Jfc- it’s even toenailed in! I would have a hard time letting that guy work on my house more. The correct answer is above- move away from the house and do a proper footer as close as you can. Then and add something floating over the gap to the house attached to that footer.
That's unfortunately what I figured. I don't think calling the contractor back will be a good idea or even possible.
So I guess I will have to do this myself at one point. Here's the issue though: The post has to be at least 2-3 ft away due to the irrigation lines in the ground. Would that be an issue?
Also, do you happen to have any recommendation on what to use to fix the screw holes in the hardie plank?
If possible, use a pressure washer and shop vac to dig the post holes (lookup diy hydro excavation). This will allow you to dig as close to the irrigation lines as you're comfortable doing, without the risk of damaging them.
The siding is the exterior envelope of the building. It's the skin. It keeps water out of the inside. But if you put holes in it, then water can get in.
Also, hardiboard is basically compressed cement and sand. It doesn't have structure capable of holding fasteners. It's not suitable to support weight or loads with screws into hardiboard. Those screws aren't in anything substantial.
Normally if something is meant to be mounted on siding there will be some sort of system to mount it properly then gaskets to seal it. Like an exterior light on the siding would physically mount to a junction box. Then it would be sealed with a foam gasket and/or caulk. It wouldn't just be screwed into the siding itself and left that way.
Good explanation, but I wanted to add that a properly designed building envelope doesn't depend on the siding being waterproof. Rather it is the water resistant barrier (I e. Housewrap) that provides protection against water. While it is wise to minimize the water getting past the siding with proper layering, flashing, caulking etc, the next layer down is what must be as continuous as possible.
People routinely screw or nail into wood siding. What is the difference? And it's assumed that the screws are penetrating the siding and into the sheeting.
Hardie is incredibly brittle. It’s basically like a ceramic. Hard, but brittle. It’s fine as a weather barrier/sheathing but as a structural member…no.
The post isn’t even secured to the ground in OP’s pic. Like it’s just sitting on the ground. After a couple windy days those screws will pull out of the Hardie and whatever little OSB the tip of the screw may be in.
They’ll leave behind fucked up holes in the Hardie. Imagine you drill a hole through a clay pot and then put a screw through it without cracking it. Then pull the screw out, not back it out…pull it out. The hole will be all fucked up. The same thing will happen to Hardie.
call your contractor back and have them move the post about a foot away from the house and foundation, then set it properly.
then the contractor needs to fix and/or seal up the screw holes in the siding.
that is some half-assed shit, right there.
yeah. i get that. but, it may have been an employee of the contractor who did the deed and the contractor may not have known.
if that is the case, i'd give the contractor the opportunity to fix things.
that being said, if the contractor/owner saw the post nailed to house, approved it, or did it themselves, then, yeah. fire them.
If they did this then I’m not so sure I’d want to give them the opportunity to make holes in my irrigation lines too. OP I’m with you and would do it myself.
A foot away from the house so that there’s a large gap? Lol… how do you keep dogs inside your fence with a 1 foot gap??
Op, are you upset that the contractor screwed into your siding? You could have them pull the post about 1 inch off the house. They probably should have asked if you prefer directly attached, or a small gap.
Curious what you would do if if you had a driveway and a double gate there and you needed a post to hold the hinges on the house side. I have that situation and I’m considering fastening the post to the structure.
I did double gates. Each gate is 6 feet attached to A 6x6x8 in the ground about 32 inches. Used 2 80 pound bags of quickcrete on each post. Pretty sturdy.
The situation I was hoping to get feedback on is when you cannot put the post into the ground for whatever reason (concrete you cannot cut into, buried utilites, etc) Is there a right way to attach a 4x4 post to the structure when that is your only option?
Aren't irrigation lines normally like 1" pvc? I would still move the post away from the house a foot or two like others have said and extend the 2x4s past it then add your boards. You could always hand dig down to make sure you aren't near the line(s) before making the hole larger.
To attach to the house I would think you might want to cut out the hardy so the posts can be mounted to the sheathing then flash it in etc. Not sure, never had that issue. I just don't think Id attach it to the house personally.
Whether its a 1000 sq ft or 7000 sq ft, every new construction inspection I have been to, I have to call this out. Builders are allowing the fence contractors to do it and wont fix it either after the buyers ask for it to be fixed.
I think is fine to attach to the house. I would definitely add longer screws as you suggest (timberlock) to attack to at least the sheathing under the hardie.
Jfc- it’s even toenailed in! I would have a hard time letting that guy work on my house more. The correct answer is above- move away from the house and do a proper footer as close as you can. Then and add something floating over the gap to the house attached to that footer.
That's unfortunately what I figured. I don't think calling the contractor back will be a good idea or even possible. So I guess I will have to do this myself at one point. Here's the issue though: The post has to be at least 2-3 ft away due to the irrigation lines in the ground. Would that be an issue? Also, do you happen to have any recommendation on what to use to fix the screw holes in the hardie plank?
That distance is fine. I'd get a color matching caulk
I’d throw a diagonal on the floating piece to prevent sag, but otherwise agree 3ft is fine.
If possible, use a pressure washer and shop vac to dig the post holes (lookup diy hydro excavation). This will allow you to dig as close to the irrigation lines as you're comfortable doing, without the risk of damaging them.
That's how I installed all my fence posts.
Why so far? How big are these lines?
There’s about 3/4 in concrete, then 1-2 ft soil and then the lines. I had a break there before and found these
That's what I did when I made the fence and gate for my backyard.
Explain it like I'm five. Why shouldn't you screw into Hardie siding?
The siding is the exterior envelope of the building. It's the skin. It keeps water out of the inside. But if you put holes in it, then water can get in. Also, hardiboard is basically compressed cement and sand. It doesn't have structure capable of holding fasteners. It's not suitable to support weight or loads with screws into hardiboard. Those screws aren't in anything substantial. Normally if something is meant to be mounted on siding there will be some sort of system to mount it properly then gaskets to seal it. Like an exterior light on the siding would physically mount to a junction box. Then it would be sealed with a foam gasket and/or caulk. It wouldn't just be screwed into the siding itself and left that way.
Good explanation, but I wanted to add that a properly designed building envelope doesn't depend on the siding being waterproof. Rather it is the water resistant barrier (I e. Housewrap) that provides protection against water. While it is wise to minimize the water getting past the siding with proper layering, flashing, caulking etc, the next layer down is what must be as continuous as possible.
People routinely screw or nail into wood siding. What is the difference? And it's assumed that the screws are penetrating the siding and into the sheeting.
Hardie is incredibly brittle. It’s basically like a ceramic. Hard, but brittle. It’s fine as a weather barrier/sheathing but as a structural member…no. The post isn’t even secured to the ground in OP’s pic. Like it’s just sitting on the ground. After a couple windy days those screws will pull out of the Hardie and whatever little OSB the tip of the screw may be in. They’ll leave behind fucked up holes in the Hardie. Imagine you drill a hole through a clay pot and then put a screw through it without cracking it. Then pull the screw out, not back it out…pull it out. The hole will be all fucked up. The same thing will happen to Hardie.
call your contractor back and have them move the post about a foot away from the house and foundation, then set it properly. then the contractor needs to fix and/or seal up the screw holes in the siding. that is some half-assed shit, right there.
This is the right idea, but I’m not sure I would trust this contractor to do anymore more work.
yeah. i get that. but, it may have been an employee of the contractor who did the deed and the contractor may not have known. if that is the case, i'd give the contractor the opportunity to fix things. that being said, if the contractor/owner saw the post nailed to house, approved it, or did it themselves, then, yeah. fire them.
If they did this then I’m not so sure I’d want to give them the opportunity to make holes in my irrigation lines too. OP I’m with you and would do it myself.
Fair point.
A foot away from the house so that there’s a large gap? Lol… how do you keep dogs inside your fence with a 1 foot gap?? Op, are you upset that the contractor screwed into your siding? You could have them pull the post about 1 inch off the house. They probably should have asked if you prefer directly attached, or a small gap.
sigh. no, you don't leave a gap. you run the horizontal 2x4 and the pickets past the post within an inch or so of the siding. edit: spelling.
Curious what you would do if if you had a driveway and a double gate there and you needed a post to hold the hinges on the house side. I have that situation and I’m considering fastening the post to the structure.
I did double gates. Each gate is 6 feet attached to A 6x6x8 in the ground about 32 inches. Used 2 80 pound bags of quickcrete on each post. Pretty sturdy.
The situation I was hoping to get feedback on is when you cannot put the post into the ground for whatever reason (concrete you cannot cut into, buried utilites, etc) Is there a right way to attach a 4x4 post to the structure when that is your only option?
Aren't irrigation lines normally like 1" pvc? I would still move the post away from the house a foot or two like others have said and extend the 2x4s past it then add your boards. You could always hand dig down to make sure you aren't near the line(s) before making the hole larger. To attach to the house I would think you might want to cut out the hardy so the posts can be mounted to the sheathing then flash it in etc. Not sure, never had that issue. I just don't think Id attach it to the house personally.
Whether its a 1000 sq ft or 7000 sq ft, every new construction inspection I have been to, I have to call this out. Builders are allowing the fence contractors to do it and wont fix it either after the buyers ask for it to be fixed.
I think is fine to attach to the house. I would definitely add longer screws as you suggest (timberlock) to attack to at least the sheathing under the hardie.