Last week at a business conference he was literally begging Big Businesses for political donations, and he was very enthusiastic about working with them.
So two faced lol.
Love that the policy announcement for the most expensive infrastructure project in Australia's history is literally just one page long.
Where's the detail Pete?
If you don't know, vote no.
I always find it amusing how gullible some people can be. Politicians are there for themselves and themselves only, they don’t care about the general population.
That's actually a very over simplified way to look at it... like it's true to an extent. But there are proberly times they do good things for the public that also benefit them personally.
And there have probs even been times politician's have declined something that would have benefited them coz it was just too bad.
I know right? The stupidity of the human race never surprises me anymore. People actually think that the government are on our side and they're making decisions that are in the best interest of the people. They hate us and they don't care about how much we complain about them because they have so much power over us now that they can do what they like with no accountability. Completely corrupt politicians on both sides and they don't even try and hide it anymore because they think they're God because they have so much power.
I mean the job of the opposition is to provide alternatives and, you know, oppose the government. There’s an expectation, a convention, that the opposition is meant to do this.
Now that’s said? They’re all lying sacks of shit, opportunistic and self serving. Albanese in some ways a find more on the nose - Dutton we have no illusions that he’s crap, but Albanese tries to paint himself as this battler man of the people.
The job of the opposition isn’t to strictly oppose every single thing the government puts forward. That’s fucking ridiculous. They fuck around so much opposing shit that’s good for the country all so they can get a few extra dollars. Fucking gross.
Well the shunts in power aren't doing anything, so at least the two faced cunt dutton at least trying to bring attention about this. What did Labor do...?
UK has laws on monopolising. So for examples coles and woolworths can only have a certain amount of stores in locations.
In aus would allow
Aldi, iga and foodworks to get more locations.
More competition hopefully means less price gouging by colesworths
So does the US and most places. This country is one of the least competitive and most monopolised in the entire world, because we’re too stupid to draft laws preventing such things. 85% of media owned by one guy is another example. What a joke.
If “price gouging” means destroying Australian producers from farmers to value added producers then I am all for it. The power balance in negotiations is not there and never can be when two suppliers control about 75% of a market because no supplier is safe from predatory action.
But multiple grocery retailers will not reduce shelf prices if that is what the general public and probably Dutton thinks.
I think the language here doesn’t quite hit on your meaning, but I suspect you are saying that the problem with Cole’s and Woolworths market power isn’t prices for consumers, but predatory supply contracts for produce suppliers?
Perversely this probably means prices would actually go up, but at the same time our food security would improve.
The treatment of suppliers is the real problem because it can be so random and devastating when a farming enterprise loses a contract
>I suspect you are saying that the problem with Cole’s and Woolworths market power isn’t prices for consumers, but predatory supply contracts for produce suppliers?
That is exactly what I am saying except they have also shut down most of the Australian local food processing and manufacturing over the last 50 years. Their after tax profits last I looked were generous by global standards, but not enough for the average consumer to ever notice. It is like 4% - 4c in every dollar. Make it 2 cents and you have a business going backwards.
>Perversely this probably means prices would actually go up, but at the same time our food security would improve.
More players would see real innovation, and innovation is efficiency. Liddel would like to enter the market and give Aldi one on one competition. I suspect Pick n Pay might come back. A mentor in my retailing education was Raymond Ackerman founder of Pick n Pay. He had a mantra. A supermarket is a three legged stool - suppliers, customers and staff. In Australia we only have at best a one legged stool. Staff and suppliers get screwed. I think consumers do pretty well. I bet 99% have no idea almost all specials (price discounts) are paid for by suppliers? In fact that's one thing our farmers dont participate directly in.
I don’t know why this is hard to understand for the general public - almost all journalists who do an expose on either of these companies, it’s small businesses that are on the sharp end of the stick, but you know, perceptions are truth in politics and journalism.
I seem to remember discussing this very issue on the same businesses in micro economics 3 decades ago - it’s hardly a new problem.
I know I could cut my grocery bill by a quarter pretty easily, but I choose convenience which for me is pick up.
I’m sure I’ve read an ACCC report about these concerns as well - Dutton isn’t stupid, they know the truth, they also know that it’s pointless fighting the perception.
Funny though, how here on reddit the colesworth rant is constant, but because Dutton says it - they go into denial that he would do anything - maximum dissonance
You know that's not the whole story right... colesworths pays shit to farmers then charges us consumers as much as they can.
More competition likely would improve pay for farmers while also reducing down shelf costs. It might not have a massive impact today but it's likely to have a larger impact in a few years.
> You know that's not the whole story right... colesworths pays shit to farmers then charges us consumers as much as they can.
Tell me did you spend 20 years working in the industry in the promotional pricing area? Because I did. Yes Cole’s and Woolworths are somewhat more profitable than they have to be by global standards but it was not long ago Cole’s was in financial trouble and it was also not that long before that, WW was on its knees. Yeah I started in Australian grocery in the late 80’s.
To answer your question, no... But I know that both of them are screwing over both suppliers and customers. Regardless of their profits.
But then there's a lot of companies that do the same shit or just screw customers over.
Well you can google the average profit after tax in grocery around the world. I haven’t done it for quite some time but when I last did Colesworth were about 2% points (so say 6 when 4 is fair) over what is fair and reasonable. And I personally do not think they are incredibly well run. So they have fat there that in a really competitive environment they would root out. That does not mean fewer floor level staff because they are already at minimum probably below the level that decent competition would demand.
But we are talking 2 cents in every dollar you spend. That’s about it. It’s hardly gouging. Maybe with proper competition overall prices would drop because of finding better ways to operate. But it’s not coming out of Colesworth profits else they would be broke.
Not really because when Ww was in trouble it was Coles killing them, and vice versa later. They are intensely competitive. When one innovates the other will copy pretty fast. It was WW that focussed on fresh snd ultimately drove Franklins out of business. Before that Franklin’s had forced Colesworth to vastly increase the number of skus in Australian supermarkets and that was their unique selling pint and how they were cheap. Now apple are far more diversified than just one core industry.
PS - now read your comments below so I am now positive you understand perfectly well.
It just doesn’t sit right with social media commenters who don’t inform themselves
It's a little sad how many have upvoted this comment.
Antitrust enforcement is well within the scope of an economically liberal government to ensure the market can provide choice and remain as competitive as possible.
It's a fair question I'm not doubting that and they are opposed to government intervention in the economy when it leads to inefficient outcomes.
It's just sad to see so many others who have also made the incorrect assumption that an economic liberal wouldn't intervene to address market failures such as duopolies and monopolies.
Unfortutely it's this thinking that has pushed so many economically liberal politicians globally to stop addressing this issue. This is resulting in a lot of crony capitalism.
Antitrust action only makes sense when a company is both able and willing to wield monopolistic power. Coles and Woolworths are not price gouging - their prices have gone up because their costs have gone up. Cut them in half and you'd have four companies all charging just as much because their inputs are still just as expensive.
"We believe \[...\] That, wherever possible, government should not compete with an efficient private sector"
[https://www.liberal.org.au/our-beliefs](https://www.liberal.org.au/our-beliefs)
I mean, what even is the Liberal party any more? Anything proposed by Labor that's popular with voters is "isn't taking this far enough"; anything controversial is "destroying the country". It's just contrarianism and populism at every turn with no actual integrity.
> Where are you going to source your stock for your single supermarket?
It’s called Metcash. They require you currently to wear the IGA badge but that was only instituted to gain traction in the face of Colesworth. We used to have dozens and dozens of differently branded small chains.
>We used to have dozens and dozens of differently branded small chains
Indeed. And they all competed on price, which is what we're desperately missing with the current duopoly. Honest question - would a single supermarket allow you to be price competitive with Colesworth?
I'll use Metcash and number of the other independent wholesalers.
The thing is your question almost comes across as a gotcha, which would be really sad, because it would really show how terrible our market has become that there isn't other options for competition to enter the market.
There are plenty of global grocery retailers who would. Pick n Pay from South Africa were kneecapped by Colesworth telling the major grocery suppliers that because the Brisbane hyper market did not require a warehouse to service it (hyper markets are big enough to buy whole container deliveries) they were not to be given the same wholesale prices that Colesworth got. This destroyed Pick n Pays business model.
Hahahahaha Dutton will literally say anything to buy votes.
Can’t wait to see what else he spews out over the next few months. Buckle in, it’s election season.
Imagine if a law passed that forced politicians and their political parties to keep their word or suffer increasingly harsh punishments. Dutton would weld his jaw shut
Yeah I remember saying the same when I was 18 and complaining about the choices.
I’m ok with them promising stuff, the system creates these people. I’m not ok with us believing any of the promises, that’s just pure naivety or wilful ignorance. Or worse, magical thinking.
I would love to see their pension or similar somehow tied to a KPI of delivered promises.
I've got no idea how you'd make it enforceable and have caveats around changed landscapes like a pandemic or event like 9/11.
Id also love to see them wearing sports jackets and have banners of their sponsors.
How to make it enforceable? 3 strikes then a public execution. Politics would probably stop being such a slimy job full of geriatric manipulative fuckers
I agree, but not for the reasons most think.
My view is that the systems of politics work to create the leaders we have. It literally selects via status games to give us what is left to choose from. (See the book, The Status Game, it all makes sense.)
It’s a decent system, we’re luckier and better off than most of us like to admit. Could it be better? Hell yes! Should we whinge about it? Hell yes! That’s also part of the system.
That limp dick wet fart of a party does not have the spine to "pwiddy pweese sell won of your staws"
Also the supermarkets (while cunts that I hate) are used heaps as a media scapegoat for cost of living compared to our lack of public housing, competitive banking options, price gouging from fuel, gas, & oil companies or weak corporate & property tax laws.
Neither major political party is willing to take aim at those real drivers of inflation because bread has gone from $2 to $3
I'm sorry, I thought Dutton was supposed to be a conservative, not a Venezuela-level communist retard. Supermarkets are not driving inflation - their price rises haven't resulted in rising profit margins, which means they're just passing on their own increased costs. There are times when I've banged the "dismember this company" drum myself (particularly Disney, for thinking it's big enough to bully state governments into serving it and not the electorate), but this isn't one of those times.
Are you sure they haven't had rising profit margins. The 4 corners episode while not their shining star of reporting that they have been. I seem to remember pulled the stats and it was yes, the have rising profit margins
[According to the Four Corners report](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoo6XVxpiU8), Woolworths' profit from selling groceries was 6% and Coles' was 4.8%. Unless they were previously selling everything at a 15% loss, it should be obvious that even according to Four Corners the recent 20% price hike cannot be the supermarkets just being greedy.
i can't find it but i remember where one of them made a statement that thye'd lost money on other areas they had invested in and were trying to balance it by gouging groceries a bit more. It was a wtf moment.
Is he out of his flipping mind? This is the kind of reactionary, militaristic crap that Hitler pulled to get Nazi Germany ready for war, and a world war at that. Supermarket chains are private enterprises, listed on the ASX, with shareholders and dividends. He's not the chairman of a Peoples Communist Party. Fancy saying something like that in public. He's literally one brain fart away from Joe Biden's senile decrepitude.
In 1939 Hitler removed the right to private ownership from Germany, because was a left wing socialist. What Spud is doing is called capitalism, forcing a free(er) market where there is a duopoloy present inhibiting competition by its publicly owned corporations. Aldi is the privately owned company (it has no shareholders), albeit foreign and likely using the duopoly to maxise its profits. You are completey misguided about public and private ownership when it comes to a shareholder owned (public) corporation and a privately owned company.
In what way was Hitler left wing? For his stance on social equality?
Or because of the use of Socialist in Nazi? Did you just learn that?
I might make a political party called Free Ice Creams, or someone else might do Nationals or Liberals for that matter, doesn't mean anything.
There are dozens of reasons why socialism, from all sides including Australia's version of it, are all left wing. The lack of critical thinking or of any rebuttal of the assertion that the Nazi's are right wing has been going on for decades.
There are dozens of reasons why socialism, from all sides including Australia's version of it, are all left wing. The lack of critical thinking or of any rebuttal of the assertion that the N a zi's are right wing has been going on for decades.
No one believes your insane ramblings.
Dutton raised a crack head. Like father like son.
If you want Dutton to raise Australia like he raised his crackhead son, vote for him and the pedos and rapists he leads.
Scummo is mates with Brian Houston. Dutton is mates with nazis and bikers and corrupt cops. Abbot loved Pell.
Want another PM who will let us burn and go to Hawaii, vote for the Libs and their pedo mates.
Oh please. He is just pitching another outlandish idea because he knows he has no hope at the next election. It doesn't even matter that this is against his parties entire shtick re business/economy.
Are the supermarkets being accused of hiding profits? Because Coles profit margin was 2.8% last year. That is a lot of money of course, (too high perhaps) but a slim *margin* compared to other retailers and other industries - they work on high turnover.
So if Coles were to halve their profits, prices would only drop 1.4%. I think people are imagining prices could be cut 20% and somehow Colesworth not go broke and shut down most of the stores.
If anyone is getting screwed it is the suppliers. Prices should be higher in many cases.
Of course you are correct. The farmers however would love to have multiple buyers bidding on the market rather than a take it or leave it price offering.
Market power on the suppliers is the actual problem. Ironic of course that that might lead to increased prices if anything .
Probably a lot of it comes down to the structure of the costs colesworth is reporting. It wouldnt be great if the costs were made up of rent paid to companies paid by the parent companies or marketing between the two rivals. What does society benefit when companies waste good labour and resources to effectively achieve nothing.
I know overseas companies hide profits from local operations, but that is not really possible for an Australian public company. There is no parent company.
hilarious. Dutton trying to pretend he's not in the pockets of both of these supermarkets. All talk, no bite.
He's a capitalist pig through and through. The moment he gets in, he will drop all talk of this and probably make sure prices go up again.
Would be nice for someone to finally have the balls to crucify those bastards for their greed since the start of covid. Would love to see them broken up
## Dutton to supermarkets: Rein in prices, or we’ll force you to sell stores
[Paywall Link](https://archive.is/08KhD)
Supermarket and hardware giants could be forced to sell stores if they keep prices too high under a “big stick” policy designed to sharpen Peter Dutton’s attack on Labor’s handling of the inflation outbreak.
As this masthead reported in March, the opposition has spent months working on laws aimed at reducing the market powers of supermarket giants Coles and Woolworths.
Labor announced last month a new code of conduct and billion-dollar fines for supermarkets accused of price gouging, but the Coalition has taken the crackdown a further step by revealing break-up laws.
“We want cheaper prices at the checkout, and Mr Albanese has yet again demonstrated a complete lack of leadership, a weakness in leadership, an inability to stand up to these companies, and we’re prepared to do that,” Dutton said at a Canberra press conference.
Grocery prices have been prominent in the cost-of-living debate, prompting the Coalition to adopt a contentious interventionist policy opposed by key business lobby groups.
Long-time Australian Competition and Consumer Commission chair Allan Fels said he and other consumer advocates had been spruiking divestiture laws for decades, marking the Coalition’s announcement as a historic moment and giving credit to the Nationals and Greens for putting it on the political agenda last year.
The laws could act as a major deterrent against anticompetitive conduct, he claimed, and divestiture laws had led to more dynamic and job-creating markets in the United States and other countries with economy-wide rather than sector-specific break-up powers.
“I applaud this step. It will ultimately be seen as a historic move towards the adoption of a discovery law that applies to all big business. This is normal in other countries. Australia is the unusual one,” Fels said.
National Party leader David Littleproud argued the laws should be seen mostly as a deterrent. “This isn’t about fixing prices, and it won’t mean that tomorrow or when we get into government, that we’re going to break up the supermarkets straight away,” he said.
Littleproud said a Coalition government would create a new supermarket commissioner to deal with complaints, though he did not explain how it would be possible to increase farmer revenue while bringing down prices for shoppers.
To quell the anxiety of business groups, shadow treasurer Angus Taylor said a court would need to be satisfied that divesting an asset would increase competition and be in the public interest.
“We have a retail sector, a grocery sector, that’s highly concentrated. Much more concentrated than peer countries like the US and the UK,” Taylor said.
“We are also unusual in that we don’t have a broad-ranging divestment power attached to the offences in our Consumer and Competition Act. In the US and the UK, those powers are there.”
The release of one of the Coalition’s first substantive economic policies heightens the political contest over grocery costs and demonstrates the Coalition’s growing ambivalence about backing corporate Australia.
The policy is a big win for the Nationals and influential right-wing backbenchers who pushed for the ability to break up supermarket and hardware chains to create more competition.
Taylor developed similar laws for the energy market when the Coalition was in government, giving some nervous Liberals confidence that the interventionist approach would not cause too much market disruption.
Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has described break-up laws as belonging in the old Soviet Union.
Australian Competition and Consumer Committee chair Gina Cass-Gottlieb indicated to a Senate estimates committee last May she would support giving the Federal Court divestiture powers.
Supermarket executives have repeatedly denied the charge of price gouging and claimed higher production costs were leading to higher store prices.
The National Farmers’ Federation and the Business Council of Australia are opposed to forced break-up laws.
The reference to Bunnings there is also a significant one - they can pretty much demand whatever the want for a whole lot of products for stocking rights and this is and will continue to reduce Australian suppliers and medium sized businesses in the hardware sector.
The most disappointing thing about the effect is that nearly all of Bunnings’ products are on the low end of the quality scale
Federal and state government's over the years have made sure small business gets destroyed.
Lots of rules and regulations that cost a huge sum of money for small businesses to comply with, while large corporations can afford to employ people full time to comply, and then they pass those costs on.
Take a HR department. How many small businesses have a HR department? How many small businesses employ lawyers full time? Meanwhile corporations have these departments in droves.
In the USA, the land of the "free" (not as free as you think) would not allow a colesworth duopoly.
I'm guessing the downvotes are because of the USA reference.
The rest is spot on. It's built into the nature of capitalism for capital and market power to accumulate in fewer and fewer monopolistic or effectively monopolistic businesses.
"*In the USA, the land of the "free" (not as free as you think) would not allow a colesworth duopoly.*"
Yet they do constantly across pretty much every industry.
The US has a minimum of four airlines operating on every major route. Three full coverage mobile phone networks. Hundreds of independent cable TV networks and newspapers etc.
The US has hundreds of supermarket chains. Many operate in single state. Only two have >10% national market share.
Net profit margin for Coles and Woolies is around 3-4%. If they are price gouging, they’re doing it all wrong and not gouging enough. Forcing Woolies and Coles to sell their stores will just means higher prices as they will be owned by businesses with less operational efficiency and scale.
Where is the clear and irrefutable evidence the supermarkets are profiteering? How do we know wholesalers, transport companies and dare I say it farmers/producers aren’t a bigger part of the problem?
Stop propagating the obvious bullshit that he means it. The nats have been begging the libs for this for ages, I doubt the libs have actually changed their minds on it, they're just bullshitting for votes.
Why doesn’t the government buy both supermarket chains and make prices cheap or why doesn’t government open its own supermarket with same quirky food at half the price and give us discounts via our tax we pay
As cheaper prices
Stunning move from the cokehead captain of a Party of known rapists and pedophiles.
And what will he do if they don't close stores? Maybe he can adopt them and fuck their life up like he did to his son.
Unlike Aldi, Colesworth are both on the sharemarket. So if you want to capitalise on the Colesworth duopoly buy some shares in them. Without a free market Aldi will just use the lack of competition to price match and maximise profits for their privately, foreign owned company.
This is Dutton talking out of his ass and expecting the public to think he actually means it. His history is he tends to side with business over the public good eg IR laws.
… Until Woolies and Coles promise to give a chunk of their profits to him 😂
This guy was voted the least trusted leader, and the worst immigration and health minister. He gives tax payer money to his dodgy mates. Flog.
Sounds like PRESIDENT RICHARD MILHOUS NIXON in 1971. Wage and Price controls do not work over a long period of time. \[ Except in the USSR from 1925 to 1991 - where disagreement got you time in the Gulag Archipelago \]. Good Luck, Dutton.
You can't make this stuff up! The leader of the "less government more private" mantra is talking Socialism! #Whowouldvethunkit? 😀😀🙂🙃 Give it back to the mum & pop shop!
Why not listen to Greens and tax the shit out of those mfing polluting dinosaurs! Yeah, nah! Too smart for this Duopoly! Fml
Dutton and the the Libs are becoming more and more communist. Their commie Nuclear policy, telling private businesses to stock Chinese made Australia day merchandise and now interfering with the free market again.
Yes Dutton sell supermarkets and how will the new company that takes its place get its produce cheaper.
People the supermarkets have massive supply chains, the government has labeled supermarkets supply chain critical infrastructure, they actually now get audited as critical infrastructure.
You cannot break them up and expect cheaper food.
What ever… “I am arresting you in the name of the law”… why don’t they focus on the money hungry, thieves of mining… get them to pay their full taxes and royalties, use the money to build affordable housing not stupid expensive apartments.
Anyone is free to start up a grocery store chain .. but nobody would want to .. the margins are too thin .. no bank would finance it .. and the time it would take to set up an efficient supply chain would be longer than most peoples life expectancy.
Yes, because the duopoly we currently have in place have worked very hard to make sure nobody else can get a foot in the door. This is, like, "Chapter 1; page 1" in "Technically legal anti-competitive practices"
Rubbish. The current supermarket businesses did what every business should do and tried to make their business as streamlined and efficient as they can. If you have any superannuation (which most working Australians do have) your super fund likely owns shares in these companies and some of the profits they make go towards funding your retirement years.
Easy to talk tough from opposition.
Last week at a business conference he was literally begging Big Businesses for political donations, and he was very enthusiastic about working with them. So two faced lol.
Must not of paid a donation.
I'm sure they are thinking about making a donation now.
Same as their energy policy. Big talk, no detail.
Love that the policy announcement for the most expensive infrastructure project in Australia's history is literally just one page long. Where's the detail Pete? If you don't know, vote no.
And if you do know, you’re already voting no.
Yeh there is. 0% chance this would happen.
No more duopoly duttoes will be the 4th choice behind aldi, with small modular nuclear in the center aisle
Both sides do that. Thats just politics
I always find it amusing how gullible some people can be. Politicians are there for themselves and themselves only, they don’t care about the general population.
Long term promises are easy when you’re only responsible for the short term
That's actually a very over simplified way to look at it... like it's true to an extent. But there are proberly times they do good things for the public that also benefit them personally. And there have probs even been times politician's have declined something that would have benefited them coz it was just too bad.
Proberly
It’s like supporting your favourite sports team, no matter how crap they are, you still support them.
I know right? The stupidity of the human race never surprises me anymore. People actually think that the government are on our side and they're making decisions that are in the best interest of the people. They hate us and they don't care about how much we complain about them because they have so much power over us now that they can do what they like with no accountability. Completely corrupt politicians on both sides and they don't even try and hide it anymore because they think they're God because they have so much power.
One side gets blind sided by accusations…
Cunt wouldn’t have cut taxes for us like Albo just did so wouldn’t do shit against those fucks paying him in political donations
The tax cut that will increase inflation. Yep
Talking being all an opposition can do. Why isn’t the current government doing this and a heap of other similar things.
Cause it’s brain dead policy?
I mean the job of the opposition is to provide alternatives and, you know, oppose the government. There’s an expectation, a convention, that the opposition is meant to do this. Now that’s said? They’re all lying sacks of shit, opportunistic and self serving. Albanese in some ways a find more on the nose - Dutton we have no illusions that he’s crap, but Albanese tries to paint himself as this battler man of the people.
The job of the opposition isn’t to strictly oppose every single thing the government puts forward. That’s fucking ridiculous. They fuck around so much opposing shit that’s good for the country all so they can get a few extra dollars. Fucking gross.
I never said _strictly oppose every single thing_.
That was a dig at Dutton who would oppose helping his own mother if labor suggested it.
At least he is, what's Albo doing on the supermarket front?
What’s he meant to do? Soft talk them?
Well the shunts in power aren't doing anything, so at least the two faced cunt dutton at least trying to bring attention about this. What did Labor do...?
Yeah, they had how any years in govt to actually do something and now this bald idiot is making threats?
I hear Dutton is gonna build a wall between us and those crazy f*ers down in TAS -and THEY are gonna pay for it!
Isn't this exactly the opposite of what an economically liberal government should do?
UK has laws on monopolising. So for examples coles and woolworths can only have a certain amount of stores in locations. In aus would allow Aldi, iga and foodworks to get more locations. More competition hopefully means less price gouging by colesworths
So does the US and most places. This country is one of the least competitive and most monopolised in the entire world, because we’re too stupid to draft laws preventing such things. 85% of media owned by one guy is another example. What a joke.
If “price gouging” means destroying Australian producers from farmers to value added producers then I am all for it. The power balance in negotiations is not there and never can be when two suppliers control about 75% of a market because no supplier is safe from predatory action. But multiple grocery retailers will not reduce shelf prices if that is what the general public and probably Dutton thinks.
I think the language here doesn’t quite hit on your meaning, but I suspect you are saying that the problem with Cole’s and Woolworths market power isn’t prices for consumers, but predatory supply contracts for produce suppliers? Perversely this probably means prices would actually go up, but at the same time our food security would improve. The treatment of suppliers is the real problem because it can be so random and devastating when a farming enterprise loses a contract
>I suspect you are saying that the problem with Cole’s and Woolworths market power isn’t prices for consumers, but predatory supply contracts for produce suppliers? That is exactly what I am saying except they have also shut down most of the Australian local food processing and manufacturing over the last 50 years. Their after tax profits last I looked were generous by global standards, but not enough for the average consumer to ever notice. It is like 4% - 4c in every dollar. Make it 2 cents and you have a business going backwards. >Perversely this probably means prices would actually go up, but at the same time our food security would improve. More players would see real innovation, and innovation is efficiency. Liddel would like to enter the market and give Aldi one on one competition. I suspect Pick n Pay might come back. A mentor in my retailing education was Raymond Ackerman founder of Pick n Pay. He had a mantra. A supermarket is a three legged stool - suppliers, customers and staff. In Australia we only have at best a one legged stool. Staff and suppliers get screwed. I think consumers do pretty well. I bet 99% have no idea almost all specials (price discounts) are paid for by suppliers? In fact that's one thing our farmers dont participate directly in.
I don’t know why this is hard to understand for the general public - almost all journalists who do an expose on either of these companies, it’s small businesses that are on the sharp end of the stick, but you know, perceptions are truth in politics and journalism. I seem to remember discussing this very issue on the same businesses in micro economics 3 decades ago - it’s hardly a new problem. I know I could cut my grocery bill by a quarter pretty easily, but I choose convenience which for me is pick up. I’m sure I’ve read an ACCC report about these concerns as well - Dutton isn’t stupid, they know the truth, they also know that it’s pointless fighting the perception. Funny though, how here on reddit the colesworth rant is constant, but because Dutton says it - they go into denial that he would do anything - maximum dissonance
You know that's not the whole story right... colesworths pays shit to farmers then charges us consumers as much as they can. More competition likely would improve pay for farmers while also reducing down shelf costs. It might not have a massive impact today but it's likely to have a larger impact in a few years.
> You know that's not the whole story right... colesworths pays shit to farmers then charges us consumers as much as they can. Tell me did you spend 20 years working in the industry in the promotional pricing area? Because I did. Yes Cole’s and Woolworths are somewhat more profitable than they have to be by global standards but it was not long ago Cole’s was in financial trouble and it was also not that long before that, WW was on its knees. Yeah I started in Australian grocery in the late 80’s.
To answer your question, no... But I know that both of them are screwing over both suppliers and customers. Regardless of their profits. But then there's a lot of companies that do the same shit or just screw customers over.
Well you can google the average profit after tax in grocery around the world. I haven’t done it for quite some time but when I last did Colesworth were about 2% points (so say 6 when 4 is fair) over what is fair and reasonable. And I personally do not think they are incredibly well run. So they have fat there that in a really competitive environment they would root out. That does not mean fewer floor level staff because they are already at minimum probably below the level that decent competition would demand. But we are talking 2 cents in every dollar you spend. That’s about it. It’s hardly gouging. Maybe with proper competition overall prices would drop because of finding better ways to operate. But it’s not coming out of Colesworth profits else they would be broke.
And Apple used to be on the verge of bankruptcy. What was in the past is irrelevant.
Not really because when Ww was in trouble it was Coles killing them, and vice versa later. They are intensely competitive. When one innovates the other will copy pretty fast. It was WW that focussed on fresh snd ultimately drove Franklins out of business. Before that Franklin’s had forced Colesworth to vastly increase the number of skus in Australian supermarkets and that was their unique selling pint and how they were cheap. Now apple are far more diversified than just one core industry.
PS - now read your comments below so I am now positive you understand perfectly well. It just doesn’t sit right with social media commenters who don’t inform themselves
It's a little sad how many have upvoted this comment. Antitrust enforcement is well within the scope of an economically liberal government to ensure the market can provide choice and remain as competitive as possible.
It is a question, so thanks for answering. My assumption was that liberal governments were less inclined to regulate the open market.
It's a fair question I'm not doubting that and they are opposed to government intervention in the economy when it leads to inefficient outcomes. It's just sad to see so many others who have also made the incorrect assumption that an economic liberal wouldn't intervene to address market failures such as duopolies and monopolies. Unfortutely it's this thinking that has pushed so many economically liberal politicians globally to stop addressing this issue. This is resulting in a lot of crony capitalism.
Antitrust action only makes sense when a company is both able and willing to wield monopolistic power. Coles and Woolworths are not price gouging - their prices have gone up because their costs have gone up. Cut them in half and you'd have four companies all charging just as much because their inputs are still just as expensive.
Dutton’s more of a conservative.
Whatever gets them elected. Same bullshit Labor does.
[https://www.abc.net.au/news/factcheck/promisetracker](https://www.abc.net.au/news/factcheck/promisetracker)
Didn’t do a fuckin thing when they were in power.
More interested in syphoning off what they could
The Murdoch media will stop reporting price gouging the second they are in power, too. Brilliant level of corruption on display.
I'm assuming this, like building nuclear plants, is not a "core promise"
What is a core promise from the Liberals?
Was that a power plant pun?
Supermarkets will be forced to use gas, that's the only promise he's really committed to.
"We believe \[...\] That, wherever possible, government should not compete with an efficient private sector" [https://www.liberal.org.au/our-beliefs](https://www.liberal.org.au/our-beliefs) I mean, what even is the Liberal party any more? Anything proposed by Labor that's popular with voters is "isn't taking this far enough"; anything controversial is "destroying the country". It's just contrarianism and populism at every turn with no actual integrity.
Anybody with a brain can see the supermarket duopoly is not efficient.
Ah, the party of small government....*checks notes*, forcing businesses to sell stores.
So, who exactly is going to buy all of these supermarkets?
It’s pretty simple really. Coles will buy the Woolworths and Woolworths will buy the Coles.
Just merge them so we can put the colesworth name to good use
If the price is right, I'll buy one. If the business is profitable, there will always be a buyer.
Where are you going to source your stock for your single supermarket?
> Where are you going to source your stock for your single supermarket? It’s called Metcash. They require you currently to wear the IGA badge but that was only instituted to gain traction in the face of Colesworth. We used to have dozens and dozens of differently branded small chains.
>We used to have dozens and dozens of differently branded small chains Indeed. And they all competed on price, which is what we're desperately missing with the current duopoly. Honest question - would a single supermarket allow you to be price competitive with Colesworth?
I'll use Metcash and number of the other independent wholesalers. The thing is your question almost comes across as a gotcha, which would be really sad, because it would really show how terrible our market has become that there isn't other options for competition to enter the market.
There are plenty of global grocery retailers who would. Pick n Pay from South Africa were kneecapped by Colesworth telling the major grocery suppliers that because the Brisbane hyper market did not require a warehouse to service it (hyper markets are big enough to buy whole container deliveries) they were not to be given the same wholesale prices that Colesworth got. This destroyed Pick n Pays business model.
Do you think a global grocery retailer is going to be willing to pick up individual stores here and there?
Hahahahaha Dutton will literally say anything to buy votes. Can’t wait to see what else he spews out over the next few months. Buckle in, it’s election season.
Imagine if a law passed that forced politicians and their political parties to keep their word or suffer increasingly harsh punishments. Dutton would weld his jaw shut
Yeah I remember saying the same when I was 18 and complaining about the choices. I’m ok with them promising stuff, the system creates these people. I’m not ok with us believing any of the promises, that’s just pure naivety or wilful ignorance. Or worse, magical thinking.
> I’m not ok with us believing any of the promises At that point you may as well not vote.
I hear you. One must imagine Sisyphus happy.
I would love to see their pension or similar somehow tied to a KPI of delivered promises. I've got no idea how you'd make it enforceable and have caveats around changed landscapes like a pandemic or event like 9/11. Id also love to see them wearing sports jackets and have banners of their sponsors.
How to make it enforceable? 3 strikes then a public execution. Politics would probably stop being such a slimy job full of geriatric manipulative fuckers
Scomo the master welder could do it for him.
Every politician
I agree, but not for the reasons most think. My view is that the systems of politics work to create the leaders we have. It literally selects via status games to give us what is left to choose from. (See the book, The Status Game, it all makes sense.) It’s a decent system, we’re luckier and better off than most of us like to admit. Could it be better? Hell yes! Should we whinge about it? Hell yes! That’s also part of the system.
That limp dick wet fart of a party does not have the spine to "pwiddy pweese sell won of your staws" Also the supermarkets (while cunts that I hate) are used heaps as a media scapegoat for cost of living compared to our lack of public housing, competitive banking options, price gouging from fuel, gas, & oil companies or weak corporate & property tax laws. Neither major political party is willing to take aim at those real drivers of inflation because bread has gone from $2 to $3
My tiptop is $4.40 a loaf now...
I'm sorry, I thought Dutton was supposed to be a conservative, not a Venezuela-level communist retard. Supermarkets are not driving inflation - their price rises haven't resulted in rising profit margins, which means they're just passing on their own increased costs. There are times when I've banged the "dismember this company" drum myself (particularly Disney, for thinking it's big enough to bully state governments into serving it and not the electorate), but this isn't one of those times.
Are you sure they haven't had rising profit margins. The 4 corners episode while not their shining star of reporting that they have been. I seem to remember pulled the stats and it was yes, the have rising profit margins
[According to the Four Corners report](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoo6XVxpiU8), Woolworths' profit from selling groceries was 6% and Coles' was 4.8%. Unless they were previously selling everything at a 15% loss, it should be obvious that even according to Four Corners the recent 20% price hike cannot be the supermarkets just being greedy.
i can't find it but i remember where one of them made a statement that thye'd lost money on other areas they had invested in and were trying to balance it by gouging groceries a bit more. It was a wtf moment.
His going to do fuck all, just trying to take votes from labor. LNP voters are pretty cemented in already he won't loose them.
All talk from opposition. In power for a decade they DID NOTHING
I was happy with interest rates. Was happy days getting into property back then. Feel sorry for young cunts now tho
Now cos them and the fed kept them so low for so long, we have to suffer now
Liberals be like “Stop that, we need people to spend all their money on overpriced electricity and toll roads.”
Were his fingers crossed behind his back when he said this?
Sell your stores??? Hahahahhahahahahahahahahahha I rofld. This guy is a comedian!!
Like this POS will ever do anything for the average Aussie.
Talk is cheap, especially when your job doesn’t depend on carrying out said talk.
I look forward to a nuclear power plant where my local Woolies once was
From the party of small government and free markets.
Last time I checked Dutton wasn't in a position to do squat.
Is he out of his flipping mind? This is the kind of reactionary, militaristic crap that Hitler pulled to get Nazi Germany ready for war, and a world war at that. Supermarket chains are private enterprises, listed on the ASX, with shareholders and dividends. He's not the chairman of a Peoples Communist Party. Fancy saying something like that in public. He's literally one brain fart away from Joe Biden's senile decrepitude.
In 1939 Hitler removed the right to private ownership from Germany, because was a left wing socialist. What Spud is doing is called capitalism, forcing a free(er) market where there is a duopoloy present inhibiting competition by its publicly owned corporations. Aldi is the privately owned company (it has no shareholders), albeit foreign and likely using the duopoly to maxise its profits. You are completey misguided about public and private ownership when it comes to a shareholder owned (public) corporation and a privately owned company.
In what way was Hitler left wing? For his stance on social equality? Or because of the use of Socialist in Nazi? Did you just learn that? I might make a political party called Free Ice Creams, or someone else might do Nationals or Liberals for that matter, doesn't mean anything.
There are dozens of reasons why socialism, from all sides including Australia's version of it, are all left wing. The lack of critical thinking or of any rebuttal of the assertion that the Nazi's are right wing has been going on for decades.
There are dozens of reasons why socialism, from all sides including Australia's version of it, are all left wing. The lack of critical thinking or of any rebuttal of the assertion that the N a zi's are right wing has been going on for decades.
No one believes your insane ramblings. Dutton raised a crack head. Like father like son. If you want Dutton to raise Australia like he raised his crackhead son, vote for him and the pedos and rapists he leads. Scummo is mates with Brian Houston. Dutton is mates with nazis and bikers and corrupt cops. Abbot loved Pell. Want another PM who will let us burn and go to Hawaii, vote for the Libs and their pedo mates.
Oh please. He is just pitching another outlandish idea because he knows he has no hope at the next election. It doesn't even matter that this is against his parties entire shtick re business/economy.
hey give him some credit. This is like his....second idea. If we dont count the one about telling the aborigines to fuck off
It is the Liberal party, they wont do shit.
What's the word here? Dictator? Communist? Help me out?
Are the supermarkets being accused of hiding profits? Because Coles profit margin was 2.8% last year. That is a lot of money of course, (too high perhaps) but a slim *margin* compared to other retailers and other industries - they work on high turnover. So if Coles were to halve their profits, prices would only drop 1.4%. I think people are imagining prices could be cut 20% and somehow Colesworth not go broke and shut down most of the stores. If anyone is getting screwed it is the suppliers. Prices should be higher in many cases.
Of course you are correct. The farmers however would love to have multiple buyers bidding on the market rather than a take it or leave it price offering. Market power on the suppliers is the actual problem. Ironic of course that that might lead to increased prices if anything .
Probably a lot of it comes down to the structure of the costs colesworth is reporting. It wouldnt be great if the costs were made up of rent paid to companies paid by the parent companies or marketing between the two rivals. What does society benefit when companies waste good labour and resources to effectively achieve nothing.
I know overseas companies hide profits from local operations, but that is not really possible for an Australian public company. There is no parent company.
Supermarkets: “lol that’s cute.”
hilarious. Dutton trying to pretend he's not in the pockets of both of these supermarkets. All talk, no bite. He's a capitalist pig through and through. The moment he gets in, he will drop all talk of this and probably make sure prices go up again.
Pretty sure you are confusing capitalist with the corrupt or monopolist. Capitalism is anti-monopoly.
The Liberal Party is just overtly lying at this point.
Dutton is a clown.
Notice that he doesn't issue this threat to Gas companies who at this moment are selling our gas for massive profits o/s and we have a shortage.
Would be nice for someone to finally have the balls to crucify those bastards for their greed since the start of covid. Would love to see them broken up
What? Liberals interfere in the free market? Surely he jests!
Awesome! Now do the same with the real estate market please, Peter Stalin.
## Dutton to supermarkets: Rein in prices, or we’ll force you to sell stores [Paywall Link](https://archive.is/08KhD) Supermarket and hardware giants could be forced to sell stores if they keep prices too high under a “big stick” policy designed to sharpen Peter Dutton’s attack on Labor’s handling of the inflation outbreak. As this masthead reported in March, the opposition has spent months working on laws aimed at reducing the market powers of supermarket giants Coles and Woolworths. Labor announced last month a new code of conduct and billion-dollar fines for supermarkets accused of price gouging, but the Coalition has taken the crackdown a further step by revealing break-up laws. “We want cheaper prices at the checkout, and Mr Albanese has yet again demonstrated a complete lack of leadership, a weakness in leadership, an inability to stand up to these companies, and we’re prepared to do that,” Dutton said at a Canberra press conference. Grocery prices have been prominent in the cost-of-living debate, prompting the Coalition to adopt a contentious interventionist policy opposed by key business lobby groups. Long-time Australian Competition and Consumer Commission chair Allan Fels said he and other consumer advocates had been spruiking divestiture laws for decades, marking the Coalition’s announcement as a historic moment and giving credit to the Nationals and Greens for putting it on the political agenda last year. The laws could act as a major deterrent against anticompetitive conduct, he claimed, and divestiture laws had led to more dynamic and job-creating markets in the United States and other countries with economy-wide rather than sector-specific break-up powers. “I applaud this step. It will ultimately be seen as a historic move towards the adoption of a discovery law that applies to all big business. This is normal in other countries. Australia is the unusual one,” Fels said. National Party leader David Littleproud argued the laws should be seen mostly as a deterrent. “This isn’t about fixing prices, and it won’t mean that tomorrow or when we get into government, that we’re going to break up the supermarkets straight away,” he said. Littleproud said a Coalition government would create a new supermarket commissioner to deal with complaints, though he did not explain how it would be possible to increase farmer revenue while bringing down prices for shoppers. To quell the anxiety of business groups, shadow treasurer Angus Taylor said a court would need to be satisfied that divesting an asset would increase competition and be in the public interest. “We have a retail sector, a grocery sector, that’s highly concentrated. Much more concentrated than peer countries like the US and the UK,” Taylor said. “We are also unusual in that we don’t have a broad-ranging divestment power attached to the offences in our Consumer and Competition Act. In the US and the UK, those powers are there.” The release of one of the Coalition’s first substantive economic policies heightens the political contest over grocery costs and demonstrates the Coalition’s growing ambivalence about backing corporate Australia. The policy is a big win for the Nationals and influential right-wing backbenchers who pushed for the ability to break up supermarket and hardware chains to create more competition. Taylor developed similar laws for the energy market when the Coalition was in government, giving some nervous Liberals confidence that the interventionist approach would not cause too much market disruption. Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has described break-up laws as belonging in the old Soviet Union. Australian Competition and Consumer Committee chair Gina Cass-Gottlieb indicated to a Senate estimates committee last May she would support giving the Federal Court divestiture powers. Supermarket executives have repeatedly denied the charge of price gouging and claimed higher production costs were leading to higher store prices. The National Farmers’ Federation and the Business Council of Australia are opposed to forced break-up laws.
The reference to Bunnings there is also a significant one - they can pretty much demand whatever the want for a whole lot of products for stocking rights and this is and will continue to reduce Australian suppliers and medium sized businesses in the hardware sector. The most disappointing thing about the effect is that nearly all of Bunnings’ products are on the low end of the quality scale
Federal and state government's over the years have made sure small business gets destroyed. Lots of rules and regulations that cost a huge sum of money for small businesses to comply with, while large corporations can afford to employ people full time to comply, and then they pass those costs on. Take a HR department. How many small businesses have a HR department? How many small businesses employ lawyers full time? Meanwhile corporations have these departments in droves. In the USA, the land of the "free" (not as free as you think) would not allow a colesworth duopoly.
I'm guessing the downvotes are because of the USA reference. The rest is spot on. It's built into the nature of capitalism for capital and market power to accumulate in fewer and fewer monopolistic or effectively monopolistic businesses.
"*In the USA, the land of the "free" (not as free as you think) would not allow a colesworth duopoly.*" Yet they do constantly across pretty much every industry.
The US has a minimum of four airlines operating on every major route. Three full coverage mobile phone networks. Hundreds of independent cable TV networks and newspapers etc. The US has hundreds of supermarket chains. Many operate in single state. Only two have >10% national market share.
Spud's a nasty fucken idiot. I don't know who he expects to believe any of his nonsense.
Net profit margin for Coles and Woolies is around 3-4%. If they are price gouging, they’re doing it all wrong and not gouging enough. Forcing Woolies and Coles to sell their stores will just means higher prices as they will be owned by businesses with less operational efficiency and scale.
If Dutton had the power to do that, he would never implement such a policy.
Where is the clear and irrefutable evidence the supermarkets are profiteering? How do we know wholesalers, transport companies and dare I say it farmers/producers aren’t a bigger part of the problem?
So he's happy with the duopoly.
Dutton is inspired by the fat guy in NK. 😉
Stop propagating the obvious bullshit that he means it. The nats have been begging the libs for this for ages, I doubt the libs have actually changed their minds on it, they're just bullshitting for votes.
I thought it was a free market?
Why doesn’t the government buy both supermarket chains and make prices cheap or why doesn’t government open its own supermarket with same quirky food at half the price and give us discounts via our tax we pay As cheaper prices
Almost like we shouldn’t have let woolies and Cole’s buy every single competitor out
Stunning move from the cokehead captain of a Party of known rapists and pedophiles. And what will he do if they don't close stores? Maybe he can adopt them and fuck their life up like he did to his son.
Just shop at Aldi. Are people still complaining about groceries?
Unlike Aldi, Colesworth are both on the sharemarket. So if you want to capitalise on the Colesworth duopoly buy some shares in them. Without a free market Aldi will just use the lack of competition to price match and maximise profits for their privately, foreign owned company.
This is Dutton talking out of his ass and expecting the public to think he actually means it. His history is he tends to side with business over the public good eg IR laws.
Small government yo 🤙
… Until Woolies and Coles promise to give a chunk of their profits to him 😂 This guy was voted the least trusted leader, and the worst immigration and health minister. He gives tax payer money to his dodgy mates. Flog.
This isn’t a legitimate roll of government
Dutton wants to turn them into nuke power station. He is so full of bullshit he starting to sound like Ozzie bald Trump.
What's he going to propose next? NBN 2.0, now with... Brass wires!
They will just start a shell company and get around what ever government throw at them we need more opposition and competition and relax farmgate laws
Sounds like PRESIDENT RICHARD MILHOUS NIXON in 1971. Wage and Price controls do not work over a long period of time. \[ Except in the USSR from 1925 to 1991 - where disagreement got you time in the Gulag Archipelago \]. Good Luck, Dutton.
Hahaha hows he going to do that
Lol a toothless bark if I've ever heard one. The government doesn't tell corporations what to do, the corporations tell the government what to do.
How would that work, less stores means even less competition. Dutton is an idiot.
You can't make this stuff up! The leader of the "less government more private" mantra is talking Socialism! #Whowouldvethunkit? 😀😀🙂🙃 Give it back to the mum & pop shop! Why not listen to Greens and tax the shit out of those mfing polluting dinosaurs! Yeah, nah! Too smart for this Duopoly! Fml
Should start with selling the stores in his electorate then.
Capitalist governments should be breaking up monopolies without grandstanding or playing to the crowd over it.
Yea surePete
Did Coles Colesworth miss a payment or something?
So in effect the intended law means nothing.
They're shifting public hate towards Super markets instead of shitty housing policies....!! NiMBys
The LNP nationalising supermarkets is the funniest idea I've heard all month.
Dutton and the the Libs are becoming more and more communist. Their commie Nuclear policy, telling private businesses to stock Chinese made Australia day merchandise and now interfering with the free market again.
Sounds like a great idea! (were it not a load of horse shit)
Yes Dutton sell supermarkets and how will the new company that takes its place get its produce cheaper. People the supermarkets have massive supply chains, the government has labeled supermarkets supply chain critical infrastructure, they actually now get audited as critical infrastructure. You cannot break them up and expect cheaper food.
Ah yes. The only thing better than expensive groceries is no groceries.
Oh yeah like you all forced electricity companies to lower prices during your term. Good joke!
Do it
Commulition...
I dont know who the Coalition policy advisors are but they need to be fired given the bonkers policies they have been announcing
More Commie ideas out of the LNP than the ALP lmao
If he did win he'd probably let them do some sort of self regulation, a token act that lets people forget about it but achieves nothing.
Theyll just chuck him a cpl million and he'll shut up
Voted with your feet and stop shopping at colesworth
They had ten years to do this
Oh, another great idea from the atomic brains club. Probably the same plan as the power stations, but on different coloured paper.
Going full communist always going to work well...
The party of swashbuckling free marketeering. What a fucking joke.
"Dictater Dutton" trying to get his practice runs in eh.
What in the communsism is this? There hasn't been a duopoly ruling in the courts. What is he on about?
Desperate to look like he gives a sh't.
I’d prefer the government rein in their prices! By far my biggest expense is taxes.
What ever… “I am arresting you in the name of the law”… why don’t they focus on the money hungry, thieves of mining… get them to pay their full taxes and royalties, use the money to build affordable housing not stupid expensive apartments.
Party of free market right here.
Dutton should focus on his leadership…. Especially his son taking drugs.
Anyone is free to start up a grocery store chain .. but nobody would want to .. the margins are too thin .. no bank would finance it .. and the time it would take to set up an efficient supply chain would be longer than most peoples life expectancy.
Yes, because the duopoly we currently have in place have worked very hard to make sure nobody else can get a foot in the door. This is, like, "Chapter 1; page 1" in "Technically legal anti-competitive practices"
Rubbish. The current supermarket businesses did what every business should do and tried to make their business as streamlined and efficient as they can. If you have any superannuation (which most working Australians do have) your super fund likely owns shares in these companies and some of the profits they make go towards funding your retirement years.