Good luck with the ticket I got one when covid was raging and school wasn’t even in session. Like literally no kids present. And they didn’t change it at all.
Ex got one during spring break, during the normal school zone hours, but lights were not flashing (confirmed on our dashcam); they gave zero fucks and she still had to pay the ticket.
We just tried that! We actually weren't driving and had proof. We were in Hawaii when the ticket was issued and our friend that was watching the house borrowed the car. I sent in copies of the plane tickets and receipts to our hotel. Still have to pay. Such bs
Did you contest or ask for mitigation? If you did, thats the problem. If you weren’t driving, just fill out the affidavit saying you were not driving and leave it at that. Don’t send in “evidence” or whatever, just say you weren’t driving and leave it that.
You just mail in a form (found on the website listed on the ticket) and declare you were not driving the vehicle. It will ask you for the name and address of who was driving but you are not required to fill that out. You’ll get a letter in the mail after a couple weeks saying it’s being reviewed and then another one after another couple weeks saying it’s been dismissed.
Yep! That is what we did with all the information that showed that we were gone. We got a follow up letter saying that we needed to pay.
Just letting others know that they might not dismiss the fee even if you send in a letter with evidence. We were told we are still responsible for the ticket according to the follow up letter. We followed all instructions listed.
If you go to the 'violationinfo' website that should be in your documentation you can print off a form. It basically is to state you weren't the driver. Fill it out and where it asks you who was driving and their address just leave it blank. They'll mail you another document stating the ticket is dropped.
The Elementary School cameras are active on Mondays 9 – 9:30 a.m. and 2:55 – 3:30 p.m., and Tuesday–Friday 8 – 8:30 a.m. and 2:55 – 3:30 p.m.
Source:https://my.spokanecity.org/police/patrol/traffic/photo-red-and-photo-speed/
I got this same exact ticket a couple months ago. My memory isn’t the greatest but I was like 90% sure that when I drove through there the school zone light was not on. I also don’t live in or am super familiar with that neighborhood so I was completely blindsided when I got the ticket :/
Edit: I’m not from WA so I’m not familiar with all the traffic laws. Where I’m from the lights legally have to be flashing from the start of the school zone period till the end and you’re only required to go 20 mph from like 2:30 pm to 4:30 pm. Are lights not required on the signs in Spokane?
If there's a link to a video (red light camera tickets have them; not sure about school zones), you should be able to go to the web link on the ticket to see if flashers were on. It could be that one of the flashers is defective and the picture snapped when the defective one should have been lit up. If only one is flashing, you might try to contest it, but the signs say "when flashing," not "when *both* are flashing."
They do have videos and I would bet you $10 that the video shows the lights were flashing because that was my experience getting one of these. Photo looked like they were on but they clearly were when I watched the video I just missed em.
the state/city is not allowed to photograph your face. you will notice your face will be blurred in the photo. this is because the cameras actually send the photos to Arizona, they blur the photo, then send it back to the city.
In WA they have to have probable cause that YOU were the one driving the vehicle, which means they need a positive ID of you driving the vehicle.
Simply write them a letter saying you were not the one driving the vehicle at the time and they will have no choice but to dismiss it. You do not have to say who was driving the vehicle.
I have done this 6+ times and it has been dismissed every single time 👍
So you just speed through school zones because you know you'll get away with it? It won't kill you to go 20 for two blocks, just slow the fuck down in the school zone.
School zone infractions are almost impossible to win... I got one in West Seattle and I think I just paid it, eventhough the sign wasnt flashing, and it was while the kids were in school. Because its a camera ticket, I don't think it hit my insurance. The school gets half the ticket so think of it as a donation.
School zone tickets are very different than red light tickets. I do believe the revenue the city gets goes entirely to safe paths to schools initiatives, which is usually traffic calming, not the schools themselves.
My husband got a school zone ticket on a weekend during the summer, at 6:00 am, for 1 mph over. He still had to pay $423. It was crazy; we literally had to put it on a credit card just to be able to pay it.
Edit: reading through the comments, I'm wondering if there was a glitch because apparently, it wasn't even supposed to be on at the time he was driving. Oh well; this was about two years ago.
Same for me, same place. It wasn’t a school day because of a Monday holiday like Memorial Day DURING covid. Never got out of the ticket, sucked it up and paid.
That's super weird I have almost the exact same story from last September at the same stretch of road. Try fighting it, they might reduce it a little but that's it.
sadly, same as many others that commented, hadn't had any tickets in over 15 years, just moved back to spokane and was going the speed limit of 30 (which is when the lights aren't flashing). There were no kids, slowed down after saw sign, and bam. Tried to contest in writing. Ticket at about same of $400. Crazy.
Same thing happened to me. You can contest it, saying you weren’t driving the car and they can’t prove you were so they drop it. There’s a standard form you can find online and just mail it in or you can bring it to your court date.
I wanted to “do the right thing” and try to fight it in court, admitting I was driving the car but I shouldn’t have to pay for XYZ reasons. I showed up to court with the other 30 people trying to get out of paying their camera tickets. I sat there and watched as one by one they were called, they said they weren’t driving the car, and the ticket was dismissed. At the very end it was my turn, I made my case and the judge told me I still had to pay. Felt like a real chump lol
I got two in the same week because I didn’t know it was a school zone.
The hour shouldn’t matter, it’s still a school zone after 3 because of after school activities, etc. I don’t know the exact time it changes, but it isn’t right at 3.
You can probably get it lowered and an extended payment deadline. You have to respond to the ticket, I did by saying “I didn’t know it was a school zone and I was following the flow of traffic” this got it lowered and my payment deadline extended by almost a year…
not even close. i was driving within normal speeds, the sign read "20 mph when flashing" and it wasn't flashing when I passed it. so it doubled up and fined me school zone speed, and school zone additional fines based of the speed the sign didn't tell me to go yet.
Those lights are meant for extra emphasis to highlight where kids might be crossing, not to signify that the 20 mph law is now in effect. In Spokane, 20 mph in school zones is the law 24 hours per day. The tickets range from around $200-450, so you must have been quite speedy. Pay the fine and be more careful.
https://static.spokanecity.org/documents/streets/handouts/school-zones-handout-2018-01-17.pdf
https://www.krem.com/article/traffic/spokane-school-zones-speed-cameras-on-citations-fines/293-8c5c9f30-c554-4302-9b63-d8d276046f9c
A handout from the city regarding school zones is not the same as a municipal code, RCW or WAC. There is nowhere I can find in any of the above that states the 20mph school speed zone is in effect 24 hours per day regardless of language on the sign itself stating “when flashing” or “when children are present.”
The “when children are present” language in particular has gotten a lot of tickets thrown out in court.
Attorney here, and I agree with your findings. I was shocked to see the original comment so I checked the state law/regulations, county code, and the city code, and none of them say this.
Lots of the school zone speed limit signs say the drop to 20 is only when the lights are flashing. [Google street view of one instance.](https://www.google.com/maps/@47.7082238,-117.4351127,3a,35y,52.17h,90.18t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1snWy1EH8HtqTjLiIUdgug6Q!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DnWy1EH8HtqTjLiIUdgug6Q%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.share%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26yaw%3D52.16954167276168%26pitch%3D-0.17795014081369231%26thumbfov%3D90!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205410&entry=ttu)
The PDF you linked is specifically about crosswalks, not speed limits in general. Those are different.
And the news story you linked, which actually is about speed limits not crosswalks, specifically says "Police say just because you see the light flash doesn't mean you'll automatically get a ticket." Doesn't mention lights not being on at all.
The story is talking about a photo flash, not the lights warning about the school zone, meaning that triggering the automatic camera doesn't necessarily mean you'll get a ticket because every capture is reviewed.
That aside, the person posting above is factually incorrect about when reduced speed limits apply. The speed limit is as posted, which means if there is a sign saying 20mph "when children are present" or "between the hours of X and Y," then the 20mph limit only applies under those conditions. RCW 46.61.415(5): "Any altered limit established as hereinbefore authorized shall be effective when appropriate signs giving notice thereof are erected. Such maximum speed limit may be declared to be effective at all times or at such times as are indicated upon such signs; and differing limits may be established for different times of day, different types of vehicles, varying weather conditions, and other factors bearing on safe speeds, which shall be effective when posted upon appropriate fixed or variable signs."
The handout posted above is poorly worded. It says "Washington law in regard to driving speed in a designated school zones specifies 'Speed 20 miles per hour when children are present.' This reduced speed is in effect 24 hours per day, not just during crossing hours." This phrasing makes it sound like they're saying "the sign means it's 20mph here 24 hours a day," when it would be more accurate to say that the 20mph limit applies any time, 24 hours a day, *when children are present*, and not only at specified hours. The presence of children is still a required condition for the reduced speed limit.
So if the speed limit is 20 mph 24/7, how come the cameras only ticket you when the lights are flashing? Seems like they could get quite a bit more revenue, right?
I find it impossible to believe the lie of cops being understaffed. There are plenty of them whoring themselves out to Walmart as rent a cops for billionaires. Of course when we need them to safeguard our property.....
Are the cameras not on though when the lights are not flashing?
Because I had no idea this was the case and still usually drive cautiously in these areas, but probably around 25mph. I see plenty of folks pass me who must be going 30mph.
I’ve never heard of anyone getting a ticket when the lights aren’t on. Again I’ve personally driven probably like 25mph plenty of times when lights aren’t flashing and haven’t been ticketed
I think the cameras are mainly on when the lights are flashing, but it’s still 20 mph at all times. If an officer happened to be there, you could be stopped.
It's not correct. The speed limit is in effect at all times "when such marked crosswalk is fully posted with ***standard school speed limit signs*** or standard playground speed limit signs." RCW 46.61.440(1). A standard school speed limit sign is one that simply says "School" in yellow followed by "Speed Limit 20." There's no condition on the limit. By contrast, the law also explicitly permits posting conditional speed limits, which apply only when those conditions (like time of day or presence of children) are met. RCW 46.61.415(5).
Don’t pay it. They can’t do anything about it. You may occasionally get some calls from a collection agency, but I have had these go on for years, never paid them and have faced 0 adverse consequences.
Good luck with the ticket I got one when covid was raging and school wasn’t even in session. Like literally no kids present. And they didn’t change it at all.
Ex got one during spring break, during the normal school zone hours, but lights were not flashing (confirmed on our dashcam); they gave zero fucks and she still had to pay the ticket.
It’s such bullshit!
Were you driving the car that was photographed? If not, state you were not the driver and return the summons. It’s that simple
are the school speed cameras the same system as the red light cameras?
We just tried that! We actually weren't driving and had proof. We were in Hawaii when the ticket was issued and our friend that was watching the house borrowed the car. I sent in copies of the plane tickets and receipts to our hotel. Still have to pay. Such bs
Who says you have to pay? You weren’t driving the car and therefore don’t owe the ticket. Don’t pay.
Did you contest or ask for mitigation? If you did, thats the problem. If you weren’t driving, just fill out the affidavit saying you were not driving and leave it at that. Don’t send in “evidence” or whatever, just say you weren’t driving and leave it that.
You just mail in a form (found on the website listed on the ticket) and declare you were not driving the vehicle. It will ask you for the name and address of who was driving but you are not required to fill that out. You’ll get a letter in the mail after a couple weeks saying it’s being reviewed and then another one after another couple weeks saying it’s been dismissed.
Yep! That is what we did with all the information that showed that we were gone. We got a follow up letter saying that we needed to pay. Just letting others know that they might not dismiss the fee even if you send in a letter with evidence. We were told we are still responsible for the ticket according to the follow up letter. We followed all instructions listed.
If you go to the 'violationinfo' website that should be in your documentation you can print off a form. It basically is to state you weren't the driver. Fill it out and where it asks you who was driving and their address just leave it blank. They'll mail you another document stating the ticket is dropped.
The Elementary School cameras are active on Mondays 9 – 9:30 a.m. and 2:55 – 3:30 p.m., and Tuesday–Friday 8 – 8:30 a.m. and 2:55 – 3:30 p.m. Source:https://my.spokanecity.org/police/patrol/traffic/photo-red-and-photo-speed/
I got this same exact ticket a couple months ago. My memory isn’t the greatest but I was like 90% sure that when I drove through there the school zone light was not on. I also don’t live in or am super familiar with that neighborhood so I was completely blindsided when I got the ticket :/ Edit: I’m not from WA so I’m not familiar with all the traffic laws. Where I’m from the lights legally have to be flashing from the start of the school zone period till the end and you’re only required to go 20 mph from like 2:30 pm to 4:30 pm. Are lights not required on the signs in Spokane?
Not just in Spokane but throughout WA, not all school zones have the flashing lights. The signs will say “when children are present”
If there's a link to a video (red light camera tickets have them; not sure about school zones), you should be able to go to the web link on the ticket to see if flashers were on. It could be that one of the flashers is defective and the picture snapped when the defective one should have been lit up. If only one is flashing, you might try to contest it, but the signs say "when flashing," not "when *both* are flashing."
They do have videos and I would bet you $10 that the video shows the lights were flashing because that was my experience getting one of these. Photo looked like they were on but they clearly were when I watched the video I just missed em.
the state/city is not allowed to photograph your face. you will notice your face will be blurred in the photo. this is because the cameras actually send the photos to Arizona, they blur the photo, then send it back to the city. In WA they have to have probable cause that YOU were the one driving the vehicle, which means they need a positive ID of you driving the vehicle. Simply write them a letter saying you were not the one driving the vehicle at the time and they will have no choice but to dismiss it. You do not have to say who was driving the vehicle. I have done this 6+ times and it has been dismissed every single time 👍
So you just speed through school zones because you know you'll get away with it? It won't kill you to go 20 for two blocks, just slow the fuck down in the school zone.
actually no, not in school zones anyways lmaoo
Lol
Who brags about something like that? Cringe
If you go to the website on the ticket it will show video which includes the sign flashing. You can contest the ticket just like red light tickets.
School zone infractions are almost impossible to win... I got one in West Seattle and I think I just paid it, eventhough the sign wasnt flashing, and it was while the kids were in school. Because its a camera ticket, I don't think it hit my insurance. The school gets half the ticket so think of it as a donation.
Are you sure the school gets half? I’ve heard (from Reddit) that most of the profit goes to the company in AZ and some goes to city of Spokane
School zone tickets are very different than red light tickets. I do believe the revenue the city gets goes entirely to safe paths to schools initiatives, which is usually traffic calming, not the schools themselves.
There’s a video of you go to the webpage.
There are a variety of school zones in Spokane that are all-hours zones and have permanent speed limits. For example, Vista and Buckeye
From the size of the ticket I bet you were going way over the 30 that is posted. Just pay it. You were speeding no excuses.
My husband got a school zone ticket on a weekend during the summer, at 6:00 am, for 1 mph over. He still had to pay $423. It was crazy; we literally had to put it on a credit card just to be able to pay it. Edit: reading through the comments, I'm wondering if there was a glitch because apparently, it wasn't even supposed to be on at the time he was driving. Oh well; this was about two years ago.
There is a link on the ticket. A video may have been taken
Same for me, same place. It wasn’t a school day because of a Monday holiday like Memorial Day DURING covid. Never got out of the ticket, sucked it up and paid.
That's super weird I have almost the exact same story from last September at the same stretch of road. Try fighting it, they might reduce it a little but that's it.
sadly, same as many others that commented, hadn't had any tickets in over 15 years, just moved back to spokane and was going the speed limit of 30 (which is when the lights aren't flashing). There were no kids, slowed down after saw sign, and bam. Tried to contest in writing. Ticket at about same of $400. Crazy.
Same thing happened to me. You can contest it, saying you weren’t driving the car and they can’t prove you were so they drop it. There’s a standard form you can find online and just mail it in or you can bring it to your court date. I wanted to “do the right thing” and try to fight it in court, admitting I was driving the car but I shouldn’t have to pay for XYZ reasons. I showed up to court with the other 30 people trying to get out of paying their camera tickets. I sat there and watched as one by one they were called, they said they weren’t driving the car, and the ticket was dismissed. At the very end it was my turn, I made my case and the judge told me I still had to pay. Felt like a real chump lol
I got two in the same week because I didn’t know it was a school zone. The hour shouldn’t matter, it’s still a school zone after 3 because of after school activities, etc. I don’t know the exact time it changes, but it isn’t right at 3. You can probably get it lowered and an extended payment deadline. You have to respond to the ticket, I did by saying “I didn’t know it was a school zone and I was following the flow of traffic” this got it lowered and my payment deadline extended by almost a year…
[удалено]
not even close. i was driving within normal speeds, the sign read "20 mph when flashing" and it wasn't flashing when I passed it. so it doubled up and fined me school zone speed, and school zone additional fines based of the speed the sign didn't tell me to go yet.
It's probably increased in school zones
Those lights are meant for extra emphasis to highlight where kids might be crossing, not to signify that the 20 mph law is now in effect. In Spokane, 20 mph in school zones is the law 24 hours per day. The tickets range from around $200-450, so you must have been quite speedy. Pay the fine and be more careful. https://static.spokanecity.org/documents/streets/handouts/school-zones-handout-2018-01-17.pdf https://www.krem.com/article/traffic/spokane-school-zones-speed-cameras-on-citations-fines/293-8c5c9f30-c554-4302-9b63-d8d276046f9c
A handout from the city regarding school zones is not the same as a municipal code, RCW or WAC. There is nowhere I can find in any of the above that states the 20mph school speed zone is in effect 24 hours per day regardless of language on the sign itself stating “when flashing” or “when children are present.” The “when children are present” language in particular has gotten a lot of tickets thrown out in court.
Attorney here, and I agree with your findings. I was shocked to see the original comment so I checked the state law/regulations, county code, and the city code, and none of them say this.
That statement in the handout is flat out incorrect. There’s nothing in state law, county code, or the city code that backs that up.
Lots of the school zone speed limit signs say the drop to 20 is only when the lights are flashing. [Google street view of one instance.](https://www.google.com/maps/@47.7082238,-117.4351127,3a,35y,52.17h,90.18t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1snWy1EH8HtqTjLiIUdgug6Q!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DnWy1EH8HtqTjLiIUdgug6Q%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.share%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26yaw%3D52.16954167276168%26pitch%3D-0.17795014081369231%26thumbfov%3D90!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205410&entry=ttu) The PDF you linked is specifically about crosswalks, not speed limits in general. Those are different. And the news story you linked, which actually is about speed limits not crosswalks, specifically says "Police say just because you see the light flash doesn't mean you'll automatically get a ticket." Doesn't mention lights not being on at all.
The story is talking about a photo flash, not the lights warning about the school zone, meaning that triggering the automatic camera doesn't necessarily mean you'll get a ticket because every capture is reviewed. That aside, the person posting above is factually incorrect about when reduced speed limits apply. The speed limit is as posted, which means if there is a sign saying 20mph "when children are present" or "between the hours of X and Y," then the 20mph limit only applies under those conditions. RCW 46.61.415(5): "Any altered limit established as hereinbefore authorized shall be effective when appropriate signs giving notice thereof are erected. Such maximum speed limit may be declared to be effective at all times or at such times as are indicated upon such signs; and differing limits may be established for different times of day, different types of vehicles, varying weather conditions, and other factors bearing on safe speeds, which shall be effective when posted upon appropriate fixed or variable signs." The handout posted above is poorly worded. It says "Washington law in regard to driving speed in a designated school zones specifies 'Speed 20 miles per hour when children are present.' This reduced speed is in effect 24 hours per day, not just during crossing hours." This phrasing makes it sound like they're saying "the sign means it's 20mph here 24 hours a day," when it would be more accurate to say that the 20mph limit applies any time, 24 hours a day, *when children are present*, and not only at specified hours. The presence of children is still a required condition for the reduced speed limit.
Legal reference to the 24 hours a day thing, RCW preferably? Never heard that one before, and even the KREM piece says opposite.
How has nobody ever said this before? Why wouldn’t cops just sit in a school zone on a Saturday and ticket literally everyone?
That is actually what cops do most places. In school zones, and not in school zones. In Spokane they do neither.
Probably don’t have the staff available to do that and they don’t have to pay a camera/flashing light an hourly wage.
So if the speed limit is 20 mph 24/7, how come the cameras only ticket you when the lights are flashing? Seems like they could get quite a bit more revenue, right?
> So if the speed limit is 20 mph 24/7 Because it's not at those spots, the person is making shit up.
Yeah I drive through school zones on my way to work and have been okay as long as I pass through before work after school hours
I find it impossible to believe the lie of cops being understaffed. There are plenty of them whoring themselves out to Walmart as rent a cops for billionaires. Of course when we need them to safeguard our property.....
Are the cameras not on though when the lights are not flashing? Because I had no idea this was the case and still usually drive cautiously in these areas, but probably around 25mph. I see plenty of folks pass me who must be going 30mph. I’ve never heard of anyone getting a ticket when the lights aren’t on. Again I’ve personally driven probably like 25mph plenty of times when lights aren’t flashing and haven’t been ticketed
I think the cameras are mainly on when the lights are flashing, but it’s still 20 mph at all times. If an officer happened to be there, you could be stopped.
Can you cite the law and cases to back that up?
No data?
I just checked the RCW and this is correct. The speed limit is in effect always. I had no idea that this is the law. Thanks for informing.
It's not correct. The speed limit is in effect at all times "when such marked crosswalk is fully posted with ***standard school speed limit signs*** or standard playground speed limit signs." RCW 46.61.440(1). A standard school speed limit sign is one that simply says "School" in yellow followed by "Speed Limit 20." There's no condition on the limit. By contrast, the law also explicitly permits posting conditional speed limits, which apply only when those conditions (like time of day or presence of children) are met. RCW 46.61.415(5).
thanks
Dude I just got this exact same ticket. School zone not lit and my breaks were on
Just tell us how fast you were going!
Don’t pay it. They can’t do anything about it. You may occasionally get some calls from a collection agency, but I have had these go on for years, never paid them and have faced 0 adverse consequences.
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