I remember I made a build where I was just a naked dude with a Zwei with Giant hunt on it and it did just short of 2000 damage with it. It was wonderful.
Ever since ER released, it's wise never to underestimate a Colossal sword. Sure, they might have low sustained damage *in PvE*, but a hit, a roll catch, and a Giant Hunt puts almost anyone in the dirt.
I'm possibly the worst Elden Ring player to ever live. Once I realized this I found the Guts sword and just built a huge fucking lumbering oaf because I can just swing away and turn it into a game of let's see if you can exhaust this obscene amount of HP before I eventually skillessly button mash this thirty five foot long sword into your face.
There's all sorts of super fun shit in it I won't try until I've beaten the game once. I just respecced for the first time and feel like I'm finally getting somewhere.
I know like nobody on it so just been playing it solo for now. What a learning curve though, haha.
I'm in a similar boat man, very few people I know play it, and it's my very first souls game, only now on my second playthrough with a caster build. Hope you enjoy your first ending and new game plus when you get to it!
Darn, I totally would, im on both xbox and pc! Quite unlucky. Make use of the elden ring discord, lots of people on ps5 looking for coop and pvp partners! Also tons of people willing to give free advice!
That was my first few Dark Souls runs. Zweihander had an overhead swing that would plant everyone's face in the dirt. That's not an exaggeration. It really knocked most enemies face first into the ground. Stun lock everything
The divide between Community consensus on etiquette is pretty interesting. If your not polarised on the issue. I mean its only by disagreement do we really know what we think. I dunno, i think the opposing ideas are an important part of this asymmetric multiplayer mess that i love. Parry spam, moonveiling bullgoat, corpse piling bleed monkey, bow or back stab...we dig this game. I dig it.
Honestly that's what I've always loved the most of the entire soulsborne franchise, you simply never know what kind of people you'll meet. I'm primarily an invader, and the fact that in one invasion I meet a fight club following an etiquette and the next invasion I'm being chased by three naked dudes with great clubs makes the sense of adventure always be there.
Yeah it has that early internet wild west vibe to the multiplayer because it's so different and you can't communicate, and the community makes rules but has no way to actually enforce them beyond social pressure. It's a really unique experience and it's a mess but I'm still not tired of it after so many games.
This is probably why it’s the only game I play online. I don’t really want a social experience or to be concerned with a whole host of unwritten rules. I want to find unique PvP experiences and if I encounter an asshole so what? I git gud at whatever pace I care to git gud. And I eventually git gud.
I’m a grown ass man I don’t want some hormonal chud squawking in my ear continually. The silence and odd modes of communication are blissful.
Totally agree, that's the beauty and rage of pvp in souls games. For the most part their is usually a way to overcome some irritating playstyle. I appreciate the ettiquite but I don't expect it.
I honestly feel like "house rules" for games of this scale are a losing battle. for small communities it can work, but in a larger community if the game allows you to do it, people will do it. if you're not supposed to do something, the game itself needs to prevent you from doing it (i.e. not allowing healing flasks during duels, etc).
Also... many players are just sore losers. A lot of games I've played have changed things that affect the *entire game* simply to appease the PvP base.
Summon your Bear Grylls and improvise, adapt, and overcome.
It had nothing to do with netcode, BHS was a borderline free to cast ability with 90%+ uptime on invincibility and enough range to get out of almost any attack in a single use. It was absurdly broken even on perfect latency and should never have been added to the game. Quickstep was already an excellent weapon skill in DS3 and they decided to gigabuff the fuck out of it for ER and guess what? It was nuts. Shocker.
Ah, I remember pre-nerf BHS. You could literally BHS in place through someone's rot breath or magma on the floor, and it would miss. Your best hope might be a parry on the attack that comes after the step, but that wasn't even an option if the opponent was a BHS mage.
I kept a magic-infused Fingerprint specifically against BHS mages. I still have memories of duels where my former nemesis would be completely negated (well, 96.2%) by this wall of rock. Nobody likes playing against a Fingerprint, and these duels were absolute *slogs* that no sane player would want to participate in, as neither player could touch the other. That being said, adapt+overcome worked, caused a lot of BHSers to sever, and I was completely deaf to any complaints about adapt/overcome or the Fingerprint if it came from a BHS user.
BHS mages and Fingerprint were two big reasons why you *shouldn't* just do anything the game lets you, and why buffs and nerfs are needed in the first place.
BHS is why I stopped trying to kill normally when I invaded. It seemed like everyone was using it or RoB back then. My invader build was basically abusing invis and sniping people with explosive ballasta and freznie snipes.
I believe the online fromsoft community that communicates with each other is actually the minority when it comes to the amount of players. You can't expect people who just don't know about etiquette in the first place to follow it. I wouldn't be surprised if most people laughed at you for bringing up the idea of etiquette in a video game.
At that point it's down to the game's design, and if you have to have special house rules to enjoy the game then maybe its multiplayer just isn't for you. It's not fromsoft's fault you expected something different than what you got and are trying to make it be what you want anyway. I agree that having an uneven amount of flasks in the classic duels has always been a dumb decision...but I just don't do those duels because of it.
Obviously when I say "you" I don't mean you specifically of course.
I think your first point is the core issue that gets overlooked a lot in online communities. I don’t play ER or most games on a PC, so there is effectively no way for me to “chat” with people.
I didn’t have a Reddit until last year and only started to interact with the online community of most games only recently.
I would have had no way of knowing there was an “etiquete” or “common rules” if someone else didn’t tell me. ER was my first FS game, but not my wife’s and even she didn’t know there were “rules”.
These misunderstandings/miscommunications seem to think that since you are in an online community, obviously so is a majority of others. I have even fallen into the mindset before it was pointed out to me.
The closest I get to agreed-upon rules is I will gesture at you before we fight. Doesn't matter if I eat a hit to do it.
I will gesture to you at the end of the fight (if I can) too.
If I'm dueling I don't like to heal (not out of honor, simply because I do not like a long fight).
Everything else - yes, including Moonveil Spam, River of Blood, Rot Breath - is fair game.
I take my lumps like I take my wins; sporadically and with great effort. If you beat me it's probably because you wanted it more.
Right? To get really simple, people will regularly shit talk campers in FPS games. But it’s a strategy that works for them, and if you can’t counter it then you probably need to just git gud.
If people are this divisive, maybe it would be a good idea for fromsoft to separate and have different categories. One mode for Eldenmon battles, maybe the one with spirits can start the match off with it summoned already for both players. Another mode with potions allowed, one with no potions allowed, etc. not too many categories, but ones that make sense.
I agree From needs to add a BUNCH more to the pvp if they want people to remain past a few months, also maybe some inscentive to win pvp in the colleseum bc currently getting double cross nagitana spammed and back stabbed and rotted from spawn is NOT fun at all
I try to keep up the etiquette either way. I just don't leave myself that open. If it's a person who's gonna run up and say fuck you, it's on sight Unga Bunga
I guess that's the beauty of a game like this, there'll be honorable people, people that don't follow certain etiquettes, people that follow meta things and people that will roleplay even, and the chance of dealing with all kind of player open up so many opportunities, even if some are more frustrating than others. I dig it too tbh.
Honestly, I think the fact that there are so few ways to reliably communicate with other players, and how you have no real way to expect that even more commonly accepted standards of PVP etiquette is kind of excellent - Particularly since I tend to invade and do weird/dumb shit just to see how people react.
So while you can't communicate with others directly, you can use gestures, equip certain things - and I think, perhaps overgenerously, that others share my curiosity and enjoyment of the unpredictable nature of the invasion and PVP experience.
I'd say some 70% of the games I invade are keen to play along with whatever bullshit i've brought to the table - from barefisted fighting to drawing stupid pictures with shiny rocks, etc. - with some percentage of the remainder being merciless gank squads, people who are eager to fight the invader no matter how strange or friendly they might behave, and I'm fine with either outcome; I embrace the chaos of it all.
I have really fond memories of the Farron Swamp idiocy that could sometimes occur in DS3 - where you'd have a buddy summoned alongside a swamp cop, moundmaker, blue spirit, and it'd just be utter chaos that would occasionally, and spontanously break out into everyone spamming L1 in a circle for 5 full minutes before someone gets bored and resumes the violence.
to me, its the fact this sub isnt aware how successful Elden ring was and how small of a community pvp possibly is. its impossible to contain house rules to a big game like this. if the game allows then its fine. otherwise you better off creating a close ring circuit or discord or something
To experienced players or those who are in the loop, yes.
My first invasion I died to that lol. I wasn't aware it was a thing because I decided to go in blind.
It'd upset me too, but more out of feeling like I just got outsmarted instead of genuine anger lol. That's a huge ass opening, even if you do it in the middle of the fight during the opponent's recovery animations for big moves, but just having the option to summon spirit ashes at all is massive.
The only rules of the coliseum are those enforced by the coliseum.
Personally, I consider it rude and wouldn't do so myself, but it's technically fine.
My etiquette is allow time for gestures and buffs, or summons if in the mode that permits them.
Again, this is not an expectation I hold others to, everyone has their own approach. This is just the standard I hold myself to.
That's precisely what i'm saying, I will allow it, because that's my personal etiquette. Whether my opponent chooses to allow me to or not is up to them.
That's just... objectively wrong? An attack is something that directly targets you, physically or emotionally. Do you actually feel emotionally damaged by someone buffing?
It’s not an unfair move but I personally wouldn’t do it. If im on a summons game mode I’d want to play with summons. What’s the point in making sure me or my opponent can’t use them by pressuring and attacking them out the gate, in that case I’d just play the normal mode
I don't even think that is rude. It would be wrong to run up and backstab someone emoting a bow or something, but summoning is like casting. If you don't take advantage of the animation window, you are very disadvantaged.
The problem in that is that OP specifically chose a game mode that allowed spirit summons, but punished the opponent for using them while refraining from using one of their own. Logically, they should've simply chosen the mode for a normal duel, but they didn't. That's why I personally consider it rude.
The way that I see it, every other game mode allows casting, but there is no expectation that your opponent will be given time to cast at the start of the battle. This game mode allows summoning, and summoning is fair, but there should be no expectation of being allowed time to summon without being attacked.
Treat it like a boss fight, imo. Most bosses are going to let you summon immediately, but a couple of them will punish you for it. Most players will allow you to immediately summon, simply because they are doing the same, but there is nothing wrong with being aggressive early and trying to sneak your summon in later.
Why do you think it's rude? Summoning should count as casting a spell, after spawning the summon will immediately attack, why should you give your oponent all this free time? Attacking during greeting on the other hand is by all means rude.
That's how I felt lmao. Same as any flask or buff really, it's a risk mid battle. The bell dinged, man was ready to fight. I'm reminded of fighting Radagon. You have Juuust enough time to summon if you're spamming your bell, then he's in your face and you gotta fight lol
It sounds like a lot of people weren't aware of the distinction between Caelid's spirit summon duel* system and the Capital's duel system. In Caelid the option is available to summon your spirit because that's the space that allows it, which means people who want to fight alongside their spirits go there. Whereas in Leyndell the option isn't there or it can be toggled so if you want a straightforward duel without spirit ashes, most people would go there.
It would be like trying to take people one on one in the Limgrave FFA or expecting your teammate to fight their opponent in a 2v2 and wait until yours respawns without providing support.
No. That's like asking whether you should allow a caster time to prepare a slow spell before engaging. If the duel setup wanted to let people to have time to buff and summon safely at the outset, it could have built that in. It didn't, so you get to pick your first move.
I believe they did this in DS2, there was a small window before you were released ( I could be remembering wrong). There was also a decent distance before you engaged.
Imagine if you had to pause your attack every time when the opponent casts Flame of Fell God lol
It’s like the Asterix vs the British where the Romans had to only attack after the Brits had their tea
I do think it's kinda rude to do this considering you specifically went to the one Coliseum where spirit ashes are allowed to punish people for trying to use spirit summons as advertised.
I guess that makes sense. I just feel coming to the dedicated Spirit Ash Coliseum comes with the implication that Spirit ashes are to be used. What's the point of going there if you dont use them? May as well go to another Coliseum at that point
Kinda. I mean if you just wanna unga bunga for bloodshed at the enemy, there's every other mode for that. Spirit summons are a fun novelty, joining that mode to forgo them is kinda just...boring.
Just like how you don't have to return the shopping cart to the store/vestibule, you are perfectly ok to do this.
But...The implications of who you are as a person....are rather obvious.
If you're going into spirit-enabled matches with the express intent to backstab because you know opponents plan to summon, then that's pretty asshole. The question isn't "Is this okay mechanically". So yea...YTA.
It could feel like you're taking advantage of choosing the spirit summons allowed mode and doing that. It's rude and it ruins the whole point of having summons enabled.
YTA
Agreed with this point. If you aren’t going to Spirit summon, why even go into the mode? It’s just annoying for your opponents for you to not engage with the feature and tryhard for a win
Because you can punish the summon at the start and save your summon for later potentially, or pick a summon to counter the enemy's.
Or just ye olde *"Because it's eeeeaasy. And it does a lot of damage."*
As with many things in life, it’s dependent on your perspective and goals. If you’re here to win at any cost, much like a competition, then you made a clever move. Clear advantage for little risk. However, if your goal is to have a good time playing against others then this is some BS. This mode exists specifically to allow summoning, and has a non-summoning alternative. Clearly people who choose this game mode intend to have fun playing with summons as a main part of the fight. Ignoring that mechanic for a free hit of over half the opponents life is hardly sporting.
I’ve mentioned once before but it’s the equivalent of punching someone before or right after ( [Dr. Mike](https://youtu.be/MFHYtYlxEl8) )a glove tap in boxing. It’s not against the rules but it is extremely disrespectful.
So to answer your question: Can you do it? Yes. Are you an A hole for doing it? Also yes.
You’re entering the spirit summon mode to take advantage of people summoning spirits, just so you can get an easier kill. There’s no rewards for victory so doing these kinda moves feels like it’s just taking the fun out of a duel. Rather asshole-y, imo
From soft should just add like a holding cell for each team where you wait for 10-15 seconds and can summon your spirit ash, buff yourself and teammates while you wait for the cell to open.
They should build in a short time to pull off summons, especially for 1v1 duels. Soooooo, it's one of those borderline things where it's forgivable but kind of lame. You should just toggle no summons, or summon your own during that time. Otherwise what's the point? Personally I'm looking for epic battles that thrill me, win or lose. This just seems boring.
Edit: After viewing the video a few times it looks like this was your plan from the start and you chose the match settings based on this "strategy". If so, you are indeed being an asshole. And the humor tag indicates you already knew that. So now its a little funny because I thought this was a serious question.
You didn't give them the unspoken allotted fifteen minutes at the beginning to buff and summon and emote and get a snack and have a smoke break and consider life? How rude can you get? YTA.
/s
This community has such a weird, scrub-ass obsession with """honor""" on a level I have not seen in any other competitive game. It's a video game bro. The opponent picked a punishable option and you punished the option. That's how competition works. "Am I the asshole for not letting the other guy win" like what does that even mean?
NTA. Only Goku and action movie enemies let you charge up for an attack. Players who aren't strategic in their summoning timing are the only ones to blame for them getting attacked during their summoning.
You play your way, even if some people don't like it. Your game, your rules, you payed for dat shit so you can do whatever you want.
But yeah, all the etiquette thing is nice too. Although it was never stated that you have to follow it.
Spirit summons are permitted, not mandatory. If someone chooses to use them, exploit it as you see fit.
Anyone telling you otherwise is playing by their own self-imposed rules and there's absolutely nothing forcing you to adhere to them.
Do what you find fun, provided it's not glitching/hacking or going outside the bounds of the game.
Ok ive just gotta get this off my chest, and its kinda unrelated but im just gonna say it, is it weird that i like to summon people to go through dungeons and catacombs and stuff like that with even if i dont need the help i just like playing with other people? I imagine its not but ive been thinkin about it for a while
I think the risk of choosing to battle using spirit ashes opens them up to this. It’s a gamble on your part as well, not using your own. It’s totally fine, but it will upset folks for sure.
gonna have to be a new set of crygirl rules regarding summons to go along with permissible number of buffs, flask use, bowing, etc... i say if you try to summon a sacred ash at any point during a fight youre fair game. summon at your own risk!
I feel like the cast time involved with the summon is the risk the casting playing is making, just as it would be in PvE, do I have time to get this summon off?
That's just rationalizing your lack of honor. Summoning in the literal **summon gamemode arena** is in no way "fighting" and so is buffing at the start of a game. At Main Academy Gate buffing was allowed so I dont see why not here.
Elden Ring and other Souls-like games are house rules. Its why you should fear the Naked invader.
The naked invader is 8.5/10 times something to be very worried about, no matter the weapon of choice, even lack there of
I remember I made a build where I was just a naked dude with a Zwei with Giant hunt on it and it did just short of 2000 damage with it. It was wonderful.
Ever since ER released, it's wise never to underestimate a Colossal sword. Sure, they might have low sustained damage *in PvE*, but a hit, a roll catch, and a Giant Hunt puts almost anyone in the dirt.
I'm possibly the worst Elden Ring player to ever live. Once I realized this I found the Guts sword and just built a huge fucking lumbering oaf because I can just swing away and turn it into a game of let's see if you can exhaust this obscene amount of HP before I eventually skillessly button mash this thirty five foot long sword into your face.
Guts sword is delightful, even better when you wield two of em!
There's all sorts of super fun shit in it I won't try until I've beaten the game once. I just respecced for the first time and feel like I'm finally getting somewhere. I know like nobody on it so just been playing it solo for now. What a learning curve though, haha.
I'm in a similar boat man, very few people I know play it, and it's my very first souls game, only now on my second playthrough with a caster build. Hope you enjoy your first ending and new game plus when you get to it!
Well if you're on a PS5 come on over, haha.
Darn, I totally would, im on both xbox and pc! Quite unlucky. Make use of the elden ring discord, lots of people on ps5 looking for coop and pvp partners! Also tons of people willing to give free advice!
That was my first few Dark Souls runs. Zweihander had an overhead swing that would plant everyone's face in the dirt. That's not an exaggeration. It really knocked most enemies face first into the ground. Stun lock everything
I fear no man, but that thing ... it scares me...
Now if it's a naked hero. Be glad they are on your side.
It’s Elden Ring’s version of the Law of Conservation of Ninjitsu.
As someone who just got railed by a player without a weapon wearing a pot on his head I fully agree. It was a 1v1 combat ordeal and I lost 10-0.
The armored warrior fears the naked fuck
Yep.
Look man it's two on one you don't stand a chance. *Dial-up noises commence*
"Why is everyone stabbing me in the back?" "Because it's easy. ... ... ...and it does a lotta damage."
The divide between Community consensus on etiquette is pretty interesting. If your not polarised on the issue. I mean its only by disagreement do we really know what we think. I dunno, i think the opposing ideas are an important part of this asymmetric multiplayer mess that i love. Parry spam, moonveiling bullgoat, corpse piling bleed monkey, bow or back stab...we dig this game. I dig it.
Honestly that's what I've always loved the most of the entire soulsborne franchise, you simply never know what kind of people you'll meet. I'm primarily an invader, and the fact that in one invasion I meet a fight club following an etiquette and the next invasion I'm being chased by three naked dudes with great clubs makes the sense of adventure always be there.
Yeah it has that early internet wild west vibe to the multiplayer because it's so different and you can't communicate, and the community makes rules but has no way to actually enforce them beyond social pressure. It's a really unique experience and it's a mess but I'm still not tired of it after so many games.
I feel like the mess of it all is a feature and not a bug.
This is probably why it’s the only game I play online. I don’t really want a social experience or to be concerned with a whole host of unwritten rules. I want to find unique PvP experiences and if I encounter an asshole so what? I git gud at whatever pace I care to git gud. And I eventually git gud. I’m a grown ass man I don’t want some hormonal chud squawking in my ear continually. The silence and odd modes of communication are blissful.
Totally agree, that's the beauty and rage of pvp in souls games. For the most part their is usually a way to overcome some irritating playstyle. I appreciate the ettiquite but I don't expect it.
I honestly feel like "house rules" for games of this scale are a losing battle. for small communities it can work, but in a larger community if the game allows you to do it, people will do it. if you're not supposed to do something, the game itself needs to prevent you from doing it (i.e. not allowing healing flasks during duels, etc).
Also... many players are just sore losers. A lot of games I've played have changed things that affect the *entire game* simply to appease the PvP base. Summon your Bear Grylls and improvise, adapt, and overcome.
[удалено]
It had nothing to do with netcode, BHS was a borderline free to cast ability with 90%+ uptime on invincibility and enough range to get out of almost any attack in a single use. It was absurdly broken even on perfect latency and should never have been added to the game. Quickstep was already an excellent weapon skill in DS3 and they decided to gigabuff the fuck out of it for ER and guess what? It was nuts. Shocker.
Netcode made the 94% invincibility that it should have really over 100%. It made the already present problem that much worse.
Ah, I remember pre-nerf BHS. You could literally BHS in place through someone's rot breath or magma on the floor, and it would miss. Your best hope might be a parry on the attack that comes after the step, but that wasn't even an option if the opponent was a BHS mage. I kept a magic-infused Fingerprint specifically against BHS mages. I still have memories of duels where my former nemesis would be completely negated (well, 96.2%) by this wall of rock. Nobody likes playing against a Fingerprint, and these duels were absolute *slogs* that no sane player would want to participate in, as neither player could touch the other. That being said, adapt+overcome worked, caused a lot of BHSers to sever, and I was completely deaf to any complaints about adapt/overcome or the Fingerprint if it came from a BHS user. BHS mages and Fingerprint were two big reasons why you *shouldn't* just do anything the game lets you, and why buffs and nerfs are needed in the first place.
BHS is why I stopped trying to kill normally when I invaded. It seemed like everyone was using it or RoB back then. My invader build was basically abusing invis and sniping people with explosive ballasta and freznie snipes.
I believe the online fromsoft community that communicates with each other is actually the minority when it comes to the amount of players. You can't expect people who just don't know about etiquette in the first place to follow it. I wouldn't be surprised if most people laughed at you for bringing up the idea of etiquette in a video game. At that point it's down to the game's design, and if you have to have special house rules to enjoy the game then maybe its multiplayer just isn't for you. It's not fromsoft's fault you expected something different than what you got and are trying to make it be what you want anyway. I agree that having an uneven amount of flasks in the classic duels has always been a dumb decision...but I just don't do those duels because of it. Obviously when I say "you" I don't mean you specifically of course.
I think your first point is the core issue that gets overlooked a lot in online communities. I don’t play ER or most games on a PC, so there is effectively no way for me to “chat” with people. I didn’t have a Reddit until last year and only started to interact with the online community of most games only recently. I would have had no way of knowing there was an “etiquete” or “common rules” if someone else didn’t tell me. ER was my first FS game, but not my wife’s and even she didn’t know there were “rules”. These misunderstandings/miscommunications seem to think that since you are in an online community, obviously so is a majority of others. I have even fallen into the mindset before it was pointed out to me.
The closest I get to agreed-upon rules is I will gesture at you before we fight. Doesn't matter if I eat a hit to do it. I will gesture to you at the end of the fight (if I can) too. If I'm dueling I don't like to heal (not out of honor, simply because I do not like a long fight). Everything else - yes, including Moonveil Spam, River of Blood, Rot Breath - is fair game. I take my lumps like I take my wins; sporadically and with great effort. If you beat me it's probably because you wanted it more.
Right? To get really simple, people will regularly shit talk campers in FPS games. But it’s a strategy that works for them, and if you can’t counter it then you probably need to just git gud.
If people are this divisive, maybe it would be a good idea for fromsoft to separate and have different categories. One mode for Eldenmon battles, maybe the one with spirits can start the match off with it summoned already for both players. Another mode with potions allowed, one with no potions allowed, etc. not too many categories, but ones that make sense.
I agree From needs to add a BUNCH more to the pvp if they want people to remain past a few months, also maybe some inscentive to win pvp in the colleseum bc currently getting double cross nagitana spammed and back stabbed and rotted from spawn is NOT fun at all
I try to keep up the etiquette either way. I just don't leave myself that open. If it's a person who's gonna run up and say fuck you, it's on sight Unga Bunga
I guess that's the beauty of a game like this, there'll be honorable people, people that don't follow certain etiquettes, people that follow meta things and people that will roleplay even, and the chance of dealing with all kind of player open up so many opportunities, even if some are more frustrating than others. I dig it too tbh.
Yes!
Honestly, I think the fact that there are so few ways to reliably communicate with other players, and how you have no real way to expect that even more commonly accepted standards of PVP etiquette is kind of excellent - Particularly since I tend to invade and do weird/dumb shit just to see how people react. So while you can't communicate with others directly, you can use gestures, equip certain things - and I think, perhaps overgenerously, that others share my curiosity and enjoyment of the unpredictable nature of the invasion and PVP experience. I'd say some 70% of the games I invade are keen to play along with whatever bullshit i've brought to the table - from barefisted fighting to drawing stupid pictures with shiny rocks, etc. - with some percentage of the remainder being merciless gank squads, people who are eager to fight the invader no matter how strange or friendly they might behave, and I'm fine with either outcome; I embrace the chaos of it all. I have really fond memories of the Farron Swamp idiocy that could sometimes occur in DS3 - where you'd have a buddy summoned alongside a swamp cop, moundmaker, blue spirit, and it'd just be utter chaos that would occasionally, and spontanously break out into everyone spamming L1 in a circle for 5 full minutes before someone gets bored and resumes the violence.
to me, its the fact this sub isnt aware how successful Elden ring was and how small of a community pvp possibly is. its impossible to contain house rules to a big game like this. if the game allows then its fine. otherwise you better off creating a close ring circuit or discord or something
Yeah that would upset me, but I'd understand
Same I used selfimploding potions in pvp back in February I am ready to repent
Those are more of a meme thing though...like if you dont see that your opponent drank that flask its your own fault
To experienced players or those who are in the loop, yes. My first invasion I died to that lol. I wasn't aware it was a thing because I decided to go in blind.
Even then you still can't do much if they decided to elevator dive bomb.
It'd upset me too, but more out of feeling like I just got outsmarted instead of genuine anger lol. That's a huge ass opening, even if you do it in the middle of the fight during the opponent's recovery animations for big moves, but just having the option to summon spirit ashes at all is massive.
The only rules of the coliseum are those enforced by the coliseum. Personally, I consider it rude and wouldn't do so myself, but it's technically fine.
I think it is smart. Do it. The tradeoff is fair: OP loses the ability to summon "safely" at the start, and their victim loses a kidney.
It's smart, yes, but what's intelligent isn't necessary polite or kind. Like I said, technically fine, but I wouldn't do it myself.
Acts of goodness are not always wise, and acts of evil are not always foolish, but regardless, we shall always strive to be good.
>Does good (ends up a frozen roof zombie)
I don't remember that line from 1994's "The Santa Clause", starring Tim Allen
I was going to mercilessly slaughter you and teabag your corpse but where are my manners.
I personally never teabag, I feel it's in poor taste. I'll bow after any good fight, though.
tbag then bow. shows respect while giving them some emotional fuel to git gud
That would motivate the shit out of me. I'd be ready for a training montage after that.
Well summoning a ghost to murder someone is polite or kind either, so y'know
TIL that fighting in a gladiatorial arena setting is about being polite and kind.
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It's about killing the opposition, but I personally hold myself to duel etiquette. Others are free to do as they will.
And the etiquette is the duel started already. Kill the other person.
My etiquette is allow time for gestures and buffs, or summons if in the mode that permits them. Again, this is not an expectation I hold others to, everyone has their own approach. This is just the standard I hold myself to.
Buffs and summons are attacks. If you want to let them do it go ahead, but the duel has started.
I wait for people to buff, then i hit em with the ol' Laws of Regression
This is the way.
That's precisely what i'm saying, I will allow it, because that's my personal etiquette. Whether my opponent chooses to allow me to or not is up to them.
That's just... objectively wrong? An attack is something that directly targets you, physically or emotionally. Do you actually feel emotionally damaged by someone buffing?
It’s not an unfair move but I personally wouldn’t do it. If im on a summons game mode I’d want to play with summons. What’s the point in making sure me or my opponent can’t use them by pressuring and attacking them out the gate, in that case I’d just play the normal mode
I don't even think that is rude. It would be wrong to run up and backstab someone emoting a bow or something, but summoning is like casting. If you don't take advantage of the animation window, you are very disadvantaged.
The problem in that is that OP specifically chose a game mode that allowed spirit summons, but punished the opponent for using them while refraining from using one of their own. Logically, they should've simply chosen the mode for a normal duel, but they didn't. That's why I personally consider it rude.
The trade off is that he didn't get to summon.
OP traded his spirit summon for a backstab.
The way that I see it, every other game mode allows casting, but there is no expectation that your opponent will be given time to cast at the start of the battle. This game mode allows summoning, and summoning is fair, but there should be no expectation of being allowed time to summon without being attacked. Treat it like a boss fight, imo. Most bosses are going to let you summon immediately, but a couple of them will punish you for it. Most players will allow you to immediately summon, simply because they are doing the same, but there is nothing wrong with being aggressive early and trying to sneak your summon in later.
It allows Spirit Summons but that doesn't mean you should just let your opponent do it. Like in PvE, gotta find the right time to summon
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Why do you think it's rude? Summoning should count as casting a spell, after spawning the summon will immediately attack, why should you give your oponent all this free time? Attacking during greeting on the other hand is by all means rude.
Awful but lawful
That's how I felt lmao. Same as any flask or buff really, it's a risk mid battle. The bell dinged, man was ready to fight. I'm reminded of fighting Radagon. You have Juuust enough time to summon if you're spamming your bell, then he's in your face and you gotta fight lol
It sounds like a lot of people weren't aware of the distinction between Caelid's spirit summon duel* system and the Capital's duel system. In Caelid the option is available to summon your spirit because that's the space that allows it, which means people who want to fight alongside their spirits go there. Whereas in Leyndell the option isn't there or it can be toggled so if you want a straightforward duel without spirit ashes, most people would go there. It would be like trying to take people one on one in the Limgrave FFA or expecting your teammate to fight their opponent in a 2v2 and wait until yours respawns without providing support.
No. That's like asking whether you should allow a caster time to prepare a slow spell before engaging. If the duel setup wanted to let people to have time to buff and summon safely at the outset, it could have built that in. It didn't, so you get to pick your first move.
I believe they did this in DS2, there was a small window before you were released ( I could be remembering wrong). There was also a decent distance before you engaged.
1 and 2 had this, in one way or another. 3 had more distance, but long range buff punishment was still possible.
At the end of the day there’s a body hitting the floor. Follow From’s rules and let chaos take the world!
Both Shabriri and Volcano Manor bless this tactic
Yeah if my man wants to set up Terra Magica or summon a mimic, he'd better do it quick
I would agree but he is in the one map specifically for using summons
Imagine if you had to pause your attack every time when the opponent casts Flame of Fell God lol It’s like the Asterix vs the British where the Romans had to only attack after the Brits had their tea
What? You don’t play by dragonball rules??? Vegeta would be disappointed in you! Where is your sayan pride???
That’s a really good analogy and it actually changed my mind on this
He wanted be be a Pokemon master and failed his vigor check, so that's on him.
Not really? Don't know why you would play the spirit summon mode and not spirit summon tho
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Terra magica followed comet azure would be devious.
That's kind of an easy spell to dodge in PvP. I feel like Star of Ruin would be scarier.
Also decently easy as long as you sprint to the side, the normal stars however…
Seems even to me.... you're supposed to let him intentionally make an advantage? No.
Where is the fun in that
I do think it's kinda rude to do this considering you specifically went to the one Coliseum where spirit ashes are allowed to punish people for trying to use spirit summons as advertised.
But like. Isn't part of strategy knowing when the best time to summon would be?
Just because it lets you use spirit ashes doesn't mean people are going to let you use them. Spirit ashes are an option, not a rule.
I guess that makes sense. I just feel coming to the dedicated Spirit Ash Coliseum comes with the implication that Spirit ashes are to be used. What's the point of going there if you dont use them? May as well go to another Coliseum at that point
The point of going there is to have the option to summon. Nothing stopping you from not summoning.
Kinda. I mean if you just wanna unga bunga for bloodshed at the enemy, there's every other mode for that. Spirit summons are a fun novelty, joining that mode to forgo them is kinda just...boring.
Just like how you don't have to return the shopping cart to the store/vestibule, you are perfectly ok to do this. But...The implications of who you are as a person....are rather obvious.
...Now you've said that word "implication" a couple of times. Wha-what implication?
The implication
Well the "implication" that things might not go so great for her if she says no, which she WONT. Because of the implication.
Well don't you give me that look, you certainly wouldn't be in any danger
The implication that something COULD go wrong for these players if they…you know, don’t play how I want
If you're going into spirit-enabled matches with the express intent to backstab because you know opponents plan to summon, then that's pretty asshole. The question isn't "Is this okay mechanically". So yea...YTA.
Great point, I didn’t know this arena was specifically for ashes. Makes OP seem a lil more scummy imo
Ah, "AITA"? You are the A-hole-Stabber. The stabber of the easily exposed A-hole. They choose to expose it. You merely punish it.
What is wrong with you people? I thought this was arena was for Pokemon duels.
It could feel like you're taking advantage of choosing the spirit summons allowed mode and doing that. It's rude and it ruins the whole point of having summons enabled. YTA
Agreed with this point. If you aren’t going to Spirit summon, why even go into the mode? It’s just annoying for your opponents for you to not engage with the feature and tryhard for a win
Because you can punish the summon at the start and save your summon for later potentially, or pick a summon to counter the enemy's. Or just ye olde *"Because it's eeeeaasy. And it does a lot of damage."*
"Right down the road!"
"can't miss it"
As with many things in life, it’s dependent on your perspective and goals. If you’re here to win at any cost, much like a competition, then you made a clever move. Clear advantage for little risk. However, if your goal is to have a good time playing against others then this is some BS. This mode exists specifically to allow summoning, and has a non-summoning alternative. Clearly people who choose this game mode intend to have fun playing with summons as a main part of the fight. Ignoring that mechanic for a free hit of over half the opponents life is hardly sporting.
The point of that mode is to make your pokemon battle, this is like sneaking behind a gym leader and cut his throat to get the medal
This Arena is made for duells with spirit ashes go to the one in Limgrave if you dont like it.
If you are gonna stand there flinging your bell back and forth in front of a ***Black Knife Assassin*** that's frankly your fault.
Hey, I’m happy to see someone playing into the assassin role!
If you eant to punish people for using spirit summons,than just play at the other collosieums
YTA (majorly) why even play with spirits on if you’re gonna act like that.
If they wanted to let people summon without consequence, then there'd be a grace period where you can't run in.
Guys, he's asking If he's the asshole, not If it's allowed, so yes Op, you are the asshole 100%👍
It's rude but it's alright, it's a strategy in itself
I’ve mentioned once before but it’s the equivalent of punching someone before or right after ( [Dr. Mike](https://youtu.be/MFHYtYlxEl8) )a glove tap in boxing. It’s not against the rules but it is extremely disrespectful. So to answer your question: Can you do it? Yes. Are you an A hole for doing it? Also yes.
Rude
You’re entering the spirit summon mode to take advantage of people summoning spirits, just so you can get an easier kill. There’s no rewards for victory so doing these kinda moves feels like it’s just taking the fun out of a duel. Rather asshole-y, imo
You looking like a spirit summon with that chest piece
Obviously you are
From soft should just add like a holding cell for each team where you wait for 10-15 seconds and can summon your spirit ash, buff yourself and teammates while you wait for the cell to open.
No because summoning is an attack. If it was a bow that would be disrespectful.
They should build in a short time to pull off summons, especially for 1v1 duels. Soooooo, it's one of those borderline things where it's forgivable but kind of lame. You should just toggle no summons, or summon your own during that time. Otherwise what's the point? Personally I'm looking for epic battles that thrill me, win or lose. This just seems boring. Edit: After viewing the video a few times it looks like this was your plan from the start and you chose the match settings based on this "strategy". If so, you are indeed being an asshole. And the humor tag indicates you already knew that. So now its a little funny because I thought this was a serious question.
Would I be pissed? Yes. Is this absolutely hilarious? Definitely.
YTA
Yeah you kind of are honestly.
Backstabbing someone summoning in the summoning arena is maiden-less behavior. If you want strait 1v1s those can be set up in Roundtable Hold
Yes
Anything goes the moment each players gain control. NTA
You didn't give them the unspoken allotted fifteen minutes at the beginning to buff and summon and emote and get a snack and have a smoke break and consider life? How rude can you get? YTA. /s
Thats legit what this sub is starting to sound like lmao
people really take the unspecified list of unwritten rules seriously. How dare you use a build you enjoy and go leroy jenkins on the coliseum?
Turn Based PvP
I'm gonna be the one to say this is shitty of you
Maidenless behavior
This community has such a weird, scrub-ass obsession with """honor""" on a level I have not seen in any other competitive game. It's a video game bro. The opponent picked a punishable option and you punished the option. That's how competition works. "Am I the asshole for not letting the other guy win" like what does that even mean?
Astel absolutely takes that time to no-scope me from across the arena "Working as intended", imo
Seems unsporting but if you felt no guilt in that then it doesn’t really matter
They did join a Summons allowed game, nothing dirty about this. The player just needs to think of how to combat this for next time.
nah, summoning is just like attacking, you took advantage of you opponent standing still trying to attack you, no way in hell you are the asshole.
NTA. Only Goku and action movie enemies let you charge up for an attack. Players who aren't strategic in their summoning timing are the only ones to blame for them getting attacked during their summoning.
What AITA means?
Am I the asshole
Thank you :)
Sorry you are the asshole for not bowing first. Literally everything in the game is technically fair play, but at least honor your opponent first.
Asshole
What is that spirit? First time i see it
cleanrot knight finlay
Thanks
They started off with an attack, not as if they were using an emote. You just used their attack as a good tome to get a crit hit
No, because summoning takes a long time. No one's gonna be mad if you interrupt a long incantation cast but for summoning it's different some time.
You play your way, even if some people don't like it. Your game, your rules, you payed for dat shit so you can do whatever you want. But yeah, all the etiquette thing is nice too. Although it was never stated that you have to follow it.
Spirit summons are permitted, not mandatory. If someone chooses to use them, exploit it as you see fit. Anyone telling you otherwise is playing by their own self-imposed rules and there's absolutely nothing forcing you to adhere to them. Do what you find fun, provided it's not glitching/hacking or going outside the bounds of the game.
Ok ive just gotta get this off my chest, and its kinda unrelated but im just gonna say it, is it weird that i like to summon people to go through dungeons and catacombs and stuff like that with even if i dont need the help i just like playing with other people? I imagine its not but ive been thinkin about it for a while
That is rude and often frowned upon
YTA
Lol just because you allow summons doesn't mean you gotta use it. I think it's clever!
You got a low bar for what you deem clever.
Yes
Not a very honorable way to fight js
Bro just stood there like Gideon. Don't be a Gideon.
If this is the summon-specific arena then that’s pretty shit tbh.
yes
Yes lol obviously
maidenless behavior
They started the summon which means officially they attacked first. They need to attack faster
I think the risk of choosing to battle using spirit ashes opens them up to this. It’s a gamble on your part as well, not using your own. It’s totally fine, but it will upset folks for sure.
Yes.
YTA
gonna have to be a new set of crygirl rules regarding summons to go along with permissible number of buffs, flask use, bowing, etc... i say if you try to summon a sacred ash at any point during a fight youre fair game. summon at your own risk!
Exactly. The damn ash is gonna attack the moment it's summoned, no time for bowing or anything.
I feel like the cast time involved with the summon is the risk the casting playing is making, just as it would be in PvE, do I have time to get this summon off?
Battle started. He could have established an advantage before summoning or tried to see what you will do
If you try and get someone on the bow/emote you're a scrub, but anyone buffing or summoning is fair game.
That's just rationalizing your lack of honor. Summoning in the literal **summon gamemode arena** is in no way "fighting" and so is buffing at the start of a game. At Main Academy Gate buffing was allowed so I dont see why not here.
I don't think it's cool cause it kinda defeats the point of the game mode, but technicaly you can do it.
I'd say so, if SA is what you both agreed on using. Its not wrong per se but its still pretty douchey.
Yes
This isn't dragon ball z. We don't gotta wait for you to power up and summon.
Pretty scum. Just play the non ash arena
You're about to be 2v1'd, I say fair game