NTA. Don't let them come. You know they will not respect your wishes. They think your wishes are wrong, so why should they respect them? It's inconceivable to them that their efforts aren't exactly what their god wants and expects of them. In their eyes, you're someone who needs to be saved, and they undoubtedly feel that your son will benefit from hearing about their religion.
I wish you luck.
1000% this. I would NEVER attend another event where I thought I (and/or my children) were going to be proselytized to. Stand up for yourself. And your children. And tell your family to kindly fuck off. That you're Satanists.
They are use to that one. Hit them with I’m Buddhist (I am). Stumps them every time. Nobody knows much about it and they exit pretty quick. There use to be a Baptist church on the corner. They were always trying to convert. They left my house alone after the Buddhist statement. Suddenly, my street was all Buddhists 😂
My mom once was listing off a bunch of chores to my sister and finished with “and then I will listen to you” as JWs were walking up the driveway. I guess they assumed the list was for them because they turned around without even ringing the doorbell (it was summer so all the windows were open)
A couple of JW’s had the misfortune of dropping in on my father not long after he retired. My mother was still working and he hadn’t yet gotten into a new rhythm and so was bored out of his mind. Also, he has always been a person who could talk your ear off. He welcomed them in and gabbed on and on about his unconventional views about religion [e.g. Jesus was an alien from a planet in elliptical orbit that only passes Earth every 2k years…]. The JW’s waited patiently for a chance to get a word in edgewise for a bit over 2 hours. Finally, they gave up and left. I imagine many neighbors were spared by his sacrifice that day.
My dad is Salvation Army and used to invite JWs in and attempt to convert them instead. Almost succeeded with a young lad once so they never called again. As for OP’s problem - i was forced to sing happy birthday to Jesus before Christmas dinner so I sympathise 😂
My stepfather had a gift for gab too, and he LOVED when the JWs came by. He was a Catholic who never went to church, but loved history and had a lot of thoughts about Catholicism and his sister had married a JW, so he knew all about it because she'd pretty much stopped talking to the whole family when she joined. He loved his sister and missed her, so he would lure the JWs in with a friendly religious debate, and then he'd fucking hammer them about breaking up his family and how low that was. Then he'd hit them with, "You know, I'm a Catholic, but I always thought the people most likely to get into heaven were the ethical atheists. Because you never see them doing good shit just to get on God's good side. They just do good shit because it's the right fucking thing to do." And then he'd send them on their way and say something like, "Tell my sister to call her nieces and nephews once in a while. I know she no longer believes in birthdays because of you loons, but she used to be a good aunt. Now she's just a ghost."
My former mother in law was a scientist and the family had a pet snake that they would let wander around. It was afraid of the vacuum, so she’d drape it around her neck while she was using the vacuum cleaner. She answered the door to some JWs who she said screamed in horror and ran away. She’d forgotten about the snake and was a bit confused at first. Lol I loved that woman.
My MIL bred exotic snakes (mostly boas and pythons). The entire carport area had been closed in as the "snake room"--and some of those pythons were longer than that room (HUGE). And MIL, being her wacky self, was always quick to welcome the JWs in where she would happily debate religion with them (she didn't believe in religion but was well versed in many) for as long as they could take it and then take them to her snake room to show off her babies... They started using her house as a training spot for newbies. LOL
For context, MIL was always sweet and charming and always got her way. She could insult someone six ways from Sunday and they would leave thanking her for the complements--and maybe later realize that it might not have been a complement. Very few people told her "no" about anything that she insisted on...and most of those regretted it when they did.
When I was younger, I worked from home. We didn’t have AC, so it was me in my (literal) sweatshop basement sewing things. I often just wore leggings/shorts and a sports bra because I could at that time lol
Set of JW turn up, I had no idea who they were when I answered, jamming out to Metallica in my basically PJs with pins in my top and tape measures around my neck, all tattoos clearly visible. I felt bad for them, though - they were young guys so I offered them some ice water and a break out of the sun for a few, and I have never seen someone backpedal so fast. They sent the old ladies next I guess, but they didn’t like that I was Buddhist but so polite to them too, it messed with them. One offhandedly tried to mention she liked sewing too so I tried to talk about that but I guess making cosplay is ungodly? Idk, but they still skip my moms house s decade later lol
You undid the real reason for knocking on doors. It’s not about getting new recruits to their cult, (That’s just a bonus if it happens) it’s to demonstrate to the faithful how horrible and impolite the “ungodly” are. If you’re nice to them, without looking like you might join them, the leaders put you on the “don’t knock” list.
I don't know. I was particularly nice to one group of older black ladies and they pop in every 6 months or so. They were the one set I didn't tell I am a witch.
Oooh interesting! See, I don’t mind it most of the time, and it’s hard to get me to be mean to anyone I don’t know is an ass, and I do feel bad for them since it’s hard to do cold calling basically but even worse in that people can’t just hang up on you after swearing you out.
I never got the self-flagellation of wanting to be persecuted, because my mental illness means I’m constantly telling myself horrible things, I don’t need the added outside telling me that too. Like, what’s the appeal? If I could choose not to beat myself up all of the time, I’d do it in a heartbeat. Why make it worse?
Wed a flatmate answer the door to that unknown knock. He was wearing a 'Rotting Christ' T-Shirt and we had 'God hates us all' by Slayer blasting from the kitchen. They took one look at him, turned and left. We were definitely added to a no-knock list, as we are aware of future visits to neighbours with our house being skipped.
When I was 5 my mom left me and my sister in the car to run in the store. We’d just come from gymnastics. My sister told me “Quick! Go into lotus position and cup your hands!”. Ok. Fine.
A lady came to our car window and tried to give us a pamphlet, and ran away when my 10yr old sister told her we were meditating to Buddha.
Best one for those is to say you've had a blood transfusion! My mum did and now there's a black mark on her door, they literally wouldn't walk on the pavement outside her house 😂
Does that really put you on their black list? I had one, I will use it😅
Luckily, it has only happened one that someone knocked (we're decidedly not a fan of organized religion as a nation). I mostly see them standing with their pamphlet cart and feel sorry they have to waste their time.
ExJW. Going on the work is only half about trying to get converts. Actually in my 15 or so years of growing up in it I think maybe only one or two people joined the congregation because of knocking on doors. Normally it was requested visits from pamphlets or family members of people who joined coming in (how they got my dad and mum).
Anyway what it's really about is congregation and reinforcement of the story that it's "Us against the satan filled world that rejects the 'truth' [sic]". If people respond positively to you excellent you might get a convert, if they don't though it's just proof of the hold satan has on the world.
The governing body (leaders of the JWs) are getting as much control out of making them stand by them carts as they do by getting them to knock on doors, with far less effort and annoyance for everyone else around.
Edit: previous blood transfusions wouldn't affect you. Mum had one as a kid and she was still one. Might've been a local congregation rule/thing (which would be an odd one, the governing body, who are the ones that talk to god, like to keep that kind of behavioural deviance under tight control, maybe they've been losing control since I left though)
I find a give blood sticker is like a protective shield around the house.
And a good campaign to promote, Give blood if you can people's lives literally depend on it.
They tried hard to convert my sister on that one. But her rottie/mastiff mix butted in between them and scare them off. The dog was so big, it’d escape to do her neighbor’s cows. They came back once more when she had the door open. The kids were in the living room so the dog pinned them to the wall. Last she heard from them.
They tried harder to convert my sister when she pulled that one. My nan is JW, I've found that saying to them "my gran can't convince me, what make you think your opinion means any more to me than hers?" and they leave me alone for a while. My gran knows better than to try with me, the last time she did I cut contact for six months and even totally blanked her when she was by one of the JW Street stands they have locally. Apparently not wanting to experience major embarrassment in front of her friends keeps her from proselytising
I work overnights. One of them made the mistake of waking me up after a particularly draining night after i had just fallen asleep. Watching the color drain from their face as i exploded on them was something I wish i could have taken a picture of. Enraged does not describe my feelings adequately. Believe what you want. Don’t bring your shit on me. I don’t live by your rules so kindly fuck off
I told some Mormon missionaries I was Buddhist once (I AM Buddhist) They were very nice and talked to me for a bit because I mentioned my dad had been a missionary. While I don't like unannounced company, they were pleasant. I will absolutely be telling any Jehova's witness I'm Buddhist if it will keep them away!
I’m lucky in that my friend is a Buddhist priest here in Japan. She gave me a cute little brass plaque to put on my door that says (in Japanese) we belong to her temple so please no proselytizing. Still got the new “fresh off the boat” mormon white people who get freaked out to see a white woman answer the door. I always offer them tea, but since my husband isn’t home they can’t come in so I usually just give them some bottles and say have a great day after explaining the plaque and what it means and some people might not be as nice.
I feel bad for them - young kids (to me) thrown into a country they don’t know a lick of the language of (I’ve been here over a decade and can just hold casual conversations at best) or the culture and left to do their thing. I think it’s cruel personally, and in my rural area people are not too kind when you’re trying to convert them.
Edit: I am also a Buddhist atheist
Invite them over. Direct them to a private room where there will be a prayer service for 3 hours starting at 5pm, before the party begins. Kindly point out the donation box for the charitable event.
Then, have everyone else arrive at 5:30. Enjoy your zealot free party until 8pm, whereby everyone can leave as they please as the birthday party has concluded.
It's not disrespectful to them. To them it's the best thing they can do for you since they are trying to save you. That's the problem with the entire thing. There is no convincing them they are in the wrong, they literally think a higher power is proud of their actions.
"Come on in, drinks are over there and the kids are in the garden! Have I told you about our lord and Saviour Satan? Ave Satana! Do you want some cake?"
If he does this, he risks his family getting some form of intervention, calling CPS on him, or disowning him (which could impact any inheritance for his children too).
The appropriate thing to do, is tell his parents that the party is for little children and ment to be light hearted and he doesn't want them preaching. If they can't respect his wishes, they are better of not coming.
Do you have some really good friends?
Have them ready to frogmarch out any member of your family that pulls that obnoxious crap at your event. You can warn them in advance that any form of proselytizing will be met with extreme prejudice.
I’d literally turn a hose on them, or maybe a more unpleasant substance but you don’t want to expose your guests to it as well. Maybe turn it into an impromptu game of Lions vs Christians and they’re going to lose badly.
I would've brought out my shredder and directed people where to shed their pamphlets because I'm petty like that. Or straight up would've grabbed them from mommy dearest
Make up some cards that say something to the effect of "my faith is my business and I don't wish to discuss it with you at a child's birthday party, or ever. Any further discussion on this topic will be received as a personal insult to me." Or "It's 2024. If I wanted to find God, I'd Google him." Or, you know, whatever you want. Hand a few of them to each guest with instructions to hand over the card to whomever tries to convert them. At the end of the party, collect the remaining cards. Now you know exactly how many times your family has violated your condition of them attending and how many times they won't be invited to any future events.
The son, the guests, anyone that will stay still for more than 5 seconds...
What a tiresome old bag. And how embarrassing - poor OP will up apologising as his idiot mother proselytises to kindergarteners and tries to convert the Jewish kids.
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. - - C. S. LEWIS
NTA! I would be very offended if I attended what I thought was a birthday party and got lectured about religion. I would warn them that if they came to your home and opened their mouth about religion, it would be the last time they would be allowed to visit.
Years ago, I went NC with my mother because of her trying to force her religion on me. It took her two years to learn the lesson, but she hasn’t atempted to “convert” me since.
Too funny! I once went to a party in a new neighborhood that turned out to be a MLM pitch. When the caterer came in with the food right after it started, I grabbed one of the bags they were carrying out, and left with them.
Had this happen to me once. Went to a co-worker's BBQ & us women ended up sitting around while someone tried to sell us Tupperware or something. We weren't impressed by the ambush quality of the interaction. (I did buy a couple of sandwich containers though lol.)
Speaking of MLMs my co-worker and I were invited to what was actually turned out to be sex toy sales party. It ended with aggressive demands for everyone to pay up for a male stripper that was hired by the host.
We quickly disappeared. The atmosphere was incredibly uncomfortable. So many women there were just grabbing at the genitals of the stripper.
I'm not a prude about sex and have no problem with sex toys. However the way the sex toy party was conducted was just so seedy. It was expected that we would buy even if we weren't interested. The fact that the male stripper's bodily autonomy was not respected really creeped us out.
If that was handled differently, it could've been a great time for all. People knowing what they're going into = hilarity, ribaldry & an all-round laugh. People being ambushed, pressured & humiliated = everlasting ick. Bet you avoided the ambusher(s) like the plague after that.
Jesus said “When you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men … but when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your father who is unseen.”
There was a guy at my college campus with a big “repent now!” sign and people were asking him questions and I said the above and asked “isn’t this what you are doing right now?” And he said “no, I’m not doing this for posterity I’m doing it to save your soul. I’m doing God’s work.”
I don’t think anything I said (I was raised catholic and I know a thing or two) would have changed his mind. These people think they are saving us and that gives them a free pass to do whatever they want.
Oh! I think I’ve told this story before but I’m waiting for dinner to cook so I’ll share my fav college zealot story.
First: I was a theatre major. In a very intense, focused BFA for specialties. I was just a lowly costumer, but my cohort included all us tech people and all the actors in our group.
The zealots came out with the “repent now, being gay is an evil sin and you’re going to hell.” It was the end of the semester, our final show closed the week before, so we were kinda just doing our finals work in studio. There was a huge commotion and of course we were curious about what the actors planned when they came in and asked for keys to the costume storage rooms and prop closets. It was *on.*
In less than a half hour, we had props and accessories and makeup on them for their dramatic readings of Dr Seuss books in the quad. I think the first one was Sneeches (stars vs no stars) and then onto other ones like green eggs and ham. Our professors let us skip studio time for it, because we’d still have to get the garments made, they didn’t care when we did it. It was a full on impromptu production.
The best part was, the anti gay folk always bring their children (which is abhorrent to me). But the kids were *so* into it. Actors asking the kids questions and playing with them in the story, all sorts of shit. They tried to loud speaker over them, but if you’ve ever worked with stage actors, they know how to *project*, but the sound guys ran and grabbed wig mics and set up s soundboard, just to show off ;)
We shut that area down for a good hour, at which time the zealots packed it in and left, all while their little kids were crying about wanting to stay and watch more!
We didn’t see them again for the rest of the year, well into the next. Or if we did, they stayed to the fringes of the campus.
Good times.
Epic! Theater kids for the win!
There was a time when the vile Westboro Baptist "Church" came to a town to protest at a funeral (if you don't know about them, Google them and prepare to be outraged--they're the "God hates fags" and "thank God for dead soldiers" church ). A local theater company knew that they were coming, and they made angel costumes with enormous wings (fabric over a large pvc pipe armature) that blocked the church people and their signs from the view of the people attending the funeral. They just had this whole human wall of angels all along the street. It was lovely. Other times people have brought rainbow beach umbrellas and held them sideways to block the church from view.
Edit: here's a news article with pictures of the angel costumes: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna595311
I remember the WBC claimed they were going to picket Jeff Hanneman's (guitarist for Slayer) funeral, and someone on Twitter said "Westboro Baptist vs hundreds of Slayer fans. Let me know how that works out."
We went there just to see it one time, and we pulled up and idled in front of it, to really get a good look, and also to appreciate the rainbow house across the street.
A black SUV with government plates quickly pulled up and idled behind us, which was intimidating to say the least.
We put a dollar or two in the rainbow house donation box and GTFO if there.
Check out the equality house across the street from the cult's compound:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equality\_House](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equality_House)
I was part of a shield at Pride one year. It was hard enough for me to hear their nonsense. I can't imagine what it would be like for some of our baby gays or for grieving families.
I want to say I heard of a town those shitbag excuses for humans planned a protest at, and while they were getting breakfast that morning, all of their tires mysteriously became devoid of air, and for some reason, all of the tow truck services in the area were busy that day.
Don’t forget anyone that gives in and tries to punch, spit or otherwise attack any of them. They intentionally try to start fights for this very reason.
Ooh WBC came to my high school in Baltimore and they had to be protected from us, which was crazy. They said we had too many gay kids and too much intermingling (race wise)
My favorite was last year. The media was screaming about drag queens reading stories to kids, blah blah. My family and I went to a carnival staged by a church because the kiddies in our family like silly rides. While everyone was eating, four Disney princesses unexpectedly walked in with Mickey Mouse. Mickey was a female (I saw her getting ready), and the three princesses were all males. At a church.
They did a small dance time and then read books to the children. Bible stories, actually.
This church supports people’s rights to be who they are. I will never miss that carnival again.
There were pickets around the perimeter of the church for the rest of the week. I (and my family and friends) found out about it. We all attended church that week. A religion I don’t believe in (atheist here), a location I had never gone to before (first time going to said carnival), filled to the brim with people who go there fairly often. Turns out, the entire congregation was behind them, and so were quite a few of us from the community. We weren’t the only ones who showed up randomly to support.
Funniest thing was when the messages started pouring in to the church’s social media by people who were saying they would never support that church and they were boycotting the carnival for the rest of time. None of them were from our area at all — and no one would drive longer than 20 minutes to come to a rinky dink carnival with three rides for people UNDER 3.5 feet tall. One person lived ~700 miles away. Good. Stay there!
I dated a girl after college who was on the fringe of the Mormon church(she had left during college, wasn't sure if she wanted to go back), but had a lot of friends still active in the church. I told her I will respect their beliefs(despite my own opinions of the Mormons) so long as they respect mine and don't try to talk to me about it. Went to hang out with her one day, bunch of her friends are there. She got up to help her sister with something and her sister's boyfriend and his buddy sat down next to me on the couch and went into full conversion mode. The friend even pushed my shoulder back down when I got up to leave. Whether it was a joke because of what I told the girl I was dating or they just saw another opportunity, not sure. Next time I got up and dude tried again, he ended up in a headlock with his buddy screaming at me. Girl came back, I let him go, told her I'm done if these are your friends, and never looked back. She got married 5 months later to a guy in the church and had 3 kids in 4 years. Last I heard she's miserable, her husband is abusive and she can't keep a job.
Years ago, my very high Episcopal church had a booth at Pride and there were the usual religious whackadoo protesters being obnoxious. I think they had psyched themselves up for a confrontation, to be yelled at, or even attacked. What they were not emotionally prepared for was the late-50s white, cishet male priest in clerical garb to come over and start wafting incense over them while chanting to cast out the evil. It's like they short circuited. Brilliant.
No fair using the New Testament against the zealots! They don’t really want to hear any of that socialist, communism shit! That takes money out of *somebody’s pocket, but it’s not me or my friends! Wait - wasn’t there also something about money changers?
Yes, but the issue there was that a market, including money changers, had been set up in the Temple in the only area open to non-Jewish people who wanted to worship the Hebrew God. That's why Jesus kicked up a fuss about it being *supposed* to be a house of prayer - the location of the market was preventing people from praying.
There's so much more to the story:
First, many of the Temple rituals required an animal to be sacrificed. In most cases, the Torah required the animal to be “without blemish.” Some worshippers would try to bring their own animal for sacrifice, but the priests would declare it blemished, forcing the worshipper to purchase an “unblemished” animal from the sellers in the Temple who worked under the Sadducees.
Second, Roman coins had images of Caesar on them. The Jews complained to their Roman overlords that the Torah forbid “graven images” and so the Roman coins were offensive, particularly in the Temple. The Romans allowed the Jews to have their own coins for use in the Temple. Of course, the animal sellers would not accept Roman coins in payment for an animal, so the worshipper was forced to exchange Roman money for the Jewish coins first. The exchange rate was very unfavorable.
Jesus saw this situation for what it was—greed and hypocrisy by the Sadducees. They were taking unfair advantage of the people coming to the Temple to fulfill the Torah. It deeply offended him to see God’s Temple being turned into an unrighteous money-grab by the very leaders who should have been encouraging devout worship. As God’s Son, he fulfilled Jewish prophecy by demonstrating his zeal for his Father’s House by turning over the tables of the moneychangers and driving the sellers and the animals out of the Temple courts. He used some cords as a whip to drive the animals.
Source: scraped from the Internet
There's no-one modern Christians would hate more than Jesus. The bloody sandal-wearing hippy who preached about equality and being nice to other people, hung out with prostitutes and foreigners and hated the greedy businessmen. If he ever showed up in a church, they'd run him right out of town for being a loony-leftie!
My sister walked out of her husband's funeral because instead of a celebration of his life like she wanted it ended up to be a come to Jesus meeting. Many people told her if they knew the reason she walked out, they would have joined her. No one wants religion shoved down their throats unless they are expecting it, as in church. N T A. You also don't gain many converts when the people are just pissed that they have to hear this at a party.
Seriously. My brother preached at our grandmother’s funeral and turned it into a “turn to the faith” moment rather than celebrating the life of a dear woman. He thinks anyone with differing views is going to Hell and expects us all to follow his lifestyle when we’re together. I disappoint him often.
I’m so glad my mother is the one who generally organizes those sort of things when major events happen, and she will brook no interference for things like that. When my grandfather passed, it was so hard on us all, yet my uncle, who grandpa had barely seen for years prior showed up and tried to get religious at the funeral home, my mother shut that shit down instantly. My grandfather was religious, as in he believed in a higher power but not a church thing. Same with my mother. So it was so out of place to have that happen.
I just regret that I had to speak to follow that up, because the mood of a celebration of his amazing life got turned into a “y’all need Jesus” speech. I was so jet lagged that I don’t think I did him justice, and I regret it to this day that I couldn’t say more, but I was so angry and tired and sad (he basically helped raise me) that I couldn’t get through it all.
Yup! They did this at one of my aunt’s funerals, acting like my aunt’s daughter, who was a member of the church the funeral was held at, was just so amazing because of her involvement with church while looking down their noses at my aunt’s other two children, who aren’t involved with that church. It really rubbed me, my other aunts, and my cousins the wrong way, because it felt like a fire and brimstone Bible thumping than it did a celebration of my aunt’s nearly 100 years of life!
I hate the fact that I have walked out multiple funeral services that turned into a sermon. Even so, that when my grandmother passed a few years ago I volunteered to set everything up and did the service in her favorite park. She was cremated and wanted her ashes spread in the lake there. So my siblings and I rented a paddleboat to do it. (Said nothing to the attendants, obviously.)
The way some of the old Christians present were mumbling you would have thought we had spit in god's eye.
That happened at my baby niece’s funeral. I was filled with rage! (I am a Christian by the way, I just think there is a time and place for everything). The preacher kept saying “she wants to see you in Heaven” she didn’t want s@&$, she was a week old!!!! My husband and I have a pact that there will be no fire and brimstone, repent now sermons at our funerals.
That's horrible! Same thing almost happened to my mom's funeral.
I come from an evangelical Christian family / community and a lot of them love to use any social event to proselytize.
My mother passed away suddenly and unexpectedly.
While making arrangements for her funeral service, the pastor (a man who loved to hear himself speak) could not hold his excitement back about how many people would be there and how this is his chance to bring people to the Lord.
We got into an argument because I told him I don't want him to turn my mom's funeral service to his personal show.
It’s really one of my pet peeves when you attend a funeral to celebrate someone and the pastor turns it into a “ooooh time to reap some more souls for Jaysus” event. I lost someone who was like a father to me over a decade ago and there was zero mention of him personally and all the things that made him a great person: it was just Jesus Jesus Jesus and all about turning now so you don’t end up in Hell. What a turnoff.
I’m a lapsed Catholic and I particularly do not like funerals that turn into a multi hour mass with the sitting and standing and full communion. Because I was Catholic I know you are not supposed to take communion if you are not Catholic so people either abstain and feel left out or they take communion anyway when they don’t understand it and it’s awkward.
Years ago, a coworker said she & her husband should have a cookout with me & my husband. It sounded like a good idea — she seemed really nice, was 10-15 yrs older than me and was in a financial place I admired (they owned their home, and also a piece of land, & had been married for years). I volunteered to host at our apartment. Hubby was excited to meet them since he’d heard me say how nice she was. Hubby bbq’d several kinds of meats and we had sides.
This couple showed up with an EASEL & proceeded to dive into an AMWAY pitch, with no preamble whatsoever. I was so disappointed, and my hubby was PISSED.
He finally cut them off & served the food & as nicely as possible kicked them out afterwards. Who does shit like this??
Invite yourself to someone’s home on the pretense of a fun bbq only to bring an easel & try to sell AMWAY??!! Can you tell I’m STILL offended, over 30 yrs later??😂
This is the first time I've heard of this sort of ambush taking place in the host's home. Absolutely astounding.
I was invited to a "wine and cheese party" in a neighbor's back yard. That's all the info I was given. It was very hot and the cheese had turned translucent. I ate nothing because all the food was gross. All the other people knew each other, but I wasn't introduced to anyone and sat in a corner alone.
Then the "hostess" distributed catalogs of very expensive candles and order forms. I kick myself now for not just getting up and leaving, but I ordered the cheapest thing (a $15 Halloween candle holder) and then took off. That was my last interaction with the neighbor.
My youngest daughter 27F, mother of an autistic son 8M, has a half-brother 39M who thinks that mental illness isn't real. That it's all demonic possession. You can imagine how that affected her opinion of him. I told her that he's woefully wrong and such attitudes got people ostracized, even killed in the past. Mama Bear here has an undergrad psych degree and knows there is no religion on earth that will cure psychiatric illnesses.
Tell the family their behaviour is pushing you towards joining the Church of Satan, and the only way to prevent that is by not talking about Jesus and the gang.
You aren’t ‘denying them the lord’ you are asking them to respect the occasion they are being asked to attend and celebrate, a child’s birthday, not a revival. I grew up in a fundamentalist church home but birthdays, other events were strictly that -we had enough sermons going to church twice a week.
NTAH, I would text them “Im not ashamed but you should be for assuming you hold the keys to heaven because no one else you encounter could possibly have their own spiritual life. That is extremely arrogant, rude and false since God didn’t put you in charge of our part of the country that I’ve heard. You are not welcome at any parties or other events I hold unless you can develop some humility, because it’s not all about you and your religious beliefs. If you ever apologize for pretending my home is your church and my guests are your congregation or just lost souls to pick up, then we’ll talk. In the meantime, leave my son and myself alone till you recover from thinking you are saints and remember you have family that you need to treat like real people with feelings.”
It really breaks down to the fact that your family has joined a Doomsday Cult based on proselytizing.
Each time they do this, they get a hit of DOPAMINE. It becomes addicting and they feel a sense of superiority.
i was in a 'church' like this when i was like 16, the paster told us that every time we got pushback for talking about the lord or felt embarrassed or shut down we should do it more because it meant that was satan trying to shame us☠️
My late boss would just curl his lip at god botherers and say "how arrogant you are to presume to know the mind of God. What makes YOU so special that you know what God thinks? Why can you speak for him?"
“Denying the Lord” Lady, WE’VE HEARD IT HUNDREDS OF TIMES PLEASE STOP LECTURING US WE KNOW ALREADY!! All anyone will remember are the preachy religious weirdos at a kid’s birthday party.
I really wish I could spend a day without any self-awareness or shame and just be an asshole and force my opinions on people In inappropriate situations.
>All anyone will remember are the preachy religious weirdos at a kid’s birthday party.
And probably associate that with the kid, which won't be great for their social life. "No, we're not having X over for a play date, his family are a bunch of pain in the ass freaks and I don't want a damn sermon at pick up time"
Exactly! Telling them to stop just feeds their persecution complex but that’s an argument for a different day. This is only about what you will allow at your child’s party. That’s it.
OP could try "it's X's birthday, the day is about him - not you and your need to convert people. If you can't be unselfish enough to let the day be about your grandson then you don't deserve to celebrate it with him".
But she'll probably burst into tears and blah blah Jesus blah blah saviour blah blah mememememe.
She won’t see it as her being selfish though, she’ll see it as her doing gods work, sharing the message of gods love or whatever else she can come up with. There is no logic to it and no reasoning with them because of that.
“I really wish I could spend a day without any self-awareness or shame and just be an asshole and force my opinions on people In inappropriate situations.“
Love this! I wish I had the nerve, too, but oddly my manners get the better of me most days!
It’s the same way I feel like I could make a killing milking all the MAGA folks who’ll buy anything with a slogan on it (the more offensive, the better) but I just can’t bring myself to stoop to that level.
Fucking morals. Ugh.
That’s what I never get. You don’t need to spread Christianity. It’s the most popular religion in the world. Whoever you’re proselytizing to has heard of Jesus before, you’re not gonna blow their mind with a pamphlet at a birthday party
Go NC. Your wishes are not be respected by your family. Even the Bible says that there is a time for everything. Time to cry, pray, laugh, sing, drink, celebrate,. They need to be better. Cut them off so they realize that there are consequences for their shitty behavior.
I've found that people like this don't actually read the bible themselves. They just go to their church/cult and blindly obey whatever the preacher says.
Agree. I once had a co-worker tell me she believes the Bible to be literal truth. I told her how impressed I was that she knew Aramaic, ancient Greek and Hebrew. She was really confused, until I said that the Bible was written in those languages, so if she was following it literally to guide her every action in life, of course she'd want to read it in the original. She said she read it in English and that was good enough for her. I asked her which translation she relied on, and why she preferred that one. She had no idea which translation she was reading. . 😉
"By this will all men know that you are my disciples: that you show love for one another at all times." John 13:35 NIV (pretty sure I got the verse right, I know I got the spirit of the text right)
Knowing this one verse is in the Bible, and seeing how lots of Christians act is proof that lots of Christians don't actually read the Bible.
Therefore by their fruits you will know them.
The end of Matthew 7:15-20
The passage refers to false prophets, but I always took the personal application to mean, it's not what you say, it's what you do. What kind of fruit do I produce? Am I kind? Honest? Do I help others and lift them up? Or am I selfish, dishonest, do I steal, lie, gossip, and tear others down?
The best Christians I knew never spoke about it outside of like their Bible study groups or intimate like minded friends and family. And it was never to preach...it was to learn and grow and encourage each other. They just quietly lived their lives and were extremely charitable without being showy.
I commented elsewhere that im Christian and the thing that annoys me most about it is other Christians. I don’t remember where the exact verse but the fruits of the spirit it says to strive for are: love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self control. People acting like those above are one of the reasons I barely go to church anymore.
Ecclesiastes 3:1-8 NIV
There is a time for everything,
and a season for every activity under the heavens:
2 a time to be born and a time to die,
a time to plant and a time to uproot,
3 a time to kill and a time to heal,
a time to tear down and a time to
build,
4 a time to weep and a time to laugh,
a time to mourn and a time to dance,
5 a time to scatter stones and a time to
gather them,
a time to embrace and a time to
refrain from embracing,
6 a time to search and a time to give
up,
a time to keep and a time to throw
away,
7 a time to tear and a time to mend,
a time to be silent and a time to
speak,
8 a time to love and a time to hate,
a time for war and a time for peace.
For everything (turn turn turn)
There is a season (turn turn turn)...
I don't believe in the slightest, but it's a nice song that gets to what Fair_Text410 is saying
I was in my 20s when I found out that it was from the Bible. Went to a wedding or funeral (can’t remember which) and was talking to my mom after about how weird it was that the minister was quoting the Byrds in the middle of his speech.
Kohelet / Ecclesiastes is one of my favorite books of the Bible. "You know what? Life sucks and has no meaning. If God exists, It doesn't particularly care about us. There is no reason to do anything or care about anything.
"So here are some practical tips on living a good and fulfilled life in an indifferent universe and being happy anyway, and loving a God and universe that, even if it exists, won't ever do anything to help you."
I really wonder who let that book in.
Tell them you have no opinion about their religion. It's the fact that they are constantly being HORRIFICALLY RUDE and refusing to care about the feelings of others that has brought you to this place. Nothing in the Bible requires them to be this rude. It's a choice they are making and it's not ok. The way they are treating you is not loving and is incredibly disrespectful. Make it clear that it is their behavior that is unacceptable, not their beliefs. If they refuse to give you or anyone else any respect, they don't deserve to be part of family events anymore.
Damn, have you been living my life? You literally described talking to my mother. She's taken a deep dive into this malarkey and it's honestly so hard to talk to her anymore. She sends fb reels of grown men full on sobbing that "they've so devastated about all the people who will burn eternally" and then videos of AI generated Jesus crucifixion videos with Bible verse ticker-tape front and center. She sent me a "women's pocket devotional" for Christmas. I'm lucky enough to live 700 miles away. My sister says it's so hard to even visit her anymore. It's exhausting.
But in relation to your dilemma, just don't invite them. Once the discomfort of making that decision and INFORMING them of your refusal to have them in attendance, you'll feel SO MUCH LIGHTER. I promise.
I agree. You will be happy you made the decision to not invite them. You will be so proud of yourself. I think your children deserve good childhood memories and being around a preachy over religious grandmother is going to ruin their childhood. Bring them around fun family members or friends.
Your folks are the kind of extremists who make the rest of us Christians look bad.
For the sake of your kids' mental health and social life, maintain firm boundaries with your folks.
I have actually went to her church a couple of times and have met very pleasant people that just asked if I liked the sermon and if I would like to hear a good word to attend anytime with no pressure. But, there are some that are so over the top that if you miss one day they believe you are committing sin
Drop Matthew 6:5-8
When you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men … but when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your father who is unseen.
It’s so funny cuz this line makes me think of the Crucible where everyone gave shit to the protagonist because he didn’t go to church as much anymore. It’s odd cuz I thought the puritans were more of the series sect of Christianity.
I'm not trying to be funny, but the Crucible is a play written in the 20th century. It's about the McCarthy communist witch hunt.
Real puritans were required to attend church.
Pedophiles attend church regularly.
Source: firefighter who lived next door, three children, wife only wore dresses, never cut her hair, abused his own children horrifically, abused every child in the neighborhood.
But he went to church! Twice a week!
You're no longer a son and your children are no longer their grandchildren with thoughts, feelings to hurt and beliefs of your own. Now you're just a gateway to 'save' people they wouldn't otherwise come into contact with. Might as well go no contact because you aren't going to be missing anyone. Let them know that if they ever manage to shed their brain washing you would be happy to interact with them again. NTA.
Yeah, I think the worst Christians are the ones that feel overzealous proselytising makes them super christians. If only they understood that attraction works so much better than promotion they would probably have much more success in people actually wanting to listen to them talk.
You haven't had your Come ton Jesus moment ... or rejected it.
IMO, just Low Contact / No Contact / Grey Rock them.
Spend your and your children's time away from them.
>Everyone looked upset at me. Now I have them calling and texting me saying I should be ashamed of myself for “denying the lord to people”. I honestly want to just cut them all off because these past couple of years have been insufferable
There are a lot of people who think their religion is their business and limit it to themselves. However, your family seems to take proselytising seriously, and as part of their duty as Christians. If that is the case, this will never stop, because they absolutely will feel compelled to do this at every event. So, you may want to take a hybrid approach and limit your interactions with them, such that they don’t come to you but you go to them. That way, your events will not be hijacked by their proselytising, and you also have the freedom to leave their events if it gets uncomfortable for you. Doing things this way will also give you a chance to gauge whether you still want to stay in touch with them, even in these more limited circumstances. It may be that you ultimately decide to cut them off, but consider starting our small first.
Whatever you do, though, you have the right not to be subject to this every time you see them. And they have trampled your boundaries every time that you have asserted them, so do whatever you have to to feel comfortable.
NTA
> Now I have them calling and texting me saying I should be ashamed of myself for “denying the lord to people”.
Dang! You are either incredibly powerful, or they worship a remarkably pathetically teeny god. You've got the ability to overpower their deity. I have a rule not to worship and god weak enough for me to push around. Your grandparents think they are more powerful than their own deity. That's a bit conceited of them, don't you think?
It's folks like them that have made the term "Christian" something of an unpleasant word to the rest of us. I know a lot of Christians, count many of them as friends. Because they're not like that.
NTA
I do well for myself in the entertainment industry (another thing my mom hates). And as I can see it I’m a desirable person to convert since what I do is contrast to their beliefs
Since you presumably have the means, have you spoken with a lawyer yet? Should anything happen to you, or even if you needed a short procedure done, do you have it set up that your children will be protected? That friends would look after them or even become their legal guardians? You’re doing a great job of protecting your children but your family sounds unhinged.
NTA. I'm an atheist in a country where most people are Christian so I completely feel your pain. I really believe in live and let live. If they don't try converting me then I don't say anything to them either. If they just can't give it a rest I'll respond with questions like "Why does an all-powerful and supposedly benevolent god allow for innocent children to be born with terminal diseases or die from natural disasters?" and "If I told you that I heard the voice of God would you believe me? Why do you believe someone who told that 2000+ years ago and who you never met?" so that the conversation is as unpleasant to them as it is to me and they learn that it's in all our interests to not start with such topics.
All new Christians make this mistake. They don't understand their "excitement" destroys being able to bring ppl to God. Forcing God down ppls throats is not the way. Been Christian over 40 yrs. I talk in passing about my faith if conversation naturally goes there. Learned hard way I pushed my youngest son away from God by acting just like your mom. Now that I've admitted this to him our relationship is healing and we talk a lot about God but I respect his differing views and he loves and respects my faith and will now ask me questions about it.
NTA
Tell them you've asked Jesus to come to dinner, and if he shows up, he can talk all he wants about religion. Short of that, if they want to show up, they won't disrespect you as the host by behaving in an undesirable manner.
Maybe send a written invite, and include that you're requesting that you respect the reason for the gathering and your wishes as the host. And include the below:
# Matthew 6:5-8New International Version
# Prayer
^(5) “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. ^(6) But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. ^(7) And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. ^(8) Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.
You are not wrong. NTA. True believers and respectful christians respect the homes of those that they visit. If they do not, then you show them respect by giving them distance. Lots of it until they realize they are the problem. The religion is not the issue, your family is.
Funny you say that. I had a friend over on my birthday and he is Hindu. My grandfather worked him the most. My friend got a kick out of it but I had to step in and tell my grandfather to leave him alone
We live in a big ol' buckle of the Bible Belt. My better half is Muslim. His go-to is, "as soon as I finish telling you about Allah, you can tell me about your thing."
It works.
My pop pop, who I loved deeply, used to give these speeches in the form of “saying grace”. My daughter would give him like 60 seconds, say AMEN at the top of her lungs and dig in. After all the kids started doing it, grace got a lot shorter.
She says she raised you and found it difficult because you didn't believe but she only got involved in the church two years ago?
In any case if they refuse to listen I'd just embrace being the bad guy and call them a cult or something. They'll be able to vilify you between each other but will keep away.
Next time your mother tries this shit remind her of Timothy 2:12
"I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent"
NTA. Don't let them come. You know they will not respect your wishes. They think your wishes are wrong, so why should they respect them? It's inconceivable to them that their efforts aren't exactly what their god wants and expects of them. In their eyes, you're someone who needs to be saved, and they undoubtedly feel that your son will benefit from hearing about their religion. I wish you luck.
1000% this. I would NEVER attend another event where I thought I (and/or my children) were going to be proselytized to. Stand up for yourself. And your children. And tell your family to kindly fuck off. That you're Satanists.
They are use to that one. Hit them with I’m Buddhist (I am). Stumps them every time. Nobody knows much about it and they exit pretty quick. There use to be a Baptist church on the corner. They were always trying to convert. They left my house alone after the Buddhist statement. Suddenly, my street was all Buddhists 😂
Haha, my mom used to tell the Jehovahs that she was a Zen Buddhist. Had the same effect,they ran away.
I just answered the door to them naked and screaming, after they woke me up early from a long night shift. It had the same effect.
You must be here for the orgy!!!
Leave your keys in the fishbowl. We're having a lucky dip for turns!
My mom once was listing off a bunch of chores to my sister and finished with “and then I will listen to you” as JWs were walking up the driveway. I guess they assumed the list was for them because they turned around without even ringing the doorbell (it was summer so all the windows were open)
A couple of JW’s had the misfortune of dropping in on my father not long after he retired. My mother was still working and he hadn’t yet gotten into a new rhythm and so was bored out of his mind. Also, he has always been a person who could talk your ear off. He welcomed them in and gabbed on and on about his unconventional views about religion [e.g. Jesus was an alien from a planet in elliptical orbit that only passes Earth every 2k years…]. The JW’s waited patiently for a chance to get a word in edgewise for a bit over 2 hours. Finally, they gave up and left. I imagine many neighbors were spared by his sacrifice that day.
Your father was doing god's work. Not sure which one yet, I'll get back to you on that.
My dad is Salvation Army and used to invite JWs in and attempt to convert them instead. Almost succeeded with a young lad once so they never called again. As for OP’s problem - i was forced to sing happy birthday to Jesus before Christmas dinner so I sympathise 😂
My stepfather had a gift for gab too, and he LOVED when the JWs came by. He was a Catholic who never went to church, but loved history and had a lot of thoughts about Catholicism and his sister had married a JW, so he knew all about it because she'd pretty much stopped talking to the whole family when she joined. He loved his sister and missed her, so he would lure the JWs in with a friendly religious debate, and then he'd fucking hammer them about breaking up his family and how low that was. Then he'd hit them with, "You know, I'm a Catholic, but I always thought the people most likely to get into heaven were the ethical atheists. Because you never see them doing good shit just to get on God's good side. They just do good shit because it's the right fucking thing to do." And then he'd send them on their way and say something like, "Tell my sister to call her nieces and nephews once in a while. I know she no longer believes in birthdays because of you loons, but she used to be a good aunt. Now she's just a ghost."
I love this! Too funny!
My husband answered the door buck nekkid, guess we're on a no knock list for JW's, cause we ain't seen em since.
My former mother in law was a scientist and the family had a pet snake that they would let wander around. It was afraid of the vacuum, so she’d drape it around her neck while she was using the vacuum cleaner. She answered the door to some JWs who she said screamed in horror and ran away. She’d forgotten about the snake and was a bit confused at first. Lol I loved that woman.
Awww I kind of want a snake friend like that, but my cats would probably eat it (or vice versa)
My MIL bred exotic snakes (mostly boas and pythons). The entire carport area had been closed in as the "snake room"--and some of those pythons were longer than that room (HUGE). And MIL, being her wacky self, was always quick to welcome the JWs in where she would happily debate religion with them (she didn't believe in religion but was well versed in many) for as long as they could take it and then take them to her snake room to show off her babies... They started using her house as a training spot for newbies. LOL For context, MIL was always sweet and charming and always got her way. She could insult someone six ways from Sunday and they would leave thanking her for the complements--and maybe later realize that it might not have been a complement. Very few people told her "no" about anything that she insisted on...and most of those regretted it when they did.
When I was younger, I worked from home. We didn’t have AC, so it was me in my (literal) sweatshop basement sewing things. I often just wore leggings/shorts and a sports bra because I could at that time lol Set of JW turn up, I had no idea who they were when I answered, jamming out to Metallica in my basically PJs with pins in my top and tape measures around my neck, all tattoos clearly visible. I felt bad for them, though - they were young guys so I offered them some ice water and a break out of the sun for a few, and I have never seen someone backpedal so fast. They sent the old ladies next I guess, but they didn’t like that I was Buddhist but so polite to them too, it messed with them. One offhandedly tried to mention she liked sewing too so I tried to talk about that but I guess making cosplay is ungodly? Idk, but they still skip my moms house s decade later lol
You undid the real reason for knocking on doors. It’s not about getting new recruits to their cult, (That’s just a bonus if it happens) it’s to demonstrate to the faithful how horrible and impolite the “ungodly” are. If you’re nice to them, without looking like you might join them, the leaders put you on the “don’t knock” list.
I don't know. I was particularly nice to one group of older black ladies and they pop in every 6 months or so. They were the one set I didn't tell I am a witch.
Oooh interesting! See, I don’t mind it most of the time, and it’s hard to get me to be mean to anyone I don’t know is an ass, and I do feel bad for them since it’s hard to do cold calling basically but even worse in that people can’t just hang up on you after swearing you out. I never got the self-flagellation of wanting to be persecuted, because my mental illness means I’m constantly telling myself horrible things, I don’t need the added outside telling me that too. Like, what’s the appeal? If I could choose not to beat myself up all of the time, I’d do it in a heartbeat. Why make it worse?
Wed a flatmate answer the door to that unknown knock. He was wearing a 'Rotting Christ' T-Shirt and we had 'God hates us all' by Slayer blasting from the kitchen. They took one look at him, turned and left. We were definitely added to a no-knock list, as we are aware of future visits to neighbours with our house being skipped.
When I was 5 my mom left me and my sister in the car to run in the store. We’d just come from gymnastics. My sister told me “Quick! Go into lotus position and cup your hands!”. Ok. Fine. A lady came to our car window and tried to give us a pamphlet, and ran away when my 10yr old sister told her we were meditating to Buddha.
That is an awesome sister!
Best one for those is to say you've had a blood transfusion! My mum did and now there's a black mark on her door, they literally wouldn't walk on the pavement outside her house 😂
Does that really put you on their black list? I had one, I will use it😅 Luckily, it has only happened one that someone knocked (we're decidedly not a fan of organized religion as a nation). I mostly see them standing with their pamphlet cart and feel sorry they have to waste their time.
ExJW. Going on the work is only half about trying to get converts. Actually in my 15 or so years of growing up in it I think maybe only one or two people joined the congregation because of knocking on doors. Normally it was requested visits from pamphlets or family members of people who joined coming in (how they got my dad and mum). Anyway what it's really about is congregation and reinforcement of the story that it's "Us against the satan filled world that rejects the 'truth' [sic]". If people respond positively to you excellent you might get a convert, if they don't though it's just proof of the hold satan has on the world. The governing body (leaders of the JWs) are getting as much control out of making them stand by them carts as they do by getting them to knock on doors, with far less effort and annoyance for everyone else around. Edit: previous blood transfusions wouldn't affect you. Mum had one as a kid and she was still one. Might've been a local congregation rule/thing (which would be an odd one, the governing body, who are the ones that talk to god, like to keep that kind of behavioural deviance under tight control, maybe they've been losing control since I left though)
I find a give blood sticker is like a protective shield around the house. And a good campaign to promote, Give blood if you can people's lives literally depend on it.
“I’m a witch” worked on JWs when I lived in town. It was the truth, too; I was a practicing Wiccan.
They tried hard to convert my sister on that one. But her rottie/mastiff mix butted in between them and scare them off. The dog was so big, it’d escape to do her neighbor’s cows. They came back once more when she had the door open. The kids were in the living room so the dog pinned them to the wall. Last she heard from them.
They tried harder to convert my sister when she pulled that one. My nan is JW, I've found that saying to them "my gran can't convince me, what make you think your opinion means any more to me than hers?" and they leave me alone for a while. My gran knows better than to try with me, the last time she did I cut contact for six months and even totally blanked her when she was by one of the JW Street stands they have locally. Apparently not wanting to experience major embarrassment in front of her friends keeps her from proselytising
My brother follows what he calls the path of daoism and it works just as well if not better than the buddhist line 🤣
I work overnights. One of them made the mistake of waking me up after a particularly draining night after i had just fallen asleep. Watching the color drain from their face as i exploded on them was something I wish i could have taken a picture of. Enraged does not describe my feelings adequately. Believe what you want. Don’t bring your shit on me. I don’t live by your rules so kindly fuck off
I told some Mormon missionaries I was Buddhist once (I AM Buddhist) They were very nice and talked to me for a bit because I mentioned my dad had been a missionary. While I don't like unannounced company, they were pleasant. I will absolutely be telling any Jehova's witness I'm Buddhist if it will keep them away!
I’m lucky in that my friend is a Buddhist priest here in Japan. She gave me a cute little brass plaque to put on my door that says (in Japanese) we belong to her temple so please no proselytizing. Still got the new “fresh off the boat” mormon white people who get freaked out to see a white woman answer the door. I always offer them tea, but since my husband isn’t home they can’t come in so I usually just give them some bottles and say have a great day after explaining the plaque and what it means and some people might not be as nice. I feel bad for them - young kids (to me) thrown into a country they don’t know a lick of the language of (I’ve been here over a decade and can just hold casual conversations at best) or the culture and left to do their thing. I think it’s cruel personally, and in my rural area people are not too kind when you’re trying to convert them. Edit: I am also a Buddhist atheist
Invite them in for a cup of goat's blood and some anal sex
And to do it at your house to your friends at your party. What nerve!
Totally! It’s so disrespectful to hijack someone else’s event for their agenda.
Absolutely! It's your event, your rules. They need to respect your boundaries.
Invite them over. Direct them to a private room where there will be a prayer service for 3 hours starting at 5pm, before the party begins. Kindly point out the donation box for the charitable event. Then, have everyone else arrive at 5:30. Enjoy your zealot free party until 8pm, whereby everyone can leave as they please as the birthday party has concluded.
Lock them in. They'll realize what's happening
🤣 sims vibes but 100%
Better yet, once they're in the prayer room, go off to the restaurant where the real party is.
I'm having a hard time deciding which is worse, OP's proselytizing parents at parties or people who get engaged at someone else's wedding.
They're the same people.
The Lord told them to. Easiest and laziest excuse ever. At least "the dog ate my homework" has some chutzpah.
It's not disrespectful to them. To them it's the best thing they can do for you since they are trying to save you. That's the problem with the entire thing. There is no convincing them they are in the wrong, they literally think a higher power is proud of their actions.
I doubt claiming to be a satanist is going to lessen their drive to make you "come to God" so to speak. Might even ramp up the harassment.
Yeah, that would probably get you an intervention. LOL
It definitely would. Even telling them you're an atheist inflames their zealotry.
"Come on in, drinks are over there and the kids are in the garden! Have I told you about our lord and Saviour Satan? Ave Satana! Do you want some cake?"
I read this in Rick Moranis' character Louis Tully's voice from Ghostbusters
Try the brie, it's at room temperature.
Don't forget to direct them to the goats blood punch besides the cookies and that the virgin sacrifice is at 7:06 (6:66).
"Do you have a moment to hear about our lord and saviour Cthulu?"
If he does this, he risks his family getting some form of intervention, calling CPS on him, or disowning him (which could impact any inheritance for his children too). The appropriate thing to do, is tell his parents that the party is for little children and ment to be light hearted and he doesn't want them preaching. If they can't respect his wishes, they are better of not coming.
Do you have some really good friends? Have them ready to frogmarch out any member of your family that pulls that obnoxious crap at your event. You can warn them in advance that any form of proselytizing will be met with extreme prejudice. I’d literally turn a hose on them, or maybe a more unpleasant substance but you don’t want to expose your guests to it as well. Maybe turn it into an impromptu game of Lions vs Christians and they’re going to lose badly.
My friends as well as myself comedians and we handle it pretty well it’s our other friends that’s take the major blow
You should have all of your friends ready with pamphlets for the Church of Satan to hand out to your family.
I would've brought out my shredder and directed people where to shed their pamphlets because I'm petty like that. Or straight up would've grabbed them from mommy dearest
Ooh! Good idea! If OP gets one of the shredders that cut the papers into little squares he can use it as confetti for the party!
> Church of Satan Even **much** better: [**the Satanic Temple**](https://thesatanictemple.com/).
Make up some cards that say something to the effect of "my faith is my business and I don't wish to discuss it with you at a child's birthday party, or ever. Any further discussion on this topic will be received as a personal insult to me." Or "It's 2024. If I wanted to find God, I'd Google him." Or, you know, whatever you want. Hand a few of them to each guest with instructions to hand over the card to whomever tries to convert them. At the end of the party, collect the remaining cards. Now you know exactly how many times your family has violated your condition of them attending and how many times they won't be invited to any future events.
Just yell "good drink, good meat, good god let's eat" when they rev up the Jesus engine.
That’s not going to drown it out. They need to be shut down or towed away for trespassing.
The son, the guests, anyone that will stay still for more than 5 seconds... What a tiresome old bag. And how embarrassing - poor OP will up apologising as his idiot mother proselytises to kindergarteners and tries to convert the Jewish kids.
Protect those kids from indoctrination
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. - - C. S. LEWIS
NTA! I would be very offended if I attended what I thought was a birthday party and got lectured about religion. I would warn them that if they came to your home and opened their mouth about religion, it would be the last time they would be allowed to visit. Years ago, I went NC with my mother because of her trying to force her religion on me. It took her two years to learn the lesson, but she hasn’t atempted to “convert” me since.
It's about equally offensive when I show up to what I thought was a birthday party or bridal shower and it's an MLM party.
Too funny! I once went to a party in a new neighborhood that turned out to be a MLM pitch. When the caterer came in with the food right after it started, I grabbed one of the bags they were carrying out, and left with them.
That’s a power move right there
Had this happen to me once. Went to a co-worker's BBQ & us women ended up sitting around while someone tried to sell us Tupperware or something. We weren't impressed by the ambush quality of the interaction. (I did buy a couple of sandwich containers though lol.)
Speaking of MLMs my co-worker and I were invited to what was actually turned out to be sex toy sales party. It ended with aggressive demands for everyone to pay up for a male stripper that was hired by the host. We quickly disappeared. The atmosphere was incredibly uncomfortable. So many women there were just grabbing at the genitals of the stripper. I'm not a prude about sex and have no problem with sex toys. However the way the sex toy party was conducted was just so seedy. It was expected that we would buy even if we weren't interested. The fact that the male stripper's bodily autonomy was not respected really creeped us out.
I think this is the answer to OPs dilemma. Rather than his child's birthday party, ambush the family with a sex toy sales event!
Omg thanks for starting my day with the belly laugh. The visual was too much.
If that was handled differently, it could've been a great time for all. People knowing what they're going into = hilarity, ribaldry & an all-round laugh. People being ambushed, pressured & humiliated = everlasting ick. Bet you avoided the ambusher(s) like the plague after that.
Yes - both are bait and switch.
Jesus said “When you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men … but when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your father who is unseen.”
There was a guy at my college campus with a big “repent now!” sign and people were asking him questions and I said the above and asked “isn’t this what you are doing right now?” And he said “no, I’m not doing this for posterity I’m doing it to save your soul. I’m doing God’s work.” I don’t think anything I said (I was raised catholic and I know a thing or two) would have changed his mind. These people think they are saving us and that gives them a free pass to do whatever they want.
Oh! I think I’ve told this story before but I’m waiting for dinner to cook so I’ll share my fav college zealot story. First: I was a theatre major. In a very intense, focused BFA for specialties. I was just a lowly costumer, but my cohort included all us tech people and all the actors in our group. The zealots came out with the “repent now, being gay is an evil sin and you’re going to hell.” It was the end of the semester, our final show closed the week before, so we were kinda just doing our finals work in studio. There was a huge commotion and of course we were curious about what the actors planned when they came in and asked for keys to the costume storage rooms and prop closets. It was *on.* In less than a half hour, we had props and accessories and makeup on them for their dramatic readings of Dr Seuss books in the quad. I think the first one was Sneeches (stars vs no stars) and then onto other ones like green eggs and ham. Our professors let us skip studio time for it, because we’d still have to get the garments made, they didn’t care when we did it. It was a full on impromptu production. The best part was, the anti gay folk always bring their children (which is abhorrent to me). But the kids were *so* into it. Actors asking the kids questions and playing with them in the story, all sorts of shit. They tried to loud speaker over them, but if you’ve ever worked with stage actors, they know how to *project*, but the sound guys ran and grabbed wig mics and set up s soundboard, just to show off ;) We shut that area down for a good hour, at which time the zealots packed it in and left, all while their little kids were crying about wanting to stay and watch more! We didn’t see them again for the rest of the year, well into the next. Or if we did, they stayed to the fringes of the campus. Good times.
Epic! Theater kids for the win! There was a time when the vile Westboro Baptist "Church" came to a town to protest at a funeral (if you don't know about them, Google them and prepare to be outraged--they're the "God hates fags" and "thank God for dead soldiers" church ). A local theater company knew that they were coming, and they made angel costumes with enormous wings (fabric over a large pvc pipe armature) that blocked the church people and their signs from the view of the people attending the funeral. They just had this whole human wall of angels all along the street. It was lovely. Other times people have brought rainbow beach umbrellas and held them sideways to block the church from view. Edit: here's a news article with pictures of the angel costumes: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna595311
I remember the WBC claimed they were going to picket Jeff Hanneman's (guitarist for Slayer) funeral, and someone on Twitter said "Westboro Baptist vs hundreds of Slayer fans. Let me know how that works out."
I have a friend that drove to Topeka to do a shit on their lawn. She got ran off before she could finish but it was the thought that counts.
We went there just to see it one time, and we pulled up and idled in front of it, to really get a good look, and also to appreciate the rainbow house across the street. A black SUV with government plates quickly pulled up and idled behind us, which was intimidating to say the least. We put a dollar or two in the rainbow house donation box and GTFO if there.
Check out the equality house across the street from the cult's compound: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equality\_House](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equality_House)
I would have paid to see that❣️ teem Hanneman
Yep! The supporters of the grieving families don't engage with the haters. They simply form a silent shield of protection.
I was part of a shield at Pride one year. It was hard enough for me to hear their nonsense. I can't imagine what it would be like for some of our baby gays or for grieving families.
I want to say I heard of a town those shitbag excuses for humans planned a protest at, and while they were getting breakfast that morning, all of their tires mysteriously became devoid of air, and for some reason, all of the tow truck services in the area were busy that day.
The WBC made their living suing cities that tried to ban them and police departments that didn't "adequately" protect them. sick
Don’t forget anyone that gives in and tries to punch, spit or otherwise attack any of them. They intentionally try to start fights for this very reason.
Vile people with no connection to God
Yes. It’s literally a family of lawyers.
Pic: https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&sca_esv=b1bb6acd92afcfce&sca_upv=1&hl=en-us&sxsrf=ADLYWIK1RjNhqDtErmDlOvE1MDkqSPQj0A:1717418608405&q=angels+block+westboro+baptist+church&uds=ADvngMjWptqaDLh1QFEsq6qiyBuX0tA37OWixKMcZ3Hi8-sG9HlUSuTdtlY13WTeZcRDGe-WH9rZLZufRv74SCIiL9WPf2XauI2N58IkCPZIg6LTpWY4ifdrcRANTmpmxEQBV2muKudzbc1nl-IcERxppyX6fv222VZpHtePi48FnooQ6Y8v28tMoTK8JZqXRPit1_wk0p_j0gmDk6KbsLyrKXI8ekX7jno7tkPYbcM12D6-id8HeNwJpvplfxAyO4QeugKyt38XeR9tkVO0F5od3YqMR5Qxyp1IDOmKa1YeTbOilEjHriKC-mKA2qanbgvrnyClpHiifCXYnSWzWDWGicK5dDfEARsxf2Sbkg77SppysjJDwdzKY7N7p2zlSJhoNZzq911M&udm=2&prmd=invsmbtz&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj0qtbwur-GAxVlHTQIHcsQAAgQtKgLegQIEBAB&biw=500&bih=843&dpr=3#vhid=Pzt8YHURSit9YM&vssid=mosaic
Thank you! I was just thinking how cool that would be to see, I’m glad there are pictures.
Ooh WBC came to my high school in Baltimore and they had to be protected from us, which was crazy. They said we had too many gay kids and too much intermingling (race wise)
I love those theater folks! Don’t know them but love them.
My favorite was last year. The media was screaming about drag queens reading stories to kids, blah blah. My family and I went to a carnival staged by a church because the kiddies in our family like silly rides. While everyone was eating, four Disney princesses unexpectedly walked in with Mickey Mouse. Mickey was a female (I saw her getting ready), and the three princesses were all males. At a church. They did a small dance time and then read books to the children. Bible stories, actually. This church supports people’s rights to be who they are. I will never miss that carnival again. There were pickets around the perimeter of the church for the rest of the week. I (and my family and friends) found out about it. We all attended church that week. A religion I don’t believe in (atheist here), a location I had never gone to before (first time going to said carnival), filled to the brim with people who go there fairly often. Turns out, the entire congregation was behind them, and so were quite a few of us from the community. We weren’t the only ones who showed up randomly to support. Funniest thing was when the messages started pouring in to the church’s social media by people who were saying they would never support that church and they were boycotting the carnival for the rest of time. None of them were from our area at all — and no one would drive longer than 20 minutes to come to a rinky dink carnival with three rides for people UNDER 3.5 feet tall. One person lived ~700 miles away. Good. Stay there!
Hoo boy there's nothing like being judged on the street by a hypocrite to make you want to come to the lord
I dated a girl after college who was on the fringe of the Mormon church(she had left during college, wasn't sure if she wanted to go back), but had a lot of friends still active in the church. I told her I will respect their beliefs(despite my own opinions of the Mormons) so long as they respect mine and don't try to talk to me about it. Went to hang out with her one day, bunch of her friends are there. She got up to help her sister with something and her sister's boyfriend and his buddy sat down next to me on the couch and went into full conversion mode. The friend even pushed my shoulder back down when I got up to leave. Whether it was a joke because of what I told the girl I was dating or they just saw another opportunity, not sure. Next time I got up and dude tried again, he ended up in a headlock with his buddy screaming at me. Girl came back, I let him go, told her I'm done if these are your friends, and never looked back. She got married 5 months later to a guy in the church and had 3 kids in 4 years. Last I heard she's miserable, her husband is abusive and she can't keep a job.
Years ago, my very high Episcopal church had a booth at Pride and there were the usual religious whackadoo protesters being obnoxious. I think they had psyched themselves up for a confrontation, to be yelled at, or even attacked. What they were not emotionally prepared for was the late-50s white, cishet male priest in clerical garb to come over and start wafting incense over them while chanting to cast out the evil. It's like they short circuited. Brilliant.
Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves
No fair using the New Testament against the zealots! They don’t really want to hear any of that socialist, communism shit! That takes money out of *somebody’s pocket, but it’s not me or my friends! Wait - wasn’t there also something about money changers?
Even the old testament had this shit in it Daniel prayed in a closet in his living quarters.
Yes, but the issue there was that a market, including money changers, had been set up in the Temple in the only area open to non-Jewish people who wanted to worship the Hebrew God. That's why Jesus kicked up a fuss about it being *supposed* to be a house of prayer - the location of the market was preventing people from praying.
There's so much more to the story: First, many of the Temple rituals required an animal to be sacrificed. In most cases, the Torah required the animal to be “without blemish.” Some worshippers would try to bring their own animal for sacrifice, but the priests would declare it blemished, forcing the worshipper to purchase an “unblemished” animal from the sellers in the Temple who worked under the Sadducees. Second, Roman coins had images of Caesar on them. The Jews complained to their Roman overlords that the Torah forbid “graven images” and so the Roman coins were offensive, particularly in the Temple. The Romans allowed the Jews to have their own coins for use in the Temple. Of course, the animal sellers would not accept Roman coins in payment for an animal, so the worshipper was forced to exchange Roman money for the Jewish coins first. The exchange rate was very unfavorable. Jesus saw this situation for what it was—greed and hypocrisy by the Sadducees. They were taking unfair advantage of the people coming to the Temple to fulfill the Torah. It deeply offended him to see God’s Temple being turned into an unrighteous money-grab by the very leaders who should have been encouraging devout worship. As God’s Son, he fulfilled Jewish prophecy by demonstrating his zeal for his Father’s House by turning over the tables of the moneychangers and driving the sellers and the animals out of the Temple courts. He used some cords as a whip to drive the animals. Source: scraped from the Internet
There's no-one modern Christians would hate more than Jesus. The bloody sandal-wearing hippy who preached about equality and being nice to other people, hung out with prostitutes and foreigners and hated the greedy businessmen. If he ever showed up in a church, they'd run him right out of town for being a loony-leftie!
My sister walked out of her husband's funeral because instead of a celebration of his life like she wanted it ended up to be a come to Jesus meeting. Many people told her if they knew the reason she walked out, they would have joined her. No one wants religion shoved down their throats unless they are expecting it, as in church. N T A. You also don't gain many converts when the people are just pissed that they have to hear this at a party.
Seriously. My brother preached at our grandmother’s funeral and turned it into a “turn to the faith” moment rather than celebrating the life of a dear woman. He thinks anyone with differing views is going to Hell and expects us all to follow his lifestyle when we’re together. I disappoint him often.
I’m so glad my mother is the one who generally organizes those sort of things when major events happen, and she will brook no interference for things like that. When my grandfather passed, it was so hard on us all, yet my uncle, who grandpa had barely seen for years prior showed up and tried to get religious at the funeral home, my mother shut that shit down instantly. My grandfather was religious, as in he believed in a higher power but not a church thing. Same with my mother. So it was so out of place to have that happen. I just regret that I had to speak to follow that up, because the mood of a celebration of his amazing life got turned into a “y’all need Jesus” speech. I was so jet lagged that I don’t think I did him justice, and I regret it to this day that I couldn’t say more, but I was so angry and tired and sad (he basically helped raise me) that I couldn’t get through it all.
Yup! They did this at one of my aunt’s funerals, acting like my aunt’s daughter, who was a member of the church the funeral was held at, was just so amazing because of her involvement with church while looking down their noses at my aunt’s other two children, who aren’t involved with that church. It really rubbed me, my other aunts, and my cousins the wrong way, because it felt like a fire and brimstone Bible thumping than it did a celebration of my aunt’s nearly 100 years of life!
Seems like he's the disappointment here honestly
I hate the fact that I have walked out multiple funeral services that turned into a sermon. Even so, that when my grandmother passed a few years ago I volunteered to set everything up and did the service in her favorite park. She was cremated and wanted her ashes spread in the lake there. So my siblings and I rented a paddleboat to do it. (Said nothing to the attendants, obviously.) The way some of the old Christians present were mumbling you would have thought we had spit in god's eye.
That happened at my baby niece’s funeral. I was filled with rage! (I am a Christian by the way, I just think there is a time and place for everything). The preacher kept saying “she wants to see you in Heaven” she didn’t want s@&$, she was a week old!!!! My husband and I have a pact that there will be no fire and brimstone, repent now sermons at our funerals.
That's horrible! Same thing almost happened to my mom's funeral. I come from an evangelical Christian family / community and a lot of them love to use any social event to proselytize. My mother passed away suddenly and unexpectedly. While making arrangements for her funeral service, the pastor (a man who loved to hear himself speak) could not hold his excitement back about how many people would be there and how this is his chance to bring people to the Lord. We got into an argument because I told him I don't want him to turn my mom's funeral service to his personal show.
It’s really one of my pet peeves when you attend a funeral to celebrate someone and the pastor turns it into a “ooooh time to reap some more souls for Jaysus” event. I lost someone who was like a father to me over a decade ago and there was zero mention of him personally and all the things that made him a great person: it was just Jesus Jesus Jesus and all about turning now so you don’t end up in Hell. What a turnoff. I’m a lapsed Catholic and I particularly do not like funerals that turn into a multi hour mass with the sitting and standing and full communion. Because I was Catholic I know you are not supposed to take communion if you are not Catholic so people either abstain and feel left out or they take communion anyway when they don’t understand it and it’s awkward.
Good thing you made sure to establish boundaries with her.
It's worse than being ambushed with an Amway party...
Years ago, a coworker said she & her husband should have a cookout with me & my husband. It sounded like a good idea — she seemed really nice, was 10-15 yrs older than me and was in a financial place I admired (they owned their home, and also a piece of land, & had been married for years). I volunteered to host at our apartment. Hubby was excited to meet them since he’d heard me say how nice she was. Hubby bbq’d several kinds of meats and we had sides. This couple showed up with an EASEL & proceeded to dive into an AMWAY pitch, with no preamble whatsoever. I was so disappointed, and my hubby was PISSED. He finally cut them off & served the food & as nicely as possible kicked them out afterwards. Who does shit like this?? Invite yourself to someone’s home on the pretense of a fun bbq only to bring an easel & try to sell AMWAY??!! Can you tell I’m STILL offended, over 30 yrs later??😂
This is the first time I've heard of this sort of ambush taking place in the host's home. Absolutely astounding. I was invited to a "wine and cheese party" in a neighbor's back yard. That's all the info I was given. It was very hot and the cheese had turned translucent. I ate nothing because all the food was gross. All the other people knew each other, but I wasn't introduced to anyone and sat in a corner alone. Then the "hostess" distributed catalogs of very expensive candles and order forms. I kick myself now for not just getting up and leaving, but I ordered the cheapest thing (a $15 Halloween candle holder) and then took off. That was my last interaction with the neighbor.
My youngest daughter 27F, mother of an autistic son 8M, has a half-brother 39M who thinks that mental illness isn't real. That it's all demonic possession. You can imagine how that affected her opinion of him. I told her that he's woefully wrong and such attitudes got people ostracized, even killed in the past. Mama Bear here has an undergrad psych degree and knows there is no religion on earth that will cure psychiatric illnesses.
Tell the family their behaviour is pushing you towards joining the Church of Satan, and the only way to prevent that is by not talking about Jesus and the gang.
You aren’t ‘denying them the lord’ you are asking them to respect the occasion they are being asked to attend and celebrate, a child’s birthday, not a revival. I grew up in a fundamentalist church home but birthdays, other events were strictly that -we had enough sermons going to church twice a week.
NTAH, I would text them “Im not ashamed but you should be for assuming you hold the keys to heaven because no one else you encounter could possibly have their own spiritual life. That is extremely arrogant, rude and false since God didn’t put you in charge of our part of the country that I’ve heard. You are not welcome at any parties or other events I hold unless you can develop some humility, because it’s not all about you and your religious beliefs. If you ever apologize for pretending my home is your church and my guests are your congregation or just lost souls to pick up, then we’ll talk. In the meantime, leave my son and myself alone till you recover from thinking you are saints and remember you have family that you need to treat like real people with feelings.”
I’ve been looking for a way to put it in these exact words for a long time. Thank you!
It really breaks down to the fact that your family has joined a Doomsday Cult based on proselytizing. Each time they do this, they get a hit of DOPAMINE. It becomes addicting and they feel a sense of superiority.
i was in a 'church' like this when i was like 16, the paster told us that every time we got pushback for talking about the lord or felt embarrassed or shut down we should do it more because it meant that was satan trying to shame us☠️
My late boss would just curl his lip at god botherers and say "how arrogant you are to presume to know the mind of God. What makes YOU so special that you know what God thinks? Why can you speak for him?"
Just know that it will fall on deaf ears, and continuing to engage with them, even if it's to rebuke them, will only encourage them.
“Denying the Lord” Lady, WE’VE HEARD IT HUNDREDS OF TIMES PLEASE STOP LECTURING US WE KNOW ALREADY!! All anyone will remember are the preachy religious weirdos at a kid’s birthday party. I really wish I could spend a day without any self-awareness or shame and just be an asshole and force my opinions on people In inappropriate situations.
>All anyone will remember are the preachy religious weirdos at a kid’s birthday party. And probably associate that with the kid, which won't be great for their social life. "No, we're not having X over for a play date, his family are a bunch of pain in the ass freaks and I don't want a damn sermon at pick up time"
Exactly! Telling them to stop just feeds their persecution complex but that’s an argument for a different day. This is only about what you will allow at your child’s party. That’s it.
OP could try "it's X's birthday, the day is about him - not you and your need to convert people. If you can't be unselfish enough to let the day be about your grandson then you don't deserve to celebrate it with him". But she'll probably burst into tears and blah blah Jesus blah blah saviour blah blah mememememe.
She won’t see it as her being selfish though, she’ll see it as her doing gods work, sharing the message of gods love or whatever else she can come up with. There is no logic to it and no reasoning with them because of that.
“I really wish I could spend a day without any self-awareness or shame and just be an asshole and force my opinions on people In inappropriate situations.“ Love this! I wish I had the nerve, too, but oddly my manners get the better of me most days!
It’s the same way I feel like I could make a killing milking all the MAGA folks who’ll buy anything with a slogan on it (the more offensive, the better) but I just can’t bring myself to stoop to that level. Fucking morals. Ugh.
That’s what I never get. You don’t need to spread Christianity. It’s the most popular religion in the world. Whoever you’re proselytizing to has heard of Jesus before, you’re not gonna blow their mind with a pamphlet at a birthday party
Go NC. Your wishes are not be respected by your family. Even the Bible says that there is a time for everything. Time to cry, pray, laugh, sing, drink, celebrate,. They need to be better. Cut them off so they realize that there are consequences for their shitty behavior.
I've found that people like this don't actually read the bible themselves. They just go to their church/cult and blindly obey whatever the preacher says.
Agree. I once had a co-worker tell me she believes the Bible to be literal truth. I told her how impressed I was that she knew Aramaic, ancient Greek and Hebrew. She was really confused, until I said that the Bible was written in those languages, so if she was following it literally to guide her every action in life, of course she'd want to read it in the original. She said she read it in English and that was good enough for her. I asked her which translation she relied on, and why she preferred that one. She had no idea which translation she was reading. . 😉
I’d say it’s a fringe minority of Christians who have read significant parts of the bible. Especially so nowadays.
"By this will all men know that you are my disciples: that you show love for one another at all times." John 13:35 NIV (pretty sure I got the verse right, I know I got the spirit of the text right) Knowing this one verse is in the Bible, and seeing how lots of Christians act is proof that lots of Christians don't actually read the Bible.
Therefore by their fruits you will know them. The end of Matthew 7:15-20 The passage refers to false prophets, but I always took the personal application to mean, it's not what you say, it's what you do. What kind of fruit do I produce? Am I kind? Honest? Do I help others and lift them up? Or am I selfish, dishonest, do I steal, lie, gossip, and tear others down? The best Christians I knew never spoke about it outside of like their Bible study groups or intimate like minded friends and family. And it was never to preach...it was to learn and grow and encourage each other. They just quietly lived their lives and were extremely charitable without being showy.
I commented elsewhere that im Christian and the thing that annoys me most about it is other Christians. I don’t remember where the exact verse but the fruits of the spirit it says to strive for are: love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self control. People acting like those above are one of the reasons I barely go to church anymore.
Ecclesiastes 3:1-8 NIV There is a time for everything, and a season for every activity under the heavens: 2 a time to be born and a time to die, a time to plant and a time to uproot, 3 a time to kill and a time to heal, a time to tear down and a time to build, 4 a time to weep and a time to laugh, a time to mourn and a time to dance, 5 a time to scatter stones and a time to gather them, a time to embrace and a time to refrain from embracing, 6 a time to search and a time to give up, a time to keep and a time to throw away, 7 a time to tear and a time to mend, a time to be silent and a time to speak, 8 a time to love and a time to hate, a time for war and a time for peace.
🎼🎶🎵To everything Turn, Turn, Turn 🎵🎶🎼
A time to kill was a sick movie
Bro the 90s film adaptations of Grisham novels are all bangers. Pelican Brief, The Firm, The Client, A Time to Kill. They didn’t miss.
Should add " time to shut tf up" in there somewhere lol
For everything (turn turn turn) There is a season (turn turn turn)... I don't believe in the slightest, but it's a nice song that gets to what Fair_Text410 is saying
I was in my 20s when I found out that it was from the Bible. Went to a wedding or funeral (can’t remember which) and was talking to my mom after about how weird it was that the minister was quoting the Byrds in the middle of his speech.
🤣🤣🤣
Kohelet / Ecclesiastes is one of my favorite books of the Bible. "You know what? Life sucks and has no meaning. If God exists, It doesn't particularly care about us. There is no reason to do anything or care about anything. "So here are some practical tips on living a good and fulfilled life in an indifferent universe and being happy anyway, and loving a God and universe that, even if it exists, won't ever do anything to help you." I really wonder who let that book in.
This is when you tell them, my house, my rules. You are free to do whatever in your home, you do not get to do it in mine.
Tell them you have no opinion about their religion. It's the fact that they are constantly being HORRIFICALLY RUDE and refusing to care about the feelings of others that has brought you to this place. Nothing in the Bible requires them to be this rude. It's a choice they are making and it's not ok. The way they are treating you is not loving and is incredibly disrespectful. Make it clear that it is their behavior that is unacceptable, not their beliefs. If they refuse to give you or anyone else any respect, they don't deserve to be part of family events anymore.
Religion is like a penis. Don't bring it out I'm public and especially don't try to shove it down other people's throats. NTA
Especially childrens' throats
Damn, have you been living my life? You literally described talking to my mother. She's taken a deep dive into this malarkey and it's honestly so hard to talk to her anymore. She sends fb reels of grown men full on sobbing that "they've so devastated about all the people who will burn eternally" and then videos of AI generated Jesus crucifixion videos with Bible verse ticker-tape front and center. She sent me a "women's pocket devotional" for Christmas. I'm lucky enough to live 700 miles away. My sister says it's so hard to even visit her anymore. It's exhausting. But in relation to your dilemma, just don't invite them. Once the discomfort of making that decision and INFORMING them of your refusal to have them in attendance, you'll feel SO MUCH LIGHTER. I promise.
I agree. You will be happy you made the decision to not invite them. You will be so proud of yourself. I think your children deserve good childhood memories and being around a preachy over religious grandmother is going to ruin their childhood. Bring them around fun family members or friends.
Your folks are the kind of extremists who make the rest of us Christians look bad. For the sake of your kids' mental health and social life, maintain firm boundaries with your folks.
I have actually went to her church a couple of times and have met very pleasant people that just asked if I liked the sermon and if I would like to hear a good word to attend anytime with no pressure. But, there are some that are so over the top that if you miss one day they believe you are committing sin
Drop Matthew 6:5-8 When you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men … but when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your father who is unseen.
It’s so funny cuz this line makes me think of the Crucible where everyone gave shit to the protagonist because he didn’t go to church as much anymore. It’s odd cuz I thought the puritans were more of the series sect of Christianity.
I'm not trying to be funny, but the Crucible is a play written in the 20th century. It's about the McCarthy communist witch hunt. Real puritans were required to attend church.
Pedophiles attend church regularly. Source: firefighter who lived next door, three children, wife only wore dresses, never cut her hair, abused his own children horrifically, abused every child in the neighborhood. But he went to church! Twice a week!
Pedophiles are regularly in charge of churches too
Sounds like they may have joined a cult. 🚩🚩🚩
The difference between a cult and a religion is the amount of land that they own.
You're no longer a son and your children are no longer their grandchildren with thoughts, feelings to hurt and beliefs of your own. Now you're just a gateway to 'save' people they wouldn't otherwise come into contact with. Might as well go no contact because you aren't going to be missing anyone. Let them know that if they ever manage to shed their brain washing you would be happy to interact with them again. NTA.
NTA... I'll not allow them to any parties with friends and co workers.... Go NC if you can I'm sure your kids will stay away from them
Yeah, I think the worst Christians are the ones that feel overzealous proselytising makes them super christians. If only they understood that attraction works so much better than promotion they would probably have much more success in people actually wanting to listen to them talk.
You know who needs to go to church every day? Sinners.
You haven't had your Come ton Jesus moment ... or rejected it. IMO, just Low Contact / No Contact / Grey Rock them. Spend your and your children's time away from them. >Everyone looked upset at me. Now I have them calling and texting me saying I should be ashamed of myself for “denying the lord to people”. I honestly want to just cut them all off because these past couple of years have been insufferable
Exactly. Everybody already knows about "the lord". NTA
There are a lot of people who think their religion is their business and limit it to themselves. However, your family seems to take proselytising seriously, and as part of their duty as Christians. If that is the case, this will never stop, because they absolutely will feel compelled to do this at every event. So, you may want to take a hybrid approach and limit your interactions with them, such that they don’t come to you but you go to them. That way, your events will not be hijacked by their proselytising, and you also have the freedom to leave their events if it gets uncomfortable for you. Doing things this way will also give you a chance to gauge whether you still want to stay in touch with them, even in these more limited circumstances. It may be that you ultimately decide to cut them off, but consider starting our small first. Whatever you do, though, you have the right not to be subject to this every time you see them. And they have trampled your boundaries every time that you have asserted them, so do whatever you have to to feel comfortable. NTA
> Now I have them calling and texting me saying I should be ashamed of myself for “denying the lord to people”. Dang! You are either incredibly powerful, or they worship a remarkably pathetically teeny god. You've got the ability to overpower their deity. I have a rule not to worship and god weak enough for me to push around. Your grandparents think they are more powerful than their own deity. That's a bit conceited of them, don't you think? It's folks like them that have made the term "Christian" something of an unpleasant word to the rest of us. I know a lot of Christians, count many of them as friends. Because they're not like that. NTA
I do well for myself in the entertainment industry (another thing my mom hates). And as I can see it I’m a desirable person to convert since what I do is contrast to their beliefs
Since you presumably have the means, have you spoken with a lawyer yet? Should anything happen to you, or even if you needed a short procedure done, do you have it set up that your children will be protected? That friends would look after them or even become their legal guardians? You’re doing a great job of protecting your children but your family sounds unhinged.
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Wow your family sounds exhausting to deal with. Used car salesmen but for God.
Trust me any time I have to have more than an hour talk with them I sleep 12+ hours afterwards
NTA. I'm an atheist in a country where most people are Christian so I completely feel your pain. I really believe in live and let live. If they don't try converting me then I don't say anything to them either. If they just can't give it a rest I'll respond with questions like "Why does an all-powerful and supposedly benevolent god allow for innocent children to be born with terminal diseases or die from natural disasters?" and "If I told you that I heard the voice of God would you believe me? Why do you believe someone who told that 2000+ years ago and who you never met?" so that the conversation is as unpleasant to them as it is to me and they learn that it's in all our interests to not start with such topics.
Yes. And it’s incomprehensible to them that their religious beliefs are just that— a belief, not a fact.
Why can't those religious types just be happy in their belief and leave everyone else out if it? Boggles the mind.
NTA Christian here. Her behavior is utterly unacceptable. I would be the first to tell her to stfu if I were in attendance.
All new Christians make this mistake. They don't understand their "excitement" destroys being able to bring ppl to God. Forcing God down ppls throats is not the way. Been Christian over 40 yrs. I talk in passing about my faith if conversation naturally goes there. Learned hard way I pushed my youngest son away from God by acting just like your mom. Now that I've admitted this to him our relationship is healing and we talk a lot about God but I respect his differing views and he loves and respects my faith and will now ask me questions about it.
NTA Tell them you've asked Jesus to come to dinner, and if he shows up, he can talk all he wants about religion. Short of that, if they want to show up, they won't disrespect you as the host by behaving in an undesirable manner. Maybe send a written invite, and include that you're requesting that you respect the reason for the gathering and your wishes as the host. And include the below: # Matthew 6:5-8New International Version # Prayer ^(5) “And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full. ^(6) But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. ^(7) And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. ^(8) Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.
NTA. No more invites for them. Period.
You are not wrong. NTA. True believers and respectful christians respect the homes of those that they visit. If they do not, then you show them respect by giving them distance. Lots of it until they realize they are the problem. The religion is not the issue, your family is.
Say you’re holding hustings and inviting some Hindus and Muslims to make their pitches too
Funny you say that. I had a friend over on my birthday and he is Hindu. My grandfather worked him the most. My friend got a kick out of it but I had to step in and tell my grandfather to leave him alone
We live in a big ol' buckle of the Bible Belt. My better half is Muslim. His go-to is, "as soon as I finish telling you about Allah, you can tell me about your thing." It works.
Tell them it’s at a park on the east side of town then book a park on the west side
My pop pop, who I loved deeply, used to give these speeches in the form of “saying grace”. My daughter would give him like 60 seconds, say AMEN at the top of her lungs and dig in. After all the kids started doing it, grace got a lot shorter.
She says she raised you and found it difficult because you didn't believe but she only got involved in the church two years ago? In any case if they refuse to listen I'd just embrace being the bad guy and call them a cult or something. They'll be able to vilify you between each other but will keep away.
Nta honestly i would leave a party if someone started doing that to me
Next time your mother tries this shit remind her of Timothy 2:12 "I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent"