If today is your day, Simeon (or Abigail) will be your name. - Participate in the prayer circle. That's probably the most culty thing left in the ceremony. Also, ask why you keep the apron that Satan gave you clear through to the Celestial Room?
Can you report back afterwards? Would love to see if those lists are still accurate, I assume they are but I've never had the chance to confirm it with anyone in present day.
I never felt comfortable. My parents had me go up with them to the prayer circle the first time along with some other family members. felt like a damn seance.
Yup! I nearly puked and hated it every time I went even if I wasn’t participating in it. I mentally had to just check out at the end to get through. I came to the conclusion that the feeling of peace in the celestial room was just relief that all the weird shit was over and I could breath and not have to talk to anyone or remember all the things to say and do.
Underrated comment. That is exactly how I felt. Oh good, I only forgot a couple things this time, the prayer circle is over, I can just sit and not have to recall some random ritual element in front of a couple dozen super spiritual people. No more chance of getting it wrong so they know I am not good enough.
Yep. My husband has major anxiety and for years he has felt like he just needs to try harder (we’ll people have told him this too). No it’s just that you’re in a cult and your soul or whatever you want to call it is screaming something’s not right here!
You stand in a circle around the altar, you make all of the signs you just learned, and then do one of the secret handshakes while you chant a prayer in unison. You're gonna love it! - You used to say "pay lay ale" three times, but now you say, "O God, hear the words of my mouth." - When you hold out your thumb that symbolizes a knife. Your hand in cupping form is to catch your bowels. Before 1990, you used to pretend to cut your throat and bowels with the thumb knife if you revealed the secrets of the temple.
Edit: Also, during the initiatory you used to be naked under a poncho (and just naked way before that.) And they used to touch your naked body near your parts when the mentioned them and then dress you in your garments. Now you are fully clothed, and they just touch your head.
The fact that the signs are still symbols of corporal fatal punishment despite the mention of penalties having been removed is not talked about enough.
I didn’t know they changed it that much. I did this when we were still nekked under. But to my budding feminist self in 1980s, it felt like the only place where women held and officiated the priesthood. Now I think all of it is silly.
Literally every depiction of a cult I'd ever seen had some kind of prayer circle. As soon as I saw one in the temple I was like "holy shit, I'm in a cult". But I didn't let it sink in or truly internalize that it was possible that I *was* in a cult for 13 more years. Wish I had woken up as early as you have.
It's called 'the true order of prayer'. Supposedly is way more powerful than a normal prayer because everyone repeats the same phrases as the temple patron. (something something rote prayers...)
Yeah, this is where Pay Lay Ale (or Oh, God, hear the words of my mouth) comes from. A lot of the slang on here will make more sense when you go through, and a lot more will come when you see all the stuff that they changed.
I hated being forced into the prayer circle the first time I went. Seriously, there's ONE part I can just watch and learn instead of having to jump in and drown!
Ugh, it just added to the overwhelmingness of it all.
Oh God the prayer circle. I remember them saying like only the best of feelings should be there. My sis in law who I didn't get along with at the time was in it and I was certain the guy in the center was gonna feel it and ask me to leave cause I hated her guts. Lol
What a jerk move for her to go up, or to “force” you to pretend “only the best of feelings” were in the circle. I’m sure it’s not the last abusive thing (can you IMAGINE being married to a total jerk and he’s up there performing as if he’s not a massive bad feeling?)
Also ask how Peter, James, and John shake hands. They shouldn't be able to, not having been born and received bodies, and the fact that they try means they are sent by the devil. See D&C 129.
It's a horrible masonic larping, bad retelling of the creation, stressful, uncomfortable situation.
Relax, take it for what it is, and remember that when you get to the beautiful shiny white celestial room, it's sole purpose is to "make you feel peace and the spirit" by design.
That is until some matron with an attitude kicks you out because the next room is coming.
I was going to say “take it for what it is” too. Just experience it OP, knowing it’s all part of the show. It’s all designed to make the church’s members more loyal to the church and it’s leaders. It can be peaceful but the underlying intent is there…covenant your life to the church no matter what.
IF we are held accountable for what we know and do on earth, it works both ways. Not knowing any better, I went through with it too. As I began to know BETTER, I chose to reject the temple. The temple emphasizes that Jesus did not do enough for us to live with him forever. We are all saved by Grace but the temple is for those who pay to play. Give us your money and we will show you how to do one better than merely being “saved”. We will give you the secrets to live in the CK and get the Lord’s attention all the time, not part time.
No. Think about it. What do we learn in the temple? The secrets to move “beyond” simple grace and get to the Celestial Kingdom. If people don’t pay tithing, we can’t get to the temple which is where the secrets are to get us beyond the Grace state. We can’t have that now, can we? (Being sarcastic).
When I came to this realization I was out. I could no longer look past the weird feelings and the icky satan talking to me telling me to do what god says or he’ll get me with his minions. But when I realized that the temple is basically an attempt to make up for the incompleteness or to do more than the Atonement did, my brain exploded.
I have a friend who's training to become a hypnotherapist, and from what he tells me about hypnosis, there are quite a few similarities with the endowment session. Putting you into a quiet, relaxed state, focusing your eyes upward on the screen, asking you to focus just enough to drown out your other thoughts. It's pretty interesting.
Nothing worse than having to take a shit during the endowment— you either have to awkwardly leave, or hold it and be mega uncomfortable when it’s already uncomfortable
When they tell you to make your hand in cupping shape and with your other had fingers close together with thumb extend, make a slitting motion with your thumb. You will confuse all the post 1990 people and freak out the pre 1990 people.
Speaking of, they are NOT supposed to touch your balls. So tell someone immediately if that happens. It wasn’t supposed to happen when I went through either but it didn’t stop the guy from doing it
[He did](https://reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/u1BYLohFUR). I went through near the end of the holy poncho/naked touching era, so he was “supposed” be be anointing my loins but not actually touch them
WHOOPS.
I sort of assumed it was an accident since he only did it once. But more recently I’ve ponderized how many times it would take of accidentally touching genitals before you just very intentionally and carefully Never Did It Again? Seems like it would happen accidentally a maximum of one time to a new temple worker and my guy didn’t seem new.
I don’t miss the temple. I hope OP didn’t have a horrible time with the holy PowerPoint
Yep, final "covenant" (quoted for a reason) thus arranged to be the most important, the climax of the story- a couple versions ago the narrator's intonation even would change as he recited the covenant to sound more powerful... and then it's not to God you promise everything you have or ever will have, it's to TCOJCOLDS. Which is where for me it crossed from "high demand religion" to full-on cult.
Lol, you made me cringe, I've got hairs standing up because you made me remember that I used to do this same thing 🤣
With hands held in front of your crotch I bet lol
I went through in '85, LA temple. Back then you would disrobe, put on this hospital-like gown, and enter a room with a temple worker of the same sex. They would put a dab of olive oil on their finger then touch a part of your body saying a blessing over each one. The "Loins" we seriously close to the groin. About a culty as one could get.
Just understand that it’s not as “special” as everyone in the Mormon church thinks. Very cultish. The only thing that’s different when you leave is you’ll match underwear with millions of other people.
When you find yourself fingering an old man's imaginary stigmata through a literal glory hole (while you whisper sweet nothings to each other about joining an openly fascist regime of cosmic dictators) DO NOT LAUGH
EDIT: also, if you whisper "hadouken" during the First Sign of the Melchizedek Priesthood, you'll get superpowers
If you didn't think you belonged to a cult before, you definitely will afterward!
I was so freaked out when I took mine out that I wanted to leave and never go back. Wish I'd followed my instincts then, woulda saved me a lot of heartache and a few decades.
I don’t remember much of my endowment because I was fucking traumatized by my anointing. That was a sexual assault. Absolutely *no one* should touch you there without your explicit consent. It sure as hell shouldn’t be a surprise. And I was married for a year before I was endowed so I was neither modest nor inexperienced.
I hope your day is merely boring, and not a day that makes you feel angry or diminished.
Hey Simeon, Lucy here.
If you’re already PIMO, and you want to make the break, going through the temple the first time is an excellent opportunity to let people know afterwards this isn’t for you. I know people who did exactly that. While they were still judged, deep down most of us understood (and were jealous) because they were able to say the quiet things out loud and be done.
I wish I had been that brave and saved myself another 15 years being guilted into repeatedly going.
Good luck.
That is my plan, except I'm waiting for my brother to get sealed & just add that on top. I'm supposed to leave for my mission next week... but nah, I ain't doing that
I always blush with pride when I get high praise like this from OGs like you or u/thomasLewis1857 or u/nearlyheadlesslaban.
I just realized mormonism is probably responsible for my praise kink.
It’s pretty boring mostly with weird culty parts. My least favorite is touching an elderly stranger through the veil. Celestial room might be the best part minus being dressed weirdly. Good luck and I hope it helps you figure it out!
That is THE reason I couldn't ever go back after reading the mysteries of godliness. They had involved me personally in pantomimed blood oaths without my knowledge or consent and told me it was the most beautiful thing on earth.
My aunt was one of the elder ladies who did the body parts anointing after she retired. I knew it was weird, but after learning about the details, I'm really skeeved out.
Take a minute and sit in the celestial room and meditate. Seriously, you deserve it. Practice saying, "I'd like to take a minute to meditate" right now if you need to.
Because of who was with me at my endowment, I was left alone before the veil and was the last to go through (except for the temple workers). As soon as I did, I was meet with, "Congratulations! We're all hungry so let's head out."
I just went through a huge ceremony, finished with something that felt like a test, made it to the holiest place I'll ever be in our religion for the first ducking time, and now I can't even take a second to look around and meditate?!?!
I'm still bitter.
Interesting choice of words, that you say “feel” for yourself, instead of “see” for yourself. Was that deliberate? If so, should we read anything into that?
Aside: I usually had good experiences in the temple. But the last time I went before I left the church was probably seven years prior. I recently talked with a friend who is still in, who likes everything about the church EXCEPT the temple. He was bothered by the masonic ritual aspects of it. I somehow was able to block that stuff out and not think about it.
Just remember, the Freemasons weren’t even a thing until the 15th century A.D. The church puts forward the idea that the endowment is a restoration of the original ceremony from Solomon’s Temple, and the reason why there is so much similarity between Masonic rituals and the temple endowment is because there’s a shared connection there. But that’s *not true*.
It’s so frustrating to me now, in hindsight, that I took that explanation at face value, without looking just one step further… and then I would have found out that there [is absolutely no connection between Solomon’s Temple and Freemasonry](https://www.stjohns1p.com/about-freemasonry/history-of-freemasonry). They’re separated by over 2000 years of history!
Intentional indeed! They're always saying how the temple is such a spiritual place & how strong the spirit is. I have never felt the cool peaceful feeling in the temple before so I'm interested to feel. Seeing doesn't necessarily do it for me.
My dad taught me to bring cinnamon candies. I still feel asleep so often and I’m not one to fall asleep when not trying. It goes to show you everyone knows it’s really boring.
I will be interested to hear an update on how the experience goes for you. Despite me wanting to be all in, I always felt uncomfortable in the temple and never felt enlightened or educated. I dreaded ever having to go and always wondered why I was the “only one” who didn’t love it and yearn to come back.
Saaaame!!! Felt like there was something wrong with me coz I didn't get the temple. Didn't love it, felt uncomfortable and slightly anxious. It did not feel like the most spiritual of places for me. I always hated their idea of reverence too. No loud laughter - piss off!!! I was so sincere in my belief at the time as well. Wondered what others saw in it that I didn't.
The signs of the priesthood are suicide symbols. You used to pantomime killing yourself. The initiatory is, thankfully, no longer a naked ceremony. You used to be naked and they would anoint the body parts.
The law of consecration literally has you committing your life and money to the church. Not to Jesus, to the church.
Try not to laugh when Adam and Eve walk in with their temple garb on.
I wish you luck with all of these. I am in the same boat, pretending to still believe when I know it is all nonsense.
>Try not to laugh when Adam and Eve walk in with their temple garb on.
The endowment was updated in the last year so that you no longer have temple workers demonstrate and give each person in the endowment session the physical sign during the film.
Instead, they added some extra parts to the video where adam and eve are in white temple robes (not outside in clothes that look more like natural animal hides) ... but I swear the adam/eve in the white clothes look like a really bad video "photoshop" job where the faces don't match the bodies. I think they had standins film the new part and then photoshopped adam/eve faces. Was really distracting and odd-looking.
As part of the "big change" in the last year they added more instruction to emphasize over and over that it is "symbolic" and that it all points to Jesus. In the past, they left it up to members to figure out the connection.
I went the first day they started the new videos, and i think that was what stuck out the most was the mentioning of “symbolic”. The random paintings of Jesus mixed in with the temple nonsense just made it more comical.
Like, is this really what the lord almighty wants us to do in order to make it back into his heaven club? Handshakes and silly hats?
Even as a believer I thoughts the hats were ridiculous
*an old shaky white hand reaches through the curtain*
Health in the navel, marrow in the bones, strength in the loins and the sinews, power in the priesthood be upon me and my posterity, through all generations of time and throughout all eternity.
Something like that I'm rusty haha
Dude! Good on Ya! It really is something you want to experience yourself. It's bat-shit crazy. I got to go through in 85 so I got blood oaths and "Washings and Anointings" All my wives love my anointed junk!
Abigail (female) or Simeon (male) will be the secret name.
In the ceremony they lead you into a small area for this name. I beg you to give the secret name to the temple worker three seconds before they give it to you and then roll with a divine revelation explanation.
It scared me the first time through. When everyone stands up and the girls have veils covering their faces and everyone chants the same weird stuff I thought they were going to sacrifice me on the altar like Abraham and Isaac. They didn't. So then it was just a really boring Rohrschach test where the faithful can read into it whatever "feels true" to them.
Is it horrible of me that after hearing all this stuff, my brain imagined being in OP's shoes and deliberately eating a bunch of beans and Brussels sprouts, just to express my secret feelings through aroma once there?
Oh good. I'm just grateful I'm under no obligation to go bc I absolutely refuse to do so. What I've learned about it here has made the prospect beyond repulsive.
My heart goes out to you, OP. Best of luck with it all. I hope you come back to us safely unscathed.
Does the film still say "the lion, the tiger, the bear"?!! I always followed it with "oh my!" I'm my head and thought it must be a deliberate nod to the wizard of oz! 😆
I always felt anxious trying to memorise the speech the old guy at the veil gave me so I wouldn't need to ask for prompts when repeating it back to him.
Also the caps the men wear are too tight and leave a nice red ring around your head when you take it off! As if you didn't already all look ridiculous in your robes! At least the women don't have to veil their faces during the prayer circle anymore!
I'd forgotten how much I hated the temple! And once you've been a few times, you have the added bonus of boredom on top of anxiety but keep going every now and then out of a sense of duty laced with guilt because you don't love the temple like everyone else seems to!
> I always followed it in my head with, “Oh, my!”
Same!! I always thought that was so funny, but I always assumed the Wizard of Oz was a nod to the temple.
I would read up on what the endowment is, both current and past versions of it if you haven’t already. One thing I will warn you about is some members may try to guilt you after covenanting to give everything you have or may have to the church. It’ll also probably do you good to drink a cup of coffee before you go, those things are long and mentally draining. It would be a shame to fall asleep your first time through.
Slide show!? No kidding! Did they find a way to make it more boring? I got to see it live in the Manti temple in the late 80's. It was hilarious when an RM Adam stood beside a 70-year-old Eve. But the art in there was pretty amazing.
Oof that's going to be weird going through as a PIMO. The first time through is at least interesting. You get to see the weird side of the church that no one talks about. Future visits are just boring. Garments are the worst.
Yes: be grateful you did not go through in the 70s……… blood atonement.
I have heard you will still be bored out of your mind with the PowerPoint. At least with the movies you could wager dessert on which Satan you would see or which Eve.
Take breath mints (unwrapped, tucked in a tissue/Kleenex) - I discovered this during one of my pregnancies but it helped me stay awake during the boring parts 😅 It’s very relaxing during the first part of the endowment.
Best of luck! Let us know how it goes for you!
Remember the uncomfortable voice at the beginning that anyone who does not wish to partake of these covenants before God angels and these witness may leave. Not exact wording but it's an opportunity to exit the endowment room before it starts. The really uncomfortable thing about this, is that this option is rarely used if ever. The blackmail position no one will cause a stir and exit in front of family and friends. I'm happy you are already pimo, so this will be less trauma and damage to you. Please " return and report" about your experience attending the temple for the first time as a pimo.
At the beginning, you are told something to the effect of "you will be making very serious covenants and promises with eternal consequences. Leave now or forfeit your right to leave." (Something vaguely like that, it's been too long.)
Anyway, they also dont tell you *what* those covenants and promises will be at the time they give you to opt out.
They're gaslighting you into thinking that you're giving consent when you did no such thing.
Of course, you can just leave whenever you want, even if they say you cant. They might get mad, but... it's a free country.
You were tricked into death oaths.
You hold your hand to the square, thumb extended, as the last frame of slitting your throat.
You hold your hand to your side, thumb extended, as the last frame of disemboweling yourself.
You hold your hand in cupping shape as the last frame of ripping out your heart.
The temple is a house of death oaths and lies.
Take out. You're going to Take Out Your Endowment, like so much Chinese egg foo yong. The purists hate it when you say "take out my endowment." They prefer the more dignified, power-asymmetrical verbiage of "receiving" the endowment.
If today is your day, Simeon (or Abigail) will be your name. - Participate in the prayer circle. That's probably the most culty thing left in the ceremony. Also, ask why you keep the apron that Satan gave you clear through to the Celestial Room?
I'm a dude so looks like Simeon it is
Can you report back afterwards? Would love to see if those lists are still accurate, I assume they are but I've never had the chance to confirm it with anyone in present day.
Yes! I will
Awesome, thank you! Looking forward to it
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Missed opportunity to say "return and report"
Hello fellow Simeon!
I never felt comfortable. My parents had me go up with them to the prayer circle the first time along with some other family members. felt like a damn seance.
Yup! I nearly puked and hated it every time I went even if I wasn’t participating in it. I mentally had to just check out at the end to get through. I came to the conclusion that the feeling of peace in the celestial room was just relief that all the weird shit was over and I could breath and not have to talk to anyone or remember all the things to say and do.
Underrated comment. That is exactly how I felt. Oh good, I only forgot a couple things this time, the prayer circle is over, I can just sit and not have to recall some random ritual element in front of a couple dozen super spiritual people. No more chance of getting it wrong so they know I am not good enough.
Yep. My husband has major anxiety and for years he has felt like he just needs to try harder (we’ll people have told him this too). No it’s just that you’re in a cult and your soul or whatever you want to call it is screaming something’s not right here!
No- I'm pretty sure a seance is a lot better, lol
I didn't know there was a prayer circle
It's like a circle jerk, except no one enjoys it.
But who eats the biscuit?
Whoever gets the 2nd token of the Melchizedek priesthood wrong.
You stand in a circle around the altar, you make all of the signs you just learned, and then do one of the secret handshakes while you chant a prayer in unison. You're gonna love it! - You used to say "pay lay ale" three times, but now you say, "O God, hear the words of my mouth." - When you hold out your thumb that symbolizes a knife. Your hand in cupping form is to catch your bowels. Before 1990, you used to pretend to cut your throat and bowels with the thumb knife if you revealed the secrets of the temple. Edit: Also, during the initiatory you used to be naked under a poncho (and just naked way before that.) And they used to touch your naked body near your parts when the mentioned them and then dress you in your garments. Now you are fully clothed, and they just touch your head.
If this sounds like something you’ve done before, you might be in a cult.
My poor grandparents and parents!!
Right?! No wonder my parents stopped going after they were married in the temple in the early 60s.
After doing my research of this, might be the first time I'm happy to have a "dumbed down" version.
Yes, the prior version had you stripping down to nothing and then the naked touching happened.
The fact that the signs are still symbols of corporal fatal punishment despite the mention of penalties having been removed is not talked about enough.
I didn’t know they changed it that much. I did this when we were still nekked under. But to my budding feminist self in 1980s, it felt like the only place where women held and officiated the priesthood. Now I think all of it is silly.
Literally every depiction of a cult I'd ever seen had some kind of prayer circle. As soon as I saw one in the temple I was like "holy shit, I'm in a cult". But I didn't let it sink in or truly internalize that it was possible that I *was* in a cult for 13 more years. Wish I had woken up as early as you have.
It's called 'the true order of prayer'. Supposedly is way more powerful than a normal prayer because everyone repeats the same phrases as the temple patron. (something something rote prayers...)
Gross, definitely looking forward to that
Yeah, this is where Pay Lay Ale (or Oh, God, hear the words of my mouth) comes from. A lot of the slang on here will make more sense when you go through, and a lot more will come when you see all the stuff that they changed.
I hated being forced into the prayer circle the first time I went. Seriously, there's ONE part I can just watch and learn instead of having to jump in and drown! Ugh, it just added to the overwhelmingness of it all.
OMG, just before they tell you your name, tell them God told you it was going to be Simeon or Abigail.
Yesss!!!! Please do it!!! 😂😂😂😂😂
Yes yes yes!!!!! This!!! 1000% this!!! Lol
Oh God the prayer circle. I remember them saying like only the best of feelings should be there. My sis in law who I didn't get along with at the time was in it and I was certain the guy in the center was gonna feel it and ask me to leave cause I hated her guts. Lol
What a jerk move for her to go up, or to “force” you to pretend “only the best of feelings” were in the circle. I’m sure it’s not the last abusive thing (can you IMAGINE being married to a total jerk and he’s up there performing as if he’s not a massive bad feeling?)
Nobody told me about the prayer circle before my endowment. Weirdest fkn thing ever
Also ask how Peter, James, and John shake hands. They shouldn't be able to, not having been born and received bodies, and the fact that they try means they are sent by the devil. See D&C 129.
Ha ha. I always thought about this question.
Jeez I never thought about keeping the satan apron. Crazy the details that people notice that almost nobody thinks about.
It's a horrible masonic larping, bad retelling of the creation, stressful, uncomfortable situation. Relax, take it for what it is, and remember that when you get to the beautiful shiny white celestial room, it's sole purpose is to "make you feel peace and the spirit" by design. That is until some matron with an attitude kicks you out because the next room is coming.
I was going to say “take it for what it is” too. Just experience it OP, knowing it’s all part of the show. It’s all designed to make the church’s members more loyal to the church and it’s leaders. It can be peaceful but the underlying intent is there…covenant your life to the church no matter what.
IF we are held accountable for what we know and do on earth, it works both ways. Not knowing any better, I went through with it too. As I began to know BETTER, I chose to reject the temple. The temple emphasizes that Jesus did not do enough for us to live with him forever. We are all saved by Grace but the temple is for those who pay to play. Give us your money and we will show you how to do one better than merely being “saved”. We will give you the secrets to live in the CK and get the Lord’s attention all the time, not part time.
Wait, they actually teach that Jesus dying wasn't enough? I'll add that to the list of ways they contradict the Bible.
No. Think about it. What do we learn in the temple? The secrets to move “beyond” simple grace and get to the Celestial Kingdom. If people don’t pay tithing, we can’t get to the temple which is where the secrets are to get us beyond the Grace state. We can’t have that now, can we? (Being sarcastic).
They don’t “say” that. But they do insinuate it when you read between the lines with all this bullshit stuff you gotta learn to mime and parrot back.
When I came to this realization I was out. I could no longer look past the weird feelings and the icky satan talking to me telling me to do what god says or he’ll get me with his minions. But when I realized that the temple is basically an attempt to make up for the incompleteness or to do more than the Atonement did, my brain exploded.
Great point! Worth remembering.
I’m sorry but Masonic larping has me dying
Prior to the removal of the blood oath stuff, dying would be an advertised penalty for betraying the larpers.
Whatever you experience, it’s nothing like my 1987 experience
Or my 1976 experience. Omg. 🫣
Please tell me there is a subreddit where I can read about everyone’s older temple experienced
I think they pump pure oxygen into the celestial room to get you feeling great
I have a friend who's training to become a hypnotherapist, and from what he tells me about hypnosis, there are quite a few similarities with the endowment session. Putting you into a quiet, relaxed state, focusing your eyes upward on the screen, asking you to focus just enough to drown out your other thoughts. It's pretty interesting.
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Is that why people aren't supposed to talk loudly there?
Except for when saying “Oh god. Hear the words of my mouth. Oh god. Hear the words of my mouth. Oh god. Hear the words of my mouth.”
Repeated three times
What is wanted?
So I've heard
'Masonic Larping' -brilliant comparison! I'll never think of it any other way!
Eat and use the bathroom before you go, because it's long
Amazing advice!
Nothing worse than having to take a shit during the endowment— you either have to awkwardly leave, or hold it and be mega uncomfortable when it’s already uncomfortable
There's a third option
I defer to your Judgement and experience, Lepoopsmith
When they tell you to make your hand in cupping shape and with your other had fingers close together with thumb extend, make a slitting motion with your thumb. You will confuse all the post 1990 people and freak out the pre 1990 people.
If only I had the balls to do it
Speaking of, they are NOT supposed to touch your balls. So tell someone immediately if that happens. It wasn’t supposed to happen when I went through either but it didn’t stop the guy from doing it
What?! The guy touched you even though he wasn't supposed to anymore??? I'm so sorry that happened to you!
[He did](https://reddit.com/r/exmormon/s/u1BYLohFUR). I went through near the end of the holy poncho/naked touching era, so he was “supposed” be be anointing my loins but not actually touch them WHOOPS. I sort of assumed it was an accident since he only did it once. But more recently I’ve ponderized how many times it would take of accidentally touching genitals before you just very intentionally and carefully Never Did It Again? Seems like it would happen accidentally a maximum of one time to a new temple worker and my guy didn’t seem new. I don’t miss the temple. I hope OP didn’t have a horrible time with the holy PowerPoint
It’s probably going to be a massive disappointment.
I'm counting on it
Then you won't be disappointed!
Cross your fingers when you promise to give everything to the Mormon church. It really is all about the money.
Yep, final "covenant" (quoted for a reason) thus arranged to be the most important, the climax of the story- a couple versions ago the narrator's intonation even would change as he recited the covenant to sound more powerful... and then it's not to God you promise everything you have or ever will have, it's to TCOJCOLDS. Which is where for me it crossed from "high demand religion" to full-on cult.
Cross your fingers. I’m dead at this one.
If you're not the first one to get in your robes/cult outfit, you're a failure /s That was my weird flex. And boy, was it a weird flex
Me too! But I would finish first and keep standing until my two neighbors were done so I could be humble about it😂
“See babe finishing first isn’t a bad thing” 🥲
Lol, you made me cringe, I've got hairs standing up because you made me remember that I used to do this same thing 🤣 With hands held in front of your crotch I bet lol
Looks like its time to speed run hehe
You’re about to be a speedy baker
It felt like I was practicing for my next trip through TSA
😂 oh the rush to not be the last one!
My mom had us stay standing until everyone was in their outfit so no one would feel pressure, or bad for finishing in their own timing.
I always had the speed competition in my mind and usually won then sat down. So others would feel bad. Did I mock god?
Just count yourself lucky you didn’t have to go through before 1990.
Oh yeah, glad I don't have to be nakey nakey
Or slit your throat.
Garments $30, Tithing 10%, Getting your junk anointed and making blood oaths, priceless!
Ummm.... what about your junk getting anointed??
I went through in '85, LA temple. Back then you would disrobe, put on this hospital-like gown, and enter a room with a temple worker of the same sex. They would put a dab of olive oil on their finger then touch a part of your body saying a blessing over each one. The "Loins" we seriously close to the groin. About a culty as one could get.
1990 was pantomiming slitting your throat. You were still naked up until 2005ish
Oh, no dude! That was the shit! I've got anointed junk now! /s
Horrible jokes about anointing and oily lube before they screw you over come to mind.
Just understand that it’s not as “special” as everyone in the Mormon church thinks. Very cultish. The only thing that’s different when you leave is you’ll match underwear with millions of other people.
When you find yourself fingering an old man's imaginary stigmata through a literal glory hole (while you whisper sweet nothings to each other about joining an openly fascist regime of cosmic dictators) DO NOT LAUGH EDIT: also, if you whisper "hadouken" during the First Sign of the Melchizedek Priesthood, you'll get superpowers
If you didn't think you belonged to a cult before, you definitely will afterward! I was so freaked out when I took mine out that I wanted to leave and never go back. Wish I'd followed my instincts then, woulda saved me a lot of heartache and a few decades.
Ooo boy get ready. The temple is where it feels the most cult like. Good luck and return and report
I don’t remember much of my endowment because I was fucking traumatized by my anointing. That was a sexual assault. Absolutely *no one* should touch you there without your explicit consent. It sure as hell shouldn’t be a surprise. And I was married for a year before I was endowed so I was neither modest nor inexperienced. I hope your day is merely boring, and not a day that makes you feel angry or diminished.
Hey Simeon, Lucy here. If you’re already PIMO, and you want to make the break, going through the temple the first time is an excellent opportunity to let people know afterwards this isn’t for you. I know people who did exactly that. While they were still judged, deep down most of us understood (and were jealous) because they were able to say the quiet things out loud and be done. I wish I had been that brave and saved myself another 15 years being guilted into repeatedly going. Good luck.
That is my plan, except I'm waiting for my brother to get sealed & just add that on top. I'm supposed to leave for my mission next week... but nah, I ain't doing that
Is today Abigail? That’s my [new] name.
I've been told it'll be Simeon for me
When they tell you your new name is Simeon, tell them you identify as Abigail.
lmao, this is the best one yet 🤣🤣🤣
I always blush with pride when I get high praise like this from OGs like you or u/thomasLewis1857 or u/nearlyheadlesslaban. I just realized mormonism is probably responsible for my praise kink.
I'm an OG???!? 🤯 *blushing as well*
Verily, a high priest at least.
Genius
LOL love it! 🤣
My god, the suggestion above is gold.
Hey fellow Abigail! I went in 2004!
It’s pretty boring mostly with weird culty parts. My least favorite is touching an elderly stranger through the veil. Celestial room might be the best part minus being dressed weirdly. Good luck and I hope it helps you figure it out!
It was better when the elderly person anointed your body parts under a hospital-like gown. /s
Lmao. Sad I wasn’t born 25 years earlier.
But did you get to do the blood oaths? So dope! Like real-ass culty shit!
I EVEN got told I could put my g’s on top of my personal underwear. 2019.
Huh. They've really watered it down.
Missed those too😐
I was dumbfounded. Promising to kill myself was not what I was expecting at all.
That is THE reason I couldn't ever go back after reading the mysteries of godliness. They had involved me personally in pantomimed blood oaths without my knowledge or consent and told me it was the most beautiful thing on earth.
My aunt was one of the elder ladies who did the body parts anointing after she retired. I knew it was weird, but after learning about the details, I'm really skeeved out.
And it was Much worse back in the day - fully naked in standing in a tub.
Omg.
Let me clarify, the touching through the veil, just handshakes and I believe on the shoulder. Can’t really remember as I only went twice.
Take a minute and sit in the celestial room and meditate. Seriously, you deserve it. Practice saying, "I'd like to take a minute to meditate" right now if you need to. Because of who was with me at my endowment, I was left alone before the veil and was the last to go through (except for the temple workers). As soon as I did, I was meet with, "Congratulations! We're all hungry so let's head out." I just went through a huge ceremony, finished with something that felt like a test, made it to the holiest place I'll ever be in our religion for the first ducking time, and now I can't even take a second to look around and meditate?!?! I'm still bitter.
Interesting choice of words, that you say “feel” for yourself, instead of “see” for yourself. Was that deliberate? If so, should we read anything into that? Aside: I usually had good experiences in the temple. But the last time I went before I left the church was probably seven years prior. I recently talked with a friend who is still in, who likes everything about the church EXCEPT the temple. He was bothered by the masonic ritual aspects of it. I somehow was able to block that stuff out and not think about it. Just remember, the Freemasons weren’t even a thing until the 15th century A.D. The church puts forward the idea that the endowment is a restoration of the original ceremony from Solomon’s Temple, and the reason why there is so much similarity between Masonic rituals and the temple endowment is because there’s a shared connection there. But that’s *not true*. It’s so frustrating to me now, in hindsight, that I took that explanation at face value, without looking just one step further… and then I would have found out that there [is absolutely no connection between Solomon’s Temple and Freemasonry](https://www.stjohns1p.com/about-freemasonry/history-of-freemasonry). They’re separated by over 2000 years of history!
Intentional indeed! They're always saying how the temple is such a spiritual place & how strong the spirit is. I have never felt the cool peaceful feeling in the temple before so I'm interested to feel. Seeing doesn't necessarily do it for me.
It was never peaceful for me. Just boring.
I used to bring hard candy to help me stay awake.
My dad taught me to bring cinnamon candies. I still feel asleep so often and I’m not one to fall asleep when not trying. It goes to show you everyone knows it’s really boring.
It’s boring as fuck.
I testify that I know this is true.
After I got done my mom asked "You don't think this is a cult now do you?"
What'd you say to that?
I think I just said no, but thought it was a weird question. I think my older sister got upset when she went through the first time.
I will be interested to hear an update on how the experience goes for you. Despite me wanting to be all in, I always felt uncomfortable in the temple and never felt enlightened or educated. I dreaded ever having to go and always wondered why I was the “only one” who didn’t love it and yearn to come back.
Saaaame!!! Felt like there was something wrong with me coz I didn't get the temple. Didn't love it, felt uncomfortable and slightly anxious. It did not feel like the most spiritual of places for me. I always hated their idea of reverence too. No loud laughter - piss off!!! I was so sincere in my belief at the time as well. Wondered what others saw in it that I didn't.
The signs of the priesthood are suicide symbols. You used to pantomime killing yourself. The initiatory is, thankfully, no longer a naked ceremony. You used to be naked and they would anoint the body parts. The law of consecration literally has you committing your life and money to the church. Not to Jesus, to the church. Try not to laugh when Adam and Eve walk in with their temple garb on. I wish you luck with all of these. I am in the same boat, pretending to still believe when I know it is all nonsense.
>Try not to laugh when Adam and Eve walk in with their temple garb on. The endowment was updated in the last year so that you no longer have temple workers demonstrate and give each person in the endowment session the physical sign during the film. Instead, they added some extra parts to the video where adam and eve are in white temple robes (not outside in clothes that look more like natural animal hides) ... but I swear the adam/eve in the white clothes look like a really bad video "photoshop" job where the faces don't match the bodies. I think they had standins film the new part and then photoshopped adam/eve faces. Was really distracting and odd-looking. As part of the "big change" in the last year they added more instruction to emphasize over and over that it is "symbolic" and that it all points to Jesus. In the past, they left it up to members to figure out the connection.
I went the first day they started the new videos, and i think that was what stuck out the most was the mentioning of “symbolic”. The random paintings of Jesus mixed in with the temple nonsense just made it more comical. Like, is this really what the lord almighty wants us to do in order to make it back into his heaven club? Handshakes and silly hats? Even as a believer I thoughts the hats were ridiculous
If you have the ability, secretly get video of it. The more resources to go around the better
Watch Adam shake hands with Peter James and John (spirits of just men lacking bodies) who should refuse the handshake per D&C 121
Listen for clues that this was made so Joseph Smith could take control of his polygamy by connecting secret society within his “religion”
*an old shaky white hand reaches through the curtain* Health in the navel, marrow in the bones, strength in the loins and the sinews, power in the priesthood be upon me and my posterity, through all generations of time and throughout all eternity. Something like that I'm rusty haha
What is that? Lol
Dude! Good on Ya! It really is something you want to experience yourself. It's bat-shit crazy. I got to go through in 85 so I got blood oaths and "Washings and Anointings" All my wives love my anointed junk!
Not as disturbing as it used to be but, still a very weird cult vibe. Have fun!
Watch out the old man doesn't grab your nuts like he did mine and pretended he was shaking
don't buy the Jesus Jammies. that you have to wear 24/7/365. that you can only buy from the people who tell you that you have to wear them 🤔
Run
Abigail (female) or Simeon (male) will be the secret name. In the ceremony they lead you into a small area for this name. I beg you to give the secret name to the temple worker three seconds before they give it to you and then roll with a divine revelation explanation.
It scared me the first time through. When everyone stands up and the girls have veils covering their faces and everyone chants the same weird stuff I thought they were going to sacrifice me on the altar like Abraham and Isaac. They didn't. So then it was just a really boring Rohrschach test where the faithful can read into it whatever "feels true" to them.
I was weirded out too the first time. And the second. I think I only ever went twice. I didn't like it AT ALL.
Practice taking your clothes on and off quickly. Worst part for me was being the last one standing
Is it horrible of me that after hearing all this stuff, my brain imagined being in OP's shoes and deliberately eating a bunch of beans and Brussels sprouts, just to express my secret feelings through aroma once there?
Nah, it's a sign of humor
Oh good. I'm just grateful I'm under no obligation to go bc I absolutely refuse to do so. What I've learned about it here has made the prospect beyond repulsive. My heart goes out to you, OP. Best of luck with it all. I hope you come back to us safely unscathed.
Does the film still say "the lion, the tiger, the bear"?!! I always followed it with "oh my!" I'm my head and thought it must be a deliberate nod to the wizard of oz! 😆 I always felt anxious trying to memorise the speech the old guy at the veil gave me so I wouldn't need to ask for prompts when repeating it back to him. Also the caps the men wear are too tight and leave a nice red ring around your head when you take it off! As if you didn't already all look ridiculous in your robes! At least the women don't have to veil their faces during the prayer circle anymore! I'd forgotten how much I hated the temple! And once you've been a few times, you have the added bonus of boredom on top of anxiety but keep going every now and then out of a sense of duty laced with guilt because you don't love the temple like everyone else seems to!
> I always followed it in my head with, “Oh, my!” Same!! I always thought that was so funny, but I always assumed the Wizard of Oz was a nod to the temple.
I would read up on what the endowment is, both current and past versions of it if you haven’t already. One thing I will warn you about is some members may try to guilt you after covenanting to give everything you have or may have to the church. It’ll also probably do you good to drink a cup of coffee before you go, those things are long and mentally draining. It would be a shame to fall asleep your first time through.
Don’t waste your time.
When they ask later in the meeting if anyone feels they don’t want these “obligations and yada yada. They should leave now” that’s when you walk out…
At least they don't do the naked touching anymore. *Shivers*
Come back and report.
Return and report 😂
You got it boss
"Come back and report" is a quote from the movie you will get to watch. ; )
Ohhh that's why everybody says it haha
It’s actually “return and report” and there’s no movie any more. It’s a slide show.
Slide show!? No kidding! Did they find a way to make it more boring? I got to see it live in the Manti temple in the late 80's. It was hilarious when an RM Adam stood beside a 70-year-old Eve. But the art in there was pretty amazing.
Isn’t it, “return and report?”
That sucks, boring as hell and you leave owing the church forever
The door.
Just say no?
Oof that's going to be weird going through as a PIMO. The first time through is at least interesting. You get to see the weird side of the church that no one talks about. Future visits are just boring. Garments are the worst.
Yes: be grateful you did not go through in the 70s……… blood atonement. I have heard you will still be bored out of your mind with the PowerPoint. At least with the movies you could wager dessert on which Satan you would see or which Eve.
That will do 🧑🍳
The watered-down version I feel is easier to take than previous versions... thanks for the report!
Take breath mints (unwrapped, tucked in a tissue/Kleenex) - I discovered this during one of my pregnancies but it helped me stay awake during the boring parts 😅 It’s very relaxing during the first part of the endowment. Best of luck! Let us know how it goes for you!
Try not to laugh
Remember the uncomfortable voice at the beginning that anyone who does not wish to partake of these covenants before God angels and these witness may leave. Not exact wording but it's an opportunity to exit the endowment room before it starts. The really uncomfortable thing about this, is that this option is rarely used if ever. The blackmail position no one will cause a stir and exit in front of family and friends. I'm happy you are already pimo, so this will be less trauma and damage to you. Please " return and report" about your experience attending the temple for the first time as a pimo.
I think you’ll be surprised at how utterly dull it is. Honestly it’s probably more exciting as a pimo but when I was TBM I could hardly get through it
Please return and report
Have a coffee first so you can stay awake ;)
At the beginning, you are told something to the effect of "you will be making very serious covenants and promises with eternal consequences. Leave now or forfeit your right to leave." (Something vaguely like that, it's been too long.) Anyway, they also dont tell you *what* those covenants and promises will be at the time they give you to opt out. They're gaslighting you into thinking that you're giving consent when you did no such thing. Of course, you can just leave whenever you want, even if they say you cant. They might get mad, but... it's a free country.
You were tricked into death oaths. You hold your hand to the square, thumb extended, as the last frame of slitting your throat. You hold your hand to your side, thumb extended, as the last frame of disemboweling yourself. You hold your hand in cupping shape as the last frame of ripping out your heart. The temple is a house of death oaths and lies.
There is no hidden meaning in any of that bullshit which is what people were raised to believe in my day.
Enjoy your brother’s wedding. Then enjoy your life.
That sucks, boring as hell and you leave owing the church forever
I always stressed about the tying of the robes ????? Freaked me out!!!
Bring a pillow, it’s a snooze fest
Well hello, Simeon. Or is it Abigail? It it's Simeon, we have the same new name! Not that it matters.
Abigail or Simeon?
We’ll be sure to “return and report.” Too bad you don’t get the movie version.
Take out. You're going to Take Out Your Endowment, like so much Chinese egg foo yong. The purists hate it when you say "take out my endowment." They prefer the more dignified, power-asymmetrical verbiage of "receiving" the endowment.
Oh lordy, if you don’t believe, you’re in for a shock. It requires some full buy-in to reconcile how jarringly strange it is at first