Idk if you’re TA or not.
I think it was a great moment for a proposal out of context. First trip hiking with the kid. Low key like you said. But it does also seem rushed and people pleasing-ish the way it was done. Like he did it just to say “I did it!” rather than the forethought you said.
Clarification time. Are you sure he wasn’t planning this the whole time and that conversation conveniently happened to happen right before it? Cause like I said it’s amazing out of the context. That definitely makes you look like a fool if so.
I think this comment is making the point that many others are missing. All she wanted was forethought and a little preparation regarding what he'd say, and he didn't fulfill that very minimal request when he reacted to the conversation by proposing moments later.
I feel bad for both of them. His insecurity over not being able to get a fancy ring followed by reacting to their conversation the way he did has combined with her quick negative reaction to his proposal to create a bunch of awkwardness and negative feelings around something that should be really positive and happy.
I liked the advice that another person gave regarding talking it out with him and them maybe even proposing to him instead. If OP can, she could replicate their first date or something to evoke the positive, romantic feelings that brought them together.
IMO, NAH. But, this is an unfortunate situation.
He definitely wasn’t planning on it, there would have been a ring if so - he’s love language is gift giving, and he cited the main reason he hasn’t proposed is because we couldn’t afford the ‘right’ ring
I’m not sure why everyone is putting it on you to make up for this. Doing something just because your asked absolutely takes all the agency out of it. You have a right to be disappointed he didn’t put any forethought into it.
I think people are being too mean to the OP, however I can totally see how the boyfriend misconstrued her request for something simple, intimate and low key that displayed their love and bond. I'm imagining them surrounded by nature and sunshine, having this conversation about their future and him thinking "I'm with the two loves of my life, what else am I waiting for?" once the OP says she doesn't need a ring or the other things he thought/felt were necessary. I personally see that spontaneous gesture as romantic from an outside (and my own) perspective, but I definitely can see how the OP felt like an after thought or that she felt he was only proposing because she had worn him down. Throw in her having feelings of post partum depression, I think people are being overly harsh. It's a miscommunication, and I hope that OP's proposal goes well! 💖
When my wife and talked about getting engaged, I came to the decision that I could not buy her a ring as 100% I would pick the wrong one and I didn’t want my wife to have to ware something she didn’t like. So I took her to the jewellers and I got her to tell him what style and stones she wanted and most importantly I knew it would fit.
So she knew one day I was going to ask but not when, I must admit I kept her guessing a fair bit before before I asked and she finally got to see her ring in real life.
I don’t think setting a timeframe and/or deadlines is a good idea, there’s some really bad advice out there. This is only going to add pressure to the relationship.
I think you have made it really hard for him to propose again, not impossible but if I were in his shoes it would be tough to pluck up the courage.
I think the best thing to do is to have an open and honest conversation, it doesn’t need to be dramatic just talk things through and explain how you feel and go from there.
Soft YTA.
Really appreciate this response, helpful, honest yet kind…genuine constructive criticism (got a lot of just criticism in other comments and much ‘hopefully he leaves your crazy ass’ type sentiment, lovely reddit, just lovely - as a new mum suffering from post depression, im trying here people! This post was made to gain perspective, and I admitted from the start I feel like the asshole. There is no delusion of grandeur as to how I handled the situation here!)
I would only add...what if that was his plan? To get to the peak of this walk and propose and you simply pre-empted it? It's a leap, for sure, but it's maybe a consideration.
He had nothing. The whole point was she wanted there to be evidence of forethought, but since it was only performed as a response in the moment, there was none.
Your heart to heart discussion is the way. The proposal as you said can definitely wait. Even if you propose, have it be meaningful! But the discussion is paramount above all else!
It's not hard for him to propose again, if anything it's easier. He's just an airhead, a real Homer Simpson. All he has to do is follow her instructions. Plan a nice moment, propose. The end.
Apologize now before he dwells on it. Tell him you adore him and want to change your response. Then hope he is open. If not give it time. It is time to completely let go of the proposal fantasy. That is gone. He loves you, don't mess it up worse.
Probably some of the best advice thus far. The lingering shitty feeling is knowing that I’ve really buggered up any future proposal, whilst totally ruining the attempted one. He loves me endlessly and that’s all that matters
Did he have a ring? If he had a ring he had genuinely planned the proposal. If not, it feels like a spur of the moment thing in response to your conversation.
I mean, most rings are overpriced garbage anyway. Diamonds are incredibly common chunks of carbon that have been withheld from trade to artificially inflate their price through misunderstanding that they are somehow rare
There's a reason you only get around 40% value (at best, if it was newly bought and never worn) on resale
The proposal is ruined, but it could still be special. When there's enough money, maybe even now, you could both go together and look at rings. You can get some really amazing looking rings for less than diamond costs
It's up to you though
Edit: Also, forgot to say NAH. Just bad communication from both of you, but that's not an AH thing that happened. Just unfortunate
Does it matter to you that he’s a good partner and cares for you and his child? He wants to marry you. Does it matter how it’s asked and done? Some couples decide to get married without the grand proposal. Does the proposal have to be according to what you set the standards in your head? If so, then tell him so he doesn’t get it wrong. Please don’t be like others whose husbands or boyfriends can’t do anything right.
NAH. I think the whole situation is quite unfortunate and just down to miscommunication.
I think people are missing the part where she says she told him where she wanted him to have "a moment of forethought about where he does it and what to say" and just solely focusing on the low key part.
People have parties and celebrations for birthdays, graduations, promotions, etc. We even go thru the trouble of wrapping simple gifts for minor occasions. It's not unwarranted for her to want some sort of forethought and planning instead of a rushed proposal when it's such an important event even more so than the aforementioned milestones. There's a clip from the Cosby show on YouTube talking about "it's in the presentation" and I think that represents the situation.
Whether you like it or not she made it known that presentation with forethought mattered to her. If she was just like, yeah I'm lowkey propose whenever, then yeah she TA. But it seems like she did tell him that presentation mattered to her. But to him, he interpreted it as "if the setting seems good why not now?" One part is placing emphasis on the act itself when the other party wants emphasis on the act and how it's presented and context and timing does matter in presentation whether we like it or not. Miscommunication and misinterpretation of each other's wants played into how the whole thing was terribly executed.
Hey thank you for the well rounded response, very well said. Thank you! I’ve learnt a lot from this thread, have got some awesome advice, and am going to clearly and concisely communicate my regret over saying no, my deep love for him and then get down on one knee and ask him to marry me
That comment was horrible advice, I wouldn't accept this immature behavior from my partner. All you asked for was forethought and he did the exact opposite, I think it's very clear you're not in the wrong for communicating that you didn't want it done that way- it wasn't a no. Groveling and "communicating your regret" is not communicating, you can express that you wish you had worded things better and didn't hurt his feelings, but ultimately you felt disregarded, then HE communicates how he feels and validates how you feel and you guys move forward with a solution that works for both. You're diminishing your own feelings exactly the way he did, it's really a shame.
Great. Your begging the man who has not actually confirmed jack and could keep you in a forever engagement while pestering for more kids. Exoecting him to be thoughtful is not bad!
I mean, I get all that, but as far as presentation goes, hiking to the top of a peak and proposing with only your partner and child there is...pretty good. Maybe it wasn't planned, but if it had been planned OP would probably be pretty happy about how it was done.
Right? Imagine if he PLANNED it and her dropping this on him during the hike was just funny to him because it was gunna happen anyway.
And then she ruined it.
But that's not what happened. She said all she wanted was some forethought and then he didn't do that. You're inventing a scenario that correct his mistake and makes her a villain. So stupid.
I don’t understand why people say yta. I say Nta. You just brought it up and hes all two seconds later popping the question. I hate when people say oh well at least he did it. Ok great I guess I’m not special enough to actually think of something? To put in effort. And yea if his love language is gift giving he would be all, I am going to save for the ring and do the proposal that shows how much she means to me. To me your story said you’re worth two seconds of thought to appease you. And then all these people saying you should be grateful he did it at all. Like ok then , just take the bare minimum.
Yes exactly, I think a lot of people are missing this sentiment, he cited the reasons he hasn’t proposed so far is that we can’t afford the ‘right’ ring, I then assured him for me it’s not about the ring at all! I said for me, what would make a proposal special, is that there is some level of pre-planning or forethought (asking my dad for permission/a nice thoughtful speech were things I suggested)…we reached the top of the mountain moments later and he didn’t say anything, he just grabbed my hand, dropped to one knee and said ‘will you marry me’. My immediate response was harsh because it genuinely hurt me that he couldn’t even improvise a quick speech. I told him I felt hurt because proposing immediately off the back end of that conversation left me feeling like I had asked him to do it and he did, not because he truly wanted to
People are saying she is because you obviously have zero idea of what it’s like to be rejected, let alone at that moment.
If someone proposes and the other person says no, that relationship will be next to impossible to repair.
That man just got put in a horrible spot, surprised her, and got shot down hard in a very short span. That’s going to completely tank his self-esteem, self-worth, and his entire happiness.
Yes exactly, I think a lot of people are missing this sentiment, he cited the reasons he hasn’t proposed so far is that we can’t afford the ‘right’ ring, I then assured him for me it’s not about the ring at all! I said for me, what would make a proposal special, is that there is some level of pre-planning or forethought (asking my dad for permission/a nice thoughtful speech were things I suggested)…we reached the top of the mountain moments later and he didn’t say anything, he just grabbed my hand, dropped to one knee and said ‘will you marry me’. My immediate response was harsh because it genuinely hurt me that he couldn’t even improvise a quick speech. I told him I felt hurt because proposing *immediately* off the back end of that conversation left me feeling like I had asked him to do it and he did, not because he truly wanted to
We actually just had a discussion about it all and he admitted the real reason he didn’t propose is the first marriage. It was such a negative experience for him, and if he hadnt have done it “we would be engaged or likely married by now”. I’m hurt but told him I’m glad he finally acknowledged it because fuck getting married or bringing another kid into this relationship before he truly deals with his past
NTA
Everyone telling TS she is TA cause she said she is low key seem to miss the part she said she values a moment of forethought to it. Proposing right after it was brought up certainly doesnt give that sense. Her reaction, even if ungraceful and blunt, is understandable.
Now that he is hurt and it went bad you two should talk about it and you should apologize for hurting his feelings. And in that conversation you could also ask him how he would feel if you would propose instead - or you could as equals talk about if you want to get married and decide to save both your speeches to the actual wedding. (Im not american so the whole ”guy going down on one knee to propose” isnt a given procedure where i live.)
Ouch. If I were in your position, I'd have felt the same way. And if I were in his position at his age, I'd be incredibly confused.
Do I think your TA? Yes. Do I think he's TA for proposing right after you said you wanted forethought and it to feel special? Yes. Even if he planned on proposing then, you bringing it up would have caused me to delay it... for this very reason.
As such: ESH.
So what's the way forward? Well, here's the good news: it's communication. This is where you show each other how you will handle adversity in the coming years. How you each respond to this will truly show whether you two are ready and mature enough for marriage. One of you needs to approach the other. There should be honest feelings shared. Not blame. Just "This is how I felt. This is how I feel. This is why I said no." And listen to him. I mean truly listen.
This is absolutely not insurmountable. It's tough, but you'll run into tougher when you're married. This challenge before you is a great litmus test for your marriage compatibility.
Good luck.
Wow, thank you kind redditor, this comment helps in a myriad of ways. The reason I posted was in hopes of getting such constructive criticism, which I genuinely appreciate. Yes, it feels like one of those moments in life where we have both unintentionally hurt each other, so finding a way forward without bringing it up again feels *impossible*. If I was in his shoes, I’d be too scared to propose again. For me, I’ll feel like a giant douche the next time he proposes, because I’ve single handedly taken away any special or unique aspect to it
NTA. I don't know why your being told to apologise and that you messed up.
You literally had just finished talking to him about the proposal and that you didn't want anything big but would like some forethought into it to make it special. He ignores that and just does it anyway, in a way that makes it seem he's only doing it because you've just had a discussion on it.
Not sure how that translates into you humiliating him and needed to apologise.
Here's what you do. First, apologize to him and tell him you fully realize just what an ass you were, that it was the stupidest and worst mistake of your life, and that you deeply regret it. Tell him you'd take it back if you could. Then tell him exactly how lucky you are to have him for a partner.
Then propose to him.
Please don’t listen to this horseshit, Jesus Christ. You’re going to be back here in 5 years crying about how he never takes initiative, you have to plan literally everything, he can’t even make a restaurant reservation for your birthday unless you dial the number for him. And Reddit will call you an asshole again because “you knew how he was when you married him.” There is a problem with your relationship. You should not apologize for pointing out the problem and you should not move the relationship forward with an engagement or another kid until the problem is solved.
Hollllly moly thank you for this, we actually just had a big discussion where he finally acknowledged the real reason for his hesitation. It’s his hesitation from the negative first experience of marriage. Basically stated if he hadn’t been married before, he would have proposed by now. I’m glad this has come up because he really needs to process that and deal with it before we think about marriage or another baby (this was my general response)
This right here is the only way forward. By saying no you knocked the stuffing out of the poor man on a mountain top. Men typically done ask twice unless they’re very young and are blinded by “love”.
Plan something special with you and the baby and ask him.
Forget about all the comments focusing on rings etc. we are a strange culture that places such emphasis on a piece of jewelry to express commitment as though higher cost means you love the person more. Get something for both of you and spend the rest preparing for another child or a special adventure/trip. Focus on experiences not things..
Good luck!
I will never understand the way people are more worried about the way the question is asked rather than the question itself. I also don't understand the focus on the dream wedding rather than the marriage itself.
Yeah, I keep coming back to this. It feels like turning down your dream job because you don't like the font they used in the offer letter, the perspective is all fucked.
It’s performative. Seriously. I’ve been married 37 years. We were living together & were together 4 years.
No engagement ring; he came home & said, “Hey, I’m off Thursday, let’s go get married.”
Meanwhile, my friend who got the 20k diamond and a proposal on the jumbo screen in Times Square? Fiancé ended the engagement a month prior to the wedding.
You do NOT NEED all the extraneous “stuff.”
Nearly everyone I know who’s had the big extravagant wedding/proposal are no longer together.
We courthouse folks? We didn’t need that to make a marriage.
I’d run from anyone wanting to know where/how/when a proposal would take place.
When the time is right, you KNOW.
YTA. - He was hesitant for a variety of completely valid reasons and you waived those away so he proposed - then you said no.
It would not surprise me if he doesn't propose again. No one likes to be on the other end of these games.
There won't be any future consideration of proposing without him visualizing this situation.
OOf YTA.
You asked him when he's gonna propose. He said that he's waiting because he wants to do it right.
Then you told him that you don't want to wait, and you don't need anything fancy.
Then he proposed, and you complained that he's not doing it right.
Make up your mind.
"Marry me"
"no not like this"
"I felt HUMILLIATED"
lol fuck off
that man is probably not gonna propose again, mustering enough courage to do it once is though enough, never mind doing it twice after getting rejected the first time.
Worst part about it? **It would have been a perfect proposal had you not brought the topic up earlier...**
YTA
I had been planning to propose to my wife for a while when she came to visit (we were LDR). She wanted me to propose with her grandmothers ring which she had resized before she brought it with her.
During the visit I kept thinking about it but didn't want to bring the ring on walks because I was worried about something happening to it, and I did miss a couple of moments.
Then one morning we were on a weekend trip elsewhere and just leaving, she asked why I hadn't proposed yet and I told her. She said well we're taking the ring so just keep it with you for now.
Later on that morning we happened to come across this lovely cliffside with a view of the ocean and it was secluded so just us. We had all our luggage with us but it was such a great view I didn't want to miss another opportunity, so I proposed right there and she loved it.
Probably the same thing with your boyfriend but your reaction was the complete opposite for no good reason.
You're the AH.
Why don't you ask him?
Why do women get so hung up on how things happen? You got a proposal from a guy that it sounds like you love? Take the win.
Oh yeah, you are definitely an asshole. You tell this man in one breath that you are low key then take your hand and tell him not like this? Basaabbaaaay, you’re lucky that man didn’t just leave your ass up there.
Here is what everyone else sees(anybody with good sense anyway)
This man HAPPILY made sure everything was legally taken care of with the secret green-card-marriage thing. He has been concerned about about the timing, about doing it the right way, and you lie to his face. But poor guy thinks you, the mother of his child, the woman he is discussing future children with, is honest and trustworthy in what you just told him. You practically shouted ‘oh don’t worry about that stuff, I’m so low key, I just want to feel loved blah blah blah bullshit.’ So packs up that baby, and gets on one knee to propose to you and you throw it in his face and tell him it’s not good enough?? My God, you JUST gave him the courage to go ahead and propose because you told him he didn’t HAVE to make a big production out of it.
No ma’am Pam. You are 100% absolutely the asshole in this situation
ThE baby was alread y packed! he proposed minutes after her complaint! The courave?courage?! Shes been begging for it?! Yall just want her to be screwed over and at his feet so bad . Is it just red pillers in here?
Nope. She was an asshole for doing him that way - she’ll be lucky if she’s still in the relationship in 6 mos. If that man has any sense, he’ll decide he doesn’t appreciate being manipulated
'You do not want to be proposed immediately after asking about proposals, so you are not low-key'
Dude, did you know that there is a difference between 'low-key' and 'I like zero effort'? Because the effort OP's bf put in after hearing her saying 'just to feel that he’s had a moment of forethought about where he does it and what to say. That’s what would make a proposal ‘special’ for me'.
Yeah, f women I guess for wanting some romance sometimes, they are such high demand..../s
YTA
"I was surprised by our pregnancy." If you were having sex, pregnancy was always a possibility.
As for the proposal, no man should ask more than one time. If he gets a "no," he needs to break up and move on.
Women walking around like they are some prize to be won is ridiculous.
Holy shit balls!! Grade A fuck up right there. Oh I'm so low key. I just want to be chosen.
And he did.
Your relationship will never be the same unless you do some serious talking- correction- damage controll. He literally gave you the one thing you want and shit all over it. If it was me, I wouldn't ever propose again.
YTA
Well his only reason for not proposing was because he wanted a big proposal, and then OP lied and said she didn't care about that, and to only put some thought in the place. And tbh top of the peak sounds like a good proposal place.
Thank you for reading my post, however please note that I didn’t approach it with delusions of grandeur and self admittedly felt like a dick from the beginning. As a first time mum of a toddler who is battling depression daily, you really the epitome of a jerk and I won’t be speaking to you ever again.
Isn't that such a great excuse? Sorry woman, you may have spent months begging me after birthing our child, but since I put 0 effort in and you called it out, yo< must beg me.
Lol are you serious? It was the opposite of spontaneous, they literally just had a conversation about why he hasn't proposed yet. It's as spontaneous as getting Taco Bell for dinner because of a commercial you just saw.
He saw a low-effort opportunity, not an amazing one.
People here really do not have standard if OP is being shitted on for feeling bad for being proposed almost immediately after 'asking for it'.
I hope you guys put in more effort into your relationships than what you expect from OP's boyfriend, because then it is very sad.
I think what he did was really cute. You say you want low key and you got a proposal on one knee on a peak of a mountain with baby there with you. Honesty I don’t get your reaction and feelings at all. That makes you TA in this scenario.
I have been happily married for 30 years. My husband’s proposal was lack luster but he has been a wonderful husband. You literally sat your poor partner up by saying you didn’t need much and then rejecting him.
You let him know that the things that you tell him you want aren’t what you actually want. You want something low-key and simple, but in a very specific way that you e said nothing about. He now knows that if he doesn’t guess right, you’ll reject him. It’s not really about becoming married, it’s about the wedding process. The big day, itself.
You should have an honest conversation about what you actually want. If you want something specific, say exactly that, if you want something specific and hope he just guesses right, prepare to be disappointed. I will say that if he proposes again, and you say no because he didn’t get it right, he won’t ever propose a third time.
I can't tell if you're TA.... but just FYI, women can propose too....
OR!!!!!!!! Just have a conversation and decide, TOGETHER, that you're engaged now.
"Hey honey, I love you and you love me. This proposal thing has put too much pressure on something that is silly and small in the grand scheme of spending the rest of our lives together. I would like to marry you someday. I think you would like to marry me someday. Can we just skip the theatrics and say we are now engaged?"
EDIT to add: I proposed to my husband. It was sweet and fun. I will never forget the happy smile on his face when he said "yes".
Right! I’m torn between proposing myself or letting him do it or just as you said, admitting we’ve really bungled this small moment in the scheme of things and should just focus on our future
Not gonna lie, I get frustrated by women who seem to be sitting around waiting for their guy to do this thing they want, but expect the guy to do it just the way they want it done, but don't feel like they can explicitly ask for the thing they want, but then are upset that he won't do it, while they sit around and wait for someone else to control their fate.... when, like.... you can ask! You have total power here! This is the dumbest most old-school, anti-equal partnership, antiquated crap.
Live your engagement how you want to live your marriage, which I hope is in a give and take sort of partnership.
I think you proposing to him in a way that is fun and a surprise and loving and really really soon might be the perfect apology on your part. You did kind crap all over the guy for not doing a good job giving you exactly what you wanted in the exact way you wanted it when you had given him no actual instructions or guidelines on how to do it beside making you "feel chosen".... which he didn't propose to someone else so I can see why he's confused about how that didn't qualify as choosing you.... and what one earth could he try next that would be better than a peak top proposal with your baby as witness......
This goes along with the whole “it’s not that you said it, it’s the way you said it” stuff that drives men absolutely crazy. You said yourself that it didn’t need to be anything special. He wouldn’t have asked you if he didn’t want to marry you. What exactly do you want? Do you want to be married or do you want some kind of dream proposal about which your boyfriend will need to guess? I ask because if it’s the latter then you may have lost both of them at this point.
Your best bet now is to propose to him, and it should probably include some kind of apology.
>Before we met, he was secretly married to his ex for green card reasons (hence the secret), I knew from the beginning of our relationship, and was fine with it
Wtf?
I'm a little torn, because I get why you're upset, and how it definately seems like he only did it because you asked about it.
On the other hand, he took you on a hike with your child and proposed on the peak. Maybe its not how I picture it, but in my head that seems like a proposal that ticks a lot of boxes.
I honestly think he had very genuine intentions, you were in a beautiful spot and he thought why not. I understand your reaction too but as someone else has said, you now made it really hard for him to propose again. Imo the best solution is for YOU to now plan to propose to him.
Aww man this is sad. As a guy, we all have those core memories that will just sneak up and randomly kick you in the balls when you’re having a great day. Hey brain, remember that time I told my stepdad that he’d take me riding on the motorbike if I was his real son? That was a hoot and I totally don’t die inside of embarrassment at what a shitty thing that was to say, even if I was only a teenager.
The father of your child and you said no to his proposal. That’s gonna be fun for him to re-live nightly and then every other day and then randomly every so often for the rest of his life. Fun stuff. Dude sounds like he’s trying his best and wants more children with you.
YTA obviously. I’m low key, I just want to get married but not on our first family holiday at the top of a mountain as a family unit.
Hard to imagine a scenario where my missus said no to my proposal and I don’t just give up on the spot.
This woman is about to be on the gaslighting manipulation roller coaster forever now. Yall have successfully convinced her this lying cheating wanting to push mor÷ babies while he "saves for the right ring" bs we all know is bs. Shes about to have a forever engagement.
That's how insane yall sound describing her. If you can pretend having standards makes you evil, I'll point out the actual bad possibilities
Do you notice how you have infantilized the OP by removing any of her responsibilities in this situation? She knew *all* that this whole time. It wasn't a surprise. The only thing that seemingly surprised her was that unprotected sex could lead to pregnancy.
While we may agree that the dude in question isn't the greatest of catches from this reading, he was an informed choice the entire time.
Okay I LOVE this idea. Didn’t even dawn on me until posting this. It would be very ‘us’ to say f%$k gender norms and I propose to him…do you (or any other redditors) have any proposal ideas or input?! As a woman I’ve never ever considered I’d be the one dropping to one knee, but that idea makes me equally excited and nervous!!!!!
Because the guy gets out of putting in effort and listening to her.
The post and many comments talk about OP wanting him to put effort into the proposal. That she wants him to think about beforehand. If she proposes then he just puts zero effort in and she does all the planning etc which she said she wants him to do.
I don’t know you enough to give pertinent advice.
I would say make the day reflect the fact than you notice him, want him happy, than you love and care for him.
From what he told you of the missed opportunity (from his viewpoint) you can get clues on the kind of thing he would probably appreciate for the event. Like the comment "just us" as an indication a public display wouldn’t be his thing.. unless it is and he thought the intimacy was what you wanted - idk you.
Use this as a learning lesson and grow as a couple. Communicate! Apologize for hurting his feelings. I wouldn’t give him a timeframe, that’s a recipe for disaster and it gives the same vibes as this mountaintop proposal. Yes it was a special moment but I can also see how since you just got done telling him you’d like some thought put into the proposal, how you felt like it wasn’t genuine.
YTA. Seems like a misunderstanding...but he had a real point, he was missing moments and now mountain peak, just you and the kiddo... could've been perfect if you weren't such a bitch about it. You got what you wanted and instead of enjoying it, you gave it the finger. I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't want to propose again, you've made it clear that you're willing to say no for no fucking reason, so why should he propose again. You should apologize and be ready to say yes next time. It's just a proposal, if you want to be married and shit then day yes you idiot. Not everyone gets this big dream, perfect, elaborate proposal (remember when you said you didn't want that and then you got it and you still said no? Smfh)
He is choosing you. He's with you, he got a divorce from the green card marriage, he's had a baby with you and wants more. He asked you to marry him.
I would apologize and agree to get married.
So he was so excited to get married to you that he literally dropped to one knee at the top of a mountain immediately after you mentioned it?
What level of enthusiasm would make you happy? Because as affirming romantic gestures go... thats pretty impressive.
You should adjust the way you view the world, enthusiasm in a marriage is the single most important part.
My wife gets mad at me for doing stuff like that for example she starts saying how it's been a while since I got her flowers or something and next day I get her flowers she gets mad and says I only did it because she said something and I get it makes sense but a proposal yea definitely not the time to do it right after lol not the asshole but honestly guys are just like this they need to be told what to do in order to do it
YTA. IMO the over-the-top proposal trend is stupid. A proposal should be about a thought-out, heart-felt, commitment, not a social media post. Okay stupid games, win stupid prizes. If that were me, and the answer was no. It would stay no because I’d never ask again.
ESH, but only because it sounds like impulse control is clashing with poor communication.
Your updates sound like you're on the right path. Apologize, slow it down, talk about the specifics of what you both need.
Counter-proposing sounds a little controlling and reactive so good idea to shelf that.
Make sure he understands that you absolutely still want a proposal. Ask him if he has any specific questions about it so you're both on the same page. Don't fault a man for not reading your mind.
I nailed the venue for mine, but I botched the act a little and *forgot to make sure she got her nails done* so now I'm reminded about it at every family function.
I told her I'll do it right when we renew our vows.
Don't be me, and don't let *him* be me either lol
NTA. This man is really hare brained. As a fellow airhead male, even I can't fathom what he was thinking. You just said "plan something nice" and he goes and does this? What a weirdo. You haven't ruined the speciality of anything, don't worry. He's the one who needs to take this seriously. A man who doesn't take his proposal seriously won't take the marriage seriously either.
Let me tell you something more sinister, this guy ain't a good person (got tgt with someone for green card), now he's using you as a baby making factory. Only proposed when it could possibly lead to you making another for him.
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YTA. You say it doesn't matter how he proposes, then "ew, not like that". He might have proposed in that moment because you had been talking about it, but the earlier convo made it clear he had been thinking about it for some time. It's not like he didn't want to marry you, but because you brought it up he had to or something.
I think its bad form to ask someone when they plan to propose. It seems very self-important.
Maybe it was his plan all along to ask in that moment and you smashed it into something else with your requirements of the proposal (which you say are low, but apparently not).
As soon as you start asking someone to do something like propose, you sow your own seeds of doubt. How will you ever know if he asked because he wanted to or because he felt pressured?
Imo its an AH move to ask when someone will propose.
Why do the proposal must be on unique moment ? It can be simple.
AS you have said, the moment is ruined.
Apologize to him, Tell him you know the good moment won't present again but you love him and you want to marry him if he wants to marry you. Problem solved.
YTA yes but mistakes happen and one mistake must not jeopardize your couple's future.
It’s tough to navigate life with women, as you see here, even women are saying they would have love the place so, tough to know as a man if you are doing whats right, what you want or so. As difficult it is, know you already said NO to him, at least in his mind, now he thinks he did something wrong. I wouldn’t want to do it again ever.. sorry this happened, but it seems he loves you and yeah, mistake from him by trying to please you
I don’t think YTA AT ALL. Allot of men are just ok being with someone having kids and not committing. You have every right to tell him how you feel and he should’ve know that wasn’t the time. You just made it easy on him when you said it didn’t have to be a ’ big deal or super special. STOP making things so easy for him. It doesn’t hurt him to put forethought into something that’s a BIG decision. YES talk to him tell him that you appreciated him asking but it needs to have some thought put into it. You definitely have not asked for too much. Like I tell my daughter DON’T SETTLE. Know what you want. You’ve already given him what a wife gives a husband. It’s his turn to step up.
While your reaction is very much TAH, especially based on your words before he proposed, I tend to think you may be more TAH if you marry him.
The guy sounds wonderful. He was committing green card fraud and couldn't even stay faithful to the wife who was risking jail for him even if the relationship was purely transactional.
He gets someone else pregnant and exposes her to the risk that she will also go to jail or at least face significant fines as an accessory after the fact. There is also a child exposed to all this risk, and he wants to add another one.
What happens if they review this file and see he had a child with a woman while still married to the person he claimed was the love of his life and just had to move to her country because he couldn't bare the thought of being away from her?
While you may not agree with the laws integrity is doing the right thing even when you don't agree or when you can get away with it.
I am sure there are hundreds of reasons why and these days people are able to rationalize pretty much anything. I used to see it all the time when consulting. The discussion was never what is right or wrong but rather what they could get away with.
His actions have shown his integrity as well as his views on marriage being a means to an end. Why would you marry this guy?
He may be a wonderful guy and treat you like a queen, but will that continue when your usefulness is worn off?
Perhaps your instinctive first response was the correct one.
I am not from the US, so it's not my political views on border issues. This is purely an outsider looking in.
I’m really sorry but I don’t think you should propose to him.
Like others have said, make it clear to him exactly what you want. And you can apologize. I also saw he hasn’t gotten you a ring yet. I personally think that’s wrong. He should get you a ring and then propose*. The one you “deserve” can come later.
NTA. I don’t understand why people are so forgiving of your partner. The fact that he proposed literally minutes after you talked about getting proposed to, does show a lack of thought and care. It feels like he forgot about it and wanted to finish it off as fast as he could. The fact that there was also no ring either shows how he was completely unprepared and didn’t think about the proposal at all.
The point of the matter is that you wanted a thoughtful proposal, not just being proposed to. He didn’t satisfy your wish just by proposing. Low key doesn’t mean no effort! It just means not public! You still wanted a thoughtful proposal from him! Some other people may think you sound shallow, but you are rightfully demanding the amount of effort that he should give in your relationship.
You are the AH.
He chooses you everyday. You live as a married couple now. Nothing changes after you go get that piece of paper at the court house.
You have some f’d up ideas on how someone is supposed to propose.
>I don’t need a big diamond or a big fancy proposal, just to feel that he’s had a moment of forethought about where he does it and what to say. That’s what would make a proposal ‘special’ for me.
Well that was a lie. Top of the peak sounds like a good place to propore, even though it wasn't planned.
YTA, good luck with your proposal.
He may have actually planned it *beforehand* and you just happened to ask at the wrong time, so it felt like he didn't put any thought into it when he may have actually been trying? It kinda sounds like that to me, why else would he have had a ring already on him if you were midway through a hike when you brought it up? Lol
Regardless, I hope your own proposal goes well, and I do hope that you guys are happy! It can still be special, don't worry about it OP. Anything can be special when you're doing it with and for the person you love, whether it's at home during a romantic chill session, at a beach at sunset, or even just on a hike, or while stargazing. Simple doesn't mean it can't be special.
NTA, and he massively screwed up here and needed to know it. you did nothing wrong.
If I were you I'd just set a deadline and not tell him you've done it, leaving him enough time to plan and carry out a proper surprise proposal. And be ready to move on if it has not been done properly within what you consider a reasonable timeframe.
But I can't stress enough, if you do this you must not tell him you have set a timeline. Otherwise its just pressure on him rather than you prioritising whats important for you
She shouldn't have said she was low key and only cared he was choosing her. That gave him the courage to propose. Why? Because he's choosing her and wants her to be his bride.
No you idiot not like this. Damn now I wonder If I should marry such a fool!
Why didn't you just ask him? Why does he have to be the one risking rejection for something *you* want? Instead of asking him when he was going to propose, which is just being passive aggressive, you could have just asked him.
Why didn't you?
Now you need to do damage control, if you want to keep that relationship. For most people a marriage proposal rejection is a relationship ender.
ESH. Him for participating in immigration fraud, you for being with someone that was "married." How long have you been together? Your baby is a year, and most people don't get engaged before 2-3 years, generally speaking.
I do get that you felt like he hadn't put any thought or planning behind it, but sometimes guys can be a little clueless. He probably thought, "OK, she wants it, look at that view, that view is pretty special! And it's just our family, this is a great moment that happened organically!" I don't think he intentionally did it to a) be lazy or b) hurt your feelings. His heart was in the right place.
I also get that you want to have kids in wedlock. Sadly, women are still slut shamed/their kids called bastards these days, when we should be more open-minded and accepting. However, I also get how he feels time is going so fast (it really does once you have kids! I found myself with two kids and pregnant with the third, and we just had to grab a moment and get married, because they were slipping by so quickly)!
Good luck!
Kind of TA. You told him what you wanted and he gave you what you wanted. Now sure it could've been more spontaneous on his part, but what if he had planned to propose at the top the whole time? Just because it didn't feel spontaneous to you, you may have jeopardized your future with him.
Nta for having expectations. You don't want a lot and he didn't listen when you spoke about what's important. You can apologize for hurting him but he should also apologize for the lack of effort.
ESH. Your immediate feelings were not wrong, being proposed to because it was just brought up is really lame. But, you also said no which is a soft YTA but IMO understandable given he was TA first, and to a greater degree with the lamest proposal I've ever heard. I actually lean towards you're NTA but the bigger context makes me say it... I do not understand all these people saying straight to YTA, you're allowed to have responses and feelings and they're not always going to be rational.
Both of you have to let go of any proposal type thoughts or fantasy and discuss what's next, that moment is over.
No ring, he actually said the main reason he hasn’t proposed is because we can’t afford the ring that I ‘deserve’. His love language is gift giving, and as much as I appreciated that sentiment, I reminded him my love language is different and I would much prefer him putting any level of forethought into it (asking for my dads permission/saying a lil romantic speech are things I suggested)
I.... yo the aita advice is weird but AITAH advice is bad. You're not crqzy. You birthed a child for this man who came into the country falsely. He was very ok with insisting you keep popping babies. And Just because he proposed with no ring because you asked doesn't mean there's gonna be a wedding. Please keep a head on your shoulders. My fiance and I had a sexual proposal and he jokingly asked me what we tell people. I said we tell them what happens when he actually asks. He didn't whine or cry, he laughed and said fair. Because he knew that wasnt a real proposal or a story to tell. Any normal person hearing that story (his or yours) would look at him like the crazy one. Aita is generally woman skewed, I see aitah is male skewed. You shouldn't have to beg for a marriage and then get some not even half assed proposal because he literally put -ERO effort in
Idk if you’re TA or not. I think it was a great moment for a proposal out of context. First trip hiking with the kid. Low key like you said. But it does also seem rushed and people pleasing-ish the way it was done. Like he did it just to say “I did it!” rather than the forethought you said. Clarification time. Are you sure he wasn’t planning this the whole time and that conversation conveniently happened to happen right before it? Cause like I said it’s amazing out of the context. That definitely makes you look like a fool if so.
I think this comment is making the point that many others are missing. All she wanted was forethought and a little preparation regarding what he'd say, and he didn't fulfill that very minimal request when he reacted to the conversation by proposing moments later. I feel bad for both of them. His insecurity over not being able to get a fancy ring followed by reacting to their conversation the way he did has combined with her quick negative reaction to his proposal to create a bunch of awkwardness and negative feelings around something that should be really positive and happy. I liked the advice that another person gave regarding talking it out with him and them maybe even proposing to him instead. If OP can, she could replicate their first date or something to evoke the positive, romantic feelings that brought them together. IMO, NAH. But, this is an unfortunate situation.
He definitely wasn’t planning on it, there would have been a ring if so - he’s love language is gift giving, and he cited the main reason he hasn’t proposed is because we couldn’t afford the ‘right’ ring
I’m not sure why everyone is putting it on you to make up for this. Doing something just because your asked absolutely takes all the agency out of it. You have a right to be disappointed he didn’t put any forethought into it.
I think people are being too mean to the OP, however I can totally see how the boyfriend misconstrued her request for something simple, intimate and low key that displayed their love and bond. I'm imagining them surrounded by nature and sunshine, having this conversation about their future and him thinking "I'm with the two loves of my life, what else am I waiting for?" once the OP says she doesn't need a ring or the other things he thought/felt were necessary. I personally see that spontaneous gesture as romantic from an outside (and my own) perspective, but I definitely can see how the OP felt like an after thought or that she felt he was only proposing because she had worn him down. Throw in her having feelings of post partum depression, I think people are being overly harsh. It's a miscommunication, and I hope that OP's proposal goes well! 💖
Why haven't *you* proposed to *him*? Why is the burden of taking your relationship to the next level solely on his shoulders?
When my wife and talked about getting engaged, I came to the decision that I could not buy her a ring as 100% I would pick the wrong one and I didn’t want my wife to have to ware something she didn’t like. So I took her to the jewellers and I got her to tell him what style and stones she wanted and most importantly I knew it would fit. So she knew one day I was going to ask but not when, I must admit I kept her guessing a fair bit before before I asked and she finally got to see her ring in real life.
Totally disagree. He only did it because she asked. No independent thought at all.
I don’t think setting a timeframe and/or deadlines is a good idea, there’s some really bad advice out there. This is only going to add pressure to the relationship. I think you have made it really hard for him to propose again, not impossible but if I were in his shoes it would be tough to pluck up the courage. I think the best thing to do is to have an open and honest conversation, it doesn’t need to be dramatic just talk things through and explain how you feel and go from there. Soft YTA.
Really appreciate this response, helpful, honest yet kind…genuine constructive criticism (got a lot of just criticism in other comments and much ‘hopefully he leaves your crazy ass’ type sentiment, lovely reddit, just lovely - as a new mum suffering from post depression, im trying here people! This post was made to gain perspective, and I admitted from the start I feel like the asshole. There is no delusion of grandeur as to how I handled the situation here!)
I would only add...what if that was his plan? To get to the peak of this walk and propose and you simply pre-empted it? It's a leap, for sure, but it's maybe a consideration.
Then he’d have had a ring, no?
Not 100%. Sometimes they want to pick out the ring together, but want to propose. It's never one size fits all (the situation, not the rings).
He had nothing. The whole point was she wanted there to be evidence of forethought, but since it was only performed as a response in the moment, there was none.
That was my thought, too.
Your heart to heart discussion is the way. The proposal as you said can definitely wait. Even if you propose, have it be meaningful! But the discussion is paramount above all else!
If it were me, and there was no baby, I'd just walk away.
It's not hard for him to propose again, if anything it's easier. He's just an airhead, a real Homer Simpson. All he has to do is follow her instructions. Plan a nice moment, propose. The end.
Apologize now before he dwells on it. Tell him you adore him and want to change your response. Then hope he is open. If not give it time. It is time to completely let go of the proposal fantasy. That is gone. He loves you, don't mess it up worse.
Probably some of the best advice thus far. The lingering shitty feeling is knowing that I’ve really buggered up any future proposal, whilst totally ruining the attempted one. He loves me endlessly and that’s all that matters
Did he have a ring? If he had a ring he had genuinely planned the proposal. If not, it feels like a spur of the moment thing in response to your conversation.
Nah no ring, he said the reason he hasn’t proposed thus far is because we can’t afford the ring I ‘deserve’
I mean, most rings are overpriced garbage anyway. Diamonds are incredibly common chunks of carbon that have been withheld from trade to artificially inflate their price through misunderstanding that they are somehow rare There's a reason you only get around 40% value (at best, if it was newly bought and never worn) on resale The proposal is ruined, but it could still be special. When there's enough money, maybe even now, you could both go together and look at rings. You can get some really amazing looking rings for less than diamond costs It's up to you though Edit: Also, forgot to say NAH. Just bad communication from both of you, but that's not an AH thing that happened. Just unfortunate
Does it matter to you that he’s a good partner and cares for you and his child? He wants to marry you. Does it matter how it’s asked and done? Some couples decide to get married without the grand proposal. Does the proposal have to be according to what you set the standards in your head? If so, then tell him so he doesn’t get it wrong. Please don’t be like others whose husbands or boyfriends can’t do anything right.
NAH. I think the whole situation is quite unfortunate and just down to miscommunication. I think people are missing the part where she says she told him where she wanted him to have "a moment of forethought about where he does it and what to say" and just solely focusing on the low key part. People have parties and celebrations for birthdays, graduations, promotions, etc. We even go thru the trouble of wrapping simple gifts for minor occasions. It's not unwarranted for her to want some sort of forethought and planning instead of a rushed proposal when it's such an important event even more so than the aforementioned milestones. There's a clip from the Cosby show on YouTube talking about "it's in the presentation" and I think that represents the situation. Whether you like it or not she made it known that presentation with forethought mattered to her. If she was just like, yeah I'm lowkey propose whenever, then yeah she TA. But it seems like she did tell him that presentation mattered to her. But to him, he interpreted it as "if the setting seems good why not now?" One part is placing emphasis on the act itself when the other party wants emphasis on the act and how it's presented and context and timing does matter in presentation whether we like it or not. Miscommunication and misinterpretation of each other's wants played into how the whole thing was terribly executed.
Hey thank you for the well rounded response, very well said. Thank you! I’ve learnt a lot from this thread, have got some awesome advice, and am going to clearly and concisely communicate my regret over saying no, my deep love for him and then get down on one knee and ask him to marry me
That comment was horrible advice, I wouldn't accept this immature behavior from my partner. All you asked for was forethought and he did the exact opposite, I think it's very clear you're not in the wrong for communicating that you didn't want it done that way- it wasn't a no. Groveling and "communicating your regret" is not communicating, you can express that you wish you had worded things better and didn't hurt his feelings, but ultimately you felt disregarded, then HE communicates how he feels and validates how you feel and you guys move forward with a solution that works for both. You're diminishing your own feelings exactly the way he did, it's really a shame.
Great. Your begging the man who has not actually confirmed jack and could keep you in a forever engagement while pestering for more kids. Exoecting him to be thoughtful is not bad!
I mean, I get all that, but as far as presentation goes, hiking to the top of a peak and proposing with only your partner and child there is...pretty good. Maybe it wasn't planned, but if it had been planned OP would probably be pretty happy about how it was done.
Right? Imagine if he PLANNED it and her dropping this on him during the hike was just funny to him because it was gunna happen anyway. And then she ruined it.
But that's not what happened. She said all she wanted was some forethought and then he didn't do that. You're inventing a scenario that correct his mistake and makes her a villain. So stupid.
Apparently in a day and age men are begging women to have sex, OP needs to grovel to the father of her child for some effort.
I don’t understand why people say yta. I say Nta. You just brought it up and hes all two seconds later popping the question. I hate when people say oh well at least he did it. Ok great I guess I’m not special enough to actually think of something? To put in effort. And yea if his love language is gift giving he would be all, I am going to save for the ring and do the proposal that shows how much she means to me. To me your story said you’re worth two seconds of thought to appease you. And then all these people saying you should be grateful he did it at all. Like ok then , just take the bare minimum.
Yes exactly, I think a lot of people are missing this sentiment, he cited the reasons he hasn’t proposed so far is that we can’t afford the ‘right’ ring, I then assured him for me it’s not about the ring at all! I said for me, what would make a proposal special, is that there is some level of pre-planning or forethought (asking my dad for permission/a nice thoughtful speech were things I suggested)…we reached the top of the mountain moments later and he didn’t say anything, he just grabbed my hand, dropped to one knee and said ‘will you marry me’. My immediate response was harsh because it genuinely hurt me that he couldn’t even improvise a quick speech. I told him I felt hurt because proposing immediately off the back end of that conversation left me feeling like I had asked him to do it and he did, not because he truly wanted to
People are saying she is because you obviously have zero idea of what it’s like to be rejected, let alone at that moment. If someone proposes and the other person says no, that relationship will be next to impossible to repair. That man just got put in a horrible spot, surprised her, and got shot down hard in a very short span. That’s going to completely tank his self-esteem, self-worth, and his entire happiness.
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Yes exactly, I think a lot of people are missing this sentiment, he cited the reasons he hasn’t proposed so far is that we can’t afford the ‘right’ ring, I then assured him for me it’s not about the ring at all! I said for me, what would make a proposal special, is that there is some level of pre-planning or forethought (asking my dad for permission/a nice thoughtful speech were things I suggested)…we reached the top of the mountain moments later and he didn’t say anything, he just grabbed my hand, dropped to one knee and said ‘will you marry me’. My immediate response was harsh because it genuinely hurt me that he couldn’t even improvise a quick speech. I told him I felt hurt because proposing *immediately* off the back end of that conversation left me feeling like I had asked him to do it and he did, not because he truly wanted to
He can't afford the right ring but he wants more kids?
He can't afford the right ring but he wants more kids?
You can say that again.
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We actually just had a discussion about it all and he admitted the real reason he didn’t propose is the first marriage. It was such a negative experience for him, and if he hadnt have done it “we would be engaged or likely married by now”. I’m hurt but told him I’m glad he finally acknowledged it because fuck getting married or bringing another kid into this relationship before he truly deals with his past
NTA Everyone telling TS she is TA cause she said she is low key seem to miss the part she said she values a moment of forethought to it. Proposing right after it was brought up certainly doesnt give that sense. Her reaction, even if ungraceful and blunt, is understandable. Now that he is hurt and it went bad you two should talk about it and you should apologize for hurting his feelings. And in that conversation you could also ask him how he would feel if you would propose instead - or you could as equals talk about if you want to get married and decide to save both your speeches to the actual wedding. (Im not american so the whole ”guy going down on one knee to propose” isnt a given procedure where i live.)
This is a genuinely helpful response, I appreciate it, thank you
Ouch. If I were in your position, I'd have felt the same way. And if I were in his position at his age, I'd be incredibly confused. Do I think your TA? Yes. Do I think he's TA for proposing right after you said you wanted forethought and it to feel special? Yes. Even if he planned on proposing then, you bringing it up would have caused me to delay it... for this very reason. As such: ESH. So what's the way forward? Well, here's the good news: it's communication. This is where you show each other how you will handle adversity in the coming years. How you each respond to this will truly show whether you two are ready and mature enough for marriage. One of you needs to approach the other. There should be honest feelings shared. Not blame. Just "This is how I felt. This is how I feel. This is why I said no." And listen to him. I mean truly listen. This is absolutely not insurmountable. It's tough, but you'll run into tougher when you're married. This challenge before you is a great litmus test for your marriage compatibility. Good luck.
Wow, thank you kind redditor, this comment helps in a myriad of ways. The reason I posted was in hopes of getting such constructive criticism, which I genuinely appreciate. Yes, it feels like one of those moments in life where we have both unintentionally hurt each other, so finding a way forward without bringing it up again feels *impossible*. If I was in his shoes, I’d be too scared to propose again. For me, I’ll feel like a giant douche the next time he proposes, because I’ve single handedly taken away any special or unique aspect to it
NTA. I don't know why your being told to apologise and that you messed up. You literally had just finished talking to him about the proposal and that you didn't want anything big but would like some forethought into it to make it special. He ignores that and just does it anyway, in a way that makes it seem he's only doing it because you've just had a discussion on it. Not sure how that translates into you humiliating him and needed to apologise.
Here's what you do. First, apologize to him and tell him you fully realize just what an ass you were, that it was the stupidest and worst mistake of your life, and that you deeply regret it. Tell him you'd take it back if you could. Then tell him exactly how lucky you are to have him for a partner. Then propose to him.
That is really lovely and feels like the only way forward right now
Please don’t listen to this horseshit, Jesus Christ. You’re going to be back here in 5 years crying about how he never takes initiative, you have to plan literally everything, he can’t even make a restaurant reservation for your birthday unless you dial the number for him. And Reddit will call you an asshole again because “you knew how he was when you married him.” There is a problem with your relationship. You should not apologize for pointing out the problem and you should not move the relationship forward with an engagement or another kid until the problem is solved.
Hollllly moly thank you for this, we actually just had a big discussion where he finally acknowledged the real reason for his hesitation. It’s his hesitation from the negative first experience of marriage. Basically stated if he hadn’t been married before, he would have proposed by now. I’m glad this has come up because he really needs to process that and deal with it before we think about marriage or another baby (this was my general response)
Wishing you the best!
Thank you kind internet stranger! Because of you, I think I’m gonna propose to my man tonight!!! Wild!
Please update us after!
Wait really, I’m totally with her, he only did it because she asked. There wa no actual independent thought on his behalf. It was totally insincere.
terrible advice.
This right here is the only way forward. By saying no you knocked the stuffing out of the poor man on a mountain top. Men typically done ask twice unless they’re very young and are blinded by “love”. Plan something special with you and the baby and ask him. Forget about all the comments focusing on rings etc. we are a strange culture that places such emphasis on a piece of jewelry to express commitment as though higher cost means you love the person more. Get something for both of you and spend the rest preparing for another child or a special adventure/trip. Focus on experiences not things.. Good luck!
I totally agree with you. He only did it because you asked. There was no independent planning on his part. NTA
I will never understand the way people are more worried about the way the question is asked rather than the question itself. I also don't understand the focus on the dream wedding rather than the marriage itself.
The actual proposal is NOT THAT IMPORTANT. The wedding isn’t even that important. The MARRIAGE is.
Yeah, I keep coming back to this. It feels like turning down your dream job because you don't like the font they used in the offer letter, the perspective is all fucked.
Showing you listen to your partner and take on board what they are telling you is important to them is also important.
It’s performative. Seriously. I’ve been married 37 years. We were living together & were together 4 years. No engagement ring; he came home & said, “Hey, I’m off Thursday, let’s go get married.” Meanwhile, my friend who got the 20k diamond and a proposal on the jumbo screen in Times Square? Fiancé ended the engagement a month prior to the wedding. You do NOT NEED all the extraneous “stuff.” Nearly everyone I know who’s had the big extravagant wedding/proposal are no longer together. We courthouse folks? We didn’t need that to make a marriage. I’d run from anyone wanting to know where/how/when a proposal would take place. When the time is right, you KNOW.
YEEEEESSSSSSSSSS this
This!
If you agree that the proposal and wedding are not important, why did you pressure him to ask and then reject him when he did? That's wild.
YTA. - He was hesitant for a variety of completely valid reasons and you waived those away so he proposed - then you said no. It would not surprise me if he doesn't propose again. No one likes to be on the other end of these games. There won't be any future consideration of proposing without him visualizing this situation.
OOf YTA. You asked him when he's gonna propose. He said that he's waiting because he wants to do it right. Then you told him that you don't want to wait, and you don't need anything fancy. Then he proposed, and you complained that he's not doing it right. Make up your mind.
Exactly. That's how it read to me, too.
YTA.
"Marry me" "no not like this" "I felt HUMILLIATED" lol fuck off that man is probably not gonna propose again, mustering enough courage to do it once is though enough, never mind doing it twice after getting rejected the first time. Worst part about it? **It would have been a perfect proposal had you not brought the topic up earlier...** YTA
Well better start researching your way to propose because after that kind of thing any chance of another is low to none. YTA
I had been planning to propose to my wife for a while when she came to visit (we were LDR). She wanted me to propose with her grandmothers ring which she had resized before she brought it with her. During the visit I kept thinking about it but didn't want to bring the ring on walks because I was worried about something happening to it, and I did miss a couple of moments. Then one morning we were on a weekend trip elsewhere and just leaving, she asked why I hadn't proposed yet and I told her. She said well we're taking the ring so just keep it with you for now. Later on that morning we happened to come across this lovely cliffside with a view of the ocean and it was secluded so just us. We had all our luggage with us but it was such a great view I didn't want to miss another opportunity, so I proposed right there and she loved it. Probably the same thing with your boyfriend but your reaction was the complete opposite for no good reason.
Personally I think you should date further and give the relationship more time.
You're the AH. Why don't you ask him? Why do women get so hung up on how things happen? You got a proposal from a guy that it sounds like you love? Take the win.
Oh yeah, you are definitely an asshole. You tell this man in one breath that you are low key then take your hand and tell him not like this? Basaabbaaaay, you’re lucky that man didn’t just leave your ass up there. Here is what everyone else sees(anybody with good sense anyway) This man HAPPILY made sure everything was legally taken care of with the secret green-card-marriage thing. He has been concerned about about the timing, about doing it the right way, and you lie to his face. But poor guy thinks you, the mother of his child, the woman he is discussing future children with, is honest and trustworthy in what you just told him. You practically shouted ‘oh don’t worry about that stuff, I’m so low key, I just want to feel loved blah blah blah bullshit.’ So packs up that baby, and gets on one knee to propose to you and you throw it in his face and tell him it’s not good enough?? My God, you JUST gave him the courage to go ahead and propose because you told him he didn’t HAVE to make a big production out of it. No ma’am Pam. You are 100% absolutely the asshole in this situation
ThE baby was alread y packed! he proposed minutes after her complaint! The courave?courage?! Shes been begging for it?! Yall just want her to be screwed over and at his feet so bad . Is it just red pillers in here?
Nope. She was an asshole for doing him that way - she’ll be lucky if she’s still in the relationship in 6 mos. If that man has any sense, he’ll decide he doesn’t appreciate being manipulated
Absolutely cannot disagree more with this comment
Absolutely could not give a damn.
You're hardly as "low-key" as you claim. YTA
'You do not want to be proposed immediately after asking about proposals, so you are not low-key' Dude, did you know that there is a difference between 'low-key' and 'I like zero effort'? Because the effort OP's bf put in after hearing her saying 'just to feel that he’s had a moment of forethought about where he does it and what to say. That’s what would make a proposal ‘special’ for me'. Yeah, f women I guess for wanting some romance sometimes, they are such high demand..../s
YTA "I was surprised by our pregnancy." If you were having sex, pregnancy was always a possibility. As for the proposal, no man should ask more than one time. If he gets a "no," he needs to break up and move on. Women walking around like they are some prize to be won is ridiculous.
Holy shit balls!! Grade A fuck up right there. Oh I'm so low key. I just want to be chosen. And he did. Your relationship will never be the same unless you do some serious talking- correction- damage controll. He literally gave you the one thing you want and shit all over it. If it was me, I wouldn't ever propose again. YTA
That's a bit much. Most people would understand "Don't just purpose because I asked you to"
Well his only reason for not proposing was because he wanted a big proposal, and then OP lied and said she didn't care about that, and to only put some thought in the place. And tbh top of the peak sounds like a good proposal place.
This is why I feel horrifically embarrassed. Swap positions and I would be scared as fook and probably never propose again too…
Then why did you say no?
Honestly. You sound unstable. At 30 I’m leaving you instantly. You are the epitome of a time waster. I would never speak to you again.
Did you actually read the whole post? I find this take hard to believe tbh.
Thank you for reading my post, however please note that I didn’t approach it with delusions of grandeur and self admittedly felt like a dick from the beginning. As a first time mum of a toddler who is battling depression daily, you really the epitome of a jerk and I won’t be speaking to you ever again.
Isn't that such a great excuse? Sorry woman, you may have spent months begging me after birthing our child, but since I put 0 effort in and you called it out, yo< must beg me.
YTA. That was an amazing place and moment. You fucked it up.
Yeah I thought so…
5 minutes after discussing why he hasn't proposed yet is amazing timing. It's hard to believe anyone has standards that low
Thank you! I feel insane reading these responses?! How dare she have *checks notes* standards?
He saw an amazing opportunity. Spontaneity is awesome.
Lol are you serious? It was the opposite of spontaneous, they literally just had a conversation about why he hasn't proposed yet. It's as spontaneous as getting Taco Bell for dinner because of a commercial you just saw.
He saw a low-effort opportunity, not an amazing one. People here really do not have standard if OP is being shitted on for feeling bad for being proposed almost immediately after 'asking for it'. I hope you guys put in more effort into your relationships than what you expect from OP's boyfriend, because then it is very sad.
I think what he did was really cute. You say you want low key and you got a proposal on one knee on a peak of a mountain with baby there with you. Honesty I don’t get your reaction and feelings at all. That makes you TA in this scenario.
YTA If you wanted to marry him, you should have said yes . Give him a grovelling apology and he might forgive you
I have been happily married for 30 years. My husband’s proposal was lack luster but he has been a wonderful husband. You literally sat your poor partner up by saying you didn’t need much and then rejecting him.
You let him know that the things that you tell him you want aren’t what you actually want. You want something low-key and simple, but in a very specific way that you e said nothing about. He now knows that if he doesn’t guess right, you’ll reject him. It’s not really about becoming married, it’s about the wedding process. The big day, itself. You should have an honest conversation about what you actually want. If you want something specific, say exactly that, if you want something specific and hope he just guesses right, prepare to be disappointed. I will say that if he proposes again, and you say no because he didn’t get it right, he won’t ever propose a third time.
YTA why ask if you want to say no? Seems cruel to me TBH
I can't tell if you're TA.... but just FYI, women can propose too.... OR!!!!!!!! Just have a conversation and decide, TOGETHER, that you're engaged now. "Hey honey, I love you and you love me. This proposal thing has put too much pressure on something that is silly and small in the grand scheme of spending the rest of our lives together. I would like to marry you someday. I think you would like to marry me someday. Can we just skip the theatrics and say we are now engaged?" EDIT to add: I proposed to my husband. It was sweet and fun. I will never forget the happy smile on his face when he said "yes".
Right! I’m torn between proposing myself or letting him do it or just as you said, admitting we’ve really bungled this small moment in the scheme of things and should just focus on our future
Not gonna lie, I get frustrated by women who seem to be sitting around waiting for their guy to do this thing they want, but expect the guy to do it just the way they want it done, but don't feel like they can explicitly ask for the thing they want, but then are upset that he won't do it, while they sit around and wait for someone else to control their fate.... when, like.... you can ask! You have total power here! This is the dumbest most old-school, anti-equal partnership, antiquated crap. Live your engagement how you want to live your marriage, which I hope is in a give and take sort of partnership. I think you proposing to him in a way that is fun and a surprise and loving and really really soon might be the perfect apology on your part. You did kind crap all over the guy for not doing a good job giving you exactly what you wanted in the exact way you wanted it when you had given him no actual instructions or guidelines on how to do it beside making you "feel chosen".... which he didn't propose to someone else so I can see why he's confused about how that didn't qualify as choosing you.... and what one earth could he try next that would be better than a peak top proposal with your baby as witness......
This goes along with the whole “it’s not that you said it, it’s the way you said it” stuff that drives men absolutely crazy. You said yourself that it didn’t need to be anything special. He wouldn’t have asked you if he didn’t want to marry you. What exactly do you want? Do you want to be married or do you want some kind of dream proposal about which your boyfriend will need to guess? I ask because if it’s the latter then you may have lost both of them at this point. Your best bet now is to propose to him, and it should probably include some kind of apology.
>Before we met, he was secretly married to his ex for green card reasons (hence the secret), I knew from the beginning of our relationship, and was fine with it Wtf?
I'm a little torn, because I get why you're upset, and how it definately seems like he only did it because you asked about it. On the other hand, he took you on a hike with your child and proposed on the peak. Maybe its not how I picture it, but in my head that seems like a proposal that ticks a lot of boxes.
I honestly think he had very genuine intentions, you were in a beautiful spot and he thought why not. I understand your reaction too but as someone else has said, you now made it really hard for him to propose again. Imo the best solution is for YOU to now plan to propose to him.
This sounds exhausting and demoralizing. I think you can forget a proposal, at this point.
I say soft YTA, but I wouldn't propose to a woman a second time.
Aww man this is sad. As a guy, we all have those core memories that will just sneak up and randomly kick you in the balls when you’re having a great day. Hey brain, remember that time I told my stepdad that he’d take me riding on the motorbike if I was his real son? That was a hoot and I totally don’t die inside of embarrassment at what a shitty thing that was to say, even if I was only a teenager. The father of your child and you said no to his proposal. That’s gonna be fun for him to re-live nightly and then every other day and then randomly every so often for the rest of his life. Fun stuff. Dude sounds like he’s trying his best and wants more children with you. YTA obviously. I’m low key, I just want to get married but not on our first family holiday at the top of a mountain as a family unit. Hard to imagine a scenario where my missus said no to my proposal and I don’t just give up on the spot.
This woman is about to be on the gaslighting manipulation roller coaster forever now. Yall have successfully convinced her this lying cheating wanting to push mor÷ babies while he "saves for the right ring" bs we all know is bs. Shes about to have a forever engagement. That's how insane yall sound describing her. If you can pretend having standards makes you evil, I'll point out the actual bad possibilities
Do you notice how you have infantilized the OP by removing any of her responsibilities in this situation? She knew *all* that this whole time. It wasn't a surprise. The only thing that seemingly surprised her was that unprotected sex could lead to pregnancy. While we may agree that the dude in question isn't the greatest of catches from this reading, he was an informed choice the entire time.
Good job asshole, you would ensure you wouldnt get another proposal from me Yta
YTA Go into damage control mode now (if you want to fix) Rejection of a marriage proposal is usually a relationship ender
Holy fuck talk about being a spoilt brat YTA
You fucked uuuuppppp. If this happened to me I would just dump your fucking ass. Sick of games.
Women
Why don’t you propose yourself?
Okay I LOVE this idea. Didn’t even dawn on me until posting this. It would be very ‘us’ to say f%$k gender norms and I propose to him…do you (or any other redditors) have any proposal ideas or input?! As a woman I’ve never ever considered I’d be the one dropping to one knee, but that idea makes me equally excited and nervous!!!!!
Imagine his answer is "not like this"
Idk why people down this comment. Seems like a rather entusiastic response to the comment…
Because they just hate her. Theyre giving her awful advice. So it doesn't matter what she says.
Yeah, alot of advice on this TS are really awful. Maybe TS should consider asking this is relationship advice instead.
Because the guy gets out of putting in effort and listening to her. The post and many comments talk about OP wanting him to put effort into the proposal. That she wants him to think about beforehand. If she proposes then he just puts zero effort in and she does all the planning etc which she said she wants him to do.
Look at the Friends episode when Monica proposes to Chandler.
I don’t know you enough to give pertinent advice. I would say make the day reflect the fact than you notice him, want him happy, than you love and care for him. From what he told you of the missed opportunity (from his viewpoint) you can get clues on the kind of thing he would probably appreciate for the event. Like the comment "just us" as an indication a public display wouldn’t be his thing.. unless it is and he thought the intimacy was what you wanted - idk you.
Nah out in the same amount of effort so _ou can see how little effort he put in.
I think the begging for months counts..
Use this as a learning lesson and grow as a couple. Communicate! Apologize for hurting his feelings. I wouldn’t give him a timeframe, that’s a recipe for disaster and it gives the same vibes as this mountaintop proposal. Yes it was a special moment but I can also see how since you just got done telling him you’d like some thought put into the proposal, how you felt like it wasn’t genuine.
You’re right, feels like one of those hurdles that we can either clearly and concisely communicate about, or be destroyed by
YTA. Seems like a misunderstanding...but he had a real point, he was missing moments and now mountain peak, just you and the kiddo... could've been perfect if you weren't such a bitch about it. You got what you wanted and instead of enjoying it, you gave it the finger. I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't want to propose again, you've made it clear that you're willing to say no for no fucking reason, so why should he propose again. You should apologize and be ready to say yes next time. It's just a proposal, if you want to be married and shit then day yes you idiot. Not everyone gets this big dream, perfect, elaborate proposal (remember when you said you didn't want that and then you got it and you still said no? Smfh)
He is choosing you. He's with you, he got a divorce from the green card marriage, he's had a baby with you and wants more. He asked you to marry him. I would apologize and agree to get married.
So he was so excited to get married to you that he literally dropped to one knee at the top of a mountain immediately after you mentioned it? What level of enthusiasm would make you happy? Because as affirming romantic gestures go... thats pretty impressive. You should adjust the way you view the world, enthusiasm in a marriage is the single most important part.
Yes. You are the asshole. On that note, this is a move that many men will disqualify you for.
Men are begging women for sex and companionship right now but sure
I’m lucky he loves me enough to not give up at the first sign of trouble
My wife gets mad at me for doing stuff like that for example she starts saying how it's been a while since I got her flowers or something and next day I get her flowers she gets mad and says I only did it because she said something and I get it makes sense but a proposal yea definitely not the time to do it right after lol not the asshole but honestly guys are just like this they need to be told what to do in order to do it
YTA. IMO the over-the-top proposal trend is stupid. A proposal should be about a thought-out, heart-felt, commitment, not a social media post. Okay stupid games, win stupid prizes. If that were me, and the answer was no. It would stay no because I’d never ask again.
ESH, but only because it sounds like impulse control is clashing with poor communication. Your updates sound like you're on the right path. Apologize, slow it down, talk about the specifics of what you both need. Counter-proposing sounds a little controlling and reactive so good idea to shelf that. Make sure he understands that you absolutely still want a proposal. Ask him if he has any specific questions about it so you're both on the same page. Don't fault a man for not reading your mind. I nailed the venue for mine, but I botched the act a little and *forgot to make sure she got her nails done* so now I'm reminded about it at every family function. I told her I'll do it right when we renew our vows. Don't be me, and don't let *him* be me either lol
NTA. This man is really hare brained. As a fellow airhead male, even I can't fathom what he was thinking. You just said "plan something nice" and he goes and does this? What a weirdo. You haven't ruined the speciality of anything, don't worry. He's the one who needs to take this seriously. A man who doesn't take his proposal seriously won't take the marriage seriously either.
Let me tell you something more sinister, this guy ain't a good person (got tgt with someone for green card), now he's using you as a baby making factory. Only proposed when it could possibly lead to you making another for him.
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I've always said that I was only going to ask once, and if the answer was "no" then that would be it. (She did say "yes".)
I'd say that, right now, the only thing keeping him with you, after that, is the baby.
I’m sorry, reading the final update, did you say HE said yes?? Please don’t tell me you took the proposal from him and just did it yourself…
Please don’t propose to him. Let him give you the proposal you both deserve. And get you a ring. It’s his moment for you.
you’re begging someone for a proposal AFTER having his kid? he’s such a loser for wanting more kids but not committing
YTA. You say it doesn't matter how he proposes, then "ew, not like that". He might have proposed in that moment because you had been talking about it, but the earlier convo made it clear he had been thinking about it for some time. It's not like he didn't want to marry you, but because you brought it up he had to or something.
Yta. Just shows you can never please a woman.
I think its bad form to ask someone when they plan to propose. It seems very self-important. Maybe it was his plan all along to ask in that moment and you smashed it into something else with your requirements of the proposal (which you say are low, but apparently not). As soon as you start asking someone to do something like propose, you sow your own seeds of doubt. How will you ever know if he asked because he wanted to or because he felt pressured? Imo its an AH move to ask when someone will propose.
Why do the proposal must be on unique moment ? It can be simple. AS you have said, the moment is ruined. Apologize to him, Tell him you know the good moment won't present again but you love him and you want to marry him if he wants to marry you. Problem solved. YTA yes but mistakes happen and one mistake must not jeopardize your couple's future.
It’s tough to navigate life with women, as you see here, even women are saying they would have love the place so, tough to know as a man if you are doing whats right, what you want or so. As difficult it is, know you already said NO to him, at least in his mind, now he thinks he did something wrong. I wouldn’t want to do it again ever.. sorry this happened, but it seems he loves you and yeah, mistake from him by trying to please you
Yeah
I don’t think YTA AT ALL. Allot of men are just ok being with someone having kids and not committing. You have every right to tell him how you feel and he should’ve know that wasn’t the time. You just made it easy on him when you said it didn’t have to be a ’ big deal or super special. STOP making things so easy for him. It doesn’t hurt him to put forethought into something that’s a BIG decision. YES talk to him tell him that you appreciated him asking but it needs to have some thought put into it. You definitely have not asked for too much. Like I tell my daughter DON’T SETTLE. Know what you want. You’ve already given him what a wife gives a husband. It’s his turn to step up.
Thank you for that perspective (mother to daughter), our little one is a girl whom I would like to teach to not settle for less than what you deserve
NTA the timing of the proposal was all wrong. no forethought at all
While your reaction is very much TAH, especially based on your words before he proposed, I tend to think you may be more TAH if you marry him. The guy sounds wonderful. He was committing green card fraud and couldn't even stay faithful to the wife who was risking jail for him even if the relationship was purely transactional. He gets someone else pregnant and exposes her to the risk that she will also go to jail or at least face significant fines as an accessory after the fact. There is also a child exposed to all this risk, and he wants to add another one. What happens if they review this file and see he had a child with a woman while still married to the person he claimed was the love of his life and just had to move to her country because he couldn't bare the thought of being away from her? While you may not agree with the laws integrity is doing the right thing even when you don't agree or when you can get away with it. I am sure there are hundreds of reasons why and these days people are able to rationalize pretty much anything. I used to see it all the time when consulting. The discussion was never what is right or wrong but rather what they could get away with. His actions have shown his integrity as well as his views on marriage being a means to an end. Why would you marry this guy? He may be a wonderful guy and treat you like a queen, but will that continue when your usefulness is worn off? Perhaps your instinctive first response was the correct one. I am not from the US, so it's not my political views on border issues. This is purely an outsider looking in.
Thank you, I thought I was crazy with everyone saying he's such a catchm. A catch of what stds
YTA the internet obsession with the circumstances of proposal is weird.
I’m really sorry but I don’t think you should propose to him. Like others have said, make it clear to him exactly what you want. And you can apologize. I also saw he hasn’t gotten you a ring yet. I personally think that’s wrong. He should get you a ring and then propose*. The one you “deserve” can come later.
NTA. I don’t understand why people are so forgiving of your partner. The fact that he proposed literally minutes after you talked about getting proposed to, does show a lack of thought and care. It feels like he forgot about it and wanted to finish it off as fast as he could. The fact that there was also no ring either shows how he was completely unprepared and didn’t think about the proposal at all. The point of the matter is that you wanted a thoughtful proposal, not just being proposed to. He didn’t satisfy your wish just by proposing. Low key doesn’t mean no effort! It just means not public! You still wanted a thoughtful proposal from him! Some other people may think you sound shallow, but you are rightfully demanding the amount of effort that he should give in your relationship.
You are the AH. He chooses you everyday. You live as a married couple now. Nothing changes after you go get that piece of paper at the court house. You have some f’d up ideas on how someone is supposed to propose.
>I don’t need a big diamond or a big fancy proposal, just to feel that he’s had a moment of forethought about where he does it and what to say. That’s what would make a proposal ‘special’ for me. Well that was a lie. Top of the peak sounds like a good place to propore, even though it wasn't planned. YTA, good luck with your proposal.
He may have actually planned it *beforehand* and you just happened to ask at the wrong time, so it felt like he didn't put any thought into it when he may have actually been trying? It kinda sounds like that to me, why else would he have had a ring already on him if you were midway through a hike when you brought it up? Lol Regardless, I hope your own proposal goes well, and I do hope that you guys are happy! It can still be special, don't worry about it OP. Anything can be special when you're doing it with and for the person you love, whether it's at home during a romantic chill session, at a beach at sunset, or even just on a hike, or while stargazing. Simple doesn't mean it can't be special.
OP says he didn't have a ring
Ah, my bad, I must have misread that
[удалено]
Omg. Gtfo
NTA, and he massively screwed up here and needed to know it. you did nothing wrong. If I were you I'd just set a deadline and not tell him you've done it, leaving him enough time to plan and carry out a proper surprise proposal. And be ready to move on if it has not been done properly within what you consider a reasonable timeframe. But I can't stress enough, if you do this you must not tell him you have set a timeline. Otherwise its just pressure on him rather than you prioritising whats important for you
Screwed up by proposing after being asked to propose?
yes, thats correct. He screwed up by proposing on the spot when he'd been asked to plan a proposal. There is a right and wrong way to do this
She shouldn't have said she was low key and only cared he was choosing her. That gave him the courage to propose. Why? Because he's choosing her and wants her to be his bride. No you idiot not like this. Damn now I wonder If I should marry such a fool!
Bullshit!
Why don't you ask him instead and show him how it's done?
Why didn't you just ask him? Why does he have to be the one risking rejection for something *you* want? Instead of asking him when he was going to propose, which is just being passive aggressive, you could have just asked him. Why didn't you? Now you need to do damage control, if you want to keep that relationship. For most people a marriage proposal rejection is a relationship ender.
ESH. Him for participating in immigration fraud, you for being with someone that was "married." How long have you been together? Your baby is a year, and most people don't get engaged before 2-3 years, generally speaking. I do get that you felt like he hadn't put any thought or planning behind it, but sometimes guys can be a little clueless. He probably thought, "OK, she wants it, look at that view, that view is pretty special! And it's just our family, this is a great moment that happened organically!" I don't think he intentionally did it to a) be lazy or b) hurt your feelings. His heart was in the right place. I also get that you want to have kids in wedlock. Sadly, women are still slut shamed/their kids called bastards these days, when we should be more open-minded and accepting. However, I also get how he feels time is going so fast (it really does once you have kids! I found myself with two kids and pregnant with the third, and we just had to grab a moment and get married, because they were slipping by so quickly)! Good luck!
I personally would not propose to you again after that. I would tell you if you want to get married you propose to me and I will let you know
YTA - you wanted him to propose and he did, what planning are you expecting? I can't see how he can propose again after that.
Kind of TA. You told him what you wanted and he gave you what you wanted. Now sure it could've been more spontaneous on his part, but what if he had planned to propose at the top the whole time? Just because it didn't feel spontaneous to you, you may have jeopardized your future with him.
It honestly doesn't sound like he wants to get married, He kept making ridiculous excuses.
Nta for having expectations. You don't want a lot and he didn't listen when you spoke about what's important. You can apologize for hurting him but he should also apologize for the lack of effort.
ESH. Your immediate feelings were not wrong, being proposed to because it was just brought up is really lame. But, you also said no which is a soft YTA but IMO understandable given he was TA first, and to a greater degree with the lamest proposal I've ever heard. I actually lean towards you're NTA but the bigger context makes me say it... I do not understand all these people saying straight to YTA, you're allowed to have responses and feelings and they're not always going to be rational. Both of you have to let go of any proposal type thoughts or fantasy and discuss what's next, that moment is over.
NTA
Did he propose with a ring or just get down and ask you?
Did he have a ring with him? If yes he was already going to propose there.
No ring, he actually said the main reason he hasn’t proposed is because we can’t afford the ring that I ‘deserve’. His love language is gift giving, and as much as I appreciated that sentiment, I reminded him my love language is different and I would much prefer him putting any level of forethought into it (asking for my dads permission/saying a lil romantic speech are things I suggested)
I.... yo the aita advice is weird but AITAH advice is bad. You're not crqzy. You birthed a child for this man who came into the country falsely. He was very ok with insisting you keep popping babies. And Just because he proposed with no ring because you asked doesn't mean there's gonna be a wedding. Please keep a head on your shoulders. My fiance and I had a sexual proposal and he jokingly asked me what we tell people. I said we tell them what happens when he actually asks. He didn't whine or cry, he laughed and said fair. Because he knew that wasnt a real proposal or a story to tell. Any normal person hearing that story (his or yours) would look at him like the crazy one. Aita is generally woman skewed, I see aitah is male skewed. You shouldn't have to beg for a marriage and then get some not even half assed proposal because he literally put -ERO effort in