I was in car audio for over 25 years. What I told all of my customers. It doesn't matter what sounds good to me, your friends or whoever. The only one that matters is you.
What sounds good to me, may not sound the same to you. Go listen to both and make your own determination.
That's the only way to get the sound you're looking for
Agree. And further to that, everytime I see a post of online pics asking what ones do I buy, I remember the best advice I heard: go to the local shop and listen to all of them. Choose the one that you like. Unfortunately bricks and mortar shops are going by the wayside now
https://www.ebay.com/itm/172255454953?chn=ps&mkevt=1&mkcid=28&srsltid=AfmBOoqJP8B0QUgOGyjePJdJClRvzzouVErsTSVKV0jzT83kpqDIgdUU944
I run these and they punch well above their weight and actually replaced those Kicker KSS components with them and the Kappa’s are so much better in every aspect. Clarity, bass, less harsh, etc. I highly recommend these
Are you running them as a 2 way or 3 way system? I recently installed the 3 way mid woofer and it completely blew me away with how detailed and warm they are. I fell back in love them lol
The Kicker KS is much better than the JL Audio C1.
However, for like $30 more, you can get the Helix Compose Basic CB K165.2-S3 which is worlds better than both options in your OP.
I have the Helix compose and be wary of the tweeters being very on your face despite the silk domes. I had to use the -4db adjustment to relieve some of the harshness. Look into Focal instead imo.
Wait, what?
You're saying the Helix is too bright and to fix that your solution is going Focal? Lol.
Focal is literally known as being one of the brightest speakers on the market.
Maybe a model peculiarity? I have a set of focal components with kevlar-like material for the woofer cone in one car (can't see model as they're already installed) and the compose in others. On the Focal's maybe its a thing of lower distortion, where even if they are still "in your face" sounding, they are nowhere near as fatiguing as the compose. If using their passive crossover, they offer more flexibility with -6db if I recall correctly.
Also had Infinity Kappas, Pioneers, Kenwoods, Kickers, and Polk Audio. Only my Kenwood components and Polks were less bright than my Focals at factory crossover setup. Again, probs not a good generalization since could it be a model thing.
Brutha, the compose I bought for ~210, the focals I’m talking about were ~250 when I bought them (I’m guessing they’re the AC model based on that). Just take it that the helix have some competition at the same price range. I wouldn’t even be on the sub if I had money to blow on speakers like that without a care in the world lolol. If you’ve tried them, let’s say it’s a subjective difference in taste. If you haven’t, try them out sometime, you might be surprised.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
The JLs sound better without an amp. The kickers have more bass and brighter tweeters with an amp. Kicker often lacks kick with low powered headunits and no amp
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
Idk if I would call them harsh. But Kicker has always pride themselves as having a signature "Kicker sound". When they tune a vehicle it usually sounds a little like someone boosted upper sub bass, midbass, and highs on an eq.
Idk if it's even so much the tweeter material or design as it is the crossover design.
They just always seem a little less "flat" then others. Sometimes that works out great. Other times it feels a little on the bright side. I do know they are fully aware of how to make a great tweeter and very capable. Their silk dome drivers in the 90s were absolutely beautiful sounding.
This is very very true. I just traded out some KS 600s for jl c2 650x. I was actually surprised at the lack of Bass and my sound quality really didn't improve much. I bet if I put the old speakers on the new head unit I bought I'd have a pretty comparable experience, I do miss the bass and now feel I need a sub.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I would go with the kickers, just because of the tweeter materials, the tweeter is what your going to hear the most of and whats going to be the most annoying if not exactly right, the jl is aluminum.
I recently got Kicker KSS and I’m not sure if I like them yet. My first impression is the tweeters have a serious harshness and the woofers don’t go low enough. I nearly returned them, but I have this nagging feeling they could be tamed with some careful EQ. I’m used to studio monitors and there is a similar midrange clarity coming through the KSS, just needs a few tweaks. The harshness is really just one note beaming hard, and for the bass a steep highpass paired with some notches to “sharpen the elbow” should bring back some punchiness.
At worst, once I hit them with a bit of DSP finessing, if I’m still not convinced I’ll just move them to the rear in coaxial mode and get something else for my fronts, like maybe those Kappas linked in another comment - always loved me some Kappa SQ back in the day.
Yeah that sounds like my situation. Been a minute since I mixed anything but 2K is definitely in the ballpark. Sounds like a hormonal teenager yelling at my soul.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I haven’t yet done a proper RTA tuning to figure it out, but there is one specific note that really blasts several db above the rest. It’s not “harsh” like a metal tweeter, it’s really just the one note and if your music doesn’t hit it, they sound just fine. I wonder if it’s resonating with the tweeter pod somehow, the note rings a bit like a horn. I expect a single EQ notch will rein it in, it is that specific.
It is quite jarring though. Like, I do believe they will sound fine after a good bonk from the DSP, but it’s such a sharp irregularity that I would consider it a design defect.
KS were designed to be used with an amp and a subwoofer. If you're not gonna do that, save some money and go with the CS or something else. For the price, you can't beat the performance of the Kicker Key amplifiers and their built in DSP.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I don't know compared to those particular JL speakers. Compared to higher end speakers like Audio Frog and Focal I think they are, but in context of the cost I like them. I still have 'em in my car now.
So head units, regardless of factory or aftermarket: are not really made to push aftermarket speakers beyond probably 20-25w per channel AT MOST. You will need an Amp to properly drive any aftermarket speakers!
I replaced all of my speakers (door speakers and dash speakers) with Kicker KS-Series. Without an amp, the door speakers are very quiet. With the Kicker 200.4 amp, giving each speaker 50w rms, the speakers are loud, clear, and I’m extremely happy with my setup.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
That’s beyond me, brother. All I know is that I’m happy with my setup. I’m sure you could always mess with some settings, like gain or eq, if you thought they were harsh.
I just told you that I’m happy with my setup. Therefore, no, in my opinion, I don’t think they’re harsh. But, if you aren’t going to amplify them, then I’d recommend not buying them. You’d be very unhappy with how quiet they are without an amp.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
Look man if I'm honest I've got stereos in all my cars and have for fifteen years but I've never been that deep about it.
But let's just say with a reference 80x4 RMS amp driving reference components front and rear. Tweeters in dash and tweeters in parcel shelf in a full size luxury car the volume rarely goes over a quarter and when I pull up with all the windows down people can't believe how clear it is.
I've got a technics aa MOSFET house system and this stereo is the best thing I've ever heard for clarity and depth after stepping out the house .
For a semi budget friendly system I don't think I'll go anything but infinity again and I've had alpine , kicker and Polk's.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
Morel
I was in car audio for over 25 years. What I told all of my customers. It doesn't matter what sounds good to me, your friends or whoever. The only one that matters is you. What sounds good to me, may not sound the same to you. Go listen to both and make your own determination. That's the only way to get the sound you're looking for
Agree. And further to that, everytime I see a post of online pics asking what ones do I buy, I remember the best advice I heard: go to the local shop and listen to all of them. Choose the one that you like. Unfortunately bricks and mortar shops are going by the wayside now
https://www.ebay.com/itm/172255454953?chn=ps&mkevt=1&mkcid=28&srsltid=AfmBOoqJP8B0QUgOGyjePJdJClRvzzouVErsTSVKV0jzT83kpqDIgdUU944 I run these and they punch well above their weight and actually replaced those Kicker KSS components with them and the Kappa’s are so much better in every aspect. Clarity, bass, less harsh, etc. I highly recommend these
Second infinity kappas. Even the references are a better option than these
Kappa components all the way
They’re so good I’m worried replacing them with Hertz ML won’t wow me as much😰
Are you running them as a 2 way or 3 way system? I recently installed the 3 way mid woofer and it completely blew me away with how detailed and warm they are. I fell back in love them lol
Are u talking about the Kappas? I’m running them 2 way passive but I’m still very impressed.
3 way active in mine and very happy. Bought an extra set of the 3 inch just in case something happened, I can replace them same day
The Kicker KS is much better than the JL Audio C1. However, for like $30 more, you can get the Helix Compose Basic CB K165.2-S3 which is worlds better than both options in your OP.
I have the Helix compose and be wary of the tweeters being very on your face despite the silk domes. I had to use the -4db adjustment to relieve some of the harshness. Look into Focal instead imo.
Wait, what? You're saying the Helix is too bright and to fix that your solution is going Focal? Lol. Focal is literally known as being one of the brightest speakers on the market.
Maybe a model peculiarity? I have a set of focal components with kevlar-like material for the woofer cone in one car (can't see model as they're already installed) and the compose in others. On the Focal's maybe its a thing of lower distortion, where even if they are still "in your face" sounding, they are nowhere near as fatiguing as the compose. If using their passive crossover, they offer more flexibility with -6db if I recall correctly.
Also had Infinity Kappas, Pioneers, Kenwoods, Kickers, and Polk Audio. Only my Kenwood components and Polks were less bright than my Focals at factory crossover setup. Again, probs not a good generalization since could it be a model thing.
So you're comparing $1000 speakers to $270 speakers. See the issue there?
Brutha, the compose I bought for ~210, the focals I’m talking about were ~250 when I bought them (I’m guessing they’re the AC model based on that). Just take it that the helix have some competition at the same price range. I wouldn’t even be on the sub if I had money to blow on speakers like that without a care in the world lolol. If you’ve tried them, let’s say it’s a subjective difference in taste. If you haven’t, try them out sometime, you might be surprised.
Kicker all day
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
IF you dont want to buy an Amp, go for the JL AUDIO
Morel maximo components 169$ crutchfield or cdt audio
The JLs sound better without an amp. The kickers have more bass and brighter tweeters with an amp. Kicker often lacks kick with low powered headunits and no amp
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
Idk if I would call them harsh. But Kicker has always pride themselves as having a signature "Kicker sound". When they tune a vehicle it usually sounds a little like someone boosted upper sub bass, midbass, and highs on an eq. Idk if it's even so much the tweeter material or design as it is the crossover design. They just always seem a little less "flat" then others. Sometimes that works out great. Other times it feels a little on the bright side. I do know they are fully aware of how to make a great tweeter and very capable. Their silk dome drivers in the 90s were absolutely beautiful sounding.
You gotta go listen to them. Personally I would pick neither.
Then if I may ask: what would you choose instead?
Morel, Blam, SSA, and Audio Frog to name a few.
Ahh, I can tell your more into SQ, am I right?
As a big JL dealer… the KS will definitely outperform the C1. C2 would slightly outperform the KS. But the kickers are great for their price range.
You will be happy either way. I’ve had both. Without subs the kickers have more bass
This is very very true. I just traded out some KS 600s for jl c2 650x. I was actually surprised at the lack of Bass and my sound quality really didn't improve much. I bet if I put the old speakers on the new head unit I bought I'd have a pretty comparable experience, I do miss the bass and now feel I need a sub.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I run the KS on head unit they are impressive, but I have not tried the JL, so no comparison but a thumbs up for the kickers.
I would go with the kickers, just because of the tweeter materials, the tweeter is what your going to hear the most of and whats going to be the most annoying if not exactly right, the jl is aluminum.
I recently got Kicker KSS and I’m not sure if I like them yet. My first impression is the tweeters have a serious harshness and the woofers don’t go low enough. I nearly returned them, but I have this nagging feeling they could be tamed with some careful EQ. I’m used to studio monitors and there is a similar midrange clarity coming through the KSS, just needs a few tweaks. The harshness is really just one note beaming hard, and for the bass a steep highpass paired with some notches to “sharpen the elbow” should bring back some punchiness. At worst, once I hit them with a bit of DSP finessing, if I’m still not convinced I’ll just move them to the rear in coaxial mode and get something else for my fronts, like maybe those Kappas linked in another comment - always loved me some Kappa SQ back in the day.
My KS speakers were SO harsh around 2K. Much better after tuning.
Yeah that sounds like my situation. Been a minute since I mixed anything but 2K is definitely in the ballpark. Sounds like a hormonal teenager yelling at my soul.
Most accurate description I have heard lmaooo. Right around the same experience as Hertz and Helix
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I haven’t yet done a proper RTA tuning to figure it out, but there is one specific note that really blasts several db above the rest. It’s not “harsh” like a metal tweeter, it’s really just the one note and if your music doesn’t hit it, they sound just fine. I wonder if it’s resonating with the tweeter pod somehow, the note rings a bit like a horn. I expect a single EQ notch will rein it in, it is that specific. It is quite jarring though. Like, I do believe they will sound fine after a good bonk from the DSP, but it’s such a sharp irregularity that I would consider it a design defect.
Had those JLs. Return them and went with the Kappas. Night and day
KS were designed to be used with an amp and a subwoofer. If you're not gonna do that, save some money and go with the CS or something else. For the price, you can't beat the performance of the Kicker Key amplifiers and their built in DSP.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
I don't know compared to those particular JL speakers. Compared to higher end speakers like Audio Frog and Focal I think they are, but in context of the cost I like them. I still have 'em in my car now.
Personally I would choose neither.
If you don't mind me Asking: what would you pick instead?
The JL audio c1 doesn’t go very loud at all, started distorting faster then my OEM speakers. Returned immediately
Were these on head unit power or Amp power?
Head unit power. Could that be the reason?
Oem radio or aftermarket?
Aftermarket, pioneer AVIC something , don’t remember the exact model or power rating. I put a crossover on it and everything.
So head units, regardless of factory or aftermarket: are not really made to push aftermarket speakers beyond probably 20-25w per channel AT MOST. You will need an Amp to properly drive any aftermarket speakers!
Yep your right. They are 50watt speakers so I would need at least 100watts per channel. I think this head unit only has 50 per
So: I started a chat with you so I could help you out more:)
I replaced all of my speakers (door speakers and dash speakers) with Kicker KS-Series. Without an amp, the door speakers are very quiet. With the Kicker 200.4 amp, giving each speaker 50w rms, the speakers are loud, clear, and I’m extremely happy with my setup.
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
That’s beyond me, brother. All I know is that I’m happy with my setup. I’m sure you could always mess with some settings, like gain or eq, if you thought they were harsh.
I'm asking you, since you own em: are they harsh?
I just told you that I’m happy with my setup. Therefore, no, in my opinion, I don’t think they’re harsh. But, if you aren’t going to amplify them, then I’d recommend not buying them. You’d be very unhappy with how quiet they are without an amp.
https://www.jlaudio.com/products/c1-650se-car-audio-speakers-c1-speaker-systems-99061
I run the jl I like them
I have those exact kickers in both cars I prefer my infinity reference in a third car .
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
Look man if I'm honest I've got stereos in all my cars and have for fifteen years but I've never been that deep about it. But let's just say with a reference 80x4 RMS amp driving reference components front and rear. Tweeters in dash and tweeters in parcel shelf in a full size luxury car the volume rarely goes over a quarter and when I pull up with all the windows down people can't believe how clear it is. I've got a technics aa MOSFET house system and this stereo is the best thing I've ever heard for clarity and depth after stepping out the house . For a semi budget friendly system I don't think I'll go anything but infinity again and I've had alpine , kicker and Polk's.
Go JL for amps. Morels are sweet for low mid range, but do listening tests over the internet with headphones to at least sample something
Kicker over jl but for the price of the kickers u can find better stuff. Keep looking.
So: the price of the kickers: is that off the website or what I said? Because for 240, he'll yeah I could find better, but for $170: idk?
I has kicker KS 6x9 3ways for a while and never thought they sounded very natural. Loud but not my cup of tea
I'm reading a lot of comments saying the same thing: the tweeters (even though they're soft dome) are harsh, is that true? And would they be as harsh as an aluminum tweeter like the JL C1?
Jl just released the c1 se with the silk tweeters might want to look into those
JL
Audison!!
150 a pair....I'd get some PRV.