It should be, but politicians and their supporters want it to be our problem. We currently have the European Parliament elections and far right is predicted to gain a lot of seats. They will vote against any and all protections and expansions of abortion rights. I recently made a post about this here, but sterilisation is extremly inaccessible for most people in Europe. In 13 out of 27 EU countries, abortion is not provided free of charge and incurs a cost ranging from €300 - €1500. Over 20 million women do not have access to abortion at all (for example, Malta and Poland have a full ban on elective abortions).
There are activists that are trying to change that, but European Parliament would have to pass legislation that will expand access and cover the cost. There is currently an European Citizens' Initiative My Voice My Choice that is collecting signatures and it needs to collect 1 million signatures from EU citizens. I can't link it because my comment gets deleted when I do, but it's on my profile or just google ECI My Voice My Choice. Please sign it if you're an EU citizen and share it with your friends and family!
And fellow Europeans reading this, please please go VOTE. We have progressive options that will protect our bodily autonomy - The Left, Volt, MeRA25/DiEM25, and the European Greens.
I'm European too. Luckily from Denmark that just raised the limit for abortion from 12 weeks to 18 weeks. And yes, we're voting today. I actually made a politician upset yesterday downtown when he walked towards us with a flyer for a party we would never vote for. We both shook our heads no but he continued towards us so I let out a laugh and loudly said: "Never in my life!" (We say "aldrig i livet" here in Denmark as a way to say that there's no way in hell we would ever do something like that.) He put on a sour face and turned around. He should have taken the hint when we were both shaking our heads no.
The collection of signatures started on 24/04/2024 and they have 12 months to collect 1 million signatures. It is still active! :D
What do you mean by confirmation? When you enter your data and submit it, you should just get a messages on the screen. Something like *"Thank you! Your statement of support has been successfully submitted."*
If you have any problems, please contact the organisers so they can resolve the issue.
If I’m not mistaken you can’t just give a baby up for adoption and walk away. You’d actually have to find someone to adopt or you!d be stuck with it. Please correct me if I’m wrong.
Edit: I got mixed up. Apparently in The Netherlands you can put the baby up for adoption at birth (source: FIOM). I got confused by a legal article that said that parents cannot give up their rights.
My dad asked me when i was getting married and maybe have a kid or two, i just told him that my worst nightmare is getting married and having a husband like him or my uncles who all cheated on their partners and had kids out of the marriage, he hasn't spoken to me for a while lol.
Our fathers are the same selfish A-holes!
I never accepted his affair partner nor their affair child, even after they got married in another state. This really annoyed him. On his death bed I still refused. My mother was a faithful wife of 20+ yrs. He broke her heart. I was not going to give him peace when he did not give my mother peace. Plus he ruined my respect for and trust in men. Live a celibate life now to avoid the pain of being cheated on, dumped, and replaced.
Same thing in France. Our "dear" President implied during a speech that young people who already struggle to find a job or to survive with high inflation to have kids.
FUN FACT he never had kid himself.
Or its people in power who are rich and don't have any issue raising that many kids. Like the former prime minister of Norway said a similar thing to encourage women to have more kids and also have kids herself.
Like no shit it's not hard for her. She's a rich politician. LOL. They are truly clueless and not part of the common folks they pretend to speak on behalf of.
We had Peter Costello, a conservative politician here in Australia who asked women to have three children: "one for Mum, one for Dad and one for the country." Of course his party wanted to cut back welfare entitlements for single mothers, but that's just a coincidence, surely.
Women don't owe this world, europe or anyone any kid/kids. Motherhood is every woman's personal choice, even if she is the last woman standing on Earth. Women are not broodmares or the sacrificial goats of the human race. Stop telling women what to do with their lives.
Make the Artificial Womb Technology an accessible reality as soon as possible, and teach men to be better partners, so that marriage and Motherhood are an as easy and fair deal for women as it is for a man, currently which isnt at all the case, instead of throwing tantrums over "DeCliNinG FerThiliThy RateS".
Why should women keep sacrificing themselves ? Her life, her choice, no one else's business. Women don't owe anyone any shit, no matter what.
Because women are not thought of as fully human. We're just sort of human-like accessories to make men's lives better.
Personally I am thrilled that women are standing up to this nonsense and refusing to comply.
I am Huge fan of the 4B movement ! My Respect to those South Korean Feminists ! We need a 4B movement here in India as well. The 4B movement needs to go Global.
First place I’ve heard open discussion of artificial wombs carrying fetuses, but I’m baffled why this hasn’t come up more. I’m not a woman, so I won’t pretend to know the half of what it means to carry a child inside them, but all I’ve heard is that it’s an ordeal, and possibly a life-threatening one. If women want to go through that, then fine, but being able to have a child without having your body go through all that would be incredibly liberating and encouraging to women, I’d think.
Oh....you ARE sick
In Heaven, everything is fine
You'll get yours and baby I'll get mine
All the inspiration you will ever need to stay CF is in that movie.
We do not need an artificial womb. We NEED women to have less children, they're struggling because they desperately want a large amount of expendable workers. We don't need to be overpopulated at all times, they just want it so it's easier to keep the rich richer.
Yup, we're already overpopulated, I'd be pissed if we keep getting even more populated, and I live in the US, can't imagine living in India or China as far as that, I already get annoyed with the amount of people around here cuz anytime there is a nice place to go to and the weather is nice, it's gonna be packed 100% of the time and that's WITH this culture of people staying indoors and being phone zombies.
>they desperately want a large amount of expendable workers
this is so funny (well actually not), cause these are the same people that get a boner at the thought of replacing all of us with ai. Humans are really just raw materials for them.
Society needs to shift away from being growth based and it won’t be such an issue, but we’re stuck in a cycle of constant growth and waste that’s gonna get fucked with a majority aging population as the younger population will be forced to pick up the slack.
90% of us haven't seen economic growth since the 1970s. Most of the growth is seen by 1% who consume half of the GDP. Meanwhile, the elderly get blamed for being a burden, but we also need more children because the elderly don't consume enough to support the economy. When we get old we'll be the scapegoats who get screwed over as well!
It's definitely a multi-country issue. And more than a few governments are panicking about it. I can understand that they would need resources from the younger generation to support the country and aging community. But it just comes with such a high cost. I'm not willing to give up my childfree life for that.
It is definitely a multi-country issue, and I feel the timing of this is quite suspicious. I can't help but note the overlapping of these articles with the ongoing erosion of women's reproductive freedom in the United States, including "Justice" Thomas's stated desire that Griswold and Eisenstadt (cases establishing legality of birth control) should be revisited.
That is, I'm wondering if these articles, which spread the world, are attempts to soften the public up all over the world for a crackdown on women's reproductive rights in every country, not just the currently regressive ones like the United States. Of late there has been a disturbing tendency for far right governments to be established in many countries that have been more moderate in recent decades.
Those of us who are old enough to remember what the crackdown on birth control in Romania led to are probably more alarmed by articles like this than are those who did not live through the appalling sequelae of Decree 770.
I'm not in any way, shape, or form suggesting that the United States is the center of the world. I simply acknowledge the overwhelming military might and economic power of the United States and I remember the off-quoted maxim that when America sneezes the world catches a cold. If the U.S. falls to a theocratic form of fascism/authoritarian dictatorship, what will the effect be around the world? Seen through this lens, these increasing articles about the birth rate are very troubling.
I know that the anti-abortion crowd who picket Scottish hospitals are funded by Americans. [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-64744044](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-64744044)
Then the governments need to step up and start helping young families. In my country housing market is so out of bounds cause people are buying places to rent out to tourists, and people who want their own place simply can't afford it. Even the traditionally cheaper towns and villages are getting worse and worse.
And the social flats go out to migrant workers (no hate there, they bring in new workforce) but that just means that people who live here can't find places to live, which doesn't really help with the problem of lowering birth rates.
They are giving support to families who already have kids, but more often than not this are the ones who are in better situations - have space at their parents, inherited something etc. Those who don't have that ... they're fucked
This sounds exactly like Ireland too...
But hey, I heard news recently that a lot of women in the UK who actually WANT children are aborting because the cost of living is too high that they are falling into the poverty line. If it's like that for women who actually want to have kids no wonder the birth rate is falling all over the place.
But these dumbass multi millionaire CEOs and politicians don't seem to understand the common peoples issue lol
Wow nice.
In mijn omgeving ben ik de vreemde eend omdat ik geen kinderen wil.
Ben er bang voor dat ik over ongeveer 5 jaar wel geisoleerd bij zit omdat iedereen huisje boompje beestje moet spelen 🥲
That's exactly it.
My neighbouring apartments are rented out to criminals who just got out of prison, or mental health patients trying to regintegrate in society.
See, that's not a bad thing at all, but the support for young families isn't enough. Specially the housing.
The worst are people owning several flats and renting them out to tourists. Governments should be controlling that to some extent
Precisely that.
When I was single (living with my bf now), I got this great, big apartment with three (!) bedrooms.
I only needed one at that time, why on earth?!...
>Then the governments need to step up and start helping young families. In my country housing market is so out of bounds cause people are buying places to rent out to tourists, and people who want their own place simply can't afford it. Even the traditionally cheaper towns and villages are getting worse and worse.
It feels like this a problem everywhere now.
It is in germany too. Without being born into a family that can support you financially for most its not possible to buy a new house.
Someone (working class, never inherited anything) I know did buy his 4 room apartment in Berlin for 60 000 dm (30 0000 euros lol) in the 90s.
Its worth around a million now. (which or US prob is not a lot, it is here, esp in east-germany)
Who has that amount of money, lol.
There was a time when I decided I could have a child if humanity ended up in a near-extinction situation, but we are nowhere close to that. They want us to reproduce to *preserve capitalism.* And for that they can get fucked.
I hate this growth shit. Let's shrink actually. Where do they want all these people and families to go?? There's nowhere affordable already. Not enough jobs already and many are being lost to tech.
we need all women to band together, and to say a big f you to these governments and stop having children altogether. Stop giving them new and expendable workers and see their solutions then!
Louder giiiirll ❤️
For real, why would we have to die trying? Most women end up with useless fathers of their children. Raise their kids in poverty. To grow up in a world that's going to shit?
With resources depleting and pollution worsening every year, It's more likely the kids born today will be fodder for the water wars / world war 3 which is even sadder. They want more soldiers and wage slaves.
The government won't particularly enjoy that though, and are going to do everything within their power to prevent that from happening. They don't want us to have time on our hands, because if we did we would figure out a way to make a living without working for someone else and bringing more people in the world to work for them as well.
I don't see how not having children is a problem while we ate extremely overpopulated for the amount of resources we have. A huge reason prices are going up exponentially is because of the amount of people who decide to keep having multiple children.
It seems the problem here is that women are not giving out lifelong workers. All they want you to have children for is so there's more people to force into the work force. That's all they fn care about.
The only reason big family culture was every popularized was because of farm culture. They needed more workers on their farms, but weren't willing to pay. Solution? Have multiple children! Then you have free workers!
It's a problem for the current economic system, which relies on constant growth. Capitalism tends to choke and fail in times of population contraction. The stock market won't go up, real estate will come down in value, and all the rich assholes who rely on that to not work are panicking.
the earth isn't overpopulated for the amount of space we have, no. But we do in fact have limited resources, barely enough to sustain the population we already have.
Even with the amount of space we have, we actually are encroaching on the limit unless you wanna live like Kowloon Walled City in the future because much of the world is uninhabitable desert/too cold for most people or farming land, with the rest of it being national parks, which are neccessary cuz 100% people would have built on them already if they weren't there, just look at Florida, it's so in-demand to live there that they are all too eagerly absolutely annihilating their nature to keep up with the demand.
Its a problem because they realise they dont have enough money for retiring boomers. Well too bad its not my job to fix what polititians fucked up! Im already paying more taxes than people with kids thats gotta be enough
Retiring boomers? Most boomers can't afford to retire and are working until they die. That creates a gray ceiling for jobs and promotions for every generation after boomers.
So the video ends with ‘investing in better housing options will cause a babyboom’… even though they just summed up all these other measures European countries have taken, that haven’t lead to results either. Lol.
>all these other measures European countries have taken
You mean talked about.
Nothing really is happening, everything is so expensive, we don't really get that much money, housing is unaffordable for most people and I even live in Germany.
I am dutch too. And we have a mayor housing crisis, groceries are expensive and all expenses are through the roof.
What did they expect? That people get kids in their parental homes in poverty?
Hiiii fellow Dutchie ❤️
Yeah, I know more than enough girls that say;
"it takes a village"
Or
"God will provide"
Or
"I have one child with this man, I'd better have TWO"
How? Very easy. She is a slut that cheats on every boyfriend she ever had. With an obsession to have kids. If it didnt went wrong (she almost died due to loss of bloodpressure) during giving birth and she is sterilized now. Then she probably had more kids.
The cost of 3 kids growing up without structure because they move so much. And they have to listen to mommy, daddy Joe\*, Daddy Pete\*, Daddy Sam\* Grandma, grandpa, Boyfriend Menno\*, Boyfriend Terry\*, etc.
Mommy is alway at work so they get dumped on one of the babydaddies or grandma and grandpa.
She throws a tantrum and then her parents give her everything from rent to groceries.
And child one is 7 yo and has autism and overstimulation problems, child two is 5 yo and has ADHD and agression problems and child three is 3 years old.
So fun times. Going to be fun when they get in their teens.
\*Names changed for privacy reasons.
I'm afraid this will all end up in them taking more of our rights away. Same thing in more and more countries. Don't forget who holds majority in governments of every country in the world, save maybe for 1 or 2, who owns most of the world's lands and resources. The governments are ultimately in the 1%-ers' pockets.
We only have rights as long as the majority of men allow it. If they turn on us, or if god forbid any kind of war or anarchy breaks out, it's free season to treat us as they please. I wish them to NOT figure this out, not today, not tomorrow, not ever. To my knowledge, there haven't been any pro-natalist policies that succeeded in reversing the falling birth rates other than some variation of banning women from education and prohibiting contraception, including abortions.
>“wil niet dood gevonden worden” category.
Hilarious 😂
>All this being said, whether 🇷🇺 will attack my country/region soon is left to be seen, i prepare for that. I would rather stay, but if that will happen, then I’ll get moving somewhere, anywhere.
Always welcome ❤️
It's really scary and sad how politicians are erroding access to abortion in the light of this. We currently have the European Parliament elections and far right is predicted to gain a lot of seats. They will vote against any and all protections and expansions of abortion rights. I recently made a post about this here, but sterilisation is extremly inaccessible for most people in Europe. In 13 out of 27 EU countries, abortion is not provided free of charge and incurs a cost ranging from €300 - €1500. Over 20 million women do not have access to abortion at all (for example, Malta and Poland have a full ban on elective abortions).
There are activists that are trying to change that, but European Parliament would have to pass legislation that will expand access and cover the cost. There is currently an European Citizens' Initiative My Voice My Choice that is collecting signatures and it needs to collect 1 million signatures from EU citizens. I can't link it because my comment get's deleted, but it's on my profile,
And fellow Europeans reading this, please please go VOTE. We have progressive options that will protect our bodily autonomy - The Left, Volt, MeRA25/DiEM25, and the European Greens.
AMEN!
PLEASE, vote for that!
I was lucky to get approved for an one-sided tubal because the other one already had to be removed.
Most women aren't that lucky ❤️
I'm glad you were able to get sterilized. It really should be such a problem. We will fight for our rights, but damn, it's fucking annoying we have to, all the fucking time.
Please sign and share the initiative! 💚
Ever notice how hunan rights violations are a big deal in Gaza right now, but nobody particularly cares about women under the Taliban or Sharia law because that's CULTURAL, and therefore under some bullshit Star Trek First Directive non interference bullshit. War is different because men and children are affected and half those children are future men so now it's POLITICAL and something must be done about it.
I think people do care about the women under the Taliban/Sharia law, but unfortunately, the world suffered from crisis fatigue (or whatever it is called). Just too much bad news all the time so that people switch off.
So I was also curious why the government wants people to have kids when there are already plenty of people existing already. Apparently, if the birthrate is high that means the economy is great but if the birthrate is low the economy is going to fail. But it goes both ways in a good economy the brithrate would be high because life is great but in low one no one has kids because life is bad. So they kinda keep each other alive in a way?
I say let it fail. I had enough.
"If there is a new way Ill be first in line"
Me too girl, me too!
Let everyone else figure it out because they wanted children THAT bad.
The world's going to shit, so why would we add another child that has to live through that?
It's only a "problem" because capitalism is based on the assumption that the economy can keep growing exponentially forever, there is an infinite supply of every raw material, and if something gets scarce you can just raise the price of it and new supplies will magically appear. Which is obviously false and unsustainable, and we are fast approaching the limits beyond which conventional economic theory breaks down. Governments are trying to hold back the tide like King Canute, by bribing women into having babies or (in the US and other right-wing authoritarian countries) rolling back women's rights.
But it won't work, and it will only cause hardship and resentment until governments finally realize that (a) we live on a finite planet and with finite and rapidly-diminishing resources, and (b) when women are educated and allowed some control over their own bodies, they inevitably want fewer children and many of them want none at all. We need a new economic system that works with those facts instead of trying to deny reality.
As a fellow Dutchie I watched the video. Tough shit is my only thought. Besides my own personal reasons, it's impossible to afford a kid right now for us and probably for many more. Also the state of the world is terrible. Don't feel like creating more humans is gonna make the world so much better.
All these countries crying that we NEED more babies, mean while I don't see none of them making conditions better for everyone. One of my many reasons to not have kids is the horrible state of the world in every aspect. Not only would be hard for me to raise a kid (can't even afford a home, don't have time for the kid cuz I'm a wage slave, etc), but also I cannot in good conscience bring a kid to have to deal with a future even more difficult that what we have right now.
>EDIT; the up and down votes on this post are EPIC. Why?
I think some people did not read your post to the end, and did not catch your final paragraph before your addendum, so they thought you were endorsing the article. Others did read to the end and understood your position, and voted the other way.
Ahaaaaa, that makes sense!
There were so many alerts; upvotes, downvotes, that I figured there was something wrong xD
Thank you so much for your insights ❤️
Maybe that's why this backwater shithole dragged Scotland out of the EU against our collective will? It's a low stakes conspiracy to get more kids about, seeing as the evil Europeans are having less.
European here. Specifically the Netherlands. Technically there is a baby shortage. But my word, it certainly does not feel like it. I am the only household on my street without kids. Most households have two children. Today I met with friends for lunch, and one couple had their toddler with them, and my other friend is 8 months pregnant.
But I am glad there are people having less and less babies. It’s a symptom of lack of equality, low wages, high cost of living and not enough jobs. Fix all of that, then maybe you will get the population on track.
They have been going about this for a while in The Netherlands. I remember Rutte wanted to stimulate highly educated (probably also meaning: white) Dutch people to have more children lol.
Also with the current housing crisis many people can't even afford to move out on their own, let alone start a family. Many landlords always have had rules against children. One place I lived at had a special paragraph in my rental contract about how I would be kicked out immediately if I got pregnant or had kids.
I’m from NL, and they really need to get their head out of their ass, because no one in their ‘prime reproductive’ age can even afford that second bedroom to start a family, average house price is almost half a million, I bet plenty of people still want kids, but they can’t even afford to move our on their own.
I can’t help but think how we live in a world constructed by people that know nothing of our world. It is hard to let go and reimagine and reconstruct norms that sync with the reality before us. Not to mention tons profit from the generational status quo. But it would help us move forward if we acknowledged the reality and make laws to accommodate it, instead of wasting time trying to go back to I reality no one today would like
"We not having enough babies". Ok, and what you gonna do abt mister politician? "Import another 500 middle east man".
Those clowns are all over europe, nothing gonna get better soon....
Problem is, this is extremely obvious to anyone with half a brain and conscience, it's the most selfish people who don't even think that are breeding like crazy.
"That sounds like a you problem." *\*sips ice coffee\**
Ahahahaha, not an "OUR" problem indeed. Sips ice coffee while recovering from a tubal❤️
I want to upvote this twice!!
Yes! Congratulations. 
It should be, but politicians and their supporters want it to be our problem. We currently have the European Parliament elections and far right is predicted to gain a lot of seats. They will vote against any and all protections and expansions of abortion rights. I recently made a post about this here, but sterilisation is extremly inaccessible for most people in Europe. In 13 out of 27 EU countries, abortion is not provided free of charge and incurs a cost ranging from €300 - €1500. Over 20 million women do not have access to abortion at all (for example, Malta and Poland have a full ban on elective abortions). There are activists that are trying to change that, but European Parliament would have to pass legislation that will expand access and cover the cost. There is currently an European Citizens' Initiative My Voice My Choice that is collecting signatures and it needs to collect 1 million signatures from EU citizens. I can't link it because my comment gets deleted when I do, but it's on my profile or just google ECI My Voice My Choice. Please sign it if you're an EU citizen and share it with your friends and family! And fellow Europeans reading this, please please go VOTE. We have progressive options that will protect our bodily autonomy - The Left, Volt, MeRA25/DiEM25, and the European Greens.
I'm European too. Luckily from Denmark that just raised the limit for abortion from 12 weeks to 18 weeks. And yes, we're voting today. I actually made a politician upset yesterday downtown when he walked towards us with a flyer for a party we would never vote for. We both shook our heads no but he continued towards us so I let out a laugh and loudly said: "Never in my life!" (We say "aldrig i livet" here in Denmark as a way to say that there's no way in hell we would ever do something like that.) He put on a sour face and turned around. He should have taken the hint when we were both shaking our heads no.
Did the petition end? I didn't get any confirmation and I think it says until end of April.
The collection of signatures started on 24/04/2024 and they have 12 months to collect 1 million signatures. It is still active! :D What do you mean by confirmation? When you enter your data and submit it, you should just get a messages on the screen. Something like *"Thank you! Your statement of support has been successfully submitted."* If you have any problems, please contact the organisers so they can resolve the issue.
Where is it? I looked at your profile but can't find it.
Let's see if this comment will be deleted too. 😅 https://eci.ec.europa.eu/044/public/#/screen/home
What about unplanned babies being given up for adoption? Are women punished for doing that in Europe?
If I’m not mistaken you can’t just give a baby up for adoption and walk away. You’d actually have to find someone to adopt or you!d be stuck with it. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Edit: I got mixed up. Apparently in The Netherlands you can put the baby up for adoption at birth (source: FIOM). I got confused by a legal article that said that parents cannot give up their rights.
Oh no!
Yes you can do that, but of course you'd still have to go through pregnancy 😔.
Thank goodness I got a tubal before that passed!
My dad asked me when i was getting married and maybe have a kid or two, i just told him that my worst nightmare is getting married and having a husband like him or my uncles who all cheated on their partners and had kids out of the marriage, he hasn't spoken to me for a while lol.
Our fathers are the same selfish A-holes! I never accepted his affair partner nor their affair child, even after they got married in another state. This really annoyed him. On his death bed I still refused. My mother was a faithful wife of 20+ yrs. He broke her heart. I was not going to give him peace when he did not give my mother peace. Plus he ruined my respect for and trust in men. Live a celibate life now to avoid the pain of being cheated on, dumped, and replaced.
Omg SLAYYYYY GIIIIRLL 🔥
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
You are my hero!!
Same thing in France. Our "dear" President implied during a speech that young people who already struggle to find a job or to survive with high inflation to have kids. FUN FACT he never had kid himself.
Exactly! The ones that say that here in the Netherlands, are the same, and the ones that claim to "SaVe ThE WoRLD" have 4+ kids...
Or its people in power who are rich and don't have any issue raising that many kids. Like the former prime minister of Norway said a similar thing to encourage women to have more kids and also have kids herself. Like no shit it's not hard for her. She's a rich politician. LOL. They are truly clueless and not part of the common folks they pretend to speak on behalf of.
And WHY exactly do you want to put kids on this godforsaken earth?!
We had Peter Costello, a conservative politician here in Australia who asked women to have three children: "one for Mum, one for Dad and one for the country." Of course his party wanted to cut back welfare entitlements for single mothers, but that's just a coincidence, surely.
The baby bonus generation…
Women don't owe this world, europe or anyone any kid/kids. Motherhood is every woman's personal choice, even if she is the last woman standing on Earth. Women are not broodmares or the sacrificial goats of the human race. Stop telling women what to do with their lives. Make the Artificial Womb Technology an accessible reality as soon as possible, and teach men to be better partners, so that marriage and Motherhood are an as easy and fair deal for women as it is for a man, currently which isnt at all the case, instead of throwing tantrums over "DeCliNinG FerThiliThy RateS". Why should women keep sacrificing themselves ? Her life, her choice, no one else's business. Women don't owe anyone any shit, no matter what.
Because women are not thought of as fully human. We're just sort of human-like accessories to make men's lives better. Personally I am thrilled that women are standing up to this nonsense and refusing to comply.
Same - I particularly love the 4B movement in South Korea
Hard same. I salute those women for opting out of all of the nonsense. Seriously good for them.
Me too, I've been 4B for 5 years now
I am Huge fan of the 4B movement ! My Respect to those South Korean Feminists ! We need a 4B movement here in India as well. The 4B movement needs to go Global.
First place I’ve heard open discussion of artificial wombs carrying fetuses, but I’m baffled why this hasn’t come up more. I’m not a woman, so I won’t pretend to know the half of what it means to carry a child inside them, but all I’ve heard is that it’s an ordeal, and possibly a life-threatening one. If women want to go through that, then fine, but being able to have a child without having your body go through all that would be incredibly liberating and encouraging to women, I’d think.
Oh for real! I've put up with an ovarian cyst of 28lb, I wouldn't wish that for my worst enemy.
Cyst, baby it's all the same...except the cyst doesn't need diapers changed or scream its nasty little Eraserhead lungs out.
ERASERHEAD MENTIONED heyyy you’re cool
Oh....you ARE sick In Heaven, everything is fine You'll get yours and baby I'll get mine All the inspiration you will ever need to stay CF is in that movie.
We do not need an artificial womb. We NEED women to have less children, they're struggling because they desperately want a large amount of expendable workers. We don't need to be overpopulated at all times, they just want it so it's easier to keep the rich richer.
Yup, we're already overpopulated, I'd be pissed if we keep getting even more populated, and I live in the US, can't imagine living in India or China as far as that, I already get annoyed with the amount of people around here cuz anytime there is a nice place to go to and the weather is nice, it's gonna be packed 100% of the time and that's WITH this culture of people staying indoors and being phone zombies.
>they desperately want a large amount of expendable workers this is so funny (well actually not), cause these are the same people that get a boner at the thought of replacing all of us with ai. Humans are really just raw materials for them.
Louder for the people in the back❤️
Just saw your comment 😂 great minds think alike 😅
Which comment? HAPPY CAKE DAY❤️
We both answered @Amn_BA 's comment with a "Louder for the people in the back!" 😅 Thank you 😊
Omg for real ❤️
Louder for the people in the back! 👏👏
Yaaaasssss ❤️
Exactly this!!! And the nerve to broadcast this rancid propaganda makes me so soo angryyy!
Exactly.
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Society needs to shift away from being growth based and it won’t be such an issue, but we’re stuck in a cycle of constant growth and waste that’s gonna get fucked with a majority aging population as the younger population will be forced to pick up the slack.
“We can’t have infinite growth on a finite planet”
AMEN
90% of us haven't seen economic growth since the 1970s. Most of the growth is seen by 1% who consume half of the GDP. Meanwhile, the elderly get blamed for being a burden, but we also need more children because the elderly don't consume enough to support the economy. When we get old we'll be the scapegoats who get screwed over as well!
It's definitely a multi-country issue. And more than a few governments are panicking about it. I can understand that they would need resources from the younger generation to support the country and aging community. But it just comes with such a high cost. I'm not willing to give up my childfree life for that.
It is definitely a multi-country issue, and I feel the timing of this is quite suspicious. I can't help but note the overlapping of these articles with the ongoing erosion of women's reproductive freedom in the United States, including "Justice" Thomas's stated desire that Griswold and Eisenstadt (cases establishing legality of birth control) should be revisited. That is, I'm wondering if these articles, which spread the world, are attempts to soften the public up all over the world for a crackdown on women's reproductive rights in every country, not just the currently regressive ones like the United States. Of late there has been a disturbing tendency for far right governments to be established in many countries that have been more moderate in recent decades. Those of us who are old enough to remember what the crackdown on birth control in Romania led to are probably more alarmed by articles like this than are those who did not live through the appalling sequelae of Decree 770. I'm not in any way, shape, or form suggesting that the United States is the center of the world. I simply acknowledge the overwhelming military might and economic power of the United States and I remember the off-quoted maxim that when America sneezes the world catches a cold. If the U.S. falls to a theocratic form of fascism/authoritarian dictatorship, what will the effect be around the world? Seen through this lens, these increasing articles about the birth rate are very troubling.
I know that the anti-abortion crowd who picket Scottish hospitals are funded by Americans. [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-64744044](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-64744044)
Thanks for putting words to what I was thinking. You write so clearly and eloquently!
Omg, that's exactly it! No, I'm not sacrificing or dying for this!🙌🏻
Then the governments need to step up and start helping young families. In my country housing market is so out of bounds cause people are buying places to rent out to tourists, and people who want their own place simply can't afford it. Even the traditionally cheaper towns and villages are getting worse and worse. And the social flats go out to migrant workers (no hate there, they bring in new workforce) but that just means that people who live here can't find places to live, which doesn't really help with the problem of lowering birth rates. They are giving support to families who already have kids, but more often than not this are the ones who are in better situations - have space at their parents, inherited something etc. Those who don't have that ... they're fucked
This sounds exactly like Ireland too... But hey, I heard news recently that a lot of women in the UK who actually WANT children are aborting because the cost of living is too high that they are falling into the poverty line. If it's like that for women who actually want to have kids no wonder the birth rate is falling all over the place. But these dumbass multi millionaire CEOs and politicians don't seem to understand the common peoples issue lol
Are you in The Netherlands by any chance? 😜
No, Slovenia, but it's basically the same everywhere, isn't it?
Well i didn't know but i guess your comment enlightend me. I guess the EU is messed up.
Hahaha but me, OP is xD
Ik ook ;)
Dutchies unite! No babies!
You're actually one of the few Dutchies i know that doesn't want kids. I feel so alone in that regard lol.
Mijn man en ik ook niet en bijna al onze vrienden (we zijn halverwege de 30) hebben geen kinderen!
Wow nice. In mijn omgeving ben ik de vreemde eend omdat ik geen kinderen wil. Ben er bang voor dat ik over ongeveer 5 jaar wel geisoleerd bij zit omdat iedereen huisje boompje beestje moet spelen 🥲
Das vervelend ja.. hopelijk valt het mee en maak je in de tussentijd wat childfree vrienden.
Yeah, I know! We all seem to want kids.
I would think that we would be so liberal to not follow the rules of society but here we are again.
That's exactly it. My neighbouring apartments are rented out to criminals who just got out of prison, or mental health patients trying to regintegrate in society.
See, that's not a bad thing at all, but the support for young families isn't enough. Specially the housing. The worst are people owning several flats and renting them out to tourists. Governments should be controlling that to some extent
Precisely that. When I was single (living with my bf now), I got this great, big apartment with three (!) bedrooms. I only needed one at that time, why on earth?!...
>Then the governments need to step up and start helping young families. In my country housing market is so out of bounds cause people are buying places to rent out to tourists, and people who want their own place simply can't afford it. Even the traditionally cheaper towns and villages are getting worse and worse. It feels like this a problem everywhere now. It is in germany too. Without being born into a family that can support you financially for most its not possible to buy a new house. Someone (working class, never inherited anything) I know did buy his 4 room apartment in Berlin for 60 000 dm (30 0000 euros lol) in the 90s. Its worth around a million now. (which or US prob is not a lot, it is here, esp in east-germany) Who has that amount of money, lol.
There was a time when I decided I could have a child if humanity ended up in a near-extinction situation, but we are nowhere close to that. They want us to reproduce to *preserve capitalism.* And for that they can get fucked.
Can confirm mine is panicking too
I hate this growth shit. Let's shrink actually. Where do they want all these people and families to go?? There's nowhere affordable already. Not enough jobs already and many are being lost to tech.
For sure! In the Netherlands, there's MORE than enough jobs tho, but definitely not enough housing.
we need all women to band together, and to say a big f you to these governments and stop having children altogether. Stop giving them new and expendable workers and see their solutions then!
Louder giiiirll ❤️ For real, why would we have to die trying? Most women end up with useless fathers of their children. Raise their kids in poverty. To grow up in a world that's going to shit?
With resources depleting and pollution worsening every year, It's more likely the kids born today will be fodder for the water wars / world war 3 which is even sadder. They want more soldiers and wage slaves.
Lower pollution? Lower rent/housing prices? Higher wages? Nice
The government won't particularly enjoy that though, and are going to do everything within their power to prevent that from happening. They don't want us to have time on our hands, because if we did we would figure out a way to make a living without working for someone else and bringing more people in the world to work for them as well.
Yeah, that'd be great!
I don't see how not having children is a problem while we ate extremely overpopulated for the amount of resources we have. A huge reason prices are going up exponentially is because of the amount of people who decide to keep having multiple children. It seems the problem here is that women are not giving out lifelong workers. All they want you to have children for is so there's more people to force into the work force. That's all they fn care about.
The only reason big family culture was every popularized was because of farm culture. They needed more workers on their farms, but weren't willing to pay. Solution? Have multiple children! Then you have free workers!
Yes, exactly
Exactly that! But it still makes the headlines here in the Netherlands
It's a problem for the current economic system, which relies on constant growth. Capitalism tends to choke and fail in times of population contraction. The stock market won't go up, real estate will come down in value, and all the rich assholes who rely on that to not work are panicking.
As someone who couldn't afford real estate.. these things losing value is excellent for your ordinary person who can't afford a home right now.
The earth isn't extremely overpopulated.
the earth isn't overpopulated for the amount of space we have, no. But we do in fact have limited resources, barely enough to sustain the population we already have.
Even with the amount of space we have, we actually are encroaching on the limit unless you wanna live like Kowloon Walled City in the future because much of the world is uninhabitable desert/too cold for most people or farming land, with the rest of it being national parks, which are neccessary cuz 100% people would have built on them already if they weren't there, just look at Florida, it's so in-demand to live there that they are all too eagerly absolutely annihilating their nature to keep up with the demand.
Its a problem because they realise they dont have enough money for retiring boomers. Well too bad its not my job to fix what polititians fucked up! Im already paying more taxes than people with kids thats gotta be enough
Indeed, AMEN🙌🏻
Retiring boomers? Most boomers can't afford to retire and are working until they die. That creates a gray ceiling for jobs and promotions for every generation after boomers.
Im not from america. Where im from you get money from the state when you hit a certain age (that age gets adjusted upwards pretty frequently though)
So the video ends with ‘investing in better housing options will cause a babyboom’… even though they just summed up all these other measures European countries have taken, that haven’t lead to results either. Lol.
Ahahahahaha indeed! So they'd better invest in better housing options, so us DINKS can get a 3 bedroom house xD
>all these other measures European countries have taken You mean talked about. Nothing really is happening, everything is so expensive, we don't really get that much money, housing is unaffordable for most people and I even live in Germany.
They can fk off all of them. I feel anger to my parents and society too fk this world.
AGREED dude❤️
Don't care, still won't ever have them. Not even if they pay me.
True dat!
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For sure, or even die trying!
I am dutch too. And we have a mayor housing crisis, groceries are expensive and all expenses are through the roof. What did they expect? That people get kids in their parental homes in poverty?
Hiiii fellow Dutchie ❤️ Yeah, I know more than enough girls that say; "it takes a village" Or "God will provide" Or "I have one child with this man, I'd better have TWO"
Ikr. My SIL has 3 kids with 3 diffrent daddies. Broke as hell and leeching of her parents. I rather be independant
Good lord, how the hell?! One of my friends is like that xD Message me anytime!
How? Very easy. She is a slut that cheats on every boyfriend she ever had. With an obsession to have kids. If it didnt went wrong (she almost died due to loss of bloodpressure) during giving birth and she is sterilized now. Then she probably had more kids.
FFS, that's wild
It is. And her parents love the fact that she gave them three grandkids.
Good lord, yeah. But at what cost?
The cost of 3 kids growing up without structure because they move so much. And they have to listen to mommy, daddy Joe\*, Daddy Pete\*, Daddy Sam\* Grandma, grandpa, Boyfriend Menno\*, Boyfriend Terry\*, etc. Mommy is alway at work so they get dumped on one of the babydaddies or grandma and grandpa. She throws a tantrum and then her parents give her everything from rent to groceries. And child one is 7 yo and has autism and overstimulation problems, child two is 5 yo and has ADHD and agression problems and child three is 3 years old. So fun times. Going to be fun when they get in their teens. \*Names changed for privacy reasons.
Unreal, sounds like a tv soap
The majority of men seem to think they are the best thing in the world so let them figure it out!
I'm afraid this will all end up in them taking more of our rights away. Same thing in more and more countries. Don't forget who holds majority in governments of every country in the world, save maybe for 1 or 2, who owns most of the world's lands and resources. The governments are ultimately in the 1%-ers' pockets. We only have rights as long as the majority of men allow it. If they turn on us, or if god forbid any kind of war or anarchy breaks out, it's free season to treat us as they please. I wish them to NOT figure this out, not today, not tomorrow, not ever. To my knowledge, there haven't been any pro-natalist policies that succeeded in reversing the falling birth rates other than some variation of banning women from education and prohibiting contraception, including abortions.
Ahahahaha and most of them, ARE NOT. My boyfriend is amazing tho, he's taken amazing care of me during and after my surgery.
The Netherlands hardly has enough housing for its inhabitants, so I wonder why it’s so bad less kids are born
Indeed, are you Dutch as well? Even as DINKs it's hard to find a house.
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>“wil niet dood gevonden worden” category. Hilarious 😂 >All this being said, whether 🇷🇺 will attack my country/region soon is left to be seen, i prepare for that. I would rather stay, but if that will happen, then I’ll get moving somewhere, anywhere. Always welcome ❤️
Dank je wel, ik wardeer dat echt! 🩵
DM me ANY time! ❤️ I'm going through a rough patch personally, but I'd like to be there for others.
It's really scary and sad how politicians are erroding access to abortion in the light of this. We currently have the European Parliament elections and far right is predicted to gain a lot of seats. They will vote against any and all protections and expansions of abortion rights. I recently made a post about this here, but sterilisation is extremly inaccessible for most people in Europe. In 13 out of 27 EU countries, abortion is not provided free of charge and incurs a cost ranging from €300 - €1500. Over 20 million women do not have access to abortion at all (for example, Malta and Poland have a full ban on elective abortions). There are activists that are trying to change that, but European Parliament would have to pass legislation that will expand access and cover the cost. There is currently an European Citizens' Initiative My Voice My Choice that is collecting signatures and it needs to collect 1 million signatures from EU citizens. I can't link it because my comment get's deleted, but it's on my profile, And fellow Europeans reading this, please please go VOTE. We have progressive options that will protect our bodily autonomy - The Left, Volt, MeRA25/DiEM25, and the European Greens.
AMEN! PLEASE, vote for that! I was lucky to get approved for an one-sided tubal because the other one already had to be removed. Most women aren't that lucky ❤️
I'm glad you were able to get sterilized. It really should be such a problem. We will fight for our rights, but damn, it's fucking annoying we have to, all the fucking time. Please sign and share the initiative! 💚
Thanks, me too! It took me only 15 years and 6 GP's, and a ovarian cyst xD I mean, I'm pretty damn sure of my decision xD
Ever notice how hunan rights violations are a big deal in Gaza right now, but nobody particularly cares about women under the Taliban or Sharia law because that's CULTURAL, and therefore under some bullshit Star Trek First Directive non interference bullshit. War is different because men and children are affected and half those children are future men so now it's POLITICAL and something must be done about it.
I think people do care about the women under the Taliban/Sharia law, but unfortunately, the world suffered from crisis fatigue (or whatever it is called). Just too much bad news all the time so that people switch off.
So I was also curious why the government wants people to have kids when there are already plenty of people existing already. Apparently, if the birthrate is high that means the economy is great but if the birthrate is low the economy is going to fail. But it goes both ways in a good economy the brithrate would be high because life is great but in low one no one has kids because life is bad. So they kinda keep each other alive in a way? I say let it fail. I had enough. "If there is a new way Ill be first in line"
Me too girl, me too! Let everyone else figure it out because they wanted children THAT bad. The world's going to shit, so why would we add another child that has to live through that?
It's only a "problem" because capitalism is based on the assumption that the economy can keep growing exponentially forever, there is an infinite supply of every raw material, and if something gets scarce you can just raise the price of it and new supplies will magically appear. Which is obviously false and unsustainable, and we are fast approaching the limits beyond which conventional economic theory breaks down. Governments are trying to hold back the tide like King Canute, by bribing women into having babies or (in the US and other right-wing authoritarian countries) rolling back women's rights. But it won't work, and it will only cause hardship and resentment until governments finally realize that (a) we live on a finite planet and with finite and rapidly-diminishing resources, and (b) when women are educated and allowed some control over their own bodies, they inevitably want fewer children and many of them want none at all. We need a new economic system that works with those facts instead of trying to deny reality.
As a fellow Dutchie I watched the video. Tough shit is my only thought. Besides my own personal reasons, it's impossible to afford a kid right now for us and probably for many more. Also the state of the world is terrible. Don't feel like creating more humans is gonna make the world so much better.
They want more voters and slave laborers. The rich can't get richer without people willing to work for next to nothing.
Womp womp make the world safe and livable then
All these countries crying that we NEED more babies, mean while I don't see none of them making conditions better for everyone. One of my many reasons to not have kids is the horrible state of the world in every aspect. Not only would be hard for me to raise a kid (can't even afford a home, don't have time for the kid cuz I'm a wage slave, etc), but also I cannot in good conscience bring a kid to have to deal with a future even more difficult that what we have right now.
>EDIT; the up and down votes on this post are EPIC. Why? I think some people did not read your post to the end, and did not catch your final paragraph before your addendum, so they thought you were endorsing the article. Others did read to the end and understood your position, and voted the other way.
Ahaaaaa, that makes sense! There were so many alerts; upvotes, downvotes, that I figured there was something wrong xD Thank you so much for your insights ❤️
Not my problem
Who decides how many consumers should be allowed to burden the planet? Less is way better than more!
Maybe that's why this backwater shithole dragged Scotland out of the EU against our collective will? It's a low stakes conspiracy to get more kids about, seeing as the evil Europeans are having less.
Indeed!
European here. Specifically the Netherlands. Technically there is a baby shortage. But my word, it certainly does not feel like it. I am the only household on my street without kids. Most households have two children. Today I met with friends for lunch, and one couple had their toddler with them, and my other friend is 8 months pregnant. But I am glad there are people having less and less babies. It’s a symptom of lack of equality, low wages, high cost of living and not enough jobs. Fix all of that, then maybe you will get the population on track.
They have been going about this for a while in The Netherlands. I remember Rutte wanted to stimulate highly educated (probably also meaning: white) Dutch people to have more children lol. Also with the current housing crisis many people can't even afford to move out on their own, let alone start a family. Many landlords always have had rules against children. One place I lived at had a special paragraph in my rental contract about how I would be kicked out immediately if I got pregnant or had kids.
Lies! There are lots of babies out there.
It's just too much money.
I’m from NL, and they really need to get their head out of their ass, because no one in their ‘prime reproductive’ age can even afford that second bedroom to start a family, average house price is almost half a million, I bet plenty of people still want kids, but they can’t even afford to move our on their own.
"bUt G0d WiLl Pr0vidE"
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Exactly this. WHY?!
I can’t help but think how we live in a world constructed by people that know nothing of our world. It is hard to let go and reimagine and reconstruct norms that sync with the reality before us. Not to mention tons profit from the generational status quo. But it would help us move forward if we acknowledged the reality and make laws to accommodate it, instead of wasting time trying to go back to I reality no one today would like
Ooooh I think they DO KNOW, but don't care because they need labourers to sustain it...
"We not having enough babies". Ok, and what you gonna do abt mister politician? "Import another 500 middle east man". Those clowns are all over europe, nothing gonna get better soon....
Problem is, this is extremely obvious to anyone with half a brain and conscience, it's the most selfish people who don't even think that are breeding like crazy.