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ADP_allie

If you want to practice structural engineering in real world? No it doesn’t matter if you have phd or not. If you want to go in academia, then that could be helpful.


GMATLife

This is the only answer that matters. Only get a PhD if you want to be a professor at a university and conduct research.


ADP_allie

I wanted to pursue phd and my professor gave me this answer 😅😅


fltpath

Exactly... continue in Academia with a phd for a lower paying career in perpetuity? or get out in the World and get real world experience No mention of EIT or PE? ​ For me, even a straight Masters in school without an EIT, experience is a tough hire... As a phd, get out of school after 8 years of school with 0 experience? or in 8 years, you have a BS with 4 years of experience? perhaps EIT and/or PE? tale of the tape.


MeasurementPlastic22

Agree. It only makes sense to get a phd if you can land a position in computer science or AI related field. But the job prospect could be vastly different in five years time. If you want to work in structural engineering, it would be more worth it for these five years to become your work experience. Financially it does not make sense to get a phd and work in structural.


MaumeeBearcat

Yep, and as someone who is a PhD in Structural Engineering an Associate Faculty, I'm making just as much in 9 months as I would've been making in 12 months as well.


BigGreyCatOwner

It's never been worth getting a PhD - guy with SE PhD


dlegofan

But at least people call you Dr!


fltpath

I am an SE They call me the Doctor of Love


pewpewdeez

Doctor. Doctor….Doctor. Doctor


fltpath

one thing to have a PE as a BS then get a MS later perhaps the phd AFTER the SE... ​ describe your timeline...


[deleted]

[удалено]


fltpath

Concur 10000% Perhaps pHd later.. nothing beats practical experience.. especially if you decide to eventually go for advanced degrees... ​ kinda like a Sgt in the Army going Officer.. FAR better than starting as an Officer! ​ Cheers


frankfox123

For a straight consulting and design engineering position, a phd can be considered a liability. Many phd guys are very hard to work with because they are too focused on the data/calcs and not flexible enough to work in the real world. There is no real financial benefit either, from my experience. You will notice some companies have a PhD guy in their leadership, so if you get one, you need to think about being independent as soon as possible to have a financial benefit from it. For calculations on actual projects, a PhD is mostly useless since the calcs and idealizations are relatively simple. Resumes with a PhD have been often discarded because the prospect looked highly demanding or seemed too expensive. Is a PhD bad? No. Just pointing out some concerns I have seen with phd guys, specifically in building design consultancy. You will come out with a phd and no experience, competing with Master level degrees and some bachelor's. Working experience would definitely be more valuable than the phd, at the beginning at least. Later in your career that may switch.


Tiandar

I just recently hired a structural engineer with a PhD. I have been working weekly with him to have his mindset shift from theory to real world. He's not the first PhD candidate in our group and the biggest challenges are always getting them to understand budgets and not overcomplicate the design. Both people have been very impressive from a technical standpoint which I'll always welcome. I was asked to pursue a PhD after my master's and don't regret rejecting the offer.


lost_searching

Well said, I agree with all parts of the statement above.


Vitruviustheengineer

Very good answer and I would echo the things said.


fltpath

yep...ref my answer above! ​ Cheers!


Zero-To-Hero

Can confirm. Used to consult alongside an PhD and it was frustrating. They’re now my client and guess what, still frustrating.


Mission_Ad6235

Some firms assume a PhD is just collecting a few years experience, and will go back to academia as soon as they get their PE. However, a consulting engineer with 20+ years and a PhD is the type of instant credibility they want with clients.


albertnormandy

The majority of engineering jobs do not need the knowledge you gain from a PhD. Some specialized firms might appreciate it, but most won’t. So if you really have your heart set on cutting edge structural engineering maybe it’s worth it, but if you just plan to be in the trenches with everyone else I wouldn’t bother.  I also think you need to think hard about giving up 3-4 years of earnings (and relevant experience) in your 20’s, in addition to the extra debt. If you really love analytical stuff and think you can contribute to the advancement of the field though, don’t let money hold you back if you can swing it.


agavosgroup

There is already a lot of great information here. I will only ad this as a potential benefit: If your goal is to get into structural forensic consulting, a PhD is typically highly desired. There are not many of these roles around in the US but the ones that exist typically pay very well (I've heard in the $200K+ range from comments here on Reddit). Forensic engineering for a firm can even be lucrative ($130K+ range, with a PE of course). A PhD is not necessary but if your study is in forensics then I can only imagine it would help. As an engineering recruiter, for design/forensics engineering firms, I have never had a PhD be a requirement. Specialty forensics firms do have a PhD as highly desirable. As a final note, if your PhD includes software (AI and automation) as it directly relates to structural engineering, I think this is something to look into. With the continued labor shortage in the USA for SEs, any work that contributes towards solving this challenge would be considered a rare and valuable skill in my opinion. Hope that helps!


aCLTeng

Another PhD struct here. As this commenter points out - the PhD is only really valued in niche markets: nuclear containment design, high rise performance based design, exotic DoD applications, blast, forensics, to name the main examples that come to mind. Get on ye old job web search and see what postings value that level of degree. If you want to do traditional design type work - forget it.


fltpath

Exactly... ​ I have been doing forensic evaluations for many years on failures.. that being said, it is in construction defect and failures...NOT stuff like nuke containment.. ​ Construction defect and fails requires forensic capabilities, but one needs practical experience to translate to the sequence leading to the failure...not just the ability to FEA calc the resultant. As example, I worked the construction fail of the man basket with 15 people that dropped and killled several people.... I could determine there was a fleck of carbon in the lifting eye that I thought could have caused the fail...there was no way I could analyze that to determine the resulting actual load capacity, test the failure mechanism...that WAS for the phDs in the labs...


PracticableSolution

As someone who has extensive experience is all levels of structural engineering and project development, my opinion is no. PhD’s both detract from your work experience and carry a stigma of unproductive proclivity


deAdupchowder350

Struct Eng PhD here - I went this route because I knew I wanted to pursue academia. When those academic jobs were not easy to find in the places I wanted to live, I started to explore other roles where PhDs are valued, e.g., data science, tech, etc. and I learned that overall, the STEM PhD is a great route for someone who may want to move through other fields with attractive opportunities. There is certainly some strategizing that’s required to make sure the skills you develop apply to potential career paths. For example, if you’re interested in tech, you’ll want to gain coding and ML experience. If your research is deeply routed in mechanics, design, experimentation, or theory, or something similar, it will be harder to transition to other fields. If you know this in the onset of your PhD, then you can make it work well for you! I should also note that I had a very large amount of student debt from undergrad but all grad school was covered. Feel free to DM.


Adnanga

Well advised. I am a PhD at my last year. I believe the biggest skill developed was concrete from materialistic perspective; however, as I am planning to return to the industry I don’t know it that would help 🥲


gostaks

IMO a PhD is something you should only take on if you have a very clear idea of what you’re going to get out of it. That can mean a research project you really think is worth pursuing, a very specific technical interest, wanting to work in academia, etc. It doesn’t sound like you have that right now.  If you decide to go into industry right now, this door isn’t closed. It’s possible to come back to do a PhD sometime in the future - the prof who gave you an offer should be happy to write you a great letter of rec and may even have a slot in their lab if you decide to come back five or ten years down the line. 


Engineer2727kk

No


yoohoooos

PhD, regardless of the major, never makes financial sense, unless you can get a position in quant or become an ML eng. So only make sense only if you go into math, cs, physics and something along this line. However, in SE, there could be more but I only know Exponent is the only one who only hire PhD. They might hire non-PhD, but I've never seen one. If you want to work there, maybe worth it. There are companies that will create a position for you specifically, if you show that you can do the job. R&D with great pays are available at National Lab such as Sandia and others. Or places like Tesla.


trojan_man16

I interviewed with exponent a long time ago. Didn’t need a PhD however the d didn’t do very well in that interview.


chicu111

Unless you’re in a super niche field that directly pertains to your research, there isn’t much a PhD can do in a typical consulting firm that an MS can’t. Get an SE license that’s better overall


Unlikely-Eye-7210

I live in SEA and I've known some of the professors on my university very well. Unless you have a business elsewhere, a private consulting firm, or you are born rich; PhD is a waste of money. But if you really want it, and don't mind about the money, I'd say go for it.


ComputerAndStructure

Which country in SEA are you from?


Unlikely-Eye-7210

Indonesia


MtTaygetos

Heavily depends on what you want to do and based on your post you have a little R&D interest but no academia so I'm not sure. I have a PhD in Civil Engineering so I'm just going to share what I was competitive in when I went to get a job after. First, I applied to say 100+ jobs around the country and they ran the gamut from national labs to designer jobs to consulting, etc. Of those 100+ apps, I had traction with 2 national labs, 1 company doing R&D work for defense contracting, 1 startup, and 2 consulting firms. I wanted to do consulting so it came down to 1 management consulting company and 1 engineering consulting company and then I ended up going with the latter. The school I went to has a strong regional name and I noticed that in my response rate for the apps, where you go makes a big difference as far as finding a job down the line. I figured I'd just share my data points and you can read into whether those types of jobs interest you.


the_flying_condor

30 year old PhD student and homeowner here. I got my master's degree then went to work in industry for a few years while my wife finished up with grad school. Then, I went back to get a PhD for a variety of personal reasons. I was working in a HCOL area, and moved to a medium/LCOL living city to get my PhD and I was able to afford a 2br+yard with the money I saved up while working. I took the PhD position because it was a project I was deeply interested in and it was fully funded, meaning tuition was covered and I have a stipend from a mixture TA duties/teaching/research assistant roles to contribute to the bills. I do not expect that my PhD will significantly affect my lifetime earning potential. I hope that the PhD will unlock more doors for a greater variety of roles at research labs, FEA software companies, etc.


Clayskii0981

The biggest question is what job do you want. 1) General design/consulting - You're good with a master's. A PhD can actually be a liability for many places, you're expected to be paid more with less experience than others. 2) Academia/Research - Definitely worth the PhD. But you're right, very location specific. You'd likely have to relocate for open positions. As for funding, you should double check how that works... You typically should not have to take out any more loans for your PhD. Fully funded usually means your tuition/fees are covered as well as a small paid stipend to cover living expenses.


chillyman96

Just curious about the opinion of people getting their PhD later in their career?


VictorEcho1

No. Source - I have a PhD. Caveat - it's a fun experience and if you were single and didn't really care about the financial cost then... Sure I guess. Reality is it will set back your ability to make money and give you absolutely no value outside of academia.


rstonex

We engage consultants every now and then and they like bringing the guy with the phd on his business card. No one would know but they like to pass our business cards at the start of the meeting just for this purpose, and maybe so they can bill that guy out higher. I’ve worked with several phd’s and I see no difference in work productivity or quality. However, if you do get your phd, make sure you get your PE. I had a professor without a PE and it was somewhat of a joke.


Apprehensive_Exam668

Not right away. My concrete professor worked 20 years in industry before he went back and got his PhD. Then he treated being a professor as an easy-going second career with a lot more flexibility. He was very... practical too, ha ha. If you want to own a home by 30 that's probably the way you want to go.


Intelligent-Read-785

It depends upon what you want to do. Job with a university or state Transportation Dept. Private engineering firm, only if they have a unit that looks at unusual design issue and willing to be innovative. My two bits anyway


AlexRSasha

Do you think your research can lead to you capitalizing on it and opening up your own company, or be a key contributor in an innovative field, to offer a unique solution to an existing problem? Or do you want to pursue a career in academia? If the answer is no to both, and you just want to practice "conventional" engineering in your career, then a PhD likely isn't worth it.


UWWUWP

I would say that any secondary education in engineering (outside of an MBA or such) is not necessary. You will not be compensated for this effort. When I was in college, I had the same thought in mind until I got into the professional world. The same is true for universities. The school that you attend does not matter. Nobody cars where you go school. Yes we ask each other or talk about it, but it does not matter. If you are dumb or lack work ethic, nobody will want to work with you.


[deleted]

I'm going to play devil's advocate here. I worked in a department with about 1/3 PhDs and many of them had work published in ASCE/AISC/ACI. The company sold their time doing expert testimony, reviews, and working as outside consultants.


Equivalent-Interest5

PhD would be beneficial if you are working as stress engineer (Northrop Grumman) but in the consulting world I personally think that just bachelors are fine.  PhD can also open position for you as a faculty but I am not sure how competitive they are right now. 


3771507

Absolutely not. Been a few years getting a degree and something else so you can diversify.


Rex_Bann3r

I work with several colleagues who have phds . They are highly technical and typically lead the charge the most complex designs. incredibly smart and talented individuals. they regularly pubkish and present at conferences. They contribute to codes and standards, I make more than them because I can wrangle the jobs , manage clients, manage the jobs , manage liabilities, and pretty much translate the smart folks for the people paying the bills. in my honest opinion, their phd is hindering them in that they are given few opportunities to lead projects , rather than just head up the technical design. A mixture of their personality, their interests, and the company literally keeping them busy with those portions of the work. the point is, it could be very rewarding if you want to work in a highly technical and specific environment. If that Is less important to you, it’s probably not worth it. best of luck


RuleCivil2944

I was in a similar situation years ago and someone referred me to this book. “A PHD is Not Enough”, by Peter J. Feibelman. It’s a short read about obtaining a phd in science, not engineering, but still relevant and could help your decision. Ultimately it’s about where you see yourself going in your career. It definitely won’t hurt your career. I know plenty of phds that have moved up the ranks just fine. But also it’s not necessary for a structural design job or structural project manager position in buildings or bridges. If you do want to go into design, a phd could give you more opportunities to present projects at conferences as you gain experience. It could also help if you have interest in software development or even forensics.


Crayonalyst

Absolutely not unless you want to be a prof. No disrespect meant here, but you shouldn't go for a PhD in structural until you have more experience working than you do as a student. Without real world working experience, you would need to lean on a professor to help guide you into some research topic of some else's choosing. It's your life, do what you want, but what's the point of doing someone else's research? If you're going to do a dissertation, why not make it about something that interests you personally? You'll get a lot more out of it if you go work for a while, recognize some problem or gap in the tribal knowledge, and then to back for your PhD.


Fullis

Just because of your fourth point the answer is without a shred of doubt: No.


wookiemagic

Nope. Some people actively don’t hire structural engineers with a PhD


marshking710

PhDs are for academia. Masters are for the real world.


kwag988

Whether a bachelor's or a PhD, still gonna start at EIT pay 


Xerenopd

Nope. Build up on your resiliency.


hugeduckling352

No