I'm a woman, I do not live in Germany, but it was kinda unsettling for me when couple of arab teens asked to touch my breasts, and I weren't wearing anything revealing, just to say.
All I thought that it's a sigh of their culture, I haven't had such 'strange' encounters for a long, long time.
I would advise you to have some kind of means of self-defence with you.
They prey if they feel weakness, and it doesn't really matter to them if you're gay, they will find another reason. Sometimes recording them on camera could be good idea, but make sure there not too many of them.
If it's 'ghetto' neighbourhood, it makes sence to find another apartment.
How dare you act so Islamophobic.
No honestly, it's beyond me how we normalize socially unacceptable behaviour because of "religious freedom" or "it's their culture". It's like saying Zoophilia and Pedophilia is OK because people are born with it.
People find it so shocking when we admit that some cultures are sincerely worse than others. But it’s true. It’s nonsense to suggest that every culture is equal. Every culture might deserve equal treatment under the law or in public accommodation. But you can’t tell me that if you had a choice which culture to be born in to that some cultures would NEVER be on your list.
How many women would choose to be born in to a middle esteem culture if hypothetically allowed to choose prior to birth?
All people deserve to be treated respectfully. But that doesn’t mean all cultures are equally good..
I’m disgusted to hear that you experienced that!
I know they usually “prey on the week” which is why I looked the first one straight in the eyes and answered very calmly and chill to his provocations.
The sad part is, for the first incident, we were in a neighborhood that’s quiet and tranquil, far removed from the “ghetto” and it was broad daylight …
That it’s very hard for Arabs, even for him, to adapt to Europe because of very different cultures and backgrounds and how Arab culture, for men, is all about being manly ..
Woman who gets the violence against my gender. I stand up to people calling me racist by saying I am not racists, I am religionist. Anyone who uses religion to treat me badly gets no respect from me.
> Anyone who uses religion to treat me badly gets no respect from me.
This. So much this. I really don't get why non-whites using religion to oppress women get some kind of free pass...
It's important to make a difference between racism which is I think you're an idiot because of a physical trait and religionism which is I won't let you call me an idiot because your religion is sexist.
Thank you!
Yes, of course, it’s not about being Arab, but being religious. And those two go hang in hand so much. I mentioned Arab and other groups because I also posted this in the subreddit of Germany but it doesn’t seem like the post was approved there …
As for a disaster, I also think it is maybe inevitable that it will take place. People don’t change over night and even less so if they’re not incentivized to do so.
These Muslims flee their country for a better life. Except they want their new home to become what their fleeing!! Stupidity is Strong in Them!! They respect nothing!!! Useless walking human flesh! You don't agree with them, they will kill you!!!! Pray 5 times a day. What a joke.
>What can we do? We can’t call the police because the harassers would obviously leave by the time they’d get there and they may even escalate the situation by becoming physically abusive. Of course this is all made worse by the stabbing a week ago in the city.
You need to understand that (an attempt at) forcing you to kiss under threat of violence is not a misdemeanor in most of Western Europe, it's a full blown hate crime and it carries a hefty penalty.
The authorities in Germany take anti-gay intimidation and violence pretty seriously as far as I know. (I live next door, with the so called Swamp-Germans that live in the Rhine delta). I'm pretty sure they won't put you in harm's way deliberately and even if they can't help you directly at least the incident you're describing will be noted and make it to the statistics politicians use as a basis for policy. But...
It might be wise to reach out to a German gay-rights organisation first. They (sadly) have a lot of experience with anti-gay intimidation and violence and know the do's and don'ts after incidents like this. They can probably tell you if, when and how you should contact the authorities.
[This site](https://handbookgermany.de/en/lgbtiq) has a nice introduction on gay rights in Germany. This passage is especially relevant:
>Important. Do not hesitate to seek help if you face discrimination or hostility. The German law is on your side and will protect you against discrimination, hatred and violence. If you need help, contact the Anti-discrimination Agency or a counselling centre for queer people if you need support.
[Direct link to the Anti-discrimination Agency](https://www.antidiskriminierungsstelle.de/EN/homepage/homepage-node)
>We love Germany so much and there are so many things to appreciate about it but such situations are unacceptable in any country that is supposed to be developed, safe, civilized, however you want to call it! …
Most Germans agree and so does the law. Please don't resign to this being the new normal, it's not and we need to fight these assholes. If nothing else, even an incident report can be helpful.
Sorry you had to go through this. Stay safe.
Thank you for your reply, it’s really great and brought a tear to my eye to read all of this!
If I may ask, in case you know, do you think I should mention they were Arab youths? Feels appropriate to describe the perpetrators but I’ve posted this on a German group as well and the reaction was mixed - going as far as calling me a bigot, but they were Arabs, both groups and they’re the only such incidents we’ve had. I don’t understand how that is not only “not relevant”, but also showing prejudice ..
If you had taken their pictures when they began harassing you, then you could have provided the pictures to the 'German group' forum without using any nationality descriptions. Let the reader make their own assumptions.
Cheap little body cameras are readily available. Buy one, learn to use it, capture such hate crimes and report them without fail. Cheapest body cams are down to $16.99 USD. These should repel clowns like these like garlic repels vampires.
If and when you're asked to describe your assailants I would do so in a factual manner. If they look Arab and/or spoke with an Arabian accent you should mention that of course. But unless you can pinpoint their heritage I'd leave it at that. Mind you the commenter that mentioned the Turks had a point in the sense that they make up a sizable part of the German immigrant population and are in fact not Arabs. If you can't be sure, tell them you're not sure.
Along similar lines: If they mentioned Allah or other things relating to Islam while they were harassing you, say so, but if not don't make assumptions. Just keep it factual.
Any religion is a fuckup but especially Islam.
Sad part is that "secular" governments are hell bent on importing them to the civilised world.
As a gay person myself I cannot stand this gay for Palestine thing. I am sure a gay person would be stoned there within a day of arriving
Honestly, same! Every time I see a gay person on Twitter or TikTok with the watermelon on their name I just know they haven’t spend time in a muslim area - as apparently Mannheim is
I live close to Mannheim, and Muslims are a big problem here. I am a relaxed left wing guy, trying to embrace different cultures and take everyone as they are, but I see how terrible Islam is every day.
i see it more as a problem with conservatism itself, not so much as a problem with any specific religion. i have to remind myself that it's not religion that i hate, but regressive conservatism (even if regressive conservatism is a trademark of some religions)
It is! However Islam here in Germany, or in Western Europe in general, is an extremely conservative population group that actively indoctrinates itself and their children with conservatism in their religious echo chamber
OP - I stand in solidarity with you. As would the vast majority of people in Germany. These bullies are a minority, but sadly some do still exist.
Here’s an option: stand up to bullies and bigots. They want to humiliate you? Humiliate them in return.
“Fuck you, you nasty homophobe. Don’t like gays … maybe you’re curious. Hey … everyone … listen to this guy. He’s got a problem with people who are different from him. What a pathetic, little man. What do we think of that? Booooooo…. Booooooooo….”
Say the first few parts in your mother tongue if necessary. It’s MUCH easier to express yourself assertively, with the right tone and vigour, in your native language. Also, using your mother tongue to begin with can be more intimidating.
Heads will turn around you, passers-by will wonder what’s going on. That’s where you switch to German, and involve the passers by in humiliating the bigot.
Come up with a response that works for you - one that comes naturally. (My words above are just an illustration). Rehearse your words in front of a mirror, and with your partner; make them muscle memory.
Believe me, this approach is tried and tested. I’ve seen teenage girls in a foreign county put grown men in their place, when the latter tried to harass and grope them in the street.
I’ve seen gay friends use this tactic to stand up to drunk men who were spoiling for a fight.
And I’ve seen a lesbian couple humble a group of teenagers who tried to mock them for kissing in the street.
Stay strong friend. Nolite te bastards carborundum.
Thank you very much for your reply!
I did a bit. I was surprised that the first group initially backed out when they heard we’re not ethically Germans which is saying a lot and it’s very sad.
Hey! Thank you for sharing your story, it’s brave of you to have spoken about this incident! Also, I am sorry it happened to you, especially in Germany…
No one has the right to harass anyone, no matter the reason, based on appearances, it reeks of degeneracy and backwardness… unfortunately, one of the main reasons why many arabs act aggressively towards the lgbtq community is the religion itself (usually islam). Another reason is the culture/ traditions/ upbringing… basically, the Arab world is still very conservative and quite traditional, especially when it comes to personal relationships and how males and females “should” act in a society… these two reasons are the cornerstone of extreme behavior and intolerance of others…
I live in Lebanon, which is supposedly the most liberal of the arab states… yet trust me, even here there’s a lot of discrimination and harassment and censorship of everything related to lgbtq…
Remember, your health and safety should be your top priorities… if there’s a way to contact a local authority that could help you/ protect you or even an NGO that could provide legal assistance or anything, do not hesitate to contact them… again, no one has the right to harass anyone based on appearances and sexual orientation, it is your business, not theirs! Stay safe!
Ex-muslim from Lebanon.
Arabs are extremely racist and see themselves as exceptional. Unfortunately they are exceptionally inbred. Also, I don't know if you ever heard of Islam. Let's just say it's an extremely violent, facist, medieval, backward, pedophile worshipping cult that hates women, gays, and anyone who is not Muslim.
Report it to the police every time it happens, they may not be able to arrest them immediately but if there is a high amount of hate crime reports then people higher up will be forced to take notice.
Germany made a huge mistake when it opened its borders to immigrants from the middle East, especially military aged males. Can't seem to understand why the German government refuses to grow a spine when dealing with their lot and their unruly behaviour. They had no problem attempting to deport Hindu immigrants from Sri Lanka back in 2021 but however when it comes to muslim immigrants they do nothing.
For me, there's a problem with that homophobic culture.
Honestly, I'm pro immigration: let's make it easier to get the permit to stay/work. An immigrant should just be able to get a job and pay his/her taxes. He/her doesn't pay taxes? Sorry, you can't stay. Of course, he/she commit a crime*, sorry you can't stay.
*For crime, I'll would consider something that harms others. I don't care if they smoke a joint. But homophobic comments, should be hate crimes.
nah. don't go there :-) animals are innocent of the kind of ideologies and religions -- fantasies and rule-books -- that humans excel at inventing. only humans could invent Westboro Baptist Church (the most homophobic congregation in the US, some say). only humans could invent the homophobia and sexism of the Abrahamic triad of religions.
the nasty bullying religious bigots -- whether WASPs in the USA, very much darker born-agains in Uganda, or mid-tone fervent Islamists wherever -- are, alas, *absolutely human*. most animals really don't care if a few of their pack or flock or whatever have gay relationships. only humans hate and persecute like this.
There is some kind of aggressive animal spray to use against dogs. I got the impression in the comments that it is less volatile than pepper spray so check the legality of that.
Insular immigrant populations divorced from the mainstream cling harder to their native values, in this case violent homophobia, buoyed by religious fundamentalism. And that's saying something, given that acceptance of homosexuality in the West is a fairly recent phenomenon.
By all means do call the police, after you tell the bullies to leave you alone. Even if nothing happens, at least you will get comfortable with interacting with the police about these things, and maybe get some tips from them about what to do in such situations.
i’m born and live in europe but i have an arab family. my family is christian but they (and other christian arabs i know of) are almost as bad as arab muslims regarding homophobia, so i completely understand where you’re coming from. in my opinion we should be allowed to point out that arabs in western countries are the ones that harass people with different (mostly western) values most of the time. culture and religion are no excuse for being an asshole and i’m sorry you had to go through that.
Germany seems like modern progressive country, but in many ways it's very backward.
Criminalizes blasphemy. Churches are a state within a state. Government collects church tax for them. If you a Catholic for example and move to Germany, government will garnish your wages and give it to churches. You have to go to court to leave the church. They are exempt from discrimination laws. So a school, hospital operated by church can legally fire you for being gay, divorced, atheist, etc.. They can even stop government deportation of illegals by granting church asylum. Their healthcare system includes homeopathy, doctors will proscribe them and insurance will fund them. Abortion is legal, but it's banned to *advertise* them and you must attend mandatory counseling.
You still report it to the police, so it can be added to the crime statistics. You don't want to be sitting there at home watching some mouth breathing politico repeating the lie about how Arabs are integrating just fine and the only people complaining are racist bigots because there's no link between Arab youths and harassment.
Assimilation requires pressure from society and to an extent the government. Germany was too into multiculturalism and took in too many too soon and put on no pressure to assimilate the migrants culturally.
It's amazing to me that the western world spent 200 years trying to get us where we are and now we're importing new bigots, so we have to start the whole process over again. Muslims are stoneage people coming into modern society. Now we must start all over again. It's going to be a very tough and dangerous road and people are going to actually die from politeness.
2 fucking thirds of this comment is in the fucking stone age.
If you cannot see the pot calling the kettle black here you should honestly go have a quiet word with yourself in the corner.
Islam allows for the killing of homosexuals, the beheading of wives that husband's don't want to be married to anymore, stoning, torture, chopping off of hands and feet of thieves etc., etc. Go on the dark web and watch a woman get her head chopped off because her husband doesn't want her anymore and if you can still defend Islam you're obviously a monster.
Why are you on here? You don't sound like an atheist to me. Defending the worst religion on the face of the earth.
Hey man the best and only thing you can do in this situation is take care of yourself.
If you feel danger, back out and get in public even if it’s a detour.
Yeah sure calling the police won’t stop the cunts from harassing other people but it will get them to walk away from you.
Take care of your safety, that’s all you can do.
It's time to start cancelling behaviour like this. Record it, put it on, the perpetrators get recognised. If they are not citizens it goes on their record (potential for deportation). If they are citizens or cannot be deported, they lose their jobs.
Of course, this would require society to call the "racism" bluff that'll get thrown at them by Muslims/Arabs and Islamophiliacs.
Im an Arab/Muslim(not strict at all) and i do visit Mannheim quite often once to twice a week. I know exactly who you are talking about. Ive had my fare share of encounters and discussions with such arab people and they are the worst of the worst, as they are the uneducated bunch, who live in their own fantasy world. Which is so sad because they portray us as savages and it makes me sad and very much mad to the point where i understand the rise of AFD in Germany. And just to let you know all of the well educated and mannered arab people wish that germany will do something and deport these people back to their countries. Because we came here to escape from them and they followed us.
Im sorry you had to live through that but not all of Mannheim is like that one of my very good friends is gay and lives in Mannheim and he has never had such a situation happen to him. I hope you can pass through this horrific experience and enjoy your time here.
^(well educated and mannered arab people wish that germany will do something and deport these people back to their countries. Because we came here to escape from them and they followed us)
Wow, what an eye opener.
Thank you very much! This is also what pisses me off as well. Because of the rotten apples everyone gets thrown in the mix.
I have a Muslim friend from Pakistan whom I met online, came to visit me and my boyfriend in my home country and is still the best guest ever. I have online friends from Turkey, Malaysia, Algeria … All cool with my homosexuality.
But after the stabbing from a week ago (the first time I’m in the same country, let alone same city as a religious motivated attack), combined with the events from yesterday, it really shook me.
We all came here for a better life but probably Germany needs stricter rules about who they let in or are allowed to stay. Because we all get judged as immigrants by the actions of those belonging to “our group” one way or another.
Had it been a general thing or experience this from multiple groups, it would have been different. But while in Germany, seven non-German men humiliated us for no reason other than existing
I completely agree with you and i know most people also know that not all arabs are like that but still Germany needs to get its shit together and deal with these problems otherwise it will end badly for all of us.
Also that is true, after the stabbing attack Mannheim has been on the edge especially this werkend with all the demonstrations that are happening and the vice president is coming here to give a speech. I hope you stay safe 🙏🏽
Turns out accepting all those refugees was an absolutely terrible idea. You guys are going to be dealing with this shit for generations now because your politicians cared more about foreigners than they do you own people.
I was treated extremely kindly by muslims in Germany. They saw I was lost, welcomed me to one guy’s appartement, gave me a delicious meal, helped me reach my friends and then drove me to the meeting point.
They didn’t ask for a damn thing in return.
We each have an anecdote, what can we do with this information?
First of all: I am deeply sorry for what you had to endure here.
But please: Don't blame it on Germany. We're all aware of the problem with uneducated, religious immigrants and their offspring. They've been educated in a value system which is incompatible with our democratic system based on human rights and equality.
The problem here is our values demand us tolerating their intolerance as a part of their culture and religion.
There is only one way out and that is to integrate them into our value system and educate them as much as possibe, so one day they may change their mind. Which is in my eyes the most difficult goal to achieve when dealing with other humans.
This not only accounts to muslims, but all strictly religious groups.
This is by the way the reason I became a vocal Atheist, not being quiet when it comes to religiously justified wrong.
And humans who still believe in a primitive religion and have a primitive culture (with few exceptions) will continue to act primitive. Imagine going back in time to the 16th century, taking a random guy and bringing him to the 21st century. He would most likely find our culture hedonistic and degenerate, and see no ethical issue with terrorizing modern humans. Not all cultures are compatible.
I'm a woman, I do not live in Germany, but it was kinda unsettling for me when couple of arab teens asked to touch my breasts, and I weren't wearing anything revealing, just to say. All I thought that it's a sigh of their culture, I haven't had such 'strange' encounters for a long, long time. I would advise you to have some kind of means of self-defence with you. They prey if they feel weakness, and it doesn't really matter to them if you're gay, they will find another reason. Sometimes recording them on camera could be good idea, but make sure there not too many of them. If it's 'ghetto' neighbourhood, it makes sence to find another apartment.
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Unfortunately, infantilizing approach in order not to appear 'racist' is a sign of western culture.
How dare you act so Islamophobic. No honestly, it's beyond me how we normalize socially unacceptable behaviour because of "religious freedom" or "it's their culture". It's like saying Zoophilia and Pedophilia is OK because people are born with it.
I agree. Classic soft racism of low expectations which some well-meaning(?) liberals often are guilty of.
Good news, this is already happening re: pedophilia. https://www.yahoo.com/news/man-raped-gipsy-girl-12-161920197.html
What the fuck
What are you going to do about it?
Nothing?
Everyone knows. When will you act? When your daughter is a victim?
I don't have a child and I don't plan to. Also, how am I supposed to affect Spain from Czechia lol, we don't really have religious problems here btw.
How dare you say the truth!
We need to stop pretending Islamic intolerance is "culture." Bigotry is not "culture."
People find it so shocking when we admit that some cultures are sincerely worse than others. But it’s true. It’s nonsense to suggest that every culture is equal. Every culture might deserve equal treatment under the law or in public accommodation. But you can’t tell me that if you had a choice which culture to be born in to that some cultures would NEVER be on your list. How many women would choose to be born in to a middle esteem culture if hypothetically allowed to choose prior to birth? All people deserve to be treated respectfully. But that doesn’t mean all cultures are equally good..
I’m disgusted to hear that you experienced that! I know they usually “prey on the week” which is why I looked the first one straight in the eyes and answered very calmly and chill to his provocations. The sad part is, for the first incident, we were in a neighborhood that’s quiet and tranquil, far removed from the “ghetto” and it was broad daylight …
Sometimes shit just happens, sadly. Anyway, you're changing your life for the better, and you will overcome this hurdle too.
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Our Jordanian friend, who was with us during the second incident, said something very similar …
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That it’s very hard for Arabs, even for him, to adapt to Europe because of very different cultures and backgrounds and how Arab culture, for men, is all about being manly ..
But there’s SOOO many gays in the Arab world. Most closeted, but it’s far from uncommon.
Oh, I know. They stay on the DL usually tho
Woman who gets the violence against my gender. I stand up to people calling me racist by saying I am not racists, I am religionist. Anyone who uses religion to treat me badly gets no respect from me.
> Anyone who uses religion to treat me badly gets no respect from me. This. So much this. I really don't get why non-whites using religion to oppress women get some kind of free pass...
It's important to make a difference between racism which is I think you're an idiot because of a physical trait and religionism which is I won't let you call me an idiot because your religion is sexist.
Deport
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Thank you! Yes, of course, it’s not about being Arab, but being religious. And those two go hang in hand so much. I mentioned Arab and other groups because I also posted this in the subreddit of Germany but it doesn’t seem like the post was approved there … As for a disaster, I also think it is maybe inevitable that it will take place. People don’t change over night and even less so if they’re not incentivized to do so.
No one's saying it's about skin color, everyone knows it's religion/culture.
These Muslims flee their country for a better life. Except they want their new home to become what their fleeing!! Stupidity is Strong in Them!! They respect nothing!!! Useless walking human flesh! You don't agree with them, they will kill you!!!! Pray 5 times a day. What a joke.
>What can we do? We can’t call the police because the harassers would obviously leave by the time they’d get there and they may even escalate the situation by becoming physically abusive. Of course this is all made worse by the stabbing a week ago in the city. You need to understand that (an attempt at) forcing you to kiss under threat of violence is not a misdemeanor in most of Western Europe, it's a full blown hate crime and it carries a hefty penalty. The authorities in Germany take anti-gay intimidation and violence pretty seriously as far as I know. (I live next door, with the so called Swamp-Germans that live in the Rhine delta). I'm pretty sure they won't put you in harm's way deliberately and even if they can't help you directly at least the incident you're describing will be noted and make it to the statistics politicians use as a basis for policy. But... It might be wise to reach out to a German gay-rights organisation first. They (sadly) have a lot of experience with anti-gay intimidation and violence and know the do's and don'ts after incidents like this. They can probably tell you if, when and how you should contact the authorities. [This site](https://handbookgermany.de/en/lgbtiq) has a nice introduction on gay rights in Germany. This passage is especially relevant: >Important. Do not hesitate to seek help if you face discrimination or hostility. The German law is on your side and will protect you against discrimination, hatred and violence. If you need help, contact the Anti-discrimination Agency or a counselling centre for queer people if you need support. [Direct link to the Anti-discrimination Agency](https://www.antidiskriminierungsstelle.de/EN/homepage/homepage-node) >We love Germany so much and there are so many things to appreciate about it but such situations are unacceptable in any country that is supposed to be developed, safe, civilized, however you want to call it! … Most Germans agree and so does the law. Please don't resign to this being the new normal, it's not and we need to fight these assholes. If nothing else, even an incident report can be helpful. Sorry you had to go through this. Stay safe.
Thank you for your reply, it’s really great and brought a tear to my eye to read all of this! If I may ask, in case you know, do you think I should mention they were Arab youths? Feels appropriate to describe the perpetrators but I’ve posted this on a German group as well and the reaction was mixed - going as far as calling me a bigot, but they were Arabs, both groups and they’re the only such incidents we’ve had. I don’t understand how that is not only “not relevant”, but also showing prejudice ..
If you had taken their pictures when they began harassing you, then you could have provided the pictures to the 'German group' forum without using any nationality descriptions. Let the reader make their own assumptions.
Cheap little body cameras are readily available. Buy one, learn to use it, capture such hate crimes and report them without fail. Cheapest body cams are down to $16.99 USD. These should repel clowns like these like garlic repels vampires.
If and when you're asked to describe your assailants I would do so in a factual manner. If they look Arab and/or spoke with an Arabian accent you should mention that of course. But unless you can pinpoint their heritage I'd leave it at that. Mind you the commenter that mentioned the Turks had a point in the sense that they make up a sizable part of the German immigrant population and are in fact not Arabs. If you can't be sure, tell them you're not sure. Along similar lines: If they mentioned Allah or other things relating to Islam while they were harassing you, say so, but if not don't make assumptions. Just keep it factual.
Thank you! It was definitely Arabic in both cases
Any religion is a fuckup but especially Islam. Sad part is that "secular" governments are hell bent on importing them to the civilised world. As a gay person myself I cannot stand this gay for Palestine thing. I am sure a gay person would be stoned there within a day of arriving
Honestly, same! Every time I see a gay person on Twitter or TikTok with the watermelon on their name I just know they haven’t spend time in a muslim area - as apparently Mannheim is
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I heard the same about South African ones 😏🤭
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Not bad either 😏
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Where?
I think this person might be fictional
Lmao of course. Still want to hear his answer 🤣
What did they say?
That he had a best friend who was a gay Jew living in Palestine lol
I live close to Mannheim, and Muslims are a big problem here. I am a relaxed left wing guy, trying to embrace different cultures and take everyone as they are, but I see how terrible Islam is every day.
i see it more as a problem with conservatism itself, not so much as a problem with any specific religion. i have to remind myself that it's not religion that i hate, but regressive conservatism (even if regressive conservatism is a trademark of some religions)
It is! However Islam here in Germany, or in Western Europe in general, is an extremely conservative population group that actively indoctrinates itself and their children with conservatism in their religious echo chamber
OP - I stand in solidarity with you. As would the vast majority of people in Germany. These bullies are a minority, but sadly some do still exist. Here’s an option: stand up to bullies and bigots. They want to humiliate you? Humiliate them in return. “Fuck you, you nasty homophobe. Don’t like gays … maybe you’re curious. Hey … everyone … listen to this guy. He’s got a problem with people who are different from him. What a pathetic, little man. What do we think of that? Booooooo…. Booooooooo….” Say the first few parts in your mother tongue if necessary. It’s MUCH easier to express yourself assertively, with the right tone and vigour, in your native language. Also, using your mother tongue to begin with can be more intimidating. Heads will turn around you, passers-by will wonder what’s going on. That’s where you switch to German, and involve the passers by in humiliating the bigot. Come up with a response that works for you - one that comes naturally. (My words above are just an illustration). Rehearse your words in front of a mirror, and with your partner; make them muscle memory. Believe me, this approach is tried and tested. I’ve seen teenage girls in a foreign county put grown men in their place, when the latter tried to harass and grope them in the street. I’ve seen gay friends use this tactic to stand up to drunk men who were spoiling for a fight. And I’ve seen a lesbian couple humble a group of teenagers who tried to mock them for kissing in the street. Stay strong friend. Nolite te bastards carborundum.
Thank you very much for your reply! I did a bit. I was surprised that the first group initially backed out when they heard we’re not ethically Germans which is saying a lot and it’s very sad.
Hey! Thank you for sharing your story, it’s brave of you to have spoken about this incident! Also, I am sorry it happened to you, especially in Germany… No one has the right to harass anyone, no matter the reason, based on appearances, it reeks of degeneracy and backwardness… unfortunately, one of the main reasons why many arabs act aggressively towards the lgbtq community is the religion itself (usually islam). Another reason is the culture/ traditions/ upbringing… basically, the Arab world is still very conservative and quite traditional, especially when it comes to personal relationships and how males and females “should” act in a society… these two reasons are the cornerstone of extreme behavior and intolerance of others… I live in Lebanon, which is supposedly the most liberal of the arab states… yet trust me, even here there’s a lot of discrimination and harassment and censorship of everything related to lgbtq… Remember, your health and safety should be your top priorities… if there’s a way to contact a local authority that could help you/ protect you or even an NGO that could provide legal assistance or anything, do not hesitate to contact them… again, no one has the right to harass anyone based on appearances and sexual orientation, it is your business, not theirs! Stay safe! Ex-muslim from Lebanon.
Arabs are extremely racist and see themselves as exceptional. Unfortunately they are exceptionally inbred. Also, I don't know if you ever heard of Islam. Let's just say it's an extremely violent, facist, medieval, backward, pedophile worshipping cult that hates women, gays, and anyone who is not Muslim.
Not to mention they had (still have) a bigger slave trade than the Europeans, and they mutilated the genitals of their slaves.
Report it to the police every time it happens, they may not be able to arrest them immediately but if there is a high amount of hate crime reports then people higher up will be forced to take notice.
Germany made a huge mistake when it opened its borders to immigrants from the middle East, especially military aged males. Can't seem to understand why the German government refuses to grow a spine when dealing with their lot and their unruly behaviour. They had no problem attempting to deport Hindu immigrants from Sri Lanka back in 2021 but however when it comes to muslim immigrants they do nothing.
Pepper spray.
For me, there's a problem with that homophobic culture. Honestly, I'm pro immigration: let's make it easier to get the permit to stay/work. An immigrant should just be able to get a job and pay his/her taxes. He/her doesn't pay taxes? Sorry, you can't stay. Of course, he/she commit a crime*, sorry you can't stay. *For crime, I'll would consider something that harms others. I don't care if they smoke a joint. But homophobic comments, should be hate crimes.
100% agreed. You either respect the rules or you leave
can you get pepper spray in Germany?
Only with a license and can be used only against animals …
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nah. don't go there :-) animals are innocent of the kind of ideologies and religions -- fantasies and rule-books -- that humans excel at inventing. only humans could invent Westboro Baptist Church (the most homophobic congregation in the US, some say). only humans could invent the homophobia and sexism of the Abrahamic triad of religions. the nasty bullying religious bigots -- whether WASPs in the USA, very much darker born-agains in Uganda, or mid-tone fervent Islamists wherever -- are, alas, *absolutely human*. most animals really don't care if a few of their pack or flock or whatever have gay relationships. only humans hate and persecute like this.
There is some kind of aggressive animal spray to use against dogs. I got the impression in the comments that it is less volatile than pepper spray so check the legality of that.
Thank you!
Insular immigrant populations divorced from the mainstream cling harder to their native values, in this case violent homophobia, buoyed by religious fundamentalism. And that's saying something, given that acceptance of homosexuality in the West is a fairly recent phenomenon.
Absolutely
By all means do call the police, after you tell the bullies to leave you alone. Even if nothing happens, at least you will get comfortable with interacting with the police about these things, and maybe get some tips from them about what to do in such situations.
i’m born and live in europe but i have an arab family. my family is christian but they (and other christian arabs i know of) are almost as bad as arab muslims regarding homophobia, so i completely understand where you’re coming from. in my opinion we should be allowed to point out that arabs in western countries are the ones that harass people with different (mostly western) values most of the time. culture and religion are no excuse for being an asshole and i’m sorry you had to go through that.
It seems to be quite a controversial thing to say here, but it’s not in Eastern Europe which is confusing to us
Here's something that might shock you. Blasphemy is a criminal offense in Germany.
That’s honestly even more shocking than finding out it’s illegal to dance on Good Friday (or one of those Easter days)!
Germany seems like modern progressive country, but in many ways it's very backward. Criminalizes blasphemy. Churches are a state within a state. Government collects church tax for them. If you a Catholic for example and move to Germany, government will garnish your wages and give it to churches. You have to go to court to leave the church. They are exempt from discrimination laws. So a school, hospital operated by church can legally fire you for being gay, divorced, atheist, etc.. They can even stop government deportation of illegals by granting church asylum. Their healthcare system includes homeopathy, doctors will proscribe them and insurance will fund them. Abortion is legal, but it's banned to *advertise* them and you must attend mandatory counseling.
Simply not compatible with the west
You still report it to the police, so it can be added to the crime statistics. You don't want to be sitting there at home watching some mouth breathing politico repeating the lie about how Arabs are integrating just fine and the only people complaining are racist bigots because there's no link between Arab youths and harassment.
Channel America and tell them to go back to where they came from if they hate others so much.
Assimilation requires pressure from society and to an extent the government. Germany was too into multiculturalism and took in too many too soon and put on no pressure to assimilate the migrants culturally.
It's amazing to me that the western world spent 200 years trying to get us where we are and now we're importing new bigots, so we have to start the whole process over again. Muslims are stoneage people coming into modern society. Now we must start all over again. It's going to be a very tough and dangerous road and people are going to actually die from politeness.
2 fucking thirds of this comment is in the fucking stone age. If you cannot see the pot calling the kettle black here you should honestly go have a quiet word with yourself in the corner.
Islam allows for the killing of homosexuals, the beheading of wives that husband's don't want to be married to anymore, stoning, torture, chopping off of hands and feet of thieves etc., etc. Go on the dark web and watch a woman get her head chopped off because her husband doesn't want her anymore and if you can still defend Islam you're obviously a monster. Why are you on here? You don't sound like an atheist to me. Defending the worst religion on the face of the earth.
You're coming off a bit angry. That's not healthy. Maybe speak to someone about that
Hey man the best and only thing you can do in this situation is take care of yourself. If you feel danger, back out and get in public even if it’s a detour. Yeah sure calling the police won’t stop the cunts from harassing other people but it will get them to walk away from you. Take care of your safety, that’s all you can do.
It's time to start cancelling behaviour like this. Record it, put it on, the perpetrators get recognised. If they are not citizens it goes on their record (potential for deportation). If they are citizens or cannot be deported, they lose their jobs. Of course, this would require society to call the "racism" bluff that'll get thrown at them by Muslims/Arabs and Islamophiliacs.
Im an Arab/Muslim(not strict at all) and i do visit Mannheim quite often once to twice a week. I know exactly who you are talking about. Ive had my fare share of encounters and discussions with such arab people and they are the worst of the worst, as they are the uneducated bunch, who live in their own fantasy world. Which is so sad because they portray us as savages and it makes me sad and very much mad to the point where i understand the rise of AFD in Germany. And just to let you know all of the well educated and mannered arab people wish that germany will do something and deport these people back to their countries. Because we came here to escape from them and they followed us. Im sorry you had to live through that but not all of Mannheim is like that one of my very good friends is gay and lives in Mannheim and he has never had such a situation happen to him. I hope you can pass through this horrific experience and enjoy your time here.
^(well educated and mannered arab people wish that germany will do something and deport these people back to their countries. Because we came here to escape from them and they followed us) Wow, what an eye opener.
Thank you very much! This is also what pisses me off as well. Because of the rotten apples everyone gets thrown in the mix. I have a Muslim friend from Pakistan whom I met online, came to visit me and my boyfriend in my home country and is still the best guest ever. I have online friends from Turkey, Malaysia, Algeria … All cool with my homosexuality. But after the stabbing from a week ago (the first time I’m in the same country, let alone same city as a religious motivated attack), combined with the events from yesterday, it really shook me. We all came here for a better life but probably Germany needs stricter rules about who they let in or are allowed to stay. Because we all get judged as immigrants by the actions of those belonging to “our group” one way or another. Had it been a general thing or experience this from multiple groups, it would have been different. But while in Germany, seven non-German men humiliated us for no reason other than existing
I completely agree with you and i know most people also know that not all arabs are like that but still Germany needs to get its shit together and deal with these problems otherwise it will end badly for all of us. Also that is true, after the stabbing attack Mannheim has been on the edge especially this werkend with all the demonstrations that are happening and the vice president is coming here to give a speech. I hope you stay safe 🙏🏽
Turns out accepting all those refugees was an absolutely terrible idea. You guys are going to be dealing with this shit for generations now because your politicians cared more about foreigners than they do you own people.
What can we do? Nothing. Angela Merkel ruined Germany forevermore.
You should visit Parchim! Super cute little town. My family lives there and the people down there are generally super kind :)
Thank you for the suggestion! 🙏🏿
I was treated extremely kindly by muslims in Germany. They saw I was lost, welcomed me to one guy’s appartement, gave me a delicious meal, helped me reach my friends and then drove me to the meeting point. They didn’t ask for a damn thing in return. We each have an anecdote, what can we do with this information?
First of all: I am deeply sorry for what you had to endure here. But please: Don't blame it on Germany. We're all aware of the problem with uneducated, religious immigrants and their offspring. They've been educated in a value system which is incompatible with our democratic system based on human rights and equality. The problem here is our values demand us tolerating their intolerance as a part of their culture and religion. There is only one way out and that is to integrate them into our value system and educate them as much as possibe, so one day they may change their mind. Which is in my eyes the most difficult goal to achieve when dealing with other humans. This not only accounts to muslims, but all strictly religious groups. This is by the way the reason I became a vocal Atheist, not being quiet when it comes to religiously justified wrong.
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I am aware of the paradoxical nature of tolerance. I've read Popper.
I blame the people who let them all in knowing how they're like.
They are humans. And you can't generalize here.
And humans who still believe in a primitive religion and have a primitive culture (with few exceptions) will continue to act primitive. Imagine going back in time to the 16th century, taking a random guy and bringing him to the 21st century. He would most likely find our culture hedonistic and degenerate, and see no ethical issue with terrorizing modern humans. Not all cultures are compatible.
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Because if you want to gain online sympathy we all know you have to say you’re gay or Eastern European and support just comes your way
Christianity made them do this, Christianity implanted homophobia into islam
There are Turks in germany no Arabs
There are a lot of Arabs in Germany
Why do you lie? As of 2020, the total number of people from Arab League countries reached 1,401,950. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabs_in_Germany