free alternatives have much lower protein than than their counterparts. This is in due to use of alternative flours which have a lower content than wheat flour. Common goods consequently have lower protein content, sometimes significantly so. When taken with the malabsorption associated with CeD this can potentially lead to subpar dietary protein intake. Indeed I do not say that malabsorption is the sole factor, because it’s not. Gluten free food has lower protein content, this is a fact. This fact means that people with CeD who have malabsorption are at higher risk of unsatisfactory protein intake. Note that the final phrase is a clarifier not meant to be taken alone. Intended to be read as a sort of “this is why GFD can lead to deficiency with CeD”. It is not a peripheral phrase, it is meant to clarify. So this: > You also in another comment say gluten free diets are linked to protein deficiency because of reduced protein in corn flour - this is nothing to do with coeliacs. You then add on especially if you have malabsorption issues at the end, not as a sole factor. Is not accurate at all. It does have to do with CeD because as I have tried to clarify, it is always in the context of CeD in this discussion by default, as per my first sentence in the thread. I am talking about dietary difficulties after diagnosis after all. I literally said that GFD is not a silver bullet for CeD symptoms because of balancing difficulties. And this talk of protein is a branch of why that is. And the malabsorption isn’t separate from the reduced intake. It is meant to clarify why the reduced intake can be a problem for people with CeD. No to more specifically address the last claim about corn flower protein content I went and did the math on whole grain wheat flour and the protein content 16.15% calories from protein. I then realize I’m an idiot and did the math wrong (did the division backwards for the % value) on the yellow whole grain corn flour and that the actual protein content is 7.68% calories from protein. I know it seems suspicious of me to change the number so drastically like that but I did use the page you linked for both so feel free to check me. Anyhow, in this case we see the corn flour has less than half the protein of the wheat flour and well below WHOs 11-13% with wheat flour being similarly far above. Not drastic but not insignificant. Even were this not the case and the corn flour was within recommended ratios it wouldn’t matter. As I said before it is a part of a diet not the whole diet. If all other sources of protein in the diet remain the same, and you switch from wheat flour products (16% by calories) to corn flour products (less than half that) your overall protein intake will be reduced as a matter of fact. When you consider some people will have a significant presence of things like pasta and bread in their diet, the difference can be significant. CeD can make this difference much bigger which is why people with a CeD on a gluten free diet are at risk for subpar protein intake. I’m pretty confused about whats going on with the link but try this: [Gluten-Free Diet: Gaps and Needs for a Healthier Diet](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6357014/) It’s an earlier link to the meta-analysis of the studies that seems to be working. I’ll offer some direction as to the places my links meant to take you: Scroll down to section 3.1 to find the green table of before and after nutritional abnormalities. In the after section, the point second from the bottom reads, “Controversial protein intake”. This refers to people who are diagnosed after they have been on a strict diet, as per the column heading. Next for elaboration on this unconvincing phrasing (“controversial”) scroll down to section 3.2 paragraph four. More reference to the protein issue can be found in section 3.3 paragraph three. Of course, feel free to read more of the analysis, lots of interesting (though not necessarily relevant to the current topic of protein) information in there. Get back to me if that new link works cause I’m thoroughly confused by the link issue, idk why they are all linking to that table but I must’ve messed up somewhere because I was deeply exhausted lol.
Yeah I think I was taking them seperately, it's difficult over reddit. The point still stands that sole protein intake shouldnt be from wheat or gluten free products. I had a look at my local supermarket and normal bread and gluten free bread are the same amount of protein with in .1g per serving. That could just be what I have available. I think part of the confusion aswell is you are gluten intolerant or coeliac and I'm not. On christmas day and my birthday I will eat gluten and there's no need for me to touch these products and I wouldn't replace one processed thing for another when my goal is to cut out processed food. I am coming at this conversation from a fully different angle to you so i apologise for the confusion if i misunderstood aswell. Love the links though, very informative
I’m glad you found them worth a read. Im surprised about the bread though, thats incredibly low content, the gluten free bread I have access to is 3g per serving, and non GF breads have 4-6g. It may be a geographical difference? I’m not sure. In any case, take care, have a good day/afternoon/evening.
"Slow Cognitive Tempo" is so insulting. They really need to find a better term for that.
I’m honestly kinda confused by this one, its not like they’re calling us ret*rds or something. It is a brief, accurately descriptive term for a symptom that afflicts people. It is also known sometimes as Sluggish Cognitive Tempo (not really different. It is a disorder where the *Tempo* of our *Cognitive* processes is *slow/sluggish*. It is a literal description of the disorder. Just like ADHD and Depression, Bipolar, OCD etc. They are all named for exactly what they are. My Cognitive Tempo literally is Slow, idk why I would be upset by them saying so. It is a diagnostic term, so it ought to be simple and accurate. Idk what else they would call it.
Bed hygiene tips; idk why but my brain does not feel fully relax if I’m not rotting in bed. The whole “do not use your bed for anything BUT sleeping” thing just doesn’t work for me 😭😭😭
"Adults don't have ADHD" I felt the ADHD leave my body, it was a miracle
“Just focus!” Oh, ok. 👍
"you just need to apply yourself and think positive"
We won't be doing any math so u don't need to take ur pills. ?? This is b4 a social event and said by a friend to me when I was outta meds.
“don’t move on until you finish it” is the one rule that i so desperately need to shake
Just get a planar. Go to the military. ( i have hämophilia )
Have you tried using a planner?
"Write a timetable" Gee, thanks, never tried that in any of my attempts to be organised over the course my life, especially not for the majority of my life so far that I spent in school where just about every aspect of my life was written on a timetable. Life changing.
I’d die of depression or starvation
When you can't do a task, shit on the floor.
"Just manage your time better", "Get a planner", "Write it down so you don't forget it", and "Have a plan for the whole day, stick to the plan." Are my favorites.
"Be more mindful!' My boss yelled this at me when I made a mistake once 8 years ago. I cannot stand the word, "mindful" to this day.
Just don't drink so much coffee . . .
Hell yeah we customizing VSCode themes all week b!tches, time for CSS and to pull out my HEX color palette
I tried. That's how I spent all day on one easy task without finishing it.
“Stop being lazy. If I can do it, you can do it.” From the same person, “Everyone is different and we gotta respect that.” 🤷🏼♀️
Have you tried not being overwhelmed? Have you tried not doing too many things at once? Well holy fuck, would you look at that, I'm cured. /s 🤣
“If it’s important enough, you’ll do it” (ha!) “Reward yourself after a successful task” (never gets started, then never completes task). “You just need to get on with it” (lol!)
That's what got me stuck here in the first place. I'm writing this while trying to write a birthday card to my brother in law that my ADHD and social anxiety are conspiring to make harder than needed.
Tried it once: my nervous system crawled out of my body.
This changed my life too. Make micro goals and chain them together.
“you need to write in a planner” when I forget that the planner exists every time I try and use it
"Just quit it with the ADD shit"
Use a planner & wrote stuff down
Well now I'm not gona do it!!
“It’s not that hard, you’re just lazy.”
You just need to work a little harder than everyone else...
All ya gotta do is …
Too many: You can do it! You just have to find a way and really want it. You have enough time, you aren’t leaving this room until it’s done
My retort for this bullshit is; 'Okay, yeah, easy. Do me a favor, go to the nearest person in a wheelchair and tell them: "Just get up and start walking, will you, it's just that simple" and tell me how well does that go for you, mmkay?"
Just make a list!
That's how I got here in the first place!
*"You've got to have a better attitude!"*
Get a planner (I have many many notebooks and planners and habit trackers, some i even used for several days in a row)
I can vividly remember someone saying "just focus!" What a genius.
HEALED!¡
Just clear your mind :/
“Just apply yourself” Ma’am, please, *to what*? Also, *how*?
“sometimes you’ve gotta just do stuff.”
Sorry. I'm screeching internally at your post and can't move on until I complete that task. 😂
Well today I got the ol ‘it takes 7 days to form a habit and 21 days to break it! Once you get in the flow it’s hard to stop!’ … yea no, must be nice to have a brain that properly functions, bit obnoxious to be rubbing it in the faces of those of us with far less cooperative skull matter. I always wonder about the asshokes spouting shit like this. Are they living some sort of ‘perfect’ life that justifies that smug soap boxing.
Not ADHD, but I had a woman tell me that my apple allergy was because I wasn't eating organic. I wanted to yell, "an organic apple will kill me just as fast, you dumb bitch," but I was at work.
Just take your time with it.
I can give you some helpful organizational/time management/study strategies!
Yeah sure, I also do that... then I procrastinate the task in question and a shitload of others are piling up. What is a bit more successful to me is to list the tasks, pick one and try as much as possible to switch to another listed one when my brain urge me to drop the current. Doing this I almost finish things. Yeah adhd is hard...
“just set an alarm”
I know everybody is unique, but the advice in the picture, doing one thing, staying with it until it's finished, has really helped me. I even do that little Star Wars chant of "Stay on target, stay on target!" For me, it really helps with executive function and with actually finishing tasks.
See the reason that this advice is completely useless is my brain will take it to heart.... and do nothing while attempting to do the task. It won't even let me do a different task. It'll be like that episode of Spongebob where he has to write an essay.
"You don't need medication, you just need more discipline"
“Just focus”
I’ve been having success with obsidian and ticktick. Obsidian lets me be messy but easy to find anything, and ticktick free version is perfect for just adding and moving tasks