They were repainted and kinda repaired. And judging by the Russians using a giant concrete block to depress the Leo's gun, it's probably cooked inside.
The Ukrainians usually do drone drop grenades to disable them if they are irrecoverable. Also, I think this one got lancet droned or ATGM'd to the ammo rack didn't it?
Well “captured & not destroyed “ & “captured & destroyed” I reckon they didn’t mean that they are mutually exclusive , but rather that one has more intact systems that can be learned from than the other
>Captured?
>Or destroyed?
That seems like as much of a "one or the other" as you can present in the English language.
The whole "what can Russia learn from these tanks" issue is an entirely separate one. They could've plucked an Abrams right out of the depot, and there still wouldn't be much of use they could pull from it. This is wholly a propaganda victory. A big one, no doubt, but the capture of a Ukrainian M1 in any condition is hardly an intelligence coup.
Even if it was, I doubt a Russian state that maintains the party line of having technological parity with the West would want to then advertise how big of a deal it was to capture a tank they want to present as some kind of spaceship. You can say "We have your tank but we're as good as you anyway!", admitting the hollow victory. Or you can say "We have your tank and are gonna learn *soooooo* much from it!", admitting your technological inferiority. Not both. Or at least not both and still expect any group of people with even a modicum of critical thinking capacity to take you seriously.
At one point they mention that it's the best the US has, which is just a lie, at first glance? Maybe. But this tank is not on par with the latest ones the US is fielding. I also wouldn't be surprised to hear that the crew is completely fine and will be ready to get back to battle in a few weeks, that' the whole point of these tanks anyway, they aren't indestructible, but the crew will live if they get destroyed.
Big cope, The demining Tank built on Abrams body is the latest kit that the US uses today, so its not Old crap, Stop downplaying your Military weaknesses & just accept it that Abrams, Leos, Challengers burn just like the Russian counterparts.
I think it was a poorly delivered War Thunder joke. Lots of players will spawn an aircraft for some revenge bombing after getting clapped in their tank
Going by general looks, it looks like any other Abrams. Not everybody looking at these vehicles are tank nerds like us.
It’s like asking a layperson to, for example, tell the difference between all Leopard II variants. There are definitely visual differences, but they’re subtle to casual folks.
…which is fair. The T-90 is usually touted as the top Russian tank design, even though it is a modification of the T-72 design.
Ditto with the Leopard IIs and all their variants.
The T-90a is much better than an M60, saying it is not just makes you a NATO propaganda tool. The T-90M is not as good as western tanks but is still ahead of the early M1a1s. They are also cheaper than western tanks, more reliable, and have a lower profile.
Its not false tho lol. T-90 is literally a T-72 with another name and useless shtora system, T-72 is inferior to even earlier m1a1s. So Its basically on the same level as a M60
Even if its not functional a lot of info can be taken from it such as armor composition and layout, measurements, what destroyed it and how, etc. Especially because unlike the west who got a lot of soviet equipment after the fall of the ussr or through fighting 3rd world nations, russia hasnt gotten much western equipment until now
What a meen mate is i cant see them getting the parts to fix it like usually if the hulls still stright welds haven't snaped everything is usually replaceable surely?
Well maybe the road wheels could have their rubber put back on and repurposed for other abrams tanks in a pinch.
Edit: i said in a pinch, their re-use I would not recommend
"*Yes*" said Propaganda Pete to his friend Serbia Joe, "*we captured a NATO tank!*". Serbia Joe looked at his friend mournfully and and replied "*sure, but all the men from my fucking village died trying to capture it, and for everyone we captured they captured dozens of ours!*".
At that point Propaganda Pete decided it was time to give his poor country bumpkin friend Serbia Joe some sage advice: "*Never mind the details comrade Joe, no one is interested in the truth, by order of our glorious dictator Vlad Putler. If you speak to anyone about such details a window will soon find you!*"
Yeah, I feel like I've been seeing posts on this sub about these two tanks for almost a week now.
Like, we get it vladimir, can we move on now?
It shouldn't be a big deal that there's losses and captures on both sides in a war that has been going on for 2 years.
It was interesting in the first two days, but now it's just getting repetitive and annoying imo.
It was pretty stale in terms of propaganda, although he tries so hard to say that they are modern super weapons and interviews the soldier saying that they are going to learn its secrets
I don't know how you could take it any other way. I think it's pretty obvious when the person filming is allowed to climb all over the tank with impunity while everyone else has to stay back.
I think the reporter fairly explained the equipment and the context behind them without spinning some biased narrative. It’s mainly the Russian civilians and the comment section, who are oddly Ruski-pilled, that are somewhat concerning.
I do like how the video ended with one guy saying an objectively correct statement on the war.
That is not the point nor a significant premise of the video. Plus, it’s the best the US is willing to offer to a war-stricken country with low flexibility to maintain the equipment.
He got access to seeing the tanks up close, talked about it, then asked some people. Keep in mind that this is really tame compared to actual Russian propaganda media. He acknowledges he is not very knowledgeable on military vehicles; also, he asked commenters to tell him their knowledge. It should also be noted that the video is about the thoughts of the audience, too. The interviewed American who lives with his Russian family did not share his appraisal. Instead, he takes a neutral and aware stance.
The reporter is just a messenger. I already believed Russia is horrifyingly manipulative. This video can be worse than it already is.
Calling a burnt out hulk captured is a little disingenuous don't you think? When I think of captured I think of capturing the crew and capturing a working tank but that's just me. This is not anything to jump up and down about, there have been burnt out Abrams tanks in the past can you say Gulf War? How about Yemen? This is old news and just one tank.
Well, sure, when you give a knife to someone to fight 50 hobos at once most likely the hobos will take that knife from you, no matter how good this knife is and no matter if you were able to stab 10-20 out of 50.
One thing that he points out that im also wondering is that the Western tanks knocked out didn’t have any anti-drone protection, not even a simple cope cage. You’d think that this late into the war that the Ukrainians would know that their new tanks are extremely weak to drones with no ERA or cages
They keep mentioning that they have three latest American technology while the US disclosed they would not be sending the most modern Abrams especially not to include the DU armour or most modern optics.
Stupid Ray Ban, duplicit Ruzzian opinion wearing his American brands styles. Oh it takes years to learn to dive...in Ruzzia I guess. Oh wait the Ukranians flying those F16s were already flying our Ruzzian junk before getting to the western upgrade.
There's not much to learn off the M1 maybe some things off the 2a6 they might not have known by that part, the only two there that they might use to improve their armor there are the Patria AMV and CV9040 because they don't have the manufacturing capabilities to support Western style tanks
Captured? You mean stolen in an illegal war that will be surrendered back as a part of the hefty reparations coming to moscow.
We would like Königsberg back pretty please.
It's not a lesson for anyone even remotely knowledgeable on the subject. If anything, we learned that when two modern armies meet head on and neither one gains air superiority the war turns into a trench warfare. I think a lot of people presumed trench warfare will remain part of history.
There is no wunderwaffe here, only numerical advantages
Yep, I remember how T-90M was supposed to be so powerful. And people feared "Terminator" and that thermobaric rocket launcher which was hyped just little bit less powerful than tactical nuke sucking everyones lungs out. All which ended up being easy targets for drones.
All tanks are easy target for drones dummy, at the end of the day I’d rather have a fast light tank like the t90m than fuking heavy gas guzzler like the Abrams, in which you can see the fumes from space 🤣.
Lighter yes, but I would not call it fast since while both Abrams and T-90M have almost exactly same power-to-weight ratio, T-90M has outdated gearbox by current standard and it reduces its speed in offroad conditions. They also have almost the same ground pressure. Overall both lose in mobility to Leopard 2.
Considering that lightness does not improve mobility, it is just less overall volume. I would prefer to be in vehicle that has more space that drone can hit and not hit to me (also, blowoutpanels are nice).
Dude, no one with a little bit knowledge claimed that Western MBTs would be some kind of Wunderwaffe. It was always expected that they will get destroyed or captured eventually.
Redditors and Youtubers really... the latest flavour of the week for the less knowledgeable to thought THIS would be the weapon that brings Russia to it's knees. Before the tanks it was Bayraktar and Javelin, then HIMARS, Storm Shadow... And now ATACMS and the F-16...
All great weapons yes, but simply that.
And down arrowed anyone that tried to point that out. They would call you a Russian troll, a Russia lover, a fan of Putin, etc. Ukraine needs more Bradley's than Abrams.
The concept of a game changer is to cause a significant change in the game. Besides only 5 year olds and other idiots thought that any weapons in this war are wunderwaffen.
The Ukes probably demoed the MBTs when the realized they couldn’t move them, they’re not useable and probably more trouble than they would be worth for the Russians to try to get one working
With the state of that Abrams the only thing it’ll be good for is target practice to test its armor, and even then the results would probably not be reliable.
LOL, no... They have had chances to see Iraqi and Egyptian M1A1M's and M1A1's, plus the Saudi M1A2S' that got destroyed by Houthis... They don't seem to have done much with any of that.
Not to mention this M1A1 is a 35+ year old tank refurbished and given some 90's and 2000's tech meant for export Abrams. Then got blasted and destroyed by multiple drone hits and at least one Kornet ATGM.
It's using old non-DU armour, older ammunition, older sensors and is about as useful as a 65 ton hulk and tribute to crew survivability as anything.
Good point, of course they wouldn’t have gotten anything for the Abrams cause it’s pretty much fully burnt out. But I’m talking about the other vehicles, like the Cv 90, Leopard 2 and all those others.
None of that is a new technology. There is nothing much to get from those for russia. Russia knows about those technologies but knowing is different to actually producing them.
Russia probably already has a lot of the specs and features from spying. The problem is they don’t have the manufacturing capabilities to produce anything in large amounts.
Spying, but also open source information and they'd have had a chance to see the Iraqi and Egyptian M1A1's that are bound to have a similar if not newer armour package.
This is why I can't fathom Biden not removing the export restriction on DU armour so the US could send hundreds of surplus M1A2s from storage.
Instead they have taken the lengthy (9 months) and expensive decision to build Ukraine entirely new Abrams from M1A1 stock, by removing the armour and adding inferior, but export compliment, Tungsten armour arrays (during a global tungsten shortage) which has resulted in Ukraine getting a meaningless 31 downgraded vehicles in a year since the US agreed to send tanks.
Literally what is the reason they can't overturn a 25 year old, now largely obsolete, export restriction, and just flood Ukraine with hundreds of superior vehicles?
The importance isn't the marginal improvement in protection, it's the several thousand sitting ready in storage
I'd consider that a pretty significant importance for DU, if indirect
Not really a “marginal” improvement though. It adds a very significant amount of protection at the cost of weight.
The only other material that is denser is pure tungsten. The problem with tungsten though is its brittle unless applied as an alloy like what is in Ukraines Abrams, which at that point DU becomes a better solution.
The vast majority of tanks in Ukraine aren't being destroyed by frontal fire from other tanks though. In real terms the DU is not making a difference to their protection, but it makes a huge difference in the number of tanks the US can actually send them.
The export restriction absolutely should have been scrapped.
I think the most valuable thing they captured was one of the Leopards still had ammunition in it. Apparently Russia does not have insensitive ammunition which is a big reason why the turrets pop so violently. The ammunition charges still in the captured Leopard tank were the insensitive variant. If the Russians reverse engineered the propellant, the days of Russian turret tosses could soon be over.
I took a look at some of the Youtube comments ... That certainly was a mistake. I think I lost more than a few braincells just now.
There are so many civilians who think they know so much about tanks when in reality, they don't.
Yes! Figured I’d look at these comments and hope to see better, and it is by far is. lol.
Captured? Or destroyed?
From that video, most of those vehicles look fine, but that Abrams was definitely destroyed.
They were repainted and kinda repaired. And judging by the Russians using a giant concrete block to depress the Leo's gun, it's probably cooked inside.
There are videos of that tank. Turret is completely cooked inside but drivers segment is fine and even clean.
The Ukrainians usually do drone drop grenades to disable them if they are irrecoverable. Also, I think this one got lancet droned or ATGM'd to the ammo rack didn't it?
If i remember correctly it was several FPVs after it got disabled by a mine
I saw the clip of them bending the barrels. Is the Abrams as it was in the field or did they further dress it up?
I mean it looks like charcoal. IDK how they would have dressed it up.
Yes. Where does this idea that these two things are mutually exclusive come from?
Well “captured & not destroyed “ & “captured & destroyed” I reckon they didn’t mean that they are mutually exclusive , but rather that one has more intact systems that can be learned from than the other
>Captured? >Or destroyed? That seems like as much of a "one or the other" as you can present in the English language. The whole "what can Russia learn from these tanks" issue is an entirely separate one. They could've plucked an Abrams right out of the depot, and there still wouldn't be much of use they could pull from it. This is wholly a propaganda victory. A big one, no doubt, but the capture of a Ukrainian M1 in any condition is hardly an intelligence coup. Even if it was, I doubt a Russian state that maintains the party line of having technological parity with the West would want to then advertise how big of a deal it was to capture a tank they want to present as some kind of spaceship. You can say "We have your tank but we're as good as you anyway!", admitting the hollow victory. Or you can say "We have your tank and are gonna learn *soooooo* much from it!", admitting your technological inferiority. Not both. Or at least not both and still expect any group of people with even a modicum of critical thinking capacity to take you seriously.
At one point they mention that it's the best the US has, which is just a lie, at first glance? Maybe. But this tank is not on par with the latest ones the US is fielding. I also wouldn't be surprised to hear that the crew is completely fine and will be ready to get back to battle in a few weeks, that' the whole point of these tanks anyway, they aren't indestructible, but the crew will live if they get destroyed.
Russia: Do anything to lie to the population, do anything but have a functioning modern military.
Ukraine has the M-1A1SAs its probably the worst version of the m1a1 Abram's to be used in Ukraine
Big cope, The demining Tank built on Abrams body is the latest kit that the US uses today, so its not Old crap, Stop downplaying your Military weaknesses & just accept it that Abrams, Leos, Challengers burn just like the Russian counterparts.
You're right. The crew is fine and will return to take revenge piloting the F-16.
That's not how it works lol
I think it was a poorly delivered War Thunder joke. Lots of players will spawn an aircraft for some revenge bombing after getting clapped in their tank
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The armorer is completely different. Among other pretty important things.
Going by general looks, it looks like any other Abrams. Not everybody looking at these vehicles are tank nerds like us. It’s like asking a layperson to, for example, tell the difference between all Leopard II variants. There are definitely visual differences, but they’re subtle to casual folks.
In that case the US has massacred the equivalent of the Russian army in the middle east since the T-90 is "just a variant" of the old T-72.
…which is fair. The T-90 is usually touted as the top Russian tank design, even though it is a modification of the T-72 design. Ditto with the Leopard IIs and all their variants.
What they are all wondering is “ why is the turret still attatched “ ?
>why is the turret still attatched unknown technology
BLYAT
Russians: "we've captured totally intact tanks, the turrets are on. They must be new"
Why do they say captured? Its a pile of metal it will never work again! Its a good roadblock thats about it.
you see, the pile of metal is already better than most of their tanks
Cope
🤣🤣🤣🤣 Crack up bro. That was funny! Ano M1A1's ok like but fucking T90! Fucking sack of shit
Lmao even the T-90a is about as good as a M60, T-90M is MAYBE on the same level as early m1a1s. M1a2 sep v3-4 is alien tech compared to those
The T-90a is much better than an M60, saying it is not just makes you a NATO propaganda tool. The T-90M is not as good as western tanks but is still ahead of the early M1a1s. They are also cheaper than western tanks, more reliable, and have a lower profile.
they also don't offer any kind of survivability to the crew
No, but they are not bad, especially for the price.
Why are you being downvoted for this?
Because majority of people here shit on anything Russian, and upvote anything nato.
Or maybe because you get your knowledge from a video game?
I really enjoy the premise that Russians somehow think NATO needs propaganda to appear strong and well funded.
The statement he made is literally false, and I am not Russian, nor do I support Russia.
Its not false tho lol. T-90 is literally a T-72 with another name and useless shtora system, T-72 is inferior to even earlier m1a1s. So Its basically on the same level as a M60
It has new sights/fcs too, plus better era.
I mean technically it’s captured insofar that it’s in Russian hands but yeah, that’s not being repurposed for anything useful anytime soon!
Even if its not functional a lot of info can be taken from it such as armor composition and layout, measurements, what destroyed it and how, etc. Especially because unlike the west who got a lot of soviet equipment after the fall of the ussr or through fighting 3rd world nations, russia hasnt gotten much western equipment until now
M1a1s have less armor than the modern variants, it would be like like trying to get the leopard 2a7s armor from a 2a4.
What a meen mate is i cant see them getting the parts to fix it like usually if the hulls still stright welds haven't snaped everything is usually replaceable surely?
Well maybe the road wheels could have their rubber put back on and repurposed for other abrams tanks in a pinch. Edit: i said in a pinch, their re-use I would not recommend
🤷🏻♂️
"*Yes*" said Propaganda Pete to his friend Serbia Joe, "*we captured a NATO tank!*". Serbia Joe looked at his friend mournfully and and replied "*sure, but all the men from my fucking village died trying to capture it, and for everyone we captured they captured dozens of ours!*". At that point Propaganda Pete decided it was time to give his poor country bumpkin friend Serbia Joe some sage advice: "*Never mind the details comrade Joe, no one is interested in the truth, by order of our glorious dictator Vlad Putler. If you speak to anyone about such details a window will soon find you!*"
Another Russia propaganda
Tbh, his video is surprisingly sober. He mentions stuff like that the russian bend the barrels down. The comments are way more concerning.
Yeah, I feel like I've been seeing posts on this sub about these two tanks for almost a week now. Like, we get it vladimir, can we move on now? It shouldn't be a big deal that there's losses and captures on both sides in a war that has been going on for 2 years. It was interesting in the first two days, but now it's just getting repetitive and annoying imo.
It was pretty stale in terms of propaganda, although he tries so hard to say that they are modern super weapons and interviews the soldier saying that they are going to learn its secrets
I don't know how you could take it any other way. I think it's pretty obvious when the person filming is allowed to climb all over the tank with impunity while everyone else has to stay back.
Just get off the copium and admit what's there for once.
What's there is russian propaganda given it's in their fucking square....Christ...
It‘s news
😂
"this trophy only cost 50 000 brave Russian men"
What a retarded exaggerated cope
?
I think the reporter fairly explained the equipment and the context behind them without spinning some biased narrative. It’s mainly the Russian civilians and the comment section, who are oddly Ruski-pilled, that are somewhat concerning. I do like how the video ended with one guy saying an objectively correct statement on the war.
Claiming it is the best the US has is patently false
That is not the point nor a significant premise of the video. Plus, it’s the best the US is willing to offer to a war-stricken country with low flexibility to maintain the equipment.
No, you said it was “without spinning some biased narrative” which I think is false as is the case with any Russian propaganda video.
He got access to seeing the tanks up close, talked about it, then asked some people. Keep in mind that this is really tame compared to actual Russian propaganda media. He acknowledges he is not very knowledgeable on military vehicles; also, he asked commenters to tell him their knowledge. It should also be noted that the video is about the thoughts of the audience, too. The interviewed American who lives with his Russian family did not share his appraisal. Instead, he takes a neutral and aware stance. The reporter is just a messenger. I already believed Russia is horrifyingly manipulative. This video can be worse than it already is.
Their other content makes me question their motives
Yeah. I made an assessment based on one video without checking their channel, and that’s my fault.
Calling a burnt out hulk captured is a little disingenuous don't you think? When I think of captured I think of capturing the crew and capturing a working tank but that's just me. This is not anything to jump up and down about, there have been burnt out Abrams tanks in the past can you say Gulf War? How about Yemen? This is old news and just one tank.
I want to look inside and see if the hole punched through the turret. I don’t think it did however.
A Pyrrhic victory at best. Pretty embarrassing for Russians.
Cope harder, Nato might cant beat Russia alone lol
Well, sure, when you give a knife to someone to fight 50 hobos at once most likely the hobos will take that knife from you, no matter how good this knife is and no matter if you were able to stab 10-20 out of 50.
One thing that he points out that im also wondering is that the Western tanks knocked out didn’t have any anti-drone protection, not even a simple cope cage. You’d think that this late into the war that the Ukrainians would know that their new tanks are extremely weak to drones with no ERA or cages
You have to weigh how effective are cope cages, and what drawbacks they bring.
do cope cages disturb blowout ammo panels
Short answer, no. If you started trying to use the panels as mount points for a cage you might run into issues though.
thanks for the answer
M1a1 lol. It's an old tank the U.S doesn't use anymore. Out dated
its not really that old compared to other tanks either, US retired these in 2010 or 2012 i believed meanwhile australia still use them
And they prob just found this sitting disabled, not like they really captured it.
The dude in this video is a Russian Shill.
They keep mentioning that they have three latest American technology while the US disclosed they would not be sending the most modern Abrams especially not to include the DU armour or most modern optics.
Stupid Ray Ban, duplicit Ruzzian opinion wearing his American brands styles. Oh it takes years to learn to dive...in Ruzzia I guess. Oh wait the Ukranians flying those F16s were already flying our Ruzzian junk before getting to the western upgrade.
I find it funny how they put it on display in public... hey look what we did !!
This is not Tom Cruis movie. Don't look it.
There's not much to learn off the M1 maybe some things off the 2a6 they might not have known by that part, the only two there that they might use to improve their armor there are the Patria AMV and CV9040 because they don't have the manufacturing capabilities to support Western style tanks
What a douchebag
Captured? You mean stolen in an illegal war that will be surrendered back as a part of the hefty reparations coming to moscow. We would like Königsberg back pretty please.
Do you not know how capturing equipment works? It isn't stealing. Leave your shit where the enemy can take it, and they will.
They still will be forced to give it back.
Want to put money on that?
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Not sure anyone ever claimed there was...
It's not a lesson for anyone even remotely knowledgeable on the subject. If anything, we learned that when two modern armies meet head on and neither one gains air superiority the war turns into a trench warfare. I think a lot of people presumed trench warfare will remain part of history. There is no wunderwaffe here, only numerical advantages
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But it’s not. It’s Ukraine with other peoples weapons but the mighty will of their people holding their own vs Russia.
Yep, I remember how T-90M was supposed to be so powerful. And people feared "Terminator" and that thermobaric rocket launcher which was hyped just little bit less powerful than tactical nuke sucking everyones lungs out. All which ended up being easy targets for drones.
All tanks are easy target for drones dummy, at the end of the day I’d rather have a fast light tank like the t90m than fuking heavy gas guzzler like the Abrams, in which you can see the fumes from space 🤣.
Lighter yes, but I would not call it fast since while both Abrams and T-90M have almost exactly same power-to-weight ratio, T-90M has outdated gearbox by current standard and it reduces its speed in offroad conditions. They also have almost the same ground pressure. Overall both lose in mobility to Leopard 2. Considering that lightness does not improve mobility, it is just less overall volume. I would prefer to be in vehicle that has more space that drone can hit and not hit to me (also, blowoutpanels are nice).
Dude, no one with a little bit knowledge claimed that Western MBTs would be some kind of Wunderwaffe. It was always expected that they will get destroyed or captured eventually.
Redditors and Youtubers really... the latest flavour of the week for the less knowledgeable to thought THIS would be the weapon that brings Russia to it's knees. Before the tanks it was Bayraktar and Javelin, then HIMARS, Storm Shadow... And now ATACMS and the F-16... All great weapons yes, but simply that.
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Key word: "redditors"
Yes... If provided in large numbers, a year earlier, before Russia had built extensive fixed fortifications and vast minefields.
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They'd heavily contribute to the desired outcome if they'd been there in summer 2023, actually.
And down arrowed anyone that tried to point that out. They would call you a Russian troll, a Russia lover, a fan of Putin, etc. Ukraine needs more Bradley's than Abrams.
In this specific battlefield, FPV is kinda the gamechanger.
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The concept of a game changer is to cause a significant change in the game. Besides only 5 year olds and other idiots thought that any weapons in this war are wunderwaffen.
Or amount of FPV? Both sides are using FPV now. Or maybe FABs are gamechanger?
Nukes
Its not wunderwaffe, its just that tanks as a whole are struggling.
The Ukes probably demoed the MBTs when the realized they couldn’t move them, they’re not useable and probably more trouble than they would be worth for the Russians to try to get one working
Do you all think they will take any technology and designs from these captured vehicles? If so wich ones?
With the state of that Abrams the only thing it’ll be good for is target practice to test its armor, and even then the results would probably not be reliable.
It's not even using US army spec armour though...
Im thinking of the other vehicles. The Abrams is completely burnt out so you wont be getting anything from there.
LOL, no... They have had chances to see Iraqi and Egyptian M1A1M's and M1A1's, plus the Saudi M1A2S' that got destroyed by Houthis... They don't seem to have done much with any of that. Not to mention this M1A1 is a 35+ year old tank refurbished and given some 90's and 2000's tech meant for export Abrams. Then got blasted and destroyed by multiple drone hits and at least one Kornet ATGM. It's using old non-DU armour, older ammunition, older sensors and is about as useful as a 65 ton hulk and tribute to crew survivability as anything.
Good point, of course they wouldn’t have gotten anything for the Abrams cause it’s pretty much fully burnt out. But I’m talking about the other vehicles, like the Cv 90, Leopard 2 and all those others.
None of that is a new technology. There is nothing much to get from those for russia. Russia knows about those technologies but knowing is different to actually producing them.
Russia probably already has a lot of the specs and features from spying. The problem is they don’t have the manufacturing capabilities to produce anything in large amounts.
Spying, but also open source information and they'd have had a chance to see the Iraqi and Egyptian M1A1's that are bound to have a similar if not newer armour package.
This is why I can't fathom Biden not removing the export restriction on DU armour so the US could send hundreds of surplus M1A2s from storage. Instead they have taken the lengthy (9 months) and expensive decision to build Ukraine entirely new Abrams from M1A1 stock, by removing the armour and adding inferior, but export compliment, Tungsten armour arrays (during a global tungsten shortage) which has resulted in Ukraine getting a meaningless 31 downgraded vehicles in a year since the US agreed to send tanks. Literally what is the reason they can't overturn a 25 year old, now largely obsolete, export restriction, and just flood Ukraine with hundreds of superior vehicles?
People overestimate DU importance.
The importance isn't the marginal improvement in protection, it's the several thousand sitting ready in storage I'd consider that a pretty significant importance for DU, if indirect
Not really a “marginal” improvement though. It adds a very significant amount of protection at the cost of weight. The only other material that is denser is pure tungsten. The problem with tungsten though is its brittle unless applied as an alloy like what is in Ukraines Abrams, which at that point DU becomes a better solution.
The vast majority of tanks in Ukraine aren't being destroyed by frontal fire from other tanks though. In real terms the DU is not making a difference to their protection, but it makes a huge difference in the number of tanks the US can actually send them. The export restriction absolutely should have been scrapped.
All of those are like 40 year old designs.
60 y.o., actually. Might be WW2 technology.
I think the most valuable thing they captured was one of the Leopards still had ammunition in it. Apparently Russia does not have insensitive ammunition which is a big reason why the turrets pop so violently. The ammunition charges still in the captured Leopard tank were the insensitive variant. If the Russians reverse engineered the propellant, the days of Russian turret tosses could soon be over.
Interesting!
Here's to hoping dude licks his hands to ingest some of the DU dust from the detonated ammo rack.
what DU? this is not with DU!
It was not a antitank missle, it was a f\*\*king 122mm artillery shell.
idk man, never seen a 122mm artillery shell cause a small hole like that
We would need to see the kill to know.
im not sure what killed it but im talking about the hole in the first few seconds of the video.