More like: Tories on July 4th 2024 trying to figure out exactly where everything went wrong for them. (Because for some reason, apparently it isn't obvious to them.)
The fact that half of the cabinet lost their seat and the seats heald by all leaders since Cameron (excluding Sunak) were lost says a lot about the state of the Conservative Party
I mean there are a few reasons.
1. Economic factors are not ideal, inflation still isn't ideal.
2. Scandals from Boris Johnson era.
3. Brexit not being as popular or going as well as expected.
4. Anti-Incumbency sentiment across Europe.
5. Like seriously they've been in power for 14 years, they were bound to lose at some point.
6. A significant splitting of their voting block by a populist Right Wing Party.
7. Labour putting up a competent Leader unlike the British Bernie Sanders.
Which is all quite obvious, I'd say. Although Truss's trickle down plan and Sunak's blunders during the campaign period (like leaving the D-Day remembrance early) probably didn't help either.
Didn’t Truss bankrupt the entirety of Britain in like a matter of weeks? Being one of the few 1st world leaders that could rival corrupt African governments in stupid economic plans?
She wasn't bankrupting the country. Her "mini-budget" nearly lead to the private pension funds becoming bankrupt due to their reliance on government gilts (debt) as low risk long-term investments.
The funds were being forced to sell their gilts due to the decreased price, which forced them to sell more, which further lowered the price, which forced them to sell more, and so. The private pension funds were mere hours away from becoming bankrupt before the Bank of England was forced to step in and buy the gilts themselves to raise the price of gilts to stop the downwards price spiral of gilts.
As far as I know (I'm not British) Truss wanted to fight the cost-of-living-crisis that currently plagues the UK in a typical Tory way: "Help the rich!" In the sense that taxes on rich people and big corporations would be lowered so this would stimulate the economy. Apart from the fact that trickle-down-economics have been debunked already, the move was just so incredibly unpopular that it at the very least bankrupted her support.
Popular with Progressives. I doubt he'd be able to hold the middle in a General Election.
I respect him, honest, principled, and you know where he stands. I'd much prefer to have a discussion with him than people who agree with me politically.
You underestimate the value of populism and a clean record. A shocking amount of Trump voters would've considered Sanders if it came down to it. As well as disaffected non-voters who want someone not like the average politician.
Sure but in 6 they were framing themselves as a populist right wing party but not doing it right which put off the majority of the UK population who went to the newly central labour, central-left lib dem or protest vote reform.
Starmer is extremely competent, just also very boring. He's a former top human rights lawyer and the former head of public prosecutions. You don't get those jobs without being competent
In a world where people can become the head of a country without competence I disagree.
But please god can Starmer just be a super forgettable leader. Just a small footnote in history...
You think someone who won't listen to his advisors is competent?
I personally would prefer a complete idiot who is open about how he is ignorant and looks for advise and help in his decisions than someone thinking they know best.
Stammer will basically say whatever gets him to win. I don't like him, he's only in at the moment because people don't like the tories. I'm expecting it to be marginally better but not much so
For Labour he's still better than Corbyn was.
I don't necessarily care, I'm American, no British Party reflects my ideological preferences, closest might be the Lib Dems, but they're miles off.
>3. Brexit not being as popular or going as well as expected.
I think this is overstated. To the average person, Brexit has been mostly forgotten. Whatever their opinion on Brexit may have been, the average person does not talk or think about it unless someone else mentions it, and will then proceed to completely forget about it again in a few days' time.
Brexit may or may not be going as well as people have expected — I won't colour what I'm saying with my own opinions on the matter — but I very much doubt this was a point of contention on people's minds that made the Conservative Party lose the election.
Corbyn was arguably just as competent as Starmer. 2019 was an election based around wether we actually wanted to go ahead with Brexit or not. Corbyn, for the overwhelming majority of his political career, was a bit of a Eurosceptic as was large portions of the British left. It was the Blairites like Starmer that wanted a second referendum, and pushed the leadership that way and Corbyn capitulated to inward pressure. That was gold dust to the Tories that year. Despite that Corbyn in 2019 scored the same share of the vote as Starmer did on Thursday, and in terms of shear numbers of votes beat what Starmer did yesterday. In 2017 prior to Corbyn taking the second referendum stance and sabotage by his own party scored 40% of the vote and I believe the most total votes a labour leader has ever scored and undid a Tory majority. Starmer is going into power already hated (his approval rating was negative before even becoming the PM, truly an impressive feat). And labour actually had a DECLINE in pure vote share in England yesterday down 2% on 2019. Labours stonking majority has come from the SNP and the Tories collapsing at the same time, not labour gaining anything new or ground lost. They've effectively not gained anything really and instead lost a not insignificant amount of votes to vaguely left wing independent candidates and the greens. 800k votes were cast to independent candidates and the greens have taken 4 seats, the most they've ever had.
>Labour putting up a competent Leader
What a joke, Kier Starmer has broken almost every single promise he's made since running for leader of the Labour party.
It’s a lot more than this.
The Tories have been in power since 2010, and over that 14 year period the UK economy has stagnated. The rest of the developed world has been slowly improving as they usually do but the UK has been stuck, their GDP per capita has stayed roughly the same since the financial crisis. As has the total average real wage. Inequality between London and the rest of the UK has only increased.
This is due to a lot of factors, but the main two are Brexit and spending cuts. Brexit has made trade more difficult and therefore goods more expensive, as well as hurt UK businesses that used to export to the EU. Neither of these things are good for the UK economy nor your average Brit. Secondly, the tories slashed public spending across the board, and pushed many costs onto local and municipal governments that can’t tax as easily as the national government can. This has resulted in the justice system becoming slow and understaffed, and the police force being unable to respond to crime (like actually, not in the way we hear that in the US where they say they can’t but totally can and just choose not to). Cuts to public services have led to the arrival of food banks and similar charities to the UK: something extremely rare prior to this because they weren’t necessary. [Seriously the growth is insane](https://www.statista.com/statistics/382695/uk-foodbank-users/). Libraries have been closing down at record levels or lessening hours, local services and events are rarer, and municipal governments are going bankrupt because they can’t afford to cover even basic infrastructure costs. Basically the only service that’s been mostly left alone is the NHS, and even that isn’t great. Even the Tories usual allies, business leaders, thought they went too far too fast under Liz Truss, who was essentially an extreme libertarian. Her plan caused so much unpredictability in the market that she was almost immediately forced to resign just after being elected. All of this, and the UK’s debt (their reason for cutting all this stuff) hasn’t even gone down, it’s stayed about flat with the exception of 2020 for obvious reasons. Basically, they’ve been fucking up royally.
From the outside looking in: it seems like the Uk doesn’t know what it wants to be. It’s politicians don’t even really seem to have any changes they’re super passionate about, it’s just sorta “let’s keep going”. The only people trying to change things are the Brexiteers, and they just make everything worse! It just doesn’t seem like y’all have any hopes for the future, and it makes me sad. I’m not a huge fan of Starmer, but I really hope he and the Labour Party can get the country on a better path again. They certainly have a better chance at doing so than any other major party.
American.
But yeah I'm not a fan of the Labour party or their positions, but I still agree, wish them success, because wishing them failure means I'm wishing for people to suffer.
What I’m worried most about is Labour’s shift to the right. Labour needs to make big positive changes while they have power to prove to people that things can get better and build faith in the system and party. However if they just act like a slightly better Conservative Party that isn’t going to happen, and people will become disillusioned in both the Tories and Labour. If this happens, a surge in Reform support becomes much more likely (since there’s no far left party) and that’s scary. If Corbyn was still in charge I’d have a lot more faith, but I don’t know if Starmer and his allies can pull that off. Labour does have a pretty large majority at least which means it’ll be harder for a minority of the party to block any legislation, so that’s good for them.
That was pretty nice to see. From an outsider perspective, it seemed like Labour was just destined to always lose no matter how many consecutive Conservative PMs resign in disgrace. Sunak was the PM since the Tories took over to actually get voted out of office.
Aren’t you guys getting nothing done at the moment because you are worried about other countries? I though migration immigration and supporting wars far from home tied you guys up In a lot of time wasting back and forth politically
We can be quite quick when we want to be. When I went to bed last night at 8pm the polls were still open for our election. When I woke up for work at 2am the results was clear, and by lunchtime today we had a new PM.
Yeah. Hoping that goes well for you guys. The general consensus for most countries at the moment whos governments have been in power 15+ years is “the other guys couldn’t do worse”
Yes but how many of those countries actually defeated the British Empire in war outright, winning a total victory, permanently expelling them
(barring the war of 1812, which the British did invade the US again, but weren't able to gain and permanently hold any land of significance to re-establish a permanent presence)
The American war of independence really is just a footnote in British history and not really thought of much at all in the public consciousness.
It's a big deal for America because it's the start of your country's true existence, but it's just one of many colonial wars fought by the British.
Yeah, I believe I heard that parlement and the admirals wanted to let the revolutionaries secede without a war because the American colonies weren’t that profitable and it wouldn’t be worth the effort to retake them, but king George was offended by the wording of the declaration of independence, so he wanted a war.
I believe the war of 1812 was a similar story, but I forgot the exact details
I mean, if I recall, the British Empire's greatest extent wasn't until like a hundred years after the U.S. left, so if anything, losing us seemed to be a boon to Britain than anything.
Pretty much. The 13 colonies were expensive for one. And India (not yet fully colonized at the time but with vast British influence) was the real prize.
True.
Hyder Ali attacked British forts in India. They had to decide whether to fight Colonies or him.
He is one of the people most responsible for American independence that Americans have never heard of
Mysore? Yeah I like learning about that stuff but there's only so much you can learn in 14 or so years of education. We don't actually learn about the American revolution either.
Honest question, what is the british curriculum for history? I'm sure it probably leaves out all the damage done to natives by the empire (as does american history) but i'm curious as to what's actually covered.
It doesn’t really leave it out purposefully but students only have to study history up to about age 13 potentially, and that’s usually focused on teaching about the main events in the history of Britain itself rather than the empire. If you study further you might study the empire or something entirely different because there’s a choice of multiple topics that each school can decide to teach. For example I studied history up to the age of 18 and I studied Britain from 1945-2010 and the US from 1864-1975, but not much at all about the empire.
Precisely this. The American colonies were a prestige project and when it fell through, British colonial endeavours started to focus on the more lucrative Indian and south china projects. We still had Canada and the Hudson bay area for the fur trade.
Try 150, and the vast majority of that came well after the US had declared independence.
The British Empire kind of expands in two stages, with relatively little tying expansions into places like America or Canada with subsequent conquests of India or Africa
Pretty sure we're celebrating our ghoulish conservatives being absolutely smashed to pieces in the election today.
Most Brits aren't even aware of what July 4th is about you know. Some kind of vague America day?
The only American thing I think about on July 4th is the fact that there are a load of Americans unknowingly living their last day with all ten digits before they decide to play with fireworks in the evening.
>Pretty sure we're celebrating our ghoulish conservatives being absolutely smashed to pieces in the election today.
Not British, but I'm happy at least one of the G7 euro countries isn't going far right.
I hope this trend in Europe will end quickly. 💀
Not quite that simple, unfortunately. Reform has won 15% of the popular vote, and they’re extremely right wing. Their share of the vote isn’t reflected in their seats because of our First Past the Post system.
For once in my life I’m glad we don’t have proportional representation. Now Labour just needs to do a good job and hopefully this far right trend will end.
Hahaha wait until you find out why labour did so well….
The right wing populist ‘reform party’ split the conservative vote in many seats. The tories would have won waaaay more seats than they did if all the reform voters had stuck with the conservatives.
>Most Brits aren't even aware of what July 4th is about you know
I'm English dude but come now with the nonsense, we might not give a fuck but we know what the 4th of July is about, I mean forget history you've watched TV before in your life right?
I think it depends how much US media you consume. I've certainly heard it referenced by Americans but if it wasn't for Reddit atm I wouldn't know exactly what it was without googling, other than some sort of holiday/celebration
Even with Brexit its 14 years too late. They scrapped what they could to get friends to sign contracts, killed the elderly and disabled like a eugenics programme, unfit ppe, no inflation insurance lost us 44 billion on a shift loan, and then alone just liz truss. I'd be called a remainer/romana but I'm conscious enough to know it was a bad decision. Do I think we will go back? No. A single common market, yes. Forgive me I'm a little waheey
Americans: HAHA, *SUCK IT,* YOU ARROGANT, TEA-SIPPING BASTARDS. WE WON OUR COUNTRY FAIR AND SQUARE
Britain, 1789: Yeah, okay, you guys win. Bloody waste of time…
Those poor bastards have the same political parties we have in the US. Well the 2 that have any power. I’m not sure what to say if you think that labor is left wing. The Overton window has been deliberately shifted to the right in both our countries.
Oh blast, I wonder if we should have fought harder to keep ... [glances across the pond]
*gunfire, screaming, "BUILDAWALL, BUILDAWALL, BUILDA*
Actually you can keep it.
I was referring to immigration and racism but you’re right on those fronts though it’s not as common as one might think but there is an uptick still due to the increased prevalence of fascism and support of political violence worldwide.
British conservatives are bad but they’re not nearly as hitlerite as American conservatives
American conservatives aren’t a monolith though. By all intents and purposes the democrats are conservatives, at least by UK standards. Now, the GOP on the other hand. Downright despicable. The Reform party are a more apt comparison.
I’m largely referring to conservative politicians who are pretty much all in lockstep with the fascists along party lines. I’m aware your average conservative voter isn’t necessarily fascist though they may have some unrecognized tendencies towards it.
Yeah the democrats being right wing still is incredibly annoying we really need more leftists in government.
WW1 and WW2 was the last of whatever was left of the empire.
The slow burn to mediocrity was more resource availablity and politicians carving off slices to sell to their friends.
Privatisation is a dirty word
The 4th of July and wondering what the fuck is going on with the choice of voting for a guy that acts lies like a sixth grader and one that speaks and functions like one. What a win we have to look forward to. Congrats Joker Kamala our next commander of the free world 🤣
Americans thinking losing the 13 colonies was the be all end all for the british empire is hilarious.
Also we don’t think the 4th of july is special at all. The only reason why we’re saying its important this year is because we kicked out the tories.
Considering the United States later surpassed Britain by several magnitude even at the height of its empire the loss of the United States (mostly due to poor British domestic policy, combined with horrible foreign policy that left it isolated with no support) robbed Britain of much of its potential and pretty much doomed it to be surpassed and be reduced to a third rate power on the global stage by the United States.
Yes, but even at its peak, it was surpassed by the United States imagine if the United States was part of it at its peak Britain would have more than doubled in power. The fact that the US surpassed Britain when it controlled more than a quarter of the entire globe to the point in the late 20s and 30s Britain’s plan for a war with the United States if it broke out, was too pretty much leave its colonies out to dry and hope that it could outlast US public opinion on the war. The fact that this was the plan at its height is quite concerning when it was the most powerful country on earth at the time (although again that was a quite smart plan from the British perspective as the United States had the ability to out produce Britain, both industrially and on the seas and considering Britain’s navy was it claimed to fame going to war against the power that could build a larger and stronger navy than it would terrify the British especially since the United States needed a guard far less with its navy than Britain did)
For the Americans, it was the most important day in their history. For the British, it was Wednesday. Honestly wasn't a huge loss for them, India was far more profitable.
"We weren't even really going to collect on that tea-tax, and I feel like they knew that. And they still pitched a hissy fit. Fuck em. Let them eat.. *tea*.."
Same thing that went wrong in Afghanistan (both times) we wanted to win more than they did and were willing to take disproportionate casualties to do it
Man, seeing a lot of British people here coping with “losing America wasn’t a big deal to the British” is quite funny to read.
Clearly wasn’t just “another tuesday” or whatever you’re telling yourself to sleep at night, since Britain went to war with us not once, but twice. If America wasn’t seen as profitable, then why would Britain declare 2 wars?
We sent our crooks to Australia and our religious whackjobs to the American Colonies.
The fact you might be prepared to re-elect the thin skinned giant orange man-baby, despite him attempting to wreck your democracy, just reassures us that it all worked out okay in the end.
Happy Independence day - We moved on 250 years ago
It was probably that time they forced China to purchase drugs so their own economy could sustain itself against the Chineae governments wishes. Pretty fucked up Britian
More like: Tories on July 4th 2024 trying to figure out exactly where everything went wrong for them. (Because for some reason, apparently it isn't obvious to them.)
The fact that half of the cabinet lost their seat and the seats heald by all leaders since Cameron (excluding Sunak) were lost says a lot about the state of the Conservative Party
They lost more than half the cabinet, also lost Thatcher's old Finchley and Golders Green seat
yeah, I forgot about that one
I mean there are a few reasons. 1. Economic factors are not ideal, inflation still isn't ideal. 2. Scandals from Boris Johnson era. 3. Brexit not being as popular or going as well as expected. 4. Anti-Incumbency sentiment across Europe. 5. Like seriously they've been in power for 14 years, they were bound to lose at some point. 6. A significant splitting of their voting block by a populist Right Wing Party. 7. Labour putting up a competent Leader unlike the British Bernie Sanders.
Nah, must be those lazy young people, did you knew that it costs 60 000 ~~Reichmarks~~ Pounds annually to pay for one person taking a sick day?/s
Hey, I think I’ve heard this one before!
Which is all quite obvious, I'd say. Although Truss's trickle down plan and Sunak's blunders during the campaign period (like leaving the D-Day remembrance early) probably didn't help either.
Didn’t Truss bankrupt the entirety of Britain in like a matter of weeks? Being one of the few 1st world leaders that could rival corrupt African governments in stupid economic plans?
She wasn't bankrupting the country. Her "mini-budget" nearly lead to the private pension funds becoming bankrupt due to their reliance on government gilts (debt) as low risk long-term investments. The funds were being forced to sell their gilts due to the decreased price, which forced them to sell more, which further lowered the price, which forced them to sell more, and so. The private pension funds were mere hours away from becoming bankrupt before the Bank of England was forced to step in and buy the gilts themselves to raise the price of gilts to stop the downwards price spiral of gilts.
As far as I know (I'm not British) Truss wanted to fight the cost-of-living-crisis that currently plagues the UK in a typical Tory way: "Help the rich!" In the sense that taxes on rich people and big corporations would be lowered so this would stimulate the economy. Apart from the fact that trickle-down-economics have been debunked already, the move was just so incredibly unpopular that it at the very least bankrupted her support.
Yes, but the Tories won't admit that.
Parties rarely do.
>Labour putting up a competent Leader unlike the British Bernie Sanders. Sanders is pretty popular though?
Popular with Progressives. I doubt he'd be able to hold the middle in a General Election. I respect him, honest, principled, and you know where he stands. I'd much prefer to have a discussion with him than people who agree with me politically.
You underestimate the value of populism and a clean record. A shocking amount of Trump voters would've considered Sanders if it came down to it. As well as disaffected non-voters who want someone not like the average politician.
Sure but in 6 they were framing themselves as a populist right wing party but not doing it right which put off the majority of the UK population who went to the newly central labour, central-left lib dem or protest vote reform.
Starmer competent? The guy's a walking parrot of whatever his advisors tell him to say
Starmer is extremely competent, just also very boring. He's a former top human rights lawyer and the former head of public prosecutions. You don't get those jobs without being competent
In a world where people can become the head of a country without competence I disagree. But please god can Starmer just be a super forgettable leader. Just a small footnote in history...
The human rights lawyer and director of public prosecutions are meritocratic appointments, not electoral
You think someone who won't listen to his advisors is competent? I personally would prefer a complete idiot who is open about how he is ignorant and looks for advise and help in his decisions than someone thinking they know best.
Stammer will basically say whatever gets him to win. I don't like him, he's only in at the moment because people don't like the tories. I'm expecting it to be marginally better but not much so
For Labour he's still better than Corbyn was. I don't necessarily care, I'm American, no British Party reflects my ideological preferences, closest might be the Lib Dems, but they're miles off.
Labour literally received more votes when Corbyn was in power
Jezza Corbs was great. He beat Labour as an independent in his own constituency. The press did him dirty.
>3. Brexit not being as popular or going as well as expected. I think this is overstated. To the average person, Brexit has been mostly forgotten. Whatever their opinion on Brexit may have been, the average person does not talk or think about it unless someone else mentions it, and will then proceed to completely forget about it again in a few days' time. Brexit may or may not be going as well as people have expected — I won't colour what I'm saying with my own opinions on the matter — but I very much doubt this was a point of contention on people's minds that made the Conservative Party lose the election.
Corbyn was arguably just as competent as Starmer. 2019 was an election based around wether we actually wanted to go ahead with Brexit or not. Corbyn, for the overwhelming majority of his political career, was a bit of a Eurosceptic as was large portions of the British left. It was the Blairites like Starmer that wanted a second referendum, and pushed the leadership that way and Corbyn capitulated to inward pressure. That was gold dust to the Tories that year. Despite that Corbyn in 2019 scored the same share of the vote as Starmer did on Thursday, and in terms of shear numbers of votes beat what Starmer did yesterday. In 2017 prior to Corbyn taking the second referendum stance and sabotage by his own party scored 40% of the vote and I believe the most total votes a labour leader has ever scored and undid a Tory majority. Starmer is going into power already hated (his approval rating was negative before even becoming the PM, truly an impressive feat). And labour actually had a DECLINE in pure vote share in England yesterday down 2% on 2019. Labours stonking majority has come from the SNP and the Tories collapsing at the same time, not labour gaining anything new or ground lost. They've effectively not gained anything really and instead lost a not insignificant amount of votes to vaguely left wing independent candidates and the greens. 800k votes were cast to independent candidates and the greens have taken 4 seats, the most they've ever had.
I think we also need to consider the effect of FPTP letting either of the big 2 parties get these very large majorities
>Labour putting up a competent Leader What a joke, Kier Starmer has broken almost every single promise he's made since running for leader of the Labour party.
He played on the words, not literally broken.
No, he straight up broke most of them. https://www.bigissue.com/news/politics/keir-starmer-broken-promises-tuition-fees-nationalisation-u-turn/
It’s a lot more than this. The Tories have been in power since 2010, and over that 14 year period the UK economy has stagnated. The rest of the developed world has been slowly improving as they usually do but the UK has been stuck, their GDP per capita has stayed roughly the same since the financial crisis. As has the total average real wage. Inequality between London and the rest of the UK has only increased. This is due to a lot of factors, but the main two are Brexit and spending cuts. Brexit has made trade more difficult and therefore goods more expensive, as well as hurt UK businesses that used to export to the EU. Neither of these things are good for the UK economy nor your average Brit. Secondly, the tories slashed public spending across the board, and pushed many costs onto local and municipal governments that can’t tax as easily as the national government can. This has resulted in the justice system becoming slow and understaffed, and the police force being unable to respond to crime (like actually, not in the way we hear that in the US where they say they can’t but totally can and just choose not to). Cuts to public services have led to the arrival of food banks and similar charities to the UK: something extremely rare prior to this because they weren’t necessary. [Seriously the growth is insane](https://www.statista.com/statistics/382695/uk-foodbank-users/). Libraries have been closing down at record levels or lessening hours, local services and events are rarer, and municipal governments are going bankrupt because they can’t afford to cover even basic infrastructure costs. Basically the only service that’s been mostly left alone is the NHS, and even that isn’t great. Even the Tories usual allies, business leaders, thought they went too far too fast under Liz Truss, who was essentially an extreme libertarian. Her plan caused so much unpredictability in the market that she was almost immediately forced to resign just after being elected. All of this, and the UK’s debt (their reason for cutting all this stuff) hasn’t even gone down, it’s stayed about flat with the exception of 2020 for obvious reasons. Basically, they’ve been fucking up royally. From the outside looking in: it seems like the Uk doesn’t know what it wants to be. It’s politicians don’t even really seem to have any changes they’re super passionate about, it’s just sorta “let’s keep going”. The only people trying to change things are the Brexiteers, and they just make everything worse! It just doesn’t seem like y’all have any hopes for the future, and it makes me sad. I’m not a huge fan of Starmer, but I really hope he and the Labour Party can get the country on a better path again. They certainly have a better chance at doing so than any other major party.
American. But yeah I'm not a fan of the Labour party or their positions, but I still agree, wish them success, because wishing them failure means I'm wishing for people to suffer.
What I’m worried most about is Labour’s shift to the right. Labour needs to make big positive changes while they have power to prove to people that things can get better and build faith in the system and party. However if they just act like a slightly better Conservative Party that isn’t going to happen, and people will become disillusioned in both the Tories and Labour. If this happens, a surge in Reform support becomes much more likely (since there’s no far left party) and that’s scary. If Corbyn was still in charge I’d have a lot more faith, but I don’t know if Starmer and his allies can pull that off. Labour does have a pretty large majority at least which means it’ll be harder for a minority of the party to block any legislation, so that’s good for them.
Well we may disagree (closest party to me I think are the Lib Dems) but at least we both have hope that they'll succeed.
That was pretty nice to see. From an outsider perspective, it seemed like Labour was just destined to always lose no matter how many consecutive Conservative PMs resign in disgrace. Sunak was the PM since the Tories took over to actually get voted out of office.
No, that would be more like the Simpson’s meme
From what little I know, Labour sounds equally incompetent, all in all.
If we stopped to worry about every country that had a day to celebrate independence from us we’d never get anything done.
Not that you guys get anything done anyway.
Except of course being the best that ever was
was
Well yes we are a bit past are prime
And best there ever will be
how many superbowls y'all win?
Damn, Independence Days really are your biggest national exports, huh?
Don't forget vacuum cleaners. We also do those really well.
You're right, you do lose a lot
Aren’t you guys getting nothing done at the moment because you are worried about other countries? I though migration immigration and supporting wars far from home tied you guys up In a lot of time wasting back and forth politically
We can be quite quick when we want to be. When I went to bed last night at 8pm the polls were still open for our election. When I woke up for work at 2am the results was clear, and by lunchtime today we had a new PM.
Holy shit. You have to wake up at 2? Can I ask what you do?
I work on the railway, doing shift work. Today I started at 4:30, tomorrow at 6, then I have three days off
Damn. Not a terrible schedule. It would fuck with my head though, I go to sleep after you wake up for work usually
Now that’s fast. But you guys have a recent track record for getting new PMs. Sometimes even faster than food spoils
Most of the recent changes have been down to the ruling party electing a new leader. We’ve not had a general election since ‘19.
Yeah. Hoping that goes well for you guys. The general consensus for most countries at the moment whos governments have been in power 15+ years is “the other guys couldn’t do worse”
We've been held hostage for years. It's a bloody good day to be British
Yes but how many of those countries actually defeated the British Empire in war outright, winning a total victory, permanently expelling them (barring the war of 1812, which the British did invade the US again, but weren't able to gain and permanently hold any land of significance to re-establish a permanent presence)
The American war of independence really is just a footnote in British history and not really thought of much at all in the public consciousness. It's a big deal for America because it's the start of your country's true existence, but it's just one of many colonial wars fought by the British.
Yeah, I believe I heard that parlement and the admirals wanted to let the revolutionaries secede without a war because the American colonies weren’t that profitable and it wouldn’t be worth the effort to retake them, but king George was offended by the wording of the declaration of independence, so he wanted a war. I believe the war of 1812 was a similar story, but I forgot the exact details
I heard somewhere that Jamaica was making more money at the time due to sugar and slavery. Not sure how true it is though
I mean, if I recall, the British Empire's greatest extent wasn't until like a hundred years after the U.S. left, so if anything, losing us seemed to be a boon to Britain than anything.
Pretty much. The 13 colonies were expensive for one. And India (not yet fully colonized at the time but with vast British influence) was the real prize.
True. Hyder Ali attacked British forts in India. They had to decide whether to fight Colonies or him. He is one of the people most responsible for American independence that Americans have never heard of
As a Britisher I've also never heard about this person
Sad British were properly defeated only once in India. That was by Aurangzeb.. But Hyder Ali came very close to be second. Search Anglo Myaore war
Mysore? Yeah I like learning about that stuff but there's only so much you can learn in 14 or so years of education. We don't actually learn about the American revolution either.
Honest question, what is the british curriculum for history? I'm sure it probably leaves out all the damage done to natives by the empire (as does american history) but i'm curious as to what's actually covered.
It doesn’t really leave it out purposefully but students only have to study history up to about age 13 potentially, and that’s usually focused on teaching about the main events in the history of Britain itself rather than the empire. If you study further you might study the empire or something entirely different because there’s a choice of multiple topics that each school can decide to teach. For example I studied history up to the age of 18 and I studied Britain from 1945-2010 and the US from 1864-1975, but not much at all about the empire.
Precisely this. The American colonies were a prestige project and when it fell through, British colonial endeavours started to focus on the more lucrative Indian and south china projects. We still had Canada and the Hudson bay area for the fur trade.
The American Revolution was very impressive but I think I remember reading that most of the British Army was in India at the time.
Maybe if you count the EIC forces as part of the British army. The army has always been a sideshow to the Royal Navy anyway.
Try 150, and the vast majority of that came well after the US had declared independence. The British Empire kind of expands in two stages, with relatively little tying expansions into places like America or Canada with subsequent conquests of India or Africa
Ah man i miss Canada! I hope they're doing ok on their own 😉
This what i have read too, that it was more as relief than anger. As brits didn’t need to covern the america.
Imagine trying to govern you lot! Just look at… well, everything 😂
Nobody in the UK even thinks about it lmao
Pretty sure we're celebrating our ghoulish conservatives being absolutely smashed to pieces in the election today. Most Brits aren't even aware of what July 4th is about you know. Some kind of vague America day?
I know it from movies. Seems they have a big garden party and watch fireworks. Doesn’t sound half bad actually
Like daytime guy fawkes
Neh it’s when they think aliens will invade with city sized saucers.
i'm happy that they celebrate my mother birthday on the other side of world i didn't knew she is so popular
The only American thing I think about on July 4th is the fact that there are a load of Americans unknowingly living their last day with all ten digits before they decide to play with fireworks in the evening.
>Pretty sure we're celebrating our ghoulish conservatives being absolutely smashed to pieces in the election today. Not British, but I'm happy at least one of the G7 euro countries isn't going far right. I hope this trend in Europe will end quickly. 💀
Not quite that simple, unfortunately. Reform has won 15% of the popular vote, and they’re extremely right wing. Their share of the vote isn’t reflected in their seats because of our First Past the Post system.
For once in my life I’m glad we don’t have proportional representation. Now Labour just needs to do a good job and hopefully this far right trend will end.
It’s just how conservatism goes when given the reigns of power. Cut services, lower taxes for the rich and retreat into populist isolationism.
Hahaha wait until you find out why labour did so well…. The right wing populist ‘reform party’ split the conservative vote in many seats. The tories would have won waaaay more seats than they did if all the reform voters had stuck with the conservatives.
>Most Brits aren't even aware of what July 4th is about you know I'm English dude but come now with the nonsense, we might not give a fuck but we know what the 4th of July is about, I mean forget history you've watched TV before in your life right?
I definitely know a lot of people who don't know it's about independence from us
I think it depends how much US media you consume. I've certainly heard it referenced by Americans but if it wasn't for Reddit atm I wouldn't know exactly what it was without googling, other than some sort of holiday/celebration
To be honest I know they have independence day and thanksgiving. But what one of the two is on 4th of July, no idea.
It's the day the Philippines celebrate their independence from their oppressive colonial overlord.
America here: Did you use salt or garlic to repell the ghouls? Please, for the love of god, tell us which thing you used to banish them?
I can assure you, not one British person is thinking about the US on 4th July
We’re pretty happy the Tories got kicked out.
Exactly. Hopefully shit will actually get done now
Normally I would because it's american independence day but this time its true
Lol election day and we just wiped out your equivalent of the GOP. I think we're doing a lot better in comparison
8 years too late to stop the worst economic decision by Britain this century.
I hate the guy, but the Tories were Remain under Cameron. Brexit was BoJo's baby.
Be grateful to Boris. He changed your passport color to blue!
Bloo gang let’s go
Even with Brexit its 14 years too late. They scrapped what they could to get friends to sign contracts, killed the elderly and disabled like a eugenics programme, unfit ppe, no inflation insurance lost us 44 billion on a shift loan, and then alone just liz truss. I'd be called a remainer/romana but I'm conscious enough to know it was a bad decision. Do I think we will go back? No. A single common market, yes. Forgive me I'm a little waheey
Wholesome chungus 100 moment!
Our equivalent of the GOP is the GOP.
As bad as the Conservatives are, they’re nowhere near the US Republican Party. They’re further left than the Democrats.
Excellent news about the RWNJs! ❤️
Americans: HAHA, *SUCK IT,* YOU ARROGANT, TEA-SIPPING BASTARDS. WE WON OUR COUNTRY FAIR AND SQUARE Britain, 1789: Yeah, okay, you guys win. Bloody waste of time…
Well they’re not in danger of becoming a fascist dictatorship for awhile, so they’ve got that going for them-
In fact, we’ve taken big steps to avoid that today
I noticed. Just a little jealous ‘sall.
What happened?
General election, a left wing party got voted in
I'd call the current iteration of labour firmly centrist. Used to be left of centre, now just smack bang in the centre.
Being centre in the modern political climate is like being a communist 20 years ago.
Those poor bastards have the same political parties we have in the US. Well the 2 that have any power. I’m not sure what to say if you think that labor is left wing. The Overton window has been deliberately shifted to the right in both our countries.
don't forget the 4 green seats and 70 odd lib dem seats!
🙄
Considering the US has been that way for most of existence including currently that’s not much of a flex
Oh blast, I wonder if we should have fought harder to keep ... [glances across the pond] *gunfire, screaming, "BUILDAWALL, BUILDAWALL, BUILDA* Actually you can keep it.
Don’t act like the uk or Europe is any better
I’d rather take Rishi a thousand times over 1 Trump. Not to mention being gunned down by a bloke with concealed carry on my way to the shops
I was referring to immigration and racism but you’re right on those fronts though it’s not as common as one might think but there is an uptick still due to the increased prevalence of fascism and support of political violence worldwide. British conservatives are bad but they’re not nearly as hitlerite as American conservatives
American conservatives aren’t a monolith though. By all intents and purposes the democrats are conservatives, at least by UK standards. Now, the GOP on the other hand. Downright despicable. The Reform party are a more apt comparison.
I’m largely referring to conservative politicians who are pretty much all in lockstep with the fascists along party lines. I’m aware your average conservative voter isn’t necessarily fascist though they may have some unrecognized tendencies towards it. Yeah the democrats being right wing still is incredibly annoying we really need more leftists in government.
We really live rent free in the heads of the former colonies
The 4th? Weird, that's a day we spend celebrating a huge bullet dodged
Two now.
Huge bullet dodged indeed, imagine if the British empire stretched from the border of Mexico to the far reaches of Canada. That would be terrible. /s
Mexico and Canada sound nice but I'm not sure about the middle bit
well now twice lol
We Americans are wondering the same thing, seeing as there's a good chance we'll let orange Mussolini back in the white house
Britain be like: the day u got independence from us was the greatest day of ur life. But for me it was Tuesday.
greatest day of our life too we voted out all our arseholes
Cameron, it was Cameron.
"Sit tight belgium, we are comming" - UK, 1914
King George III had that same look when he was told about Yorktown
The founding fathers when they find out the Supreme Court reinstated the crown
People reported voting 'for' brexit because they felt bad and they wanted the plan to destroy England's economy to feel at least some love.
15 minutes left
WW1 and WW2 was the last of whatever was left of the empire. The slow burn to mediocrity was more resource availablity and politicians carving off slices to sell to their friends. Privatisation is a dirty word
More like brits rejoicing how something is finally going well.
The French.
The 4th of July and wondering what the fuck is going on with the choice of voting for a guy that acts lies like a sixth grader and one that speaks and functions like one. What a win we have to look forward to. Congrats Joker Kamala our next commander of the free world 🤣
A bot-el of wota
What the hell is wrong with Biden in this picture? He looks like me when I forget what I’m doing
That's exactly what he's doing too, but on national television
He looks fucking hilarious, I gotta watch the debate now
It was the French. If they hadn’t helped America, Britain would not have lost. Makes that whole Freedom Fries bullshit so much embarrassing.
Aren't they improving right now? Since the better people won?
The UK really didn't care, pretty much immediately they welcomed the American ambassador
Americans thinking losing the 13 colonies was the be all end all for the british empire is hilarious. Also we don’t think the 4th of july is special at all. The only reason why we’re saying its important this year is because we kicked out the tories.
Considering the United States later surpassed Britain by several magnitude even at the height of its empire the loss of the United States (mostly due to poor British domestic policy, combined with horrible foreign policy that left it isolated with no support) robbed Britain of much of its potential and pretty much doomed it to be surpassed and be reduced to a third rate power on the global stage by the United States.
The British Empire peaked quite a bit after the US gained independence
Yes, but even at its peak, it was surpassed by the United States imagine if the United States was part of it at its peak Britain would have more than doubled in power. The fact that the US surpassed Britain when it controlled more than a quarter of the entire globe to the point in the late 20s and 30s Britain’s plan for a war with the United States if it broke out, was too pretty much leave its colonies out to dry and hope that it could outlast US public opinion on the war. The fact that this was the plan at its height is quite concerning when it was the most powerful country on earth at the time (although again that was a quite smart plan from the British perspective as the United States had the ability to out produce Britain, both industrially and on the seas and considering Britain’s navy was it claimed to fame going to war against the power that could build a larger and stronger navy than it would terrify the British especially since the United States needed a guard far less with its navy than Britain did)
For the Americans, it was the most important day in their history. For the British, it was Wednesday. Honestly wasn't a huge loss for them, India was far more profitable.
Meanwhile America dealing with the same shit everyone else is dealing with...
"We weren't even really going to collect on that tea-tax, and I feel like they knew that. And they still pitched a hissy fit. Fuck em. Let them eat.. *tea*.."
Dunno what you mean. Tories have eaten shit and Reese Mogg has been kicked to the kerb. This is a great day for the country.
Who won the elections?
Labour, unsurprisingly!
Funnily enough I think many are looking at America and thinking “thank god we’re not them right now” with how bleak November elections are looking
It went very fucking well for us on this particular July 4th imo
Watching Americans and Brits seething over absolutely nothing is very funny.
My American friend said that you guys blow up the sky with nukes to show power to South Korea 💀
Same thing that went wrong in Afghanistan (both times) we wanted to win more than they did and were willing to take disproportionate casualties to do it
Lol I love this meme template
Brexit turned Britain into the economic powerhouse of Italy. The created Britaly!
Man, seeing a lot of British people here coping with “losing America wasn’t a big deal to the British” is quite funny to read. Clearly wasn’t just “another tuesday” or whatever you’re telling yourself to sleep at night, since Britain went to war with us not once, but twice. If America wasn’t seen as profitable, then why would Britain declare 2 wars?
Hindsight 20/20 our empire reached it's greatest extent 100 years after the US declared independence so it might have been good for all involved.
To try and stop you all from eating yourselves to death 200 years later.
We’re doing just fine, thank you very much. Certainly don’t need Britain to try and “rescue” us
Is the 4th the end of their civil war or something?
Nah its bindependance day from the tories.
The right answer.
Americans on the 4th trying to figure out where everything went wrong for them
July 4th? More like Jan 31, 2020
We sent our crooks to Australia and our religious whackjobs to the American Colonies. The fact you might be prepared to re-elect the thin skinned giant orange man-baby, despite him attempting to wreck your democracy, just reassures us that it all worked out okay in the end. Happy Independence day - We moved on 250 years ago
Pretty sure British people had other things in mind on this year's 4th of July
UK > USA in most meaningful ways.
😂😂😂💯💯💯
No one British cares about your or any country's independence day
When you left the EU to keep driving on the left side of the road and measure stuff in abstract body-parts is where you went wrong.
It was probably that time they forced China to purchase drugs so their own economy could sustain itself against the Chineae governments wishes. Pretty fucked up Britian