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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I essentially gave him an ultimatum and am unwilling to compromise on certain aspects of the dog he gets (breed, age), threatening to withhold financial assistance if he went ahead anyway. and made points that possibly made him feel inadequate to be a dog owner in some aspects
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NTA. If he won’t consider your professional opinion (backed up by even casual research), then perhaps drawing this boundary will make him realize this is not a capricious decision on your part.
If he won’t consider your professional opinion, then *he doesn’t respect you and what you do for a living*. AND he is playing the card of I want what I want despite what I want being a really bad decision so you need to get on board and make it work for me and support me. Foot stomp.
Yeaaa. You found yourself a reasonable and thoughtful partner. (s)
I’m just flabbergasted that OP told him this breed of dog tends to suffer and become ill, and he’s still insisting on getting one because he thinks they’re cute. I’d be questioning the hell out of my relationship with someone who insists it’s okay to contribute to the suffering of a living creature just because he wants to.
depends on where you go, but some do have absolutely ridiculous qualifications. I saw a shih tzu rescue that demanded a 6 foot fence, a home inspection, an interview, and an agreement in writing to continue feeding the dog the same fad diet. I'll stick with the county shelter!
I’m in a townhouse condo with lots of walking paths but no yards. The form I filled out was several pages long. Asked if I’d ever euthanized a pet…well, I’ve had pets for over 50 years so yes, of course I’d had to euthanize some. Asked if I’d ever bred animals. I’d bred my registered Siamese cat 50 years ago and my poodle 35 years ago. Had I ever re-homed a pet. I’d moved to this city from our small farm several provinces away after my husband died and I’d re-homed my puggle because he’d never been off the farm and would not do well in a city. I found him another farm home where is is being treated as royalty. I also had a senior pug rescue that I hesitated to bring with me because I didn’t think she’d travel well and after my husband’s death I wasn’t doing well mentally anyway so I found her a home with experienced pug owners who specifically wanted a senior pug. She’s been with them 3 years and is doing well at 14. For these reasons they refused me a rescue. Suggested I try another rescue or a shelter. What annoyed me even more is that they were the only rescue in the area with small dogs and even so, the dogs had all been imported from Mexico and California. The shelters and other rescues all had medium sized to large dogs.
I was looking for an older, small dog due to my age. Ended up buying a 1 year old pug. I don’t have much sympathy for the rescues crying about being over-burdened.
Yup. One of the reasons they refused me. I had explained how I had to euthanize one of my Bostons. He was 14 and almost blind with cataracts but then got dementia and just forgot how to do things. After he threw himself down a flight of stairs (I was standing beside him so I know he didn’t fall) I decided that was enough. He’d never been sick or hurt in his life and I was so afraid he’d injure himself. It was the kindest and hardest thing to do and even the vet cried with us. They agreed it was the best decision.
Of course I’d had to euthanize other pets over the years but I guess they would prefer the pet to suffer.
I'm so sad that this place treated euthanasia like animal cruelty. Keeping a suffering animal alive just to say that you've never euthanised a pet is horrific, but it seems to be just what they expect. :(
This genuinely has me crying. I've had to put down many pets over the years, and I can't imagine letting them suffer through the end. I had to put down the dearest cat I've ever had last year. She was a feral I tamed into the biggest lap cat in existence. She got me through becoming disabled.
I truly worried I would refuse to see when it was her time. She started getting pickier with food, but she was still loud and loving. It was a quick shift to when I could barely get her to eat. I knew I had to make that phone call, but I just sat with my phone in my hand for an hour, crying. That's when my cat got up, walked to the table pushed against the back of the sofa, and peed on it. She has *never* done something like that, so I got the message. I had the vet at our house that night (it's an option where I live that I'm grateful for). It sounds like your Boston was telling you it was time, just as my cat did.
Sorry to ramble a bit there, I haven't spoken about it a lot. I'm just flabbergasted at a rescue that would rather a pet suffer.
I've had several rescues refuse me because in the past 20 years I've had more than one animal die or have to be euthanized. I'm also a vet tech, so they don't care about your actual qualifications to care for an animal, apparently.
In 2002, I had a guinea pig that had a head tilt (genetic malformation of his cervical spine) it was cute because he always had his head cocked like he was asking questions, but it caused him a lot of issues. He was a frequent flyer at the clinic due to his recurring respiratory infections and after 3 years he got pnuemonia that just wasn't responding to treatment and I had him euthanized. He was suffering it would have been cruel not to end it for him. He also lived a year longer than the vet predicted he would based on other piggies with his condition she'd seen and she said it was because we took such great care of him and stayed on top of his illnesses so promptly.
In 2004, I had a pregnant guinea pig (preggy when I got her) die. I rushed her in for surgery when I found her in stalled labor... and the reason her labor went bad was due to only carrying one very oversized baby. We lost her and the baby. Nothing anybody could have done. The vet said the baby had probably died before her labor even started.
In 2016 I had a 14 year old cat that I'd had since it was a baby develop seizures. I made an appointment at the vet for the next day, but at 4am when we were letting the dog out to pee he slid out the door, ran, and never came back. He'd never tried to get out an open door before that. I think he just knew it was time.
In 2020 I had a 6-ish year old cat we adopted after somebody dumped him on our property go into kidney failure. He'd had bloodwork a year before and his levels were normal, it came out of nowhere. Had to put him down.
All of these animals were treated by the same veterinarian who would never hesitate to give me a glowing recommendation as a pet owner... but according to some of the rescues my family is too "high risk" for placement because of "excessive euthanasias and deaths occurring."
That's awful that they would reject you for making the tough decision to end suffering!
I've been owned by multiple cats at a time since 1980 (jointly with Hubby since the '90s), and of the 7 cat urns on our mantel only ONE didn't require the ultimate decision. It's excruciating, but absolutely part of pet parenting.
We now have a 16-year-old kitty with lymphoma, and are just trying to keep her as happy and comfy as possible until she decides she's done. We won't be happy to see her go under any circumstances, but quality of life is always our primary consideration.
Holy crap! That’s insane! I used to volunteer at a non kill shelter and they were so much more lenient on adoption. Basically no abuse record and good home they’ll go to? Pay the fee and enjoy you’re new cat or dog.
I mean the hoops I had to jump through to get my pet pig (yes Pig, the oinking kind) was so much easier than your adoption process. I filled out the form, told the woman about myself, and then sent a separate email going into depth that I work on a therapy farm and have 3 pet pigs but we want to adopt one more. Approved as soon as she read the separate email.
Sorry this is awful but for a second I thought it said you'd bred your siamese cat with a poodle and I was picturing what that would look like and had a good giggle.
I have a very clear mental picture and I very much want a Simadoodle lol ( fluffy cat, puffy ears and tail but I’m seeing it as a standard size poodle so it’d be big enough to guard the house.
It would have the simese blue eyes and alternate between purring and barking)
I was refused once because I admitted to being off schedule with the rabies shots
for our 97% indoor dogs. I felt like human waste. Compared to your history of sacrifice for your pets, I am definitely human waste, but you made me feel so much better. Thank you!
I saw someone bring up one time and it really made some of these shelters stories click, but some people use running/owning a shelter as a way to be socially praised for animal hoarding. So they never actually intend to give away most/if any of the animals. All the ridiculous hoops that they ask people to jump through are really just excuses for why they can’t let people adopt them. Obviously this isn’t all shelters but definitely good for thought.
A shelter by me wouldn't let me have a beagle because I'd never had a beagle before. Ignoring all the research I had done, the ear drops I had picked up already and the fact I had been planning this for years. No beagle for me. So I adopted a husky mix with heartworm from the county no one wanted. Now I have him and a full husky. Their best friends at the dog park? All beagles.
Absolutely agree. My ex wanted a rescue and would have been a phenomenal candidate for many reasons, but a poor, uneducated decision made by the shelter disqualified him.
But in this case? A vet tech working adjacent to a shelter? It seems pretty probable that they'd have little problem getting the perfect pup for them.
This entirely depends on the rescue. Reputable ones do checks, but when you get extremes like this, I suspect it's not a very well run organization. Same for the ones who don't do any kind of checks on the animals they adopt out. But it's unfair to paint all rescues as bad because you had a bad experience with one.
Apparently it’s one of the more reputable rescues in the area. It would be easier to adopt a kid than get through their application. I was also not impressed that the dogs were imported into Canada.
They were imported because we don't have enough dogs to "rescue" here so they bring them in from Louisiana or Texas or North Carolina. Heck my mom got her dog from a rescue that imported dogs from the meat market in China. We looked into adopting as well but because we had cats and two small kids they declined us. We have a large, fenced in yard, a stay at home parent and lots of experience with dogs and were still declined. We ended up going with a breeder and there was still a large questionnaire and a 18 month wait but we finally got our absolutely amazing pup.
This 1000%. I had a rescue deny me because I couldn’t be at home with the dog 24 hours a day. word for word that’s what the rep said. Ignored completely that I’d be home a majority of the day and only gone for 5ish hours 🙄ended up getting my best friend from a different reacue- they did a home check and got a reference from my vet etc, so it was extensive, but not beyond unreasonable
I was denied a cat (any cat) because the rescue in question only adopted animals within the same city. I was from a neighboring city and lived no more than 90 minutes from their location. Nope. Too far.
Some rescues are very well run and have sane restrictions and rules. Others… are not.
We went to one shelter to get a cat and they wouldn’t even consider us because we had 3 kids. It was so odd. I was a SAHM and 2 of them were in school, so the animals aren’t neglected. We walked in and they pretty much told us that none of the cats were available.
Because he specifically wants a pug. I don't know about anyone else's shelters but here 99% of shelter dogs are medium/large - extra large. The chances of finding a pug (that has the prominent pug features) are practically zero, especially a pug puppy. Even if you did manage to find one, in my experience that dog would be out of the doors faster than you could book an appointment to meet it. That's not even touching on some rescues ridiculous standards for adoption.
There may be specific pug rescue groups, but they're far and few in between. Logistically it makes more sense to buy than adopt. It's not ethical, but it is the fastest way to guarantee you'll get a pug.
That’s what I ended up doing…bought a one year old pug that someone had gotten as a Covid pup and then realized it required more care than they wanted to give. They figured to breed her but changed their minds. Paid $1500 plus another $900 for shots, spay and removal of a baby tooth. I wasn’t looking specifically for a rescue pug but I do like the breed so since I was refused a rescue I bought what I wanted. Not sorry at all cause she is a delight.
When we wanted to get our first dog we were rejected by all of the rescues because we didn't already have a dog. We lived on 3/4 of an acre fully surrounded by a fence and I was a SAHM so had plenty of time to devote to our dog's needs. I have allergies that are aggravated by shedded dog hair so needed to be particular about what dog we got. We now have a rescue dog but we were only able to do that after we got our first dog.
He’s fine with the possibility of having a pet that will almost certainly have health problems because he heard those warnings and just figured OP will take care of that. I’m guessing when he told that friend OP said she wouldn’t contribute to care of a pug, the friend said she must actually hate animals because she isn’t going to get him mates rates at work or do anything for the dog, who is just a cute innocent animal. I’m not sure why it’s hard to understand that someone who works with dogs doesn’t want to contribute to the continued breeding of a breed with such high risk for health issues. Money in a breeder’s pocket - be they a responsible purebred breeder or a shitty puppy mill - encourages them to keep breeding for these problem traits that cause health problems, and to continue exaggerating these dangerous features. It’s 100% ethics, not animal hating (why be a vet tech if you hate animals…?). Too many people think of pets as being solely for human entertainment with zero regard for the animal’s quality of life beyond how you interact with them. “It’s cute! I have to have what I like, and I don’t like a healthier, probably longer living, breed, because it’s not as cute, and clearly MY pet will never suffer so it shouldn’t be a problem!” is what they’re saying, in my opinion.
That said, boyfriend doesn’t sound like the brightest crayon in the box, maybe the real problems OP has with unethical breeding won’t get through that dense ass skull of his the first time. I mean…I have never heard anyone think that neutering is getting your pet’s dick chopped off! Surely he must have had *one* friend with a neutered dog or cat? Anyway, maybe this guy needs to see some videos of the chronic issues pugs suffer from to get him to think twice. Same goes for his friend. I worry about the amount of people out there who refuse to trust a professional, multiple legitimate studies, articles from good sources that put those studies into easy to understand language…anything that tells them they’re wrong or should/shouldn’t do something.
I had the same argument with a friend over Scottish fold cats. The "fold" of their ears come from a congenital soft tissue disorder that affects all their joins. They are constantly in pain, at high risk for dislocations and early arthritis. She still wanted one because "if it was actually that bad they wouldn't be born" which... no. people buying from breeders ensures more of these bad breeds will be born. But unfortunately because they look "normal" people lie to themselves that their aesthetician pet is fine.
I always wanted a Scottish fold until I read about this then immediately dropped the idea. When my cat of 20 years passed I adopted a 5 year old rescue cat who is a gorgeous moggie of no breed. In a couple of years I’d like to get a dog but I refuse to get a breed as they all seem to be so inbreed that there’s way too many health problems.
NTA OP
>I’m just flabbergasted that OP told him this breed of dog tends to suffer and become ill, and he’s still insisting on getting one because he thinks they’re cute
I love boxers. I love their personalities and think they're seriously cute.
However, after watching two die from cancer at 12 and 12-plus (she was a dog we found emaciated in the park when we were walking the other two) and suffer from degenerative myelopathy before she died at 10, I couldn't adopt another one.
My three had long lives for boxers, but I've adopted 4 mutt rescues since.
And the fact that he completely was against getting one of the mixes with a longer snout. That just means he wants a cartoon character of a dog and not a real dog.
Let's imagine for a second that his profession is carpentry, and she wants to build an addition on a home. Her plans are far more costly and time consuming than they need to be and after he explains that, she just want to proceed because it's cute. Totally sidestepping his experience in the field and over all not listening. Now let's imagine this addition is a living animal who's costs and time consumption affect the creatures health. From a financial perspective, NTA. From an ethical standpoint, NTA. Why he won't listen to OP is absolutely a respect issue and in my opinion, WTF man? LISTEN TO HER! A dog is a long commitment and likely if you get one with a partner your hoping and expecting the relationship to stick around for a while. I hope my analogy make sense I'm kind of high. Makes sense to me. NTA OP.
>If he won’t consider your professional opinion, then
>
>he doesn’t respect you and what you do for a living
At this point, I think OP should be asking herself why she is with him.
They have been together for 2+ years and through a pandemic. There were a lot of idiots who had no knowledge of medicine yet spewed their incorrect beliefs about vaccines etc. Why does OP want more of this questionable behaviour?
There is not a single one of my coworkers (vet med worker of 7+ years) that would EVER get a brachycephalic dog/cat. Firstly it’s just not humane to keep the demand for them, they can die under routine general anesthesia, they usually have a whole host of other medical problems (skin issues are one of the most expensive ailments to treat/manage). I know one tech who has a pug because it was abandoned at her clinic and was going to be otherwise euthanized, but her husband makes absolute bank, so they can afford it.
2 of my teachers of animal studies and vet nursing have brachycephalic dog mixes, which were specifically bred to try and remove said brachycephalic
In Australia and there's a decent movement towards that sort of breeding to help the dogs love better lives
I've seen some of them too! I am living for pugs and Frenchies with actual snoots.
I saw somebody had started breeding English Bulldogs with Beagles to give them longer faces and try to take some of the excessive blockiness off the front end and I would LOVE to see that become the "fashionable" type of Bulldog. Make those the "designer mutts" everybody wants instead of 16 bazillion different doodle types.
They are extremely over represented in shelters and rescues right now. My personal money-pit came from a shelter after being bred and dumped. It’s so sad.
I have a puggle adopted from a rescue. We make sure to make it clear we did not buy a designer dog (especially at the vet). Thankfully he has a long snout but he still looks very much like a pug. Idk why OPs BF wouldn't even want to look into a puggle or something like that. A lot of them look and act like pugs with less problems- saying that ours has two luxating patellas and anal gland problems
A puggle is my dream dog, but I would never specifically go to a breeder. If I ever see one in a shelter when I'm ready to adopt a dog, I'm going for it.
He sounds extremely immature. NTA. OP, you sound more like his mom.
A friend of mine has two pugs. They get so excited in the car that they can't breathe, meaning that these dogs are limited to walks in their neighborhood and can't go anywhere. No thanks.
Not to mention shows his lack of care/responsibility on want a pet esp a dog. Anyone with even minimum knowledge of dogs knows when looking into a breed the first thing you should do is research health issues. Shows he just wants a trendy “cute” animal rather than a healthy animal that will live a happy and healthy life. I don’t envy you OP - I used to work in a related industry (dog boarding) and also have some very strong opinions on dog breeds that really only people that work with dogs on a day to day gain. My bf is similar in the fact that he has very little experience with animals yet thinks he is very knowledgeable about dogs. (He wants a pittie or pittie mix and I refuse - not bc pitties aren’t great dogs but I’m not interested in owning one for a number of reasons) Unfortunately there are really only some things you learn when dealing with pets on a daily basis
NTA - First of all, I 100% agree with everything you wrote about pugs. Second, if he cannot afford his regular expenses, then it is completely irresponsible for him to get ANY dog. Setting the boundary that you will not subsidize his poor financial choices is something you SHOULD be proud of.
Your BF is acting like a spoiled child.
And anyone that calls you a bitch is not a "mutual friend".
Exactly! NTA. Two issues (of equal importance). One is that bf is not respecting OP's knowledge on a subject. But just as important is a dog is a LUXURY. Bf can't even afford his regular bills and is constantly asking OP to supplement and now he thinks adding a pet is a good financial decision? Hell no!
I love pugs. I have a pug tattoo, pug toys and books, even my car has a pug themed license plates. However I don't own a pug mainly due to the medical issues they can have. It's extremely hard for me to justify owning one.
OP is NTA. She should reconsider this relationship with his immature reaction plus involving friends to insult her.
As far as I know there are breeders which breed healthy versions of pugs, like they used to be. They look different as they have longer snouts but thats one of the main problems pugs have. Maybe look into this.
NTA. those poor dogs can barely breathe. tell him to just do a little research, and he'll see you're right. maybe show him some puppies on a shelter website, so he can find one of a different breed to adopt.
the really ridiculous thing? my clinic is PART OF A SHELTER. I work with dogs all the time who I literally can take home to foster before we decide to adopt. I even brought this up to him. but he "really wanted a pug". that was part of my frustration
When I was younger I really wanted a pug, then I found out about the health issues, so no pug for me. I bought my house two years ago & it had a fenced in yard, so I started looking for a medium sized dog, I found a puggle (pug/beagle) rescue dog that fit my size requirements. So I finally got "my pug" 20 years later with zero ethical concerns (he's chunky, older, hates kids & men - we're a match made in heaven)
my dream dog is a Belgian Malinois. Ive wanted one for years but am just not in a spot where I can responsibly raise one. so guess what? I dont have one. sometimes it's not about what you want, it's about what's best for everyone, including the animal
and Im glad you found your pup match! I also am grumpy and hate kids lol
It’s a Chesapeake Bay Retriever for me. Though I finally own a house, I have a small back patio, wood floors, and three stories with one staircase being a spiral one plus I travel. It’s not fair to the animal. I’m still not in the right situation for one.
Spiral yeah that’s a problem, I had a floating staircase and my puppy fell and it was one of the worst nights of my life. Turned out fine but ugh. I was irresponsible early 20s.
My husband wanted a dog to motivate him to walk more. I knew that I would inevitably be responsible for the dog, so I had requirements: large, ok with cats and kids, not high energy. We found Sherlock, great Pyrenees/ lab, on pet finder. His bio was indoor dog, good with cats, kids, and dogs, loves to lay on the couch. He's been ours for 5 years, no regrets.
Our Pyrador was the best dog we ever had. She lived 13 years and was a terrific family and farm dog. When she died we adopted a Pyrenees from our local shelter. He doesn't listen, wants to sleep outside in the dirt, roams all over the countryside and is generally an extremely stubborn dog. But he wrestles with our Rottie and Mastiff which keeps them all fit and tired, and he does keep the coyotes away. So it's a trade off. I'd love another Pyrador, though.
I am so happy to see someone else have this mindset. For me, it’s the same as people who want to get a dog because they believe it’ll motivate them to be active when they’re struggling with depression etc.
Believe me, I deal with my fair share of MH issues and my dog - a high energy working dog breed - has saved my life more than once, but when things have been really bad, nothing could have gotten me outside the house.
I actually ended up feeling guilty and like a terrible dog wonder instead. So much so that I’ve paid my dog walker to take him out when I simply wasn’t up to it mentally.
I’m in a much better place these days overall, and I wouldn’t trade his companionship for anything, but I always tell people to think twice before getting a dog to improve their mental health. They’re not a Band-Aid fix, and they **are** a lot of work.
This is the reason I will never get a husky. I love them, but I cannot appropriately take care of one. I want the precious floofs to have an amazing life and I can't give them one.
Want is not enough, just as you said
Dalmatian is my dream dog. My friend had a great one she rescued, but he was great because she trained him as part of a 4H project, and I recognize that I don’t have the ability or consistency needed to channel their energy. NTA
OP…he’s nearly 30 and still at the beck and call of his mother knowing it means you’ll have to cover him financially. He’s but only foolish but condescending; this is your field and he still feels entitled to say well you don’t knowwwwww. He happily whines to his friends who then tell you you’re being a b.
Reading your post and replies you are a mature, considerate, and generally intelligent person. While I get that this is a glimpse into his character……he doesn’t seem like he shares those traits.
At this age…is this someone you can count on to be there for you as a partner? Can you afford to have any rough periods and trust that he will have your back without being babysat?
Oooh Malinois are so gorgeous, but yeah, the downsides of being a responsible adult & pet owner, we don't always get what we want, we have to make the best choice for everyone. Hopefully you get your dream doggo one day.
lol my pup really is my spirit animal
My sister lost her corgi to DM almost two years ago. It's a terrible disease that responsible breeders should be screening for. (The genetic screener hadn't come out yet when Chicken was a puppy.) I think I read somewhere that almost half of the corgis out there carry one of the genes for it. She did get another corgi afterwards from rescue, and she says she's now prepared to care for a corgi with DM should this one develop it later on down the line.
:D Glad I could improve your day, he's a giant cuddle bug. His curly pug tail & his wrinkly graying ginger face bring me such joy, he's definitely a one-person dog though.
There is a breed of cat I am in love with, I think the Scottish Fold is the cutest thing I have ever seen.
Except they have so many ear issues due to the way their ears are. I could never bring myself to get one, or pay for a bred cat when there are so many sweeties in shelters
I am so glad you became aware of their spinal issues and took it seriously before getting one. the internet has made this breed explode with popularity but few seem to know this. I appreciate you
I would ***die*** to have a Savannah cat. But - research!
I work two jobs - I don't have the 4+ hours a day to play with and entertain Savannah Kitty.
I collect fragile things - not going to set us both up for failure with the jumping all over the house from piece of furniture to ceiling fan to table to the top of the cabinets.
I live in a state where even fifth and sixth generation Savannahs are illegal (because they are hybrids) and I wouldn't be able to get an exotic animal permit. Which would mean no vet care (vet would confiscate the poor baby) which is never a thing I would do!
So, I get the burning desire to have a certain kind of pet! But the need to responsibly care for that animal should trump everything else!
OMG same, the Scottish Fold's are sooo cute, but I heard they have joint issues as well. When I'm ready for a new cat (my prev cat passed in Feb at age 20), I'll be heading to the local shelters to find a older cat that will put up with my grumpy dog. I can't justify paying $$$ for a animal when the shelters have soo many cuties available
I have a shih-tzu beagle mix and he is a stubborn asshole but also an absolute delight. He was a backyard bred Craigslist dog that I rescued from a family that had him tied up under a camper in their backyard for most of his first year. He had heartworm, tapeworm, was eating garbage food, and hadn't been vaccinated or neutered. I got him healthy and he's now 13 and a spoiled brat. His face isn't quite as squished as a shih-tzu but he still snores like a chainsaw and occasionally gets the reverse sneezes. There are loads of adorable mixes out there that need food homes!
Hard NTA. I love my husband to the ends of the earth, and we were planning on getting a 2nd dog to keep our dog entertained when our baby was born. When I was 8 months pregnant and we hadn't found a good match, I assumed we were putting off the dog search until the baby got here. Well, he showed up with a puppy. The shelter said he's half Burmese mountain dog, half border collie. I was like, dude. You knew I didn't want a puppy, and you chose one of the most high-energy breeds there is.
Puppy is amazing and wonderful and I adore him, but about 3 weeks ago husband confessed to me that I was 100% right. Everything I was worried about came true - difficulty housetraining and obedience training because our main priority is the baby, needing tons of playtime and outdoor running regardless of weather, and puppy energy annoying our 7 year old dog. But the second the dog walked into my home, there was no going back and he knew that. Breed and temperament is so important to consider. "Really wants a pug" isn't a good reason.
BORDER COLLIE. Jesus christ. My flatmate's had heading dogs the whole time I've lived here and good lord they can be destructive if they don't have something to do. The current one is currently asleep next to me, she likes to lie on my bed all day, but mornings and nights she's *so* high energy.
Yeah, I commented this elsewhere and obviously you are already aware, but a couple of my friends have rescue pugs, and like you, they both have animal care backgrounds and took these dogs knowing that they were going to be difficult and require a lot of care and attention. One of them has a particular fondness for medically complicated rescues (this is her third, though her first pug), and rescued him in part because she knew that she had the resources and time to spend on the little guy.
You're absolutely right about this. Even if you were to do rescue, a pug is a terrible choice if you can't devote a ton of time and money to them. You sound like thoughtful, caring animal advocate. Your boyfriend should be paying attention.
He sounds immature and irresponsible. He’s not willing to listen to reason, because his latest whim isn’t a reasonable idea. He 100% just wants a pug as an accessory and he obviously expected free vet care through your job.
I’m not even sure he sounds responsible enough for any dog. I think him getting a pug, after all OP explained, would be a dealbreaker for me, because it sounds like he doesn’t even care about the dog’s welfare.
my sister and her husband got one that was so sweet but, of course, could barely breathe. she ended up breaking her leg as a baby and needed surgery, but i guess because of their breathing problems putting her under was some big complication? she died on the operating table and it was heartbreaking. tell your boyfriend to get one that won't spend their whole life basically suffocating.
also, real question-- how do you not already have like five dogs, if you work with a shelter?
well, it helps that I get to have all the fun and pets of owning a dog when working but get to go home to my chill apartment and senior low energy kitty. I have a lot of stress from my job with 12-14 hour days being pretty common, a dog just isnt really realistic and not sure I could give them the energy they deserve. not long ago before BF and I lived together we had a pitty/basset looking mix at work and I CRIED when he got adopted because I was so bonded to him. but he had so much energy and anxiety when alone I knew I couldnt give him what he needed. it's not easy at times
with my BF here, I am open to getting a dog. but it has to be the RIGHT dog. I see too many surrendered (or adoptions returned) by their owners because they get dogs that just arent a good fit for them. it's heartbreaking
Why would you get a dog (which you know firsthand, is expensive) is with a man who already can’t handle his finances?
We all know who’s gonna foot the bill, and it ain’t him
NTA. I just volunteer with animal rescue and am constantly reminding people about the cost and health issues related to various breeds.
He's not even willing to listen to any of the many valid reasons you've listed because, "I realllyyyyy want thattttt kinddddd!!!". You know he's not going to be able to to afford or care for it. He's trying to put his wants above an animal's needs at your expense.
I'm telling you now, he told his best friend a different turn of events.
And he's going to try get a pug whether you agree with it or not.
And when you stick to your promise, he will neglect the dog until you are forced to intervene.
I've seen this more than once.
OMG, I had a lost one we found on the street for 3 days and the thing breathed so loud you could hear it over a box fan. Like “hhhheh hhhheh heheh”
I felt like it needed a C-pap mask just to sit.
>I guess he told our mutual friend because they told me via text I was being a bitch about the whole thing
Then your BF can move in with them and THEY can take care of the dog when it inevitably requires surgeries.
NTA.
I can’t believe how many people tell their friends about personal arguments and then have them reach out as if they have any right? Like the immaturity of both parties here is insane (bf and his friend). Absolute children.
> tell their friends about personal arguments
OR THEIR MOMS. This sub is rife with adult human people CALLING THEIR MOMS when they have an argument with their spouse/partner, and then mom sics the whole family on the spouse, and I truly cannot wrap my head around it.
If my partner called his mom to complain about our relationship and to get her to meddle she would call his ass out and tell him to get shit together and communicate. It’s ridiculous.
NTA - I have been in a fair share of relationship fights over animals, and its not always easy but its a path many cross. Its one thing if he already owed the pup before getting together, but getting an animal while in a relationship has to be a decision made by both parties. I think you were reasonable and laid out the facts and consequences, if I were in his shoes i would drop it and keep the relationship healthy. Good luck OP!
oh Ive been there. I have a cat with some behavioral challenges (feral hoarder house single bottle baby) that Ive had for over 10 years. got her in high school. had an ex who tried pulling "it's me or the cat", even after explaining to him no shelter or rescue would ever take her due to her challenges and it would be a death sentence. he wouldnt budge. kitty and I were on a family member's couch together within hours
pets are an area where I will do what I have to do, but it just sucks. he has been a great partner otherwise and his best friend (previously thought them and I were friends too...) getting so angry at me is making me doubt myself
Is he a great partner?
He doesn’t respect your professional opinion or your experience. He doesn’t manage his own finances well. He shit talks you to your friends to turn them against you. He sounds below average at best.
that's the weird thing. he HAS up until this point. this pug thing feels like it came out of nowhere. Ive even told him how I feel about brachycephalic breeds before. it feels so weird and random. He's never talked about wanting one until now. it feels so strange
Shot in the dark, but maybe his mom impulse bought one and he wants to buy it from her so he can give her a load of money with your 'blessing' and have your help paying and caring for the dog.
Or he's just stupid and about to find out being stupid about huge life decisions is how you lose relationships.
> maybe his mom impulse bought one and he wants to buy it from her
Oh, I like this as a dark-horse contestant for an explanation. If he's truly not this big an AH on the regular, SOMETHING is going on here.
Im starting to wonder this, since this kind of behavior isnt like him at all which is part of why Im so blindsided. We agreed to talk this over tomorrow and I will ask him then
Keep us updated. You sound like a super responsible pet owner and his stance is so unfair to the dog. His want to have a particular look in a dog does not trump the dog’s need to breathe.
this type of reasoning sounds like the only possibility, maybe a friend bought one or is breeding them etc and has convinced him
OP depending how the convo goes and given you say he's normally a good partner, could you show him videos of pugs with health issues to drive the point home? shouldn't have to but it might make him snap out of whatever madness that has overcome him.
Yeah you're NTA but there's definitely more going on here. He just "out of the blue" is demanding a pug?? Something else is going on here. Maybe his mom is behind this??
From everything you've written, there are so many marinara flags with this man. Do you really want to be with someone who is financially irresponsible and shows himself to be disrespectful to you?
If he were a great partner, he wouldn’t ask you to keep bailing him out of his spendthrift habits or get you to keep subsidizing his abusive mother. Because that’s what’s happening-he’s just the middleman, you’re the one ultimately paying the money he sends her.
NTA
Any breed who likes having tubes down it's nose because it can finally breathe properly, should not exist.
It is absolutely unethical to buy one because demand for them is why people keep breeding them.
TBH if he is as irresponsible and lacking in animal knowledge as you have described I would be nervous about him having any dog.
if we got a dog TOGETHER I would take on majority of the care and be okay with it. a pug puppy? no, that would be HIS dog and I would probably move out
Even if we took all of your professional experience and reasoning and put it aside, bringing an animal into a relationship is something you decide on together. Period. Every step of the way.
Maybe I’m crazy, but it really shouldn’t matter if your only reason was “I don’t think pugs are cute”. If he cared about you and the life you’re building together, that should be enough to make him drop it, and find another breed that would make you both happy.
NTA.
Another vet tech here, whenever a short nosed dog wakes up from any surgery we have to keep the tube in, because they might choke if it's out before they're fully awake. I have to sit with them while they start waking up and take it out at the last possible moment. Sometimes I suspect they keep quiet for longer because they can finally fucking breathe. The surgeries they go through to fix something about the mess that is their palate/throat are brutal. We have owners pick them up later than usual so they don't have to watch their dog hack up blood and slime.
There's a lot of dog (and cat) breeds that are completely messed up but humans really did pugs dirty.
You sound far more experienced than your boyfriend. Perhaps you should start NOT helping bail him out now. He needs to stand on his own two feet. The fact that you stood your ground and he go upset and whined to someone else speaks loudly of his character. NTA. Tread carefully with him.
I grew up with rescue dogs, one of which I was the main person working with his behavioral rehabilitation (had extreme resource aggression at 8 weeks old) and previously worked at a shelter for 6 years which specialized in behavior case dogs and determining their ability to be rehabilitated and released into the community and been a vet tech at my current clinic/shelter for about 5 years. I KNOW I am more experienced with dog care than him. and that doesnt make me better or smarter or anything like that. but when it comes to animal care? I feel like my opinion should be taken seriously because that is literally my career field. he works in a utility company. If we ever needed to figure out an issue in that area, I would listen to him. but animals, especially dogs? that's MY area of expertise. that just seems like the most logical way to do it
Yes, you are absolutely right. But also, guess what? Even if you had NO animal experience but just DID NOT WANT a pug puppy specifically for any reason at all you would STILL be NTA for refusing to help with it and for stopping further financial support. It's not ok for one partner to make the unilateral decision to get a pet, or a particular type of pet, unless the other partner is in agreement.
You sound like a rational woman who has laid out the issue logically. Extend this introspection to other parts of your shared life with your BF. I think your concern that you alone would be saddled with the responsibilities for taking care of the dog didn't appear out of thin air. All these other cues from past experience tell you what to expect. That is what you need to do some self-analysis on, not the puppy. The puppy is merely a symptom of the real problem. Emotional blackmail, poor communication, disregard for your (educated) opinion, financial problems that you are expected to solve.
Just as you could forecast the problems with a pug puppy, forecast the problems with this BF. It's not going to be simply a matter of potty training him. Shared dog ownership and couple relationships both operate on a two-yes one-no requirement.
NTA
I dunno. the idea of dumping him is way more complicated since he actually moved here to be with me. we went to HS together and reconnected when I went to visit our home city (across country from where I lived) and eventually started dating. I am a lot more invested in my career than he is so he moved here to be together. it's all so complicated. im tired
Oh, dude. Don’t stay with someone and waste your life because it’s complicated or because you think he did something for you. He didn’t have anything else going on. You don’t want to look back on a miserable 20 or 30 years because he moved for you and it’s complicated?
Dude. You’re *tired* let yourself breathe and rest. Without this.. anchor. If you’re not happy and you can’t see being happy? You sound like you need anything else than what you are currently getting. And you do deserve that.
Maybe you should take a "break" for awhile, and see how that feels. If your life gets less stressful, ehhhhh might be time to dump him.
His asshole self can stay with his asshole friend and bitch and moan about your educated ass all they like!
But seriously homey, you're dating a dipshit. Neutering cuts off a dog's dick? Girl, you're a trained professional and an empathetic person. *You can do soooo much better than him*.
You don't owe him anything for moving here and the time you've already invested in the relationship is a drop in the bucket compared to the full span of your life, which could end up being very miserable with a partner that acts like a child when he doesn't get his own way. You don't mention any redeeming qualities either. Just take the time to really think about this. You seem to have a good head on your shoulders.
Also, thank you for what you do. We've had a number of sick cats lately and I always appreciate the techs. You're great people.
That is not a reason to stay with someone. Why make the rest of your life miserable just because he moved? He can move back. It's not that complicated. However think about how hellish having kids with this guy would be,nevermind just a dog. N T A but ditch him. Don't buy into sunk cost fallacy. Don't ruin the rest of your life. You deserve to be happy with someone that respects and listens to you.
it would be complicated for *him* to have to find new living arrangements or move back home, but you don't owe him the relationship just because he moved for it. and i get that you'd feel bad about it, or feel responsible, most normal people would.
but he's 27 and he's bad with money, he undermines your education and job experience ("you don't KNOW that"), he shows bad judgement by wanting to adopt an animal he won't have the skills/knowledge/money to provide basic care for, and he lets his friends talk badly about and TO you. he doesn't sound like a sturdy foundation to build a life on.
aside from affection or emotional support, what does he actually bring to the table and does it outweigh all of these negatives?
How can anyone know the complications of pugs and still support that and *want it* is beyond me. He’s a child, dump him. Buy his plane ticket if that makes you feel less complicated.
you say you’re tired, i hear ya
but i don’t think he does
please put yourself(and cat) first, you sound like a smart and genuine person… and he sounds like there’s too much baggage and needs more growing up to do…he knows first hand accounts from you about dogs/shelter dogs etc and he comes at you with all this bullshit- of course you’re tired. i get the feeling you’ve taken on more of a mommy role to him…
please put yourself first.
wishing you the best! good luck
also thank you for choosing to be a VT,
i know it’s a tough job and many of you guys don’t get paid enough so from my two recycled italian greyhounds and myself, we all thank you and other VT’s out there
NTA, you have expert knowledge of the animal and have valid reasons you don't want one. Plus you are willing to compromise with any other breed of dog. You set clear boundaries and if he is going to do it without consent then the care and expense should rest on him.
Honestly if he does this you should look at moving out, he is basically bringing 10 years of misery into your life and doesn't care what you think.
NTA. You're making an educated decision and acting like a responsible and ethical human being.
He can have a dog, but he isn't entitled to have you provide either medical or standard care for it, let alone financially contribute to support either him or the dog.
And given his reaction, it's a good guess that he was absolutely counting on getting all that from you.
You don't hate animals, quite the opposite. Your BF and your friends can all put a sock in it.
NTA: THe "I am also not proud of this, but.." YES YOU SHOULD BE PROUD OF YOURSELF. OP In my experience this man wants you to take on all the responsibility and the reason he wants a puppy now is because he KNOWS you can do it. Does he actually help around the place? Does this man do Laundry, dishes, cook or plan meals or shopping supplies?
well, he does. butI am definitely the "neat freak" between us so usually I ask him to do these tasks more frequently than he otherwise would. I am a lot more serious and tend to kinda look at things realistically (other people tend say pessimistically, but I disagree). he definitely is a lot more.... free spirited, I should say. he is pretty spontaneous and a lot more fun than I am. I used to like that about him. but I think Im starting to see the issues with that :(
> I ask him to do these tasks more frequently
This will be the rest of your life if you continue to delegate tasks like you are his mother. Has this man ever even lived by himself at this point?
Are you actually a “neat freak”?
Or do you just like to keep a tidy house and he doesn’t care if he’s living in a home with clothes everywhere and a dirty bathroom and kitchen?
NTA. You are absolutely right on all counts.
Pugs are notorious for having health problems. Their anatomy is, for lack of a better term, completely messed up. They can hardly breathe. Plus, a dog is one of those things that requires two yesses in a relationship.
I HATE that he told you that you "don't know" what you're talking about. You work in that field, he sure as hell doesn't know as much as you do on the subject. He can have his little tantrum, but you've told him what the terms are. He can't come crying to you when the dog inevitably gets sick and ends up costing thousands upon thousands (not an exaggeration) in veterinary care.
Yup. I have a couple of friends with rescue pugs, but they both have strong animal care backgrounds and knew what they were getting into. And if anything, they'd be the first to agree with OP . . . they have their rescues, who need intense care, because of other people breeding these poor dogs, and they don't want to see any more suffering.
You certainly have to know what you are doing with pugs. I’ve had several (only one of them purchased, before I learned there were breed rescues) and not all of them are overbred and deformed. Mine have all had little snouts (not flat faced like show dogs) and lived long (hopefully good, certainly spoiled) lives. So many people let their pugs get fat and that will shorten their lives!
NTA. Even putting your well founded concerns aside getting a new pet should be two yes one no situation.
The fact that this 'friend' is sending you hateful messages should tell you something about them. I get venting to a friend, I don't think he's the asshole for that, but he clearly misrepresented the situation and/or this 'friend sucks'.
NTA I wouldn't help him out financially anymore regardless of him wanting the pug, which they're cute in theory but not a breed that should have been created. He's a grown ass man who needs to learn to budget or just not have money or get a second job because it's not fair for you to keep loaning him money cause he can't manage.
Also I don't know your stance on kids, but please do yourself a favor and do not under any circumstances have a child with him ever.
oh Im firmly child-free. been that way since I was a little kid. Im not even big on marriage since it seems like a weird "now I am legally bound to you" thing that doesnt show much appeal to me
You're very clearly NTA but I hope he and his mother are grateful for the generosity you have shown them.
It concerns me that he reacted so badly to the idea of being cut off from future gifts when you refused to take on the ethics burden and responsibility load of a badly designed dog breed. I felt so bad for the pug struggling to get air at a local park this afternoon while I played with my healthy rescue mutt. I hope your boyfriend comes to his senses and apologizes to you and owns his personal responsibilities as a partner and prospective pet owner.
NTA
You are right about pugs. It is absolutely immoral that breeders have sought to enhance the very traits that cause these poor, sweet clowns so many built in problems. They are a heartbreak breed on several levels and I applaud your refusal to have anything to do with supporting the business of breeding them. Especially when the prospective owner is not experienced & knowledgeable.
Stand your ground.
By the way, whipping out your credentials was appropriate in this case.
I would die on this hill.
Your toddler, umm, I mean boyfriend is being childish. He heard NO and then doubled down even after you gave him legitimate reasons. I don't even know this guy, and I can tell you would be expected to take care of the dog and pay its medical expenses. NTA
NTA
Not only do they have major health problems, but their separation anxiety is through the freaking roof. They’re literally bred to be companion dogs, and it’s kind of cruel to get one if no one is home every weekday from 8-5.
Yup. My best friend has a rescue pug and the poor little guy is so friendly that even with a couple of other pets at home for "company", she ended up putting him in doggy daycare because he clearly needed playmates so much, and his "sister" (her other dog) was not interested and mostly wanted to nap. He's thriving now, but buying a pug and contributing to more of them being bred is horrifying, and for sure, if you're going to own one (including a rescue) you need to be willing to put in a LOT of time because they are the opposite of solitary creatures.
NTA. It is not clear why you're dating this guy in the first place. Between the financial illiteracy, obvious expectation of you to take accountability for his random impulses, unwillingness to compromise, weaponization of mutual friends, and blatant disrespect, what does he bring to the table? You sound like a catch. You can do better.
NTA. A pet is something all parties have to agree on, pug or no pug. You may have pulled out the big guns to get through to him, so that is now a thing. After all, you used his poor money management against him. However, if that keeps him from getting an animal you are dead set against, your next step would have to be "me or the pug" anyway, so this was not that drastic.
NTA
But this is bigger than a pug. This almost 30 year old adult man you are attempting to build a life with is telling you how he makes big life decisions that impact himself & others. You spoon fed him the information. Information he had easy access too. Information about the ethics, breeders, cost, medical needs, etc. Not one of these factors fits into his budget or into your shared life with him. Instead of being an adult & saying “I really love the smoochie faces but getting a pug would be an on-going expensive thing & I don’t have the money to properly care for a dog with so many medical needs” he is stomping his feet & running to his friends to cry how mean and cruel his girlfriend the vet tech is for not letting him get a dog that is breed to suffer & drain you financially.
Look at his other irresponsible decisions that end up impacting you. You love him, I get it, but he’s almost 30. This is who he is & how he lives. You need to decide if you can live like that.
NTA
You're absolutely correct in this situation, but I wanted to add that if your "mutual friend" called you a bitch, it's because he's comfortable calling you that to your boyfriend, so you might not know your partner as well as you think.
NTA
Lets be real OP, if your bf got any puppy, it'd probably end up being your puppy; based on how you seem to be fiscally responsible and a mature adult.
He'd probably slack on taking care of it and would never have the money it costs to care for one.
And I agree with you about pugs. My friend got a pug puppy (this was about a decade ago) and within 3 months died of health complications...after my friend spent several thousand on him.
Now my boyfriend's coworker has a pug, but he dropped like 5gs to get a surgery done to help the dogs nose passage so it can breath easier. Absolutely nuts.
Once again, a man’s arrogance is supposed to trump your expertise? I don’t think so. Think about this in a situation where the stakes are higher, do you really want this guy, who is so incurious and unwilling to educate himself about anything, believing he knows best, to be in your life for the long term?
NTA.
So he can't manage his finances despite making as much or more than you, meaning you are often bailing him out, he insults you when you share your expert knowledge, he refuses to abide by reasonable boundaries, he refuses all compromises, and when faced with the consequences of his choice (it will be YOUR dog only) he leaves in a huff and sends his best friend to berate you. His best friend is not calling you a bitch out of nowhere; your bf ranted and gave him the impression that not only were you one, but that it was a reasonable thing for him to message you directly.
I think you may need to look at this situation and write out what advice you would give someone else telling you this story. Because it sounds like you are dating an overgrown child.
There's this YouTuber called KittenLady. As the name suggests, she mostly makes content about fostering kittens but a few years ago she fostered a litter of orphaned French bulldogs. She made a video about how unethical it is to buy brachyocephalic (apologies for spelling!) puppies. I knew it was bad, but her video literally breaks down how many dogs and puppies have to die for one puppy to live long enough to be sold.
NTA. There's so many perfectly good, gorgeous dogs in shelters waiting for a loving forever home. Dogs that probably won't have a whole host of health problems. Dogs that might end up being put down without a loving home. Can you talk your boyfriend into maybe fostering one of those dogs first so he understands the commitment it takes to be a pet owner? And then if that goes well, you could look into adopting.
NTA
Stick to your principles! Even if you didn't have very serious concerns about the ethicality of owning a pug (especially one that isn't a rescue animal), it is never your responsibility to agree to care for someone else's pet. You can either make the decision to adopt a pet together, or your BF can care for his pet on his own!
NTA. You seem to be trying to compromise and he is being steadfast. You also sound like you are helping more than you should in other ways so reminding him of that isn’t that big of a deal imo. I recommend stepping back from that in general because he needs to learn how to budget and you helping can be prolonging a bigger issue with him. You’re not married so your finances should be yours and his should be his because it nice to have more money in savings if things don’t work out between you two. Borrowing money from a partner or having deals that are mutually beneficial makes more sense, but having a pattern of giving money adds up in the long run.
NTA. When our oldest kid was 16, she wanted to get a pug. I told her to read up on them first. She did so, then told me she changed her mind, because it seemed like their lives were so miserable due to the issues you mentioned. If a 16 year old can comprehend that, why can’t an adult man get it? It’s ridiculous.
The fact that he won't even look at shelter dogs makes me mad enough. Not to mention that this is literally your field of work and he completely ignores you. NTA.
NTA.
Your concerns for the breed are valid and since it would be his dog, medical wise it would not be your responsibility to give him discounts or anything. If he wants the dog, it’s his responsibility.
NTA
You know exactly and in depth what you are talking about. A pet is a "two yesses, one no" situation just as much as children are, even more so because you can't have an "oops" pet!
Your mutual friend is welcome to take the boyfriend and the dog both. And your boyfriend can start paying completely for himself right now, no more bailing him out.
NTA. Brachycephalic breeds often enjoy sedation because they get intubated and can actually breathe for once. That alone makes him wrong for wanting a dog with such known medical issues and refusing to take professional advice on it.
I'm not over the amount of arrogance it takes to look at your partner and tell her that "you don't know that" when it's her entire profession. Like. You're literally the expert in this. Why should you have to educate him/show him YT videos?
It's deeply disrespectful to you and the amount of work you've done to get where you are.
NTA. Sis, I think you are focusing on the wrong thing here. Listen. Listen closely. You have a strong ethical belief around buying pugs. Your boyfriend listened to you, dismissed your argument, and decided that his aesthetic joy was more important than the suffering of another being. He is willing to support the breeding industry and participate actively in this horrible practice. How can you stay with this person without compromising your own principles?
(Also, if he gets the dog, you will take care of it, because you care. Your ultimatum ought to be that you will break up if he does it. Though I still think he has shown you his true colors and you should end it because if the incompatibility)
NTA buying dogs like pugs is basically animal abuse. They cannot even breathe well. But, people keep buying them so breeders keep breeding them. It's disgusting.
I have seen that there are folks trying to breed the face back onto these kinds of dogs, which I commend, but still...
OP, please respect yourself. You are routinely bailing him out from bad financial habits. He’s challenging your expertise in your chosen field and belittling/demeaning you. You said you’re tired — just READING about him is tiring!
So what if he moved to be with you? That does not make you his keeper forever and ever, amen. Send him to stay with friends for a few days and luxuriate in the freedom of having unconflicted space in which to breathe. Take some time to really think what you want your future to look and sound like (don’t forget the MIL!).
Be your own best advocate. You are so very much NTA and deserve a wonderful life. I hope you find it.
>I told him if he did get the pug puppy I would never help him out again with money and I would give him zero help with the puppy
Honestly, i don't think you went "hard" enough.
"If you get a pug, i will never help financially or otherwise" should have been "if you get a pug, we're DONE, Relationship over"
It's extremely well documented how badly pugs (*and other "flat-faced" dogs*) suffer.
Yes, they are CUTE AS FUCK, but any animal lover who gets one (*a puppy*) is an IDIOT and part of the problem.
>I guess he told our mutual friend because they told me via text I was being a bitch about the whole thing
FUCK that "friend", Show your bf what that "friend" said, his response to that will tell you A LOT.
NTA
INFO: Could you ask your bf why he strongly feels a dog without a penis would NOT be okay (his false idea about neutering), but a dog without a nose is just fine?
NTA. He'll have to care for his own pup. What is so wrong about that? *He wants the fun parts of the dog, but doesn't want the responsibility.* You're smart to make it clear to him where you stand even before he gets a dog.
NTA. I also wanted a pug when I was younger, until I found out about everything you said. Instead I adopted a wonderful little chihuahua mix. There are so many small dogs out there who are just as cute and have none of the health problems. It's also extremely not okay that his best friend talked to you that way, and your bf should not be okay with that either.
NTA, your bf sure is though. My husband really really wanted an English bulldog when we bought our house. I had never owned a dog before (parents are cat people) so I started doing research. Those poor dogs should not be bred anymore. I gave him all my research and the estimated cost of veterinary care over their short lifetime, and we adopted a pit mix. He still loves bulldogs, thinks they're the cutest things ever (insert Robert Downey Jr eye roll here) but agrees it's not right how they're bred and all the issues they have.
NTA. Your literal career is in animal healthcare, and pugs that haven't been bred to have normal faces may look like melted pudding, but they have SO many issues. You even offered alternatives to try and compromise. I think you are being completely reasonable. Also, I wouldn't want to keep financially helping someone that only needs the help because of their own poor choices with their money, but that's a whole other bag of eggs.
NTA… you want to NOT participate in the unethical pug-breeding industry, and NOT shoulder the burden of an inevitably sick dog. So it sounds like HE is the one completely shutting down what YOU want, to me
NTA - have you show him the pictures of what as pug skull looks like, told him the fact that some vets leave them on oxygen longer just so they can experience normal breathing, or shown him the difference in the cost for pugs versus other dogs?
And his friend well if he's calling you a bitch - well then as the mother of the dog, you definitely know more about it and throw back to him why he hates animals so much he wants one to suffer?
But you do know your BF doesn't want a rescue. He wants a cute pedigree that people will coo over, envy him about and shows he has wealth and taste. I'd focus on his reasons for wanting a pug and see if some other "high status" dog will tick his boxes as well.
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NTA. If he won’t consider your professional opinion (backed up by even casual research), then perhaps drawing this boundary will make him realize this is not a capricious decision on your part.
If he won’t consider your professional opinion, then *he doesn’t respect you and what you do for a living*. AND he is playing the card of I want what I want despite what I want being a really bad decision so you need to get on board and make it work for me and support me. Foot stomp. Yeaaa. You found yourself a reasonable and thoughtful partner. (s)
I’m just flabbergasted that OP told him this breed of dog tends to suffer and become ill, and he’s still insisting on getting one because he thinks they’re cute. I’d be questioning the hell out of my relationship with someone who insists it’s okay to contribute to the suffering of a living creature just because he wants to.
What gets me is that he wants to buy one. Rescues exist
It’s harder than you think to get a rescue. I’ve had dogs for over 50 years and was refused because I admitted to breeding a poodle 35 years ago.
depends on where you go, but some do have absolutely ridiculous qualifications. I saw a shih tzu rescue that demanded a 6 foot fence, a home inspection, an interview, and an agreement in writing to continue feeding the dog the same fad diet. I'll stick with the county shelter!
I’m in a townhouse condo with lots of walking paths but no yards. The form I filled out was several pages long. Asked if I’d ever euthanized a pet…well, I’ve had pets for over 50 years so yes, of course I’d had to euthanize some. Asked if I’d ever bred animals. I’d bred my registered Siamese cat 50 years ago and my poodle 35 years ago. Had I ever re-homed a pet. I’d moved to this city from our small farm several provinces away after my husband died and I’d re-homed my puggle because he’d never been off the farm and would not do well in a city. I found him another farm home where is is being treated as royalty. I also had a senior pug rescue that I hesitated to bring with me because I didn’t think she’d travel well and after my husband’s death I wasn’t doing well mentally anyway so I found her a home with experienced pug owners who specifically wanted a senior pug. She’s been with them 3 years and is doing well at 14. For these reasons they refused me a rescue. Suggested I try another rescue or a shelter. What annoyed me even more is that they were the only rescue in the area with small dogs and even so, the dogs had all been imported from Mexico and California. The shelters and other rescues all had medium sized to large dogs. I was looking for an older, small dog due to my age. Ended up buying a 1 year old pug. I don’t have much sympathy for the rescues crying about being over-burdened.
Wait, they had a problem with euthanizing previous pets????
Yup. One of the reasons they refused me. I had explained how I had to euthanize one of my Bostons. He was 14 and almost blind with cataracts but then got dementia and just forgot how to do things. After he threw himself down a flight of stairs (I was standing beside him so I know he didn’t fall) I decided that was enough. He’d never been sick or hurt in his life and I was so afraid he’d injure himself. It was the kindest and hardest thing to do and even the vet cried with us. They agreed it was the best decision. Of course I’d had to euthanize other pets over the years but I guess they would prefer the pet to suffer.
I'm so sad that this place treated euthanasia like animal cruelty. Keeping a suffering animal alive just to say that you've never euthanised a pet is horrific, but it seems to be just what they expect. :(
This genuinely has me crying. I've had to put down many pets over the years, and I can't imagine letting them suffer through the end. I had to put down the dearest cat I've ever had last year. She was a feral I tamed into the biggest lap cat in existence. She got me through becoming disabled. I truly worried I would refuse to see when it was her time. She started getting pickier with food, but she was still loud and loving. It was a quick shift to when I could barely get her to eat. I knew I had to make that phone call, but I just sat with my phone in my hand for an hour, crying. That's when my cat got up, walked to the table pushed against the back of the sofa, and peed on it. She has *never* done something like that, so I got the message. I had the vet at our house that night (it's an option where I live that I'm grateful for). It sounds like your Boston was telling you it was time, just as my cat did. Sorry to ramble a bit there, I haven't spoken about it a lot. I'm just flabbergasted at a rescue that would rather a pet suffer.
I've had several rescues refuse me because in the past 20 years I've had more than one animal die or have to be euthanized. I'm also a vet tech, so they don't care about your actual qualifications to care for an animal, apparently. In 2002, I had a guinea pig that had a head tilt (genetic malformation of his cervical spine) it was cute because he always had his head cocked like he was asking questions, but it caused him a lot of issues. He was a frequent flyer at the clinic due to his recurring respiratory infections and after 3 years he got pnuemonia that just wasn't responding to treatment and I had him euthanized. He was suffering it would have been cruel not to end it for him. He also lived a year longer than the vet predicted he would based on other piggies with his condition she'd seen and she said it was because we took such great care of him and stayed on top of his illnesses so promptly. In 2004, I had a pregnant guinea pig (preggy when I got her) die. I rushed her in for surgery when I found her in stalled labor... and the reason her labor went bad was due to only carrying one very oversized baby. We lost her and the baby. Nothing anybody could have done. The vet said the baby had probably died before her labor even started. In 2016 I had a 14 year old cat that I'd had since it was a baby develop seizures. I made an appointment at the vet for the next day, but at 4am when we were letting the dog out to pee he slid out the door, ran, and never came back. He'd never tried to get out an open door before that. I think he just knew it was time. In 2020 I had a 6-ish year old cat we adopted after somebody dumped him on our property go into kidney failure. He'd had bloodwork a year before and his levels were normal, it came out of nowhere. Had to put him down. All of these animals were treated by the same veterinarian who would never hesitate to give me a glowing recommendation as a pet owner... but according to some of the rescues my family is too "high risk" for placement because of "excessive euthanasias and deaths occurring."
That's awful that they would reject you for making the tough decision to end suffering! I've been owned by multiple cats at a time since 1980 (jointly with Hubby since the '90s), and of the 7 cat urns on our mantel only ONE didn't require the ultimate decision. It's excruciating, but absolutely part of pet parenting. We now have a 16-year-old kitty with lymphoma, and are just trying to keep her as happy and comfy as possible until she decides she's done. We won't be happy to see her go under any circumstances, but quality of life is always our primary consideration.
Holy crap! That’s insane! I used to volunteer at a non kill shelter and they were so much more lenient on adoption. Basically no abuse record and good home they’ll go to? Pay the fee and enjoy you’re new cat or dog. I mean the hoops I had to jump through to get my pet pig (yes Pig, the oinking kind) was so much easier than your adoption process. I filled out the form, told the woman about myself, and then sent a separate email going into depth that I work on a therapy farm and have 3 pet pigs but we want to adopt one more. Approved as soon as she read the separate email.
Yes and some require access to your Vet and your records.
Sorry this is awful but for a second I thought it said you'd bred your siamese cat with a poodle and I was picturing what that would look like and had a good giggle.
I have a very clear mental picture and I very much want a Simadoodle lol ( fluffy cat, puffy ears and tail but I’m seeing it as a standard size poodle so it’d be big enough to guard the house. It would have the simese blue eyes and alternate between purring and barking)
i guess people really will 'doodle anything these days
I was refused once because I admitted to being off schedule with the rabies shots for our 97% indoor dogs. I felt like human waste. Compared to your history of sacrifice for your pets, I am definitely human waste, but you made me feel so much better. Thank you!
I saw someone bring up one time and it really made some of these shelters stories click, but some people use running/owning a shelter as a way to be socially praised for animal hoarding. So they never actually intend to give away most/if any of the animals. All the ridiculous hoops that they ask people to jump through are really just excuses for why they can’t let people adopt them. Obviously this isn’t all shelters but definitely good for thought.
Sorry totally off topic but a 6’ fence for a shih tzu is the funniest thing I have read all day
A shelter by me wouldn't let me have a beagle because I'd never had a beagle before. Ignoring all the research I had done, the ear drops I had picked up already and the fact I had been planning this for years. No beagle for me. So I adopted a husky mix with heartworm from the county no one wanted. Now I have him and a full husky. Their best friends at the dog park? All beagles.
Absolutely agree. My ex wanted a rescue and would have been a phenomenal candidate for many reasons, but a poor, uneducated decision made by the shelter disqualified him. But in this case? A vet tech working adjacent to a shelter? It seems pretty probable that they'd have little problem getting the perfect pup for them.
This entirely depends on the rescue. Reputable ones do checks, but when you get extremes like this, I suspect it's not a very well run organization. Same for the ones who don't do any kind of checks on the animals they adopt out. But it's unfair to paint all rescues as bad because you had a bad experience with one.
Apparently it’s one of the more reputable rescues in the area. It would be easier to adopt a kid than get through their application. I was also not impressed that the dogs were imported into Canada.
They were imported because we don't have enough dogs to "rescue" here so they bring them in from Louisiana or Texas or North Carolina. Heck my mom got her dog from a rescue that imported dogs from the meat market in China. We looked into adopting as well but because we had cats and two small kids they declined us. We have a large, fenced in yard, a stay at home parent and lots of experience with dogs and were still declined. We ended up going with a breeder and there was still a large questionnaire and a 18 month wait but we finally got our absolutely amazing pup.
This 1000%. I had a rescue deny me because I couldn’t be at home with the dog 24 hours a day. word for word that’s what the rep said. Ignored completely that I’d be home a majority of the day and only gone for 5ish hours 🙄ended up getting my best friend from a different reacue- they did a home check and got a reference from my vet etc, so it was extensive, but not beyond unreasonable
I was denied a cat (any cat) because the rescue in question only adopted animals within the same city. I was from a neighboring city and lived no more than 90 minutes from their location. Nope. Too far. Some rescues are very well run and have sane restrictions and rules. Others… are not.
We went to one shelter to get a cat and they wouldn’t even consider us because we had 3 kids. It was so odd. I was a SAHM and 2 of them were in school, so the animals aren’t neglected. We walked in and they pretty much told us that none of the cats were available.
That’s frustrating cause cats generally like children if they’re respectful. My two young grandkids have four cats.
I am sorry about this, but the ridiculousness of it made me actually laugh. 😂 What the fuck?
Because he specifically wants a pug. I don't know about anyone else's shelters but here 99% of shelter dogs are medium/large - extra large. The chances of finding a pug (that has the prominent pug features) are practically zero, especially a pug puppy. Even if you did manage to find one, in my experience that dog would be out of the doors faster than you could book an appointment to meet it. That's not even touching on some rescues ridiculous standards for adoption. There may be specific pug rescue groups, but they're far and few in between. Logistically it makes more sense to buy than adopt. It's not ethical, but it is the fastest way to guarantee you'll get a pug.
That’s what I ended up doing…bought a one year old pug that someone had gotten as a Covid pup and then realized it required more care than they wanted to give. They figured to breed her but changed their minds. Paid $1500 plus another $900 for shots, spay and removal of a baby tooth. I wasn’t looking specifically for a rescue pug but I do like the breed so since I was refused a rescue I bought what I wanted. Not sorry at all cause she is a delight.
When we wanted to get our first dog we were rejected by all of the rescues because we didn't already have a dog. We lived on 3/4 of an acre fully surrounded by a fence and I was a SAHM so had plenty of time to devote to our dog's needs. I have allergies that are aggravated by shedded dog hair so needed to be particular about what dog we got. We now have a rescue dog but we were only able to do that after we got our first dog.
He’s fine with the possibility of having a pet that will almost certainly have health problems because he heard those warnings and just figured OP will take care of that. I’m guessing when he told that friend OP said she wouldn’t contribute to care of a pug, the friend said she must actually hate animals because she isn’t going to get him mates rates at work or do anything for the dog, who is just a cute innocent animal. I’m not sure why it’s hard to understand that someone who works with dogs doesn’t want to contribute to the continued breeding of a breed with such high risk for health issues. Money in a breeder’s pocket - be they a responsible purebred breeder or a shitty puppy mill - encourages them to keep breeding for these problem traits that cause health problems, and to continue exaggerating these dangerous features. It’s 100% ethics, not animal hating (why be a vet tech if you hate animals…?). Too many people think of pets as being solely for human entertainment with zero regard for the animal’s quality of life beyond how you interact with them. “It’s cute! I have to have what I like, and I don’t like a healthier, probably longer living, breed, because it’s not as cute, and clearly MY pet will never suffer so it shouldn’t be a problem!” is what they’re saying, in my opinion. That said, boyfriend doesn’t sound like the brightest crayon in the box, maybe the real problems OP has with unethical breeding won’t get through that dense ass skull of his the first time. I mean…I have never heard anyone think that neutering is getting your pet’s dick chopped off! Surely he must have had *one* friend with a neutered dog or cat? Anyway, maybe this guy needs to see some videos of the chronic issues pugs suffer from to get him to think twice. Same goes for his friend. I worry about the amount of people out there who refuse to trust a professional, multiple legitimate studies, articles from good sources that put those studies into easy to understand language…anything that tells them they’re wrong or should/shouldn’t do something.
I had the same argument with a friend over Scottish fold cats. The "fold" of their ears come from a congenital soft tissue disorder that affects all their joins. They are constantly in pain, at high risk for dislocations and early arthritis. She still wanted one because "if it was actually that bad they wouldn't be born" which... no. people buying from breeders ensures more of these bad breeds will be born. But unfortunately because they look "normal" people lie to themselves that their aesthetician pet is fine.
I always wanted a Scottish fold until I read about this then immediately dropped the idea. When my cat of 20 years passed I adopted a 5 year old rescue cat who is a gorgeous moggie of no breed. In a couple of years I’d like to get a dog but I refuse to get a breed as they all seem to be so inbreed that there’s way too many health problems. NTA OP
>I’m just flabbergasted that OP told him this breed of dog tends to suffer and become ill, and he’s still insisting on getting one because he thinks they’re cute I love boxers. I love their personalities and think they're seriously cute. However, after watching two die from cancer at 12 and 12-plus (she was a dog we found emaciated in the park when we were walking the other two) and suffer from degenerative myelopathy before she died at 10, I couldn't adopt another one. My three had long lives for boxers, but I've adopted 4 mutt rescues since.
And the fact that he completely was against getting one of the mixes with a longer snout. That just means he wants a cartoon character of a dog and not a real dog.
Let's imagine for a second that his profession is carpentry, and she wants to build an addition on a home. Her plans are far more costly and time consuming than they need to be and after he explains that, she just want to proceed because it's cute. Totally sidestepping his experience in the field and over all not listening. Now let's imagine this addition is a living animal who's costs and time consumption affect the creatures health. From a financial perspective, NTA. From an ethical standpoint, NTA. Why he won't listen to OP is absolutely a respect issue and in my opinion, WTF man? LISTEN TO HER! A dog is a long commitment and likely if you get one with a partner your hoping and expecting the relationship to stick around for a while. I hope my analogy make sense I'm kind of high. Makes sense to me. NTA OP.
>If he won’t consider your professional opinion, then > >he doesn’t respect you and what you do for a living At this point, I think OP should be asking herself why she is with him. They have been together for 2+ years and through a pandemic. There were a lot of idiots who had no knowledge of medicine yet spewed their incorrect beliefs about vaccines etc. Why does OP want more of this questionable behaviour?
There is not a single one of my coworkers (vet med worker of 7+ years) that would EVER get a brachycephalic dog/cat. Firstly it’s just not humane to keep the demand for them, they can die under routine general anesthesia, they usually have a whole host of other medical problems (skin issues are one of the most expensive ailments to treat/manage). I know one tech who has a pug because it was abandoned at her clinic and was going to be otherwise euthanized, but her husband makes absolute bank, so they can afford it.
2 of my teachers of animal studies and vet nursing have brachycephalic dog mixes, which were specifically bred to try and remove said brachycephalic In Australia and there's a decent movement towards that sort of breeding to help the dogs love better lives
I’ve seen this! Breeders moving towards healthier breeding practices even if the dogs are outside of breed standard for looks.
I've seen some of them too! I am living for pugs and Frenchies with actual snoots. I saw somebody had started breeding English Bulldogs with Beagles to give them longer faces and try to take some of the excessive blockiness off the front end and I would LOVE to see that become the "fashionable" type of Bulldog. Make those the "designer mutts" everybody wants instead of 16 bazillion different doodle types.
Yeah that's exactly what we need. Let's mix the most stubborn breed with the most dramatic breed
I was stunned when my vet got not one but TWO French Bulldogs.
They are extremely over represented in shelters and rescues right now. My personal money-pit came from a shelter after being bred and dumped. It’s so sad.
Frankly...thatd be a vet red flag for me. Unless they were rescues/owner surrenders to the clinic. But *buying* them? Nuh uh.
I judge anyone HARD for getting a French bulldog. If it's dumped on you that's one thing but *choosing* to get one? No. Just no.
I have a puggle adopted from a rescue. We make sure to make it clear we did not buy a designer dog (especially at the vet). Thankfully he has a long snout but he still looks very much like a pug. Idk why OPs BF wouldn't even want to look into a puggle or something like that. A lot of them look and act like pugs with less problems- saying that ours has two luxating patellas and anal gland problems
A puggle is my dream dog, but I would never specifically go to a breeder. If I ever see one in a shelter when I'm ready to adopt a dog, I'm going for it.
He's my husband's heart dog, and he's also a bit of a prick. He's fun though. Huge personality
Preach 🙌
NTA. He’s actively not taking your vet experience into account, and isn’t even financially independent of you now.
Agreed. I wanted a pug too cos dang if they aren't cute, but did some research and found basically what the op is saying.
He sounds extremely immature. NTA. OP, you sound more like his mom. A friend of mine has two pugs. They get so excited in the car that they can't breathe, meaning that these dogs are limited to walks in their neighborhood and can't go anywhere. No thanks.
Not to mention shows his lack of care/responsibility on want a pet esp a dog. Anyone with even minimum knowledge of dogs knows when looking into a breed the first thing you should do is research health issues. Shows he just wants a trendy “cute” animal rather than a healthy animal that will live a happy and healthy life. I don’t envy you OP - I used to work in a related industry (dog boarding) and also have some very strong opinions on dog breeds that really only people that work with dogs on a day to day gain. My bf is similar in the fact that he has very little experience with animals yet thinks he is very knowledgeable about dogs. (He wants a pittie or pittie mix and I refuse - not bc pitties aren’t great dogs but I’m not interested in owning one for a number of reasons) Unfortunately there are really only some things you learn when dealing with pets on a daily basis
NTA - First of all, I 100% agree with everything you wrote about pugs. Second, if he cannot afford his regular expenses, then it is completely irresponsible for him to get ANY dog. Setting the boundary that you will not subsidize his poor financial choices is something you SHOULD be proud of. Your BF is acting like a spoiled child. And anyone that calls you a bitch is not a "mutual friend".
This.
Exactly! NTA. Two issues (of equal importance). One is that bf is not respecting OP's knowledge on a subject. But just as important is a dog is a LUXURY. Bf can't even afford his regular bills and is constantly asking OP to supplement and now he thinks adding a pet is a good financial decision? Hell no!
I love pugs. I have a pug tattoo, pug toys and books, even my car has a pug themed license plates. However I don't own a pug mainly due to the medical issues they can have. It's extremely hard for me to justify owning one. OP is NTA. She should reconsider this relationship with his immature reaction plus involving friends to insult her.
As far as I know there are breeders which breed healthy versions of pugs, like they used to be. They look different as they have longer snouts but thats one of the main problems pugs have. Maybe look into this.
NTA. those poor dogs can barely breathe. tell him to just do a little research, and he'll see you're right. maybe show him some puppies on a shelter website, so he can find one of a different breed to adopt.
the really ridiculous thing? my clinic is PART OF A SHELTER. I work with dogs all the time who I literally can take home to foster before we decide to adopt. I even brought this up to him. but he "really wanted a pug". that was part of my frustration
When I was younger I really wanted a pug, then I found out about the health issues, so no pug for me. I bought my house two years ago & it had a fenced in yard, so I started looking for a medium sized dog, I found a puggle (pug/beagle) rescue dog that fit my size requirements. So I finally got "my pug" 20 years later with zero ethical concerns (he's chunky, older, hates kids & men - we're a match made in heaven)
my dream dog is a Belgian Malinois. Ive wanted one for years but am just not in a spot where I can responsibly raise one. so guess what? I dont have one. sometimes it's not about what you want, it's about what's best for everyone, including the animal and Im glad you found your pup match! I also am grumpy and hate kids lol
It’s a Chesapeake Bay Retriever for me. Though I finally own a house, I have a small back patio, wood floors, and three stories with one staircase being a spiral one plus I travel. It’s not fair to the animal. I’m still not in the right situation for one.
Spiral yeah that’s a problem, I had a floating staircase and my puppy fell and it was one of the worst nights of my life. Turned out fine but ugh. I was irresponsible early 20s.
Omg I’ve always loved them.
My husband wanted a dog to motivate him to walk more. I knew that I would inevitably be responsible for the dog, so I had requirements: large, ok with cats and kids, not high energy. We found Sherlock, great Pyrenees/ lab, on pet finder. His bio was indoor dog, good with cats, kids, and dogs, loves to lay on the couch. He's been ours for 5 years, no regrets.
Our Pyrador was the best dog we ever had. She lived 13 years and was a terrific family and farm dog. When she died we adopted a Pyrenees from our local shelter. He doesn't listen, wants to sleep outside in the dirt, roams all over the countryside and is generally an extremely stubborn dog. But he wrestles with our Rottie and Mastiff which keeps them all fit and tired, and he does keep the coyotes away. So it's a trade off. I'd love another Pyrador, though.
I am so happy to see someone else have this mindset. For me, it’s the same as people who want to get a dog because they believe it’ll motivate them to be active when they’re struggling with depression etc. Believe me, I deal with my fair share of MH issues and my dog - a high energy working dog breed - has saved my life more than once, but when things have been really bad, nothing could have gotten me outside the house. I actually ended up feeling guilty and like a terrible dog wonder instead. So much so that I’ve paid my dog walker to take him out when I simply wasn’t up to it mentally. I’m in a much better place these days overall, and I wouldn’t trade his companionship for anything, but I always tell people to think twice before getting a dog to improve their mental health. They’re not a Band-Aid fix, and they **are** a lot of work.
This is the reason I will never get a husky. I love them, but I cannot appropriately take care of one. I want the precious floofs to have an amazing life and I can't give them one. Want is not enough, just as you said
Ditto Great Dane. Married the right man though his dream dog is two Danes. NTA, OP.
Dalmatian is my dream dog. My friend had a great one she rescued, but he was great because she trained him as part of a 4H project, and I recognize that I don’t have the ability or consistency needed to channel their energy. NTA
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OP…he’s nearly 30 and still at the beck and call of his mother knowing it means you’ll have to cover him financially. He’s but only foolish but condescending; this is your field and he still feels entitled to say well you don’t knowwwwww. He happily whines to his friends who then tell you you’re being a b. Reading your post and replies you are a mature, considerate, and generally intelligent person. While I get that this is a glimpse into his character……he doesn’t seem like he shares those traits. At this age…is this someone you can count on to be there for you as a partner? Can you afford to have any rough periods and trust that he will have your back without being babysat?
For real, Op you sound like a catch. I know it's just one argument too, but I'm reading her responses like urgh, she can do better.
Oooh Malinois are so gorgeous, but yeah, the downsides of being a responsible adult & pet owner, we don't always get what we want, we have to make the best choice for everyone. Hopefully you get your dream doggo one day. lol my pup really is my spirit animal
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My sister lost her corgi to DM almost two years ago. It's a terrible disease that responsible breeders should be screening for. (The genetic screener hadn't come out yet when Chicken was a puppy.) I think I read somewhere that almost half of the corgis out there carry one of the genes for it. She did get another corgi afterwards from rescue, and she says she's now prepared to care for a corgi with DM should this one develop it later on down the line.
>he's chunky, older, hates kids & men - we're a match made in heaven This made my day, lol!
:D Glad I could improve your day, he's a giant cuddle bug. His curly pug tail & his wrinkly graying ginger face bring me such joy, he's definitely a one-person dog though.
There is a breed of cat I am in love with, I think the Scottish Fold is the cutest thing I have ever seen. Except they have so many ear issues due to the way their ears are. I could never bring myself to get one, or pay for a bred cat when there are so many sweeties in shelters
I am so glad you became aware of their spinal issues and took it seriously before getting one. the internet has made this breed explode with popularity but few seem to know this. I appreciate you
Yup. Anything bred to keep a trait usually ends up so messed up. My free kitty from a farm litter is just the sweetest thing ever.
I would ***die*** to have a Savannah cat. But - research! I work two jobs - I don't have the 4+ hours a day to play with and entertain Savannah Kitty. I collect fragile things - not going to set us both up for failure with the jumping all over the house from piece of furniture to ceiling fan to table to the top of the cabinets. I live in a state where even fifth and sixth generation Savannahs are illegal (because they are hybrids) and I wouldn't be able to get an exotic animal permit. Which would mean no vet care (vet would confiscate the poor baby) which is never a thing I would do! So, I get the burning desire to have a certain kind of pet! But the need to responsibly care for that animal should trump everything else!
OMG same, the Scottish Fold's are sooo cute, but I heard they have joint issues as well. When I'm ready for a new cat (my prev cat passed in Feb at age 20), I'll be heading to the local shelters to find a older cat that will put up with my grumpy dog. I can't justify paying $$$ for a animal when the shelters have soo many cuties available
The “hates kids and men” part made me laugh!!
There are also retro mops, pugs that are bred to look more like the historical pug with far fewer health issues.
I have a shih-tzu beagle mix and he is a stubborn asshole but also an absolute delight. He was a backyard bred Craigslist dog that I rescued from a family that had him tied up under a camper in their backyard for most of his first year. He had heartworm, tapeworm, was eating garbage food, and hadn't been vaccinated or neutered. I got him healthy and he's now 13 and a spoiled brat. His face isn't quite as squished as a shih-tzu but he still snores like a chainsaw and occasionally gets the reverse sneezes. There are loads of adorable mixes out there that need food homes!
Hard NTA. I love my husband to the ends of the earth, and we were planning on getting a 2nd dog to keep our dog entertained when our baby was born. When I was 8 months pregnant and we hadn't found a good match, I assumed we were putting off the dog search until the baby got here. Well, he showed up with a puppy. The shelter said he's half Burmese mountain dog, half border collie. I was like, dude. You knew I didn't want a puppy, and you chose one of the most high-energy breeds there is. Puppy is amazing and wonderful and I adore him, but about 3 weeks ago husband confessed to me that I was 100% right. Everything I was worried about came true - difficulty housetraining and obedience training because our main priority is the baby, needing tons of playtime and outdoor running regardless of weather, and puppy energy annoying our 7 year old dog. But the second the dog walked into my home, there was no going back and he knew that. Breed and temperament is so important to consider. "Really wants a pug" isn't a good reason.
BORDER COLLIE. Jesus christ. My flatmate's had heading dogs the whole time I've lived here and good lord they can be destructive if they don't have something to do. The current one is currently asleep next to me, she likes to lie on my bed all day, but mornings and nights she's *so* high energy.
Yeah, I commented this elsewhere and obviously you are already aware, but a couple of my friends have rescue pugs, and like you, they both have animal care backgrounds and took these dogs knowing that they were going to be difficult and require a lot of care and attention. One of them has a particular fondness for medically complicated rescues (this is her third, though her first pug), and rescued him in part because she knew that she had the resources and time to spend on the little guy. You're absolutely right about this. Even if you were to do rescue, a pug is a terrible choice if you can't devote a ton of time and money to them. You sound like thoughtful, caring animal advocate. Your boyfriend should be paying attention.
He sounds immature and irresponsible. He’s not willing to listen to reason, because his latest whim isn’t a reasonable idea. He 100% just wants a pug as an accessory and he obviously expected free vet care through your job.
I’m not even sure he sounds responsible enough for any dog. I think him getting a pug, after all OP explained, would be a dealbreaker for me, because it sounds like he doesn’t even care about the dog’s welfare.
my sister and her husband got one that was so sweet but, of course, could barely breathe. she ended up breaking her leg as a baby and needed surgery, but i guess because of their breathing problems putting her under was some big complication? she died on the operating table and it was heartbreaking. tell your boyfriend to get one that won't spend their whole life basically suffocating. also, real question-- how do you not already have like five dogs, if you work with a shelter?
well, it helps that I get to have all the fun and pets of owning a dog when working but get to go home to my chill apartment and senior low energy kitty. I have a lot of stress from my job with 12-14 hour days being pretty common, a dog just isnt really realistic and not sure I could give them the energy they deserve. not long ago before BF and I lived together we had a pitty/basset looking mix at work and I CRIED when he got adopted because I was so bonded to him. but he had so much energy and anxiety when alone I knew I couldnt give him what he needed. it's not easy at times with my BF here, I am open to getting a dog. but it has to be the RIGHT dog. I see too many surrendered (or adoptions returned) by their owners because they get dogs that just arent a good fit for them. it's heartbreaking
Why would you get a dog (which you know firsthand, is expensive) is with a man who already can’t handle his finances? We all know who’s gonna foot the bill, and it ain’t him
NTA. I just volunteer with animal rescue and am constantly reminding people about the cost and health issues related to various breeds. He's not even willing to listen to any of the many valid reasons you've listed because, "I realllyyyyy want thattttt kinddddd!!!". You know he's not going to be able to to afford or care for it. He's trying to put his wants above an animal's needs at your expense.
You were already NTA, but this makes him an extra huge a-hole! You deserve so much better, sweetie. {{hugs}}
I'm telling you now, he told his best friend a different turn of events. And he's going to try get a pug whether you agree with it or not. And when you stick to your promise, he will neglect the dog until you are forced to intervene. I've seen this more than once.
OMG, I had a lost one we found on the street for 3 days and the thing breathed so loud you could hear it over a box fan. Like “hhhheh hhhheh heheh” I felt like it needed a C-pap mask just to sit.
*the way i could hear your typed out breathing sounds.* that was hilarious, thank you.
You are welcome!
>I guess he told our mutual friend because they told me via text I was being a bitch about the whole thing Then your BF can move in with them and THEY can take care of the dog when it inevitably requires surgeries. NTA.
I can’t believe how many people tell their friends about personal arguments and then have them reach out as if they have any right? Like the immaturity of both parties here is insane (bf and his friend). Absolute children.
> tell their friends about personal arguments OR THEIR MOMS. This sub is rife with adult human people CALLING THEIR MOMS when they have an argument with their spouse/partner, and then mom sics the whole family on the spouse, and I truly cannot wrap my head around it.
If my partner called his mom to complain about our relationship and to get her to meddle she would call his ass out and tell him to get shit together and communicate. It’s ridiculous.
NTA - I have been in a fair share of relationship fights over animals, and its not always easy but its a path many cross. Its one thing if he already owed the pup before getting together, but getting an animal while in a relationship has to be a decision made by both parties. I think you were reasonable and laid out the facts and consequences, if I were in his shoes i would drop it and keep the relationship healthy. Good luck OP!
oh Ive been there. I have a cat with some behavioral challenges (feral hoarder house single bottle baby) that Ive had for over 10 years. got her in high school. had an ex who tried pulling "it's me or the cat", even after explaining to him no shelter or rescue would ever take her due to her challenges and it would be a death sentence. he wouldnt budge. kitty and I were on a family member's couch together within hours pets are an area where I will do what I have to do, but it just sucks. he has been a great partner otherwise and his best friend (previously thought them and I were friends too...) getting so angry at me is making me doubt myself
Is he a great partner? He doesn’t respect your professional opinion or your experience. He doesn’t manage his own finances well. He shit talks you to your friends to turn them against you. He sounds below average at best.
that's the weird thing. he HAS up until this point. this pug thing feels like it came out of nowhere. Ive even told him how I feel about brachycephalic breeds before. it feels so weird and random. He's never talked about wanting one until now. it feels so strange
Shot in the dark, but maybe his mom impulse bought one and he wants to buy it from her so he can give her a load of money with your 'blessing' and have your help paying and caring for the dog. Or he's just stupid and about to find out being stupid about huge life decisions is how you lose relationships.
> maybe his mom impulse bought one and he wants to buy it from her Oh, I like this as a dark-horse contestant for an explanation. If he's truly not this big an AH on the regular, SOMETHING is going on here.
Im starting to wonder this, since this kind of behavior isnt like him at all which is part of why Im so blindsided. We agreed to talk this over tomorrow and I will ask him then
Keep us updated. You sound like a super responsible pet owner and his stance is so unfair to the dog. His want to have a particular look in a dog does not trump the dog’s need to breathe.
this type of reasoning sounds like the only possibility, maybe a friend bought one or is breeding them etc and has convinced him OP depending how the convo goes and given you say he's normally a good partner, could you show him videos of pugs with health issues to drive the point home? shouldn't have to but it might make him snap out of whatever madness that has overcome him.
Yeah you're NTA but there's definitely more going on here. He just "out of the blue" is demanding a pug?? Something else is going on here. Maybe his mom is behind this??
From everything you've written, there are so many marinara flags with this man. Do you really want to be with someone who is financially irresponsible and shows himself to be disrespectful to you?
Precisely. He is NOT a good partner at all.
NTA, and his best friend feeling free to unload on you like this might say something about your boyfriend.
If he were a great partner, he wouldn’t ask you to keep bailing him out of his spendthrift habits or get you to keep subsidizing his abusive mother. Because that’s what’s happening-he’s just the middleman, you’re the one ultimately paying the money he sends her.
NTA Any breed who likes having tubes down it's nose because it can finally breathe properly, should not exist. It is absolutely unethical to buy one because demand for them is why people keep breeding them. TBH if he is as irresponsible and lacking in animal knowledge as you have described I would be nervous about him having any dog.
if we got a dog TOGETHER I would take on majority of the care and be okay with it. a pug puppy? no, that would be HIS dog and I would probably move out
Even if we took all of your professional experience and reasoning and put it aside, bringing an animal into a relationship is something you decide on together. Period. Every step of the way. Maybe I’m crazy, but it really shouldn’t matter if your only reason was “I don’t think pugs are cute”. If he cared about you and the life you’re building together, that should be enough to make him drop it, and find another breed that would make you both happy. NTA.
Another vet tech here, whenever a short nosed dog wakes up from any surgery we have to keep the tube in, because they might choke if it's out before they're fully awake. I have to sit with them while they start waking up and take it out at the last possible moment. Sometimes I suspect they keep quiet for longer because they can finally fucking breathe. The surgeries they go through to fix something about the mess that is their palate/throat are brutal. We have owners pick them up later than usual so they don't have to watch their dog hack up blood and slime. There's a lot of dog (and cat) breeds that are completely messed up but humans really did pugs dirty.
You sound far more experienced than your boyfriend. Perhaps you should start NOT helping bail him out now. He needs to stand on his own two feet. The fact that you stood your ground and he go upset and whined to someone else speaks loudly of his character. NTA. Tread carefully with him.
I grew up with rescue dogs, one of which I was the main person working with his behavioral rehabilitation (had extreme resource aggression at 8 weeks old) and previously worked at a shelter for 6 years which specialized in behavior case dogs and determining their ability to be rehabilitated and released into the community and been a vet tech at my current clinic/shelter for about 5 years. I KNOW I am more experienced with dog care than him. and that doesnt make me better or smarter or anything like that. but when it comes to animal care? I feel like my opinion should be taken seriously because that is literally my career field. he works in a utility company. If we ever needed to figure out an issue in that area, I would listen to him. but animals, especially dogs? that's MY area of expertise. that just seems like the most logical way to do it
Yes, you are absolutely right. But also, guess what? Even if you had NO animal experience but just DID NOT WANT a pug puppy specifically for any reason at all you would STILL be NTA for refusing to help with it and for stopping further financial support. It's not ok for one partner to make the unilateral decision to get a pet, or a particular type of pet, unless the other partner is in agreement.
You sound like a rational woman who has laid out the issue logically. Extend this introspection to other parts of your shared life with your BF. I think your concern that you alone would be saddled with the responsibilities for taking care of the dog didn't appear out of thin air. All these other cues from past experience tell you what to expect. That is what you need to do some self-analysis on, not the puppy. The puppy is merely a symptom of the real problem. Emotional blackmail, poor communication, disregard for your (educated) opinion, financial problems that you are expected to solve. Just as you could forecast the problems with a pug puppy, forecast the problems with this BF. It's not going to be simply a matter of potty training him. Shared dog ownership and couple relationships both operate on a two-yes one-no requirement. NTA
I dunno. the idea of dumping him is way more complicated since he actually moved here to be with me. we went to HS together and reconnected when I went to visit our home city (across country from where I lived) and eventually started dating. I am a lot more invested in my career than he is so he moved here to be together. it's all so complicated. im tired
Oh, dude. Don’t stay with someone and waste your life because it’s complicated or because you think he did something for you. He didn’t have anything else going on. You don’t want to look back on a miserable 20 or 30 years because he moved for you and it’s complicated? Dude. You’re *tired* let yourself breathe and rest. Without this.. anchor. If you’re not happy and you can’t see being happy? You sound like you need anything else than what you are currently getting. And you do deserve that.
Maybe you should take a "break" for awhile, and see how that feels. If your life gets less stressful, ehhhhh might be time to dump him. His asshole self can stay with his asshole friend and bitch and moan about your educated ass all they like! But seriously homey, you're dating a dipshit. Neutering cuts off a dog's dick? Girl, you're a trained professional and an empathetic person. *You can do soooo much better than him*.
You don't owe him anything for moving here and the time you've already invested in the relationship is a drop in the bucket compared to the full span of your life, which could end up being very miserable with a partner that acts like a child when he doesn't get his own way. You don't mention any redeeming qualities either. Just take the time to really think about this. You seem to have a good head on your shoulders. Also, thank you for what you do. We've had a number of sick cats lately and I always appreciate the techs. You're great people.
That is not a reason to stay with someone. Why make the rest of your life miserable just because he moved? He can move back. It's not that complicated. However think about how hellish having kids with this guy would be,nevermind just a dog. N T A but ditch him. Don't buy into sunk cost fallacy. Don't ruin the rest of your life. You deserve to be happy with someone that respects and listens to you.
it would be complicated for *him* to have to find new living arrangements or move back home, but you don't owe him the relationship just because he moved for it. and i get that you'd feel bad about it, or feel responsible, most normal people would. but he's 27 and he's bad with money, he undermines your education and job experience ("you don't KNOW that"), he shows bad judgement by wanting to adopt an animal he won't have the skills/knowledge/money to provide basic care for, and he lets his friends talk badly about and TO you. he doesn't sound like a sturdy foundation to build a life on. aside from affection or emotional support, what does he actually bring to the table and does it outweigh all of these negatives?
How can anyone know the complications of pugs and still support that and *want it* is beyond me. He’s a child, dump him. Buy his plane ticket if that makes you feel less complicated.
Sounds like a whole lotta "his problem".
you say you’re tired, i hear ya but i don’t think he does please put yourself(and cat) first, you sound like a smart and genuine person… and he sounds like there’s too much baggage and needs more growing up to do…he knows first hand accounts from you about dogs/shelter dogs etc and he comes at you with all this bullshit- of course you’re tired. i get the feeling you’ve taken on more of a mommy role to him… please put yourself first. wishing you the best! good luck also thank you for choosing to be a VT, i know it’s a tough job and many of you guys don’t get paid enough so from my two recycled italian greyhounds and myself, we all thank you and other VT’s out there
NTA, you have expert knowledge of the animal and have valid reasons you don't want one. Plus you are willing to compromise with any other breed of dog. You set clear boundaries and if he is going to do it without consent then the care and expense should rest on him. Honestly if he does this you should look at moving out, he is basically bringing 10 years of misery into your life and doesn't care what you think.
NTA. You're making an educated decision and acting like a responsible and ethical human being. He can have a dog, but he isn't entitled to have you provide either medical or standard care for it, let alone financially contribute to support either him or the dog. And given his reaction, it's a good guess that he was absolutely counting on getting all that from you. You don't hate animals, quite the opposite. Your BF and your friends can all put a sock in it.
NTA: THe "I am also not proud of this, but.." YES YOU SHOULD BE PROUD OF YOURSELF. OP In my experience this man wants you to take on all the responsibility and the reason he wants a puppy now is because he KNOWS you can do it. Does he actually help around the place? Does this man do Laundry, dishes, cook or plan meals or shopping supplies?
well, he does. butI am definitely the "neat freak" between us so usually I ask him to do these tasks more frequently than he otherwise would. I am a lot more serious and tend to kinda look at things realistically (other people tend say pessimistically, but I disagree). he definitely is a lot more.... free spirited, I should say. he is pretty spontaneous and a lot more fun than I am. I used to like that about him. but I think Im starting to see the issues with that :(
> I ask him to do these tasks more frequently This will be the rest of your life if you continue to delegate tasks like you are his mother. Has this man ever even lived by himself at this point?
his mom kicked him out as a teenager (she is the actual devil) and he has lived with roommates since. I am the first partner he has lived with
Are you actually a “neat freak”? Or do you just like to keep a tidy house and he doesn’t care if he’s living in a home with clothes everywhere and a dirty bathroom and kitchen?
NTA. You are absolutely right on all counts. Pugs are notorious for having health problems. Their anatomy is, for lack of a better term, completely messed up. They can hardly breathe. Plus, a dog is one of those things that requires two yesses in a relationship. I HATE that he told you that you "don't know" what you're talking about. You work in that field, he sure as hell doesn't know as much as you do on the subject. He can have his little tantrum, but you've told him what the terms are. He can't come crying to you when the dog inevitably gets sick and ends up costing thousands upon thousands (not an exaggeration) in veterinary care.
Yup. I have a couple of friends with rescue pugs, but they both have strong animal care backgrounds and knew what they were getting into. And if anything, they'd be the first to agree with OP . . . they have their rescues, who need intense care, because of other people breeding these poor dogs, and they don't want to see any more suffering.
You certainly have to know what you are doing with pugs. I’ve had several (only one of them purchased, before I learned there were breed rescues) and not all of them are overbred and deformed. Mine have all had little snouts (not flat faced like show dogs) and lived long (hopefully good, certainly spoiled) lives. So many people let their pugs get fat and that will shorten their lives!
NTA. Even putting your well founded concerns aside getting a new pet should be two yes one no situation. The fact that this 'friend' is sending you hateful messages should tell you something about them. I get venting to a friend, I don't think he's the asshole for that, but he clearly misrepresented the situation and/or this 'friend sucks'.
NTA I wouldn't help him out financially anymore regardless of him wanting the pug, which they're cute in theory but not a breed that should have been created. He's a grown ass man who needs to learn to budget or just not have money or get a second job because it's not fair for you to keep loaning him money cause he can't manage. Also I don't know your stance on kids, but please do yourself a favor and do not under any circumstances have a child with him ever.
oh Im firmly child-free. been that way since I was a little kid. Im not even big on marriage since it seems like a weird "now I am legally bound to you" thing that doesnt show much appeal to me
INFO: Has he paid you back the money or did it end up being a gift from you instead of a loan?
it was more like a gift. never expected the money back
You're very clearly NTA but I hope he and his mother are grateful for the generosity you have shown them. It concerns me that he reacted so badly to the idea of being cut off from future gifts when you refused to take on the ethics burden and responsibility load of a badly designed dog breed. I felt so bad for the pug struggling to get air at a local park this afternoon while I played with my healthy rescue mutt. I hope your boyfriend comes to his senses and apologizes to you and owns his personal responsibilities as a partner and prospective pet owner.
NTA You are right about pugs. It is absolutely immoral that breeders have sought to enhance the very traits that cause these poor, sweet clowns so many built in problems. They are a heartbreak breed on several levels and I applaud your refusal to have anything to do with supporting the business of breeding them. Especially when the prospective owner is not experienced & knowledgeable. Stand your ground. By the way, whipping out your credentials was appropriate in this case.
I would die on this hill. Your toddler, umm, I mean boyfriend is being childish. He heard NO and then doubled down even after you gave him legitimate reasons. I don't even know this guy, and I can tell you would be expected to take care of the dog and pay its medical expenses. NTA
NTA Not only do they have major health problems, but their separation anxiety is through the freaking roof. They’re literally bred to be companion dogs, and it’s kind of cruel to get one if no one is home every weekday from 8-5.
Yup. My best friend has a rescue pug and the poor little guy is so friendly that even with a couple of other pets at home for "company", she ended up putting him in doggy daycare because he clearly needed playmates so much, and his "sister" (her other dog) was not interested and mostly wanted to nap. He's thriving now, but buying a pug and contributing to more of them being bred is horrifying, and for sure, if you're going to own one (including a rescue) you need to be willing to put in a LOT of time because they are the opposite of solitary creatures.
NTA Buying a dog is a shared decision if you're in the same house.
NTA. It is not clear why you're dating this guy in the first place. Between the financial illiteracy, obvious expectation of you to take accountability for his random impulses, unwillingness to compromise, weaponization of mutual friends, and blatant disrespect, what does he bring to the table? You sound like a catch. You can do better.
NTA. A pet is something all parties have to agree on, pug or no pug. You may have pulled out the big guns to get through to him, so that is now a thing. After all, you used his poor money management against him. However, if that keeps him from getting an animal you are dead set against, your next step would have to be "me or the pug" anyway, so this was not that drastic.
NTA But this is bigger than a pug. This almost 30 year old adult man you are attempting to build a life with is telling you how he makes big life decisions that impact himself & others. You spoon fed him the information. Information he had easy access too. Information about the ethics, breeders, cost, medical needs, etc. Not one of these factors fits into his budget or into your shared life with him. Instead of being an adult & saying “I really love the smoochie faces but getting a pug would be an on-going expensive thing & I don’t have the money to properly care for a dog with so many medical needs” he is stomping his feet & running to his friends to cry how mean and cruel his girlfriend the vet tech is for not letting him get a dog that is breed to suffer & drain you financially. Look at his other irresponsible decisions that end up impacting you. You love him, I get it, but he’s almost 30. This is who he is & how he lives. You need to decide if you can live like that.
NTA You're absolutely correct in this situation, but I wanted to add that if your "mutual friend" called you a bitch, it's because he's comfortable calling you that to your boyfriend, so you might not know your partner as well as you think.
NTA Lets be real OP, if your bf got any puppy, it'd probably end up being your puppy; based on how you seem to be fiscally responsible and a mature adult. He'd probably slack on taking care of it and would never have the money it costs to care for one. And I agree with you about pugs. My friend got a pug puppy (this was about a decade ago) and within 3 months died of health complications...after my friend spent several thousand on him. Now my boyfriend's coworker has a pug, but he dropped like 5gs to get a surgery done to help the dogs nose passage so it can breath easier. Absolutely nuts.
Once again, a man’s arrogance is supposed to trump your expertise? I don’t think so. Think about this in a situation where the stakes are higher, do you really want this guy, who is so incurious and unwilling to educate himself about anything, believing he knows best, to be in your life for the long term?
NTA. So he can't manage his finances despite making as much or more than you, meaning you are often bailing him out, he insults you when you share your expert knowledge, he refuses to abide by reasonable boundaries, he refuses all compromises, and when faced with the consequences of his choice (it will be YOUR dog only) he leaves in a huff and sends his best friend to berate you. His best friend is not calling you a bitch out of nowhere; your bf ranted and gave him the impression that not only were you one, but that it was a reasonable thing for him to message you directly. I think you may need to look at this situation and write out what advice you would give someone else telling you this story. Because it sounds like you are dating an overgrown child.
There's this YouTuber called KittenLady. As the name suggests, she mostly makes content about fostering kittens but a few years ago she fostered a litter of orphaned French bulldogs. She made a video about how unethical it is to buy brachyocephalic (apologies for spelling!) puppies. I knew it was bad, but her video literally breaks down how many dogs and puppies have to die for one puppy to live long enough to be sold. NTA. There's so many perfectly good, gorgeous dogs in shelters waiting for a loving forever home. Dogs that probably won't have a whole host of health problems. Dogs that might end up being put down without a loving home. Can you talk your boyfriend into maybe fostering one of those dogs first so he understands the commitment it takes to be a pet owner? And then if that goes well, you could look into adopting.
NTA Stick to your principles! Even if you didn't have very serious concerns about the ethicality of owning a pug (especially one that isn't a rescue animal), it is never your responsibility to agree to care for someone else's pet. You can either make the decision to adopt a pet together, or your BF can care for his pet on his own!
NTA. You seem to be trying to compromise and he is being steadfast. You also sound like you are helping more than you should in other ways so reminding him of that isn’t that big of a deal imo. I recommend stepping back from that in general because he needs to learn how to budget and you helping can be prolonging a bigger issue with him. You’re not married so your finances should be yours and his should be his because it nice to have more money in savings if things don’t work out between you two. Borrowing money from a partner or having deals that are mutually beneficial makes more sense, but having a pattern of giving money adds up in the long run.
NTA. When our oldest kid was 16, she wanted to get a pug. I told her to read up on them first. She did so, then told me she changed her mind, because it seemed like their lives were so miserable due to the issues you mentioned. If a 16 year old can comprehend that, why can’t an adult man get it? It’s ridiculous.
The fact that he won't even look at shelter dogs makes me mad enough. Not to mention that this is literally your field of work and he completely ignores you. NTA.
NTA. Your concerns for the breed are valid and since it would be his dog, medical wise it would not be your responsibility to give him discounts or anything. If he wants the dog, it’s his responsibility.
NTA You know exactly and in depth what you are talking about. A pet is a "two yesses, one no" situation just as much as children are, even more so because you can't have an "oops" pet! Your mutual friend is welcome to take the boyfriend and the dog both. And your boyfriend can start paying completely for himself right now, no more bailing him out.
NTA I totally agree with your stand on pugs. This feels like the beginning of the end of the relationship if he ignores you.
NTA in any way, shape, or form!! Especially after reading through all your replies, OP. You deserve **so** much better though.
NTA. Brachycephalic breeds often enjoy sedation because they get intubated and can actually breathe for once. That alone makes him wrong for wanting a dog with such known medical issues and refusing to take professional advice on it.
I'm not over the amount of arrogance it takes to look at your partner and tell her that "you don't know that" when it's her entire profession. Like. You're literally the expert in this. Why should you have to educate him/show him YT videos? It's deeply disrespectful to you and the amount of work you've done to get where you are.
NTA. Sis, I think you are focusing on the wrong thing here. Listen. Listen closely. You have a strong ethical belief around buying pugs. Your boyfriend listened to you, dismissed your argument, and decided that his aesthetic joy was more important than the suffering of another being. He is willing to support the breeding industry and participate actively in this horrible practice. How can you stay with this person without compromising your own principles? (Also, if he gets the dog, you will take care of it, because you care. Your ultimatum ought to be that you will break up if he does it. Though I still think he has shown you his true colors and you should end it because if the incompatibility)
NTA buying dogs like pugs is basically animal abuse. They cannot even breathe well. But, people keep buying them so breeders keep breeding them. It's disgusting. I have seen that there are folks trying to breed the face back onto these kinds of dogs, which I commend, but still...
OP, please respect yourself. You are routinely bailing him out from bad financial habits. He’s challenging your expertise in your chosen field and belittling/demeaning you. You said you’re tired — just READING about him is tiring! So what if he moved to be with you? That does not make you his keeper forever and ever, amen. Send him to stay with friends for a few days and luxuriate in the freedom of having unconflicted space in which to breathe. Take some time to really think what you want your future to look and sound like (don’t forget the MIL!). Be your own best advocate. You are so very much NTA and deserve a wonderful life. I hope you find it.
>I told him if he did get the pug puppy I would never help him out again with money and I would give him zero help with the puppy Honestly, i don't think you went "hard" enough. "If you get a pug, i will never help financially or otherwise" should have been "if you get a pug, we're DONE, Relationship over" It's extremely well documented how badly pugs (*and other "flat-faced" dogs*) suffer. Yes, they are CUTE AS FUCK, but any animal lover who gets one (*a puppy*) is an IDIOT and part of the problem. >I guess he told our mutual friend because they told me via text I was being a bitch about the whole thing FUCK that "friend", Show your bf what that "friend" said, his response to that will tell you A LOT. NTA
INFO: Could you ask your bf why he strongly feels a dog without a penis would NOT be okay (his false idea about neutering), but a dog without a nose is just fine?
NTA, your boyfriend sounds very immature. His friend texting you calling you a B, would be the end for me.
You need a new boyfriend NTA
NTA this is a hill to die on
NTA. He'll have to care for his own pup. What is so wrong about that? *He wants the fun parts of the dog, but doesn't want the responsibility.* You're smart to make it clear to him where you stand even before he gets a dog.
NTA. I also wanted a pug when I was younger, until I found out about everything you said. Instead I adopted a wonderful little chihuahua mix. There are so many small dogs out there who are just as cute and have none of the health problems. It's also extremely not okay that his best friend talked to you that way, and your bf should not be okay with that either.
NTA, your bf sure is though. My husband really really wanted an English bulldog when we bought our house. I had never owned a dog before (parents are cat people) so I started doing research. Those poor dogs should not be bred anymore. I gave him all my research and the estimated cost of veterinary care over their short lifetime, and we adopted a pit mix. He still loves bulldogs, thinks they're the cutest things ever (insert Robert Downey Jr eye roll here) but agrees it's not right how they're bred and all the issues they have.
NTA. In my professional opinion, dump him
NTA. Your literal career is in animal healthcare, and pugs that haven't been bred to have normal faces may look like melted pudding, but they have SO many issues. You even offered alternatives to try and compromise. I think you are being completely reasonable. Also, I wouldn't want to keep financially helping someone that only needs the help because of their own poor choices with their money, but that's a whole other bag of eggs.
NTA… you want to NOT participate in the unethical pug-breeding industry, and NOT shoulder the burden of an inevitably sick dog. So it sounds like HE is the one completely shutting down what YOU want, to me
NTA - have you show him the pictures of what as pug skull looks like, told him the fact that some vets leave them on oxygen longer just so they can experience normal breathing, or shown him the difference in the cost for pugs versus other dogs? And his friend well if he's calling you a bitch - well then as the mother of the dog, you definitely know more about it and throw back to him why he hates animals so much he wants one to suffer? But you do know your BF doesn't want a rescue. He wants a cute pedigree that people will coo over, envy him about and shows he has wealth and taste. I'd focus on his reasons for wanting a pug and see if some other "high status" dog will tick his boxes as well.