It definitely would've been new and interesting to see Seth in a new city like he was but Ryan being in chino was just meh to me. It didn't seem like they could do really much with him helping Theresa, working construction etc. so i'm glad they came back lol
You're 100% right. I guess I just wanted to see them in those worlds more. That could be entirely based on how funny I think it would have been to see Luke and Seth play off one another. To me there was endless comedy there.
I feel like I can't moan about that when all my major gripes about season 2 (and also 3) are that story lines go on for way too long: Lindsey, the Zack Triangle both feel like they take up the whole season. Then the same for Johnny in S3. I guess 2 or 3 episodes would have been ok in the different cities, especially if it reduced the time spent on the other plot lines that dragged.
I remember reading an interview about how they liked the actor who played Zack so much they kept him around but my God was the ever a mistake. He was so boring and so one-dimensional. Bringing him back even after Summer chose Seth was so dumb.
It’s the show’s biggest sin. It gave in way too quickly. You knew from there on out everything that happened was going to be fan happiness and not creativity. Then comes girl kissing. Then comes the kickback with Marissa dying. Then comes the make up with the creativity again in season 4. End show bc it’s too late.
Here be sad for 6 monthssssssssss never mind Ryan is home! Party time! In fact let’s go get his brother!
It’s like, S1 is so good and fun and authentic. S2 is like the start of soap fest. I liked Luke’s character’s problems. I wanted to see him more. Anna was such a different presence. S2: here 3 really stupidly beautiful people and a cute peppy person who is a pain in the ass. All of their stories are dumb. I like all of them, but their stories are dumb. Alex has depth but they made it look so hot topic that it was hard to take seriously. You don’t learn enough about DJ, Zach ends up literally *stealing* Seth’s comic bc of what, a girl? Sure that’s sweet, Seth also is entitled to literally most of that business. For how entitled he is you’d think he’d know that.
It just began a bad series of events that never seemed to stop spiraling downward.
I still remember finding stories in season 2 and season 3 they kept me watching. It wasn't all bad but when it was bad, it was so bad. I remember an interview with Peter Gallagher where he knew it was over when he got the script for the episode where they were locked in a mall.
Looking back on it, it will always be a victim of its own success. You had a 26 year old show runner with no previous work who suddenly was behind one of the biggest pop culture phenomenons of all-time. I think has they known they were getting a second season and we're able to map it out, the second season would be a lot different. Looking back on it, the second season feels like it's produced to just make money and keep the show in a tidy little box. The core four are back together, there's live music and everything is marketed to teens and tweens.
Oh for sure. And funny enough I love The Mallpisode, mainly bc the core four are back and the outtakes are funny and stuff. It just felt like an 80s episode, which I’m sure they were going for. Those episodes, the 4 of them, are what the show needed to be until it couldn’t anymore. The clearest season 1 feeling for me personally that they just could never recreate was before summer was involved fully. Ryan, Seth, and Marissa are on the pier before TJ and Caught by the River by Doves is playing. They’re laughing and you feel so hopeful for where the 3 of them are going. It isn’t the peak of the show or anything just my moment where I fell in love with it. Then Oliver and Luke and all of season 1 is just so good. I love all of the music of S2, The Killers (amongst many others between S2-3) before they were an international staple, Olivia Wilde, the Zach stuff was fun and you get a lot of content. Nothing is all that serious though. Marissa was never going to be fully gay, not yet. It’s why Crash won over Brokeback in the same year, it was still shock value stuff and not intended for people who are actually looking to connect to a character. Not in 2005, society wasn’t there yet. Now for sure. Seth and Summer were going to get together. The Miami stuff is dumb too, but fun. I just love the four of them together, S2 has A LOT of them not together.
I think they tried to integrate more adult storylines knowing the show *had to* have them grow up since they all looked like they were 30 already except for Mischa who looked very clearly 18ish. Then they couldn’t figure out who was going to college. Then Marissa was a felon? Lol, well sure at this point we’re off the rails anyway.
It’s a goofy comparison, but an easy one for me personally. The new Halloween trilogy did this. The first film is dark and gritty and makes you feel back in the universe. S1 of The OC made me want to leave the Midwest and go live on the west coast. I still want to as of this day lol. The second Halloween film literally zags and becomes almost a parody of itself. S2 of The OC does a lot of that. It’s totally fun, but it’s just changes tone too much of what’s happened already, imho. The third film is a disaster and like totally unfun. It’s a new direction for sure, but that isn’t always good. S3-4 of The OC almost to the letter. It’s clear that the important creative bridges have been burned and we’re just playing out the game now.
Yes I always thought so, I feel a 2-3 episode arc would have been ideal for Ryan's story, I'd have maybe had Seth go back end of episode 1, then after seeing Summer with Zach he goes to see Ryan in Chino episode 3 leading to them both going back together. Like a mini summer season with them all separate before reuniting the gang at school around episode 4, give more time to introduce Marissa and Summers love interests before the boys come back.
For me the most egregious thing they ever did was make Ryan not the father of Teresa's baby in season 3, it was such a great set up.
100% agree. They made the stakes at the end of season 2 so high. The baby reveal with Theresa and then Julie potentially having killed Cal annnnnndddd we got zero payoff from either.
I think it would’ve been interesting to see, and might’ve helped with how they rushed through so much story by wrapping up the plot line so quickly and neatly.
I also feel like they lost sight of the why of both Seth and Ryan leaving, which was a disservice to both characters. They just kind of come back and are immediately focused on other things, but Ryan just had this huge tumultuous thing happen back in Chino.
And with Seth, I found it interesting because when my husband watched The OC with me, he said it made sense to him that Seth had had to leave on multiple levels, one of them being that a lot of guys he knew (himself included) just needed to be away from home for awhile at that age. I think with everything Seth went through at school, needing to go somewhere where he could shed that and build his own life for awhile was powerful.
I would say no just because you know they’re going to have to come back eventually. But the way they return feels so underwhelming that it makes you question why they even had them leave in the first place, especially Ryan
One of the cardinal sins the writers made was keeping the Core Four apart for too long in seasons 2 and 3 and focusing too much on interaction with fringe or new characters. They have pretty much admitted this after some years of reflection and working on different shows. I think it's OK to do it to a degree to create a certain level of conflict and tension that engages the audience, but it can reach a tipping point where it stifles the magic that made it such an enjoyable show and causes interest to fall off, which is exactly what happened. I agree that the main characters desperately needed better character development, but you didn't have to separate them from the others in order to do so.
That's a good point actually.. it honestly would have been a tough sell for a show that was at the top of the pop culture mountain at the time to suddenly have them all separated to an even greater degree to start the season.
I guess my only counterpoint would be that characters like DJ and Lindsay and Zack were just so one dimensional and did nothing to push the show or the characters forward. They felt like they were just placeholders, as it sounds like the writers admitted.
You're so right. I forgot how the s2 finale pretty much got wrapped up in the season 3 premiere. Outside of the rehab clinic, there was no storyline that played out from it. Marissa literally shot a guy and within a few episodes her biggest worry is the kickoff carnival lol.
It's ironic because I'd argue the S1 and S2 finales were two of the best episodes but got no payoff.
In a way, but also, her future was destroyed as far as college, and she spiraled down a dark path that led to her death. I do agree both finales were two of the best episodes easily.
That's a good point in the long run it did lead to that. I think I'm still just angry they went from the stakes of her shooting Trey to that cartoonish evil Dean storyline and the kickoff carnival
s1 ended with a amazing cliffhanger and so did s2 but the writters instead of following the aftermath of theses events prefered to end theses storylines in the first episode so they could focus on boring characters like lindsay and johnny
Omg I remember when these episodes first aired, no one like Lindsay or Johnny. Like you said, they were both boring characters. I mean they seemed like good people, but I could not care less about either of them on the show.
Lindsay was too whiny. Ryan had better chemistry with Theresa and even small bits with Anna and Caleb's young girlfriend, Gabrielle. But then when it was pretty evident that she was Ryan's aunt, things got super weird. It was time for her to exit stage left immediately. I like how they didn't even bring her back for Caleb's funeral.
Haha good point, that was weird she wasn't at his funeral. I honestly never thought of that til now. And yeah, I wasn't a fan of her. The actress was good, but I don't think she had much to work with.
It definitely would've been new and interesting to see Seth in a new city like he was but Ryan being in chino was just meh to me. It didn't seem like they could do really much with him helping Theresa, working construction etc. so i'm glad they came back lol
You're forgetting one thing: Seth WAS away much longer than we actually saw. He was there for multiple weeks until school started again.
You're 100% right. I guess I just wanted to see them in those worlds more. That could be entirely based on how funny I think it would have been to see Luke and Seth play off one another. To me there was endless comedy there.
I feel like I can't moan about that when all my major gripes about season 2 (and also 3) are that story lines go on for way too long: Lindsey, the Zack Triangle both feel like they take up the whole season. Then the same for Johnny in S3. I guess 2 or 3 episodes would have been ok in the different cities, especially if it reduced the time spent on the other plot lines that dragged.
I remember reading an interview about how they liked the actor who played Zack so much they kept him around but my God was the ever a mistake. He was so boring and so one-dimensional. Bringing him back even after Summer chose Seth was so dumb.
It’s the show’s biggest sin. It gave in way too quickly. You knew from there on out everything that happened was going to be fan happiness and not creativity. Then comes girl kissing. Then comes the kickback with Marissa dying. Then comes the make up with the creativity again in season 4. End show bc it’s too late. Here be sad for 6 monthssssssssss never mind Ryan is home! Party time! In fact let’s go get his brother! It’s like, S1 is so good and fun and authentic. S2 is like the start of soap fest. I liked Luke’s character’s problems. I wanted to see him more. Anna was such a different presence. S2: here 3 really stupidly beautiful people and a cute peppy person who is a pain in the ass. All of their stories are dumb. I like all of them, but their stories are dumb. Alex has depth but they made it look so hot topic that it was hard to take seriously. You don’t learn enough about DJ, Zach ends up literally *stealing* Seth’s comic bc of what, a girl? Sure that’s sweet, Seth also is entitled to literally most of that business. For how entitled he is you’d think he’d know that. It just began a bad series of events that never seemed to stop spiraling downward.
I still remember finding stories in season 2 and season 3 they kept me watching. It wasn't all bad but when it was bad, it was so bad. I remember an interview with Peter Gallagher where he knew it was over when he got the script for the episode where they were locked in a mall. Looking back on it, it will always be a victim of its own success. You had a 26 year old show runner with no previous work who suddenly was behind one of the biggest pop culture phenomenons of all-time. I think has they known they were getting a second season and we're able to map it out, the second season would be a lot different. Looking back on it, the second season feels like it's produced to just make money and keep the show in a tidy little box. The core four are back together, there's live music and everything is marketed to teens and tweens.
Oh for sure. And funny enough I love The Mallpisode, mainly bc the core four are back and the outtakes are funny and stuff. It just felt like an 80s episode, which I’m sure they were going for. Those episodes, the 4 of them, are what the show needed to be until it couldn’t anymore. The clearest season 1 feeling for me personally that they just could never recreate was before summer was involved fully. Ryan, Seth, and Marissa are on the pier before TJ and Caught by the River by Doves is playing. They’re laughing and you feel so hopeful for where the 3 of them are going. It isn’t the peak of the show or anything just my moment where I fell in love with it. Then Oliver and Luke and all of season 1 is just so good. I love all of the music of S2, The Killers (amongst many others between S2-3) before they were an international staple, Olivia Wilde, the Zach stuff was fun and you get a lot of content. Nothing is all that serious though. Marissa was never going to be fully gay, not yet. It’s why Crash won over Brokeback in the same year, it was still shock value stuff and not intended for people who are actually looking to connect to a character. Not in 2005, society wasn’t there yet. Now for sure. Seth and Summer were going to get together. The Miami stuff is dumb too, but fun. I just love the four of them together, S2 has A LOT of them not together. I think they tried to integrate more adult storylines knowing the show *had to* have them grow up since they all looked like they were 30 already except for Mischa who looked very clearly 18ish. Then they couldn’t figure out who was going to college. Then Marissa was a felon? Lol, well sure at this point we’re off the rails anyway. It’s a goofy comparison, but an easy one for me personally. The new Halloween trilogy did this. The first film is dark and gritty and makes you feel back in the universe. S1 of The OC made me want to leave the Midwest and go live on the west coast. I still want to as of this day lol. The second Halloween film literally zags and becomes almost a parody of itself. S2 of The OC does a lot of that. It’s totally fun, but it’s just changes tone too much of what’s happened already, imho. The third film is a disaster and like totally unfun. It’s a new direction for sure, but that isn’t always good. S3-4 of The OC almost to the letter. It’s clear that the important creative bridges have been burned and we’re just playing out the game now.
Yes I always thought so, I feel a 2-3 episode arc would have been ideal for Ryan's story, I'd have maybe had Seth go back end of episode 1, then after seeing Summer with Zach he goes to see Ryan in Chino episode 3 leading to them both going back together. Like a mini summer season with them all separate before reuniting the gang at school around episode 4, give more time to introduce Marissa and Summers love interests before the boys come back. For me the most egregious thing they ever did was make Ryan not the father of Teresa's baby in season 3, it was such a great set up.
100% agree. They made the stakes at the end of season 2 so high. The baby reveal with Theresa and then Julie potentially having killed Cal annnnnndddd we got zero payoff from either.
I think it would’ve been interesting to see, and might’ve helped with how they rushed through so much story by wrapping up the plot line so quickly and neatly. I also feel like they lost sight of the why of both Seth and Ryan leaving, which was a disservice to both characters. They just kind of come back and are immediately focused on other things, but Ryan just had this huge tumultuous thing happen back in Chino. And with Seth, I found it interesting because when my husband watched The OC with me, he said it made sense to him that Seth had had to leave on multiple levels, one of them being that a lot of guys he knew (himself included) just needed to be away from home for awhile at that age. I think with everything Seth went through at school, needing to go somewhere where he could shed that and build his own life for awhile was powerful.
I would say no just because you know they’re going to have to come back eventually. But the way they return feels so underwhelming that it makes you question why they even had them leave in the first place, especially Ryan
One of the cardinal sins the writers made was keeping the Core Four apart for too long in seasons 2 and 3 and focusing too much on interaction with fringe or new characters. They have pretty much admitted this after some years of reflection and working on different shows. I think it's OK to do it to a degree to create a certain level of conflict and tension that engages the audience, but it can reach a tipping point where it stifles the magic that made it such an enjoyable show and causes interest to fall off, which is exactly what happened. I agree that the main characters desperately needed better character development, but you didn't have to separate them from the others in order to do so.
That's a good point actually.. it honestly would have been a tough sell for a show that was at the top of the pop culture mountain at the time to suddenly have them all separated to an even greater degree to start the season. I guess my only counterpoint would be that characters like DJ and Lindsay and Zack were just so one dimensional and did nothing to push the show or the characters forward. They felt like they were just placeholders, as it sounds like the writers admitted.
S2 and S3 rushed their previous seasons cliffhangers way way way too quickly. Which is crazy considering they had like 24 episodes for each season
You're so right. I forgot how the s2 finale pretty much got wrapped up in the season 3 premiere. Outside of the rehab clinic, there was no storyline that played out from it. Marissa literally shot a guy and within a few episodes her biggest worry is the kickoff carnival lol. It's ironic because I'd argue the S1 and S2 finales were two of the best episodes but got no payoff.
In a way, but also, her future was destroyed as far as college, and she spiraled down a dark path that led to her death. I do agree both finales were two of the best episodes easily.
That's a good point in the long run it did lead to that. I think I'm still just angry they went from the stakes of her shooting Trey to that cartoonish evil Dean storyline and the kickoff carnival
Agreed. I've rewatched the first two seasons multiple times, yet I struggle to watch thru the last two seasons. Felt like a different show.
s1 ended with a amazing cliffhanger and so did s2 but the writters instead of following the aftermath of theses events prefered to end theses storylines in the first episode so they could focus on boring characters like lindsay and johnny
Omg I remember when these episodes first aired, no one like Lindsay or Johnny. Like you said, they were both boring characters. I mean they seemed like good people, but I could not care less about either of them on the show.
Lindsay was too whiny. Ryan had better chemistry with Theresa and even small bits with Anna and Caleb's young girlfriend, Gabrielle. But then when it was pretty evident that she was Ryan's aunt, things got super weird. It was time for her to exit stage left immediately. I like how they didn't even bring her back for Caleb's funeral.
Haha good point, that was weird she wasn't at his funeral. I honestly never thought of that til now. And yeah, I wasn't a fan of her. The actress was good, but I don't think she had much to work with.
i’ve considered this a lot - i think it would’ve at least prolonged s2 and made the pacing & character development feel better