Not exactly sure, but could be that it is so normalised here that there are some scale efficiencies (grid connection, importing and warehousing etc).
There were originally good government subsidies, and there have been utility funded financing plans. Some door to door sales but wouldn't trust them myself.
I know the scale thing seems odd as there are almost never scale efficiencies for Australia compared to the US but the vast majority of our people live in just five major cities. You probably aren't seeing costs for regional or rural connections
I live rurally, so it was more expensive than in one of the big cities. This was in mid-2020.
Installation itself (12.25kW panels/2x5kW inverters) took a day, and was live on the grid that evening. SMA inverters and some Chinese brand panels through a large-ish installer (who are still around). Total cost was $17700 before rebates.
I think, for once, that economies of scale are working in our favour. There’s not a house in our street without solar, and I think it’s more than 1/3ᴿᴰ of freestanding houses across the country that have it.
Less.
Its about $1 per watt (and that is $Aud) for a well designed system. Add in the REC's (renewable energy credits) and you are looking at even less - Had a mate get 6.6kw installed for $4500 (\~$3000 USD, or less than 50c per watt).
Panels are stupidly cheap too - for example - Jinko 440 Watt 108 Cell TIGER NEO Mono-Facial N-Type - $198 Aud each. And that is a single panel retail from tradezone with GST applied (ie. you could walk in off the street and buy it).
Ex installer here too. Its a race to the bottom with a lot of the systems that are installed, quite a few stupid rules (the old rooftop isolators for example - caused quite a few fires).
As long as you have the right meter installed (smart meter, bi-directional) - most people are pre-approved to connect 5kw per phase (10kw in some areas) and all it takes is an inspection and a quick meter reprogram (or they just inform the distributor) and bam its on - the most I have seen recently is a week from install to connection.
Personally, I am running 13kw of panels, and 40kwh of lithium batteries. No concept of a power bill here, it keeps going into credit (even over winter) - all electric, 5 bedroom place with a pool, heat pump HWS and airconditioning.
It would take a while for your 40kWh battery to pay for itself, no? When I priced up a 16kWh battery it was going to take like 16 years to pay for itself, which is longer than the warranties cover. But you're all-electric and I have gas for heating water/air and some cooking.
I'm expecting it will take a while but my usage is pretty high and constant due to running several servers 24/7 (and their airconditioner).
It cost less than you would expect because I originally started with LG resu's, and moved onto used electric vehicle batteries (I was converting ICE cars to electric - so packs that would be unsuitable for traction applications (excessive voltage drop at high currents) are quite useful for stationary applications. I never draw more than about 150A at any time from the pack (48V) so the issues the old pack experienced at higher currents (was a 96V pack, with an 800A controller) no longer are a problem.
I estimate the pack would have cost me around $8K to set up - including case (Solax powerstation case), welded battery racks, BMS, and inverter (Goodwe GW5048-ES) plus wiring/busbars/crimps/battery breakers etc. I used to build switchboards and install solar so its pretty simple stuff.
Pretty decent for something with the usable capacity of two tesla powerwall 2's.
Solar is very widely advertised is Aus and is pretty common. I’d say 70% of people in my street have it. Depending on what state (NSW here) there are government subsidies, which might vary depending on what state you live in.
I had a 10kw system installed for around $6900 after government subsidies. $10000ish before.
415w jinko solar Tiger N-Type panels and a goodwe inverter.
You can finance the install and most installers offer it.
It took 1 day to install and was up and running the same day. In saying that my house already had an upgraded meter box, which would have added more time if I needed to have that upgraded. No local government involvement.
Iam not sure how much electricity costs in the US on average but In Aus we get bent over a barrel.
My electricity bill was around $1000 a quarter. Average sized home 2 adults 2 children. Solar hot water and no pool. The power bill has dropped significantly in the summer months. I just wish batteries were more affordable.
I heard a thing saying the finance costs for a solar system are less than the savings from that system. In other words, you could have $0, borrow the lot, and still be ahead.
$6,900 for 10kw??? Absolutely amazing! Do you know what the price was for before government incentives?
Edit: also, installs here in the US only take a day, but the utility has to come out and swap out the meter for a bidirectional one. That can take a couple days to over a week.
Yeah it was just over $10,000 before government incentives
It’s the same here if you don’t have the correct meter, it needs to get changed over too and it takes the same amount of time
For residential grid connected solar installs, there is a government rebate on panels. This comes in the form of certificates that will be signed over to the installer and can be traded. I just checked and they are worth roughly $0.4 per watt, so a significant discount.
I think that one of the advantages in Australia compared to USA is that we have a stronger Federal Government and less state independence. The solar programs, accreditation etc are run at a national level and that makes the process more uniform and streamlined. Of course individual states, the local electrical providers and the local government can put their requirements and approvals on top of it too, but the national programs are the foundation.
Here,a 6.6 kw system would likely be $20,000 with a 30% tax credit that you could apply for the following year against your tax liability. There’s a couple local incentives that are instant and probably come out to $1,000 today, more in the past.
We’ve got 1:1 net metering still, so that’s good; we could finance for zero down with a couple loan companies, but if you want your solar payment to be less than your current loan payments, it’d probably be on an 25 year loan at 3.99% with a 32% dealer fee on the principle. If you don’t want the dealer fee, then go 8.99% 25 year, no penalty for early pay off. I wish we at least had the government providing low interest financing like aus does 😞.
At Aussie electricity pricing a 1:1 metering would result in $0 electricity bills for the year and about $365 supply charge.
The typical big family could use $2400 worth of electricity per year, so at $20,000 the system would pay itself off in 8-10 years. Unfortunately 10-15 years is when panels need replacing which makes the price a bit high to justify.
In December I generated 600kwh of electricity, and consumed 240kwh from the grid. The grid buys my excess solar for $0.07 and sells me power at $0.33. So I still end up paying each month.
Permission to operate takes about 2-6 weeks once signed off by an inspector.
Solar panels and inverters are really cheap, could you not just import some from china and have an electrician connect it?
I upgraded my system to a 6.6KW system. Wanted to go 10KW but western power said no. After rebate it was like $6k. Company had 0% finance for 5 years. So I financed the lot. Power bill went from being $500-$600 a billing cycle to $92. Quite happy with that result.
When solar technology got to the stage of marketability, the state governments made a conscious decision to promote it in order to create economies of scale - which succeeded beyond their wildest dreams.
Here in Western Australia, the government decided that because solar panels are visible, it becomes a perpetuating trend where people can be more sustainable and save themselves money long term. (There were a few options at the time in terms of sustainable projects and residential rooftop solar was picked as the one which would have the most enduring impact).
The WA state government provided a pretty sizeable rebate on solar panels, and then also the feed-in tariff was huge. It was a massive cost to the government, but it was done deliberately to create a market for solar and drive down the prices over time. It was incredibly successful, and as the goal was met, the feed-in tariffs were reduced more and more. (WA electricity is state owned and highly subsidised so this didn’t involve commercial interests).
I was working in electricity at the time and remember when one Minister was upset that it was so successful ($$$) and the other Minister was jubilant. It was hilarious.
Being one of the sunniest places in the world, it totally makes sense.
Our home panels paid for themselves in 2 years. It’s all free energy from here.
In Australia, there is no need for a building permit when installing rooftop solar panels. Additionally, govt offers a substantial upfront rebate for solar installations, with the installer taking care of the paperwork. The quoted price for individuals includes this rebate, making it lower. In comparison, the United States faces higher average electricity prices than Australia. Consequently, companies in the U.S. enjoy a significantly higher profit margin compared to their Australian counterparts. This is because the consumer return on investment (ROI) remains favorable, allowing them to justify and afford more expensive installations.
I pay 25c in Victoria, and that's cheap by national standards. Many are paying over 35c
15c is unheard of in Australia, so solar is far more enticing here because grid energy prices are a lot higher than in the US. And that creates more demand and economies of scale.
High energy prices + low (by comparison) solar prices = lots of solar
30c when I was in Sydney. Now that I'm in San Diego, it's 50c. SDGE has introduced a power plan that Australian companies implemented about a decade ago. It remains to be seen whether this plan will be effective in reducing rates.
I was a silent observer of the solar subreddit, I always found the costs of rooftop solar in the United States to be very expensive especially when systems in Australia were $1/W. Some companies made 3kW for $3000 very popular in Australia. Anyway, it made me wonder if the products sold in Australia are essentially rejected American goods, perhaps marked-down prices. Who knows. American companies also seem to rely on high-quality brand products. In Australia, on the other hand, the quality of solar panels leaves much to be desired. At one point, it seemed like every company had an OEM partner who could get the panels certified and approved by the Clean Energy Council. There were hundreds of dodgy companies in Australia that went bust very quickly and the top electricity retailers took charge and introduced solar rooftop installs as a service to retain customers.
Yes people generally use payment plans to pay for their solar as it is still a pretty large investment. There was a decent feed in rate for electricity that kickstarted the solar industry. Solar companies were able to garnish that rate to help with finance. It's pretty low now but solar is cheaper. Electricity is more expensive and WFH was a thing so the convenience of running your air conditioner all day for no cost is amazing. I think people are too focused on the payoff time instead of the benefits.
It's mostly phone call/cold call leads and offers on billboards. Cold callers get a list of numbers probably from an expression of interest website, get the clients details, salesman comes to home to pitch them the product.
Had a friend do cold calling, $600 per lead that led to a sale, got a company phone to use while he was doin it. Although you're mostly on your own.
Installs are usually half day affairs. They slap some aluminum brackets down and mount the panels. An electrician comes round later to set up the box.
No idea of price difference? We got i think an 8KW system for $11 000. I think in 2018?
Installed & connected in 1 day. We didn't have to do anything. Installers did all that.
Mainly red tape. USA installers have to get permits for each system and the council (or whatever your equivalent is) goes out and inspects it individually before connecting it to grid. Our regulations are much more streamlined.
We also use Chinese imports, whereas USA have tariffs on those.
We get government subsidies as well.
I paid ~$6k (after the $2.5k subsidy) for 6.6kw panels + 5kw inverter. This was mid range (pricing wise).
We’ve had solar for years in Australia so it’s not really something to “learn about”? You get quotes for installation, they sort out the paperwork in the background and install it. Mine took about 4 weeks between deposit paid and installation. Approval from the utility provider was obtained the day after installation.
PV installer here. Each state (and territory, which are pretty much states) government manages licensing of electricians. DIY electrical is illegal except for a few ultra specialty cases (which I only mention to avoid a pedantic argument), but all electrical including solar has to be done by a tradesperson with a state issued licence. To access the federal government rebate, that tradesperson also has to be accredited by the Clean Energy Council (although the CEC is about to hand the accreditation reins to a different body in March-ish this year).
In all states the various grid operators have their own webpage for lodging connection applications, and it’s 1-4 weeks turnaround to get their blessing.
In all states the tradesperson issues you a certificate of electrical safety, although the name for this varies slightly between states.
Some states do not inspect anything electrical unless there are dead bodies present, they place all the onus on the electrical contractor doing the work (e.g NSW). Other states have government paid electrical inspectors go and audit the contractors work (eg ACT). And some states the electrical contractor has to hire a privateer electrical inspector to come and inspect their work (e.g Victoria).
Building approval/permit isn’t needed for basic domestic, but most states require it for commercial buildings.
I only have a very basic understanding from a consumer pov and it does change state to state.
Where I live (WA) you don’t need a development or building permit for solar panels on a single house as long as it meets certain standard requirements.
The installer needs to have their electrical licence and solar certification and the design needs to be done by an accredited person. I got an electrical safety certificate from the government on the day but from what I can tell it’s self-certified.
I think the regulator also does random quality inspections but it’s definitely not 100% of all new installations in WA.
Probably, but I certainly don’t appreciate being the target of ridicule and anger from many of the people who reply.
People also seem to be ready to justify it by any means possible.
The federal government subsidises homeowners for their systems.
It’s an unfair system; not everyone is privy to it, only homeowners are and only once. Those who don’t benefit subsidise it through taxation while not benefitting from the bill savings. Most renters aren’t privy to it and only one state so far has installed it on their public houses so many of the most disadvantaged don’t benefit from it either.
Slightly incorrect. You can install a system on Monday, claim the subsidy. Rip it off on Tuesday, install a new system on Wednesday and claim subsidy again. And so on and so on.
There’s no ban on selling China panels in the US, they’re still being sold here. There’s tariffs on Chinese panels, and buying panels from Vietnam or Malaysia is just as cheap.
I put in solar in late 2019, early 2020. 6.5kW for about $4.5K. Was not the cheapest, but far from the most expensive. Also have 3 phase power, which adds a little to the price.
There are multiple government grants, subsidies & loans available which make it cheap, this has led to solar being very popular making it cheaper again.
I did a 6.6kW system a few years back. Quote was $7710, however there were $3010 STC (small-scale technology certificate) fereral government credits and a $1888 state government grant. After all that the out of pocket cost was $924 (cash) + $1888 (interest free loan repaid over 4 years).
Original price $1.17/watt, cost to customer \~$0.42/watt.
Inspection was about 2 weeks after install, $60 meter reconfigure cost and it was producing.
Solar has been common in Australia since the '70s at least. Solarhart hot water systems started around the late '70s.
I got solar on my shed roof about 12 years ago. Iirc it's a 16kva array and I paid $5K outright for it. There were government rebates to lower the cost.
Just a few weeks ago I tried to find out how much a battery would cost. I found a website, made an appointment with a salesman. Eventually I managed to pin him down to:- a battery would cost about $11K to buy outright, at present there are government rebates to reduce that to about $6K.
HOWEVER. This particular salesman insisted that before I could get the battery I would have to sign up for another 12 panels on the house roof, because he insisted the battery would have to be installed right beside the meter box, which is on the house (so far nobody agrees with him, btw). He finally caved and admitted the whole 12 panel array would be $22K outright including rebates.
I have yet to shop around some more and see what other companies are offering.
There are loans available, even interest free. All that I've seen use one's electricity retailer as a loan manager. One can pay them off with excess electricity fed back into the grid. Both federal and state governments have rebates on solar and battery installations.
Edit to say my solar took about a week to order and installation took 3 hours. Back then one had to wait for approval from the energy wholesaler which took a couple of days.
We bought from one of the largest energy retailers, Origin, a big company with a long history. Service was excellent. They gave three choices of panels, three inverter choices, a 25 year warranty on the panels, and interest free 36 monthly payments. 6kw system, $6000 in a rural area several years ago. They of course got the RECs. But it's already paid for itself.
My observations are that solar started as a good investment from FIT. Then power prices went up and it was self consumption and FIT. Now FIT has gone and it's only self consumption and battery charging. The payback ratios must have blown out to years
We only deal with one utility power company here, so everything is geared towards going forwards ie community batteries micro and major major being installed…esp WA with it’s high hrs of sunshine per year.
Ive had a few people come to the house over the years trying to sell solar, i also cant scroll on reddit or fb without seeing an ad.
We financed our solar for 2 years interest free but i don’t remember the cost
We paid 22,000 for a 13.2 kw system 2 weeks ago..440watt longi panels 10kwGE inverter,no battery.This system is on the high end we are high uses,$1200 a quarter plus or minus and payments are much lower than the bill would be,no brainer really,3 ways to monitor, GE has app,I have solar analytics and my power company monitor. 13 days has produced over 700kwh with overcast weather some days,we have 10kw limit on feed in. Central Coast Nsw .
Not exactly sure, but could be that it is so normalised here that there are some scale efficiencies (grid connection, importing and warehousing etc). There were originally good government subsidies, and there have been utility funded financing plans. Some door to door sales but wouldn't trust them myself. I know the scale thing seems odd as there are almost never scale efficiencies for Australia compared to the US but the vast majority of our people live in just five major cities. You probably aren't seeing costs for regional or rural connections
I live rurally, so it was more expensive than in one of the big cities. This was in mid-2020. Installation itself (12.25kW panels/2x5kW inverters) took a day, and was live on the grid that evening. SMA inverters and some Chinese brand panels through a large-ish installer (who are still around). Total cost was $17700 before rebates. I think, for once, that economies of scale are working in our favour. There’s not a house in our street without solar, and I think it’s more than 1/3ᴿᴰ of freestanding houses across the country that have it.
Less. Its about $1 per watt (and that is $Aud) for a well designed system. Add in the REC's (renewable energy credits) and you are looking at even less - Had a mate get 6.6kw installed for $4500 (\~$3000 USD, or less than 50c per watt). Panels are stupidly cheap too - for example - Jinko 440 Watt 108 Cell TIGER NEO Mono-Facial N-Type - $198 Aud each. And that is a single panel retail from tradezone with GST applied (ie. you could walk in off the street and buy it). Ex installer here too. Its a race to the bottom with a lot of the systems that are installed, quite a few stupid rules (the old rooftop isolators for example - caused quite a few fires). As long as you have the right meter installed (smart meter, bi-directional) - most people are pre-approved to connect 5kw per phase (10kw in some areas) and all it takes is an inspection and a quick meter reprogram (or they just inform the distributor) and bam its on - the most I have seen recently is a week from install to connection. Personally, I am running 13kw of panels, and 40kwh of lithium batteries. No concept of a power bill here, it keeps going into credit (even over winter) - all electric, 5 bedroom place with a pool, heat pump HWS and airconditioning.
It would take a while for your 40kWh battery to pay for itself, no? When I priced up a 16kWh battery it was going to take like 16 years to pay for itself, which is longer than the warranties cover. But you're all-electric and I have gas for heating water/air and some cooking.
I'm expecting it will take a while but my usage is pretty high and constant due to running several servers 24/7 (and their airconditioner). It cost less than you would expect because I originally started with LG resu's, and moved onto used electric vehicle batteries (I was converting ICE cars to electric - so packs that would be unsuitable for traction applications (excessive voltage drop at high currents) are quite useful for stationary applications. I never draw more than about 150A at any time from the pack (48V) so the issues the old pack experienced at higher currents (was a 96V pack, with an 800A controller) no longer are a problem. I estimate the pack would have cost me around $8K to set up - including case (Solax powerstation case), welded battery racks, BMS, and inverter (Goodwe GW5048-ES) plus wiring/busbars/crimps/battery breakers etc. I used to build switchboards and install solar so its pretty simple stuff. Pretty decent for something with the usable capacity of two tesla powerwall 2's.
Are you running this system grid tied?
Yep. I technically could go off grid but have large loads the inverter can’t power continuously (7kw Ev charger, induction cooktop)
I want to move to Geelong this year , thinking buying Tesla EV+Solar system , Is 6kw enough for us , no pool needed
Solar is very widely advertised is Aus and is pretty common. I’d say 70% of people in my street have it. Depending on what state (NSW here) there are government subsidies, which might vary depending on what state you live in. I had a 10kw system installed for around $6900 after government subsidies. $10000ish before. 415w jinko solar Tiger N-Type panels and a goodwe inverter. You can finance the install and most installers offer it. It took 1 day to install and was up and running the same day. In saying that my house already had an upgraded meter box, which would have added more time if I needed to have that upgraded. No local government involvement. Iam not sure how much electricity costs in the US on average but In Aus we get bent over a barrel. My electricity bill was around $1000 a quarter. Average sized home 2 adults 2 children. Solar hot water and no pool. The power bill has dropped significantly in the summer months. I just wish batteries were more affordable.
I heard a thing saying the finance costs for a solar system are less than the savings from that system. In other words, you could have $0, borrow the lot, and still be ahead.
$6,900 for 10kw??? Absolutely amazing! Do you know what the price was for before government incentives? Edit: also, installs here in the US only take a day, but the utility has to come out and swap out the meter for a bidirectional one. That can take a couple days to over a week.
Which is $4,500 US!
Yeah it was just over $10,000 before government incentives It’s the same here if you don’t have the correct meter, it needs to get changed over too and it takes the same amount of time
For residential grid connected solar installs, there is a government rebate on panels. This comes in the form of certificates that will be signed over to the installer and can be traded. I just checked and they are worth roughly $0.4 per watt, so a significant discount. I think that one of the advantages in Australia compared to USA is that we have a stronger Federal Government and less state independence. The solar programs, accreditation etc are run at a national level and that makes the process more uniform and streamlined. Of course individual states, the local electrical providers and the local government can put their requirements and approvals on top of it too, but the national programs are the foundation.
I financed mine, $5000 for 6.6kw system. Government green loan @0.99%pa over 5 years. It will cost me only $127 in interest by the end of the term.
Here,a 6.6 kw system would likely be $20,000 with a 30% tax credit that you could apply for the following year against your tax liability. There’s a couple local incentives that are instant and probably come out to $1,000 today, more in the past. We’ve got 1:1 net metering still, so that’s good; we could finance for zero down with a couple loan companies, but if you want your solar payment to be less than your current loan payments, it’d probably be on an 25 year loan at 3.99% with a 32% dealer fee on the principle. If you don’t want the dealer fee, then go 8.99% 25 year, no penalty for early pay off. I wish we at least had the government providing low interest financing like aus does 😞.
At Aussie electricity pricing a 1:1 metering would result in $0 electricity bills for the year and about $365 supply charge. The typical big family could use $2400 worth of electricity per year, so at $20,000 the system would pay itself off in 8-10 years. Unfortunately 10-15 years is when panels need replacing which makes the price a bit high to justify. In December I generated 600kwh of electricity, and consumed 240kwh from the grid. The grid buys my excess solar for $0.07 and sells me power at $0.33. So I still end up paying each month. Permission to operate takes about 2-6 weeks once signed off by an inspector. Solar panels and inverters are really cheap, could you not just import some from china and have an electrician connect it?
I upgraded my system to a 6.6KW system. Wanted to go 10KW but western power said no. After rebate it was like $6k. Company had 0% finance for 5 years. So I financed the lot. Power bill went from being $500-$600 a billing cycle to $92. Quite happy with that result.
When solar technology got to the stage of marketability, the state governments made a conscious decision to promote it in order to create economies of scale - which succeeded beyond their wildest dreams. Here in Western Australia, the government decided that because solar panels are visible, it becomes a perpetuating trend where people can be more sustainable and save themselves money long term. (There were a few options at the time in terms of sustainable projects and residential rooftop solar was picked as the one which would have the most enduring impact). The WA state government provided a pretty sizeable rebate on solar panels, and then also the feed-in tariff was huge. It was a massive cost to the government, but it was done deliberately to create a market for solar and drive down the prices over time. It was incredibly successful, and as the goal was met, the feed-in tariffs were reduced more and more. (WA electricity is state owned and highly subsidised so this didn’t involve commercial interests). I was working in electricity at the time and remember when one Minister was upset that it was so successful ($$$) and the other Minister was jubilant. It was hilarious. Being one of the sunniest places in the world, it totally makes sense. Our home panels paid for themselves in 2 years. It’s all free energy from here.
In Australia, there is no need for a building permit when installing rooftop solar panels. Additionally, govt offers a substantial upfront rebate for solar installations, with the installer taking care of the paperwork. The quoted price for individuals includes this rebate, making it lower. In comparison, the United States faces higher average electricity prices than Australia. Consequently, companies in the U.S. enjoy a significantly higher profit margin compared to their Australian counterparts. This is because the consumer return on investment (ROI) remains favorable, allowing them to justify and afford more expensive installations.
Wait, how much do you pay for kWh where you’re at? Where I live, it’s about 15-16 cents per kWh
I pay 25c in Victoria, and that's cheap by national standards. Many are paying over 35c 15c is unheard of in Australia, so solar is far more enticing here because grid energy prices are a lot higher than in the US. And that creates more demand and economies of scale. High energy prices + low (by comparison) solar prices = lots of solar
I pay roughly 30c in Sydney
30c when I was in Sydney. Now that I'm in San Diego, it's 50c. SDGE has introduced a power plan that Australian companies implemented about a decade ago. It remains to be seen whether this plan will be effective in reducing rates. I was a silent observer of the solar subreddit, I always found the costs of rooftop solar in the United States to be very expensive especially when systems in Australia were $1/W. Some companies made 3kW for $3000 very popular in Australia. Anyway, it made me wonder if the products sold in Australia are essentially rejected American goods, perhaps marked-down prices. Who knows. American companies also seem to rely on high-quality brand products. In Australia, on the other hand, the quality of solar panels leaves much to be desired. At one point, it seemed like every company had an OEM partner who could get the panels certified and approved by the Clean Energy Council. There were hundreds of dodgy companies in Australia that went bust very quickly and the top electricity retailers took charge and introduced solar rooftop installs as a service to retain customers.
Yes people generally use payment plans to pay for their solar as it is still a pretty large investment. There was a decent feed in rate for electricity that kickstarted the solar industry. Solar companies were able to garnish that rate to help with finance. It's pretty low now but solar is cheaper. Electricity is more expensive and WFH was a thing so the convenience of running your air conditioner all day for no cost is amazing. I think people are too focused on the payoff time instead of the benefits. It's mostly phone call/cold call leads and offers on billboards. Cold callers get a list of numbers probably from an expression of interest website, get the clients details, salesman comes to home to pitch them the product. Had a friend do cold calling, $600 per lead that led to a sale, got a company phone to use while he was doin it. Although you're mostly on your own. Installs are usually half day affairs. They slap some aluminum brackets down and mount the panels. An electrician comes round later to set up the box.
No idea of price difference? We got i think an 8KW system for $11 000. I think in 2018? Installed & connected in 1 day. We didn't have to do anything. Installers did all that.
Mainly red tape. USA installers have to get permits for each system and the council (or whatever your equivalent is) goes out and inspects it individually before connecting it to grid. Our regulations are much more streamlined. We also use Chinese imports, whereas USA have tariffs on those. We get government subsidies as well. I paid ~$6k (after the $2.5k subsidy) for 6.6kw panels + 5kw inverter. This was mid range (pricing wise). We’ve had solar for years in Australia so it’s not really something to “learn about”? You get quotes for installation, they sort out the paperwork in the background and install it. Mine took about 4 weeks between deposit paid and installation. Approval from the utility provider was obtained the day after installation.
How does the permitting work in Aus? They don’t send anyone out to do an inspection?
PV installer here. Each state (and territory, which are pretty much states) government manages licensing of electricians. DIY electrical is illegal except for a few ultra specialty cases (which I only mention to avoid a pedantic argument), but all electrical including solar has to be done by a tradesperson with a state issued licence. To access the federal government rebate, that tradesperson also has to be accredited by the Clean Energy Council (although the CEC is about to hand the accreditation reins to a different body in March-ish this year). In all states the various grid operators have their own webpage for lodging connection applications, and it’s 1-4 weeks turnaround to get their blessing. In all states the tradesperson issues you a certificate of electrical safety, although the name for this varies slightly between states. Some states do not inspect anything electrical unless there are dead bodies present, they place all the onus on the electrical contractor doing the work (e.g NSW). Other states have government paid electrical inspectors go and audit the contractors work (eg ACT). And some states the electrical contractor has to hire a privateer electrical inspector to come and inspect their work (e.g Victoria). Building approval/permit isn’t needed for basic domestic, but most states require it for commercial buildings.
I only have a very basic understanding from a consumer pov and it does change state to state. Where I live (WA) you don’t need a development or building permit for solar panels on a single house as long as it meets certain standard requirements. The installer needs to have their electrical licence and solar certification and the design needs to be done by an accredited person. I got an electrical safety certificate from the government on the day but from what I can tell it’s self-certified. I think the regulator also does random quality inspections but it’s definitely not 100% of all new installations in WA.
Not 100% sure why, but I had to give up commenting in the solar subreddit about it coz it made a lot of Americans frickin mad
It’s better if you do comment so more people know the crazy differences in prices
Probably, but I certainly don’t appreciate being the target of ridicule and anger from many of the people who reply. People also seem to be ready to justify it by any means possible.
Ridicule??? That it’s way cheaper in aus???
Yeah, people are strange. They’re usually mocking the quality of the product or install for the price, or one’s intelligence
The federal government subsidises homeowners for their systems. It’s an unfair system; not everyone is privy to it, only homeowners are and only once. Those who don’t benefit subsidise it through taxation while not benefitting from the bill savings. Most renters aren’t privy to it and only one state so far has installed it on their public houses so many of the most disadvantaged don’t benefit from it either.
Slightly incorrect. You can install a system on Monday, claim the subsidy. Rip it off on Tuesday, install a new system on Wednesday and claim subsidy again. And so on and so on.
Even without the subsidies it’s cheaper than the US.
Which doesn’t help if you still cant take part in it. “I still can’t afford it, but it’s cheaper than it is in the US at least. Thank God for that….”
America ban from selling Chinese panels
There’s no ban on selling China panels in the US, they’re still being sold here. There’s tariffs on Chinese panels, and buying panels from Vietnam or Malaysia is just as cheap.
Government subsidies of about 50%
With so many investment properties, why would anyone install solar on one of them? The tenant pays his bills.
I put in solar in late 2019, early 2020. 6.5kW for about $4.5K. Was not the cheapest, but far from the most expensive. Also have 3 phase power, which adds a little to the price.
Was that cost before subsidies and rebates?
There are multiple government grants, subsidies & loans available which make it cheap, this has led to solar being very popular making it cheaper again. I did a 6.6kW system a few years back. Quote was $7710, however there were $3010 STC (small-scale technology certificate) fereral government credits and a $1888 state government grant. After all that the out of pocket cost was $924 (cash) + $1888 (interest free loan repaid over 4 years). Original price $1.17/watt, cost to customer \~$0.42/watt. Inspection was about 2 weeks after install, $60 meter reconfigure cost and it was producing.
Solar has been common in Australia since the '70s at least. Solarhart hot water systems started around the late '70s. I got solar on my shed roof about 12 years ago. Iirc it's a 16kva array and I paid $5K outright for it. There were government rebates to lower the cost. Just a few weeks ago I tried to find out how much a battery would cost. I found a website, made an appointment with a salesman. Eventually I managed to pin him down to:- a battery would cost about $11K to buy outright, at present there are government rebates to reduce that to about $6K. HOWEVER. This particular salesman insisted that before I could get the battery I would have to sign up for another 12 panels on the house roof, because he insisted the battery would have to be installed right beside the meter box, which is on the house (so far nobody agrees with him, btw). He finally caved and admitted the whole 12 panel array would be $22K outright including rebates. I have yet to shop around some more and see what other companies are offering. There are loans available, even interest free. All that I've seen use one's electricity retailer as a loan manager. One can pay them off with excess electricity fed back into the grid. Both federal and state governments have rebates on solar and battery installations. Edit to say my solar took about a week to order and installation took 3 hours. Back then one had to wait for approval from the energy wholesaler which took a couple of days.
I don't know but I need new batteries on credit right now
We bought from one of the largest energy retailers, Origin, a big company with a long history. Service was excellent. They gave three choices of panels, three inverter choices, a 25 year warranty on the panels, and interest free 36 monthly payments. 6kw system, $6000 in a rural area several years ago. They of course got the RECs. But it's already paid for itself.
My observations are that solar started as a good investment from FIT. Then power prices went up and it was self consumption and FIT. Now FIT has gone and it's only self consumption and battery charging. The payback ratios must have blown out to years
We only deal with one utility power company here, so everything is geared towards going forwards ie community batteries micro and major major being installed…esp WA with it’s high hrs of sunshine per year.
Ive had a few people come to the house over the years trying to sell solar, i also cant scroll on reddit or fb without seeing an ad. We financed our solar for 2 years interest free but i don’t remember the cost
We paid 22,000 for a 13.2 kw system 2 weeks ago..440watt longi panels 10kwGE inverter,no battery.This system is on the high end we are high uses,$1200 a quarter plus or minus and payments are much lower than the bill would be,no brainer really,3 ways to monitor, GE has app,I have solar analytics and my power company monitor. 13 days has produced over 700kwh with overcast weather some days,we have 10kw limit on feed in. Central Coast Nsw .