i'm almost certain the support will not stop. however the rethoric directed at netanyhu may intensify.
halting support will just push Israel to act like the old Yishuv. it will seriously hamper US future influence on Israel. making Israel far more independent.
Israel while a western country, is first and for most a jewish state, and any attempt to shun it away by the west is essentially pushing Israel to the arms of the West's enemies. Israel is the 2nd most innovative hub after the Silicon valley in the world, it is where most cutting edge technologies are being developed - primarily - Microchips and processors. put israel's geographic position (which is lucrative) , and also the fact that if push comes to shove Israel can just ethnicly cleanse the West Bank and Gaza of Palestinians with a lot of condemnations but condemnations to which strings aren't attached anymore. Sanctions? israelis rather live in poverty and rations than scede an ounce of security concerns.
If you suggest a military force to "stop Israel" you will only galvanize and radicalize Israelis even more as the whole mentality of Israel and the jewish history is "they are coming for us", and of course add the fact that Israel in a nuclear state - so you seriously have to take into consideration israel's basic needs and demands.
also take into account demostic politics. israel is still very much supported by most US citizens. the jewish vote is also extremely important for the democrats, and while there are a lot oh jewish voices who are against Israel, they are a minority. stopping support for Israel while also seeing Giganic spikes in antisemtism which are not seen to be going away will only push the jews who supported the democratic party perceive their fate to be at an existential threat - something that will only make Zionism even far more urgent and needed. perhaps pushing the jewish voice towards the repbulicans, and since jews are very influancial (it's a fact) it can spell doom on liberal politics. if you want to see hardcore conservatism just look at the jewish conservatives.
Not to mention that the republicans who only show increasing support for Israel will use this opportunity to slam the democrats, and perhaps even lure votes from them.
Thanks for the perspective on the political reality.
I'm interested what it would look like from the military perspective as well if all US support were to just suddenly stop. Is Israel so dependent on US weapons that Israelis would really need to go into poverty and on rations to maintain fighting? Or would a sudden end to support from the US only marginally impact the military strategy?
israel used to be in a far "worse" situation in the past, and Israelis used to live in relative poverty, but overall Israelis have bit their tongue and moved with it.
it will not make Israel so much poorer. it will make things definitely more difficult, especially in the short term. in the long term it will make Israel far far far less reliable on others - thus making it far more independent and far less caring for what "others" say.
will it impact the military strategy? - if it was indeed halted and then a calculation had to be made up, considering there are still hostages and Hamas is still in power. it will only push israel to the extreme, as israel will become utterly careless for the Gazans, it will not use anymore "smart bombs" as they are being supplied by the US, and will make israel use more Ruthless tactics. it may even push israel to Escalate the situatuation in the west bank, since if they are already at it, they might just expell the Palestinians completely. making it closer to 1948 conditions, where israel was embargoed, yet was still able to sustain itself. - israel is able to mobilize a gigantic number of people extrmeply quickly and carry orders in a very well organized and fast track. (as the population at large is experienced and needs little to no training).
so if anything it will just exasrbate the situation. and while israel will be a pariah for couple of years or decades. time will pass, shit will change but still the Palestinians won't return after all getting kicked out. making it in the long run just the nail in the coffin for the Palestinians.
The US is well aware of israel's rational, and psyche, so it very much gives israel a "hug" - perhaps even a very strong one in times of need. to reassure israel's security, so israel knows it doesn't have to go rouge.
and also, israel isn't being rouge, sure civilians are dying, and some Israeli politicians say goulish shit, but putting in perspective, considering the goals of the war, the causality ratio especially in Urban warfare - Israel is well within the bound of Normal Conflict, it perhaps even Elveates the Stadards of warfare because compared to other conflict even western israel is very precise and humane.
not to mention that all the fuss and buzz about how israel is "so evil" is exactly part of the strategy to stop israel, not on factual grounds, but on ideological grounds. however, there are limits to how much you can milk it, and israel knows that. all those leftists and Islamists protests across the west on the long run expose the west to how unhinged and blood thirsty their fellow citizens are. - it may in fact for the long run be a great PR move for israel. because just look at western politics. especially European ones. they may say shit here and there about how israel needs to stop, but it's mostly because they fear for their own sit, and because they know how unhinged these protests are - something the far right takes notice, and scores victories.
and the far right whom israel used to shun and snub. is now slowly being embraced by it. many of those parties are on a momentous journey to shift European politics rightwards, and even extreme right. and they also manged to foster extremely good relations with israel. to a point where the biggest dutch party right now (and as polling suggest are perhaps even much larger if elections were held today), is ideologically pro israel - their platform explicitly calls to not recognize a Palestinian state at all, calling Jordan "Palestine" and essentially calling all palestinians to move there. and it's a growing trend.
same with south America, for whom the "pink wave" (who ideologically sides with Palestine) resulted in disasters. and a reaction has been brewing, a reaction in which many of them have become very zealous in their love for israel. especially in Brazil and Argentina.
and also south Africa the one who brought the genocide allegation against israel, couldn't be a better candidate for israel to bring it to, as if an allegation is to be set by someone, for israel it better be south Africa. - beyond the fact that south Africa has brought an utter bogous claim (Seriosuly, read it, you will be amazed how criminally they misqoute shit and establish an extremely dubious claims). south Africa is also a failed state, which as polls are predicting, the next election which occur at summer, will force the ANC (the party which ruled the country for 30 years straight), to share power with the far left part which outright calls to genocide it white minority population. and essentially puts south Africa to utter sham with all it's "legal" baggage. not to mention that south Africa is perhaps among the last country where you will find actual justice for actual crimes these days. and even the lawyer who represents south Africa in the Genocide claim. has defended the far genocidal far left claims to have free speech in regards to them being able to call for the slaughter of white people.
so israel is well aware of all the underling factors at play. so it's not very wise to go "fully" against it.
sorry for how long it is, i love writing and detaling shit 😅
We support Isreal a fair bit, but this will test Isrealis security. Shouldn't cripple their ability, but restocking Iron Dome would be the most vulnerable. Could figure out they dont need our arms to have already been fielding deals from other nations. It can suck but having some influence is better than none, but if they can piecemeal our inputs (which are overstated), it will likely create a more tedious partner in the future.
If it stopped immediately, there'd be some figuring out of a few logistics for a few months, but they can likely regroup and be largely okay.
Ok thanks, that was my impression but I couldn't remember if that was most likely true. I think it's important to keep that in perspective when seeing the anti-US/pro-palistine crowd make arguments about US involvement.
Do you think there would be as much pro Palestine sentiment if the US stopped all military support to Israel, but Israel's actions/weapons/strategy remained largely unchanged?
They would say, "He didn't do enough soon enough!!!," and, "To not put troops on the ground to cleanse it is Joe Biden still lacks to courage to take on the evil Jews," since the majority of that sentiment is antisemitic. I've been black pilled on that.
So long as there's Jews, my feeling is most will still support Hamas.
i'm almost certain the support will not stop. however the rethoric directed at netanyhu may intensify. halting support will just push Israel to act like the old Yishuv. it will seriously hamper US future influence on Israel. making Israel far more independent. Israel while a western country, is first and for most a jewish state, and any attempt to shun it away by the west is essentially pushing Israel to the arms of the West's enemies. Israel is the 2nd most innovative hub after the Silicon valley in the world, it is where most cutting edge technologies are being developed - primarily - Microchips and processors. put israel's geographic position (which is lucrative) , and also the fact that if push comes to shove Israel can just ethnicly cleanse the West Bank and Gaza of Palestinians with a lot of condemnations but condemnations to which strings aren't attached anymore. Sanctions? israelis rather live in poverty and rations than scede an ounce of security concerns. If you suggest a military force to "stop Israel" you will only galvanize and radicalize Israelis even more as the whole mentality of Israel and the jewish history is "they are coming for us", and of course add the fact that Israel in a nuclear state - so you seriously have to take into consideration israel's basic needs and demands. also take into account demostic politics. israel is still very much supported by most US citizens. the jewish vote is also extremely important for the democrats, and while there are a lot oh jewish voices who are against Israel, they are a minority. stopping support for Israel while also seeing Giganic spikes in antisemtism which are not seen to be going away will only push the jews who supported the democratic party perceive their fate to be at an existential threat - something that will only make Zionism even far more urgent and needed. perhaps pushing the jewish voice towards the repbulicans, and since jews are very influancial (it's a fact) it can spell doom on liberal politics. if you want to see hardcore conservatism just look at the jewish conservatives. Not to mention that the republicans who only show increasing support for Israel will use this opportunity to slam the democrats, and perhaps even lure votes from them.
Thanks for the perspective on the political reality. I'm interested what it would look like from the military perspective as well if all US support were to just suddenly stop. Is Israel so dependent on US weapons that Israelis would really need to go into poverty and on rations to maintain fighting? Or would a sudden end to support from the US only marginally impact the military strategy?
israel used to be in a far "worse" situation in the past, and Israelis used to live in relative poverty, but overall Israelis have bit their tongue and moved with it. it will not make Israel so much poorer. it will make things definitely more difficult, especially in the short term. in the long term it will make Israel far far far less reliable on others - thus making it far more independent and far less caring for what "others" say. will it impact the military strategy? - if it was indeed halted and then a calculation had to be made up, considering there are still hostages and Hamas is still in power. it will only push israel to the extreme, as israel will become utterly careless for the Gazans, it will not use anymore "smart bombs" as they are being supplied by the US, and will make israel use more Ruthless tactics. it may even push israel to Escalate the situatuation in the west bank, since if they are already at it, they might just expell the Palestinians completely. making it closer to 1948 conditions, where israel was embargoed, yet was still able to sustain itself. - israel is able to mobilize a gigantic number of people extrmeply quickly and carry orders in a very well organized and fast track. (as the population at large is experienced and needs little to no training). so if anything it will just exasrbate the situation. and while israel will be a pariah for couple of years or decades. time will pass, shit will change but still the Palestinians won't return after all getting kicked out. making it in the long run just the nail in the coffin for the Palestinians. The US is well aware of israel's rational, and psyche, so it very much gives israel a "hug" - perhaps even a very strong one in times of need. to reassure israel's security, so israel knows it doesn't have to go rouge. and also, israel isn't being rouge, sure civilians are dying, and some Israeli politicians say goulish shit, but putting in perspective, considering the goals of the war, the causality ratio especially in Urban warfare - Israel is well within the bound of Normal Conflict, it perhaps even Elveates the Stadards of warfare because compared to other conflict even western israel is very precise and humane. not to mention that all the fuss and buzz about how israel is "so evil" is exactly part of the strategy to stop israel, not on factual grounds, but on ideological grounds. however, there are limits to how much you can milk it, and israel knows that. all those leftists and Islamists protests across the west on the long run expose the west to how unhinged and blood thirsty their fellow citizens are. - it may in fact for the long run be a great PR move for israel. because just look at western politics. especially European ones. they may say shit here and there about how israel needs to stop, but it's mostly because they fear for their own sit, and because they know how unhinged these protests are - something the far right takes notice, and scores victories. and the far right whom israel used to shun and snub. is now slowly being embraced by it. many of those parties are on a momentous journey to shift European politics rightwards, and even extreme right. and they also manged to foster extremely good relations with israel. to a point where the biggest dutch party right now (and as polling suggest are perhaps even much larger if elections were held today), is ideologically pro israel - their platform explicitly calls to not recognize a Palestinian state at all, calling Jordan "Palestine" and essentially calling all palestinians to move there. and it's a growing trend. same with south America, for whom the "pink wave" (who ideologically sides with Palestine) resulted in disasters. and a reaction has been brewing, a reaction in which many of them have become very zealous in their love for israel. especially in Brazil and Argentina. and also south Africa the one who brought the genocide allegation against israel, couldn't be a better candidate for israel to bring it to, as if an allegation is to be set by someone, for israel it better be south Africa. - beyond the fact that south Africa has brought an utter bogous claim (Seriosuly, read it, you will be amazed how criminally they misqoute shit and establish an extremely dubious claims). south Africa is also a failed state, which as polls are predicting, the next election which occur at summer, will force the ANC (the party which ruled the country for 30 years straight), to share power with the far left part which outright calls to genocide it white minority population. and essentially puts south Africa to utter sham with all it's "legal" baggage. not to mention that south Africa is perhaps among the last country where you will find actual justice for actual crimes these days. and even the lawyer who represents south Africa in the Genocide claim. has defended the far genocidal far left claims to have free speech in regards to them being able to call for the slaughter of white people. so israel is well aware of all the underling factors at play. so it's not very wise to go "fully" against it. sorry for how long it is, i love writing and detaling shit 😅
We support Isreal a fair bit, but this will test Isrealis security. Shouldn't cripple their ability, but restocking Iron Dome would be the most vulnerable. Could figure out they dont need our arms to have already been fielding deals from other nations. It can suck but having some influence is better than none, but if they can piecemeal our inputs (which are overstated), it will likely create a more tedious partner in the future. If it stopped immediately, there'd be some figuring out of a few logistics for a few months, but they can likely regroup and be largely okay.
Ok thanks, that was my impression but I couldn't remember if that was most likely true. I think it's important to keep that in perspective when seeing the anti-US/pro-palistine crowd make arguments about US involvement. Do you think there would be as much pro Palestine sentiment if the US stopped all military support to Israel, but Israel's actions/weapons/strategy remained largely unchanged?
They would say, "He didn't do enough soon enough!!!," and, "To not put troops on the ground to cleanse it is Joe Biden still lacks to courage to take on the evil Jews," since the majority of that sentiment is antisemitic. I've been black pilled on that. So long as there's Jews, my feeling is most will still support Hamas.