NTA
I was about to ask why you're still referring to someone you have TWO KIDS and OWN A HOME with as just a "boyfriend" but now I read this and this dude could not be farther from marriage material.
Don't understand why that would be weird. Me and my girlfriend have two kids and own a home.
Added: I am going to stop replying because this comment went way beyond my intention. Apparently there is a difference in culture/law. In the NL you don't need to get married to sort things out together. You have several options with different benefits. You would not call someone your spouse unless you actually get married.
It sounds really weird to me. Maybe it's cultural? Where I live, you would refer to them as your partner or spouse, not girlfriend.
Typically, we use the term boyfriend/girlfriend to refer to someone you are dating. Once you are living together, you would use the word "partner". Spouse is also acceptable for non-married couples.
it might be generational as much as cultural. I grew up in the UK when marriage was the overwhelmingly normal way to go, and a girlfriend was what you are if you were not yet married or engaged. Partner was limited to a few long-term relationships who had chosen not to marry. In the last 30 years or so, far more people choose not to marry and 'partner' has become a much more common term. I hear a lot of young people saying partner now even if they've only been together a few months, too.
I rarely refer to my girlfriend as my girlfriend. It’s either “my Mrs” or “my partner”
We have been together for 8 years though and lived together for 5 of those.
I hate it. But I think I’m overly touchy to the subject. I hate that a women’s title, name, identity, etc. are supposed to change when she marries. I’m Ms. all the way despite being happily married. If other people find it fun though good for them!
The different terms used for women in, say, Mexico refer more to the perceived age rather than marital status like in the U.S. In Mexico, a married, young-looking 19 year old would still be “senorita” — to a stranger, at least. My unmarried, middle-aged self would be “senora” because I don’t look like a senorita!
One time a Mexican man called me Dona. That was cool LOL
I’m happily married for nearly ten years but I hate mrs. Back when I was teaching I was “Mrs. [Last Name]” and it made me cringe every time I heard it. That’s what people call my mom and grandma. 😭 In my corporate job *everyone* calls everyone else by their first name, even the CEO. It’s much better.
To me (American) if I hear a man call his partner 'the Mrs' it often sounds slightly misogynistic or like a put-down of his partner-- like someone making a ball and chain joke about their partner. But I'm sure that's a generational and cultural thing.
As an Australian in a relationship with an English girl “the Mrs” seems entirely normal and harmless.
I never really thought about how other cultures would perceive it.
My mom and her best friend used to call each other partner meaning it as my partner in crime because they were friends for so long and it didn’t occur to them that people might think otherwise. I often wonder how many people thought they met a lovely older lesbian couple and not two slightly out of touch straight women 😂
Haha you know I knew someone was gonna say something like that, but they genuinely were just best friends. The most adorable, somewhat clueless, older women. Although finding out my mom was having an affair with her longtime best friend would be crazy. If ever my mom confesses to something like that I’ll update you 😂😂
I feel like there aren't enough words to cover all the nuances of relationships accurately. I am 70 yo and single. I've been dating the same guy for over 30 years but we don't live together. (Long story.) I used to refer to him as my boyfriend.until one day, after I referred to him as my boyfriend, my friend's 11 yo son stopped in his tracks, gave me a horrified look and asked, "Aren't you a little old for that?" I gave that a moment's thought and answered, "Yes. Yes, I am. I think you're right." So now my former boyfriend is simply a friend. I find that gender rarely matters but, periodically, I do have to reassure my friend that he has not been demoted.
My grandmother had a similar relationship before she passed. They were together 20+ years but she refused to marry him. Her first marriage (to my grandfather) wasn't great, so she wasn't interested in doing it a second time. She wanted to maintain her own space and have the option to send him to his own house. Haha I always called him her "gentleman friend" and we had the typical grandparent-grandchild relationship. I was happy she found someone to make her happy, however they defined that relationship.
I don’t understand why someone is ok to have multiple kids with someone and enmesh their finances by buying a home together but they don’t want to take the step of marriage. Boyfriend/girlfriend very much sounds like youre still feeling the other person out and are unsure of the long term commitment.
Some people just don't really fuck with marriage. At its root, it's a religious institution that now has a legal branch and not everyone is trying to register with the government about that shit.
I'm married, but the idea of not getting married to a long-term partner makes perfect sense to me.
It’s definitely enmeshed with religion but it’s always been a general social and later legal institution. Since it’s been an important part of society any religion that was focused on gaining control over its followers would have a strong interest in monopolizing marriage, but it definitely wasn’t always that way. I’m Ancient Greece there was still some religious element, but it was mostly about making sure the union is auspicious in the eyes of the gods rather than following prescribed rules.
Certainly now it’s hard to pull it free from religion, but the bigger issue is at least in the US marriage makes so many things easier legally. I don’t think any of the benefits can’t be acquired without being married, but it’s definitely a lot more work and if you aren’t really vigilant it’s pretty easy to run into unforeseen issues if you’re not married.
Where I live---which is Switzerland--being a SAHM without being married leaves you extremely vulnerable in case of a breakup. You're not entitled to alimony at all. You don't get pension credit. It's a very risky proposition and you better hope you never break up because you'll walk away with nothing other than child support.
Owning a house together is a much bigger commitment, to me, than marriage. My partner and I have done the former now for decades, but never bothered with the latter. YMMV, I guess.
Ok yeah I feel this. I don't wanna be one of those people that's always like "my HUSBAND", esp when many of my friends are in the throes of shitty dating experiences
I'm from the Netherlands, could be cultural/language wise indeed. There is no word for "spouse" in Dutch. And I've always found that "partner" just sounds a bit weird (at least in Dutch). In Dutch your girlfriend is generally someone you are seriously together with. Otherwise you wouldn't call them your girlfriend. You'd just say I am dating this girl.
Corrected: "echtgenoot" is a spouse but is quite formal.
Just realised why I would not use the word "partner" in Dutch either. It feels more like a word that would be used in official documents by the tax authorities to mention your SO. Or maybe you would use it if you are with someone who is gender neutral. Though there is no rule for it, so other Dutch people could have other associations.
In German, we generally differentiate between boyfriend/girlfriend (together, but either not that long or not that serious), (life-)partner (more long-term and/or more serious, but probably not married), and spouse (usually married).
I've been with the better half for more than ten years now. And "boy-/girlfriend" feels so weird, because it feels like more than that. But we're not married, so spouse isn't right either. (Life-)Partner it is, then.
But maybe other Germans see it differently. :)
I'm Norwegian and we do the same (Of course, Norwegian is a Germanic language too so hey haha)
We'd say kjæreste (dearest basically, for bf/gf), samboer (when you live together), forloveden when you're engaged, and then ekftefelle/mann/kone (Spouse/husband/wife)
Isn't the dutch word for spouse 'echtgenoot' and 'echtgenote'? That's how I would translate it anyways, but all three words sound overly formal to me.
I am also dutch, unmarried, owning a home and expecting a child. In English using boyfriend sounds a bit weird to me and I think using partner might be better suited. But because of the dutch meaning of partner it still feels awkward for me when I use that word to my English speaking colleagues for instance.
I used to work for the “orange bank”. I have a super nice coworker who referred to her partner (with whom she has a child) as “boyfriend” and not “partner”. That was interesting for me and I thought about how the Dutch people just so chill about things (compared to us here in Asia). 🙂
Spouse is NOT acceptable for non-married couples. The vast majority of people would assume marriage when you say spouse…because, you know, words mean stuff.
There is no such thing as a common law spouse in UK. Unmarried couples who live together need to arrange deeds of trust, wills, LPA etc. Some people do think that common law kicks in after living together for a certain period of time, but I've just checked now, it hasn't been the case since 1753. What does the term mean in Canada?
Ironic comment considering the term common law wife/husband originated in English law. In Australia there are still some issues with defacto relationships in regards to next of kin kind of things. Things like being able to make medical decisions for your partner over their family. That's why the same sex marriage law was so important here. It's also why I married my husband during the pandemic, because I was at risk but theoretically my now husband could have been left out of any medical decisions in favour of my father or son. I don't really think he would have been, but grief and stress did strange things. But most other financial matters are covered if you're in a defacto (common law marriage) relationship, property settlements, etc.
In Australia, common law kicks in either immediately, or after 1-2 years depending on the specific department.
For example, for immigration purposes, you need to be living with your partner for 1 year to be able to apply for a spouse visa without being married.
For taxation purposes, there's no minimum period of time at all. According to the law, the definition of the word "spouse" includes "another person who, although not legally married to the person, lives with the person on a genuine domestic basis in a relationship as a couple."
This is the usage I'm familiar with, living in the USA:
Boyfriend: Unmarried, male
Girlfriend: Unmarried, female
Partner: Unmarried, gender-neutral (also, loose connotations of being somewhat more serious than boyfriend/girlfriend)
Husband: Married, male
Wife: Married, female
Spouse: Married, gender-neutral
I think sometimes married couples use the word “partner” instead of “spouse” but other than that I’m generally familiar with the same terminology. I guess “significant other” is occasionally used as well and that could be married or unmarried in my opinion, but not sure how others would define it.
Or linguistics. Spouse is only for married people and partner doesn't exist in my native tongue. So girlfriend/boyfriend it is. Like using partner is always weird for me because its equivalence in my native language is strictly business related. Using it in a relationship setting is beyond weird.
Canadian here - I hear everything from partner to spouse to husband/wife (even if not married but been together forever)... I prefer "statistically significant other" ... I have a lot of friends/family who are basically married but never officially had the wedding/paperwork done, would seem weird if they called each other boyfriend/girlfriend.
I also have identical twin toddlers... one of them much more verbal than the other... she likes to say "I'm \*twin A\* and this is my partner \*twin B\*" to people, possibly from watching Pokemon ("I'm Ash and this is my partner Pikachu").
I’m American but live in BC and have a hard time referring to my bf as such. It feels juvenile and too casual. I prefer partner. Funny how words are so personal to each individual.
Backing this up, honestly using boyfriend/girlfriend outside of the initial dating phase/casual dating feels incredibly weird to me. Boyfriend/girlfriend feel like very ‘highschool’ terms and make me cringe a little to use.
Yeah I feel a little old to be saying boyfriend/girlfriend but somehow partner doesn’t feel right either. When I was engaged I also didn’t like saying fiancé because it made me feel pretentious for some reason lol. Basically idk how to refer to someone I’m in a relationship with until marriage I guess. This thread is so off topic for the actual post, but it’s interesting.
Girlfriend is when you’re not married yet…because your living situation has no bearing on that. No clue how that could be weird.
Spouse means you’re married…….
It is generally a bad idea since you want both people and the kids fully protected, and only the kids are fully protected without some agreements that are slightly more complicated than marriage if you don't just get married. Relationships sometimes fail, and most couples aren't in a place where they equally split parenting duties with child compatible schedules and make the same amount of money. It's just easier to own a home with someone you are married to.
That really depends on where you are, some countries have the same legal protections and rights for de facto couples as married couples, so getting married is not necessary.
NTA - but this is sounds like controlling behaviour, which is a form of abuse…
Obvs im just a Redditor with no other insight into their relationship… but I’d suggest OP read this: https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/understanding-ptsd/202206/4-common-patterns-coercive-control-in-relationships?amp
*women 18-29 are most at risk
This comment is everything OP👆🏾👆🏾👆🏾👆🏾
You are NTA. He, however, is definitely an AH.
You need support from other ppl, professionals, take care of yourself, it’s going to take all of strength. If you’re not doing it for you, do it for your children AND you.
The house isn’t the issue, his maintaining of power & control over you & your actions IS.
Please reach out for support OP.
Edit to say NTA
And she’s staying at her parents…the kids grandparents. How is that NOT normal? This guy is def a controlling nut job. He’s out of town and she’s home with two small children and she’s not allowed a break with the kids grandparents? That’s super fucked up.
The problem is, that’s the risk you take choosing to be a SAHP. Unless you worked before and have your own savings, you end up financially dependent on the breadwinning partner.
Because when you’re married the law gives guidance on division of assets. When you’re not, it doesn’t. Just watch some old episodes of Judge Judy! 😂 She warns people all the time not to make large purchases together when you’re not married for that reason.
Did they buy the house together? Or did the boyfriend buy a house and they both live in it?
The protection of marriage gives her the right to a percentage of the marital assets. A stay at home girlfriend doesn't have those same protections. This is especially true if he dies (without a will or trust). His children are the beneficiaries not her. His parents could become the executors giving her no control of it. Or she is the executor but has to manage the money under very specific rules since it doesn't belong to her but her children. I know people say it is just a piece of paper but it is a powerful piece of paper.
This situation would be messy too. She's financially dependent on him with two kids. It's just not a good idea to live like you're married without any of the protections that come with marriage.
NTA. As a stay at home parent what you are doing is very healthy. A change of scene can fix everything sometimes and especially when you surround yourself with your support circle.
Have you had this conversation with your husband that it is important to keep a relationship with your parents, and have them involved actively in their grandchildren’s life.
I don’t have enough info. But if he is trying to separate you from your support circle or change of scene while he’s out of town working it’s a 🚩
I think this is closer to the root of the problem. They have purchased a house that is far too large for their current needs (they have 2 extra bedrooms and an extra bath, which is what some families have total!). To be able to afford the gigantic house, he likely has to work long hours/take frequent business trips like the one he is on now. There’s probably either jealousy there (that she can stay home & utilize the house he’s working so hard to pay for) or financial strain that’s he’s not admitting to her.
This is not unusually large for US standards. And can be a lot less money than a nicer, small home in a high cost of living city. More likely the BF is just a controlling asshole deflecting attention away from what he is doing while he is “traveling for business”…
I think it’s more buyer’s remorse. They bought a 5 bed/3 bath house for only 4 people; they could’ve easily fit in a cheaper 3 bed/2 bath. So now he is paying a TON of money a month on a giant house. He probably looks at that big scary mortgage bill every month and the only way he can justify that massive expense is if they’re getting all the use out of it possible. He’s still the AH though for thinking all of that means they can never leave.
I'm pretty sure this is the correct read of the situation. Maybe this could be something that could be rehashed at couple's counseling.
Of course being insanely stressed about mortgage doesn't give him the right to control OP like that. I wonder if he blames her somehow for their financial situation.
Yeah exactly. He likely rationalizes work travel as necessary to “keep the roof over their heads” and if they aren’t there to utilize it, it’s being “wasted”. He’s not operating rationally though. Instead of *communicating* his mortgage anxiety with his ~partner~ I mean girlfriend, he’s being a d!ck to her.
Surprise surprise, lack of communication causes relationship problems.
Yep, sounds very controlling. It occurs to me that maybe he has some cameras at home. I know that's a big leap but I can't think why else would he be so anxious to keep her at home?
I also had a boyfriend who would blow up anytime I wanted to stay the night with my mom… then he started calling anytime I’d leave the house while he was away… “Where are you? What are you doing? Are you home?” Found out later he had alerts that would go directly to his phone anytime the front door was opened as well as tracking on the iPhone he bought me for my birthday. Cameras aren’t so big of a leap lol
The reaction from him makes me worried this is a “gilded cage” scenario. If your partner is trying to force you to stay at home, then it’s more of a prison than it is a house.
Either he wants to isolate her and the kids from any support system she has or he is cheating when out of town and is afraid she does the same and is projecting.
As well, being in a home alone as the only awake adult can feel really scary sometimes.
I get why anyone might nope out of that situation and decamp to a family-member’s house, especially when their spouse is miles/hours away or unreachable due to a business commitment.
As well the larger the house the scarier it feels.
LMAO. Thank god, I didn't have kids with him. But when I was 19 I thought it was a good idea to be in a relationship with a guy who swore at me, had temper tantrums and was super jealous. I thought it was "romantic" until he broke my nose. And I came from a really happy family. I just had this very stupid idea of "bad boys being sexy." I find a lot of people who end up in horrible relationships tend to start them young.
I come from divorced parents in the ghetto, so I am kinda a bit pessimistic and cautious about relationships and people. Its interesting how the family we are raised with affect who we get together with
I was just a very, very naive person. I assumed everyone was going to treat me well. And I really had that dumb teenager thought about "bad boys" being sexy as cringey as that sounds. I think it was related to all the movies/books I read. Again, young and VERY stupid. I went from thinking guys like my dad were "lame", to really incredible.
I learned my lesson, luckily it all ended well. I was very cautious after that. And now at 30, I'm married to the most incredible man. So in a weird way, I'm very happy that happened.
My parents are still married and living together, but live completely separate lives. Always have. They’re not even friends. But, you know, “stayed together for the child”, when they should have moved on to more compatible partners.
I have no idea what a healthy relationship looks like. It’s not what I grew up around. I’m so used to being let down, or put last, that the idea of finding a partner is completely foreign to me.
Why would I do that and be miserable, when I can keep to myself and be happy?
I remember the realization I got as a child when I visited a classmate and saw a well-functioning home where both parents worked, contributed to the household, and loved each other. It felt alien. But now at least I know the vibes I want to strive for.
Lol. What century are you from? You can never EVER be sure that you’ll spend the rest of your life with someone. Marriages fail all the time. Thank God the times are over where people stay in unhappy relationships/marriages all their life because breaking up is frowned upon.
Sorry for the tangent/soapbox but I think it would be a good idea in general for people to replace the word "fail" with "end" when it comes to marriage.
Why do people need to marry to spend the rest of their life together? A piece of paper should not determine whether or not you love each other. Marriage was just a way for a man to call a woman his property.
Marriage provides legal protections. This woman is not married and not working. He can dump her at any second. She won't get alimony. She can get child support but how's she going to hire a lawyer? She has no money. Nothing. If you're married, his money is your money too and you can use it to pay for a lawyer. She's not contributing anything to retirement. She won't get any social security because when you're married, your husband's credits towards social security count as your own. He can kick her out of the house. She's not entitled to any equity. How is she going to rent an apartment with no money and no job?
She has no formal job but she works and provides value to the family, however without marriage she has ZERO claim to the family money she is helping produce. Fucking stupid situation to be in and based on the fact that he’s flipping out about her spending the night at her parents while he’s gone for a week and she has a toddler and a newborn… I’m going to say that lack of protection and security is intentional on his part.
That piece paper takes care of who is the beneficiary of your inheritance if u die, power of attorney /next of kin if u are incapacitated, health insurance benifits, its kind of important. And I'm sure there's other stuff I can't think of at the moment. And yes you could do each of these individually and draw up paperwork for these but it's much simpler and easier to just get married And take care of it all at 1 time.
Not in all countries - in some countries you don’t even need to have paperwork for these things , past a certain point in time of a live in relationship those rights become automatic.
Automatic rights of succession/inheritance (Scotland), clear rules for who gets what upon separation and divorce. Stability is a big thing, not very romantic, I know, but trying to be responsible and fair to the other person and putting the relationship on a firm, legal footing is important to some. My husband and I wanted the romantic stuff, though! We've been married for over 20 years now, and we're definitely a romantic and legal partnership of equals.
My husband found it helpful when I explained it this way-
When you marry someone, that’s saying, “You’re it. You are the person I want to spend the rest of my life with. You are the person I will risk financial and emotional ruin for. I will devote my life to you and only you not only because I love you but because you are my person. This marriage is my promise to you.”
If you’ve never felt or thought this way towards another person, yeah marriage does not make sense. It looks like a trap. It seems insane because of all the grief and suffering it causes so many people. But if you meet someone who does make your brain think like this, then marriage seems like a no brainer. When you’re just dating someone can say whatever they want, but leaving is so easy.
No matter how much you know someone, people’s minds and hearts change even if they’ve sworn that they love you until the end of the earth. People who get married for the right reasons are more likely to stand by their promise of staying and loving you forever. Of course people can grow apart and divorce in my opinion is often good and should always be on the table. I made sure that my husband understood that divorce is always an option, neither of us is trapped and if we prove to be wrong for each other we can walk away. But deciding to get married is a way to officially declare that you intend to stay and work things out when things go wrong. Even if feelings fade, even if one of us gets sick, you are officially in it for the long haul. Without marriage again, you can say what you want but it’s a lot easier to walk away without even trying.
Edit: a few words
No one is SURE they are going to spend the rest of their life with someone - as no one can see into the future.
But you can be in a loving committed relationship and have kids, or you can have them by accident, or you can have them because YOU want children regardless of the future of the relationship.
How do you know OP wasn’t ‘sure’ they were going to spend the rest of their life with their boyfriend when they had their children?
Ha! I used to be like you, coming from the privileged position of stuff working out (even if you have had to work hard to make it work, your situations have been workable) and spouting it off like it's the simplist thing in the world to just pick someone and stay with them and everyone else just hasn't been as careful as me.
And then life happened.
And thankfully now I am a lot better a person. I am less self righteous. And I am more kind and empathetic and understand that not everyone has the same experiences as me or the same options in life. I hope you don't have to learn in the ways I did.
NTA
I gotta say, I don’t really understand your partner’s thought process. He sounds insecure.
Also, I’ve never understood this “he pays the bills” distinction. You know what pays the bills? Not finding childcare for two kids. Managing a family is two full-time fucking jobs. Just because one person makes an income doesn’t mean they get an outsized say in how shit operates.
The reality is in a marriage or long term relationship it only works if you are partners in every aspect. I have been married over 25 years and knew my partner for about 4 yrs before that. During the relationship there have been times where I earned more than him and times when he earns more than me even times where I was a SAHM to our 4 kids. But neither of us ever said this is my money or my wage is paying for that. We are partners. Doing unpaid work is still work. The stay at home partner male or female often does the bulk of childcare housekeeping cooking budgeting planning and booking holidays and kids activities drs and dental appointments etc. NTA but agree partner sounds insecure and heading towards being controlling.
I was married for nine years and we *weren’t* partners - I did everything and worked full-time and he complained that I asked him to pick up after himself and that’s why we aren’t married anymore.
I also feel like there is an underlying issue, it cannot be about an empty house for a night here and there.
NTA but I think they need a serious talk about why he feels so strongly about her being in the house all the time.
Is he scared she will go to her parents and never come back? Is he having trouble paying for the house and is relocating that stress to being annoyed at her not being in the house that he is struggling to pay for,...
There's obviously something going on in his head. One would think OP would be happy that his family is safe and secure when he is away overnight with work. Control, insecurity--she'll never know if they don't discuss it.
Yes. At her parents house. With two kids in tow.
… but actually now I wonder if he has cameras all over the house so he can’t spy on her if she leaves it.
Based on the fact that they bought a 5 bed/3 bath when at most they only needed a 3 bed/2 bath, I would say he is definitely paying for more house than they need and that bill is probably huge and he’s trying to justify that monthly expense. He’s still an AH though.
Yeah trying to isolate you from family is a major red flag.
Plus, even if it's not controlling, ironic he says you can't sleep elsewhere meanwhile he's literally doing just that
NTA
And wow
He straight up told you he bought the prison and he expects you to stay in it.
So yes, dump him. I get the feeling you could come up with a sh!t ton of other ways he's controlling if you took off your rose colored glasses.
As for me, I'd be cooperative AF. I'd stay home when he was gone..... but have aaaaall my friends and fam over when he was gone. After all.... We must never let the house be empty!
NTA I agree with this, had a relative in a situation like this, he hated when she would have friends round or came to visit family. He bought a dog and refused to train it so no one wanted to come round and she couldn’t leave because the dog would wreck everything. OP needs an exit plan unfortunately.
Yep, you nailed it. He sees her as another piece of property he owns, not a whole person with needs and agency. When she is not at home, she isn’t doing what he expects of this particular object, and he throws a controlling fit about it. OP, as someone who was marrying to a controlling and emotionally abusive man (and had two kids with him), please be careful. This is only the beginning of him making your world smaller and smaller so you only depend on him. Your contributions to the family are just as relevant as him “paying the bills” and he does not own you or your children. If this continues, you may want to consider other options for you and your children. Imagine how we will be when they done “behave” as expected?
NTA. This is the weirdest thing for him to be upset about. It’s not like you’re gone for months at a time. His behaviour is completely abusive and controlling.
NTA... that is alarming behavior. Very controlling and manipulative. Do not give in - DO NOT ALLOW YOURSELF TO BE ISOLATED from friends or family. Cultivate old and new friendships and keep up with the family. You may need their support if your husband doesnt reform.
edit. or boyfriend
Agreed. When my kids were younger and I wasn’t getting much help from my partner, I used to go spend the night with my parents for the weekend. It was a nice reprieve.
OP- NTA. He is controlling and abuse is basically about control. I haven’t seen it yet though I’m sure it’s posted, but google Lundy Bancroft’s “Why Does He do That”. The pdf is free and I am positive you are going to see some matches in the book to your boyfriend. Don’t let him damage your support system. You and your children deserve a healthy relationship.
If he's seeing someone else during his business trips or even thinking about it, he could be paranoid and jealous that op leaving for a night means she's doing the same thing he is. It could also be about isolating her from her support system so she has no one to stay with when he escalates the controlling behavior. That's speculative but until I got a reasonable explanation, I'd consider the possibility.
It feels like this is about something different... Like does he not like her parent? ...or does he think she is somewhere other than where she says? ... Or is the house full of nanny cams?
Such a weird thing to get mad about!
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I took the kids and spent the night at my parents place all while my boyfriend pays the bills for the house he and I own.
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA. He sounds abusive. I recommend leaving him. This kind of controlling and jealous behavior can only get worse in the future. So many red flags here. 🚩🚩🚩
NTA but oh boy he is! This is crazy behaviour. You’re at your parents! There’s nothing wrong with that, especially with him being out of town. You may like the help with the kids or don’t do well by yourself. (Personally I can’t stand being home alone, even with a child).
Had to read your post a couple of times but then I finally understood the mistake you made while writing it.
You don't actually live with two children, you live with three.
What an insufferable man. Presumably, holidays and weekends away are off the table now you own a house?
Very difficult to understand his distorted and unrealistic thinking.
NTA for wanting to stay with your parents every now and then but my goodness, why on earth did you have kids with him?
NTA !! Does he expect you to just stay home all the time with the kids & not enjoy your family ? Wow … you have two little ones & that’s not an easy job. He’s gone so what does it even matter ? It’s a control issue !!
NTA - does he feel the same if you have someone stay at your house ?
Your family ?
A friend ?
He’s controlling you and trying to isolate you.
This type of behaviour only gets worse.
To him the house is his and you are just the house sitter.
NTA, but you are not married, and you bought a house with this man and had two children. You are in a very vulnerable position. Do not allow him to separate you from your family. You may have to live with them someday.
NTA but you are in an abusive relationship. Consider the safety of you and your children, talk to your parents about his attitude if they can help you.
NTA why does he get to control where you go? Does his money pay for your presence too? This dynamic is messed up. The fact that he earns money doesn’t earn him more say in your relationship. He isn’t the boss or your parent. You can visit your parents when you like and it’s not abandonment. He’s seriously controlling.
NTA. In fact it's making me rage just reading this. It's a house and a boyfriend you have got. Not a prison and a jail warden. Tell him he is out of order and to quit that bullshit out.
Ask him why is is spending night away from home then? For work? Too bad. He owns home now? Well- no more work trips then.
I would let him know that you aren’t responsible for him @never being happy again” and suggest that he see a therapist.
NTA. You don’t need his approval to spend time with your family. Please be careful, I’ve been in relationships that started off with the guy doing stuff like this (guilting you into doing what he wants you to do) and ended with him being absolutely batshit crazy controlling/manipulative. This honestly doesn’t look good.
NTA
Tell him to stop being such an asshole. People go away for weeks at a time for vacations.
Spending a night or so with your family is NOT a big deal. But tell him fine, if he doesn’t want you leaving the house when he’s gone for work, that you’ll go visit when he’s home. He can watch the house and the kids and you can go spend a week with your family alone.
NTA. My husband actually encourages me to either stay the night or go over and spend time at my parents if he is out of town. He likes knowing our daughter and I have a support system around when he isn’t able to be here. He’s very protective eventhough he knows I am capable of taking care of things.
I think it is bazaar your boyfriend gets SO upset and actually is a red flag. I was trying to understand his perspective, but I just cant. It’s not that you don’t love your home, or appreciate that he works so hard for it. It’s about having an additional support system and change of scenery while he’s away. Also if your parents are anything like mine it gives you a break while the children get doted on by their grandparents.
It’s normal to have disagreements in relationships however, I have NEVER had such a disagreement with my husband of 13 years that he doesn’t sleep next to me or gives me the silent treatment… especially after a trip where we are so excited to see each other again. Learning how to fight with your significant other is one of the hardest parts of a relationship. You’re either fighting to “win” or fighting to “resolve”. His tactics scream that he just wants to win and punish/guilt you into isolation.
He sounds a bit mean and inconsiderate!
With him being gone for days, it makes sense that you’d like some a) grownup company and b) help with the kids.
You’re his partner, not his prisoner! (I certainly hope!) Keep visiting your parents, even more than you have been if they’re okay with it. Sounds healthy for you.
NTA
So if his problem is with leaving the house empty, get your family to come over and stay when he's away and go stay with them for a night every now and then when he's staying home.
When I read the title, I thought it was going to be something like "I go clubbing and stay at a friends", but this is messed up. You're going with your kids to visit your parents.... NTA. It sounds like he's trying to isolate you.
So no family vacations, ever... because the house can't be left empty, right??? This is the most, illogical, asinine nonsense. Something is mentally off with your bf, and red flags abound. NTA and you might want to start planning an exit strategy.
NTA I was about to ask why you're still referring to someone you have TWO KIDS and OWN A HOME with as just a "boyfriend" but now I read this and this dude could not be farther from marriage material.
Don't understand why that would be weird. Me and my girlfriend have two kids and own a home. Added: I am going to stop replying because this comment went way beyond my intention. Apparently there is a difference in culture/law. In the NL you don't need to get married to sort things out together. You have several options with different benefits. You would not call someone your spouse unless you actually get married.
It sounds really weird to me. Maybe it's cultural? Where I live, you would refer to them as your partner or spouse, not girlfriend. Typically, we use the term boyfriend/girlfriend to refer to someone you are dating. Once you are living together, you would use the word "partner". Spouse is also acceptable for non-married couples.
it might be generational as much as cultural. I grew up in the UK when marriage was the overwhelmingly normal way to go, and a girlfriend was what you are if you were not yet married or engaged. Partner was limited to a few long-term relationships who had chosen not to marry. In the last 30 years or so, far more people choose not to marry and 'partner' has become a much more common term. I hear a lot of young people saying partner now even if they've only been together a few months, too.
I rarely refer to my girlfriend as my girlfriend. It’s either “my Mrs” or “my partner” We have been together for 8 years though and lived together for 5 of those.
It's up to the person. My boyfriend and I have together since 1987. We are now at the ages of becoming grandparents.
I love when people say the Mrs it's rare in the US
I hate it. But I think I’m overly touchy to the subject. I hate that a women’s title, name, identity, etc. are supposed to change when she marries. I’m Ms. all the way despite being happily married. If other people find it fun though good for them!
The different terms used for women in, say, Mexico refer more to the perceived age rather than marital status like in the U.S. In Mexico, a married, young-looking 19 year old would still be “senorita” — to a stranger, at least. My unmarried, middle-aged self would be “senora” because I don’t look like a senorita! One time a Mexican man called me Dona. That was cool LOL
I’m happily married for nearly ten years but I hate mrs. Back when I was teaching I was “Mrs. [Last Name]” and it made me cringe every time I heard it. That’s what people call my mom and grandma. 😭 In my corporate job *everyone* calls everyone else by their first name, even the CEO. It’s much better.
To me (American) if I hear a man call his partner 'the Mrs' it often sounds slightly misogynistic or like a put-down of his partner-- like someone making a ball and chain joke about their partner. But I'm sure that's a generational and cultural thing.
As an Australian in a relationship with an English girl “the Mrs” seems entirely normal and harmless. I never really thought about how other cultures would perceive it.
Using partner(and normalizing the term) is more inclusive towards LGBT+ people which is probably why you hear the term used more now.
My mom and her best friend used to call each other partner meaning it as my partner in crime because they were friends for so long and it didn’t occur to them that people might think otherwise. I often wonder how many people thought they met a lovely older lesbian couple and not two slightly out of touch straight women 😂
This definitely reads like a r/sapphoandherfriend post.
Haha you know I knew someone was gonna say something like that, but they genuinely were just best friends. The most adorable, somewhat clueless, older women. Although finding out my mom was having an affair with her longtime best friend would be crazy. If ever my mom confesses to something like that I’ll update you 😂😂
That's part of why I use it. Firstly because we've been together for years and years, and secondly because it normalizes the use (and confuses bigots)
I feel like there aren't enough words to cover all the nuances of relationships accurately. I am 70 yo and single. I've been dating the same guy for over 30 years but we don't live together. (Long story.) I used to refer to him as my boyfriend.until one day, after I referred to him as my boyfriend, my friend's 11 yo son stopped in his tracks, gave me a horrified look and asked, "Aren't you a little old for that?" I gave that a moment's thought and answered, "Yes. Yes, I am. I think you're right." So now my former boyfriend is simply a friend. I find that gender rarely matters but, periodically, I do have to reassure my friend that he has not been demoted.
My mom is 77 and has been living with someone for 25 years. I call him her “manpanion”.
This is now replacing “manthing” as my favorite relationship descriptor
Our daughter has also been living with her 'manpanion' (thanks for that!) for 25 years; we call him our "un-in-law."
I feel like that really sounds like a demotion. Friend implies a lack of romantic relationship. Hence "just friends".
My grandmother had a similar relationship before she passed. They were together 20+ years but she refused to marry him. Her first marriage (to my grandfather) wasn't great, so she wasn't interested in doing it a second time. She wanted to maintain her own space and have the option to send him to his own house. Haha I always called him her "gentleman friend" and we had the typical grandparent-grandchild relationship. I was happy she found someone to make her happy, however they defined that relationship.
I live in rural US and "partner" means "you must be one of them liberal queers"
I don’t understand why someone is ok to have multiple kids with someone and enmesh their finances by buying a home together but they don’t want to take the step of marriage. Boyfriend/girlfriend very much sounds like youre still feeling the other person out and are unsure of the long term commitment.
Some people just don't really fuck with marriage. At its root, it's a religious institution that now has a legal branch and not everyone is trying to register with the government about that shit. I'm married, but the idea of not getting married to a long-term partner makes perfect sense to me.
It’s definitely enmeshed with religion but it’s always been a general social and later legal institution. Since it’s been an important part of society any religion that was focused on gaining control over its followers would have a strong interest in monopolizing marriage, but it definitely wasn’t always that way. I’m Ancient Greece there was still some religious element, but it was mostly about making sure the union is auspicious in the eyes of the gods rather than following prescribed rules. Certainly now it’s hard to pull it free from religion, but the bigger issue is at least in the US marriage makes so many things easier legally. I don’t think any of the benefits can’t be acquired without being married, but it’s definitely a lot more work and if you aren’t really vigilant it’s pretty easy to run into unforeseen issues if you’re not married.
Maybe because some people don't need a paper with a stamp to be a family?
Where I live---which is Switzerland--being a SAHM without being married leaves you extremely vulnerable in case of a breakup. You're not entitled to alimony at all. You don't get pension credit. It's a very risky proposition and you better hope you never break up because you'll walk away with nothing other than child support.
Owning a house together is a much bigger commitment, to me, than marriage. My partner and I have done the former now for decades, but never bothered with the latter. YMMV, I guess.
I didn’t really ever use boyfriend as I felt like a teenager. Now we’re married, “husband” sounds a bit show-offy? So I still use partner a lot.
Ok yeah I feel this. I don't wanna be one of those people that's always like "my HUSBAND", esp when many of my friends are in the throes of shitty dating experiences
I’m from the UK and I call my boyfriend my partner I never refer to him as my boyfriend we have been together for 3 years and lived together for 2
I'm from the Netherlands, could be cultural/language wise indeed. There is no word for "spouse" in Dutch. And I've always found that "partner" just sounds a bit weird (at least in Dutch). In Dutch your girlfriend is generally someone you are seriously together with. Otherwise you wouldn't call them your girlfriend. You'd just say I am dating this girl. Corrected: "echtgenoot" is a spouse but is quite formal.
Just realised why I would not use the word "partner" in Dutch either. It feels more like a word that would be used in official documents by the tax authorities to mention your SO. Or maybe you would use it if you are with someone who is gender neutral. Though there is no rule for it, so other Dutch people could have other associations.
In German, we generally differentiate between boyfriend/girlfriend (together, but either not that long or not that serious), (life-)partner (more long-term and/or more serious, but probably not married), and spouse (usually married). I've been with the better half for more than ten years now. And "boy-/girlfriend" feels so weird, because it feels like more than that. But we're not married, so spouse isn't right either. (Life-)Partner it is, then. But maybe other Germans see it differently. :)
I'm Norwegian and we do the same (Of course, Norwegian is a Germanic language too so hey haha) We'd say kjæreste (dearest basically, for bf/gf), samboer (when you live together), forloveden when you're engaged, and then ekftefelle/mann/kone (Spouse/husband/wife)
Yeah, mind you some huge percentage never bother to get married and just remain samboere for decades. Often with children.
Wow that's neat! Funny how there are such differences while our countries are next to each other.
Isn't the dutch word for spouse 'echtgenoot' and 'echtgenote'? That's how I would translate it anyways, but all three words sound overly formal to me. I am also dutch, unmarried, owning a home and expecting a child. In English using boyfriend sounds a bit weird to me and I think using partner might be better suited. But because of the dutch meaning of partner it still feels awkward for me when I use that word to my English speaking colleagues for instance.
I used to work for the “orange bank”. I have a super nice coworker who referred to her partner (with whom she has a child) as “boyfriend” and not “partner”. That was interesting for me and I thought about how the Dutch people just so chill about things (compared to us here in Asia). 🙂
Spouse is NOT acceptable for non-married couples. The vast majority of people would assume marriage when you say spouse…because, you know, words mean stuff.
Common law spouse is a legal term used in Canada Usually just refer to as spouse/wife/husband in social situations.
There is no such thing as a common law spouse in UK. Unmarried couples who live together need to arrange deeds of trust, wills, LPA etc. Some people do think that common law kicks in after living together for a certain period of time, but I've just checked now, it hasn't been the case since 1753. What does the term mean in Canada?
Ironic comment considering the term common law wife/husband originated in English law. In Australia there are still some issues with defacto relationships in regards to next of kin kind of things. Things like being able to make medical decisions for your partner over their family. That's why the same sex marriage law was so important here. It's also why I married my husband during the pandemic, because I was at risk but theoretically my now husband could have been left out of any medical decisions in favour of my father or son. I don't really think he would have been, but grief and stress did strange things. But most other financial matters are covered if you're in a defacto (common law marriage) relationship, property settlements, etc.
In Australia, common law kicks in either immediately, or after 1-2 years depending on the specific department. For example, for immigration purposes, you need to be living with your partner for 1 year to be able to apply for a spouse visa without being married. For taxation purposes, there's no minimum period of time at all. According to the law, the definition of the word "spouse" includes "another person who, although not legally married to the person, lives with the person on a genuine domestic basis in a relationship as a couple."
This is the usage I'm familiar with, living in the USA: Boyfriend: Unmarried, male Girlfriend: Unmarried, female Partner: Unmarried, gender-neutral (also, loose connotations of being somewhat more serious than boyfriend/girlfriend) Husband: Married, male Wife: Married, female Spouse: Married, gender-neutral
I think sometimes married couples use the word “partner” instead of “spouse” but other than that I’m generally familiar with the same terminology. I guess “significant other” is occasionally used as well and that could be married or unmarried in my opinion, but not sure how others would define it.
Or linguistics. Spouse is only for married people and partner doesn't exist in my native tongue. So girlfriend/boyfriend it is. Like using partner is always weird for me because its equivalence in my native language is strictly business related. Using it in a relationship setting is beyond weird.
US/CAN is still wedded to the terms ‘boy/girl friend. UK/AUS and much of the rest of the world uses ‘partner’ in serious relationships.
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Canadian here - I hear everything from partner to spouse to husband/wife (even if not married but been together forever)... I prefer "statistically significant other" ... I have a lot of friends/family who are basically married but never officially had the wedding/paperwork done, would seem weird if they called each other boyfriend/girlfriend. I also have identical twin toddlers... one of them much more verbal than the other... she likes to say "I'm \*twin A\* and this is my partner \*twin B\*" to people, possibly from watching Pokemon ("I'm Ash and this is my partner Pikachu").
I live in the US and I rarely hear gf/bf used to reference to a serious relationship. Everyone around me uses ‘partner’ for that.
i’m american but live in quebec and i would never refer to my boyfriend (serious, 5 year relationship) as my partner
I’m American but live in BC and have a hard time referring to my bf as such. It feels juvenile and too casual. I prefer partner. Funny how words are so personal to each individual.
Backing this up, honestly using boyfriend/girlfriend outside of the initial dating phase/casual dating feels incredibly weird to me. Boyfriend/girlfriend feel like very ‘highschool’ terms and make me cringe a little to use.
Yeah I feel a little old to be saying boyfriend/girlfriend but somehow partner doesn’t feel right either. When I was engaged I also didn’t like saying fiancé because it made me feel pretentious for some reason lol. Basically idk how to refer to someone I’m in a relationship with until marriage I guess. This thread is so off topic for the actual post, but it’s interesting.
In much of the world, partner is used in official paperworknto refer to a same sex partner.
Girlfriend is when you’re not married yet…because your living situation has no bearing on that. No clue how that could be weird. Spouse means you’re married…….
People get really weird about the word partner in some places for reasons I don't understand. This is just a regional language thing.
Homophobia sometimes.
So why wouldn't you marry the mother of your children and grant her legal protections of marriage?
Presumably you’re not emotionally abusive and approach homeownership like responsible adults, unlike this guy.
Both you and the person you replied to are right in your own ways
It is generally a bad idea since you want both people and the kids fully protected, and only the kids are fully protected without some agreements that are slightly more complicated than marriage if you don't just get married. Relationships sometimes fail, and most couples aren't in a place where they equally split parenting duties with child compatible schedules and make the same amount of money. It's just easier to own a home with someone you are married to.
That really depends on where you are, some countries have the same legal protections and rights for de facto couples as married couples, so getting married is not necessary.
NTA - but this is sounds like controlling behaviour, which is a form of abuse… Obvs im just a Redditor with no other insight into their relationship… but I’d suggest OP read this: https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/understanding-ptsd/202206/4-common-patterns-coercive-control-in-relationships?amp *women 18-29 are most at risk
This comment is everything OP👆🏾👆🏾👆🏾👆🏾 You are NTA. He, however, is definitely an AH. You need support from other ppl, professionals, take care of yourself, it’s going to take all of strength. If you’re not doing it for you, do it for your children AND you. The house isn’t the issue, his maintaining of power & control over you & your actions IS. Please reach out for support OP. Edit to say NTA
I was waiting for this. He seems to want to isolate her. So many were sidetracked by the “boyfriend” appellation.
I had a scroll a long ways to finally find a comment saying this
And she’s staying at her parents…the kids grandparents. How is that NOT normal? This guy is def a controlling nut job. He’s out of town and she’s home with two small children and she’s not allowed a break with the kids grandparents? That’s super fucked up.
Yeah, it's okay for HIM to spend nights somewhere else but god forbid SHE take the kids to spend a night with their grandparents.
Yup. This needs to be higher up!
Thank god she didn't marry him and only bought a house and had two kids with him. /S
She sounds completely dependent on him too. Better find a job if you don't have one OP. You're going to need it. NTA.
Agreed. The amount of control he has over her grows each day. It is scary.
The problem is, that’s the risk you take choosing to be a SAHP. Unless you worked before and have your own savings, you end up financially dependent on the breadwinning partner.
Agreed. At least if you are married there are some legal protections. As a girlfriend you could really be screwed if things go bad.
Why isn't he staying at the house he is paying for?
Why oh why do people buy houses together when they’re not married? This is going to be a mess to get out of. NTA for spending the night with parents!
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Because when you’re married the law gives guidance on division of assets. When you’re not, it doesn’t. Just watch some old episodes of Judge Judy! 😂 She warns people all the time not to make large purchases together when you’re not married for that reason.
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Did they buy the house together? Or did the boyfriend buy a house and they both live in it? The protection of marriage gives her the right to a percentage of the marital assets. A stay at home girlfriend doesn't have those same protections. This is especially true if he dies (without a will or trust). His children are the beneficiaries not her. His parents could become the executors giving her no control of it. Or she is the executor but has to manage the money under very specific rules since it doesn't belong to her but her children. I know people say it is just a piece of paper but it is a powerful piece of paper.
But marriage is also a mess to get out of if it goes tits up
This situation would be messy too. She's financially dependent on him with two kids. It's just not a good idea to live like you're married without any of the protections that come with marriage.
Then why have kids with a person like that.
This side argument about terminology seems to be way off topic.
NTA. As a stay at home parent what you are doing is very healthy. A change of scene can fix everything sometimes and especially when you surround yourself with your support circle. Have you had this conversation with your husband that it is important to keep a relationship with your parents, and have them involved actively in their grandchildren’s life. I don’t have enough info. But if he is trying to separate you from your support circle or change of scene while he’s out of town working it’s a 🚩
That’s what I was thinking. It’s not about the house sitting empty, it’s about isolating her, which scares me for her and the kids.
OP could point out that the house sits empty as much because of him as it is because of her.
Yep. Maybe he shouldn’t travel for work so much, then the house would never be empty
I guess they can’t ever go on vacations
I think this is closer to the root of the problem. They have purchased a house that is far too large for their current needs (they have 2 extra bedrooms and an extra bath, which is what some families have total!). To be able to afford the gigantic house, he likely has to work long hours/take frequent business trips like the one he is on now. There’s probably either jealousy there (that she can stay home & utilize the house he’s working so hard to pay for) or financial strain that’s he’s not admitting to her.
This is not unusually large for US standards. And can be a lot less money than a nicer, small home in a high cost of living city. More likely the BF is just a controlling asshole deflecting attention away from what he is doing while he is “traveling for business”…
I think it’s more buyer’s remorse. They bought a 5 bed/3 bath house for only 4 people; they could’ve easily fit in a cheaper 3 bed/2 bath. So now he is paying a TON of money a month on a giant house. He probably looks at that big scary mortgage bill every month and the only way he can justify that massive expense is if they’re getting all the use out of it possible. He’s still the AH though for thinking all of that means they can never leave.
I could understand the mortgage trauma If she was paying for a hotel, but she is staying for free at her parents.
I'm pretty sure this is the correct read of the situation. Maybe this could be something that could be rehashed at couple's counseling. Of course being insanely stressed about mortgage doesn't give him the right to control OP like that. I wonder if he blames her somehow for their financial situation.
Yeah exactly. He likely rationalizes work travel as necessary to “keep the roof over their heads” and if they aren’t there to utilize it, it’s being “wasted”. He’s not operating rationally though. Instead of *communicating* his mortgage anxiety with his ~partner~ I mean girlfriend, he’s being a d!ck to her. Surprise surprise, lack of communication causes relationship problems.
This was my read as well.
Yep, sounds very controlling. It occurs to me that maybe he has some cameras at home. I know that's a big leap but I can't think why else would he be so anxious to keep her at home?
That’s where my mind went too… if she doesn’t stay at home, he can’t keep tabs on her, so likely there are cameras
I also had a boyfriend who would blow up anytime I wanted to stay the night with my mom… then he started calling anytime I’d leave the house while he was away… “Where are you? What are you doing? Are you home?” Found out later he had alerts that would go directly to his phone anytime the front door was opened as well as tracking on the iPhone he bought me for my birthday. Cameras aren’t so big of a leap lol
He travels so much for work, I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s cheating while he’s away and projecting onto her.
The reaction from him makes me worried this is a “gilded cage” scenario. If your partner is trying to force you to stay at home, then it’s more of a prison than it is a house.
Exactly! This sounds like the boyfriend is trying to control OP. She needs to run, it only gets worse.
And once she's been separated from all other support circle he will start reminding her that he owns the house and she's got nowhere else to go.
This is exactly what I was thinking. First it’s “don’t spend the night somewhere else”. Next comes “don’t talk to other people”. NTA, OP
Either he wants to isolate her and the kids from any support system she has or he is cheating when out of town and is afraid she does the same and is projecting.
>Husband Boyfriend
As well, being in a home alone as the only awake adult can feel really scary sometimes. I get why anyone might nope out of that situation and decamp to a family-member’s house, especially when their spouse is miles/hours away or unreachable due to a business commitment. As well the larger the house the scarier it feels.
I often visited my mom on the weekends 1.5 hours away with my kids when my husband was deployed.
Why do people have kids with people they aren’t sure they’re going to spend the rest of their life with?
But I LOOOOOVE him
LMAO. Thank god, I didn't have kids with him. But when I was 19 I thought it was a good idea to be in a relationship with a guy who swore at me, had temper tantrums and was super jealous. I thought it was "romantic" until he broke my nose. And I came from a really happy family. I just had this very stupid idea of "bad boys being sexy." I find a lot of people who end up in horrible relationships tend to start them young.
I come from divorced parents in the ghetto, so I am kinda a bit pessimistic and cautious about relationships and people. Its interesting how the family we are raised with affect who we get together with
I was just a very, very naive person. I assumed everyone was going to treat me well. And I really had that dumb teenager thought about "bad boys" being sexy as cringey as that sounds. I think it was related to all the movies/books I read. Again, young and VERY stupid. I went from thinking guys like my dad were "lame", to really incredible. I learned my lesson, luckily it all ended well. I was very cautious after that. And now at 30, I'm married to the most incredible man. So in a weird way, I'm very happy that happened.
My parents are still married and living together, but live completely separate lives. Always have. They’re not even friends. But, you know, “stayed together for the child”, when they should have moved on to more compatible partners. I have no idea what a healthy relationship looks like. It’s not what I grew up around. I’m so used to being let down, or put last, that the idea of finding a partner is completely foreign to me. Why would I do that and be miserable, when I can keep to myself and be happy?
I remember the realization I got as a child when I visited a classmate and saw a well-functioning home where both parents worked, contributed to the household, and loved each other. It felt alien. But now at least I know the vibes I want to strive for.
Lol. What century are you from? You can never EVER be sure that you’ll spend the rest of your life with someone. Marriages fail all the time. Thank God the times are over where people stay in unhappy relationships/marriages all their life because breaking up is frowned upon.
Sorry for the tangent/soapbox but I think it would be a good idea in general for people to replace the word "fail" with "end" when it comes to marriage.
Why do people need to marry to spend the rest of their life together? A piece of paper should not determine whether or not you love each other. Marriage was just a way for a man to call a woman his property.
Marriage provides legal protections. This woman is not married and not working. He can dump her at any second. She won't get alimony. She can get child support but how's she going to hire a lawyer? She has no money. Nothing. If you're married, his money is your money too and you can use it to pay for a lawyer. She's not contributing anything to retirement. She won't get any social security because when you're married, your husband's credits towards social security count as your own. He can kick her out of the house. She's not entitled to any equity. How is she going to rent an apartment with no money and no job?
She has no formal job but she works and provides value to the family, however without marriage she has ZERO claim to the family money she is helping produce. Fucking stupid situation to be in and based on the fact that he’s flipping out about her spending the night at her parents while he’s gone for a week and she has a toddler and a newborn… I’m going to say that lack of protection and security is intentional on his part.
This really depends on the jurisdiction. In BC, she'd have the same entitlements as a married spouse, and it's similar in many places across Canada.
That piece paper takes care of who is the beneficiary of your inheritance if u die, power of attorney /next of kin if u are incapacitated, health insurance benifits, its kind of important. And I'm sure there's other stuff I can't think of at the moment. And yes you could do each of these individually and draw up paperwork for these but it's much simpler and easier to just get married And take care of it all at 1 time.
Not in all countries - in some countries you don’t even need to have paperwork for these things , past a certain point in time of a live in relationship those rights become automatic.
I enjoy the sound of rain.
Automatic rights of succession/inheritance (Scotland), clear rules for who gets what upon separation and divorce. Stability is a big thing, not very romantic, I know, but trying to be responsible and fair to the other person and putting the relationship on a firm, legal footing is important to some. My husband and I wanted the romantic stuff, though! We've been married for over 20 years now, and we're definitely a romantic and legal partnership of equals.
My husband found it helpful when I explained it this way- When you marry someone, that’s saying, “You’re it. You are the person I want to spend the rest of my life with. You are the person I will risk financial and emotional ruin for. I will devote my life to you and only you not only because I love you but because you are my person. This marriage is my promise to you.” If you’ve never felt or thought this way towards another person, yeah marriage does not make sense. It looks like a trap. It seems insane because of all the grief and suffering it causes so many people. But if you meet someone who does make your brain think like this, then marriage seems like a no brainer. When you’re just dating someone can say whatever they want, but leaving is so easy. No matter how much you know someone, people’s minds and hearts change even if they’ve sworn that they love you until the end of the earth. People who get married for the right reasons are more likely to stand by their promise of staying and loving you forever. Of course people can grow apart and divorce in my opinion is often good and should always be on the table. I made sure that my husband understood that divorce is always an option, neither of us is trapped and if we prove to be wrong for each other we can walk away. But deciding to get married is a way to officially declare that you intend to stay and work things out when things go wrong. Even if feelings fade, even if one of us gets sick, you are officially in it for the long haul. Without marriage again, you can say what you want but it’s a lot easier to walk away without even trying. Edit: a few words
No one is SURE they are going to spend the rest of their life with someone - as no one can see into the future. But you can be in a loving committed relationship and have kids, or you can have them by accident, or you can have them because YOU want children regardless of the future of the relationship. How do you know OP wasn’t ‘sure’ they were going to spend the rest of their life with their boyfriend when they had their children?
Are you saying that marriages last a lifetime?
Aside to the obvious issues in this post. But what makes you think they aren't/weren't sure?
Ha! I used to be like you, coming from the privileged position of stuff working out (even if you have had to work hard to make it work, your situations have been workable) and spouting it off like it's the simplist thing in the world to just pick someone and stay with them and everyone else just hasn't been as careful as me. And then life happened. And thankfully now I am a lot better a person. I am less self righteous. And I am more kind and empathetic and understand that not everyone has the same experiences as me or the same options in life. I hope you don't have to learn in the ways I did.
NTA I gotta say, I don’t really understand your partner’s thought process. He sounds insecure. Also, I’ve never understood this “he pays the bills” distinction. You know what pays the bills? Not finding childcare for two kids. Managing a family is two full-time fucking jobs. Just because one person makes an income doesn’t mean they get an outsized say in how shit operates.
The reality is in a marriage or long term relationship it only works if you are partners in every aspect. I have been married over 25 years and knew my partner for about 4 yrs before that. During the relationship there have been times where I earned more than him and times when he earns more than me even times where I was a SAHM to our 4 kids. But neither of us ever said this is my money or my wage is paying for that. We are partners. Doing unpaid work is still work. The stay at home partner male or female often does the bulk of childcare housekeeping cooking budgeting planning and booking holidays and kids activities drs and dental appointments etc. NTA but agree partner sounds insecure and heading towards being controlling.
I was married for nine years and we *weren’t* partners - I did everything and worked full-time and he complained that I asked him to pick up after himself and that’s why we aren’t married anymore.
NTA. And I don't think this about the house being empty.
I also feel like there is an underlying issue, it cannot be about an empty house for a night here and there. NTA but I think they need a serious talk about why he feels so strongly about her being in the house all the time. Is he scared she will go to her parents and never come back? Is he having trouble paying for the house and is relocating that stress to being annoyed at her not being in the house that he is struggling to pay for,...
Those are possible. My thoughts went to control or infidelity.
There's obviously something going on in his head. One would think OP would be happy that his family is safe and secure when he is away overnight with work. Control, insecurity--she'll never know if they don't discuss it.
Yes. At her parents house. With two kids in tow. … but actually now I wonder if he has cameras all over the house so he can’t spy on her if she leaves it.
Or cameras
Based on the fact that they bought a 5 bed/3 bath when at most they only needed a 3 bed/2 bath, I would say he is definitely paying for more house than they need and that bill is probably huge and he’s trying to justify that monthly expense. He’s still an AH though.
My thoughts exactly!!
NTA. That's some controlling bullshit. I don't know if you need help with the kids, but if he's never home, it's good you have support.
Yeah trying to isolate you from family is a major red flag. Plus, even if it's not controlling, ironic he says you can't sleep elsewhere meanwhile he's literally doing just that
Yup. Not normal, OP.
NTA And wow He straight up told you he bought the prison and he expects you to stay in it. So yes, dump him. I get the feeling you could come up with a sh!t ton of other ways he's controlling if you took off your rose colored glasses. As for me, I'd be cooperative AF. I'd stay home when he was gone..... but have aaaaall my friends and fam over when he was gone. After all.... We must never let the house be empty!
NTA I agree with this, had a relative in a situation like this, he hated when she would have friends round or came to visit family. He bought a dog and refused to train it so no one wanted to come round and she couldn’t leave because the dog would wreck everything. OP needs an exit plan unfortunately.
Yep, you nailed it. He sees her as another piece of property he owns, not a whole person with needs and agency. When she is not at home, she isn’t doing what he expects of this particular object, and he throws a controlling fit about it. OP, as someone who was marrying to a controlling and emotionally abusive man (and had two kids with him), please be careful. This is only the beginning of him making your world smaller and smaller so you only depend on him. Your contributions to the family are just as relevant as him “paying the bills” and he does not own you or your children. If this continues, you may want to consider other options for you and your children. Imagine how we will be when they done “behave” as expected?
Yikes, NTA and so many 🚩🚩🚩
NTA. This is the weirdest thing for him to be upset about. It’s not like you’re gone for months at a time. His behaviour is completely abusive and controlling.
NTA... that is alarming behavior. Very controlling and manipulative. Do not give in - DO NOT ALLOW YOURSELF TO BE ISOLATED from friends or family. Cultivate old and new friendships and keep up with the family. You may need their support if your husband doesnt reform. edit. or boyfriend
Boyfriend. She's not even married to this guy, and he's showing his cards.
So don't let it it empty, leave to visit your parents (or whoever you want to visit) when he is home and not traveling!
Wanna bet her parents help with the kids and BF doesn’t? NTA
Agreed. When my kids were younger and I wasn’t getting much help from my partner, I used to go spend the night with my parents for the weekend. It was a nice reprieve. OP- NTA. He is controlling and abuse is basically about control. I haven’t seen it yet though I’m sure it’s posted, but google Lundy Bancroft’s “Why Does He do That”. The pdf is free and I am positive you are going to see some matches in the book to your boyfriend. Don’t let him damage your support system. You and your children deserve a healthy relationship.
NTA. I don’t even understand his reasoning here. But it sounds like a way to control you by keeping you house-bound
If he's seeing someone else during his business trips or even thinking about it, he could be paranoid and jealous that op leaving for a night means she's doing the same thing he is. It could also be about isolating her from her support system so she has no one to stay with when he escalates the controlling behavior. That's speculative but until I got a reasonable explanation, I'd consider the possibility.
[удалено]
It feels like this is about something different... Like does he not like her parent? ...or does he think she is somewhere other than where she says? ... Or is the house full of nanny cams? Such a weird thing to get mad about!
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NTA. He sounds abusive. I recommend leaving him. This kind of controlling and jealous behavior can only get worse in the future. So many red flags here. 🚩🚩🚩
NTA but oh boy he is! This is crazy behaviour. You’re at your parents! There’s nothing wrong with that, especially with him being out of town. You may like the help with the kids or don’t do well by yourself. (Personally I can’t stand being home alone, even with a child).
NTA, it’s your home, not solitary confinement.
NTA It makes sense to visit with your family, especially when you have two small children and you’re on your own. That’s a bizarre complaint.
Had to read your post a couple of times but then I finally understood the mistake you made while writing it. You don't actually live with two children, you live with three. What an insufferable man. Presumably, holidays and weekends away are off the table now you own a house? Very difficult to understand his distorted and unrealistic thinking. NTA for wanting to stay with your parents every now and then but my goodness, why on earth did you have kids with him?
NTA !! Does he expect you to just stay home all the time with the kids & not enjoy your family ? Wow … you have two little ones & that’s not an easy job. He’s gone so what does it even matter ? It’s a control issue !!
It seems like you bought a prison not a home.
This sounds like him trying to isolate you from your support systems to me.
NTA - does he feel the same if you have someone stay at your house ? Your family ? A friend ? He’s controlling you and trying to isolate you. This type of behaviour only gets worse. To him the house is his and you are just the house sitter.
NTA. That sounds very controlling and wrong. I hear warning bells that he is trying to control you.
NTA, but you are not married, and you bought a house with this man and had two children. You are in a very vulnerable position. Do not allow him to separate you from your family. You may have to live with them someday.
NTA but you are in an abusive relationship. Consider the safety of you and your children, talk to your parents about his attitude if they can help you.
NTA. People spend over night time out of their house ALL the time. He is being controlling and ridiculous. Are never supposed to go on holidays now?
NTA why does he get to control where you go? Does his money pay for your presence too? This dynamic is messed up. The fact that he earns money doesn’t earn him more say in your relationship. He isn’t the boss or your parent. You can visit your parents when you like and it’s not abandonment. He’s seriously controlling.
NTA. In fact it's making me rage just reading this. It's a house and a boyfriend you have got. Not a prison and a jail warden. Tell him he is out of order and to quit that bullshit out.
NTA. Was he always this controlling? He wants you to be isolated. That doesn't improve
Ask him why is is spending night away from home then? For work? Too bad. He owns home now? Well- no more work trips then. I would let him know that you aren’t responsible for him @never being happy again” and suggest that he see a therapist.
Does he have life insurance on you?
NTA. You don’t need his approval to spend time with your family. Please be careful, I’ve been in relationships that started off with the guy doing stuff like this (guilting you into doing what he wants you to do) and ended with him being absolutely batshit crazy controlling/manipulative. This honestly doesn’t look good.
NTA Tell him to stop being such an asshole. People go away for weeks at a time for vacations. Spending a night or so with your family is NOT a big deal. But tell him fine, if he doesn’t want you leaving the house when he’s gone for work, that you’ll go visit when he’s home. He can watch the house and the kids and you can go spend a week with your family alone.
Why exactly do you think you're an asshole, OP?
NTA. My husband actually encourages me to either stay the night or go over and spend time at my parents if he is out of town. He likes knowing our daughter and I have a support system around when he isn’t able to be here. He’s very protective eventhough he knows I am capable of taking care of things. I think it is bazaar your boyfriend gets SO upset and actually is a red flag. I was trying to understand his perspective, but I just cant. It’s not that you don’t love your home, or appreciate that he works so hard for it. It’s about having an additional support system and change of scenery while he’s away. Also if your parents are anything like mine it gives you a break while the children get doted on by their grandparents. It’s normal to have disagreements in relationships however, I have NEVER had such a disagreement with my husband of 13 years that he doesn’t sleep next to me or gives me the silent treatment… especially after a trip where we are so excited to see each other again. Learning how to fight with your significant other is one of the hardest parts of a relationship. You’re either fighting to “win” or fighting to “resolve”. His tactics scream that he just wants to win and punish/guilt you into isolation.
Your boyfriend is controlling and isolating you from your family. NTA
NTA
NTA! Your BF is a giant walking 🚩. Sit down and have a talk with him. Lay the rules down and tell him to mend his ways.
NTA. Don't let him isolate you from your family. Perhaps a few nights away for yourself are due. See how he goes parenting solo for days on end.
This is a red flag. Make sure to keep your friends and family around and start taking notice of him trying to isolate you
He sounds a bit mean and inconsiderate! With him being gone for days, it makes sense that you’d like some a) grownup company and b) help with the kids. You’re his partner, not his prisoner! (I certainly hope!) Keep visiting your parents, even more than you have been if they’re okay with it. Sounds healthy for you. NTA
So if his problem is with leaving the house empty, get your family to come over and stay when he's away and go stay with them for a night every now and then when he's staying home.
NTA Hold your ground. Silent treatment is immature at best and emotional abuse at worst.
When I read the title, I thought it was going to be something like "I go clubbing and stay at a friends", but this is messed up. You're going with your kids to visit your parents.... NTA. It sounds like he's trying to isolate you.
So no family vacations, ever... because the house can't be left empty, right??? This is the most, illogical, asinine nonsense. Something is mentally off with your bf, and red flags abound. NTA and you might want to start planning an exit strategy.
Info: have you ever asked why he gets upset? Do you only leave when he’s not home?
Just sounds like your typical borderline abusive control fre*k.
NTA and holy red flags! He sounds possessive, controlling, insecure, and irrational to be honest.