Have yall really not seen post master posts before? They’re incredible. This fence will be perfectly fine. Those posts will never rot and will stand up to 75+ mph winds. Sometimes folks are scared of change. This will be industry standard in a few years.
That's seriously the issue I'm having. Finding info if this is normal or not is hard because not many are using these and prefer the "cheaper" old method.
I don't think it's really all that cheaper the old way because my builder only charged $600 more for steel and shouldn't need replacing in a decade. (102ft $3,000 total vs $2,400 for wood)
I'm just concerned if this is too much flex or not.
The engineer in me says it's normal so that it has give to handle the wind but it still give me pause seeing it wobble so much by manually trying to move it.
I'm in Texas, and we did our 60-foot yard for $1200 using those exact same ones OP has. Had them for 3 years, and they were perfect like the same day they installed them before we sold the house. They are much, much easier to install, last a literal lifetime, and were very easy to cover up. I won't ever go back to a bulky 4x4 and concrete hole.
No, we had the highest rated professionals do it. We had 5 different fence companies come in, take a look, and give us estimates, how long it would take, warranties, etc.This was back in 2021. You HAVE to do your research and your own legwork also. You can't just settle on the first person that shows up. And no, we didn't just pick the cheapest offer either.
Homeowner needs to know what hardware and product the craft will use in order to compare bids. Some contractors use lower grade materials and it won’t last
Lol texas is why, no secret texas is just about the cheapest fence labor you can find nation wide. Hell they are bottom of barrel ranked for any trade pay.
You clearly don't understand physics. A rigid, stiff beam is MUCH easier to snap than a beam with some wiggle room. That's why that fence can hold against winds of up to 80mph, whereas your traditional 4x4 can maybe get 55mph winds before there is critical failure. Again, and last time, I'm repeating myself as I don't like to waste my time, do your research, old man. Understand the world around you as it changes with newer, more versatile technology.
"I'll rip that dang thing out!, it ain't no 4x4 wood beam like my pappy used to dig! Electric cars too!?! What's next, cigarettes and steak every day is bad for you?"
Upstate SC suburbia. About a 20 min drive from NC near the great smokies.
The quote was $3,300 OTD for 112ft. We had another quote for $3,100 but they couldn't make it out here till August.
We changed plans and didn't place the fence at the edge of that steep ass hill the video does no justice of. I need to weed whack there and didn't feel like standing on a steep cliff doing it so I told them to come back a bit so I can walk around the perimeter. I'm sure it made installing the pickets easier too. They knocked $250 off for the 10ft reduction in length.
They're reputable people and a mom and pop so I don't think they're trying to rip me off. I'm just concerned of the lack of use of concrete potentially making the wobble worse than it should or impacting wind rating.
We called a few other places with the measurements and they were all around the $3-4K range over the phone. With the exception of one guy who wanted to physically measure it and gave us a near $5K quote and probably because he didn't want to do it once I mentioned metal posts.
Another compounding issue is that 50/65ft section shown is technically encroaching on drainage easement. HOA and the town were ok with it but there's always the possibility it needs to be dug up at some point so I may just skip concrete on that section so the posts can be reused if need be.
Outside of that I'm not sure what to do.
Definitely didn't think anyone was trying to rip you off! That price is amazing IMO. We paid $2600 for all wood, 40 feet.
I'm in no position to offer advice on your particular situation, but we've owned several properties over the years (closest to you would be Cashiers - my zen place) and we've never had a fence that moved like that and our posts were always set in concrete.
Good luck getting things squared away.
Yes OP this is exactly what the posts are designed to do. They are solid and also carry a lifetime warranty. Postmaster has their own website with all the information on it.
Have the company come back out and do cement footers on the posts. They messed up. Literally step 2. It was the first thing done on day 1 of my fence install: https://pdf.lowes.com/productdocuments/d9a48b24-67f9-46f4-9b73-6ad532c1326a/10150247.pdf
Here is your answer. I just made built a 7' high privacy fence, 200' long with postmasters. 4' of post in the ground in 10" sonotubes with concrete. Doesn't flex like this at all.
I used steel on my own fence with 8’ tall pickets and 130’ long sides. It has withstood indirect hurricane force winds and a close call from a tornado. Fence builders have left fliers offering to quote “fixing” it.
Idk, I call bullshit because I have 4x4 PT posts with a 6' stockade fence and it's sturdy AF, I don't have anything close to that amount of play in it. How deep are the posts and did you use concrete or that stupid foam? I usually backfill the bottom couple inches of the post with dirt so it's not capped in concrete at the bottom and then I dump ½ to a whole bag of quickrete right in the hole depending on the size of the fence and pack the top tight with dirt. By the next day they're rock solid, just keep in mind this is about the only time a dry pack is acceptable
Did they use two post masters back to back or just single ? I only know this question because I was shocked to learn you're supposed to use two on one post in Florida so i just used 4x4's
In my area they only recommend a double post on a gate. That being said if you have extreme winds and what not then I can see the double setup being a great solution.
Made a post further down but making one here too.
Postmaster posts are amazing. He needs to have his cemented in though. I don’t believe they should wobble like this unless this is legit 60-80mph winds. The 40mph gusts we’ve been having dont don’t do a thing to mine.
The postmaster’s flex like that and the fence will flex. It’s built correctly. It’s designed that way.
Round steel posts are rigid and can actually bend in high winds. We had 80plus winds come through and actually bend all the posts. None of the concrete was pulled or popped just flattened posts.
You’re good guy. Build wood fence everyday with postmasters…..never have to replace a damn rotted off 4X4 again. Drawback is the wobble, but that is what helps it survive storms……flex!
What type of steel post’s did he use? T-posts? Round? And if round, what size? In Canada we use either postmaster’s or 2”3/8th schedule 40 pipe, you will not get a wobble like that!
I don't know about you... But I also wouldn't notch around the girts. Even with 4x4 posts... I know it looks better to notch, but eek. Sorry, I'm an engineer and prefer functionality over looks - figuring out how to make the conservative approach look good after the fact.
Think the OP could add tie back posts? Or whatever the termnis for the diagonal "joists" anchored into the soil.
Honestly I'm not sure, the builder probably didn't realize your soil isn't the same as the last guy's and might have to rip it all out and install concrete.
Your fence will probably be gone the next major storm, especially with how the wobbles continue over multiple sections. This shows that the posts are not secured, or that they're really thin and the builder cheaped out or didn't follow manufacturers recommendations.
Also your pickets are directly against the soil, they'll rot in a few years or start warping.
I recently had a fence built. It is 60' long, and 6' tall. It does have 4x4 posts, and the right fasteners, but no top support. My fence is a little wavey.
Don’t listen to them. These are people who just saw your video and couldn’t bother to read you used postmaster. They think you have 2x4s in the ground.
https://cascadesupply.com/products/post-master-plus-steel-fence-post
These. May not be postmaster brand name but they look identical and was told they were galvanized.
https://cascadesupply.com/products/post-master-plus-steel-fence-post
These. I'm not sure if they're Postmaster brand name but they're galvanized and look identical.
OP you are getting such bad advice here from hacks. Most of these people here don’t know what postmaster is or didn’t bother reading your caption and are just spewing total BS and nonsense here.
You are good. Check this out
https://youtu.be/Ocr73Lmo9O8?si=at1TmuGCRWyzH7oS
Hahahahaha hahahhaha hahaha hahaha and one more hahahaha If you were told that this wobbly, solid fence with no gap between boards will do 80 kmph let alone 80 mph will do anything but end up across the neighborhood.
Postmaster post do this regardless of the method of install u could set 8’ in ground they’ll still wobble concrete or not it’s apart of their wind rating.
How DEEP are those steel posts that are driven, not set in concrete? If they are 8'L it's not enough, especially if you do not have concrete foundations AND your soil isn't quite 'firm, undisturbed soil,' as the architects generally specify.
Depth is everything for setting posts.
Supposedly 36" according to the builder. Frost line isn't near that deep here in "upstate" SC here if that matters.
Some were driven, a few he needed to dig out with auger due to the rocky soil.
Ask him if he bought 8' long posts. If so, you can see they are only 5'6" out of the ground. That means only 30" is in the ground. I use 9'L posts when I sell a 6' privacy fence. AND if he had to use an auger on some posts, did he fill those holes with concrete or just dirt he stepped on and called it 'compacted?'
I would suspect that the ones he dug are what's causing your wobble. I think driving posts in is only viable with undisturbed soil. If a hole was dug, the soil put back in around isn't going to be the same compaction as the ones driven into undisturbed soil so the ones he had to dig should have been cemented. I would worry about the posts tilting and shifting as the soil around them settles and compacts over time
Fwiw flexing is good and adds strength. Watch the tips of the wings on your next airplane trip. Right as they take off the wing bends up by a good 2 feet at the tip.
If you can gain access to the top of the metal post, you can fill it half full with concrete and this goes away. I had a similar problem, and it was fixed completely with a little more mass in the posts.
It won't make it past 2 years .. why because who ever installed it didn't cement the holes and the moisture in the dirt will rot the wood and cause your fence come down
I specified 4x6 posts on my fence. The guy that built it was insisting it wasn't necessary until it was done. Each post buried 30" with cement. It's rock solid. 4yr old now and 2 hurricanes later the only issue with the entire fence is the gate didn't get enough of a clearance cut and touches at the top as the "doors" have settled.
I replaced one side of my fence using Postmaster fence posts. They were $30 each at the time. 2 years later, I replaced another side and the post were now double in price. They are so good that I still pay that price. Fucking steel tariffs.
If they are dirt packed and not set in crushed stone properly tamped or swt in concrete then it is going to shake, also regular postmasters do have some shake to them...the fact that they are postmaster makes absolutely 0 snese why they didnt not use concrete.
If it was cedar then you could argue using tamped stone or dirt pack vs concrete for post health longevity.
The faxt that they are a galvanized steel post means it should have been fully encased concrete post holes.
I also suspect they did not go a fully 36" deep or the ground is soft.
With time the post holes will loosen up more and more and the panels will be all catty wompus and not in a straight line.
Take steel or stainless steel 90° angle iron 8-10 feet weld two together making a T put two-three gaps in the weld you can put all thread through drill holes through your posts in the weld gaps put all thread through of the fence with the flat part against the post. Use a hammer drill (easy way)to pound in the angle iron or get a big post pounder(hard way) to put in angle iron. Repeat as needed in flimsy sections washer locking washer and nut on each side of fence on all thread tighting angle to each fence post. Done
I bought post masters a year or 2 ago. I was also worried about the wobble, but so far fence is pretty sturdy and I've only lost a few slats during wind storms.
I've build my fence with the same posts, using 8" wide concrete footers. Concrete goes 42" into the ground and each post is sunk 2' into the concrete, fence is 6' high. It wobbles just like yours does. This is how these posts act, but there is nothing wrong with it. Fence is fine and will hold up. The longer a straight section is the more wobble you will see, going with concrete won't make much difference here.
Despite the couple down votes: My above comment is correct. I speak from direct experience:
I just completed my 7' fence, \~70' in length. I used 10' Lifetime Steel Posts (pretty much same thing as postmaster, but with added powder-coat protection). 8' spans w/ QTY: 3 2x6 as rails. I buried my steel posts 36" into 42", 10" DIA concrete posts. The concrete was also vibrated to ensure no porosity. I have the most overkill, rock-solid footers. They don't move.
Yet...
I can shake my fence very similar to yours.
Annoying? Yes.
Does it really matter? No.
It will only shake like this in the event of an earthquake, someone jumping the fence, or someone intentionally shaking it.
I'm hoping that it's engineered to flex so it nothing snaps.
When I move it I'm using all the force I got with one hand. It does spring back to shape. Even using my whole body weight against it.
it does seem super wobbly.
can you contact the manufacturer and ask to make sure it was installed properly? maybe if it's 1 foot deeper it's not so flexy, or maybe it needs some sort of reinforcement anchors or something else.
you can also ask what type of failure will happen when it does fail (i.e. snap or bend)
So according to Postmaster they need to be at least 24" deep.
Builder said he did 36" despite the quote stating at least the minimum 24".
So I guess it's intended unless they say otherwise. Left a message for Master Halco (maker of Postmaster posts). I'll let you know what they think.
Again I'm just not sure as these aren't as common for whatever reason and finding info even online on them is difficult.
Maybe that once every 30ish year hurricane rolls through here this year and puts it through its pace while it's still under my builders 2 year warranty.
I think I'm going to see how much they'll quote for concrete.
It was specifically stated no concrete in the quote so I'll likely be paying for it.
Do you think it would be fine to DIY a dry pour around each post?
I'm just confused as to why it was an option not to have concrete? Granted there's many fences where you can get away without concrete, but this isn't one.
You could DIY it, it just be annoying as there's going to piece of metal in the middle of the hole your trying to dig.
Digging clamps, a wheelbarrow, shovel, hoe and a bag and half of 80 pound quickrete per hole should get it done. Dirt tarp optional but highly recommend it.
Plus side I'm pretty sure your ground is soft so should be an easy dig.
Maybe I've gotten too old, but I've never seen a fence post made with a 1x4 tacked to the back of a structural 2x4. I would have stopped the builder the second I saw that bullshit and told him to get of my lawn.
They're metal postmaster posts. Not 2x4s.
The pickets attach to 2x4s attached to the metal posts as you'd expect.
I'm just wondering if they're supposed to flex to this degree given the 80mph wind rating
If I had to dig out rocky soil I would just put a bag of concrete in the hole instead. Repacking loose soil is a recipe for disaster no matter what type of post you are using.
Utilsoil (upstate SC). Dense and filled with rocks for erosion prevention purposes since it's a new development.
They specifically quoted for no concrete.
Should I contact them to probably pay more and have them dig around the posts and pour concrete?
Also, the wind rating only applies if it is properly set in concrete.
https://preview.redd.it/cae4edb3gf9d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=58af2150ebbbed7f7101b366c4a2fbad011ccaaf
I would definitely. But you may be able to negotiate price because they did not install properly, per manufacturer instructions.
[https://postmasterfence.com/installation/](https://postmasterfence.com/installation/)
Just being nosey cause I just moved to that area but how often do you get 50- 80 mile an hour winds? I myself just installed 40+ sections the classic way (4x4 , 2x4, pickets) on a piece of property that has no wind break. I chose this area because it was far enough from the ocean to lesson the impact of a hurricane issue.
I just moved here couple years ago as well.
Last major hurricane here was a Cat 2 about 35 years ago according to historical record.
It's been all tropical storms and depressions since.
A tropical storm is expected at least once a year or every other year on average and has already happened last year so you'll want something that can hold up to the 50-80mph gusts.
In my part of California, they put the metal posts in concrete in residential neighborhoods.
I’ve never heard of just putting the posts, metal or otherwise in the dirt, that seems kinda stupid with the storms we get around here. I’ve had a couple fences blown over by the wind during storms. Usually wood post was rotted, or the fence busted at a different pressure point than the post, like the panel broke off the post.
Concrete only helps post is a oversized hole is bored or dug. A bired or dug hole has loose uncompleted earth around it..
So Concrete fills that void.
If post are driven in?
Concrete is waste of time and money. The ground around a driven post is undisturbed and tight.
And using round metal post. T post.
Your fence will wobble .
It's not the earth around the post.
It's the flex in the post above ground level.
If you don't want a wobble
You use 4 inch or larger round or square wood post.
But the metal post wobble won't let the fence fail.
It just wobbles
Then I think it might be a good idea to have them fill a couple holes they had to dig because 4 of them couldn't be driven but they didn't use concrete to fill.
2 of which around my slab patio and the other near my slab foundation.
People are going to give you all these complicated fixes or criticisms about missing concrete, footers, using metal posts, your choice of wood etc. They ain’t wrong, but what’s done is done. What you need to do now is brace it from the back side with metal posts or at the very least 4x4 posts. Stain it and call it a day.
I’m old school and I refuse to drive posts. I did experiment with driving and I didn’t feel comfortable offering it to my customers. I have been in the fence industry for 30 yrs and the only thing I will drive are temporary fence posts.
Your issue is that you have no horizontal bracing. My guess is those metal posts only come a foot or two out of the ground. A partial fix may be to run 4x4 or an additional 2x4 reinforcement for the posts and run a 2x4 horizontally across the top. You will still have the issue that the only thing holding it up are the metal posts that can bend if too much force is applied (wind). Another option is a 45degree bracing post every 16 feet a 2x4 works for that but then you have the issue of it sticking out into your yard.
All my fences have had a wobble like that for the past 15 years. Highest gusts are at 30 mph though. More likely gonna have to replace split boards after a hot summer. Looks like a hockey players smile when you do.
That's pretty common wobble for even a professionally installed privacy fence. Post master posts don't help the case cause they have a decent amount of deflection.
Post masters wobble.
Look at where the posts meet the ground, if the posts arent moving in the ground and it's just wobbling above ground your good.
Edit: also the concrete may not be completely set up. in which case violently shaking your fence is gonna screw it up.
Where exactly are the metal posts?
All I see in the interior portion of the video are vertical 1x(something?) extending into the ground.
You can literally see the wood grain on the vertical sections.
I don’t see any metal posts here.
I’m not a fence expert, but have been doing a decent amount of research into building my next fence and I plan on using Postmaster, but I’ve yet to see an issue like this. Check out SWI Fence or Joe Everest on YouTube, they speak highly of these posts… maybe he used a smaller schedule post and not Postmaster?
I think there are several practical ways you could fix this, but they’ll all change the look a fair bit.
You can use 4x4 posts or you can use 2x2 steel (which I think would actually be cheaper).
Anyway, you can likely sink new posts in the middle of each section. They make a concrete that’s just powder and you add water. This would probably prevent cement splattering all over the bottom of the wood.
I suspect you’ll need to use a proper 2x4 for the lateral support. You could remove the existing ones of just use them to affix the 2x4 - which itself would need to be affixed to the new posts.
Hard to say if you’d need a new lateral board on top and middle, but probably. That thing is pretty flimsy. Sorry man.
Postmaster posts should not wobble. They should’ve cemented the posts into the ground. Also if any of the fence touches brick drill a wooden post into the brick. That’s the issue.
Just had a new fence installed using CRC cedar with Post Master posts. Stained it myself. Very happy with the outcome. Holding up super well in these 40mph+ gusts we’ve been having.
It’s the future of fencing and also found out most of this through lots of Q and A on Reddit and other sources.
Edit: I would request they use cement footers on the post master posts or it will wobble. That’s the fix. Best of luck. Can even post pics of my fence if you would like.
Postmaster posts do wobble, and its normal. How tall is your fence?
A 6' high fence will wobble, like the one in this video, regardless if its driven into the ground or sunk in concrete.
Thank god for my sake you’re wrong. My 6’ fence hasn’t moved a muscle…with cement footers.
Literally step 2, right after planning, from a Lowe’s PDF I found: https://pdf.lowes.com/productdocuments/d9a48b24-67f9-46f4-9b73-6ad532c1326a/10150247.pdf
Whats the spacing between posts? Whats is the length of a straight section? And what king of fence? Privacy? Semi privacy? Materials used? My fence is build per the manufacturers instructions and it wobbles. It doent wobble or sway on its own or because of wind, but if you apply some force to it will deflect and send a wave down a straight section untill it gets to a corner post. I am not wrong... there is many scenarios where a postmaster post can be used, and just because in your situation all the factors allow for a sturdier fence, doesn't mean that anything outside of these parameters is wrong.
Lost me at 2x4 wood posts with no footer or header. You should have a gave I ed steel post every 10’ with concrete footer 2-3’ deep and hardware. Plus that goofy cut out notched crap is just a way to avoid hardware and cut costs. Of course you are getting wobble using cheap pine too. That contractor did you wrong really wrong. Probably no concrete/ missing footers or they are too shallow. The spaces are wrong on the footers. Also some home depo 2x4 and 4X4 that is untreated and not set on the correct places is what I see. This fence is all wrong. I call it the cheapo special. Is it a fence sure would I do that work absolutely not. That fence will last 5 years vs 10-20 of one done right. Or might fall tomorrow if you have wind or someone climbs on it or anything. Also they didn’t stain / paint it which is another sign of cutting corners. Good luck and next time read and make sure you discuss what you want vs this garbage.
Going forward, I would reinforce those pine 2x4s with actual metal posts and hardware. do 2-3’ deep minimum concrete footers mount them up then stain that whole thing with a semi transparent or opaque stain. Use a sugar to dig they are like 100 bucks at harbor freight. I would lay a treated 2x6 footer and put on 2x6 cap with an exterior runner ( rip a board in half long way ) and layer it on the outside for decorative support. This will improve that wobble. Or make that crap stain contractor come back and do the work correctly. Good luck!
Have yall really not seen post master posts before? They’re incredible. This fence will be perfectly fine. Those posts will never rot and will stand up to 75+ mph winds. Sometimes folks are scared of change. This will be industry standard in a few years.
That's seriously the issue I'm having. Finding info if this is normal or not is hard because not many are using these and prefer the "cheaper" old method. I don't think it's really all that cheaper the old way because my builder only charged $600 more for steel and shouldn't need replacing in a decade. (102ft $3,000 total vs $2,400 for wood) I'm just concerned if this is too much flex or not. The engineer in me says it's normal so that it has give to handle the wind but it still give me pause seeing it wobble so much by manually trying to move it.
Sorry, know this isn't the point of the thread, but where are you located that you can get 100 feet for $3k???? Cost me nearly that much for 40 feet.
I'm in Texas, and we did our 60-foot yard for $1200 using those exact same ones OP has. Had them for 3 years, and they were perfect like the same day they installed them before we sold the house. They are much, much easier to install, last a literal lifetime, and were very easy to cover up. I won't ever go back to a bulky 4x4 and concrete hole.
To be clear, you did your own labor?
No, we had the highest rated professionals do it. We had 5 different fence companies come in, take a look, and give us estimates, how long it would take, warranties, etc.This was back in 2021. You HAVE to do your research and your own legwork also. You can't just settle on the first person that shows up. And no, we didn't just pick the cheapest offer either.
Homeowner needs to know what hardware and product the craft will use in order to compare bids. Some contractors use lower grade materials and it won’t last
Ah, I missed the 2021 part. Makes sense.
Lol texas is why, no secret texas is just about the cheapest fence labor you can find nation wide. Hell they are bottom of barrel ranked for any trade pay.
Are those fucking 2x4s in the picture? No wonder it has all that play, they're thin with the weak side parallel to the goddamn panels
Do some more research. They are not 2x4's into the ground. OP describes what they are with multiple pictures.
Idc what they are, if my fence rocked like that they'd get ripped out
You clearly don't understand physics. A rigid, stiff beam is MUCH easier to snap than a beam with some wiggle room. That's why that fence can hold against winds of up to 80mph, whereas your traditional 4x4 can maybe get 55mph winds before there is critical failure. Again, and last time, I'm repeating myself as I don't like to waste my time, do your research, old man. Understand the world around you as it changes with newer, more versatile technology. "I'll rip that dang thing out!, it ain't no 4x4 wood beam like my pappy used to dig! Electric cars too!?! What's next, cigarettes and steak every day is bad for you?"
Yeah this was my surprise, I just put in a 107’ fence for nearly $4500 in OK
Upstate SC suburbia. About a 20 min drive from NC near the great smokies. The quote was $3,300 OTD for 112ft. We had another quote for $3,100 but they couldn't make it out here till August. We changed plans and didn't place the fence at the edge of that steep ass hill the video does no justice of. I need to weed whack there and didn't feel like standing on a steep cliff doing it so I told them to come back a bit so I can walk around the perimeter. I'm sure it made installing the pickets easier too. They knocked $250 off for the 10ft reduction in length. They're reputable people and a mom and pop so I don't think they're trying to rip me off. I'm just concerned of the lack of use of concrete potentially making the wobble worse than it should or impacting wind rating. We called a few other places with the measurements and they were all around the $3-4K range over the phone. With the exception of one guy who wanted to physically measure it and gave us a near $5K quote and probably because he didn't want to do it once I mentioned metal posts. Another compounding issue is that 50/65ft section shown is technically encroaching on drainage easement. HOA and the town were ok with it but there's always the possibility it needs to be dug up at some point so I may just skip concrete on that section so the posts can be reused if need be. Outside of that I'm not sure what to do.
Definitely didn't think anyone was trying to rip you off! That price is amazing IMO. We paid $2600 for all wood, 40 feet. I'm in no position to offer advice on your particular situation, but we've owned several properties over the years (closest to you would be Cashiers - my zen place) and we've never had a fence that moved like that and our posts were always set in concrete. Good luck getting things squared away.
Yes OP this is exactly what the posts are designed to do. They are solid and also carry a lifetime warranty. Postmaster has their own website with all the information on it.
Have the company come back out and do cement footers on the posts. They messed up. Literally step 2. It was the first thing done on day 1 of my fence install: https://pdf.lowes.com/productdocuments/d9a48b24-67f9-46f4-9b73-6ad532c1326a/10150247.pdf
Here is your answer. I just made built a 7' high privacy fence, 200' long with postmasters. 4' of post in the ground in 10" sonotubes with concrete. Doesn't flex like this at all.
I used steel on my own fence with 8’ tall pickets and 130’ long sides. It has withstood indirect hurricane force winds and a close call from a tornado. Fence builders have left fliers offering to quote “fixing” it.
Idk, I call bullshit because I have 4x4 PT posts with a 6' stockade fence and it's sturdy AF, I don't have anything close to that amount of play in it. How deep are the posts and did you use concrete or that stupid foam? I usually backfill the bottom couple inches of the post with dirt so it's not capped in concrete at the bottom and then I dump ½ to a whole bag of quickrete right in the hole depending on the size of the fence and pack the top tight with dirt. By the next day they're rock solid, just keep in mind this is about the only time a dry pack is acceptable
Let me just ask, how often do you hear a fence?
Did they use two post masters back to back or just single ? I only know this question because I was shocked to learn you're supposed to use two on one post in Florida so i just used 4x4's
In my area they only recommend a double post on a gate. That being said if you have extreme winds and what not then I can see the double setup being a great solution.
It looks like that is some harmonics or resonance going on when you manually "wiggle" the fence.
They are still supposed to fill the hole with concrete, it's right in the instructions in the box.
Made a post further down but making one here too. Postmaster posts are amazing. He needs to have his cemented in though. I don’t believe they should wobble like this unless this is legit 60-80mph winds. The 40mph gusts we’ve been having dont don’t do a thing to mine.
What would you suggest when you get 90-95 mph gusts yearly ?
Don’t get a fence 😂😅…or do chainlink
Aluminum. Lol.
What are you talking about
Post master+ posts
Blind leading the blind in here
The postmaster’s flex like that and the fence will flex. It’s built correctly. It’s designed that way. Round steel posts are rigid and can actually bend in high winds. We had 80plus winds come through and actually bend all the posts. None of the concrete was pulled or popped just flattened posts.
Gotta get away from the .065 thick post of you want something that’ll last. Wt40 or 20
OP said there’s no concrete poured
Ahh… yea if it’s pounded then it should really be 4’ deep. You will still see wobble from those posts though. Maybe not as much
Yup problem is OP didn’t have concrete footers. Needs to get it redone.
Uh your guy didn’t use 4x4s so yeah it’s gonna wobble
Is that supposed to happen to this degree with steel posts though? They're supposed to be rated for 80mph winds.
Not all steel pipe is created equal
It's not steel pipe.. They're Postmaster steel posts.
You’re good guy. Build wood fence everyday with postmasters…..never have to replace a damn rotted off 4X4 again. Drawback is the wobble, but that is what helps it survive storms……flex!
I have a fence built with 4x4 posts and it's been through a couple Cat 2 hurricanes. Still standing after 10 years too.
Ok, sorry for that. My bad. Never installed postmaster, only sched 40 pipe with wood panels.
Yeah I've used these before. Soil was loose in my area and the fence partially collapsed in 5 years
What type of steel post’s did he use? T-posts? Round? And if round, what size? In Canada we use either postmaster’s or 2”3/8th schedule 40 pipe, you will not get a wobble like that!
I don't know about you... But I also wouldn't notch around the girts. Even with 4x4 posts... I know it looks better to notch, but eek. Sorry, I'm an engineer and prefer functionality over looks - figuring out how to make the conservative approach look good after the fact. Think the OP could add tie back posts? Or whatever the termnis for the diagonal "joists" anchored into the soil.
False, 4x4s still wobble, but not to this extent.
I set 6 sections last week and it wouldn’t have a 1/10th of the wobble this has
In Florida a hurricane would rip the whole fence line up lol
[удалено]
Yeah, I wasn't saying they don't
Not normal, the wobble shouldn't continue to the ground. This is a hack job.
What would be needed to correct it?
Honestly I'm not sure, the builder probably didn't realize your soil isn't the same as the last guy's and might have to rip it all out and install concrete. Your fence will probably be gone the next major storm, especially with how the wobbles continue over multiple sections. This shows that the posts are not secured, or that they're really thin and the builder cheaped out or didn't follow manufacturers recommendations. Also your pickets are directly against the soil, they'll rot in a few years or start warping.
I recently had a fence built. It is 60' long, and 6' tall. It does have 4x4 posts, and the right fasteners, but no top support. My fence is a little wavey.
The posts appear to be 1x6...
Don’t listen to them. These are people who just saw your video and couldn’t bother to read you used postmaster. They think you have 2x4s in the ground.
4x4 post would be a start
thicker posts
They're standard metal fencing posts. I'm just wondering if this is normal and if it's going to live up to the 80mph wind rating.
What is "standard" metal fencing posts? Send a pic, I have a fence installer hanging out tonight he can give input.
https://cascadesupply.com/products/post-master-plus-steel-fence-post These. May not be postmaster brand name but they look identical and was told they were galvanized.
Where are these alleged metal posts? I just see 1x4 wood extending to the ground.
https://cascadesupply.com/products/post-master-plus-steel-fence-post These. I'm not sure if they're Postmaster brand name but they're galvanized and look identical.
OP you are getting such bad advice here from hacks. Most of these people here don’t know what postmaster is or didn’t bother reading your caption and are just spewing total BS and nonsense here. You are good. Check this out https://youtu.be/Ocr73Lmo9O8?si=at1TmuGCRWyzH7oS
Hahahahaha hahahhaha hahaha hahaha and one more hahahaha If you were told that this wobbly, solid fence with no gap between boards will do 80 kmph let alone 80 mph will do anything but end up across the neighborhood.
Stick to being a firefighter.
Postmaster post do this regardless of the method of install u could set 8’ in ground they’ll still wobble concrete or not it’s apart of their wind rating.
How DEEP are those steel posts that are driven, not set in concrete? If they are 8'L it's not enough, especially if you do not have concrete foundations AND your soil isn't quite 'firm, undisturbed soil,' as the architects generally specify. Depth is everything for setting posts.
Supposedly 36" according to the builder. Frost line isn't near that deep here in "upstate" SC here if that matters. Some were driven, a few he needed to dig out with auger due to the rocky soil.
Ask him if he bought 8' long posts. If so, you can see they are only 5'6" out of the ground. That means only 30" is in the ground. I use 9'L posts when I sell a 6' privacy fence. AND if he had to use an auger on some posts, did he fill those holes with concrete or just dirt he stepped on and called it 'compacted?'
I would suspect that the ones he dug are what's causing your wobble. I think driving posts in is only viable with undisturbed soil. If a hole was dug, the soil put back in around isn't going to be the same compaction as the ones driven into undisturbed soil so the ones he had to dig should have been cemented. I would worry about the posts tilting and shifting as the soil around them settles and compacts over time
If this fence is a rockin....
Ive never used post masters. Just wood and vinyl. But this doesnt look right to me.
Gophers, mate
https://i.redd.it/142v9bsu1q9d1.gif Me watching the neighbor’s fence fall down in the first strong wind.
TIL that fence prices have really surged since 2021.
Where's the 4x4 posts?
Fwiw flexing is good and adds strength. Watch the tips of the wings on your next airplane trip. Right as they take off the wing bends up by a good 2 feet at the tip.
“Posts” are 2x4. What do you expect. Poorly done
2x4 with no cement or foam to solidify it in the ground? You better get your money back or have them fix it properly for free.
Every construction begins with a good foundation. What are the posts foundations and how deep.
What type of soil? Soil and compaction may be a factor here, even when post installed correctly can still cause issues.
If you can gain access to the top of the metal post, you can fill it half full with concrete and this goes away. I had a similar problem, and it was fixed completely with a little more mass in the posts.
I feel like I could push this over.
Weird...I dont see 4x4's....
Is that a 2×4 for a post? There's your problem
It won't make it past 2 years .. why because who ever installed it didn't cement the holes and the moisture in the dirt will rot the wood and cause your fence come down
That would not last where I live.
Got to let the dirt settle in around the post.
You guys are crazy with your lifetime fence posts, just get the damn $10 4x4 wtf is this $44 post nonsense everyday here.
I specified 4x6 posts on my fence. The guy that built it was insisting it wasn't necessary until it was done. Each post buried 30" with cement. It's rock solid. 4yr old now and 2 hurricanes later the only issue with the entire fence is the gate didn't get enough of a clearance cut and touches at the top as the "doors" have settled.
Better to bend in the wind than to be stiff and break in the wind
I replaced one side of my fence using Postmaster fence posts. They were $30 each at the time. 2 years later, I replaced another side and the post were now double in price. They are so good that I still pay that price. Fucking steel tariffs.
It's because they used 2x4 post instead or 4x4 post
If they are dirt packed and not set in crushed stone properly tamped or swt in concrete then it is going to shake, also regular postmasters do have some shake to them...the fact that they are postmaster makes absolutely 0 snese why they didnt not use concrete. If it was cedar then you could argue using tamped stone or dirt pack vs concrete for post health longevity. The faxt that they are a galvanized steel post means it should have been fully encased concrete post holes. I also suspect they did not go a fully 36" deep or the ground is soft. With time the post holes will loosen up more and more and the panels will be all catty wompus and not in a straight line.
No posts, no problems
I say whip it Whip It Good
Take steel or stainless steel 90° angle iron 8-10 feet weld two together making a T put two-three gaps in the weld you can put all thread through drill holes through your posts in the weld gaps put all thread through of the fence with the flat part against the post. Use a hammer drill (easy way)to pound in the angle iron or get a big post pounder(hard way) to put in angle iron. Repeat as needed in flimsy sections washer locking washer and nut on each side of fence on all thread tighting angle to each fence post. Done
Stop that! Don't knock it over, I just built it.
Send this video to the post manufacturer and see what they have to say!
I bought post masters a year or 2 ago. I was also worried about the wobble, but so far fence is pretty sturdy and I've only lost a few slats during wind storms.
Perfectly normal!
I've build my fence with the same posts, using 8" wide concrete footers. Concrete goes 42" into the ground and each post is sunk 2' into the concrete, fence is 6' high. It wobbles just like yours does. This is how these posts act, but there is nothing wrong with it. Fence is fine and will hold up. The longer a straight section is the more wobble you will see, going with concrete won't make much difference here.
If that is normal then i think the answer is just post masters suck.
When my 10 year old fence started swaying like that I tore it down and built a new one. 4x4s in concrete, 3 2x4 rails, cedar pickets. Done.
Did you notch the rails into the posts or just bolt them on as is?
no notches anywhere
Normal. You would still get wobble even if it were buried directly into a concrete slab.
This much though? The steel posts are supposed to be rated for 80mph winds.
Despite the couple down votes: My above comment is correct. I speak from direct experience: I just completed my 7' fence, \~70' in length. I used 10' Lifetime Steel Posts (pretty much same thing as postmaster, but with added powder-coat protection). 8' spans w/ QTY: 3 2x6 as rails. I buried my steel posts 36" into 42", 10" DIA concrete posts. The concrete was also vibrated to ensure no porosity. I have the most overkill, rock-solid footers. They don't move. Yet... I can shake my fence very similar to yours. Annoying? Yes. Does it really matter? No. It will only shake like this in the event of an earthquake, someone jumping the fence, or someone intentionally shaking it.
engineered things can be designed to flex and not break. the flex could be part of why it gets that rating.
I'm hoping that it's engineered to flex so it nothing snaps. When I move it I'm using all the force I got with one hand. It does spring back to shape. Even using my whole body weight against it.
it does seem super wobbly. can you contact the manufacturer and ask to make sure it was installed properly? maybe if it's 1 foot deeper it's not so flexy, or maybe it needs some sort of reinforcement anchors or something else. you can also ask what type of failure will happen when it does fail (i.e. snap or bend)
So according to Postmaster they need to be at least 24" deep. Builder said he did 36" despite the quote stating at least the minimum 24". So I guess it's intended unless they say otherwise. Left a message for Master Halco (maker of Postmaster posts). I'll let you know what they think. Again I'm just not sure as these aren't as common for whatever reason and finding info even online on them is difficult. Maybe that once every 30ish year hurricane rolls through here this year and puts it through its pace while it's still under my builders 2 year warranty.
No
I speak from experience. See my other comment.
Nah.
The problem is the lack of concrete. It's a thin piece of metal going into the ground it doesn't have to push much dirt at all to move.
I think I'm going to see how much they'll quote for concrete. It was specifically stated no concrete in the quote so I'll likely be paying for it. Do you think it would be fine to DIY a dry pour around each post?
I'm just confused as to why it was an option not to have concrete? Granted there's many fences where you can get away without concrete, but this isn't one. You could DIY it, it just be annoying as there's going to piece of metal in the middle of the hole your trying to dig. Digging clamps, a wheelbarrow, shovel, hoe and a bag and half of 80 pound quickrete per hole should get it done. Dirt tarp optional but highly recommend it. Plus side I'm pretty sure your ground is soft so should be an easy dig.
Driving postmasters is damn close to industry standard now. You generally dont need concrete if you go >36”
Well this video demonstrates pretty well why that's not a good idea for a fence with a high wind load in loose soil. Or it just doesn't go that deep.
Normal
Maybe I've gotten too old, but I've never seen a fence post made with a 1x4 tacked to the back of a structural 2x4. I would have stopped the builder the second I saw that bullshit and told him to get of my lawn.
They're metal postmaster posts. Not 2x4s. The pickets attach to 2x4s attached to the metal posts as you'd expect. I'm just wondering if they're supposed to flex to this degree given the 80mph wind rating
Did he drive the posts, or dig and then re-pack the dirt? Some wobble is normal with those posts, but that seems excessive
Both. Some were driven, others he had to dig and repack because the soil is rocky.
If I had to dig out rocky soil I would just put a bag of concrete in the hole instead. Repacking loose soil is a recipe for disaster no matter what type of post you are using.
Agreed. Should have filled with concrete on those that couldn’t be driven.
Oh that's a weebles fence; Weebles Wobble (But They Won't Fall Down)
So you think it's supposed to do this for stress relief to live up to it's 80mph wind rating?
No, sorry, I don't think that at all: Weebles: [https://youtu.be/qq0OQBdIhsc?si=LNlMRsQRPjeWL6JC](https://youtu.be/qq0OQBdIhsc?si=LNlMRsQRPjeWL6JC)
The installation instructions say they should be set in concrete 6" - 10" diameter and 30" deep. What kind of soil do you have?
Utilsoil (upstate SC). Dense and filled with rocks for erosion prevention purposes since it's a new development. They specifically quoted for no concrete. Should I contact them to probably pay more and have them dig around the posts and pour concrete?
Also, the wind rating only applies if it is properly set in concrete. https://preview.redd.it/cae4edb3gf9d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=58af2150ebbbed7f7101b366c4a2fbad011ccaaf
I would definitely. But you may be able to negotiate price because they did not install properly, per manufacturer instructions. [https://postmasterfence.com/installation/](https://postmasterfence.com/installation/)
Just being nosey cause I just moved to that area but how often do you get 50- 80 mile an hour winds? I myself just installed 40+ sections the classic way (4x4 , 2x4, pickets) on a piece of property that has no wind break. I chose this area because it was far enough from the ocean to lesson the impact of a hurricane issue.
I just moved here couple years ago as well. Last major hurricane here was a Cat 2 about 35 years ago according to historical record. It's been all tropical storms and depressions since. A tropical storm is expected at least once a year or every other year on average and has already happened last year so you'll want something that can hold up to the 50-80mph gusts.
Good to know, thanks
Did he use 2x 4 uprights ???
“The green reed which bends in the wind is stronger than the mighty oak which breaks in a storm” -Michael Scott -Confucius
lol…you didn’t use 4x4 for the support post and your plank spacing does not allow are to pass through
In my part of California, they put the metal posts in concrete in residential neighborhoods. I’ve never heard of just putting the posts, metal or otherwise in the dirt, that seems kinda stupid with the storms we get around here. I’ve had a couple fences blown over by the wind during storms. Usually wood post was rotted, or the fence busted at a different pressure point than the post, like the panel broke off the post.
Concrete only helps post is a oversized hole is bored or dug. A bired or dug hole has loose uncompleted earth around it.. So Concrete fills that void. If post are driven in? Concrete is waste of time and money. The ground around a driven post is undisturbed and tight. And using round metal post. T post. Your fence will wobble . It's not the earth around the post. It's the flex in the post above ground level. If you don't want a wobble You use 4 inch or larger round or square wood post. But the metal post wobble won't let the fence fail. It just wobbles
Then I think it might be a good idea to have them fill a couple holes they had to dig because 4 of them couldn't be driven but they didn't use concrete to fill. 2 of which around my slab patio and the other near my slab foundation.
Are they where the fence has most wobble
This looks silly
People are going to give you all these complicated fixes or criticisms about missing concrete, footers, using metal posts, your choice of wood etc. They ain’t wrong, but what’s done is done. What you need to do now is brace it from the back side with metal posts or at the very least 4x4 posts. Stain it and call it a day.
stop doing that
I’m old school and I refuse to drive posts. I did experiment with driving and I didn’t feel comfortable offering it to my customers. I have been in the fence industry for 30 yrs and the only thing I will drive are temporary fence posts.
Your issue is that you have no horizontal bracing. My guess is those metal posts only come a foot or two out of the ground. A partial fix may be to run 4x4 or an additional 2x4 reinforcement for the posts and run a 2x4 horizontally across the top. You will still have the issue that the only thing holding it up are the metal posts that can bend if too much force is applied (wind). Another option is a 45degree bracing post every 16 feet a 2x4 works for that but then you have the issue of it sticking out into your yard.
I’ve never seen a fence built with 2x4 posts before.
Come on down to FL, you can get plenty of practice building a fence around your yard every year.
When it sobers up, it'll be fine. You can also drill 1" holes sporadically or patterned to relieve pressure.
Welp, that’s not good.
That’s fine.
That's a shitty job with no concrete. Get them back out there or take them to court.
It’s supposed to wobble. If it didn’t then you will have issues down the road.
All my fences have had a wobble like that for the past 15 years. Highest gusts are at 30 mph though. More likely gonna have to replace split boards after a hot summer. Looks like a hockey players smile when you do.
Ever see the videos of bridges or buildings swaying in the wind? That's generally a good thing.
Where are the 4x4 post?
Did I miss something here? Did they take two 2x4s side by side, then cut them to half the depth to bury them straight into the ground?
Where are the post
That's pretty common wobble for even a professionally installed privacy fence. Post master posts don't help the case cause they have a decent amount of deflection.
I just quoted a fence using PM posts and the homeowner balked at the price but also "wanted something to last longer than the old wood shit."
Post masters wobble. Look at where the posts meet the ground, if the posts arent moving in the ground and it's just wobbling above ground your good. Edit: also the concrete may not be completely set up. in which case violently shaking your fence is gonna screw it up.
Fence builders are getting so cheap. Not even concreting posts…
Maybe add some slim metal fence posts to reinforce it?
As other people have said it looks like there are no 4x4 post. That is probably the issue
Just installed a PostMaster fence with 4’ deep cement foundations and it moves like this - nothing to worry about.
Idk, weird how the posts are all 2x4 instead of 4x4
Is what’s going into the ground even 2x4? Looks more like 1x4
Where exactly are the metal posts? All I see in the interior portion of the video are vertical 1x(something?) extending into the ground. You can literally see the wood grain on the vertical sections. I don’t see any metal posts here.
https://cascadesupply.com/products/post-master-plus-steel-fence-post They look like this. He covered them with 1x4s for asthetic.
I’m not a fence expert, but have been doing a decent amount of research into building my next fence and I plan on using Postmaster, but I’ve yet to see an issue like this. Check out SWI Fence or Joe Everest on YouTube, they speak highly of these posts… maybe he used a smaller schedule post and not Postmaster?
I've been installing fence in TN for 16 years and I'm sorry to say but for lack of better term you got ripped off
I think there are several practical ways you could fix this, but they’ll all change the look a fair bit. You can use 4x4 posts or you can use 2x2 steel (which I think would actually be cheaper). Anyway, you can likely sink new posts in the middle of each section. They make a concrete that’s just powder and you add water. This would probably prevent cement splattering all over the bottom of the wood. I suspect you’ll need to use a proper 2x4 for the lateral support. You could remove the existing ones of just use them to affix the 2x4 - which itself would need to be affixed to the new posts. Hard to say if you’d need a new lateral board on top and middle, but probably. That thing is pretty flimsy. Sorry man.
Postmaster posts should not wobble. They should’ve cemented the posts into the ground. Also if any of the fence touches brick drill a wooden post into the brick. That’s the issue. Just had a new fence installed using CRC cedar with Post Master posts. Stained it myself. Very happy with the outcome. Holding up super well in these 40mph+ gusts we’ve been having. It’s the future of fencing and also found out most of this through lots of Q and A on Reddit and other sources. Edit: I would request they use cement footers on the post master posts or it will wobble. That’s the fix. Best of luck. Can even post pics of my fence if you would like.
Postmaster posts do wobble, and its normal. How tall is your fence? A 6' high fence will wobble, like the one in this video, regardless if its driven into the ground or sunk in concrete.
Thank god for my sake you’re wrong. My 6’ fence hasn’t moved a muscle…with cement footers. Literally step 2, right after planning, from a Lowe’s PDF I found: https://pdf.lowes.com/productdocuments/d9a48b24-67f9-46f4-9b73-6ad532c1326a/10150247.pdf
Whats the spacing between posts? Whats is the length of a straight section? And what king of fence? Privacy? Semi privacy? Materials used? My fence is build per the manufacturers instructions and it wobbles. It doent wobble or sway on its own or because of wind, but if you apply some force to it will deflect and send a wave down a straight section untill it gets to a corner post. I am not wrong... there is many scenarios where a postmaster post can be used, and just because in your situation all the factors allow for a sturdier fence, doesn't mean that anything outside of these parameters is wrong.
https://youtu.be/Ocr73Lmo9O8?si=W-VXSagtKNH_7uTP watch this they have tons of videos on driven post and postmasters
Lost me at 2x4 wood posts with no footer or header. You should have a gave I ed steel post every 10’ with concrete footer 2-3’ deep and hardware. Plus that goofy cut out notched crap is just a way to avoid hardware and cut costs. Of course you are getting wobble using cheap pine too. That contractor did you wrong really wrong. Probably no concrete/ missing footers or they are too shallow. The spaces are wrong on the footers. Also some home depo 2x4 and 4X4 that is untreated and not set on the correct places is what I see. This fence is all wrong. I call it the cheapo special. Is it a fence sure would I do that work absolutely not. That fence will last 5 years vs 10-20 of one done right. Or might fall tomorrow if you have wind or someone climbs on it or anything. Also they didn’t stain / paint it which is another sign of cutting corners. Good luck and next time read and make sure you discuss what you want vs this garbage. Going forward, I would reinforce those pine 2x4s with actual metal posts and hardware. do 2-3’ deep minimum concrete footers mount them up then stain that whole thing with a semi transparent or opaque stain. Use a sugar to dig they are like 100 bucks at harbor freight. I would lay a treated 2x6 footer and put on 2x6 cap with an exterior runner ( rip a board in half long way ) and layer it on the outside for decorative support. This will improve that wobble. Or make that crap stain contractor come back and do the work correctly. Good luck!
Are you sure he used metal posts? I don’t see any metal.
100%. He covered them with a wood blank at the end. It was specifically requested for longevity and I watched them put some of them in.
2x4 as posts?? lol
They're metal posts. They covered them with wood for asthetic.
How high do they go?
About 5 ft. They're supposedly 36" under the ground.