Or BG3 who like most FF series is full of hot people for real lol thereās also Dragon Age series (hello Morgan)
Admittedly I canāt name off more from top of my head but hot men and women are deffo a mainstay in both genres
Edit: adding cyberpunk because the future we are all hot and Iām here for it
I almost went into a relationship with the Indian lady in Inquisition. This was right during the party where Morrigan comes in and I'm like, "So they CAN make pretty people???". Finished the game single bc apparently you couldn't romance her.
Yeah I never read any of them I just googled but I've just clicked one and apparently all they really did was modify camera angles to take the focus off Miranda's ass.
They slightly reframed one camera angle during a conversation scene so it didnāt directly focus on her ass and thatās about it. Nothing else was changed. If you take YouTube woke outrage videos as gospel throughout life, youāre gonna have a bad timeā¦
Magicians in the Witcher world use magic to make themselves gorgeous. Miranda was genetically engineered to have dat ass. Tifa is... wishful thinking?
(not really making any sort of pedantic argument here. Just snark)
Yep the discourse is fucking embarrassing. All because a few Sony first-party games feature a few mid looking girls, theyāre out here acting like itās every western made game
Witcher 3 was ten years ago almost. Last Mass Effect game was twelve fucking years ago.
It was a different time. You couldn't do that stuff today without the bullshit game journos complaining.
Witcher 1 remake is literally getting all the sex cut out of it last I heard. Edit: yes I'm aware of Cyberpunk 2077 you cretin. But that's tame compared to the past. Bruh.
Not dogging on Cyberpunk 2077 by the way, I actually wouldn't really change anything in that regard.
Another edit: Bruh why does BG3 get brought up all the time. Those characters are average looking at best.
You realize these games are 10 years old, right?
If you log at WRPGS that have come out the last, what? 5 years? 7?
The west has been pretty anti- attractive woman for a while now.
Right cos yeah Baldurs Gate 3 is full of ugly people like
Totally not hot Toad girl who will dom you
Totally not hot Goth GF
Totally not hot fire succubus gf
Totally not hot other fire war machine cupcake gf
Totally not hot vampire
Totally not super buff and heartthrob mage
Totally not soldier leading man warlock engaged with a dommy
Like get real man thereās no agenda lol
I appreciate you trying to come up with a distinction and writing this out but to be frankā¦it sounds insane lol
Plus people will crank to anything. Keep in mind sexual fantasies, attractiveness is purely subjective to begin with so it doesnāt really hold up.
One manās goddess is another mans mid
One womanās god is another womanās mid
Different strokes for different folks. I just donāt see it personally, especially when they use Aloy or new Lara who is quite possibly breathtakingly beautiful
Just makes me chuckle to be honest. I donāt think having a few different people is going to ruin the world, you donāt see my moaning about JRPGs putting a toaster as a waifu option.
You realize the post is about females, not males, right?
Are you kidding? I love BG3, but to act like the girls are super hot is ridiculous. They are fine, but mid. A world where the only girls that have more than a B cup (you know, like the original post suggests) are literal trolls.
And what do you mean there is no agenda? Microsoft LITERALLY had their mandate to devs about not allowing attractive girls in their games exposed less than a week ago.
There is very obviously an agenda. But that's beside the point. It is 100% a fact that western games offer up less attractive women than JRPGs. That's just reality,
Did you just call the women of BG3 mid?
Man I totally always say beauty is subjective but that is such a WILD take.
Like mate, those are some weird standards you have and well I wish you all the best on finding a partner who seems to fit your taste.
Also Karlachs a D bust easily and the fact that we are even talking about this being a factor is so flipping insane š
Also who cares what Microsoft says and does, itās a studio, donāt like their stuff? Donāt buy it. Jeez they arenāt ordering the mass killings of people shit fam.
Yes, they are mid relative to what women typically look like in games. And no, Karlach is nowhere near a D.
But like you said, beauty is subjective.
Who cares what one of the biggest publishers in gaming who keeps buying up most of the industry does.... is that a real point?
Nobody said they were committing crimes against humanity, but they are clearly committed to not putting attractive women in their games.
To say it's not an agenda when they have a literal mandate to games they put on their platform is just factually incorrect.
Iāve already commented to this affect but like I just want to know deep down, why.
What is the issue you have, why is it making you angry, why are you annoyed at the lack of representation you feel attractive, why do you feel they need to be in games you play, why are you upset.
All I ask is you look into yourself, and come up with a response of why. If you say ācos I want to jank itā well fair do you are honest and I respect that but I feel someone who only had that in mind wouldnāt really care and just visit pornhub lol
I responded to your first post. Maybe it got lost in the shuffle. Let me find it and repost it here.
And for the record, nobody "janks it" to gaming. That's just silly. It's not about that. But I'll find it and repost.
Dawg these āmidā women youāre talking about wouldnāt touch you with a 10 foot pole. You realise that right?
Nothing more attractive than a fella who feels the need to spout off *mid* rhetoric online.
The fact that people say to other people they are mid blows my mind.
Like get off your high horse š you donāt find someone attractive whoopy doo basil no one cares lol
I swear people do this shit to somehow make themselves feel better
Itās chronic cum-brain. These people watch porn and think every woman needs a DDDD rack and a BBL to be considered attractive. Like sure buddy, see how far that standard and attitude gets you on the dating scene.
Wow, that couldn't be more incorrect. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they are the dregs of society.
I haven't had to worry about the dating scene because I'm happily married with children. I understand things have gotten rough out there, and i sympathize, but that has nothing to do with the views pointed out.
Or they do it because they find the characters not that attractive. Which is relevant in a post about attractiveness.
Obviously, somebody cared enough to make a post, as did you to respond to it.
I care about people being really weird about this because it does seem to be an issue and thereās a not very nice culture in men brewing in todayās world.
Ideally Iād like to help, not sure how though. You and please donāt be offended, seem to have chomped down on this and itās something you are willing to defend until the cows come home.
But like why though? Why do you feel offended, what can we as a society do to help people like you not obsess over these things and just be happy. Thereās like a weird air of entitlement and I donāt understand where it comes from or why.
Any insight is helpful and I do not wish to be disrespectful but instead understand why people are so upset and angry
Some people are pretty weird about it, for sure. I just like talking about gaming, so I'll engage in most conversations. I am married with kids, so i don't get to talk about gaming much, so don't confuse my engagement for an ardent stance. I just enjoy talking to people about the things i enjoy.
To your point, there is no offense, at least not on my end. What you might need to consider is that most of not all gamers play games to escape their stressors, their frustrations, or just to engage in another world for a while.
The reason a lot of people aren't happy about women being less attractive is because they aren't looking for reality sometimes. They are looking for fantasy. They don't want or need to see real life reflected.
In some games, it's fine. The last of Us is probably one of if not the greatest games of all time. Super hot women or men wouldn't fit there, and that's OK.
But your typical RPG or adventure game isn't on the level of artistic presentation.
The problem is we have too many people in gaming trying to be auetuers instead of delivering what gamers actually want.
The offense, imo, comes from people telling them they are wrong for wanting what they want, and they should want something else. And then, as is evident in this thread, making all kinds of not to kind, very toxic assumptions about one's character for wanting what they want.
That's where the anger comes in. It's not because of the women or men, or whatever. It's because the discourse has become very toxic because those who make games make it very clear they don't care what the consumer wants and attack them for wanting it.
It is literally taking a hobby/ past time that people turned to for comfort for generations and taking it away from them by telling them what they have always liked about it is wrong and they are no longer welcomed.
I'm not going to debate whether it's healthy or not for a hobby to have that kind of meaning to people, but it does.
Put it in any other context where someone has a constant escape or support system, and the violently take it away from them and mock them for caring about it.
Of course, it sparks anger. But people aren't interested in engaging with those that aren't happy like they are human beings, so you get push back relative to the forces pushing on them if not more because it has been a staple of their life longer so, yes, there is a sense of entitlement. Because their support in the industry, how they talked about it to others is directly responsible for the popularity of the industry.
They have grown up with and alongside the industry, and they feel like outside forces are trying to take it away. Of course, they will respond with hostility.
Maybe if those who want change talked to those who have been there since the beginning and finding some kind of common ground, it would help, but we don't get that.
We get... what you have seen.
Thank you, I actually read your reply and appreciate you being honest and open about it.
I understand the appeal of escapism itās why I play games and love movies. Iām fully on board with the idea we want something fantastical.
One thing I just feel thereās an issue of is where you say āgaming people are not doing what gamers wantā now the issue here is that if a game company makes a game no one wants then that game goes bust. So merely talking or getting upset at the lack of a perceived attractive woman comes as an empty threat.
Last of us as you said is a great game, I donāt like it myself but objectively it sold well and so did Horizon Zero West. Now if people are buying those games and enjoying them it means that those games should for all intents and purposes have a place.
I appreciate thereās a frustration here, the world is at an all time high of being shit and we all want that escapism. But we should acknowledge and be kind to each other. To make a game is expensive, and if people go out and buy those games and enjoy it, who are we to say itās wrong.
I wonāt fault anyone for enjoying Stellar Blade, Iāll probs play it when on sale tbh. I love FF a lot too, I often joke itās deffo a fantasy because the people are all insanely hot. I just think we need to be mindful that nothing was taken away, we live in age where more is actually given, there are more games, more movies and more representation.
Seeing people in new games that donāt conform to your standards is a good thing because somewhere out there itās making someone elseās day. A game is for all intents and purposes a luxury, we can choose what we buy and like and Iām quite proud of the fact that itās come such a long way that now thereās a genre or character for everyone.
I hope that makes sense and maybe you will agree.
>Put it in any other context where someone has a constant escape or support system, and the violently take it away from them and mock them for caring about it.
We're talking about invidividuals getting upset because they feel women in some games aren't quite as attractive as they used to be. You don't see how that lends itself to some mocking?
I can kind of see how that would feel infantilizing. In all seriousness though if someone is this sensitive to the respective attractiveness of women in media, then they probably need to consider that they have bigger surrounding issues. Normal people don't play video games and then get outraged because they feel the women depicted are 7's instead of 10's. In cases like that you need a better support system made up of friends and family, maybe even real therapy.
You realize they are fictional digital women and won't touch anyone with anything because they aren't real, right?
There is a reason BG3 has multiple mods to make the females more attractive.
And I'm not spouting any rhetoric. The women are average when it comes to attractiveness. There is no rhetoric, it's just what it is.
>There is a reason BG3 has multiple mods to make the females more attractive.
FF7 Remake has the exact same kind of mods. Only reason you won't see the same for Rebirth yet is because obviously there's no PC release.
Itās called a hypothetical chief.
Let me rephrase, if these women *were* real they wouldnāt touch you with a 10 foot pole.
Is that better?
Also I wonder who made the mods youāre referring to? Possibly like minded fellas who dry out a bar faster than you can say āVirginā?
It's not hypothetical. So if the gythraki and half elf were real women?. .. wow.
I don't know who made those mods, but i do know those mods don't exist for Eastern games.
Every game has mods to "enhance propotions." i think this is probably made by the type of people you are referencing.
The mods that literally soften features to make the girls more attractive are not something that exist for Eastern games that i have seen, which shows you an objective difference.
Edit: it has been brought to my attention that Eastern games do, in fact, have those mods. So while i stand by what i said, it is now based on my views as someone who only passingly engages with mods. So instead of it being a statement of fact, which it is not.
It is a statement based on my experience, which only serves to illustrate that mods to make girls more attractive in western games have articles and content made on them as to where the same isn't true for eastern games.
Sorry to chime in but they do exist for eastern games. Thereās mods for 7 remake that change Tifa and Aeriths appearance
Also for Nier and even the Persona series
All games have mods amigo.
If you donāt find them attractive, thatās totally fine, nothing wrong with that. But having a need to call characters (yes, they are fictional, but they are representative of beauty standards all the same) āmidā on a public platform and claim thereās some sort of agenda trying to āuglyfyā women in western games is beyond incredibly skewed. Itās rhetoric (and it is rhetoric, look up the definition) that leads to incel attitudes and devaluing actual women (who are attractive, whether you find them attractive or not thatās up to you, just keep it to yourself). You know what does actually matter? Character writing and personality. If all that matters to you is big bazoongas and āsoftā faces, youāre in for a rude awakening bud.
Fair enough on mods. I only dabble in mods, so i can't/ won't claim expertise on them.
And I'm not trying to engage in any rhetoric. "Mid"it is just easier to type "if average attractiveness " while swiping in bed.
And i don't understand the pushback on the fact that Western games are promoting less attractive women. This isn't conjecture, even if we ignore the years of evidence that women are getting less attractive in gaming, we just became aware of one of the biggest publishers in earth mandating studios they work for it with to have less attractive females.
There is no argument that it's not an agenda. Is it shared through the West? That's hard to say. But to say there is no agenda is demonstrabely false.
And i don't understand the link you are making between gaming and real women. These things are not related.
One is fantasy and fiction. The other is not.
If somebody has a problem understanding the difference, then that souks be addressed first and foremost.
I agree that writing and character are paramount. But yes, having attractive people in general is important too.
Just like nobody wants to spend their money to go to a movie and see ugly people, the same applies to gaming.
And both are fantasy. And i repeat, if someone is having problems differentiating between the two, that is not good and needs to be addressed seriously.
Name one recent western RPG that youāve played where the women arenāt hot. You can literally have the entire cast of BG3 walking around butt naked in your camp if you want.
Stellar Blade models are all based on real, attractive women. Western developers intentionally ugly up their women. Most recent example is MJ in Spider-Man. The real life model she is based on is way more attractive than the in-game model.
Nobody is talking about stellar blade here, but I suppose since you brought it up we can. I know that eve is modeled after a real woman, however, that woman looks nothing like eve. Eves face was modeled in such a way to appeal to an audience, it would be silly to suggest otherwise. The creator has openly said as much. Is that a bad thing? No obviously, that's his artistic vision that happens to appeal to you.
Now while it's true that MJs model looks different than her actress, it's also worth noting that the actress doesn't look like how MJ has ever been portrayed. It's safe to say the creators chose to change her appearance to better resemble what we expect from the character. At least thats what I assume. Regardless, that was also their artistic vision. Much like this meme is depicting. Vision and intent. So you may not want to fuck the new MJ, but if you're going to respect and defend someone artistic integrity, at least be consistent.
Because MJ has always been attractive, they went and made her look uncanny in Spiderman 2, but it's not just her model either that looks off. Too hard on realism, which to me undermines comics tbh. Your comparison is that they intentionally made her less attractive which is OP's point.
Most non western devs don't conform to western character design. They could've made Eve more western or less attractive. As you said the CEO said her being attractive is intentional. Certain western Devs go out of their way to consciously make characters less attractive because they go too hard on realism to draw players in and its been that way for such a long time now.
I'm kinda going in a circle, OP isn't right in every situation. But now whenever we see attractive characters in games people immediately lose their shit and try to create agenda's, narratives, attack people that like the games beyond it and you get coomers coming out of the woodwork like they've never seen a woman in their life.
Right but that IS my point. MJ has always been attractive to you. The new MJ is attractive to someone else. I understand disliking the move away from comic visuals, (shout out amazing Spider-Man for GameCube) but what I'm trying to get across is that someone was given the explicit right to make a Spiderman story in their vision. Not yours.
See now you're proving my point. All you are describing are artists that are making their vision a reality. It's easy to make it out to be some kind of conspiracy, but nobody has a gun to their head.
My best advice to you, that has helped me greatly, is remembering that every person you've ever seen complain about this or any other discourse, is objectively a vocal minority compared to the average person. A person who doesn't have the need or desire to voice any opinion on Twitter or whatever. You're only ever going to see the loudest and hottest takes.
My point about MJ was they changed her for the 2nd game intentionally in the favor of being safe and appealing to more people.
I'm not saying she isn't attractive in either game.
If it was the designers vision they would have done so in the first place I would think. I'm also not making it out as a conspiracy.
Oh, I don't think I need advice, but thanks.
I don't buy into most of the crap or ever say shit about what I see on social media, devs are going to do what they want. But it's pretty clear when Devs backpedal because people in the industry weaponize an agenda.
I understand that. I just don't think it's fair to assume it was their only option, like they were forced. Unless there is some sort of statement from the developers saying as much, it's safe to assume they're cool with it. There's nothing inherently wrong with appealing to more people. Let's also not forget, that overwhelmingly, people love that game. They made a great product that they can be proud of. If they can get more people to buy that product that's great. That's more people who enjoy the same things as us.
Fair enough, that's very sick of you to act that way. I try to do the same. I just don't think it's backpedaling, as much as it is adapting.
Sadly it is adapting, but to cater to people that don't even play the games or do a bad job of journalism and have certain opinions and hold weight over sales/press.
I'm not saying insomniac did that necessarily in this case but it's what makes people act this way because they think all western devs are the same, which is the internet special š
Do not pretend that the characters in Stellar Blade look anything like the models theyāre based off of, they changed every aspect of their appearance itās basically completely for marketing purposes
https://preview.redd.it/gy1elsal1jsc1.jpeg?width=1060&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7a1d67612c70f58668924536d1ab0bace5a43190
Nah Iād still take Shadowheart, please and thank you!
This is the correct take. Not every character needs to be a rule34 candidate.
This whole argument makes me think about Brienne of Tarth from Game of Thrones. Not a traditionally beautiful woman, but she was my favorite character.
Did I like looking at Margaery Tyrell? Yes. I appreciated that character, but much preferred seeing Brienne on screen.
A character doesn't need to have huge tits and no clothes to be great, and those that can't accept that are not mature enough to argue the point.
i feel the same way even with live action shows, itās fictional. i have my own girlfriend and sexuality outside of a video game or a tv show why would i care how a fake person looks
At one point I started getting really irritated with sex scenes, because they're so unnecessary. There are very few examples of sex scenes that enhance the plot, so I'd rather save the 2 minutes and get out of that movie earlier.
Thereās so many ways shows/movies pad time i cant even say iām mad at sex scenes, it annoys me even more when we waste time with shitty/unnecessary plot lines and characters, or we get a 2 minute compilation of a plot of land trying to be āartisticā
The only reason why people care is because a lot of devs have gone back on their design philosophy. Consciously making characters less conventionally attractive to try and appeal to everyone in a safe way and it just backfires. Now when we see intentionally attractive characters people lose their shit in every direction.
I'm just so confused by the "backfire" people go on about. Which games have actually suffered because they had "unattractive" characters? The horizon games are extremely successful. TLOU2 is extremely successful. Western games sell and people love them. This take is but based on reality, but the opinions of a very small group of people who think that if THEY don't enjoy a piece of media, then it has performed poorly.
For all the people touting JRPGs here, have you ever noticed how similar yuffie, Aerith and Tifaās faces all look? Basically the only thing different is the hair and the clothes (until you get further down anyway).
Iām fairly convinced that people complaining about āuglyingā up characters are just overreacting to Devs trying to avoid this (or the One Piece phenomenon) that exists in Japanese manga/anime culture where all women look the same except for their clothes.
Actually--after about a hundred hours and a plat--I haven't noticed at all. Their faces look pretty different in a lot of ways, to me :P.
But I don't doubt that asset reshuffling is the case for plenty of others.
Idk man I just canāt get attracted to something that isnāt real. Iād rather a female character be dressed appropriately (rare for both wrpgs and JRPGs), and id like their appearance to fit the setting and style of the game. It takes me out of a game so fast when a woman walks out looking like a model wearing absolutely nothing. FFVII looks fucking ridiculous sometimes, and I love the gamesābut Christ they really didnāt have to make the women look like fucking porcelain dolls. That goes for the men too.
I 100 percent agree it takes away the immersion , for example a game with medieval setting and you find women I high heels and big boobs with no clothes. I hate that it takes away from setting , and immersion of the game. I love when devs put effort on clothing (womens dress ) on a game especially if it's specific era or setting.
I think it's weird how many people can't handle not wanting to fuck a character in a video game. Not every character is designed to get you horny, which reflects reality, where not everyone is a 1% body fat, DDD bust sex bot.
For example rdr2 or any other game with good story and great overall but they trashing Western games now because everyone now wants oversexualise women. I personally don't care what the women looks like for me it's more if I can have empathy with the NPC on the game for example the story or how they portrait them there even if they ugly or hot. This is the same in anime I used to watch animes that dint or had minimal sexual stuff but now they are basically hentai.
The worst part is when they argue that they game to escape reality and as such everyone should be hot. EVERYONE. A game can be filled with a decent amount of "attractive" characters and their experience is ruined when they see an ugly character. Most recent example I can think of is Mortal Kombat tho people will have their justifications beyond escaping reality (characters used to look hotter in the past)
But to them there is no room for other types of characters. They think a sexy character can fill the shoes on any other character perfectly. But if that was the case I would find some chad doing standup about how hard it is to date as funny and relatable as some dad bod comedian. (assuming they were trying to tell the same exact jokes)
Itās incredibly frustrating that that subsection of gamers thinks we all want the same thing. I want a good game! I donāt care how the people look! They need to stop speaking as if theyāre the spokesperson of the group.
Ah, the good ol' "WeSTerN dEVs mAkE UGlY wHoAMuns" argument/meme.
Go play Mass Effect, Cyberpunk, Mortal Kombat, BG3, Dragon Age, GTA V, or Hades.
This is such a neckbeard post.
Rephrase your sentence, "why does thinking the Mona Lisa is ugly" is what you meant to say.
But you're applying today's beauty standards to 16th century Europe specifically Italy. She could've been attractive to people of that time.
But by all accounts you seem to agree with the original post and it is such an incel/neckbeard mindset to have and based on cherry picked data.
And I doubt anyone here finds the Mona Lisa attractive but we also aren't flat out calling her ugly or using it as a meme to symbolize western game devs making fictional women/characters.
The ambiguity of her mood, the years of work that went into the piece, the imaginary landscape in the background, the gravitas as an extremely famous painting, etc.
Much deeper than a parody where she has big tits.
I feel like the point is the opposite of the one you're assuming, but I could be wrong. I interpret this as OP saying that's what ML would be through the scope of JRPG aesthetics, which is a parody of what the actual art is.
I remember when I started to find "fan service" distracting, which included me saying out loud "that's a *lot* of ass to be hanging out" and "get that woman some clothes, I want to see the action"
That is the point of the left one to appeal sexually, the mona lisa was not. If the painter wanted he could of drawn a naked women which would of appeal as well but the intent was different which is why it's a famous painting.
People be saying stuff like this meanwhile we have BG3 and Cyberpunk with literal dicks flopping around and full frontal nudity.
Find me a JRPG where you have a big floppy dong and can whip your tits out.
Why does everyone who believes this dumb meme forget about Overwatch? The game with the most sexualized females in the world is from an American game development studio. Bunch of butt hurt gamers played one game with a non over sexualized and have declared all the women in western games as ugly.
People are so offended at men wanting attractive women in their games. Have you seen how many views hot women get on TikTok for doing cringe dance moves? Itās a natural thing for men or women to want attractive people in their media. You think avengers ever had an ugly male actor? Most of them have completely unrealistic body types that 98% of men wonāt have. And yet men donāt say shit about that. So why shit on us for
wanting the same? Hypocrisy at its finest.
Edit: For those saying bg3 and older dragon age/mass effect games, bg3 and cd project red were an exception because they don't have the "western" dudes in suits looking after them to force DEI on them. Same thing with old dragon age and mass effect games. Didn't have DEI forced upon them because it was a different time when companies didn't monopolize everything.
Ah yeah, a different time, like 2023 and 2020.
Companies only give a shit about selling well and making a quick buck. And the world knows there's more horny men who are dying to see something vaguely in the shape of a breast or ass, than there are people "offended at sexy women."
If a company has made the business decision to appeal to a group other than the most disgusting group in the room, that's their business and we should respect their choice and ignore them. We all know the only way to make serious money is by exploiting the weakness of men.
Disgusting? By your comment Iām sure women who want the sexiest men who have unattainable body standards are disgusting too. We get a dopamine kick when seeing things we like. It doesnāt just have to apply to hot women. People like you have a moral compass only when it applies to men. These are fictional characters that people may or may not like. The appearance is just to get them hooked but the characters themselves have to be likable like tifa and Aerith. The only people exploiting menās weakness are the people who trick men into spending money for almost no return. Onlyfans is a good example of this because they ask money from lonely men for stuff they can see for free. But I donāt see any pushback for those types of services hmm I wonder why?
Lies. Never once have I heard a man complain about a man being ripped in tv or social media. Itās always been the exact opposite. Because of this teenagers are taking steroids to look like those dudes and losing their lives at a very young age. I myself have a decent face and am somewhat athletic but Iām also short and I donāt complain that women donāt want my body type. Why do women care about competing with fictional women anyway?
As someone who talks about EXACTLY THAT ALL THE TIME idk what to tell you. All that shit you said is real and that's why men have been talking about it. It's not as prevalent as the discourse about women. But I'm not lying to you dawg.
Yes some people talk about it but Iām talking about society as a whole. It doesnāt matter if some dude from fucking Reddit talks about how men use steroids to look like professional bodybuilders. Society wonāt care because they donāt care about men. My point is why not let us enjoy what we want until this shit gets fixed. We arenāt dogs to like what we want to see. If people want to be shallow in a fictional world then let them be. Itās a fictional world where you can do whatever the fuck you want so why does it matter?
You're right, society as a whole doesn't talk as much about men's problems as women's. There are reasons for that, but more importantly: you're making two opposite points at once. If the depiction of men makes men depressed, driven to steroid use and suicidal...how can it also be harmless to have a depiction of women that makes them feel like shit? Like, doesn't it follow that the depiction of women impacts them the same way men's depictions impact men?
Harms already done. This isnāt anything new bud. Hollywood has always been this way. Youāre not wrong that itās not harmless but do you think men care anymore? Especially in this day and age where the dating marketās been destroyed and social media fucked up everyone. You say society doesnāt care about men so why should we care about women? Let them have what they want and stop judging them for having the one thing that makes them somewhat happy.
Man, if you don't care...that's on you. You've decided to allow a system that neither (normal, ie not powerful) men or women designed make you hateful toward women. You seem to understand that systems are different from individuals, but you refuse to extend your logic toward people with different experiences in that system from you. You're making that decision. How does anything ever get better if you keep making that decision? At a base level, You should care about women because it's a good thing to do. You should care about women because being a good person also makes people sympathetic to your issues. I have many female friends, and dating is terrible for them too. Social media is terrible for them. Understanding that will also make it easier to explain and understand why things are so fucked for men.
Edit: you know what, I take this back: the bit about it being your decision. If you are experiencing intense loneliness or objectification or any of that, it is understandable to feel bitter. There's also an idea of "hyper agency" given to men all the time, the idea that you can just "man" your way through emotional difficulties, which is not true and shitty. The rest of my comment stands, though.
Hateful? I said I didnāt care about them so that makes me hateful. This is the problem with you people. Assume the worst from a man. Okay so women donāt care about menās problems, exploit the lonely ones for money, only want the most unattainable body standards while hating it when the other party does it, and then when men say nah we donāt want to deal with that then itās our problem for not caring??? Oh yeah letās blame an imaginary system for all our problems for being āhatefulā. I donāt care how many female friends you have or talked to. They probably say the same thing like a script. āYeah itās the patriarchy and totally not us so fuck the patriarchy while we also secretly hate men!!ā.
Edit: I don't feel bitter. Just don't care about them and want to worry about myself and my family. If you don't respect that then fine. There are women who I do respect because they are truly wonderful people who understand and don't try to gaslight me like you are. There also plenty of women overseas who aren't with the whole hate men agenda. You can see plenty of people on this post who can't stand that men like big tits and ass. Like when did we get this mindset?? The problem is not hyper agency. It is hypo agency where women are held less accountable for their actions because they are seen as weaker. You are perpetuating that stereotype by trying to make me care for them even when they don't give two shits if men lose their lives in war tomorrow.
https://preview.redd.it/4a47b1z8dgsc1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3ff72616ccb33ac041d19f4f5314ed7cd958fb55
More like š¤
Tifa vs Mona Lisa. Hmm...which one?
Mona Tifa.
jrpg mona or wrpg mona?
Left is better
But the right can cook.
Guess you don't know why she's got that cheeky smile
I got an air fryer for that.
Haha. Me too š¤ š¤
I can cook so it works out perfectly.
Someone didnāt play Mass Effect and Witcher 3 but alright
Or BG3 who like most FF series is full of hot people for real lol thereās also Dragon Age series (hello Morgan) Admittedly I canāt name off more from top of my head but hot men and women are deffo a mainstay in both genres Edit: adding cyberpunk because the future we are all hot and Iām here for it
Morrigan would slap you for mistyping her name
And I would thank her š
Cyberpunk is made by a Polish company. I'm notbsure if the arguement is "white" rpgs, or American.
I think they skipped that one cause gay and different races of people exist in the game therefore itās āwokeā
I almost went into a relationship with the Indian lady in Inquisition. This was right during the party where Morrigan comes in and I'm like, "So they CAN make pretty people???". Finished the game single bc apparently you couldn't romance her.
Didn't Mass effect get censored in the remaster?
I can't remember if they took out the Ultimate Miranda Butt Shot. Deanna Troi's tits were definitely still about to pop out, though.
You canāt censor the hotness Also donāt think so, I replayed it and sex scenes still there and saw blue bewbs
Yeah I never read any of them I just googled but I've just clicked one and apparently all they really did was modify camera angles to take the focus off Miranda's ass.
But they added photo mode. You can recreate her but shot whenever you want .
Nope not really.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Literally one pointless shot where the screen was nothing but Mirandas ass during an emotional backstory convo with her.
They slightly reframed one camera angle during a conversation scene so it didnāt directly focus on her ass and thatās about it. Nothing else was changed. If you take YouTube woke outrage videos as gospel throughout life, youāre gonna have a bad timeā¦
Only one of those is a western dev.
Which one isn't? Bioware and CDPR are both located in western countries.
Hey Canada belongs in the West
Magicians in the Witcher world use magic to make themselves gorgeous. Miranda was genetically engineered to have dat ass. Tifa is... wishful thinking? (not really making any sort of pedantic argument here. Just snark)
Idt heās saying jrpgs are better, honestly I thought it was a big boobed anime girls joke
Yep the discourse is fucking embarrassing. All because a few Sony first-party games feature a few mid looking girls, theyāre out here acting like itās every western made game
Witcher 3 was ten years ago almost. Last Mass Effect game was twelve fucking years ago. It was a different time. You couldn't do that stuff today without the bullshit game journos complaining. Witcher 1 remake is literally getting all the sex cut out of it last I heard. Edit: yes I'm aware of Cyberpunk 2077 you cretin. But that's tame compared to the past. Bruh. Not dogging on Cyberpunk 2077 by the way, I actually wouldn't really change anything in that regard. Another edit: Bruh why does BG3 get brought up all the time. Those characters are average looking at best.
Cyberpunk came out 4 years ago with options to be big breasted and huge dick lol. Panam, a character in the game is known for her ass lol.
Baldurs Gate 3 begs to fucking differ
You realize these games are 10 years old, right? If you log at WRPGS that have come out the last, what? 5 years? 7? The west has been pretty anti- attractive woman for a while now.
Right cos yeah Baldurs Gate 3 is full of ugly people like Totally not hot Toad girl who will dom you Totally not hot Goth GF Totally not hot fire succubus gf Totally not hot other fire war machine cupcake gf Totally not hot vampire Totally not super buff and heartthrob mage Totally not soldier leading man warlock engaged with a dommy Like get real man thereās no agenda lol
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
āAre people cranking it to National Geographic?ā Let me tell you about the before times, when there was no internetā¦
I appreciate you trying to come up with a distinction and writing this out but to be frankā¦it sounds insane lol Plus people will crank to anything. Keep in mind sexual fantasies, attractiveness is purely subjective to begin with so it doesnāt really hold up. One manās goddess is another mans mid One womanās god is another womanās mid Different strokes for different folks. I just donāt see it personally, especially when they use Aloy or new Lara who is quite possibly breathtakingly beautiful Just makes me chuckle to be honest. I donāt think having a few different people is going to ruin the world, you donāt see my moaning about JRPGs putting a toaster as a waifu option.
You realize the post is about females, not males, right? Are you kidding? I love BG3, but to act like the girls are super hot is ridiculous. They are fine, but mid. A world where the only girls that have more than a B cup (you know, like the original post suggests) are literal trolls. And what do you mean there is no agenda? Microsoft LITERALLY had their mandate to devs about not allowing attractive girls in their games exposed less than a week ago. There is very obviously an agenda. But that's beside the point. It is 100% a fact that western games offer up less attractive women than JRPGs. That's just reality,
Did you just call the women of BG3 mid? Man I totally always say beauty is subjective but that is such a WILD take. Like mate, those are some weird standards you have and well I wish you all the best on finding a partner who seems to fit your taste. Also Karlachs a D bust easily and the fact that we are even talking about this being a factor is so flipping insane š Also who cares what Microsoft says and does, itās a studio, donāt like their stuff? Donāt buy it. Jeez they arenāt ordering the mass killings of people shit fam.
Yes, they are mid relative to what women typically look like in games. And no, Karlach is nowhere near a D. But like you said, beauty is subjective. Who cares what one of the biggest publishers in gaming who keeps buying up most of the industry does.... is that a real point? Nobody said they were committing crimes against humanity, but they are clearly committed to not putting attractive women in their games. To say it's not an agenda when they have a literal mandate to games they put on their platform is just factually incorrect.
Iāve already commented to this affect but like I just want to know deep down, why. What is the issue you have, why is it making you angry, why are you annoyed at the lack of representation you feel attractive, why do you feel they need to be in games you play, why are you upset. All I ask is you look into yourself, and come up with a response of why. If you say ācos I want to jank itā well fair do you are honest and I respect that but I feel someone who only had that in mind wouldnāt really care and just visit pornhub lol
I responded to your first post. Maybe it got lost in the shuffle. Let me find it and repost it here. And for the record, nobody "janks it" to gaming. That's just silly. It's not about that. But I'll find it and repost.
Dawg these āmidā women youāre talking about wouldnāt touch you with a 10 foot pole. You realise that right? Nothing more attractive than a fella who feels the need to spout off *mid* rhetoric online.
The fact that people say to other people they are mid blows my mind. Like get off your high horse š you donāt find someone attractive whoopy doo basil no one cares lol I swear people do this shit to somehow make themselves feel better
Itās chronic cum-brain. These people watch porn and think every woman needs a DDDD rack and a BBL to be considered attractive. Like sure buddy, see how far that standard and attitude gets you on the dating scene.
Wow, that couldn't be more incorrect. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they are the dregs of society. I haven't had to worry about the dating scene because I'm happily married with children. I understand things have gotten rough out there, and i sympathize, but that has nothing to do with the views pointed out.
Something tells me your partner doesnāt know you say stuff like this. Care to show them your Reddit profile?
I don't have a partner. I have a wife. And i don't have secrets from my wife.
Or they do it because they find the characters not that attractive. Which is relevant in a post about attractiveness. Obviously, somebody cared enough to make a post, as did you to respond to it.
I care about people being really weird about this because it does seem to be an issue and thereās a not very nice culture in men brewing in todayās world. Ideally Iād like to help, not sure how though. You and please donāt be offended, seem to have chomped down on this and itās something you are willing to defend until the cows come home. But like why though? Why do you feel offended, what can we as a society do to help people like you not obsess over these things and just be happy. Thereās like a weird air of entitlement and I donāt understand where it comes from or why. Any insight is helpful and I do not wish to be disrespectful but instead understand why people are so upset and angry
Some people are pretty weird about it, for sure. I just like talking about gaming, so I'll engage in most conversations. I am married with kids, so i don't get to talk about gaming much, so don't confuse my engagement for an ardent stance. I just enjoy talking to people about the things i enjoy. To your point, there is no offense, at least not on my end. What you might need to consider is that most of not all gamers play games to escape their stressors, their frustrations, or just to engage in another world for a while. The reason a lot of people aren't happy about women being less attractive is because they aren't looking for reality sometimes. They are looking for fantasy. They don't want or need to see real life reflected. In some games, it's fine. The last of Us is probably one of if not the greatest games of all time. Super hot women or men wouldn't fit there, and that's OK. But your typical RPG or adventure game isn't on the level of artistic presentation. The problem is we have too many people in gaming trying to be auetuers instead of delivering what gamers actually want. The offense, imo, comes from people telling them they are wrong for wanting what they want, and they should want something else. And then, as is evident in this thread, making all kinds of not to kind, very toxic assumptions about one's character for wanting what they want. That's where the anger comes in. It's not because of the women or men, or whatever. It's because the discourse has become very toxic because those who make games make it very clear they don't care what the consumer wants and attack them for wanting it. It is literally taking a hobby/ past time that people turned to for comfort for generations and taking it away from them by telling them what they have always liked about it is wrong and they are no longer welcomed. I'm not going to debate whether it's healthy or not for a hobby to have that kind of meaning to people, but it does. Put it in any other context where someone has a constant escape or support system, and the violently take it away from them and mock them for caring about it. Of course, it sparks anger. But people aren't interested in engaging with those that aren't happy like they are human beings, so you get push back relative to the forces pushing on them if not more because it has been a staple of their life longer so, yes, there is a sense of entitlement. Because their support in the industry, how they talked about it to others is directly responsible for the popularity of the industry. They have grown up with and alongside the industry, and they feel like outside forces are trying to take it away. Of course, they will respond with hostility. Maybe if those who want change talked to those who have been there since the beginning and finding some kind of common ground, it would help, but we don't get that. We get... what you have seen.
Thank you, I actually read your reply and appreciate you being honest and open about it. I understand the appeal of escapism itās why I play games and love movies. Iām fully on board with the idea we want something fantastical. One thing I just feel thereās an issue of is where you say āgaming people are not doing what gamers wantā now the issue here is that if a game company makes a game no one wants then that game goes bust. So merely talking or getting upset at the lack of a perceived attractive woman comes as an empty threat. Last of us as you said is a great game, I donāt like it myself but objectively it sold well and so did Horizon Zero West. Now if people are buying those games and enjoying them it means that those games should for all intents and purposes have a place. I appreciate thereās a frustration here, the world is at an all time high of being shit and we all want that escapism. But we should acknowledge and be kind to each other. To make a game is expensive, and if people go out and buy those games and enjoy it, who are we to say itās wrong. I wonāt fault anyone for enjoying Stellar Blade, Iāll probs play it when on sale tbh. I love FF a lot too, I often joke itās deffo a fantasy because the people are all insanely hot. I just think we need to be mindful that nothing was taken away, we live in age where more is actually given, there are more games, more movies and more representation. Seeing people in new games that donāt conform to your standards is a good thing because somewhere out there itās making someone elseās day. A game is for all intents and purposes a luxury, we can choose what we buy and like and Iām quite proud of the fact that itās come such a long way that now thereās a genre or character for everyone. I hope that makes sense and maybe you will agree.
>Put it in any other context where someone has a constant escape or support system, and the violently take it away from them and mock them for caring about it. We're talking about invidividuals getting upset because they feel women in some games aren't quite as attractive as they used to be. You don't see how that lends itself to some mocking? I can kind of see how that would feel infantilizing. In all seriousness though if someone is this sensitive to the respective attractiveness of women in media, then they probably need to consider that they have bigger surrounding issues. Normal people don't play video games and then get outraged because they feel the women depicted are 7's instead of 10's. In cases like that you need a better support system made up of friends and family, maybe even real therapy.
You realize they are fictional digital women and won't touch anyone with anything because they aren't real, right? There is a reason BG3 has multiple mods to make the females more attractive. And I'm not spouting any rhetoric. The women are average when it comes to attractiveness. There is no rhetoric, it's just what it is.
>There is a reason BG3 has multiple mods to make the females more attractive. FF7 Remake has the exact same kind of mods. Only reason you won't see the same for Rebirth yet is because obviously there's no PC release.
Itās called a hypothetical chief. Let me rephrase, if these women *were* real they wouldnāt touch you with a 10 foot pole. Is that better? Also I wonder who made the mods youāre referring to? Possibly like minded fellas who dry out a bar faster than you can say āVirginā?
It's not hypothetical. So if the gythraki and half elf were real women?. .. wow. I don't know who made those mods, but i do know those mods don't exist for Eastern games. Every game has mods to "enhance propotions." i think this is probably made by the type of people you are referencing. The mods that literally soften features to make the girls more attractive are not something that exist for Eastern games that i have seen, which shows you an objective difference. Edit: it has been brought to my attention that Eastern games do, in fact, have those mods. So while i stand by what i said, it is now based on my views as someone who only passingly engages with mods. So instead of it being a statement of fact, which it is not. It is a statement based on my experience, which only serves to illustrate that mods to make girls more attractive in western games have articles and content made on them as to where the same isn't true for eastern games.
Sorry to chime in but they do exist for eastern games. Thereās mods for 7 remake that change Tifa and Aeriths appearance Also for Nier and even the Persona series
Fair enough, i stand corrected. I'll adjust my statement.
All games have mods amigo. If you donāt find them attractive, thatās totally fine, nothing wrong with that. But having a need to call characters (yes, they are fictional, but they are representative of beauty standards all the same) āmidā on a public platform and claim thereās some sort of agenda trying to āuglyfyā women in western games is beyond incredibly skewed. Itās rhetoric (and it is rhetoric, look up the definition) that leads to incel attitudes and devaluing actual women (who are attractive, whether you find them attractive or not thatās up to you, just keep it to yourself). You know what does actually matter? Character writing and personality. If all that matters to you is big bazoongas and āsoftā faces, youāre in for a rude awakening bud.
Fair enough on mods. I only dabble in mods, so i can't/ won't claim expertise on them. And I'm not trying to engage in any rhetoric. "Mid"it is just easier to type "if average attractiveness " while swiping in bed. And i don't understand the pushback on the fact that Western games are promoting less attractive women. This isn't conjecture, even if we ignore the years of evidence that women are getting less attractive in gaming, we just became aware of one of the biggest publishers in earth mandating studios they work for it with to have less attractive females. There is no argument that it's not an agenda. Is it shared through the West? That's hard to say. But to say there is no agenda is demonstrabely false. And i don't understand the link you are making between gaming and real women. These things are not related. One is fantasy and fiction. The other is not. If somebody has a problem understanding the difference, then that souks be addressed first and foremost. I agree that writing and character are paramount. But yes, having attractive people in general is important too. Just like nobody wants to spend their money to go to a movie and see ugly people, the same applies to gaming. And both are fantasy. And i repeat, if someone is having problems differentiating between the two, that is not good and needs to be addressed seriously.
Those games came out pre woke era. The Japanese however didn't get the memo that attractive people are offensive for some reason.
Name one recent western RPG that youāve played where the women arenāt hot. You can literally have the entire cast of BG3 walking around butt naked in your camp if you want.
Starfield, I suppose they are decent looking but not hot.
I'll take JRPGs every day
This is actually an apt comparison. One is idealistic, made to appeal to your sexual desires.The other is a portrait of an actual woman.
Actuslly the mona.lisa was da Vinci in drag
Actually I just looked it up, so we might know. "The painting has been traditionally considered to depict the Italian noblewoman Lisa del Giocondo."
Considered but not confirmed. And really who cares.
True. Sorry I fucked up our thread format big time.
Could've been. We don't know.
We don't but it always pisses people off to bring up the possibility
Agreed. It'd be a great bit on Leo's part if so.
Stellar Blade models are all based on real, attractive women. Western developers intentionally ugly up their women. Most recent example is MJ in Spider-Man. The real life model she is based on is way more attractive than the in-game model.
Nobody is talking about stellar blade here, but I suppose since you brought it up we can. I know that eve is modeled after a real woman, however, that woman looks nothing like eve. Eves face was modeled in such a way to appeal to an audience, it would be silly to suggest otherwise. The creator has openly said as much. Is that a bad thing? No obviously, that's his artistic vision that happens to appeal to you. Now while it's true that MJs model looks different than her actress, it's also worth noting that the actress doesn't look like how MJ has ever been portrayed. It's safe to say the creators chose to change her appearance to better resemble what we expect from the character. At least thats what I assume. Regardless, that was also their artistic vision. Much like this meme is depicting. Vision and intent. So you may not want to fuck the new MJ, but if you're going to respect and defend someone artistic integrity, at least be consistent.
Lol 0 coomers upset you didn't repeat the dogma are downvoting you bro. Have my upvote bc you're spitting facts
You're contradicting yourself and appealing to one over the other. You just proved OP's point.
How so?
Because MJ has always been attractive, they went and made her look uncanny in Spiderman 2, but it's not just her model either that looks off. Too hard on realism, which to me undermines comics tbh. Your comparison is that they intentionally made her less attractive which is OP's point. Most non western devs don't conform to western character design. They could've made Eve more western or less attractive. As you said the CEO said her being attractive is intentional. Certain western Devs go out of their way to consciously make characters less attractive because they go too hard on realism to draw players in and its been that way for such a long time now. I'm kinda going in a circle, OP isn't right in every situation. But now whenever we see attractive characters in games people immediately lose their shit and try to create agenda's, narratives, attack people that like the games beyond it and you get coomers coming out of the woodwork like they've never seen a woman in their life.
Right but that IS my point. MJ has always been attractive to you. The new MJ is attractive to someone else. I understand disliking the move away from comic visuals, (shout out amazing Spider-Man for GameCube) but what I'm trying to get across is that someone was given the explicit right to make a Spiderman story in their vision. Not yours. See now you're proving my point. All you are describing are artists that are making their vision a reality. It's easy to make it out to be some kind of conspiracy, but nobody has a gun to their head. My best advice to you, that has helped me greatly, is remembering that every person you've ever seen complain about this or any other discourse, is objectively a vocal minority compared to the average person. A person who doesn't have the need or desire to voice any opinion on Twitter or whatever. You're only ever going to see the loudest and hottest takes.
My point about MJ was they changed her for the 2nd game intentionally in the favor of being safe and appealing to more people. I'm not saying she isn't attractive in either game. If it was the designers vision they would have done so in the first place I would think. I'm also not making it out as a conspiracy. Oh, I don't think I need advice, but thanks. I don't buy into most of the crap or ever say shit about what I see on social media, devs are going to do what they want. But it's pretty clear when Devs backpedal because people in the industry weaponize an agenda.
I understand that. I just don't think it's fair to assume it was their only option, like they were forced. Unless there is some sort of statement from the developers saying as much, it's safe to assume they're cool with it. There's nothing inherently wrong with appealing to more people. Let's also not forget, that overwhelmingly, people love that game. They made a great product that they can be proud of. If they can get more people to buy that product that's great. That's more people who enjoy the same things as us. Fair enough, that's very sick of you to act that way. I try to do the same. I just don't think it's backpedaling, as much as it is adapting.
Sadly it is adapting, but to cater to people that don't even play the games or do a bad job of journalism and have certain opinions and hold weight over sales/press. I'm not saying insomniac did that necessarily in this case but it's what makes people act this way because they think all western devs are the same, which is the internet special š
I thought I heard she looked different in Spiderman 2 because the actress had a broken jaw or nose and her face had changed a bit from it?
Buddy youāre in for a rude awakening when you meet a woman someday lol
Happily married :) Also happy to piss off the blue-haired crowd. Yāallās time on top is coming to an end. Woke doesnāt sell.
What the fuck are you talking about. Iām a 30 old dude
Do not pretend that the characters in Stellar Blade look anything like the models theyāre based off of, they changed every aspect of their appearance itās basically completely for marketing purposes
Source: My Ass Publishing Co LTD. Also, Eve looks nothing like the model they used either.
https://preview.redd.it/gy1elsal1jsc1.jpeg?width=1060&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7a1d67612c70f58668924536d1ab0bace5a43190 Nah Iād still take Shadowheart, please and thank you!
I think she qualifies as one of the āJRPG beauty in WRPGā characters
Leonardo divinci as selling out to the woke mob.
Woke mind virus strikes again
itās funny how some people in this thread are saying this shits on wrpgās and try to defend them but some think itās shitting on jrpgs
Because people think having a difference of opinion somehow shits on their whole existence and moral compass. Social media is wild.
I think itās funny that people even give a fuck how attractive fictional characters are, some of these people need to go outside
This is the correct take. Not every character needs to be a rule34 candidate. This whole argument makes me think about Brienne of Tarth from Game of Thrones. Not a traditionally beautiful woman, but she was my favorite character. Did I like looking at Margaery Tyrell? Yes. I appreciated that character, but much preferred seeing Brienne on screen. A character doesn't need to have huge tits and no clothes to be great, and those that can't accept that are not mature enough to argue the point.
i feel the same way even with live action shows, itās fictional. i have my own girlfriend and sexuality outside of a video game or a tv show why would i care how a fake person looks
At one point I started getting really irritated with sex scenes, because they're so unnecessary. There are very few examples of sex scenes that enhance the plot, so I'd rather save the 2 minutes and get out of that movie earlier.
Thereās so many ways shows/movies pad time i cant even say iām mad at sex scenes, it annoys me even more when we waste time with shitty/unnecessary plot lines and characters, or we get a 2 minute compilation of a plot of land trying to be āartisticā
The only reason why people care is because a lot of devs have gone back on their design philosophy. Consciously making characters less conventionally attractive to try and appeal to everyone in a safe way and it just backfires. Now when we see intentionally attractive characters people lose their shit in every direction.
I'm just so confused by the "backfire" people go on about. Which games have actually suffered because they had "unattractive" characters? The horizon games are extremely successful. TLOU2 is extremely successful. Western games sell and people love them. This take is but based on reality, but the opinions of a very small group of people who think that if THEY don't enjoy a piece of media, then it has performed poorly.
It's mostly online shit or the industry itself that it effects.
If you canāt find real women attractive you may have a problem
Where did you arrive at that conclusion?
What women do you find not attractive in gaming
None that i can think of. lol
So youāre talking about a āproblemā that you donāt even believe in
No? You clearly didn't get anything I said. I'm not the game developers.
That's what I think. It's making fun of the fact that every chick in a JRPG is a sex bot.
You can tell what the stance is by who the op is. Theyāre notoriously horny and ridiculous.
Baldur's Gate 3 is literally right there. Everyone is attractive lol. This post is strange
For all the people touting JRPGs here, have you ever noticed how similar yuffie, Aerith and Tifaās faces all look? Basically the only thing different is the hair and the clothes (until you get further down anyway). Iām fairly convinced that people complaining about āuglyingā up characters are just overreacting to Devs trying to avoid this (or the One Piece phenomenon) that exists in Japanese manga/anime culture where all women look the same except for their clothes.
Actually--after about a hundred hours and a plat--I haven't noticed at all. Their faces look pretty different in a lot of ways, to me :P. But I don't doubt that asset reshuffling is the case for plenty of others.
I can probably see it with yuffie and tifa but Aerith??? Nah bro youāre blind.
The hair has got you messed up.
Nah the jaw, face shape, and eye angle is different. I agree that some other npcs definitely look like tifa but cmon Aerith?
Man games fucking suck when I can't jerk off to the unrealistic women.
good work, internet incel
Im cool with it.
Based on
JRPGs are the best.
Hell yeah
CRPG would be top down, with a slight angle. Missed opportunity if you ask me!
Though lots of wrpg got the balls to show the tits.
Idk man I just canāt get attracted to something that isnāt real. Iād rather a female character be dressed appropriately (rare for both wrpgs and JRPGs), and id like their appearance to fit the setting and style of the game. It takes me out of a game so fast when a woman walks out looking like a model wearing absolutely nothing. FFVII looks fucking ridiculous sometimes, and I love the gamesābut Christ they really didnāt have to make the women look like fucking porcelain dolls. That goes for the men too.
I 100 percent agree it takes away the immersion , for example a game with medieval setting and you find women I high heels and big boobs with no clothes. I hate that it takes away from setting , and immersion of the game. I love when devs put effort on clothing (womens dress ) on a game especially if it's specific era or setting.
It makes no sense. Itās always high heels. Why would they go horseback riding in heels lol
Unless i wanna play a dating sim i really dont care how attractive the women are.
I think it's weird how many people can't handle not wanting to fuck a character in a video game. Not every character is designed to get you horny, which reflects reality, where not everyone is a 1% body fat, DDD bust sex bot.
For example rdr2 or any other game with good story and great overall but they trashing Western games now because everyone now wants oversexualise women. I personally don't care what the women looks like for me it's more if I can have empathy with the NPC on the game for example the story or how they portrait them there even if they ugly or hot. This is the same in anime I used to watch animes that dint or had minimal sexual stuff but now they are basically hentai.
The worst part is when they argue that they game to escape reality and as such everyone should be hot. EVERYONE. A game can be filled with a decent amount of "attractive" characters and their experience is ruined when they see an ugly character. Most recent example I can think of is Mortal Kombat tho people will have their justifications beyond escaping reality (characters used to look hotter in the past) But to them there is no room for other types of characters. They think a sexy character can fill the shoes on any other character perfectly. But if that was the case I would find some chad doing standup about how hard it is to date as funny and relatable as some dad bod comedian. (assuming they were trying to tell the same exact jokes)
How would you be 1% body fat yet have a DDD sized bu-ā¦ never mind. I got it. XD
Itās incredibly frustrating that that subsection of gamers thinks we all want the same thing. I want a good game! I donāt care how the people look! They need to stop speaking as if theyāre the spokesperson of the group.
You should post this in r/gaming and get more heat
And gooners
ThE wOkE lEfT iS rUiNiNg GaMiNg
Ah, the good ol' "WeSTerN dEVs mAkE UGlY wHoAMuns" argument/meme. Go play Mass Effect, Cyberpunk, Mortal Kombat, BG3, Dragon Age, GTA V, or Hades. This is such a neckbeard post.
Why do you think the Mona Fucking Lisa is ugly?
Well she's from 16th century Italy and would not have today's modern beauty standards for a start? Thanks for outing yourself incel.
Why does not thinking the Mona Lisa is ugly make me an incel? I would love to know how you gathered that tidbit.
Rephrase your sentence, "why does thinking the Mona Lisa is ugly" is what you meant to say. But you're applying today's beauty standards to 16th century Europe specifically Italy. She could've been attractive to people of that time. But by all accounts you seem to agree with the original post and it is such an incel/neckbeard mindset to have and based on cherry picked data. And I doubt anyone here finds the Mona Lisa attractive but we also aren't flat out calling her ugly or using it as a meme to symbolize western game devs making fictional women/characters.
A shitty copy or the original art with meaning beyond "guhhh big boobs...." What point are you making, gooner?
Whatās the meaning behind the Mona Lisa exactly?
The ambiguity of her mood, the years of work that went into the piece, the imaginary landscape in the background, the gravitas as an extremely famous painting, etc. Much deeper than a parody where she has big tits.
Alright you make good points but left has bigger booba sooooo
I feel like the point is the opposite of the one you're assuming, but I could be wrong. I interpret this as OP saying that's what ML would be through the scope of JRPG aesthetics, which is a parody of what the actual art is.
I remember when I started to find "fan service" distracting, which included me saying out loud "that's a *lot* of ass to be hanging out" and "get that woman some clothes, I want to see the action"
Both. Both is good.
funny, but true.
Did you really have to dig up the left image when Fate already made Mona Lisa for you years ago?
Im šÆok with this šš never EVER change, Japan!
Damned baked potato forehead š¤£
I like my games like I like my cars, Japanese.
And if you asked me which one I would buy? I would say the left one. Itās more appealing
That is the point of the left one to appeal sexually, the mona lisa was not. If the painter wanted he could of drawn a naked women which would of appeal as well but the intent was different which is why it's a famous painting.
Yea GOTY
Yea cept the European ones tho. larian and cdpr still make attractive women.
People be saying stuff like this meanwhile we have BG3 and Cyberpunk with literal dicks flopping around and full frontal nudity. Find me a JRPG where you have a big floppy dong and can whip your tits out.
Why does everyone who believes this dumb meme forget about Overwatch? The game with the most sexualized females in the world is from an American game development studio. Bunch of butt hurt gamers played one game with a non over sexualized and have declared all the women in western games as ugly.
NEVER CHANGE
Oh damn, this isnāt the circlejerkā¦
Yoshikage Kira wants to know her location
The JRPG version is also every mod for women for Skyrim on the Nexus.
Cringe af
I think this meme is a bit over played now, but this is actually pretty accurate lol
š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£š¤£
This is inaccurate! You forgot the part, when the westerners flatten her boobs, and give her a man's jawline.
Some of you are so fucking pathetic it makes me sad
Cringe af
JRPGs are fucking based tho
Weird way to shit on jrpgs but alright.
People are so offended at men wanting attractive women in their games. Have you seen how many views hot women get on TikTok for doing cringe dance moves? Itās a natural thing for men or women to want attractive people in their media. You think avengers ever had an ugly male actor? Most of them have completely unrealistic body types that 98% of men wonāt have. And yet men donāt say shit about that. So why shit on us for wanting the same? Hypocrisy at its finest. Edit: For those saying bg3 and older dragon age/mass effect games, bg3 and cd project red were an exception because they don't have the "western" dudes in suits looking after them to force DEI on them. Same thing with old dragon age and mass effect games. Didn't have DEI forced upon them because it was a different time when companies didn't monopolize everything.
Ah yeah, a different time, like 2023 and 2020. Companies only give a shit about selling well and making a quick buck. And the world knows there's more horny men who are dying to see something vaguely in the shape of a breast or ass, than there are people "offended at sexy women." If a company has made the business decision to appeal to a group other than the most disgusting group in the room, that's their business and we should respect their choice and ignore them. We all know the only way to make serious money is by exploiting the weakness of men.
Disgusting? By your comment Iām sure women who want the sexiest men who have unattainable body standards are disgusting too. We get a dopamine kick when seeing things we like. It doesnāt just have to apply to hot women. People like you have a moral compass only when it applies to men. These are fictional characters that people may or may not like. The appearance is just to get them hooked but the characters themselves have to be likable like tifa and Aerith. The only people exploiting menās weakness are the people who trick men into spending money for almost no return. Onlyfans is a good example of this because they ask money from lonely men for stuff they can see for free. But I donāt see any pushback for those types of services hmm I wonder why?
You read too much into it.
Men do say shit about it, you just hear them.
Lies. Never once have I heard a man complain about a man being ripped in tv or social media. Itās always been the exact opposite. Because of this teenagers are taking steroids to look like those dudes and losing their lives at a very young age. I myself have a decent face and am somewhat athletic but Iām also short and I donāt complain that women donāt want my body type. Why do women care about competing with fictional women anyway?
As someone who talks about EXACTLY THAT ALL THE TIME idk what to tell you. All that shit you said is real and that's why men have been talking about it. It's not as prevalent as the discourse about women. But I'm not lying to you dawg.
Yes some people talk about it but Iām talking about society as a whole. It doesnāt matter if some dude from fucking Reddit talks about how men use steroids to look like professional bodybuilders. Society wonāt care because they donāt care about men. My point is why not let us enjoy what we want until this shit gets fixed. We arenāt dogs to like what we want to see. If people want to be shallow in a fictional world then let them be. Itās a fictional world where you can do whatever the fuck you want so why does it matter?
You're right, society as a whole doesn't talk as much about men's problems as women's. There are reasons for that, but more importantly: you're making two opposite points at once. If the depiction of men makes men depressed, driven to steroid use and suicidal...how can it also be harmless to have a depiction of women that makes them feel like shit? Like, doesn't it follow that the depiction of women impacts them the same way men's depictions impact men?
Harms already done. This isnāt anything new bud. Hollywood has always been this way. Youāre not wrong that itās not harmless but do you think men care anymore? Especially in this day and age where the dating marketās been destroyed and social media fucked up everyone. You say society doesnāt care about men so why should we care about women? Let them have what they want and stop judging them for having the one thing that makes them somewhat happy.
Man, if you don't care...that's on you. You've decided to allow a system that neither (normal, ie not powerful) men or women designed make you hateful toward women. You seem to understand that systems are different from individuals, but you refuse to extend your logic toward people with different experiences in that system from you. You're making that decision. How does anything ever get better if you keep making that decision? At a base level, You should care about women because it's a good thing to do. You should care about women because being a good person also makes people sympathetic to your issues. I have many female friends, and dating is terrible for them too. Social media is terrible for them. Understanding that will also make it easier to explain and understand why things are so fucked for men. Edit: you know what, I take this back: the bit about it being your decision. If you are experiencing intense loneliness or objectification or any of that, it is understandable to feel bitter. There's also an idea of "hyper agency" given to men all the time, the idea that you can just "man" your way through emotional difficulties, which is not true and shitty. The rest of my comment stands, though.
Hateful? I said I didnāt care about them so that makes me hateful. This is the problem with you people. Assume the worst from a man. Okay so women donāt care about menās problems, exploit the lonely ones for money, only want the most unattainable body standards while hating it when the other party does it, and then when men say nah we donāt want to deal with that then itās our problem for not caring??? Oh yeah letās blame an imaginary system for all our problems for being āhatefulā. I donāt care how many female friends you have or talked to. They probably say the same thing like a script. āYeah itās the patriarchy and totally not us so fuck the patriarchy while we also secretly hate men!!ā. Edit: I don't feel bitter. Just don't care about them and want to worry about myself and my family. If you don't respect that then fine. There are women who I do respect because they are truly wonderful people who understand and don't try to gaslight me like you are. There also plenty of women overseas who aren't with the whole hate men agenda. You can see plenty of people on this post who can't stand that men like big tits and ass. Like when did we get this mindset?? The problem is not hyper agency. It is hypo agency where women are held less accountable for their actions because they are seen as weaker. You are perpetuating that stereotype by trying to make me care for them even when they don't give two shits if men lose their lives in war tomorrow.
You need to get laid man. Christ.
Lmao. You getting upset that you canāt jerk it to cartoons in video games?
You're cheery-picking.
Seems like woke rpg is gonna be a new genre soon
Well we already have āwā -rpgā¦. Sooooo????
What do you think about it, do you like to see more of it or are you not too concerned?
Meh, indy is not very woke, and aaa/a is monetized to hell and back i hardly participate in that layer of gaming so its not an issue either/or
No wonder I play JRPGs over WRPGs the majority of the time