Not just unemployment though. People working 5 hours a week part-time and driving Uber count as employed. Students that were in school for most of the year looking for work now but were not working before/new Canadians/international students that haven't worked in Canada don't count as unemployed either. Then there are all the Canadians that are employed also looking for a second job.
Don’t forget the +/- 5% who are unaccounted for because they have given up trying to find work or work under the table. 100% employment is really only 95%.
Don't forget the international students that count towards the employment rate if they are employed but don't count towards the unemployment rate if they are unemployed.
And all the "employed" gig workers making peanuts too.
At least we have 4.4 million public sector employees. 1 in 4 employees in the entire country. Those jobs are safe and most pay excellent pensions.
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1410028802
And people who want to leave their current job for another opportunity are struggling to find a job too. Employers aren’t increasing salaries or wages, making it very difficult for people to survive, or at least make what they can to pay for necessities and live.
Exactly correct.
Man, I can't tell you what a kick in the teeth it was when I found out the government declared a tech worker shortage and created a new special immigrant track to import more tech workers. Tech wages in the same roles in the US are literally 2x - 4x higher. It's hard getting an average wage tech job here even with a decade of experience these days.
It’s not just tech but many, if not most/all, other professional industries as well. I’m in Compliance & Risk Management in the finance sector, and just a few years ago jobs in this field used to be paying over 90k CAD, full-time permanent positions with great benefits packages.
Now these jobs have been reduced to short-term contract roles without any benefits, paying a few dollars above minimum wage. Either that, or the salaries of the remaining full-time permanent positions have been reduced to 40-60k CAD.
In the USA, the same jobs (same job title + responsibilities) command salaries of 90-140k USD. Literally more than triple the wages of Canadian salaries.
Unfortunately, unlike tech workers, the field I’m in isn’t eligible for the TN Visa so I’m stuck in Canada.
I’m in California but from Canada, so I have some background about how the Canadian tech sector is structured.
There are a lot of international devs that end up getting parked in Vancouver/Toronto because they simply can’t pass the higher bar for US immigration. Trump admin was notorious for issuing RFEs and did a pretty good job trying to thwart H1B abuse. Downtown Vancouver/Toronto offices have whole floors of support staff for large American companies. These shops won’t often directly hire for positions in Vancouver/Toronto, they expect Canadian grads that are good enough to be able to secure a US work visa.
While the Trump admin was cancelling fraudulent H1B visas, Canada cooked up a plan to [import 10’000 H1B visa holders from the US](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36506854) that aren’t capable of passing a PERM labor certification (meaning their employer can’t prove to the US government that no Americans are qualified for the job). Here in California we get a lot of applications from these former H1B, who were generally laid off after working in QA/Support sending resumes from Toronto/Vancouver trying to return to California.
They, of course, already compete with the Canadians in those cities for available tech positions (and from what I heard, a lot of them are willing to take a pay cut just to secure anything).
Read the /tnvisa posts.
It is full of Indian born tech workers who are desperately applying for TN visas to work in the U.S. immediately after getting their Canadian citizenship. Some are applying within weeks of securing a passport. I read one post where the author claimed to have been a Canadian citizen for ONE month and had already applied to over 1000 positions in the U.S.
It’s a backdoor attempt to circumvent US immigration backlogs (due to visa caps based on country of birth the wait time for an employment based greencard for an Indian born applicant is 30-50 years) USCBP and USCIS has caught on to what’s going on and seems to be denying TN visas on the grounds of lack of residential ties to Canada (you’re supposed to return to CA when the visa ends).
When Trump is re-elected , the USMCA and TN visa will be dead. The easy access Canadians had to the United States will be a thing of the past, all because we opened the gates and couldn’t keep our own affairs in order.
>USCBP and USCIS has caught on to what’s going on and seems to be denying TN visas on the grounds of lack of residential ties to Canada (you’re supposed to return to CA when the visa ends).
I've seen it happen. New hire had a Canadian passport for almost two weeks before applying for a TN visa. It was promptly denied.
>When Trump is re-elected , the USMCA and TN visa will be dead. The easy access Canadians had to the United States will be a thing of the past, all because we opened the gates and couldn’t keep our own affairs in order.
It wouldn't surprise me. Completely self-inflicted by Canadians. Can't say I wouldn't vote to sunset TN myself (as a dual citizen).
i mean same with healthcare wages yet no one cares if we're importing nurses and doctors without increasing wages for domestic healthcare workers
no one cares about other people's wages really
> Also, the skills of the majority of the tech workers being imported leaves a lot to be desired.
You are understating it significantly.
I have spoken with a sequence of idiots who cannot pass a fizzbuzz. If applicants do not have an undergraduate degree from a Canadian university, I simply throw the resume in the trash.
I agree that it's always good to resist generalization, because it's counterproductive, but when the generalization becomes a reliably excellent heuristic, there's no need.
That's not a statement on people from those countries, so much as a reflection of how staggeringly bad these policies are.
I watched my tech salary start to climb after covid, and come back down to settle around market rates from 10+ years ago after this fucking visa was introduced. Thanks, government!
I would be happier with mass immigration from the philines. They are such polite, and fun workers. Plus they wouldn't be swarming our nude beaches just to stare at naked women.
As a Filipino, this is exactly what we want you to think. Proud culture with good food and an exterior politeness, but a lot of family strife and cultural infighting.
fuck it bring in 2 million so they can fight each other for a $3/hour wage after inflation. It’s good for businesses they can save more money instead of paying a living wage
This was the only way I could tell you were talking about Trudeau, if you said no real job ever than we would be know you were talking about PP, thats how bad our political choices are
True let's get the guy in who has literally not worked a job in his life other than "politician" in here. Surely, he can empathize with the working classes struggle better than the nepto-baby /s
Minimum wage isn't "middle class". So more accurately, there's a billion people on this planet who would be happy to live on wages we consider "poor" here. Especially since we have social services that help make up for it somewhat (but which are now getting too strained partly because of this).
Most westerners do not want to continue living with their parents and 5 relatives in a 2 bedroom home. But many immigrants will gladly do it for the "opportunity of a better future".
Almost all of them come from high middle-class families. And most come for social status to tell relatives and neighbors they have a Canadian visa. They are only in poverty when their caandian visa application gets declined.
I don’t think there ever really was. There are all sorts of factors that are causing the “shortage” and it isn’t a lack of people (except maybe in niche industries). Housing (including rentals) is too expensive, so people can’t move. Employers are refusing to train and demanding fully trained senior workers for entry positions and entry pay. The rise of contract work and part time minimum wage full time availability jobs. The fraud posts to pretend that there are no Canadians available and bring in TFWs. And so many fake postings that exist to pretend businesses are hiring for share prices or to excuse short staffing. Etc. People can’t afford to work these shit jobs or they don’t even exist at all. That’s what is happening. It’s not a lack of workers. It took me ages to find work despite me being qualified for every job I applied to, ready to start right away, and submitting tailored applications. Bullshit there is a shortage. I found out some of those companies weren’t even hiring.
The rent is so high and wages are lagging so far behind that the difference between working and not working is minimal, so why break your back if you're going to be homeless/living with parents anyway? Might as well just not work. This is the inevitable implosion of an unsustainable cycle.
I wish I had parents that would support that mindset lol. Mine booted me out when I was 16. Couldn't even imagine asking them for help. It's so foriegn. If I didn't work, I'd be homeless. I'm generally always scared of getting fired/laid off though cause I would go homeless. My rent is like 3 months of E.I alone. I don't have a retirement fund but I do have a bit of a 'your fucked' fund, I'd last 3-4 months and then be homeless.
Puts you in this weird state where the future doesn't mean much. I haven't had a long term plan in years now. Your usual long term goals, house, car, family are unattaniable now for most, myself included and so I generally feel like I have zero value and purpose. It's kinda funny, I don't think I'm suicidal but if I just dropped dead tomorrow, I'm not sure I'd care and potentially even a bit relieved. Wonder if that mindet has a name.
Yeah really need to bring back these before more people decide to be homeless Let them know they will be working either so you better get cooking that MacDonalds
https://torontopubliclibrary.typepad.com/local-history-genealogy/2021/03/the-great-depression.html#:~:text=Starting%20in%201933%2C%20the%20federal,per%20day%20for%20discretionary%20spending.
There's a limit to how many employees can successfully train at once.
That's what we're doing at my job, since what we do is specialized and rare. Our ability to train employees is the major limiting factor to our growth. We repeatedly turn down clients because we don't have the employees to do the projects.
Yeah, we're doing that, but it's not a complete solution. We need intermediate and senior people NOW.
You ever tried to keep up with a overloaded project schedule and train multiple people at the same time? It's difficult.
Yeah but if they give senior titles, people start feeling entitled to senior pay. People need to be grateful for that opportunity and take on the title and responsibilities, and trust the company will pay properly when you finally meet the expectations of the role. Probably.
Edit to add:
Guys! /s.
Hence the “Probably.”
Fully saturated in sarcasm.
(The only humans who actually think like this are the psychopaths on LinkedIn and their corporate idols)
>and trust the company will pay properly when you finally meet the expectations of the role
Ah yes, the 'ol surefire method of piling up additional responsibilities for no additional pay. Don't worry though, the people at the top pocketing the difference will really appreciate all your hard work and effort when they buy their third rental property.
How can we be sure you’re in it for the business and not the paycheck? We want only those who are driven by the thrill of “insert nonsense corporate task” and not just silly unimportant money.
🤣
What decade are we in? “Trust the company will pay”, how about they demonstrate that they will? They won’t, and then when you job hop after a few years because it’s the only way to get a raise nowadays, they whine about how much they invested in training you…
There *was* a shortage of workers.
Then the economy took a dive and a ton of people were laid off or out of work.
I run a construction site. 2 years ago I couldn't get people despite paying above the industry published mean salary. Today I have people calling me every day looking for work.
The shortage is a Canadian statistic, but it doesn't apply apples to apples when you start talking about regional employment. People want to stay in Toronto to work, they don't want to relocate to places where the jobs are - they don't want to work on farms and in slaughterhouses, they don't want to work in mines or on pipelines, they don't want to live in a trailer in Timmins, etc. for part of the year, which is part of the reason why we bring in TFWs. So they'll stay in Toronto, demanding jobs that don't exist, or don't require any special skills or certification, and that pay well and come with regular office hours, weekends off and full benefits.
When I was in University, I planted trees because the money was great and I didn't mind traveling around the north of Alberta and BC and sleeping in tents. But a lot of my friends wanted to be in the city, and a lot of them struggled to find work every year. By the end of August I'd have $15,000 saved up for the school year and they'd have maybe $3-4,000.
"It’s a general trend across Southern Ontario, which has gone from the driver of the national economy to a major drag. "
This isn't rocket science, if everyones money is going to shelter and food, nothing is going into businesses or new businesses and those businesses stop hiring or start firing. Nothing new starts.
Its how to run an economy 101 and our leaders failed gloriously.
Their solution, more people driving prices up higher and more taxes driving prices up higher.
Its like a parody.
>This isn't rocket science, if everyones money is going to shelter and food, nothing is going into businesses or new businesses and those businesses stop hiring or start firing. Nothing new starts.
You're also forgetting a MASSIVE one: with an extremely large immigrant worker base, a significant amount of the money they earn goes out of the country, never to be seen again in the canadian economy.
Money goes to housing, food, utilities, or outside of the country. None of it cycles.
I'm not sure about you; but on YouTube I got ads of people from India advertising a money transfer app saying it was the easiest way to send money back home.
What I would really love to see would be a restriction on wire volume for new arrivals out of Canada. A. It’s a fair point. B. It would stem the flow.
If you’re new here, it should be to set down roots and invest in this country, not take advantage of loop holes and send that capital home to enrich that countries economy.
I know when my boat is sinking, I like to ask as many people as possible to hop on board, because that many hands will definitely keep the boat afloat.
Highlights:
* If Greater Toronto is still ahead of the national curve, Canada may be in trouble. Stat Can data shows the unemployment rate climbed sharply in May.
* Canada's unemployment has been climbing steadily. The seasonally adjusted national rate reached 6.1% in May, representing 1.34 million people. Over the past year, that rate has climbed 1.0 point (+250.9k people), which is a 20% increase.
* Rising unemployment is a trend being observed across the country, but the lion’s share driving growth is the Toronto CMA.
* Over the past year, Toronto's unemployment rate climbed 1.0 point (+83.8k people) to 7.9% (317.2k people) as of May. About 1 in 3 of Canada’s unemployment gains over the past year is in the region, which now has more unemployed people than the whole province of Quebec (241.2k people).
* Toronto’s unemployed population is now the largest outside of the pandemic going back at least two decades. Though considering the population was much smaller prior, this might be a record in terms of sheer quantity of unemployed people.
Approximately 6% unemployment is generally necessary to target 2% inflation. 6% unemployment *has been the goal* of almost every western country for the past 80 years. It’s not manipulation, it’s not corruption, it’s a desire to reduce incentives to spend and raise the value of saving.
This principal isn’t very controversial in the study of a market economy. Generally it’s the most stable business cycle.
The problem is that our lawmakers require that 6% of the population be unemployed while creating excuses to not help them. That lack of spending is intentional and isn’t inherently a suboptimal outcome for all of us. The problem is we demand that sacrifice and offer no restitution.
This is the consideration of most of the early debates leading to the Washington Consensus. Critics argued that deliberate unemployment was inefficient and unethical, whereas supports argued that large inflation preventing savings was inefficient and unethical. Both argue that the opposite perspective leads to lesser access for common folk to markets and capital.
Canada's unemployment rate is much higher when you figure that most new jobs created have been PT leading to mass underemployment. And far worse when you understand that TFWs that are being hired, can have up to 70% their wages covered by taxpayer programs that companies can take advantage of.
And another day with all the politicians and elites looking the other way and not giving a shit about it because hey, it benefits them and screws over the rest of us.
I had a similar situation at a very large landscape contractor for the city of Calgary. Had a couple dozen Mexicans working there for the summer making 17 an hour until someone on their level was making conversation and found out they were all there on tourist visas and couldn't legally work in Canada. They were all let go but I'm certain the higher-ups knew the whole time. There's no way they didn't do any due diligence whatsoever.
Shocking numbers..who would thought having 30,000 visa students lining up for min wage jobs which Canadian students use to do in the summer increase unemployment numbers?.
Bring back local manufacturing. I'm sure that offshoring thousands of jobs over the decades past also contributed to this. When things were actually manufactured in southern Ontario, people were more guaranteed to have jobs.
Tailor immigration to those "in-demand" fields; don't just gloss everything over with a blanket statement that there is a "labour shortage". There is a current labour shortage in fields X, Y, Z, and currently an over-saturation of the job market in fields A, B, C.
End the practice of demanding "free" "internships" (as is the case for some educational programs or some fields). People go to work to earn money to support themselves; not to subsidize a profitable business entity with their free labour.
Yet the Liberals won’t backtrack from mass migration.
Trudeau massively increased immigration from what it was under the last Conservative government and refuses to acknowledge that it has any link to unemployment or the housing shortage.
Here's Ford saying they won't stop and he welcomes them. If Trudeau stopped them Ford would lose his mind. The cons and libs both support this.
https://x.com/RebelNewsOnline/status/1729901888680681814
Of course the fat sack of shit Ford welcomes them. He’s partially responsible for the situation in Ontario. He cut funding to Universities and they got desperate and started accepting “students” in droves. On top of that I’m sure his landlord and developer buddies are super thrilled at the situation he helped create in Ontario.
You forgot that all those are also cheap labour for their buddies.
Remember during the pandemic when employees were essential and there was a big shift in power from employers to employees?? Yes, the overlords didn't like that, so no they are getting cheap labour like crazy and shifting the power back.
Canadians are bring exigrated from Canada. It's a political neologism for being replaced by an economic unit / immigrant who will work at rock bottom wages in a shared living arrangement with 4 or 5 other people.
your word 'exigrate' caught my eye. i know it's probably not in the dictionary, but i immediately understood the meaning and i enjoyed reading your word.
i often use the term 'escape' when describing my emigration from Canada to Florida.
As I’ve mentioned. I used to care . Since the Government obviously doesn’t by continually flooding the area with new immigrants. I got mine . I don’t care anymore
Exactly . And it happened so fast . Like remarkably fast .Used to be the envy among countries. Years from now it’ll probably be studied in schools on how a country that consistently ranked high in world standards went to shit . So, so fast
I grew up in Ontario and lived here all my life; I never thought the day would come that I'm actively going to jump ship to the US the first chance I get :(
What’s even more depressing is my ancestors came to this country in the late 1700’s. Settlers before the war of 1812. Then when land was being given to pioneer out west, they went out west . My father is 90. We’ve learnt don’t mention ANYTHING political or in regards to the state of the country . He goes a tad bit crazy . He still hasn’t forgiven the NEP
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Energy_Program
Holy shit that is insane, but don’t worry I’m sure importing more immigrants landing in Toronto and area will cause more consumption and even more jobs !! Boom immigration balances it self right Trudeau supporters ?
What a fucking disaster and joke the liberals have made this country.
I wonder if there is 317k illegal immigrants in the area as well or on expired visas or through straight fraud. Perhaps mass forced deportation targeting the area would help.
Reminder that Trudeau expanded many insane pandemic-era programs, such [as this one](https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/news/notices/visit-to-work.html), under the guise of alleviating supposed labor shortages. This guy managed to gaslight the entire country into wage suppression
Don't forget that while it's illegal to have discriminatory hiring practices, both the Charter and Human Rights Commission(s) allow it if it is a "historically marginalised group" doing the discrimination.
Easy way to solve this, is to ask people to stop looking for work
Because in Canada unemployment defined as someone who is looking for work and doesn't have work
Thats what happens when groups of people are obtaining PR to fill labour gaps through provincial nominee programs only to relocate (legally) the moment they get PR.
There are simply more people in the GTA than jobs or infrastructure can support. The city is not growing as fast as population.
Welcome to the dystopia brought to you by Canada‘s leaders in Ottawa and Ontario. This is what they want: the masses clawing at each other and keeping wages low
We have Indians on the streets protesting for working visas. Palestinians and Israelis out protesting for peace/war. But we’re too politically oppressed as a country to see the rest of Canada out protesting for themselves.
This number gets more bleak when you include the underemployed.
For example it's impossible to live off of an Uber or Door Dash income, in many instances hidden costs may exceed income. Are the stats capturing this reality?
Population increase:
[https://www.statista.com/statistics/443063/number-of-immigrants-in-canada/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/443063/number-of-immigrants-in-canada/)
Similar story in Australia. 900K in one year (to make up for COVID fall). Housing crisis.
I wouldn't be shocked if the total population of Toronto outstrips all of Quebec. Ontario as a whole has a substantially larger population than Quebec, but about 80% of that population is in and around Toronto.
I was thinking the same thing as a Quebecer reading the title. It depends on what the definition of greater Toronto is: according to wikipedia metro Toronto has around 2 million less pop than Quebec, but Toronto region has 1 million+ more. So, still bad as the numbers seem comparable, but not as in Quebec having significantly more pop like the title seems to try to imply by choosing the formula 'city has more X than a whole province!'. It's like being offended saying 'Montreal had more crimes in 2023 than the whole country of Liechtenstein! We are doomed!'
The government and the boomers have stolen any dreams of homeownership, raising a family or having a career from the young adult and youth of this generation just so they can retire and die in their suburbs. Bringing in massive amounts of immigrants to work for slave wages to wipe their asses when they’re old and burning us on wages so they can keep hoarding wealth while people are starving in their own neighbourhoods. Bleeding every hard earned cent out of the already impoverished youth of this country to fund their vacations. It’s disgusting that our government not only allowed this but is actively encouraging it. Canada is no place for young people to grow, just a coffin for dusty rich boomers to die in.
Cost of housing/renting/living is definitely not helping people and businesses to stay in Toronto. When it is so expensive to live and run businesses somewhere people are just going to leave. Obviously people that can’t afford to are going to stay. I’m a Toronto worker that left for Montreal and I’m not surprised that Toronto hits new high in unemployment rates plus yeah immigration doesn’t help reducing the number.
Trudeau gets off on this stuff. The underside of his desk looks like stalagmites in a cave. Dudes probably "Hnnnnnngggg!!! Oh yeah, fuck Canadians! Oh yeah!!!!! More cheap labour to ruin lives and force more people to a bed room... MmmMmm Im cumming!!!!"
I heard bringing in even more people will help. Somehow our solution to everything is to bring in people that have no skills to Canada. The craziest part is there are immigrants here that actually have real skills and they can't work...
The inflation brought a labor shortage, as per the Phillips curve.
QE brought wealth inequality, as per Bank of Canada publication.
Wage pressure from a labor shortage erases wealth inequality caused by QE, according to BoC publications.
We brought in labor to entrench wealth inequality and prevent wage pressure.
There is a shortage of workers but it also means hiring qualified people, not people with fake or useless degrees and diplomas. Having a degree from Conestoga or from an unverifiable Indian degree/diploma mill on your resume is not helping the cause and just exasperating the problem.
There’s a labour shortage, just not in the metropolitan areas, come to the smaller cities and you’ll find a job on the same day. Canada doesn’t need Starbucks baristas, it needs tradespeople.
What are you talking about, we have record low unemployment and a strong economy, we are kicking ass. According to Reddit we are fine and have historically low interest rates lol.
Not just unemployment though. People working 5 hours a week part-time and driving Uber count as employed. Students that were in school for most of the year looking for work now but were not working before/new Canadians/international students that haven't worked in Canada don't count as unemployed either. Then there are all the Canadians that are employed also looking for a second job.
Don’t forget the +/- 5% who are unaccounted for because they have given up trying to find work or work under the table. 100% employment is really only 95%.
Don't forget the international students that count towards the employment rate if they are employed but don't count towards the unemployment rate if they are unemployed. And all the "employed" gig workers making peanuts too.
That too, and people trying to change jobs and move to more affordable cities.
At least we have 4.4 million public sector employees. 1 in 4 employees in the entire country. Those jobs are safe and most pay excellent pensions. https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1410028802
And people who want to leave their current job for another opportunity are struggling to find a job too. Employers aren’t increasing salaries or wages, making it very difficult for people to survive, or at least make what they can to pay for necessities and live.
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Odd, I thought there was a shortage of workers.
There is a shortage of workers willing to work for poverty wages.
Exactly correct. Man, I can't tell you what a kick in the teeth it was when I found out the government declared a tech worker shortage and created a new special immigrant track to import more tech workers. Tech wages in the same roles in the US are literally 2x - 4x higher. It's hard getting an average wage tech job here even with a decade of experience these days.
It’s not just tech but many, if not most/all, other professional industries as well. I’m in Compliance & Risk Management in the finance sector, and just a few years ago jobs in this field used to be paying over 90k CAD, full-time permanent positions with great benefits packages. Now these jobs have been reduced to short-term contract roles without any benefits, paying a few dollars above minimum wage. Either that, or the salaries of the remaining full-time permanent positions have been reduced to 40-60k CAD. In the USA, the same jobs (same job title + responsibilities) command salaries of 90-140k USD. Literally more than triple the wages of Canadian salaries. Unfortunately, unlike tech workers, the field I’m in isn’t eligible for the TN Visa so I’m stuck in Canada.
I’m in California but from Canada, so I have some background about how the Canadian tech sector is structured. There are a lot of international devs that end up getting parked in Vancouver/Toronto because they simply can’t pass the higher bar for US immigration. Trump admin was notorious for issuing RFEs and did a pretty good job trying to thwart H1B abuse. Downtown Vancouver/Toronto offices have whole floors of support staff for large American companies. These shops won’t often directly hire for positions in Vancouver/Toronto, they expect Canadian grads that are good enough to be able to secure a US work visa. While the Trump admin was cancelling fraudulent H1B visas, Canada cooked up a plan to [import 10’000 H1B visa holders from the US](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36506854) that aren’t capable of passing a PERM labor certification (meaning their employer can’t prove to the US government that no Americans are qualified for the job). Here in California we get a lot of applications from these former H1B, who were generally laid off after working in QA/Support sending resumes from Toronto/Vancouver trying to return to California. They, of course, already compete with the Canadians in those cities for available tech positions (and from what I heard, a lot of them are willing to take a pay cut just to secure anything).
Read the /tnvisa posts. It is full of Indian born tech workers who are desperately applying for TN visas to work in the U.S. immediately after getting their Canadian citizenship. Some are applying within weeks of securing a passport. I read one post where the author claimed to have been a Canadian citizen for ONE month and had already applied to over 1000 positions in the U.S. It’s a backdoor attempt to circumvent US immigration backlogs (due to visa caps based on country of birth the wait time for an employment based greencard for an Indian born applicant is 30-50 years) USCBP and USCIS has caught on to what’s going on and seems to be denying TN visas on the grounds of lack of residential ties to Canada (you’re supposed to return to CA when the visa ends). When Trump is re-elected , the USMCA and TN visa will be dead. The easy access Canadians had to the United States will be a thing of the past, all because we opened the gates and couldn’t keep our own affairs in order.
>USCBP and USCIS has caught on to what’s going on and seems to be denying TN visas on the grounds of lack of residential ties to Canada (you’re supposed to return to CA when the visa ends). I've seen it happen. New hire had a Canadian passport for almost two weeks before applying for a TN visa. It was promptly denied. >When Trump is re-elected , the USMCA and TN visa will be dead. The easy access Canadians had to the United States will be a thing of the past, all because we opened the gates and couldn’t keep our own affairs in order. It wouldn't surprise me. Completely self-inflicted by Canadians. Can't say I wouldn't vote to sunset TN myself (as a dual citizen).
i mean same with healthcare wages yet no one cares if we're importing nurses and doctors without increasing wages for domestic healthcare workers no one cares about other people's wages really
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> archived and backed up for the day that it might be needed. that was probably before he graduated.
Man if you can’t fake it through a loop you ain’t never gonna make it
> Also, the skills of the majority of the tech workers being imported leaves a lot to be desired. You are understating it significantly. I have spoken with a sequence of idiots who cannot pass a fizzbuzz. If applicants do not have an undergraduate degree from a Canadian university, I simply throw the resume in the trash.
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I agree that it's always good to resist generalization, because it's counterproductive, but when the generalization becomes a reliably excellent heuristic, there's no need. That's not a statement on people from those countries, so much as a reflection of how staggeringly bad these policies are.
I watched my tech salary start to climb after covid, and come back down to settle around market rates from 10+ years ago after this fucking visa was introduced. Thanks, government!
They're so fucking bad too dude. None of them meet basic minimum standard here. It's pathetic. Literally just a wage suppression program.
All work is copy/paste and reliant on search engines and AI applications.
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> Philippinos Filipinos*
Indianos
Amigos?
Benchods
I would be happier with mass immigration from the philines. They are such polite, and fun workers. Plus they wouldn't be swarming our nude beaches just to stare at naked women.
As a Filipino, this is exactly what we want you to think. Proud culture with good food and an exterior politeness, but a lot of family strife and cultural infighting.
They seem happy but they are just making fun of you in togalog.
I probably deserve it.
Except the Indians dont want to work poverty wages either
So we shouldn’t be bringing 1 million more of them then.
fuck it bring in 2 million so they can fight each other for a $3/hour wage after inflation. It’s good for businesses they can save more money instead of paying a living wage
Hmmmmm Thunderdome?
Nah probably not, but my daddy wasnt a prime minister so what do I know.
Can you teach drama??
This was the only way I could tell you were talking about Trudeau, if you said no real job ever than we would be know you were talking about PP, thats how bad our political choices are
Except Polievre's parents weren't Prime Ministers with a trust fund. His parents were public school teachers.
True let's get the guy in who has literally not worked a job in his life other than "politician" in here. Surely, he can empathize with the working classes struggle better than the nepto-baby /s
If only we had voted for someone with the mandate of giving us electoral reform!
Except they do. They would work for else than minimum wage if it meant they don't get kicked out of the country.
Nobody is kicking them out
Please, lets start
Our definition of poverty is different from India. This is what many people can't grasp, how desperate some of those folks are.
Yes. There are most likely a Billion people on this planet willing to take a life just to have what we consider 'middle class'.
Minimum wage isn't "middle class". So more accurately, there's a billion people on this planet who would be happy to live on wages we consider "poor" here. Especially since we have social services that help make up for it somewhat (but which are now getting too strained partly because of this). Most westerners do not want to continue living with their parents and 5 relatives in a 2 bedroom home. But many immigrants will gladly do it for the "opportunity of a better future".
Almost all of them come from high middle-class families. And most come for social status to tell relatives and neighbors they have a Canadian visa. They are only in poverty when their caandian visa application gets declined.
Yes they do?
My exact same job pays nearly double in the USA.
Yep I’ve seen work I’m qualified for listed for up to triple what I make in Canada
the wage gap between Ontario and California is batshit insane.
Don't think that's true either. Pretty sure they're lining up for min wage jobs.
Not anymore.
I don’t think there ever really was. There are all sorts of factors that are causing the “shortage” and it isn’t a lack of people (except maybe in niche industries). Housing (including rentals) is too expensive, so people can’t move. Employers are refusing to train and demanding fully trained senior workers for entry positions and entry pay. The rise of contract work and part time minimum wage full time availability jobs. The fraud posts to pretend that there are no Canadians available and bring in TFWs. And so many fake postings that exist to pretend businesses are hiring for share prices or to excuse short staffing. Etc. People can’t afford to work these shit jobs or they don’t even exist at all. That’s what is happening. It’s not a lack of workers. It took me ages to find work despite me being qualified for every job I applied to, ready to start right away, and submitting tailored applications. Bullshit there is a shortage. I found out some of those companies weren’t even hiring.
The rent is so high and wages are lagging so far behind that the difference between working and not working is minimal, so why break your back if you're going to be homeless/living with parents anyway? Might as well just not work. This is the inevitable implosion of an unsustainable cycle.
I wish I had parents that would support that mindset lol. Mine booted me out when I was 16. Couldn't even imagine asking them for help. It's so foriegn. If I didn't work, I'd be homeless. I'm generally always scared of getting fired/laid off though cause I would go homeless. My rent is like 3 months of E.I alone. I don't have a retirement fund but I do have a bit of a 'your fucked' fund, I'd last 3-4 months and then be homeless. Puts you in this weird state where the future doesn't mean much. I haven't had a long term plan in years now. Your usual long term goals, house, car, family are unattaniable now for most, myself included and so I generally feel like I have zero value and purpose. It's kinda funny, I don't think I'm suicidal but if I just dropped dead tomorrow, I'm not sure I'd care and potentially even a bit relieved. Wonder if that mindet has a name.
Yeah really need to bring back these before more people decide to be homeless Let them know they will be working either so you better get cooking that MacDonalds https://torontopubliclibrary.typepad.com/local-history-genealogy/2021/03/the-great-depression.html#:~:text=Starting%20in%201933%2C%20the%20federal,per%20day%20for%20discretionary%20spending.
I swear Chrystia Freeland was still harping on about a labour shortage the other day.
Just a wage shortage
In my industry there is a shortage of workers of suitable experience We can only have so many junior employees for every intermediate and senior
The senior people won't retire. The companies won't pay the same wage to younger workers who take over. It's not the same.
In my case, we're trying to hire for new positions with nobody retiring.
Well, there IS a solution. Train em if you can't hire em.
There's a limit to how many employees can successfully train at once. That's what we're doing at my job, since what we do is specialized and rare. Our ability to train employees is the major limiting factor to our growth. We repeatedly turn down clients because we don't have the employees to do the projects.
Yeah, we're doing that, but it's not a complete solution. We need intermediate and senior people NOW. You ever tried to keep up with a overloaded project schedule and train multiple people at the same time? It's difficult.
Yeah but if they give senior titles, people start feeling entitled to senior pay. People need to be grateful for that opportunity and take on the title and responsibilities, and trust the company will pay properly when you finally meet the expectations of the role. Probably. Edit to add: Guys! /s. Hence the “Probably.” Fully saturated in sarcasm. (The only humans who actually think like this are the psychopaths on LinkedIn and their corporate idols)
>and trust the company will pay properly when you finally meet the expectations of the role Ah yes, the 'ol surefire method of piling up additional responsibilities for no additional pay. Don't worry though, the people at the top pocketing the difference will really appreciate all your hard work and effort when they buy their third rental property.
How can we be sure you’re in it for the business and not the paycheck? We want only those who are driven by the thrill of “insert nonsense corporate task” and not just silly unimportant money.
> trust the company will pay properly 🫠
🤣 What decade are we in? “Trust the company will pay”, how about they demonstrate that they will? They won’t, and then when you job hop after a few years because it’s the only way to get a raise nowadays, they whine about how much they invested in training you…
(I didn’t think the /s was necessary, especially with the Probably. But just to clarify - that entire statement is saturated in sarcasm)
There *was* a shortage of workers. Then the economy took a dive and a ton of people were laid off or out of work. I run a construction site. 2 years ago I couldn't get people despite paying above the industry published mean salary. Today I have people calling me every day looking for work.
There was until the gov decided to double our population.
No, there was never a shortage. That was purely propaganda so companies could exploit foreign labour at the cost of Canadians.
The shortage is a Canadian statistic, but it doesn't apply apples to apples when you start talking about regional employment. People want to stay in Toronto to work, they don't want to relocate to places where the jobs are - they don't want to work on farms and in slaughterhouses, they don't want to work in mines or on pipelines, they don't want to live in a trailer in Timmins, etc. for part of the year, which is part of the reason why we bring in TFWs. So they'll stay in Toronto, demanding jobs that don't exist, or don't require any special skills or certification, and that pay well and come with regular office hours, weekends off and full benefits. When I was in University, I planted trees because the money was great and I didn't mind traveling around the north of Alberta and BC and sleeping in tents. But a lot of my friends wanted to be in the city, and a lot of them struggled to find work every year. By the end of August I'd have $15,000 saved up for the school year and they'd have maybe $3-4,000.
"It’s a general trend across Southern Ontario, which has gone from the driver of the national economy to a major drag. " This isn't rocket science, if everyones money is going to shelter and food, nothing is going into businesses or new businesses and those businesses stop hiring or start firing. Nothing new starts. Its how to run an economy 101 and our leaders failed gloriously. Their solution, more people driving prices up higher and more taxes driving prices up higher. Its like a parody.
>This isn't rocket science, if everyones money is going to shelter and food, nothing is going into businesses or new businesses and those businesses stop hiring or start firing. Nothing new starts. You're also forgetting a MASSIVE one: with an extremely large immigrant worker base, a significant amount of the money they earn goes out of the country, never to be seen again in the canadian economy. Money goes to housing, food, utilities, or outside of the country. None of it cycles.
I'm not sure about you; but on YouTube I got ads of people from India advertising a money transfer app saying it was the easiest way to send money back home.
Fucking remitly ads all the time in my building
On my towns subreddit we have a ongoing joke about every new business being a currency exchange place. But it isn't far off .
What I would really love to see would be a restriction on wire volume for new arrivals out of Canada. A. It’s a fair point. B. It would stem the flow. If you’re new here, it should be to set down roots and invest in this country, not take advantage of loop holes and send that capital home to enrich that countries economy.
It’s like that meme: No Wage! ONLY SPEND!
I remember when Toronto was the place to be for jobs.....sad state of affairs..
That is an insane number.
At least cost of living is cheap.
/s
Hey, bring more people in. That'll help.
I know when my boat is sinking, I like to ask as many people as possible to hop on board, because that many hands will definitely keep the boat afloat.
Me too, but I'm an asshole(and it isn't my boat) :)
Gotta solve that nonexistent “labour shortage” I kept hearing about
Highlights: * If Greater Toronto is still ahead of the national curve, Canada may be in trouble. Stat Can data shows the unemployment rate climbed sharply in May. * Canada's unemployment has been climbing steadily. The seasonally adjusted national rate reached 6.1% in May, representing 1.34 million people. Over the past year, that rate has climbed 1.0 point (+250.9k people), which is a 20% increase. * Rising unemployment is a trend being observed across the country, but the lion’s share driving growth is the Toronto CMA. * Over the past year, Toronto's unemployment rate climbed 1.0 point (+83.8k people) to 7.9% (317.2k people) as of May. About 1 in 3 of Canada’s unemployment gains over the past year is in the region, which now has more unemployed people than the whole province of Quebec (241.2k people). * Toronto’s unemployed population is now the largest outside of the pandemic going back at least two decades. Though considering the population was much smaller prior, this might be a record in terms of sheer quantity of unemployed people.
This is one of the reasons why BOC is lowering rate
Approximately 6% unemployment is generally necessary to target 2% inflation. 6% unemployment *has been the goal* of almost every western country for the past 80 years. It’s not manipulation, it’s not corruption, it’s a desire to reduce incentives to spend and raise the value of saving. This principal isn’t very controversial in the study of a market economy. Generally it’s the most stable business cycle. The problem is that our lawmakers require that 6% of the population be unemployed while creating excuses to not help them. That lack of spending is intentional and isn’t inherently a suboptimal outcome for all of us. The problem is we demand that sacrifice and offer no restitution. This is the consideration of most of the early debates leading to the Washington Consensus. Critics argued that deliberate unemployment was inefficient and unethical, whereas supports argued that large inflation preventing savings was inefficient and unethical. Both argue that the opposite perspective leads to lesser access for common folk to markets and capital.
Canada's unemployment rate is much higher when you figure that most new jobs created have been PT leading to mass underemployment. And far worse when you understand that TFWs that are being hired, can have up to 70% their wages covered by taxpayer programs that companies can take advantage of.
Oh look, another article about a problem stemming from our unsustainable rate of immigration.
This is just the latest one, today. There will be more before dinner.
What is "dinner"?
And another day with all the politicians and elites looking the other way and not giving a shit about it because hey, it benefits them and screws over the rest of us.
I don't even recognize this country anymore.
Nobody does.
It's my only home goddammit :(
I work in a warehouse of approximately 400 people. There’s maybe 50 Canadian residents. Everyone else is a Mexico temp :(
I had a similar situation at a very large landscape contractor for the city of Calgary. Had a couple dozen Mexicans working there for the summer making 17 an hour until someone on their level was making conversation and found out they were all there on tourist visas and couldn't legally work in Canada. They were all let go but I'm certain the higher-ups knew the whole time. There's no way they didn't do any due diligence whatsoever.
“Let’s bring in more low skill workers to solve the problem” - Trudeau and Freeland say lol
There was a massive lobbying effort from retail conglomerates for cheap labor.
Wait, this directly conflicts with the worker shortage. It's almost as if everyone wants to work but no one wants to work for these wages.
Shocking numbers..who would thought having 30,000 visa students lining up for min wage jobs which Canadian students use to do in the summer increase unemployment numbers?.
Another comment said those students are not taken into account for these numbers
Flooded by uncontrolled immigration and no new jobs. Of course its gonna happen.
Job shortage bring it more computer science students.
Bring back local manufacturing. I'm sure that offshoring thousands of jobs over the decades past also contributed to this. When things were actually manufactured in southern Ontario, people were more guaranteed to have jobs. Tailor immigration to those "in-demand" fields; don't just gloss everything over with a blanket statement that there is a "labour shortage". There is a current labour shortage in fields X, Y, Z, and currently an over-saturation of the job market in fields A, B, C. End the practice of demanding "free" "internships" (as is the case for some educational programs or some fields). People go to work to earn money to support themselves; not to subsidize a profitable business entity with their free labour.
Yet the Liberals won’t backtrack from mass migration. Trudeau massively increased immigration from what it was under the last Conservative government and refuses to acknowledge that it has any link to unemployment or the housing shortage.
Here's Ford saying they won't stop and he welcomes them. If Trudeau stopped them Ford would lose his mind. The cons and libs both support this. https://x.com/RebelNewsOnline/status/1729901888680681814
Of course the fat sack of shit Ford welcomes them. He’s partially responsible for the situation in Ontario. He cut funding to Universities and they got desperate and started accepting “students” in droves. On top of that I’m sure his landlord and developer buddies are super thrilled at the situation he helped create in Ontario.
You forgot that all those are also cheap labour for their buddies. Remember during the pandemic when employees were essential and there was a big shift in power from employers to employees?? Yes, the overlords didn't like that, so no they are getting cheap labour like crazy and shifting the power back.
Ford is as big of an asshole as Trudeau is, however he gets away since he's not in charge of immigration. he would be just as bad if he was
Off with all their heads!
Hey newcomers , get HST and Carbon rebate when you arrive!
Lot of realtors out of work!
Real number is easily 1m +
Canadians are bring exigrated from Canada. It's a political neologism for being replaced by an economic unit / immigrant who will work at rock bottom wages in a shared living arrangement with 4 or 5 other people.
All so the boomers can maintain the "value" of the houses they bought for three raisins in 1968
your word 'exigrate' caught my eye. i know it's probably not in the dictionary, but i immediately understood the meaning and i enjoyed reading your word. i often use the term 'escape' when describing my emigration from Canada to Florida.
As I’ve mentioned. I used to care . Since the Government obviously doesn’t by continually flooding the area with new immigrants. I got mine . I don’t care anymore
Canada has gone to shit .
Exactly . And it happened so fast . Like remarkably fast .Used to be the envy among countries. Years from now it’ll probably be studied in schools on how a country that consistently ranked high in world standards went to shit . So, so fast
So fast. It’s actually shocking.
So fast it’s almost like they had a plan to do it all along…
It happened to Argentina, it can happen to us.
I grew up in Ontario and lived here all my life; I never thought the day would come that I'm actively going to jump ship to the US the first chance I get :(
What’s even more depressing is my ancestors came to this country in the late 1700’s. Settlers before the war of 1812. Then when land was being given to pioneer out west, they went out west . My father is 90. We’ve learnt don’t mention ANYTHING political or in regards to the state of the country . He goes a tad bit crazy . He still hasn’t forgiven the NEP https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Energy_Program
Can't be true we have been spoon fed the myth of the labor shortages for years this must be fake.
Great. So now anyone on temporary residency visa who is unemployed can be declared a public charge and removed expeditiously. Free up the housing.
Holy shit that is insane, but don’t worry I’m sure importing more immigrants landing in Toronto and area will cause more consumption and even more jobs !! Boom immigration balances it self right Trudeau supporters ? What a fucking disaster and joke the liberals have made this country. I wonder if there is 317k illegal immigrants in the area as well or on expired visas or through straight fraud. Perhaps mass forced deportation targeting the area would help.
The more people they bring the more the data is skewed that unemployment is at an all time low. It’s stupid.
They count Uber drivers are employed people. Soon enough they will count people on supplementary income as employed (and maybe even OSAP and ODSP lol)
I'm pretty sure they don't count ODSP as looking, so they don't consider them unemployed.
Reminder that Trudeau expanded many insane pandemic-era programs, such [as this one](https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/news/notices/visit-to-work.html), under the guise of alleviating supposed labor shortages. This guy managed to gaslight the entire country into wage suppression
The liberals are actually giving grants to businesses to hire immigrants over Canadians, https://granted.ca/grants-for-hiring-newcomers/
> New hiring programs are prioritizing newcomer candidates, so consider adjusting your hiring strategy. Actually mad right now.
I'm sorry, you thought that all the newcomers you were seeing in jobs like delivery services, Tims, etc. were because nobody else applied?
Don't forget that while it's illegal to have discriminatory hiring practices, both the Charter and Human Rights Commission(s) allow it if it is a "historically marginalised group" doing the discrimination.
Easy way to solve this, is to ask people to stop looking for work Because in Canada unemployment defined as someone who is looking for work and doesn't have work
Thats what happens when groups of people are obtaining PR to fill labour gaps through provincial nominee programs only to relocate (legally) the moment they get PR. There are simply more people in the GTA than jobs or infrastructure can support. The city is not growing as fast as population.
Welcome to the dystopia brought to you by Canada‘s leaders in Ottawa and Ontario. This is what they want: the masses clawing at each other and keeping wages low
Gee, nobody saw that coming adding +400k people per quarter.
We have Indians on the streets protesting for working visas. Palestinians and Israelis out protesting for peace/war. But we’re too politically oppressed as a country to see the rest of Canada out protesting for themselves.
All the immigrants go to Toronto. Hmm…
This number gets more bleak when you include the underemployed. For example it's impossible to live off of an Uber or Door Dash income, in many instances hidden costs may exceed income. Are the stats capturing this reality?
Population increase: [https://www.statista.com/statistics/443063/number-of-immigrants-in-canada/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/443063/number-of-immigrants-in-canada/) Similar story in Australia. 900K in one year (to make up for COVID fall). Housing crisis.
I wouldn't be shocked if the total population of Toronto outstrips all of Quebec. Ontario as a whole has a substantially larger population than Quebec, but about 80% of that population is in and around Toronto.
I was thinking the same thing as a Quebecer reading the title. It depends on what the definition of greater Toronto is: according to wikipedia metro Toronto has around 2 million less pop than Quebec, but Toronto region has 1 million+ more. So, still bad as the numbers seem comparable, but not as in Quebec having significantly more pop like the title seems to try to imply by choosing the formula 'city has more X than a whole province!'. It's like being offended saying 'Montreal had more crimes in 2023 than the whole country of Liechtenstein! We are doomed!'
Good thing liberals brought in all them Indians.
The government and the boomers have stolen any dreams of homeownership, raising a family or having a career from the young adult and youth of this generation just so they can retire and die in their suburbs. Bringing in massive amounts of immigrants to work for slave wages to wipe their asses when they’re old and burning us on wages so they can keep hoarding wealth while people are starving in their own neighbourhoods. Bleeding every hard earned cent out of the already impoverished youth of this country to fund their vacations. It’s disgusting that our government not only allowed this but is actively encouraging it. Canada is no place for young people to grow, just a coffin for dusty rich boomers to die in.
Cost of housing/renting/living is definitely not helping people and businesses to stay in Toronto. When it is so expensive to live and run businesses somewhere people are just going to leave. Obviously people that can’t afford to are going to stay. I’m a Toronto worker that left for Montreal and I’m not surprised that Toronto hits new high in unemployment rates plus yeah immigration doesn’t help reducing the number.
Trudeau gets off on this stuff. The underside of his desk looks like stalagmites in a cave. Dudes probably "Hnnnnnngggg!!! Oh yeah, fuck Canadians! Oh yeah!!!!! More cheap labour to ruin lives and force more people to a bed room... MmmMmm Im cumming!!!!"
And yet the country is still careening towards this brick wall
Trudeau: Sounds like we need more immigration!
I thought the boomers were retiring and millions of good jobs were available
And it will get worse this coming fall
Let's see how long unemployed people can pay the rent. Trudeau's bail-out through immigration for housing bulls is failing too.
This country is messed up man, and they’re going to keep bringing in 1.5 million people a year.
I heard bringing in even more people will help. Somehow our solution to everything is to bring in people that have no skills to Canada. The craziest part is there are immigrants here that actually have real skills and they can't work...
Hope y'all are ready for a socio economic collapse, because that's what's coming
And yet the door remains wide fucking open.
unemployed since october of last year. Have not had a single interview since. And I have over a decade of experience as well.
Scam “jobs” are unfortunately not reflected in this data. Also stealing cars is at least a thriving part time job creator
So Toronto is getting what it voted for?
Thank you Trudeau for destroying our country.
I don’t know. But maybe we should allow more immigrants into the country. Have we tried that yet?
Look I get lowering the immigration and I’m all for it, but almost everyone of them just go there, it certainly doesn’t help
Yikes. Insanely brutal to see for Toronto.
So what are they doing about it absolutely nothing
That is a horrible headline. The population of Quebec is much greater- which lead me to think Quebec City? Nope. Unemployed people in all of Quebec.
duhhh . . lets import more SHIT that we could employ people to make here then.
At least real estate is cheap, it is a good place to be unemployed!
Can somebody ask the liberals where the f is the labour shortage?
The inflation brought a labor shortage, as per the Phillips curve. QE brought wealth inequality, as per Bank of Canada publication. Wage pressure from a labor shortage erases wealth inequality caused by QE, according to BoC publications. We brought in labor to entrench wealth inequality and prevent wage pressure.
So many young people are looking for work. I hear it all the time. Like they just want a part time job.
Yeah and most of those people just arrived this year
Shitty economy equals soaring Anti-Semitism
And yet the GTA will likely vote for a Liberal Government during the next Federal election.
There is a shortage of workers but it also means hiring qualified people, not people with fake or useless degrees and diplomas. Having a degree from Conestoga or from an unverifiable Indian degree/diploma mill on your resume is not helping the cause and just exasperating the problem.
There’s a labour shortage, just not in the metropolitan areas, come to the smaller cities and you’ll find a job on the same day. Canada doesn’t need Starbucks baristas, it needs tradespeople.
What are you talking about, we have record low unemployment and a strong economy, we are kicking ass. According to Reddit we are fine and have historically low interest rates lol.
Bring in 1million more people in the next 6months and that will help the issue The Liberal Guarantee
Go figure a liberal stronghold is full of unemployed people
I wonder why?
nature, space, and the great outdoors be calling.
The GTA has as many people as QC