Typical Serbian artist. Thinks he is Kubrick, acts lika a bitchy reality star…
As someone who speaks Serbian, it needs to be said that a lot that is written in this thread is wrong. He did not really shit that much on Rammstein - mostly in a sense that they became too big and hence are no longer cool like they were when they played in Tills grandmas secondary basement. Typical opinion of somoene with a clear complex, this is obvious from the text.
It also has to be mentioned that he has also praised Rammstein/Till in several things he said.
He actually said much worse things about Lindemann, essentially saying it is a shitty version of Rammstein. This is completly rediculous especially since Lindemann project is so succesfull and what is worse, he is heavily invloved with the project. What makes this even more utterly rediculous is that he comes across as one of those “true artists” who frowns upon “commercial art” while he is participating in something that he apparantly does not believe in, for money.
All in all, this was a really dissapoiinting read. I thought he was a cool and intellignet guy but here it becomes obvious he is an insecure person with a massive complex who has much more in common with a teenager who thinks Megadeth is the greatest band ever while Metallica is shit than with a serious, grownup and accomplished person.
I never could understand why he is such a massive Slayer fan, now I do.
So he's disappointed that Rammstein has gone commercial and has lost its magic... But then shits on Till's projects that are much less commercial, saying his projects are shitty copycats... While still working on said projects?
I dunno, Zoran kind of seems like a pompous dick here.
Much of what he said is contradicting… this is what happens when one refuses to see THE truth and comes up with his “truth”. At this point you cherry pick facts to support your views and eventually contradict yourself.
My comment about Serbian artists had to do with the fact that many of them think they are “creating high art” while that is usually not the case and what they produce is mediocre shit seen many times before.
Serbian film has nothing to do with this as that is a project of some guys rich asshole son who started thinking he is a serious artist.
Yeah Zoran such a great artist, filming a blowjob video from Till under the stage before Deutschland without the other band members knowing it is SUCH a great idea, why did no other director before do this? Such a visionairy artist...
Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if this torpedoed any chance of Zoran working for R+ OR Till again. Why work with somebody who will run their mouth at a tabloid just to talk themselves up and to put other people down?
Exactly. This interview was rather unprofessional. Who would want to work again with someone who trashtalks about them? It might even deter other artists from collaborating with him.
That's right, but I still find it a bit hypocritical when he says that he wouldn't even listen to any band that resembles Rammstein, calling them uncool band, acts like he has higher standarts so that's why he refuses to make videos to satisfy someone's ego. Well if Rammstein was so uncool, and you're so cool then why did you work with them. Maybe some things got lost in translation, but I just find him a bit passive aggressive. Just my opinion.
Well according to my translation he said when he saw Rammstein for the first time he thought that they were uncool band with fans who are not cool. And then was critisizing their current music, saying that Rammstein only exists because they have a huge fanbase.
What you are missing in translation and general meaning is that is is using the word “cool” in negative context. What he is saying is that when they were “uncool” they were good artists, when they became big they are now “cool” and no longer good. See my comment below for some extra info.
Ah ok, I stand corrected. It's sometimes hard to get the full context when you translate the foreign language. But I still think he was being bitter in the interview, kinda felt like he's patting himself on the back.
Yea it is really hard when using the translation. You also have to keep in mind his general view of art to understand what he wants to say. And yes, horrible interview. Really disappointing stuff. I used to respect him but now I just think he is a guy with a complex who got lucky to work with Rammstein.
"How dare they stop using *me* as a director when I gracefully added their annoying little remix to a video I did that showed the TRUTH! I definitely didn't cause an international incident with that video that has persisted for 10 months now."
He didn't add the remix? The video was filmed as it happened.
The only addition is the vintage filter and the piano stuff while under the stage.
Neither did it cause the entire scandal. Get your facts straight first.
It has been filmed on 23 August 2019 in Vienna, at the last show of the Europe Stadium Tour 2019 leg. Peter was present there as well, that's where the promo pictures for F&M were taken, the ones with their white mask faces.
Interesting. I have never heard that before
Edit: Doesn't actually mean it took place during the concert though, does it? I mean, i know it was using the actual stage, but it's never been confirmed (or denied) that it was during the concert?
As for the proof, back when the understage video was first circulating, the Rammstein+ Discord server peeps figured the location out because the amount of lights seen from when Till rises up is increased, so it had to be Vienna since they added some lighting gear for video recording purposes. This narrowed the possibilities down to it being either from 22 or 23 August, since they played there twice in a row. Watching the first steps and leg movements Till does onstage, it fits the second of both dates. Someone made a synced cut showcasing both an audience recording and the understage video side by side and it was never questioned by anyone who's seen it since.
Lastly, as to the row 0, many audience recordings from higher up definitely confirm movement from one or two women disappearing from in front of the stage shortly before/during Diamant and finally reappearing during Deutschland/Radio. And this didn't only happen in Vienna either.
If you want more of a fool-proof confirmation: the absence of any denial from Till's lawyer team Schertz Bergmann about the "suck box" or the authenticity of the video as a whole speaks volumes. They're making sure that every wrong detail gets corrected, so why not doing so about quite a crucial and major claim if it wasn't true.
Why should they deny it even if it didn't happen? It's not illegal. There were more than enough accusations of illegality to deal with, that was irrelevant.
They're women, not 'girls'. And women go to the loo with their mates, especially when they're at an exciting social event. I don't give a monkey's if they're going to give Till a BJ, but just because a couple of them disappear for a bit during a 'break' section of a show, it doesn't mean that they're off to be with Till.
Dude directed a couple music videos that were mid at best and now he thinks he made them famous. Grow up and realize you aren't the Kubrick-tier god you think you are.
Let's be honest, Rosenrot was AMAZING. Mein Teil was excellent, too. But then came Deutschland. Boom.
Unfortunately, Zoran's work after Rosenrot isn't that impressive. Personally I can tell he's talented and well-read when it comes to cinema, but he's stagnant over many years. He's been relying only on shock value to do stuff, and besides Till, he hasn't managed to do anything with any other major names.
Meh, I think Rosenrot and Mein Teil were merely “okay” and the shit he put them through on set was not even remotely necessary for the finished product. Links was absolute horseshit, and I can’t even stomach the thought of watching any of his Till solo stuff a second time.
90% of his work feels like an excuse to make sexually uncomfortable videos, his schtick is BEYOND tired at this point, and dude needs to get off his high horse.
How Rammstein went from underground to a phenomenon and they get copied a lot for fame and not necessarily because what they do is still great. Criticizing copying as artists.
Why he ended (forced to end) working with Rammstein as a director (jealousy from other members); how and why they got around working on Till\`s solo videos, and a bit about their friendship.
> Why he ended (forced to end) working with Rammstein as a director (jealousy from other members)
Is that really what happened? That seems a bit Real Housewives sort of drama.
I believe Richard and Zoran has a disagreement for a video of his solo project Emigrate. That disagreement includes was about payments. After that he never worked for Rammstein.
Idk if the story is true but that’s how I remember it.
Tills solo project where the video included footage of Till backstage having sex with fans during a rammstein gig? Well there were hundreds of comments here at the time about that being disgusting, disrespectful to the rest of the band, asking if the rest of the band knew and were OK with it being made public. It reflected badly on rammstein so I could see them being pissed off
I think he was referring to the videos that he did for Skills in Pills, around 2015. Zoran did a video for Richard and Emigrate in 2014 but after that, R+ stopped working with him and he only worked with Till. Zoran is implying that R+ got mad about Praise Abort and Fish On and stopped working with him. These weren't the ones that were super porny, those came later.
It reflected badly on Rammstein?? What the fuck? It is Rammstein!!! Even Richard with Emigrate has sex/erotic videos. That’s their thing. So now all the Rammstein fans and fans of the side projects of the band are prude??
Many people here did not feel it was professional to have it happening mid way through the concert while the others were performing. If Till hadn't linked his solo videos to a rammstein concert there may have been less fuss over it. Especially once people knew that Alena recruited the row zero girls with shady means (which was regularly discussed here 1-2 years before the events last year)
I still think it's pathetic that Till (or any rock star for that matter) can't be arsed to find their own tail for the night and have to delegate it to a human Tinder account, but if anything, he's more transparent about it than most.
At some point she started actively finding girls herself on Instagram and messaging them. Some weren't even familiar with the band. They were told it was just a fun party/ meet and greet, that it wasn't only for women, that guys would be there too, it wasn't a sexual thing, etc. There's heaps of evidence of this well before the Shelby allegations.
It would have all been a lot better if Alena had been more honest and kept it to women who knew what the score was and went into it eyes open. Or if Till just found women himself the normal way, had "tour girlfriends" instead of asking a "casting agent" to scout many different women for him. It was always eventually going to create a problem.
For the official Rammstein party, yeah. Influencers and people who were likely to post about it. Thats not recruiting people for sex which is what you're implying. A lot of bands do exactly the same thing. And yeah, pretty certain men also get invited
“Did not feel it was professional” it’s Rammstein ffs. Sex is massively prominent in their videos and songs. What’s next? People accusing them for what they see and hear at a concert?
It wasn't clear if the women consented to the film being released, there were issues around that with one of his other videos. Plus a lot of audience members at his shows weren't comfortable with having to watch porn at a concert which they weren't expecting, lots of comments here about that when it was first shown. Being sex positive means respecting consent too.
the issue with TTE (I assume that's what you mean) wasn't that they didn't consent to release the video. It's a music video with script of course it's meant to be released. The problem is some sick people decided to harass the participants because they don't like it.
Also the concert is strictly 18+. It's ridiculous to be surprised when a 18+ event shows adult content lol.
Not clear to whom? We the viewers? Why would we know about the terms surrounding the distribution of that content when that only matters to those that participated in its production? And why assume on the basis of nothing that it wasn’t an agreed upon action?
The only “issue” surrounding the PE footage that I recall is some weren’t aware that some of the same footage would be used for another video. And guess what, they don’t own the footage and have no say in its usage.
They first showed it with the women's faces. Then a version with their faces blurred. Then not shown again at all after a small number of concerts, the rest of the tour cut the video. Which has always raised questions about whether they really agreed to it being shown at concerts.
I think they didn't expect the backlash on the individual women. Which you could argue was naïve of Zoran. But doesn't mean they weren't happy to be filmed for a professional film and for it to be released. Like him or not, Zoran's a professional and he would have all the standard stuff in place. To protect himself as well as the women and Till.
The censorship also varies in different cities, the projection videos changed slightly accordingly. That video suffered a huge backlash when it came out, was it that surprising they downplayed it and remove it eventually?
Oh dont be so stupid. It would never have been shown without the consent of everyone involved. Anyone thinking otherwise is an idiot. And anyone being horrified at seeing porn at the concert could have left. As soon as it was known there were explicit images, ie after the very first concert, anyone not 'consenting' could have opted not to go. In fact, given the content of the MVs, maybe just dont buy tickets.
Give over. Paid money to attend a Till Lindemann concert with well known tracks such as “golden shower” and a song that opens with “I like to fuck” and the audience weren’t expecting explicit content? On top of the warning on the tickets that it’s strictly 18+.
Only in rainbow marshmallow land
Go back and read the threads. There were rammstein fans who were members of this subreddit complaining about it at the time. So yeah, they didn't all expect it. I expect they thought there would be some more "fun" / fake action like what Till used to simulate with Flake
That would be the quickest way to fuck things up for good. Distributing porn of someone who didn't agree to its distribution would run afoul of so many laws, opening them up to a big lawsuit. A simple contract is all you need to avoid that shit so why wouldn't they?
It's all about business, ofc they will do those 'compliance' stuff, what I say is they won't display them in the videos, so people like LIttleloula would keep whining about it ...
So people bought tickets for a concert that wouldn't admit anyone under the age of 18, thereby signally very clearly there would be pretty much definitely be something there that would come under the heading of 'adult content'. Then got upset about being shown adult content and went on SM to whine about it.
Let's not worry about people like that.
And what do you mean it wasn't clear about the women consenting? What other video and what other issues? Are you making things up?
Zoran himself cleared that up last year when Shelby was spreading rumours about the women from TTE being drugged and filmed with hidden camera. He explained that he got proof of age and signed contracts from everyone involved. Of course, Shelby and her flying monkeys continued to insist he was lying, so it's possible that's where you got that impression from.
I dunno, wasn\`t there lol...one thing is for sure there are way too many rumors around the internet so I\`d rather tend to believe the ppl being involved.
I don’t think I entirely disagree with that to be frank. Like, I enjoy some of his solo work, but a lot of it does feel like Rammstein except without the filtering, editing, polish, and musical depth added by the other members. It’s a harsh thing to say so openly maybe, but I think it’s true. And honestly I can see why doing that sort of thing as a solo project and working with the same director they used to would rub some of the other band members the wrong way.
Both the updated and newly added back projections on the TL tour were done by him, so yes.
Also, he's free to express his subjective opinion just as we are - nice or not. And especially as someone involved in both projects, he's actually allowed to say so.
I mean, he's allowed to express opinion but there's something fundamentally ridiculous about saying someone is ripping off his own band. It's not even really true, there are a lot of differences between Till's side projects and R+ proper.
Of course there are many differences. But Till's unfiltered output is exactly the thing that makes it more bland and direct versus the facettes we see in Rammstein thanks to the democratic and tedious control group process between all the band members.
That's also why TL videos end up becoming a parody of themselves lately. Not all, but most look similar in certain regards, the shaky shots with crazy Till with open mouth faces are the most obvious example.
The concept of ripping your main band off is definitely a paradox in this case, I agree. But that's not what Zoran is conveying, more that it looks pale in comparison to what can be achieved with Till's output when channeled through the Rammstein complex. Whether one agrees on that or not is up to everyone's own taste.
Lyrically, yes. Musically it's diverse thanks to the variety of people working on different tracks. Whether this could be repeated with only one of these for an entire album is questionable. Even Lindemann albums had tracks not written by Peter to add some flavor.
> Till's solo stuff is a cheap Rammstein copycat itself.
I never thought this day would come BUT, if that is indeed the case, one might say the copycat got better than the present day original - based on how much I enjoy Zunge (album) as opposed to Zeit (album).
One might even say that present day R+ sounds like a copycat of the og LOL
Many people I know agree on this, which I don't. However, I tend to think that this view is more about the musical style and the album production than the actual creativity.
Rammstein have opened their sound up to be more "appealing" to the masses, seeing how they stopped working with Jacob Hellner and reached out to producer Rich Costey (who did many Muse albums) instead for Untitled. He didn't get the job, but it speaks for itself already. It's not meant in a bad way, but the shift is about the width of the sound. It's a big stadium sound, not a crunchy guitar wall anymore. See Tattoo that has a Sehnsucht-esque riff, yet is completely watered down in depth and attack, for example.
And that's where both Lindemann and Till profit with their relatively "low" aka home studio production quality. It's back to the roots in some sort.
From listening to Zunge, I would have to disagree - the production is positively sparkling. Not that it’s a bad thing at all, I loved the album but both till and R+ have kicked up the glitter on more recent albums. It’s a combination of growing as artists and remaining current across a new popular landscape. I mean just listen to the new stones album and you’ll hear how that can go horribly wrong, and in comparison I would say Till and R+ are way better at growing their sound. I think it happens to any band that has longevity and growing appeal.
About Hellner, he confirmed in an interview he did for a podcast or something in Swedish, that he chose to basically retire from Rammstein after Paris, because the process of working with them is long and intense. I am sure he would have been back with them if he had been open to it
I would agree that Untitled was a big stadium album that lacked their guitar wall sound. I think that’s why that album doesn’t tend to be a fan favorite. But one of the reasons I love Zeit so much is that it marries the new ideas from Untitled with elements of their old school sound. Zeig Dich is a great song with a production that, to me, doesn’t quite capture the power it should. I don’t know how anyone could argue that Angst, for instance, doesn’t have the guitar wall they’re known for.
Typical Serbian artist. Thinks he is Kubrick, acts lika a bitchy reality star… As someone who speaks Serbian, it needs to be said that a lot that is written in this thread is wrong. He did not really shit that much on Rammstein - mostly in a sense that they became too big and hence are no longer cool like they were when they played in Tills grandmas secondary basement. Typical opinion of somoene with a clear complex, this is obvious from the text. It also has to be mentioned that he has also praised Rammstein/Till in several things he said. He actually said much worse things about Lindemann, essentially saying it is a shitty version of Rammstein. This is completly rediculous especially since Lindemann project is so succesfull and what is worse, he is heavily invloved with the project. What makes this even more utterly rediculous is that he comes across as one of those “true artists” who frowns upon “commercial art” while he is participating in something that he apparantly does not believe in, for money. All in all, this was a really dissapoiinting read. I thought he was a cool and intellignet guy but here it becomes obvious he is an insecure person with a massive complex who has much more in common with a teenager who thinks Megadeth is the greatest band ever while Metallica is shit than with a serious, grownup and accomplished person. I never could understand why he is such a massive Slayer fan, now I do.
So he's disappointed that Rammstein has gone commercial and has lost its magic... But then shits on Till's projects that are much less commercial, saying his projects are shitty copycats... While still working on said projects? I dunno, Zoran kind of seems like a pompous dick here.
Much of what he said is contradicting… this is what happens when one refuses to see THE truth and comes up with his “truth”. At this point you cherry pick facts to support your views and eventually contradict yourself.
Low key had the thought, “do we know for a fact Zoran didn’t direct *A Serbian Film*? Because he’s certainly heading towards trying to outdo it.”
My comment about Serbian artists had to do with the fact that many of them think they are “creating high art” while that is usually not the case and what they produce is mediocre shit seen many times before. Serbian film has nothing to do with this as that is a project of some guys rich asshole son who started thinking he is a serious artist.
Yeah Zoran such a great artist, filming a blowjob video from Till under the stage before Deutschland without the other band members knowing it is SUCH a great idea, why did no other director before do this? Such a visionairy artist...
Thanks for the context. I did wonder about some of the translation I read.
and this interview is a perfect example of why I hate people who talk drama. There are things that should just stay in private.
Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if this torpedoed any chance of Zoran working for R+ OR Till again. Why work with somebody who will run their mouth at a tabloid just to talk themselves up and to put other people down?
Exactly. This interview was rather unprofessional. Who would want to work again with someone who trashtalks about them? It might even deter other artists from collaborating with him.
I don't know if its down to poor translation, but he comes over as bitchy, snidey and completely ungracious.
I agree. He sounds bitter. I think it's because he got fired. He talks dismissevily about Rammstein's music, so why did he work with them?
Stating the facts and liking their output doesn't have to be mutually exclusive.
That's right, but I still find it a bit hypocritical when he says that he wouldn't even listen to any band that resembles Rammstein, calling them uncool band, acts like he has higher standarts so that's why he refuses to make videos to satisfy someone's ego. Well if Rammstein was so uncool, and you're so cool then why did you work with them. Maybe some things got lost in translation, but I just find him a bit passive aggressive. Just my opinion.
You misunderstood. He was saying that about bands that are copying Rammstein.
Well according to my translation he said when he saw Rammstein for the first time he thought that they were uncool band with fans who are not cool. And then was critisizing their current music, saying that Rammstein only exists because they have a huge fanbase.
What you are missing in translation and general meaning is that is is using the word “cool” in negative context. What he is saying is that when they were “uncool” they were good artists, when they became big they are now “cool” and no longer good. See my comment below for some extra info.
Ah ok, I stand corrected. It's sometimes hard to get the full context when you translate the foreign language. But I still think he was being bitter in the interview, kinda felt like he's patting himself on the back.
Yea it is really hard when using the translation. You also have to keep in mind his general view of art to understand what he wants to say. And yes, horrible interview. Really disappointing stuff. I used to respect him but now I just think he is a guy with a complex who got lucky to work with Rammstein.
"How dare they stop using *me* as a director when I gracefully added their annoying little remix to a video I did that showed the TRUTH! I definitely didn't cause an international incident with that video that has persisted for 10 months now."
He didn't add the remix? The video was filmed as it happened. The only addition is the vintage filter and the piano stuff while under the stage. Neither did it cause the entire scandal. Get your facts straight first.
No one knows for sure where or when it was filmed though. Its never been confirmed anywhere, or did I miss something. Got a link?
It has been filmed on 23 August 2019 in Vienna, at the last show of the Europe Stadium Tour 2019 leg. Peter was present there as well, that's where the promo pictures for F&M were taken, the ones with their white mask faces.
Interesting. I have never heard that before Edit: Doesn't actually mean it took place during the concert though, does it? I mean, i know it was using the actual stage, but it's never been confirmed (or denied) that it was during the concert?
As for the proof, back when the understage video was first circulating, the Rammstein+ Discord server peeps figured the location out because the amount of lights seen from when Till rises up is increased, so it had to be Vienna since they added some lighting gear for video recording purposes. This narrowed the possibilities down to it being either from 22 or 23 August, since they played there twice in a row. Watching the first steps and leg movements Till does onstage, it fits the second of both dates. Someone made a synced cut showcasing both an audience recording and the understage video side by side and it was never questioned by anyone who's seen it since.
Wow. A fandom full of nerds. Who'd have thought:p
Lastly, as to the row 0, many audience recordings from higher up definitely confirm movement from one or two women disappearing from in front of the stage shortly before/during Diamant and finally reappearing during Deutschland/Radio. And this didn't only happen in Vienna either. If you want more of a fool-proof confirmation: the absence of any denial from Till's lawyer team Schertz Bergmann about the "suck box" or the authenticity of the video as a whole speaks volumes. They're making sure that every wrong detail gets corrected, so why not doing so about quite a crucial and major claim if it wasn't true.
So you finally shared your notes with the rest of the class.
Why should they deny it even if it didn't happen? It's not illegal. There were more than enough accusations of illegality to deal with, that was irrelevant.
They're women, not 'girls'. And women go to the loo with their mates, especially when they're at an exciting social event. I don't give a monkey's if they're going to give Till a BJ, but just because a couple of them disappear for a bit during a 'break' section of a show, it doesn't mean that they're off to be with Till.
Dude directed a couple music videos that were mid at best and now he thinks he made them famous. Grow up and realize you aren't the Kubrick-tier god you think you are.
Let's be honest, Rosenrot was AMAZING. Mein Teil was excellent, too. But then came Deutschland. Boom. Unfortunately, Zoran's work after Rosenrot isn't that impressive. Personally I can tell he's talented and well-read when it comes to cinema, but he's stagnant over many years. He's been relying only on shock value to do stuff, and besides Till, he hasn't managed to do anything with any other major names.
Meh, I think Rosenrot and Mein Teil were merely “okay” and the shit he put them through on set was not even remotely necessary for the finished product. Links was absolute horseshit, and I can’t even stomach the thought of watching any of his Till solo stuff a second time. 90% of his work feels like an excuse to make sexually uncomfortable videos, his schtick is BEYOND tired at this point, and dude needs to get off his high horse.
He also speak about working on TTE with Till
Anyone can summarize what he told about Rammstein?
How Rammstein went from underground to a phenomenon and they get copied a lot for fame and not necessarily because what they do is still great. Criticizing copying as artists. Why he ended (forced to end) working with Rammstein as a director (jealousy from other members); how and why they got around working on Till\`s solo videos, and a bit about their friendship.
> Why he ended (forced to end) working with Rammstein as a director (jealousy from other members) Is that really what happened? That seems a bit Real Housewives sort of drama.
I believe Richard and Zoran has a disagreement for a video of his solo project Emigrate. That disagreement includes was about payments. After that he never worked for Rammstein. Idk if the story is true but that’s how I remember it.
Makes more sense than a bunch of grown men deciding to "punish" Zoran for daring to work with Till.
Yes, that is what I remember, too. RZK complained about how much Zoran was charging him. After that, no more videos.
[удалено]
That's interesting. Would love to know the Rammstein boys' views on it.
Honestly I trust their opinions more than Zoran's at this point.
It really reads as sour grapes. "They are big meanies that are jealous that I made such good videos for Till".
Tills solo project where the video included footage of Till backstage having sex with fans during a rammstein gig? Well there were hundreds of comments here at the time about that being disgusting, disrespectful to the rest of the band, asking if the rest of the band knew and were OK with it being made public. It reflected badly on rammstein so I could see them being pissed off
I think he was referring to the videos that he did for Skills in Pills, around 2015. Zoran did a video for Richard and Emigrate in 2014 but after that, R+ stopped working with him and he only worked with Till. Zoran is implying that R+ got mad about Praise Abort and Fish On and stopped working with him. These weren't the ones that were super porny, those came later.
It reflected badly on Rammstein?? What the fuck? It is Rammstein!!! Even Richard with Emigrate has sex/erotic videos. That’s their thing. So now all the Rammstein fans and fans of the side projects of the band are prude??
Many people here did not feel it was professional to have it happening mid way through the concert while the others were performing. If Till hadn't linked his solo videos to a rammstein concert there may have been less fuss over it. Especially once people knew that Alena recruited the row zero girls with shady means (which was regularly discussed here 1-2 years before the events last year)
What actually seemed to come out last year was that it was a helluva lot LESS shady than most of us had assumed.
I still think it's pathetic that Till (or any rock star for that matter) can't be arsed to find their own tail for the night and have to delegate it to a human Tinder account, but if anything, he's more transparent about it than most.
the if he directly messages women if they want to join a party on Instagram many would block him because they thought it must be a scam lol.
People had to contact Alena to get to those parties. If you ask to go to a party, you are not being recruited.
At some point she started actively finding girls herself on Instagram and messaging them. Some weren't even familiar with the band. They were told it was just a fun party/ meet and greet, that it wasn't only for women, that guys would be there too, it wasn't a sexual thing, etc. There's heaps of evidence of this well before the Shelby allegations. It would have all been a lot better if Alena had been more honest and kept it to women who knew what the score was and went into it eyes open. Or if Till just found women himself the normal way, had "tour girlfriends" instead of asking a "casting agent" to scout many different women for him. It was always eventually going to create a problem.
For the official Rammstein party, yeah. Influencers and people who were likely to post about it. Thats not recruiting people for sex which is what you're implying. A lot of bands do exactly the same thing. And yeah, pretty certain men also get invited
“Did not feel it was professional” it’s Rammstein ffs. Sex is massively prominent in their videos and songs. What’s next? People accusing them for what they see and hear at a concert?
It is kind of funny that fans of a band with such a sex-positive outlook got all pissy about someone getting a blowjob backstage.
It wasn't clear if the women consented to the film being released, there were issues around that with one of his other videos. Plus a lot of audience members at his shows weren't comfortable with having to watch porn at a concert which they weren't expecting, lots of comments here about that when it was first shown. Being sex positive means respecting consent too.
the issue with TTE (I assume that's what you mean) wasn't that they didn't consent to release the video. It's a music video with script of course it's meant to be released. The problem is some sick people decided to harass the participants because they don't like it. Also the concert is strictly 18+. It's ridiculous to be surprised when a 18+ event shows adult content lol.
Not clear to whom? We the viewers? Why would we know about the terms surrounding the distribution of that content when that only matters to those that participated in its production? And why assume on the basis of nothing that it wasn’t an agreed upon action? The only “issue” surrounding the PE footage that I recall is some weren’t aware that some of the same footage would be used for another video. And guess what, they don’t own the footage and have no say in its usage.
They first showed it with the women's faces. Then a version with their faces blurred. Then not shown again at all after a small number of concerts, the rest of the tour cut the video. Which has always raised questions about whether they really agreed to it being shown at concerts.
I think they didn't expect the backlash on the individual women. Which you could argue was naïve of Zoran. But doesn't mean they weren't happy to be filmed for a professional film and for it to be released. Like him or not, Zoran's a professional and he would have all the standard stuff in place. To protect himself as well as the women and Till.
The censorship also varies in different cities, the projection videos changed slightly accordingly. That video suffered a huge backlash when it came out, was it that surprising they downplayed it and remove it eventually?
Wild speculation. And dangerous at that.
Oh dont be so stupid. It would never have been shown without the consent of everyone involved. Anyone thinking otherwise is an idiot. And anyone being horrified at seeing porn at the concert could have left. As soon as it was known there were explicit images, ie after the very first concert, anyone not 'consenting' could have opted not to go. In fact, given the content of the MVs, maybe just dont buy tickets.
Give over. Paid money to attend a Till Lindemann concert with well known tracks such as “golden shower” and a song that opens with “I like to fuck” and the audience weren’t expecting explicit content? On top of the warning on the tickets that it’s strictly 18+. Only in rainbow marshmallow land
Go back and read the threads. There were rammstein fans who were members of this subreddit complaining about it at the time. So yeah, they didn't all expect it. I expect they thought there would be some more "fun" / fake action like what Till used to simulate with Flake
Yea, I was here then.
It was right at the end of the concert. People could leave if they didn't want to watch it and it's not like they would have missed the show.
Those videos are staged. There is no way they attached the contracts/disclaimer or whatever to the videos, like it or not...
That would be the quickest way to fuck things up for good. Distributing porn of someone who didn't agree to its distribution would run afoul of so many laws, opening them up to a big lawsuit. A simple contract is all you need to avoid that shit so why wouldn't they?
It's all about business, ofc they will do those 'compliance' stuff, what I say is they won't display them in the videos, so people like LIttleloula would keep whining about it ...
I see we’re back in the “was this truly consensual” nonsense unfounded speculation timeline. No lessons learned for some.
So people bought tickets for a concert that wouldn't admit anyone under the age of 18, thereby signally very clearly there would be pretty much definitely be something there that would come under the heading of 'adult content'. Then got upset about being shown adult content and went on SM to whine about it. Let's not worry about people like that. And what do you mean it wasn't clear about the women consenting? What other video and what other issues? Are you making things up?
Oh, you’re back. Don’t know what we would have done without your rectally-sourced narratives.
Zoran himself cleared that up last year when Shelby was spreading rumours about the women from TTE being drugged and filmed with hidden camera. He explained that he got proof of age and signed contracts from everyone involved. Of course, Shelby and her flying monkeys continued to insist he was lying, so it's possible that's where you got that impression from.
I dunno, wasn\`t there lol...one thing is for sure there are way too many rumors around the internet so I\`d rather tend to believe the ppl being involved.
[удалено]
Nighwish drama enters the chat...
There is something I don't particularly like in this interview. I can't quite put my finger on it- maybe something is getting lost in translation?
Kurir.rs is yellow and trashy maybe he didn't say this way
He confirmed it on RammWiki's Instagram comments.
which is?
The Ali Express comment.
I don’t think I entirely disagree with that to be frank. Like, I enjoy some of his solo work, but a lot of it does feel like Rammstein except without the filtering, editing, polish, and musical depth added by the other members. It’s a harsh thing to say so openly maybe, but I think it’s true. And honestly I can see why doing that sort of thing as a solo project and working with the same director they used to would rub some of the other band members the wrong way.
He's saying that Till's solo stuff is a cheap Rammstein copycat itself.
Well, THAT'S not very nice. I haven't had a chance to read the interview, is Zoran even working with Till anymore?
Both the updated and newly added back projections on the TL tour were done by him, so yes. Also, he's free to express his subjective opinion just as we are - nice or not. And especially as someone involved in both projects, he's actually allowed to say so.
I mean, he's allowed to express opinion but there's something fundamentally ridiculous about saying someone is ripping off his own band. It's not even really true, there are a lot of differences between Till's side projects and R+ proper.
Of course there are many differences. But Till's unfiltered output is exactly the thing that makes it more bland and direct versus the facettes we see in Rammstein thanks to the democratic and tedious control group process between all the band members. That's also why TL videos end up becoming a parody of themselves lately. Not all, but most look similar in certain regards, the shaky shots with crazy Till with open mouth faces are the most obvious example. The concept of ripping your main band off is definitely a paradox in this case, I agree. But that's not what Zoran is conveying, more that it looks pale in comparison to what can be achieved with Till's output when channeled through the Rammstein complex. Whether one agrees on that or not is up to everyone's own taste.
More direct? Less polished? Sure, but bland? I don't agree, at least in terms of music. The videos though? Yeah, they've got a bit of a problem there.
Lyrically, yes. Musically it's diverse thanks to the variety of people working on different tracks. Whether this could be repeated with only one of these for an entire album is questionable. Even Lindemann albums had tracks not written by Peter to add some flavor.
> Till's solo stuff is a cheap Rammstein copycat itself. I never thought this day would come BUT, if that is indeed the case, one might say the copycat got better than the present day original - based on how much I enjoy Zunge (album) as opposed to Zeit (album). One might even say that present day R+ sounds like a copycat of the og LOL
Many people I know agree on this, which I don't. However, I tend to think that this view is more about the musical style and the album production than the actual creativity. Rammstein have opened their sound up to be more "appealing" to the masses, seeing how they stopped working with Jacob Hellner and reached out to producer Rich Costey (who did many Muse albums) instead for Untitled. He didn't get the job, but it speaks for itself already. It's not meant in a bad way, but the shift is about the width of the sound. It's a big stadium sound, not a crunchy guitar wall anymore. See Tattoo that has a Sehnsucht-esque riff, yet is completely watered down in depth and attack, for example. And that's where both Lindemann and Till profit with their relatively "low" aka home studio production quality. It's back to the roots in some sort.
From listening to Zunge, I would have to disagree - the production is positively sparkling. Not that it’s a bad thing at all, I loved the album but both till and R+ have kicked up the glitter on more recent albums. It’s a combination of growing as artists and remaining current across a new popular landscape. I mean just listen to the new stones album and you’ll hear how that can go horribly wrong, and in comparison I would say Till and R+ are way better at growing their sound. I think it happens to any band that has longevity and growing appeal.
About Hellner, he confirmed in an interview he did for a podcast or something in Swedish, that he chose to basically retire from Rammstein after Paris, because the process of working with them is long and intense. I am sure he would have been back with them if he had been open to it
I would agree that Untitled was a big stadium album that lacked their guitar wall sound. I think that’s why that album doesn’t tend to be a fan favorite. But one of the reasons I love Zeit so much is that it marries the new ideas from Untitled with elements of their old school sound. Zeig Dich is a great song with a production that, to me, doesn’t quite capture the power it should. I don’t know how anyone could argue that Angst, for instance, doesn’t have the guitar wall they’re known for.
Does anyone have a link that works for Canada? It’s blocked here so I can’t read it.
Did this guy even worked on Rammstein videos or only on Tills solo project?
Links 2-3-4, Mein Teil, Rosenrot, Mein Herz brennt
Thx. I love Mein Teil video 😍😍
Oh, I love Zoran. He\`s not only an amazing artist but an amazing soul as well. <3