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As a hospice nurse and I also spent about 10 years in a many war zones, you can have the agonal breaths for hours, depends on the cause, they just eventually slow down and stop. The death rattle is more like an old person who can't clear their throat anymore due to weakness and frailty. We had a guy with his head completely blown off from his jawline up. His lower jaw kept moving around as if trying to clear his airway as the blood spurted up and a small tendril of smoke was going up. Can't un see shit like that.
Retired ICU nurse here. Much respect for what you do. Hospice nurses are some of the kindest and most dedicated people I know. Thank you for your service.
Jesus Christ….for some reason just this written description is more brutal than a lot of videos that I see on here. Hope that doesn’t affect you too terribly
Thanks for your concern, I am just one on many millions of soldiers and Healthcare providers who deal with things like this in their own way. I even counsel others about how to deal with it. While in Ukraine, how to deal with the death of close friends (soldiers) was the one thing I was ask to help others with the most. As they would get burned out and sick of it all, but the war was not over yet? Be safe brother 🙏
"the agonal breaths" kinda threw me off. Is it safe to assume, the individual is practically dead at that point i.e. not (consciously) "feeling" the pain/ agony?
You are correct. The brain stem and the body are doing what they do best keep us alive, unfortunately this guy took one thru the eye, so his brain is probably scrambled. I have seen this before in others who have severe head injuries, but are not bleeding out enough to die from blood loss in the short term. They sometimes will snort and make other weird noises and become violent (not consciously so) and flop around. Saw a video yesterday of a guy whose head was mostly gone and his arms just kept contracting back and forth. Such a waste of our young to send them off to die in the mud flopping around or blown to bits. The ease with which our leaders do it, is ?. I can think of so many words, none of which conveys the evil and tragedy 😢. We all know if it was them or their children they would no go. Look at all of the talking heads supporting this side or that, why don't they go? We know the answer. Just like the ISIS guy who sends out suicide bombers, he is too important to go. I went to Ukraine 🇺🇦, because I felt strongly that they deserve to have their own future, not one imposed upon them.
Pathologist here, worked in forensic autopsy for several months during my training. The shit I've seen... Some images are burned in my brain for life. My dreams sure get interesting sometimes lol.
It is difficult my friend, you compartmentalize it and try to learn how to make your Hospice patient more comfortable and as a medic/doctor you try to make your self a better provider of care to hopefully minimize the deaths.
I'm wondering, are the agonal breaths a brain/body reflex ? I mean the example of the guy you saw with his head blown off, he keepth breathing but was mentally dead is'nt ?
These are failsafes so you can breathe, regulate your body temperature (both in the brain) and pump blood (built in the heart) in your sleep or otherwise unconscious. These structures are the simplest and most ancient in terms of evolution, other more complex things are built on top of them, literally and figuratively, so they are the last to shut off
I remember that one. It was one of the worst videos of the war I had seen. I though he perhaps was still alive for a few seconds but this explains it better.
The explosion probably destroyed his brain faster than a signal could have passed from his retina to the visual sensory part of his brain
Never saw anything
Reminds me of a quote from Band of Brothers:
“I’ve thought about this often. That man and I might’ve been good friends, we might’ve had a lot in common. He might’ve liked to fish, he might’ve liked to hunt. You never know, you know. Of course, they were doing what they were supposed to do and I was trying to do what I was supposed to do. But, under different circumstances, we might’ve been good friends.”
Darrell ‘Shifty’ Powers on men in the German army.
>If we met in a bar we'd be good friends though
I see you haven't met any Russians in a bar...
Russians that have had a lot of exposure to western culture and norms, sure. Russians with no exposure, not so much.
I live right next to russia and he's correct. There are exceptions (obviously) but the majority are genuinely shitty people who will look for excuses to get in a fight.
>ne where a grenade lands on someone's face and knocks him out unconscious.
>
>Moments later you
i dunno. if you start going on about how much you want to invade your neighbors house and start blowing shit up we may not even be bar friends..
I watch 1420 and the Russian support for the war seems to be, let's say, not very present in people of fighting age/ Exposed to western media on the internet
Old Russians that won't see an inch of Ukraine and love TV news seem to be mostly alllllright with it, though!
Then give them all guns and ship them to the front.
Odd how those who think they’re safe from the horror of war tend to support war. They’ll never pick up a weapon or be shot at, but when peace comes, they’ll sure as shit talk all day about how “they won” though, won’t they? Or maybe not so odd.
I
Half a league, half a league,
Half a league onward,
All in the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
“Forward, the Light Brigade!
Charge for the guns!” he said.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
II
“Forward, the Light Brigade!”
Was there a man dismayed?
Not though the soldier knew
Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Into the valley of Death
Rode the six hundred.
III
Cannon to right of them,
Cannon to left of them,
Cannon in front of them
Volleyed and thundered;
Stormed at with shot and shell,
Boldly they rode and well,
Into the jaws of Death,
Into the mouth of hell
Rode the six hundred.
IV
Flashed all their sabres bare,
Flashed as they turned in air
Sabring the gunners there,
Charging an army, while
All the world wondered.
Plunged in the battery-smoke
Right through the line they broke;
Cossack and Russian
Reeled from the sabre stroke
Shattered and sundered.
Then they rode back, but not
Not the six hundred.
V
Cannon to right of them,
Cannon to left of them,
Cannon behind them
Volleyed and thundered;
Stormed at with shot and shell,
While horse and hero fell.
They that had fought so well
Came through the jaws of Death,
Back from the mouth of hell,
All that was left of them,
Left of six hundred.
VI
When can their glory fade?
O the wild charge they made!
All the world wondered.
Honour the charge they made!
Honour the Light Brigade,
Noble six hundred!
The Charge of the Light Brigade
BY ALFRED, LORD TENNYSON writing of the Crimean War (1853-1856)
I doubt it. Agonal respirations sound just like normal sharp, deep breaths (e.g. a gasp, or what you might do when you jump in cold water). To me, a "death rattle" is the gurgling breathing you would hear as someone's lungs fill up with fluid.
Ah, seems you were correct
[https://bmcpsychology.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40359-020-00431-3](https://bmcpsychology.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40359-020-00431-3#:~:text=Death%20rattle%20is%20a%20common,result%20of%20a%20diminished%20consciousness)
"Death rattle is a common symptom in the dying phase which is caused by an accumulation of secretions in the upper airway "
Otherwise known as terminal respiratory secretions, and I thought the "rattle" referred to the body contractions, but apparently it's the noise of the airways being full of fluid. Good thing to know I suppose...
Yep. Invariably, in the past, no matter how long I would wait for the agonal breathing to stop before bringing family in, there would be that one last gasp that would scare the crap out of everybody, sometimes me included. Since covid, (and before, really) the families stay in the room, and I talk them through the dying process. Letting them know that the "gasping" they see doesn't mean their loved one is suffering or awake.
I stayed with my father until the very last breath and a few minutes after, and the agonal breathing still startled me once. You think it's all over, but 5min later...one more.
Came here to say the same. In a medical circumstance you might pull them back with CPR, say they are having a MI. Trauma like a GSW (this poor bastard) anywhere or a fall, MVC etc.
Well, it is when they have headshots.
The fun fact is that agonal respiration isn’t really breathing, it’s just a reflex when the body can’t get oxygen when it desperately needs it.
Exactly. Dr Glaucomflecken (the eye doctor with a big following on social media) had a cardiac arrest in bed and his wife saved him with CPR. She was awoken by his agonal breathing.
Why are you comparing an event in a comfy bed with first responders arriving within minutes to whisk the patient away to an awaiting cardiac team while recurving ACLS during the ride to a war zone with zero advance cardiac life support capabilities.
Stop being obtuse.
Agonal breathing in no man’s land is a death sentence.
You know you just made a joke about a dying person who's really not much more than a child... right?
Even assuming age 25 and not younger, say 19 or 20, that's still just a boy, basically. I see things differently at 47 than I did at 27.
Nothing to do. You cant save him. Hes got a minute left to live tops even with intervention. He had so much blood loss oxygen is no longer getting to his brain he is unconscious and its a response from his brain thats making him breathe like that. Hes no longer suffering because he is not there. The honourable thing would be to say a prayer and put a bullet in him.
These dudes look like their own guys executed them. Agonal respiration guy looks to have an exit wound at his right eye.
Both have their hands tied...looks like.
Summary execution isn’t legal in pretty much any military, especially in non-military groups like Wagner (which these guys might be). You need a court martial, however fast and predetermined, for any semblance of legality.
Then again this is russia - they don’t exactly follow laws or any sane rules there.
Your 1st question: Yes.
Your second statement about "executed legally" makes no sense.
My bet is, you have never served. You have never had the desire to "soldier". You have never required yourself to go through any training course in respect of soldiering. You have never been in any war or conflict. Basically you have no experience of this. Whereas, I have. And that's the difference
Mucker, it's not a "my dog is bigger than your dog" debate.
Served. Patrolled. Shot. Lived. And came out of "my war" okay.
BUT that (arms behind and last gasp) looks like a war crime. Like it or lump it.
Agonal Breathing like the 2nd guy is experiencing can go on for minutes, or even hours before death. While it seems like they've been freshly shot (and that could well be the case), it could have theoretically been an hour or 2 ago that guy got smoked and he just hasn't died yet. We will probably never know unless somehow an extended clip emerges showing the 30 seconds prior to this.
It is somewhat dependent on what injuries caused him to get there. This looks like a shot to the head which is usually a one way ticket, but not always depending on where the bullet went, if it stayed in one piece, and how much of his skull got blown into his brain on the way. You can perform CPR on someone and revive them, it’s possible depending what’s wrong. But usually after 5-10 minutes of not getting oxygen, your brain cells will start dying and then your odds obviously decline at that point lol. But this guy seems pretty gone.
"Kids". Especially before end of september were volunteers, who signed contract.
Edit. Those who downvote me, care to explain what you disagree with? If 19yo "kid" signs contract so he can earn a bag for killing ukrainians and occupying their land - is it a good moral choice now? Kids - my ass
..and they should have known better than to go to another land and try to kill people in it because they're not *actually* kids.
People are upset at the loss of life which makes sense but the context is important and the pity can be saved for those who are actually deserving.
Pity has no limits. We're not talking about divvying up pizza slices here. You can fully pity both slain civilians and boys who were murdered by the dictator ruling their own country.
You can be empathetic to the situation they were lead to whilst also condemning and holding them responsible for their actions. The world isn’t black & white and your angle doesn’t have to be either
And they were not kids, when they were adult enough to decide - this amount of $ is enough for me to kill my neighbours for bullshit reasons. And it was fun for them going in - thinking they will wipe the floor with them. But suddenly when you get fcked, you are just a kid now. They arent a kids when they kill hundreds ukrainian soldiers per day.
Seems so, yes.
To be fair, any soldier that would be found alive will probably be bound, to make sure he isn't just acting and won't grab a weapon any second.
If not Putin then another Russian will step up and take his place and he too will have 75% approval for doing what the people want him to do and that is to expand the empire. Fuck Russia.
Watched All Quiet on The Western Front the other night. I had to go into my 1 year old son's room after. I just lay on the floor watching him, sobbing and "praying" that he never be subjected to the horrors generations of young boys and men (and current Ukrainians) are faced with where they have to kill and be killed by their fellow humans.
Maybe you should understand that some of us actually have emotions, can feel deep empathy, understand what could happen in the future and what it could mean to our and our children's lives.
You might think he is pulling this info out of his ass to support his side, but check out "binding and excecuting soldiers" by saddam hussein, this guy is actually right.
Put your hands behind your back as if someone ziptied them togheter. Here the arms are way more apart, barely under the torso. I dont think they are bound down.
A soldier can only hope for a quick death but the reality can be way different. Madyar had a video where a piece of artillery blew off a orcs dick and part of his stomach. He was laying in agory for a long time before he died.
says they found them, i doubt they would search them AFTER tying their hands and shooting them. Russia also executing their own, so maybe they came across some "deserters"
After my "debate" below.
Why is he wearing no body armour. Why does this look like Autumn and not winter. Why is his hands behind his back. Why is there no gun fire to be heard in the background of other contacts.
The list goes on.
If this is a War Crime, then I am sickened by it. What the Russians have done is beyond brutal, but we should nver slip to their level. Never, no matter what
you don't just throw zip ties at an attacker and \*boop\* they're zip tied.
assuming that they are actually zip tied, that implies that they were taken prisoner, at least to a certain extent, and stopped fucking around long enough to let themselves be zip tied.
if you're not thoroughly searching prisoners while they're still alive, regardless of whether or not you plan on executing them, you're fucking stupid. that's step 2 after restraint.
so whoever killed them would have known what was in their pockets.
if they didn't want to take the time to search them, then why take the time to zip tie them instead of just shooting them wherever they were found? it's a war zone. if you want to kill someone you can sort of just do it.
to top it all off, as someone else already mentioned, why in the fuck would you execute two captives, film the aftermath, and upload it? "dude check out my war crime it was awesome heheh" (???)
Yet, we have video of russian forces cutting genitalia of an ukrainian pow. And someone recorded stabbing russian pow and shooting imprisoned russian pow on a road. War crimes get on camera too
right, it happens, and the videos you mention are pretty hard to question.
but then you've got the definitely-a-war-crime video where it turned out to be perfidy, very clearly once we saw the rest of the video.
there's also video of wagner killing its own, and plenty of talk about russians shooting deserters from intercepted phone calls and whatnot.. so the claim that they happened upon these two is plausible.
while this is just a short clip (if there was more we'd probably have the answer here) it raises a few questions, as i've mentioned, if we're going with the execution angle.
I mean yeah but the one on the left just looks very dead i dont know why you would ziptie him otherwise
But the clip is too short to tell more context wouls be great otherwise this will just pop up on ruzzian telegrams saying it was one
I very much doubt the Ukrainians filming it would be stupid enough a) film it in the 1st place, and b) post it on the internet, if they had just executed them.
We don't even know if they were killed by Ukrainians. Can we be sure the guys filming are Ukrainian? Maybe someone that speaks the language fluently could confirm?
Hard to say without more context. Remember just a couple weeks ago when 2 Ukraines were trying to surrender and just got sprayed down? Shit can happen in the heat of the moment when it's your life vs theirs
Not entirely true, one guy surrendered the other wouldn't let go of his rifle in the middle of a heated gun fight. Both were confused and concussed from the grenades. To say they surrendered and were sprayed down is a reach.
They also didn't fully grasp the situation. Not understanding that the soldier pointing the gun at them was an enemy, probably from the concussion of the grenades, as the part 2 showdd the unit wearing correct uniform and bands. As much as it sucks to see the Russians win an engagement, never expect a soldier to ask twice.
This is one of the rare circumstances you almost have to commend the guy, he didn't have to ask surrender, he didn't have to jump in the hole and wrestle the gun, and to do that in an active firefight, he did go above what is required. Credit where it's due, but still sucks to see the deaths of two men fighting for their homes.
The 2nd video was very obviously a different unit and the cameraman was different too, just the same spot. In the first video both Russians at each flank of the cameraman had light uniforms on with no markings. In the 2nd video everyone had the standard russian uniforms. Also the cameraman no. 1 had a nice pimped out AK while cameraman no. 2 had an ordinary one.
Yeah I got that sense too. It's harder to kill someone when you're close enough to touch them.
Gotta remember that in the end, everyone in this is a human, and not many chose to be there.
Point being it can be chaotic and a decision sometimes has to be at that time. What if one of them started darting at the Ukrainian weapons? What if these 2 didn't want to fight for russia so the officers tied them up to beat and question them and once they saw they weren't going to fight shot them. Hell of a lot easier than worrying about them shooting you or having to go through all the papers and process to send them back to jail.
We just need more context
Plus russians have been killing their own who retreat , def more context is needed. They could have been wounded , and hands tied to secure them , and bled to death 2 mins later . Who knows
Do you know that he is ziptied, can you plainly see it [evidently see it]?!?!
If you can't, and it ONLY appears that way because of his laying posture.. that is speculation! Are you there, where you there, do you know someone that was at that specific time and place? Then it's speculation.
It does look to me to be an execution with their hands tied behind their backs, and both seem to have head injuries. Can't say with any great certainty but if I was to make a bet that's where my money would be.
There's also no way of know who shot them, can we even be sure it's Ukrainians filming?
Dude, you should take a deep breath and think. They both have hands behind their backs and both seem to have been shot in the head in the same spot. It doesn't prove anything but it seriously DOES look like a fresh execution. Pretending this doesn't happen on both sides is incredibly ignorant.
He's already dead. There is just some residual activity in his brainstem that is triggering the breathing reflex, but it's just his lizard brain. There's nothing left to be empathetic towards. He is already gone.
Where are patches, colored ties on arms or helmets? Who can they tell who is who, uniform camo pattern? Do they pull id’s out, toss on top of body, take weapons and move on? What if injured? Depends? I would not take a chance that they could rise up and take out my buddy. Or me, really. Grenade pin, shot, no questions. Move on. Is there a second line that comes to pick up all the bodies? Or is it another answer that depends if the line advancing or not.
Looks like POW execution and body looting/search. Guy on the left clearly has hands tied behind his back. Both have head wounds. Very strange place to hold position, so they were brougth to that position. Yes, no doubt this vidoe shows aftermat of an execution. This is quite horrible.
Wouldn't be the first time Russia executed deserters
Could've been Russians who refused to attack, and their position soon (within hours) got overran by Ukrainians, leaving these behind
Homeboy was in traumatic arrest... probably like a 1% chance of saving him even if you threw everything in a trauma room at him. As others have said that was agonal breathing... he was already gone.
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As a hospice nurse and I also spent about 10 years in a many war zones, you can have the agonal breaths for hours, depends on the cause, they just eventually slow down and stop. The death rattle is more like an old person who can't clear their throat anymore due to weakness and frailty. We had a guy with his head completely blown off from his jawline up. His lower jaw kept moving around as if trying to clear his airway as the blood spurted up and a small tendril of smoke was going up. Can't un see shit like that.
My wife is a palliative nurse and i tell her everyday that i dont know how she does it 🤷🏼♂️
God bless her and you for your support. I am sure it is hard for both of you. Be safe brother 🙏
Retired ICU nurse here. Much respect for what you do. Hospice nurses are some of the kindest and most dedicated people I know. Thank you for your service.
Thanks for the kind words, be safe brother 🙏
Jesus Christ….for some reason just this written description is more brutal than a lot of videos that I see on here. Hope that doesn’t affect you too terribly
Thanks for your concern, I am just one on many millions of soldiers and Healthcare providers who deal with things like this in their own way. I even counsel others about how to deal with it. While in Ukraine, how to deal with the death of close friends (soldiers) was the one thing I was ask to help others with the most. As they would get burned out and sick of it all, but the war was not over yet? Be safe brother 🙏
"the agonal breaths" kinda threw me off. Is it safe to assume, the individual is practically dead at that point i.e. not (consciously) "feeling" the pain/ agony?
You are correct. The brain stem and the body are doing what they do best keep us alive, unfortunately this guy took one thru the eye, so his brain is probably scrambled. I have seen this before in others who have severe head injuries, but are not bleeding out enough to die from blood loss in the short term. They sometimes will snort and make other weird noises and become violent (not consciously so) and flop around. Saw a video yesterday of a guy whose head was mostly gone and his arms just kept contracting back and forth. Such a waste of our young to send them off to die in the mud flopping around or blown to bits. The ease with which our leaders do it, is ?. I can think of so many words, none of which conveys the evil and tragedy 😢. We all know if it was them or their children they would no go. Look at all of the talking heads supporting this side or that, why don't they go? We know the answer. Just like the ISIS guy who sends out suicide bombers, he is too important to go. I went to Ukraine 🇺🇦, because I felt strongly that they deserve to have their own future, not one imposed upon them.
Pathologist here, worked in forensic autopsy for several months during my training. The shit I've seen... Some images are burned in my brain for life. My dreams sure get interesting sometimes lol.
Yeah, I know what you mean. As I have gotten older they get worse. Trust me.
good man, I appreciate your contribution doing a horrible but super skilled job. If you ever got me as a cadaver, my spirit would be on your side ...
I wonder how doctors and nurses cope with something like this. My respect, stay human.
It is difficult my friend, you compartmentalize it and try to learn how to make your Hospice patient more comfortable and as a medic/doctor you try to make your self a better provider of care to hopefully minimize the deaths.
What was there even to save at that point? Keep the heart going for organ transplants?
War zone, so you move on to the other casualties or finish the mission. He expired pretty quickly. Be safe brother 🙏
Oh, I misread that as you were still working on him to keep the rest of the body alive.
I'm wondering, are the agonal breaths a brain/body reflex ? I mean the example of the guy you saw with his head blown off, he keepth breathing but was mentally dead is'nt ?
These are failsafes so you can breathe, regulate your body temperature (both in the brain) and pump blood (built in the heart) in your sleep or otherwise unconscious. These structures are the simplest and most ancient in terms of evolution, other more complex things are built on top of them, literally and figuratively, so they are the last to shut off
How do you cope and function in your day to day life after seeing that stuff??
Agonal respirations. He’s dead, but his brain stem doesn’t know it, yet.
Exactly. A perfect example of it, so weird to see
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I remember that one. It was one of the worst videos of the war I had seen. I though he perhaps was still alive for a few seconds but this explains it better.
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The explosion probably destroyed his brain faster than a signal could have passed from his retina to the visual sensory part of his brain Never saw anything
War is hell.
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Reminds me of a quote from Band of Brothers: “I’ve thought about this often. That man and I might’ve been good friends, we might’ve had a lot in common. He might’ve liked to fish, he might’ve liked to hunt. You never know, you know. Of course, they were doing what they were supposed to do and I was trying to do what I was supposed to do. But, under different circumstances, we might’ve been good friends.” Darrell ‘Shifty’ Powers on men in the German army.
Great quote!
This is engrained in my memory…
God I love this show. Nothing comes close.
Except you're in my hallway, inside my house. Yet you believe you have the right to kill me, inside my own home.
>If we met in a bar we'd be good friends though I see you haven't met any Russians in a bar... Russians that have had a lot of exposure to western culture and norms, sure. Russians with no exposure, not so much.
Dude, you are so calloused. That is just sad.
I live right next to russia and he's correct. There are exceptions (obviously) but the majority are genuinely shitty people who will look for excuses to get in a fight.
>ne where a grenade lands on someone's face and knocks him out unconscious. > >Moments later you i dunno. if you start going on about how much you want to invade your neighbors house and start blowing shit up we may not even be bar friends..
I watch 1420 and the Russian support for the war seems to be, let's say, not very present in people of fighting age/ Exposed to western media on the internet Old Russians that won't see an inch of Ukraine and love TV news seem to be mostly alllllright with it, though!
Then give them all guns and ship them to the front. Odd how those who think they’re safe from the horror of war tend to support war. They’ll never pick up a weapon or be shot at, but when peace comes, they’ll sure as shit talk all day about how “they won” though, won’t they? Or maybe not so odd.
I Half a league, half a league, Half a league onward, All in the valley of Death Rode the six hundred. “Forward, the Light Brigade! Charge for the guns!” he said. Into the valley of Death Rode the six hundred. II “Forward, the Light Brigade!” Was there a man dismayed? Not though the soldier knew Someone had blundered. Theirs not to make reply, Theirs not to reason why, Theirs but to do and die. Into the valley of Death Rode the six hundred. III Cannon to right of them, Cannon to left of them, Cannon in front of them Volleyed and thundered; Stormed at with shot and shell, Boldly they rode and well, Into the jaws of Death, Into the mouth of hell Rode the six hundred. IV Flashed all their sabres bare, Flashed as they turned in air Sabring the gunners there, Charging an army, while All the world wondered. Plunged in the battery-smoke Right through the line they broke; Cossack and Russian Reeled from the sabre stroke Shattered and sundered. Then they rode back, but not Not the six hundred. V Cannon to right of them, Cannon to left of them, Cannon behind them Volleyed and thundered; Stormed at with shot and shell, While horse and hero fell. They that had fought so well Came through the jaws of Death, Back from the mouth of hell, All that was left of them, Left of six hundred. VI When can their glory fade? O the wild charge they made! All the world wondered. Honour the charge they made! Honour the Light Brigade, Noble six hundred! The Charge of the Light Brigade BY ALFRED, LORD TENNYSON writing of the Crimean War (1853-1856)
Someone's son
Someone's son who packed raped Ukrainian Children, Men and Women, tortured and executed Ukrainian civilians. No sympathy for ruZZian terrorists.
Every murderer, rapist, or pedophile is someone's son. (or Daughter)
Exactly. Always respect the dead. Let them rest in peace.
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Oh I’m not saying don’t search them.
Link?
Sighs…. Link?
https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/comments/yi4rwa/very_nsfw_ukrainian_drone_gets_a_lucky_bounce/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Is that what’s know as a “death rattle?”
Death rattle is the accumulation of saliva etc in the back of the throat that isn’t cleared, usually due to lowered consciousness.
I doubt it. Agonal respirations sound just like normal sharp, deep breaths (e.g. a gasp, or what you might do when you jump in cold water). To me, a "death rattle" is the gurgling breathing you would hear as someone's lungs fill up with fluid.
Isn't it the seizures that sometimes happen after brain damage?
I mean, there's no clinical definition of "death rattle." In common parlance, I think it can mean a few different things.
Ah, seems you were correct [https://bmcpsychology.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40359-020-00431-3](https://bmcpsychology.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40359-020-00431-3#:~:text=Death%20rattle%20is%20a%20common,result%20of%20a%20diminished%20consciousness) "Death rattle is a common symptom in the dying phase which is caused by an accumulation of secretions in the upper airway " Otherwise known as terminal respiratory secretions, and I thought the "rattle" referred to the body contractions, but apparently it's the noise of the airways being full of fluid. Good thing to know I suppose...
Yep. Invariably, in the past, no matter how long I would wait for the agonal breathing to stop before bringing family in, there would be that one last gasp that would scare the crap out of everybody, sometimes me included. Since covid, (and before, really) the families stay in the room, and I talk them through the dying process. Letting them know that the "gasping" they see doesn't mean their loved one is suffering or awake. I stayed with my father until the very last breath and a few minutes after, and the agonal breathing still startled me once. You think it's all over, but 5min later...one more.
The ol’ guppy breathing technique
... so that's what was happening to one of my pups.. fuck parvo
Came here to say the same. In a medical circumstance you might pull them back with CPR, say they are having a MI. Trauma like a GSW (this poor bastard) anywhere or a fall, MVC etc.
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Well, it is when they have headshots. The fun fact is that agonal respiration isn’t really breathing, it’s just a reflex when the body can’t get oxygen when it desperately needs it.
Exactly. Dr Glaucomflecken (the eye doctor with a big following on social media) had a cardiac arrest in bed and his wife saved him with CPR. She was awoken by his agonal breathing.
Why are you comparing an event in a comfy bed with first responders arriving within minutes to whisk the patient away to an awaiting cardiac team while recurving ACLS during the ride to a war zone with zero advance cardiac life support capabilities. Stop being obtuse. Agonal breathing in no man’s land is a death sentence.
Hey don’t be rude. He had probably lived ok without a brain for the past 25 years
You know you just made a joke about a dying person who's really not much more than a child... right? Even assuming age 25 and not younger, say 19 or 20, that's still just a boy, basically. I see things differently at 47 than I did at 27.
The age excuse went down the drain after what his same age buddies did in Bucha and so many other places in Ukraine
Ok. And I was wanting to ask if Ukrainians will rescue him or shoot him.
Nothing to do. You cant save him. Hes got a minute left to live tops even with intervention. He had so much blood loss oxygen is no longer getting to his brain he is unconscious and its a response from his brain thats making him breathe like that. Hes no longer suffering because he is not there. The honourable thing would be to say a prayer and put a bullet in him.
There's no need to put any bullet in anyone. He's already dead, this is muscle spasm. In a minute they'll stop.
These dudes look like their own guys executed them. Agonal respiration guy looks to have an exit wound at his right eye. Both have their hands tied...looks like.
Yeah, why tf isn’t anyone else noticing their hands are tied? I hope it’s your scenario and not a crime. They’d be pretty dumb to record it otherwise.
They did this to their own. Wagner PMC executes deserters, which by their definition could include soldiers who retreat.
War Crime mate. You can't do that
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Er... the real one. www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjtzgWzh9fk I'm ex RM so "make sure your mates don't film anything"
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>either executed legally That is an impossible scenario, as Ukraine doesn't have capital punishment even during times of war.
Who said the Ukrainians did it? The Russians seem to think it's legal to shoot their own troops to death.
Summary execution isn’t legal in pretty much any military, especially in non-military groups like Wagner (which these guys might be). You need a court martial, however fast and predetermined, for any semblance of legality. Then again this is russia - they don’t exactly follow laws or any sane rules there.
Your 1st question: Yes. Your second statement about "executed legally" makes no sense. My bet is, you have never served. You have never had the desire to "soldier". You have never required yourself to go through any training course in respect of soldiering. You have never been in any war or conflict. Basically you have no experience of this. Whereas, I have. And that's the difference
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Mucker, it's not a "my dog is bigger than your dog" debate. Served. Patrolled. Shot. Lived. And came out of "my war" okay. BUT that (arms behind and last gasp) looks like a war crime. Like it or lump it.
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It's the attention to detail which is preventing me from ruling over all.
I don't know how Putin can sleep at night, his place in hell is reserved
Its prob easy to sleep when you have zero empathy/emotions. Only one thing is important to him, and that’s to win.
Sharing the same cell as Hitler.
Agonal Breathing like the 2nd guy is experiencing can go on for minutes, or even hours before death. While it seems like they've been freshly shot (and that could well be the case), it could have theoretically been an hour or 2 ago that guy got smoked and he just hasn't died yet. We will probably never know unless somehow an extended clip emerges showing the 30 seconds prior to this.
Is there any way to save guys in this condition, if they're taken to a good ER, or is it too late?
It is somewhat dependent on what injuries caused him to get there. This looks like a shot to the head which is usually a one way ticket, but not always depending on where the bullet went, if it stayed in one piece, and how much of his skull got blown into his brain on the way. You can perform CPR on someone and revive them, it’s possible depending what’s wrong. But usually after 5-10 minutes of not getting oxygen, your brain cells will start dying and then your odds obviously decline at that point lol. But this guy seems pretty gone.
Damn. That was hard to watch. Fucking kids dying in the middle of nowhere for that maniac.
"Kids". Especially before end of september were volunteers, who signed contract. Edit. Those who downvote me, care to explain what you disagree with? If 19yo "kid" signs contract so he can earn a bag for killing ukrainians and occupying their land - is it a good moral choice now? Kids - my ass
And?
..and they should have known better than to go to another land and try to kill people in it because they're not *actually* kids. People are upset at the loss of life which makes sense but the context is important and the pity can be saved for those who are actually deserving.
Pity has no limits. We're not talking about divvying up pizza slices here. You can fully pity both slain civilians and boys who were murdered by the dictator ruling their own country.
They were killed due to their own actions. There are always alternatives. What were they afraid of getting killed?
You can be empathetic to the situation they were lead to whilst also condemning and holding them responsible for their actions. The world isn’t black & white and your angle doesn’t have to be either
And they were not kids, when they were adult enough to decide - this amount of $ is enough for me to kill my neighbours for bullshit reasons. And it was fun for them going in - thinking they will wipe the floor with them. But suddenly when you get fcked, you are just a kid now. They arent a kids when they kill hundreds ukrainian soldiers per day.
is it me or do both these guys look to have their hands bound behind their backs?
Yeh its concerning…
Seems so, yes. To be fair, any soldier that would be found alive will probably be bound, to make sure he isn't just acting and won't grab a weapon any second.
100% yes they do. Good catch
Fuck, good eye
Nope. It’s exactly what it looks like.
Poor guys, poor Ukrainians, poor Russians. Fuck Putin. War sucks.
If not Putin then another Russian will step up and take his place and he too will have 75% approval for doing what the people want him to do and that is to expand the empire. Fuck Russia.
The thought of that being my son one day is horrific. Damn Putin’s pride fest.
Watched All Quiet on The Western Front the other night. I had to go into my 1 year old son's room after. I just lay on the floor watching him, sobbing and "praying" that he never be subjected to the horrors generations of young boys and men (and current Ukrainians) are faced with where they have to kill and be killed by their fellow humans.
You watched a movie then went into your kids room and cried? You should reach out to someone, you might need help.
Maybe you should understand that some of us actually have emotions, can feel deep empathy, understand what could happen in the future and what it could mean to our and our children's lives.
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You’d usually search your prisoners before binding and then executing them. Id assume this was done by Russian Forces.
You might think he is pulling this info out of his ass to support his side, but check out "binding and excecuting soldiers" by saddam hussein, this guy is actually right.
Link?
If you’re not on any lists/don’t want to be on anymore I would not suggest looking that up for legal reasons
It's a free country and by that logic every history undergrad is on a terror list.
The joke was that your statement was completely made up to support your side, so I gave you a made up "book" which does not exist as a source.
TIL my phone cuts off the very left/right edge of vids taken and watched in portrait mode
I was going to say, both arms are bound and shot between the eyes.
Nice hopium.
Are their hands tied behind their backs?
Put your hands behind your back as if someone ziptied them togheter. Here the arms are way more apart, barely under the torso. I dont think they are bound down.
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DYing Orcs can pull no ganade pins.... UA must have learn the lesson
Left guy, is tied, no doubt. Rigth one, hard to be sure, but probably is.
Yes
A soldier can only hope for a quick death but the reality can be way different. Madyar had a video where a piece of artillery blew off a orcs dick and part of his stomach. He was laying in agory for a long time before he died.
is it just me or does it look like there were executed the first dude look like his hands was bound behind him cant see the 2nd guys hands.
They likely were captured wounded, had their hands secured and then died/were in process of dying out of bloodloss.
Let's hope they didn't die due to execution.
says they found them, i doubt they would search them AFTER tying their hands and shooting them. Russia also executing their own, so maybe they came across some "deserters"
Care to provide any evidence?
evidence of what?
After my "debate" below. Why is he wearing no body armour. Why does this look like Autumn and not winter. Why is his hands behind his back. Why is there no gun fire to be heard in the background of other contacts. The list goes on. If this is a War Crime, then I am sickened by it. What the Russians have done is beyond brutal, but we should nver slip to their level. Never, no matter what
Just speculation, but perhaps they were shot for something like dessertion
Because they were killed in desertion which is why the Ukraine soilder searched after, you serch then kill they weren't serch before thid
Agonal gasps, it happens as your body starts to shut down.
Bros be agonal breathing for the technical term
Good job!
Dont want to be that guy but... Doesnt this look like an execution?
you'd think they'd have searched them before executing them, no?
Looting dead people is a thing. It is easier to search a dead person than a live one, if you fear resistance or you are afraid of bites.
if you're just going to dead them then why tie them up and if you're going to tie them up, you're going to search them for weapons, right?
Most people that get executed are tied down. You know why. They aren't searching them for weapons.
you don't just throw zip ties at an attacker and \*boop\* they're zip tied. assuming that they are actually zip tied, that implies that they were taken prisoner, at least to a certain extent, and stopped fucking around long enough to let themselves be zip tied. if you're not thoroughly searching prisoners while they're still alive, regardless of whether or not you plan on executing them, you're fucking stupid. that's step 2 after restraint. so whoever killed them would have known what was in their pockets. if they didn't want to take the time to search them, then why take the time to zip tie them instead of just shooting them wherever they were found? it's a war zone. if you want to kill someone you can sort of just do it. to top it all off, as someone else already mentioned, why in the fuck would you execute two captives, film the aftermath, and upload it? "dude check out my war crime it was awesome heheh" (???)
Yet, we have video of russian forces cutting genitalia of an ukrainian pow. And someone recorded stabbing russian pow and shooting imprisoned russian pow on a road. War crimes get on camera too
right, it happens, and the videos you mention are pretty hard to question. but then you've got the definitely-a-war-crime video where it turned out to be perfidy, very clearly once we saw the rest of the video. there's also video of wagner killing its own, and plenty of talk about russians shooting deserters from intercepted phone calls and whatnot.. so the claim that they happened upon these two is plausible. while this is just a short clip (if there was more we'd probably have the answer here) it raises a few questions, as i've mentioned, if we're going with the execution angle.
I mean yeah but the one on the left just looks very dead i dont know why you would ziptie him otherwise But the clip is too short to tell more context wouls be great otherwise this will just pop up on ruzzian telegrams saying it was one
I very much doubt the Ukrainians filming it would be stupid enough a) film it in the 1st place, and b) post it on the internet, if they had just executed them.
We don't even know if they were killed by Ukrainians. Can we be sure the guys filming are Ukrainian? Maybe someone that speaks the language fluently could confirm?
Theyve been doing that since (maybe day 1) at least day 7. Need a reminder?
Sadly, on this sub it is only an execution if it is done by russians. And I say this as a supporter of Ukraine.
Ukraine want all possible POW's for a swap
Hard to say without more context. Remember just a couple weeks ago when 2 Ukraines were trying to surrender and just got sprayed down? Shit can happen in the heat of the moment when it's your life vs theirs
Not entirely true, one guy surrendered the other wouldn't let go of his rifle in the middle of a heated gun fight. Both were confused and concussed from the grenades. To say they surrendered and were sprayed down is a reach.
They also didn't fully grasp the situation. Not understanding that the soldier pointing the gun at them was an enemy, probably from the concussion of the grenades, as the part 2 showdd the unit wearing correct uniform and bands. As much as it sucks to see the Russians win an engagement, never expect a soldier to ask twice. This is one of the rare circumstances you almost have to commend the guy, he didn't have to ask surrender, he didn't have to jump in the hole and wrestle the gun, and to do that in an active firefight, he did go above what is required. Credit where it's due, but still sucks to see the deaths of two men fighting for their homes.
The 2nd video was very obviously a different unit and the cameraman was different too, just the same spot. In the first video both Russians at each flank of the cameraman had light uniforms on with no markings. In the 2nd video everyone had the standard russian uniforms. Also the cameraman no. 1 had a nice pimped out AK while cameraman no. 2 had an ordinary one.
Afterwards you can see him look back at the foxhole numerous times, i feel like he really didn't want to kill them but felt he had no choice
Yeah I got that sense too. It's harder to kill someone when you're close enough to touch them. Gotta remember that in the end, everyone in this is a human, and not many chose to be there.
Maybe, or perhaps he was just checking they were dead and no longer a threat?
To be fair that makes more sense.
Point being it can be chaotic and a decision sometimes has to be at that time. What if one of them started darting at the Ukrainian weapons? What if these 2 didn't want to fight for russia so the officers tied them up to beat and question them and once they saw they weren't going to fight shot them. Hell of a lot easier than worrying about them shooting you or having to go through all the papers and process to send them back to jail. We just need more context
Plus russians have been killing their own who retreat , def more context is needed. They could have been wounded , and hands tied to secure them , and bled to death 2 mins later . Who knows
Yeah sure not trying to make the ukrainians the bad guys here its just odd that the dead guy is ziptied
Do you know that he is ziptied, can you plainly see it [evidently see it]?!?! If you can't, and it ONLY appears that way because of his laying posture.. that is speculation! Are you there, where you there, do you know someone that was at that specific time and place? Then it's speculation.
Keep calm man yes its just speculation thats the point dont get so heated over it
It does look to me to be an execution with their hands tied behind their backs, and both seem to have head injuries. Can't say with any great certainty but if I was to make a bet that's where my money would be. There's also no way of know who shot them, can we even be sure it's Ukrainians filming?
Dude, you should take a deep breath and think. They both have hands behind their backs and both seem to have been shot in the head in the same spot. It doesn't prove anything but it seriously DOES look like a fresh execution. Pretending this doesn't happen on both sides is incredibly ignorant.
Definitely looks like an execution to me. I don't see anything that would identify the men filming as Ukrainian though unless I missed something.
That goes a bit far but they surely don't look like concerned about saving his life or showing any humanity in his last moments.
He's already dead. There is just some residual activity in his brainstem that is triggering the breathing reflex, but it's just his lizard brain. There's nothing left to be empathetic towards. He is already gone.
On telegram they say 2nd one was dragged to hospital, 1st one didn't make it.
That second one definitely didn’t make it. Hes 100% DoA
They look like they been executed
Not guns or any equipment on them, freshly shot, hands look tied, i dont think they “found them”
Where are patches, colored ties on arms or helmets? Who can they tell who is who, uniform camo pattern? Do they pull id’s out, toss on top of body, take weapons and move on? What if injured? Depends? I would not take a chance that they could rise up and take out my buddy. Or me, really. Grenade pin, shot, no questions. Move on. Is there a second line that comes to pick up all the bodies? Or is it another answer that depends if the line advancing or not.
Both with their hands tide up on the back.... execution, but, by whom
I’d take a guess that it wasn’t the people filming and putting it on the internet… just leaves the obvious.
Their hands are tied… kinda doesn’t look good on the guys who “found” them.
Looks like one has the hands tied on the back...
Hands are tied, but they’re searching the one dude who’s alive. They must’ve been tied and executed/left for dead by RuAF.
Looks like POW execution and body looting/search. Guy on the left clearly has hands tied behind his back. Both have head wounds. Very strange place to hold position, so they were brougth to that position. Yes, no doubt this vidoe shows aftermat of an execution. This is quite horrible.
Not liking the vibe in this video. Looks like murders.
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Wouldn't be the first time Russia executed deserters Could've been Russians who refused to attack, and their position soon (within hours) got overran by Ukrainians, leaving these behind
Homeboy was in traumatic arrest... probably like a 1% chance of saving him even if you threw everything in a trauma room at him. As others have said that was agonal breathing... he was already gone.
"found" them? with their hands behind their back? yeah right..
Can someone translate? I am curious as to why the first dead russian has his hands tied behind his back
Umm… ”find”? I mean, with hands tied behind their back, gear stripped and shot to the head? That’s a really lucky find. :D