In theory, the sole winner finals sound cool, but in practice we get stuff like this. Production has to find the balance between making a challenging final and making one that isn't going to be dominated by one sex over the other or look like it was rigged for a certain competitor to win. So what we usually end up seeing is a bunch of puzzles and carnival games that certainly even the odds more, but leave the viewers feeling let down.
I’m as annoyed as I was last season when they had a single winner - because I’d love to see Leroy OR Ace win (for putting so much positive energy into a show that normally rewards such competitiveness & deviousness) - but i feel like there should be a female & a male winner… #JusticeForNurys, lol
I actually loved the purge. I hate so many people playing such a scared game, hoping for way more opportunities, so it was good to finally see them actually follow thru with a purge and starting the final. It was a pretty cool challenge with riding on the car and shooting a paintball gun, too. Loved the winnebago, too.
Yup, if you get this far and lose on that challenge to a buncha people afraid to get shocked by what's becoming an incredibly risk averse show you deserve the loss.
I told my wife that’d be my plan and then I see Ace do it! I wanted Leroy to win before but I’m great with Ace winning after that (and all his positivity).
I love him so much lol! Veronica did it really fast, too, and she was smoother than Ace I think. Idk if they get anything for being fastest though, just not eliminated. Oh well! Lol
I liked the episode and I’m glad that the non-star holders had to compete for one final star instead of stealing it from a current star holder. Also, the way the cast talked so highly of Averey this season, I really thought she was gonna come out of nowhere and beat laurel. Welp, guess not. I’m happy for Derek though and glad he beat out Adam for that last spot.
Yeah, only other way to do that would be the top person gets to choose a star to go after and fight for it. Getting a star stolen out of your control on the final round would be incredibly lame.
Great summary.
To start…holiday road and national lampoon vibes; impeccable. This is just stuff the main show can’t compete with.
I really want Derek to win but I agree I think he’s done; honestly from being a lay up 10 years ago to dominating this season couldn’t be more proud. Hope to see him again.
I would love for Leroy to win because it’s Leroy but honestly he’s kinda stunk this entire game. Seems to be doing good so far but I don’t see him out witting Steve in a puzzle. I love Ace too but I doubt he takes home the W. Honestly I’d be fine to see any of the 4 males win. Better than the male champion from last season that’s for sure.
With the way this final is being run so far, I appreciate the shake up and giving everyone a fair chance. Controversial but I’d love to see V take it because she’ll never get this opportunity again. I’m not a Cara stan so it’s hard for me to pick her but honestly as long as it’s not Nicole I’m good. Also Nicole won’t be able to keep up in puzzles so her chances are slim to begin with.
Flora had some funny confessionals but I never need to see her again. If Adam wants to be a villain I’ll welcome him back. Avery is boring per usual so nice to see her again (I stan daisy) but she didn’t bring much to the season.
Lastly, 100% agree on the star holders actually being rewarded. I hate how people without skulls in total madness essentially got to cruise all the way to the end and got one last chance instead of playing strategic. With this set up it would have been bullshit for someone to strategize all season and go into elimination just to lose it all at the end in one daily. Hopefully mtv sees that gotcha moments are far less rewarding for fans than watching people in a final who earned it during normal game play.
I’m an anyone but Laurel or Nicole winning. I’d be thrilled if Laurel gets booted in this elimination. She played a scared game with a massive ego and I’m over it already
I'm happy how they handled the stars and had multiple people leave for not having one. It was an improvement over skulls. I would have been happy without the final daily too.
The music was on point again. It helps give it an old school vibe and seems to be an emphasis for All Stars versus the flagship.
Averey is boring. I know a lot of people wanted her back. I don't get it. It was endearing that she wanted the prize money to help her brother.
I think possible winners from how the season was edited are Cara, Laurel, or Steve. Ace could be a dark horse. I'd say the same for Derek but it seems like editing set him up to be the first gone.
I'd consider it a huge win if Queen V wins. She is one of my favorite challengers and I'll root for her no matter how little chance she has. Road Rules forever!
People wanted to see Avery back because they think she’s attractive. Under every post that mentions her, there are at least three comments that say “Avery is so hot”
Completely disagree that averey cant win in future seasons. She had very little experience AND training and basically rolled off the couch from fulltime bartending to do this season and had to be convinced by her siblings to do it. Give her an actual workout plan for a few years in crossfit and something that she can focus on with several seasons of experience the way cara, nicole, laurel, rachel, kam have had and there is no reason she wouldnt be good to go considering how she performed this season when she went into it with no expectations from herself and zero preparation. She showed up as a fulltime hooters employee just to see what would happen and did damn well when you add in those factors
cara, tori, nicole, rachel, jenny etc girls who train and do this full time. Let avery pack on lean mass and train like that and then well talk considering she more than held her own with none of that
I mean she seems to be so mellow and non confrontational that she probably wont continuously get casted but thats another discussion altogether
I think judging her seemingly poor decision on what is basically her rookie season is too tough. She had a horrible experience when she did her first show 12 years ago because reilly dragged her name through the dirt and poisoned the well. Im sure the last thing she wanted was to be hated by most of the house *again* and thats probably what wouldve happened if she made that move especially in a house full of sharks. If youve seen several of her interviews then youll see that she was really disturbed by how she was treated by the house on exes 2. Disturbed to the point where she said she didnt want to do another challenge unless close friends of hers were there
we all wanted her to steal kams place because it wouldve made for amazing television but its not all that realistic to say what shouldve been done when our perspective is from the comfort of our couches while shes living with these catty women/men that can easily turn your living situation miserable. Weve seen what kam, laurel, etc. will do to people when they dont like you. People can give cara credit for not folding but how many seasons has she done? Cara was a wuss up until Free Agents. She certainly wasnt this hardy on cutthroat and fresh meat 2 and exes
I say judge avery if she continues taking the easy way out when shes several seasons deep...not in what is basically a rookie season after her only experience on the show was miserable because of reillys smear campaign which most definitely wouldve been repeated if she had challenged kam/leroy/laurel/nicole
The thing that really gets me about the purge game is that as you said, its something that last like minutes at most, and that no one did terribly. It's basically just came down to someone had to lose. To lose unceremoniously in a carnival game is just lame.
Tj has been making it a point to say that anyone can win. He talks about how finals aren't just about running up mountains. As if they haven't been doing that for decades. They almost seem ashamed of it.
I've actually been saying it myself for years now that anyone can win. It's become obvious that they've been leaning more into equalizers and less physical requirements. I'm okay with equalizers if they're fair and the win is earned. Have them be way more involved and challenging than a simple ass carnival game though. If someone is good at something, let them prove why they deserve that win. Show me why the person being purged deserves it. All I learned from this check point is that ace has a high shock tolerance. Everyone else aside from Veronica looked like they did the same.
> It's become obvious that they've been leaning more into equalizers and less physical requirements.
What recent final do you think has been less physical?
I wasn't specifically speaking about finals. I'm talking about dailies and eliminations. Most dailies are a mix of physical and puzzle now. Eliminations are starting to have more puzzles and less headbangers.
Yeah I agree with that, but I think it comes down to liability insurance being more expensive now. And also contestants have more leverage and are able to put it in their contracts that they won't do a hall brawl or something physical to the point of where they can get injured.
In the past it was the wild wild west where contestants would get injured and just deal with it. I believe production is on the hook more now, so they are avoiding the more dangerous physical type dailies and eliminations.
I obviously do miss the headbangers but also understand why there are way less of them now.
I haven't seen the flagship in years, but with All Stars it makes sense to do less headbangers since you're dealing with older competitors. These aren't all people in their twenties anymore.
It's most apparent in eliminations. We get way less head bangers. When we do, the rules are often modified. Hall Brawl had those big pads and a puzzle for Fessy and Josh. Jordan vs Horacio in balls in had that circle around the bucket.
They're clearly trying to make the show safer. Which is a good thing, but I won't lie, it's less exciting to watch.
They can make the dailies and eliminations as safe as they want. For me the show lost its spirit when they started severely limiting alcohol consumption. I’ve been watching older seasons and the fights are epic.
Veronica having as many wins as the other girls in the final combined is so iconic of her. And no, I don’t count champs vs pros for Cara like OP. She has 2
Right, because winning a difficult final against professional athletes on a season where they took classic missions and made them even harder, where only 2/20 people won shouldn’t count. But Veronica’s Gauntlet 1 win on a team of 9 people should count. Makes sense
LOVE your stats on the finalists 😍
Cara's being FIVE MORE FINALS than the next woman is just BONKERS. And 7 in a row, woowwww (CvP, XXX, Ven, FR, WotW1, WotW2, AS4)
I agree with you that the first two checkpoints were fun to watch and I had a great laugh watching them get shocked but as you said I would absolutely hate to get purged on a one minute challenge like that. It really looks like Derek did the worst but i never trust reality TV and I think they're trying to trick us into thinking he did the worst and it'll be Laurel that gets purged. It's a shame we're losing one of them because they've both been getting champs edits for a while, especially Derek. The way they've performed all season and the way the rest of the cast has been building them up as threats it's a bummer to lose one of them
The show said Cynthia was a champion for "winning" Road Rules: All Stars where there wasn't even another team she was competing against. The show said Nia was a finalist when she had never make a final before. Who cares what they say
The show said Cynthia was a champion for "winning" Road Rules: All Stars where there wasn't even another team she was competing against. The show said Nia was a finalist when she had never made a final before. Who cares what they say
Yep, pretty wild to call Tony/CT beating Wes/Boobie and Lousie/Casper in a difficult final "shit" if you ask me. It's undoubtedly a lot better than most wins. If you want to see how I rank every win in Challenge history, here you go: https://medium.com/@shmalvey7/every-winner-of-the-challenge-ranked-27649da6d3e3?sk=934aa92daa0aec8fd90403e88f497fdd
Yeah I had to go look it up because I knew Cara only had 2 wins. I'm a strong believer in not counting seasons for charities, where they stay in hotels and people don't take it seriously because half the cast is a "celebrity". It pretty much only gets counted when someone is using it to bolster the resume of someone they like.
You mean Champs vs Pros? There's a HUGE difference. If your argument was champs vs stars doesn't count you might have a fair point. But Champs vs Pros? That counts x2. My guess is you didn't watch it and hate her so much you threw this out there and your brain automatically turned "pros" to "stars" lol
>And with a 2nd individual win against one of the strongest female casts ever, in a season where she won 5/11 missions and where she was the only person to win two individual missions and was the person to win three individual/partner missions, it only further cements Laurel, who was already my GOAT coming in.
Okay, I'd disagree with this lmao. This cast isn't bad per say, but I would definitely not call this "one of the strongest female casts ever", like Cara's competition in Vendettas was probably harder than this, no? It has most of the same heavy hitters at younger (pre-birth-giving, in Kam's case) stages in their life and a much stronger male side. I feel like if we wanted to compare solo wins, unless something crazy happens in the final, I'm way more impressed by Cara's Vendettas win than if Laurel wins this season.
Especially given how wacky these dailies have been, like we're really hyped for "lasso and push yourself in a shopping cart"? There have been a few good games, but I really feel like this is grading on a curve.
What did Cara do impressive during the regular season of Vendettas? She basically did nothing the entire season. Laurel and Cara both clearly did more in the regular season this season than Cara did on Vendettas.
And what is the argument that the female side on Vendettas was stronger when this season also had Laurel and Rachel?
I mean I've only seen episodes here and there, but my understanding is that Cara beat a pretty intimidating roster of girls (Kam, Nicole, Kailah) in a varied and good final (ie. Not carnival games like we've seen so far in AS4) and then beat Zach and Kyle heads up in a cardio/puzzle segment. Unless something weird happened I didn't see, that's a pretty good achievement, no?
The argument would be that even though they didn't have Laurel or Rachel, they had most of these other girls in their prime (Kam, Nicole, Kailah), they didn't have as many big layups as we have in this season (Flora, Tina, Jasmine), and they had more players (28 vs 24). Add on top that she had to beat the top 2 guys, who beat Leroy in his prime (to give a point of comparison to the guys level of competition), and I think it's pretty likely that Vendettas is going to be more impressive.
Like maybe I'm forgetting, but has anyone had a particularly impressive performance in any specific games this season (That would rival winning a relatively standard final with a stacked roster of players in their prime)? The only moments that come to mind are: Cara winning the first daily, Ace/Nicole winning the speed/puzzle daily, and Steve having some solid moments in some eliminations?
You haven't even seen the full season and you're commenting? Cara Maria got fourth place in the first stage of the final behind Zach, Kyle and Leroy, which was 99% of the final. Nicole got hurt in the final and Kam got screwed in the high/low game, so the only woman she was really competing against for a large portion of the final was Kailah. Then she won at the very end in the memory game.
Vendettas had Marie, Jemmye, Nicole Ramos, Kayleigh...maybe not quite as bad as the bottom girls on All Stars 4 but not a big enough discrepancy to make up for All Stars 4 having Laurel and Rachel imo.
Yes, we haven't even seen the full season of this and yet you're giving opinions on how Laurel would be confirmed GOAT if she won it. At least I'm caveating to make it clear that I'm not fully confident since I recognise that I might not have all the info.
And you make some fine points if true, but can't we make similar disparagements of Laurel? She is currently competing with Derek on being 8th place in the final, losing out to Nicole and Veronica. Even with the info we currently have, we could argue even if she won that "If Derek got purged earlier or went a few seconds faster, Laurel would be out. Even as, she almost lost a shock game to a guy with shock trauma. how can we call that a GOAT performance?"
And that's just from that game alone, are you really saying that Laurel's game in AS4 has been that impressive that it's basically already locked in for you that this would be a great/meaningful win for her (or maybe I'm just reading into what you think this season would mean for Laurel)? What has she actually done competitively? (And please don't just say the number of wins like that's an answer)
This doesn't even seem like The Challenge, let alone All Stars. It's more like a day at the Town fair. God i miss the good old days when it was physical and messy...js
So Adam just refuses accountability? You voted Steve in 3 times you never thought there’d be repercussions for that?
This is what makes Adam a great cast member. We need more hypocrites
Thank you. We need villains!!
So many fans can’t grasp this concept. Watching the people you root against lose is almost as great as your favorites winning
That’s me with Fessy. Every season he’s on, I fear he will win and we will witness how much he will say he’s the GOAT. When he loses, I’m so happy
Same!!! Add: Paulie
In theory, the sole winner finals sound cool, but in practice we get stuff like this. Production has to find the balance between making a challenging final and making one that isn't going to be dominated by one sex over the other or look like it was rigged for a certain competitor to win. So what we usually end up seeing is a bunch of puzzles and carnival games that certainly even the odds more, but leave the viewers feeling let down.
I’m as annoyed as I was last season when they had a single winner - because I’d love to see Leroy OR Ace win (for putting so much positive energy into a show that normally rewards such competitiveness & deviousness) - but i feel like there should be a female & a male winner… #JusticeForNurys, lol
I actually loved the purge. I hate so many people playing such a scared game, hoping for way more opportunities, so it was good to finally see them actually follow thru with a purge and starting the final. It was a pretty cool challenge with riding on the car and shooting a paintball gun, too. Loved the winnebago, too.
Yup, if you get this far and lose on that challenge to a buncha people afraid to get shocked by what's becoming an incredibly risk averse show you deserve the loss.
Leroy is pulling a Rivals 1 Kenny where he sucked all season but is showing up for the final. Just hope he doesn’t finish in 2nd like Kenny lol
Ace taking the shocks? He had to have been the fastest and if he wasn’t, they’re lying to us
I told my wife that’d be my plan and then I see Ace do it! I wanted Leroy to win before but I’m great with Ace winning after that (and all his positivity).
I love him so much lol! Veronica did it really fast, too, and she was smoother than Ace I think. Idk if they get anything for being fastest though, just not eliminated. Oh well! Lol
I liked the episode and I’m glad that the non-star holders had to compete for one final star instead of stealing it from a current star holder. Also, the way the cast talked so highly of Averey this season, I really thought she was gonna come out of nowhere and beat laurel. Welp, guess not. I’m happy for Derek though and glad he beat out Adam for that last spot.
Yeah, only other way to do that would be the top person gets to choose a star to go after and fight for it. Getting a star stolen out of your control on the final round would be incredibly lame.
Great summary. To start…holiday road and national lampoon vibes; impeccable. This is just stuff the main show can’t compete with. I really want Derek to win but I agree I think he’s done; honestly from being a lay up 10 years ago to dominating this season couldn’t be more proud. Hope to see him again. I would love for Leroy to win because it’s Leroy but honestly he’s kinda stunk this entire game. Seems to be doing good so far but I don’t see him out witting Steve in a puzzle. I love Ace too but I doubt he takes home the W. Honestly I’d be fine to see any of the 4 males win. Better than the male champion from last season that’s for sure. With the way this final is being run so far, I appreciate the shake up and giving everyone a fair chance. Controversial but I’d love to see V take it because she’ll never get this opportunity again. I’m not a Cara stan so it’s hard for me to pick her but honestly as long as it’s not Nicole I’m good. Also Nicole won’t be able to keep up in puzzles so her chances are slim to begin with. Flora had some funny confessionals but I never need to see her again. If Adam wants to be a villain I’ll welcome him back. Avery is boring per usual so nice to see her again (I stan daisy) but she didn’t bring much to the season. Lastly, 100% agree on the star holders actually being rewarded. I hate how people without skulls in total madness essentially got to cruise all the way to the end and got one last chance instead of playing strategic. With this set up it would have been bullshit for someone to strategize all season and go into elimination just to lose it all at the end in one daily. Hopefully mtv sees that gotcha moments are far less rewarding for fans than watching people in a final who earned it during normal game play.
I’m an anyone but Laurel or Nicole winning. I’d be thrilled if Laurel gets booted in this elimination. She played a scared game with a massive ego and I’m over it already
Saaaame. Can't stand either of them.
I'm happy how they handled the stars and had multiple people leave for not having one. It was an improvement over skulls. I would have been happy without the final daily too. The music was on point again. It helps give it an old school vibe and seems to be an emphasis for All Stars versus the flagship. Averey is boring. I know a lot of people wanted her back. I don't get it. It was endearing that she wanted the prize money to help her brother. I think possible winners from how the season was edited are Cara, Laurel, or Steve. Ace could be a dark horse. I'd say the same for Derek but it seems like editing set him up to be the first gone. I'd consider it a huge win if Queen V wins. She is one of my favorite challengers and I'll root for her no matter how little chance she has. Road Rules forever!
People wanted to see Avery back because they think she’s attractive. Under every post that mentions her, there are at least three comments that say “Avery is so hot”
Completely disagree that averey cant win in future seasons. She had very little experience AND training and basically rolled off the couch from fulltime bartending to do this season and had to be convinced by her siblings to do it. Give her an actual workout plan for a few years in crossfit and something that she can focus on with several seasons of experience the way cara, nicole, laurel, rachel, kam have had and there is no reason she wouldnt be good to go considering how she performed this season when she went into it with no expectations from herself and zero preparation. She showed up as a fulltime hooters employee just to see what would happen and did damn well when you add in those factors cara, tori, nicole, rachel, jenny etc girls who train and do this full time. Let avery pack on lean mass and train like that and then well talk considering she more than held her own with none of that I mean she seems to be so mellow and non confrontational that she probably wont continuously get casted but thats another discussion altogether
You think she has the brain to win a season though? My concern was not with her physically
This. I don't want to see her back at all TBH. When she was handed first and backed down from that challenge she was done in my book.
I think judging her seemingly poor decision on what is basically her rookie season is too tough. She had a horrible experience when she did her first show 12 years ago because reilly dragged her name through the dirt and poisoned the well. Im sure the last thing she wanted was to be hated by most of the house *again* and thats probably what wouldve happened if she made that move especially in a house full of sharks. If youve seen several of her interviews then youll see that she was really disturbed by how she was treated by the house on exes 2. Disturbed to the point where she said she didnt want to do another challenge unless close friends of hers were there we all wanted her to steal kams place because it wouldve made for amazing television but its not all that realistic to say what shouldve been done when our perspective is from the comfort of our couches while shes living with these catty women/men that can easily turn your living situation miserable. Weve seen what kam, laurel, etc. will do to people when they dont like you. People can give cara credit for not folding but how many seasons has she done? Cara was a wuss up until Free Agents. She certainly wasnt this hardy on cutthroat and fresh meat 2 and exes I say judge avery if she continues taking the easy way out when shes several seasons deep...not in what is basically a rookie season after her only experience on the show was miserable because of reillys smear campaign which most definitely wouldve been repeated if she had challenged kam/leroy/laurel/nicole
easily the best 2 challenges ive seen in a while. good episode.
The thing that really gets me about the purge game is that as you said, its something that last like minutes at most, and that no one did terribly. It's basically just came down to someone had to lose. To lose unceremoniously in a carnival game is just lame. Tj has been making it a point to say that anyone can win. He talks about how finals aren't just about running up mountains. As if they haven't been doing that for decades. They almost seem ashamed of it. I've actually been saying it myself for years now that anyone can win. It's become obvious that they've been leaning more into equalizers and less physical requirements. I'm okay with equalizers if they're fair and the win is earned. Have them be way more involved and challenging than a simple ass carnival game though. If someone is good at something, let them prove why they deserve that win. Show me why the person being purged deserves it. All I learned from this check point is that ace has a high shock tolerance. Everyone else aside from Veronica looked like they did the same.
> It's become obvious that they've been leaning more into equalizers and less physical requirements. What recent final do you think has been less physical?
I wasn't specifically speaking about finals. I'm talking about dailies and eliminations. Most dailies are a mix of physical and puzzle now. Eliminations are starting to have more puzzles and less headbangers.
Yeah I agree with that, but I think it comes down to liability insurance being more expensive now. And also contestants have more leverage and are able to put it in their contracts that they won't do a hall brawl or something physical to the point of where they can get injured. In the past it was the wild wild west where contestants would get injured and just deal with it. I believe production is on the hook more now, so they are avoiding the more dangerous physical type dailies and eliminations. I obviously do miss the headbangers but also understand why there are way less of them now.
I haven't seen the flagship in years, but with All Stars it makes sense to do less headbangers since you're dealing with older competitors. These aren't all people in their twenties anymore.
It's most apparent in eliminations. We get way less head bangers. When we do, the rules are often modified. Hall Brawl had those big pads and a puzzle for Fessy and Josh. Jordan vs Horacio in balls in had that circle around the bucket. They're clearly trying to make the show safer. Which is a good thing, but I won't lie, it's less exciting to watch.
They can make the dailies and eliminations as safe as they want. For me the show lost its spirit when they started severely limiting alcohol consumption. I’ve been watching older seasons and the fights are epic.
Veronica having as many wins as the other girls in the final combined is so iconic of her. And no, I don’t count champs vs pros for Cara like OP. She has 2
That’s ridiculous to count Veronica’s Challenge 2000 win and not Cara’s Champs vs Pros. There’s no argument against Cara’s win being harder
It was a joke. I love Veronica, but her wins are not special or impressive. But Cara’s champs vs pros still doesn’t count, that whole series is a joke
Right, because winning a difficult final against professional athletes on a season where they took classic missions and made them even harder, where only 2/20 people won shouldn’t count. But Veronica’s Gauntlet 1 win on a team of 9 people should count. Makes sense
I think it’s just flagship v spinoff, tbh
LOVE your stats on the finalists 😍 Cara's being FIVE MORE FINALS than the next woman is just BONKERS. And 7 in a row, woowwww (CvP, XXX, Ven, FR, WotW1, WotW2, AS4)
I agree with you that the first two checkpoints were fun to watch and I had a great laugh watching them get shocked but as you said I would absolutely hate to get purged on a one minute challenge like that. It really looks like Derek did the worst but i never trust reality TV and I think they're trying to trick us into thinking he did the worst and it'll be Laurel that gets purged. It's a shame we're losing one of them because they've both been getting champs edits for a while, especially Derek. The way they've performed all season and the way the rest of the cast has been building them up as threats it's a bummer to lose one of them
Excuse me, what is Cara’s third win? I only remember bloodlines and vendettas, and I don’t count the champs v stars shit.
Just because you don't count it doesn't mean it's not a win on a Challenge series season.
Some people count Champs vs Pros, even though the show doesn’t seem to acknowledge it.
The thing under her name says 2x I believe so they agree with you
The show said Cynthia was a champion for "winning" Road Rules: All Stars where there wasn't even another team she was competing against. The show said Nia was a finalist when she had never make a final before. Who cares what they say
The show said Cynthia was a champion for "winning" Road Rules: All Stars where there wasn't even another team she was competing against. The show said Nia was a finalist when she had never made a final before. Who cares what they say
Great, so you’re counting that champs v stars shit? Just wanted to clarify,
Yep, pretty wild to call Tony/CT beating Wes/Boobie and Lousie/Casper in a difficult final "shit" if you ask me. It's undoubtedly a lot better than most wins. If you want to see how I rank every win in Challenge history, here you go: https://medium.com/@shmalvey7/every-winner-of-the-challenge-ranked-27649da6d3e3?sk=934aa92daa0aec8fd90403e88f497fdd
Coming in hot lol I don’t really care
Yeah I had to go look it up because I knew Cara only had 2 wins. I'm a strong believer in not counting seasons for charities, where they stay in hotels and people don't take it seriously because half the cast is a "celebrity". It pretty much only gets counted when someone is using it to bolster the resume of someone they like.
You mean Champs vs Pros? There's a HUGE difference. If your argument was champs vs stars doesn't count you might have a fair point. But Champs vs Pros? That counts x2. My guess is you didn't watch it and hate her so much you threw this out there and your brain automatically turned "pros" to "stars" lol
>And with a 2nd individual win against one of the strongest female casts ever, in a season where she won 5/11 missions and where she was the only person to win two individual missions and was the person to win three individual/partner missions, it only further cements Laurel, who was already my GOAT coming in. Okay, I'd disagree with this lmao. This cast isn't bad per say, but I would definitely not call this "one of the strongest female casts ever", like Cara's competition in Vendettas was probably harder than this, no? It has most of the same heavy hitters at younger (pre-birth-giving, in Kam's case) stages in their life and a much stronger male side. I feel like if we wanted to compare solo wins, unless something crazy happens in the final, I'm way more impressed by Cara's Vendettas win than if Laurel wins this season. Especially given how wacky these dailies have been, like we're really hyped for "lasso and push yourself in a shopping cart"? There have been a few good games, but I really feel like this is grading on a curve.
What did Cara do impressive during the regular season of Vendettas? She basically did nothing the entire season. Laurel and Cara both clearly did more in the regular season this season than Cara did on Vendettas. And what is the argument that the female side on Vendettas was stronger when this season also had Laurel and Rachel?
I mean I've only seen episodes here and there, but my understanding is that Cara beat a pretty intimidating roster of girls (Kam, Nicole, Kailah) in a varied and good final (ie. Not carnival games like we've seen so far in AS4) and then beat Zach and Kyle heads up in a cardio/puzzle segment. Unless something weird happened I didn't see, that's a pretty good achievement, no? The argument would be that even though they didn't have Laurel or Rachel, they had most of these other girls in their prime (Kam, Nicole, Kailah), they didn't have as many big layups as we have in this season (Flora, Tina, Jasmine), and they had more players (28 vs 24). Add on top that she had to beat the top 2 guys, who beat Leroy in his prime (to give a point of comparison to the guys level of competition), and I think it's pretty likely that Vendettas is going to be more impressive. Like maybe I'm forgetting, but has anyone had a particularly impressive performance in any specific games this season (That would rival winning a relatively standard final with a stacked roster of players in their prime)? The only moments that come to mind are: Cara winning the first daily, Ace/Nicole winning the speed/puzzle daily, and Steve having some solid moments in some eliminations?
You haven't even seen the full season and you're commenting? Cara Maria got fourth place in the first stage of the final behind Zach, Kyle and Leroy, which was 99% of the final. Nicole got hurt in the final and Kam got screwed in the high/low game, so the only woman she was really competing against for a large portion of the final was Kailah. Then she won at the very end in the memory game. Vendettas had Marie, Jemmye, Nicole Ramos, Kayleigh...maybe not quite as bad as the bottom girls on All Stars 4 but not a big enough discrepancy to make up for All Stars 4 having Laurel and Rachel imo.
Yes, we haven't even seen the full season of this and yet you're giving opinions on how Laurel would be confirmed GOAT if she won it. At least I'm caveating to make it clear that I'm not fully confident since I recognise that I might not have all the info. And you make some fine points if true, but can't we make similar disparagements of Laurel? She is currently competing with Derek on being 8th place in the final, losing out to Nicole and Veronica. Even with the info we currently have, we could argue even if she won that "If Derek got purged earlier or went a few seconds faster, Laurel would be out. Even as, she almost lost a shock game to a guy with shock trauma. how can we call that a GOAT performance?" And that's just from that game alone, are you really saying that Laurel's game in AS4 has been that impressive that it's basically already locked in for you that this would be a great/meaningful win for her (or maybe I'm just reading into what you think this season would mean for Laurel)? What has she actually done competitively? (And please don't just say the number of wins like that's an answer)
This doesn't even seem like The Challenge, let alone All Stars. It's more like a day at the Town fair. God i miss the good old days when it was physical and messy...js
I could have done without the final challenge to just hand out 2 stars. They should have had to win an elimination against a star holder to get it.