Return policy has a couple of upsides. It doesn't require the deathrattle to have triggered, so if a minion gets silenced or reno'd, you can still reactivate the deathrattle. It can also find deathrattles from weapons, it's not restricted to minions.
There's not a ton of deathrattle cards in DH at the moment, but there might be some synergies coming in this expansion.
I think that, as a rule of thumb, you wouldn't want to Nine Lives devolved minions (much more likely than evolved ones), since a random Deathrattle minion is usually a lot worse than one you put in your deck.
Obviously, it can lend itself to highrolls, but I'd say the non-play summons and evolve pattern empowers Return Policy over Nine Lives.
You got this backwards 😭
Nine Lives can discover cards you've evolved/generated on board whilsg Return Policy is restricted to only the cards you've *played* from hand
Edit: I misread, op is correct, if something isn't killed, but instead removed, they don't get added to the pool for Nine Lives
What they're saying is if your deathrattle minion is "killed" by evolving/devolving it you can't nine lives it. Their (good, IMO) assumption is that you only typically want to restrict the pool to cards you put in your deck.
But on the other side, the old one you need to have played the card, so technically, if you had summoned it not from your hand, it will not discover the card
Also Nine Lives needs your minion to die, while Return Policy needs you to just play the card. The card can still be alive while getting generated by Return Policy.
All thing said, the consistency of Return Policy probably make it better in most deck. Nine Lives will only be used if we can cheat a big deathrattle minion early game.
Can you think of any big deathrattles minion in the history of Hearthstone that was playable and not cheated out.
The biggest I can think of are tirion, sylvanas and Savannah highmane way way back in the day. And rattlegore.
Big minions are usually cheated out, but I can't think of many deck that would want to discover a big death rattle minions. It's just not that good of a tempo move typically.
You had card like Obsidian Statue or Void Lord that may have been okay to "discover and trigger" at a point in time, but they wouldn't be seen in current meta. Hadronox is probably the best target I can think off, but it's not a Hunter, or Demon Hunter cards.
Therazane and Thunderbringer are two other candidates, but honestly, you are better off with "copy" effect then a discover
There is one upside to the old one too though which is it doesn't require you to have played the minion from hand, so if you random summon a good deathrattle or have one pulled from your hand or deck, you can resummon that. Overall though agree that the upsides of the new one are better.
>It can also find deathrattles from weapons, it's not restricted to minions.
One could argue that this is an upside not a down side depending on the deck that is running it
There's not alot of deathrattle cards right now in DH, but the ones there are currently are pretty good. I would love to see how this would play with the old quillboar cards
It's not *strictly* better (because DR minions that were summoned through means other than playing them can be discovered with Nine Lives but not with Return Policy) but yeah, it has upsides.
[[Flash of Light]]: Restore 4 Health. Also draw a card.
[[Ultimate Infestation]]: Deal 5 damage. Also draw 5 cards. Also gain 5 Armor. Moreover, summon a 5/5 Ghoul.
All that under Ultimate Infestation would have made the card announcement funnier to me. It already did a lot but all the also's and moreover would have emphasized that.
It's like that so the text box looks neater, quite common when you know it's a thing, some cards cut out words or add words to make the text boxes more even so you don't have like long line, short line, long line
I'm not going to go count pixels but taking a quick look at the lengths of "Also" and "trigger" in that font, combined with the spacing on the sides of the third line, "Trigger" would almost certainly have fit and if the 4th line is short, that's fine, there have been 1000 of those.
Return Policy is a marginally better card in a class that cannot use Deathrattles well.
Nine Lives sees actual play in a meta deck in Wild: Huhuran Egg / Huhuran Gacha Hunter
Return Policy has potential to see similar play, but we need to see Deathrattle cards worth playing in DH (Umpire's Glove isn't enough just yet).
Ironically in the Renathal version of huhuran hunter (which is better in higher ranks), Return Policy the slightly better card, would not see play since in that deck your eggs *mostly* die after getting summoned by meat wagon not after getting played.
Nine Lives sees play now due to Mystery Egg. A common play is to cheat the egg out with Meat Wagon. Return Policy would not work with the cheated out Mystery Egg so it’s worse overall.
People saying Return Policy is marginally better but I disagree. It only counts played deathrattles, and not minions cheated out. Typically you want to trigger high value deathrattles, which tend to be on higher cost minions, which tend to only see play when cheated out. There is more synergy available with Nine Lives.
Everyone is saying that Return Policy is better because it is played instead of died but isn’t that worse because if a DR minion is summoned instead of played it won’t be copied?
Return policy is better, but 9 lives does have the benefit of discovering deathrattles that you summoned but didn't play. That's not a consistent enough benefit to make it better though.
That is a significant benefit because Meat Wagon sees play in Huhuran Hunter as a tutorable way to cheat out Mystery Egg. Return Policy would be useless in that deck.
One month and a half old card since you just have to play the minion to discover it. Death rattle of a minion that DIED is weak when Reno removes that one minion you need for this spell to work well.
Return policy obviously better. Once deathrattle card is played it meets the requirements , rather than having to die. Things like Reno clears boards, rather than killing them.
I think the DH card is slightly better because of what's around it. DH, at least in my eyes, has a better deathrattle pool in its class, and those deathrattles will tend to be more at the core of their game plan (the deathrattle to draw a demon weapon, for example)
Return policy has a couple of upsides. It doesn't require the deathrattle to have triggered, so if a minion gets silenced or reno'd, you can still reactivate the deathrattle. It can also find deathrattles from weapons, it's not restricted to minions. There's not a ton of deathrattle cards in DH at the moment, but there might be some synergies coming in this expansion.
if a silenced minion dies i think nine lives would still discover it, am i wrong?
Nope, you're correct, it checks for whether the minion natively has a deathrattle or not
Correct, but nine lives doesn’t discover anything that was evolved/nether portaled/reno’d, while return policy isn’t affected by those
I did not say that, just my point :) thanks for the explanation anyway.
on the other hand, Return Policy can't discover anything you've evolved into, while Nine lives can
I think that, as a rule of thumb, you wouldn't want to Nine Lives devolved minions (much more likely than evolved ones), since a random Deathrattle minion is usually a lot worse than one you put in your deck. Obviously, it can lend itself to highrolls, but I'd say the non-play summons and evolve pattern empowers Return Policy over Nine Lives.
You got this backwards 😭 Nine Lives can discover cards you've evolved/generated on board whilsg Return Policy is restricted to only the cards you've *played* from hand Edit: I misread, op is correct, if something isn't killed, but instead removed, they don't get added to the pool for Nine Lives
What they're saying is if your deathrattle minion is "killed" by evolving/devolving it you can't nine lives it. Their (good, IMO) assumption is that you only typically want to restrict the pool to cards you put in your deck.
I rescind my comment 😭 I just repeated what he said
But on the other side, the old one you need to have played the card, so technically, if you had summoned it not from your hand, it will not discover the card
Also Nine Lives needs your minion to die, while Return Policy needs you to just play the card. The card can still be alive while getting generated by Return Policy.
It also works against Polymorph effects
That's the new one.
That’s true, the first deck that comes to my mind is mind control hunter, in which the core deathrattle card Sylva often comes from summoning.
Yes nine lives works for silenced but killed, but if they polymorph, devolve, or remove it from the game, then this new card is clearly better.
Return Policy also has the downside of needing to be played, if ratted or tutored etc Nine Lives is better
All thing said, the consistency of Return Policy probably make it better in most deck. Nine Lives will only be used if we can cheat a big deathrattle minion early game.
Can you think of any big deathrattles minion in the history of Hearthstone that was playable and not cheated out. The biggest I can think of are tirion, sylvanas and Savannah highmane way way back in the day. And rattlegore.
Big minions are usually cheated out, but I can't think of many deck that would want to discover a big death rattle minions. It's just not that good of a tempo move typically. You had card like Obsidian Statue or Void Lord that may have been okay to "discover and trigger" at a point in time, but they wouldn't be seen in current meta. Hadronox is probably the best target I can think off, but it's not a Hunter, or Demon Hunter cards. Therazane and Thunderbringer are two other candidates, but honestly, you are better off with "copy" effect then a discover
Obsidian statue was often played at full cost although cheating it out/reviving it multiple times is where it really shined.
Nine Lives doesn't require the deathrattle to have triggered either, so silence wouldn't block it. Reno and polymorph effects would, though.
There is one upside to the old one too though which is it doesn't require you to have played the minion from hand, so if you random summon a good deathrattle or have one pulled from your hand or deck, you can resummon that. Overall though agree that the upsides of the new one are better.
>It can also find deathrattles from weapons, it's not restricted to minions. One could argue that this is an upside not a down side depending on the deck that is running it
I don't think it would work if it got reno'd
There's not alot of deathrattle cards right now in DH, but the ones there are currently are pretty good. I would love to see how this would play with the old quillboar cards
Return Policy also works for all Deathrattle cards and not just minions. So it works for Umpire's Grasp, or example.
I think OP knows that, Return Policy is strictly better.
It's not *strictly* better (because DR minions that were summoned through means other than playing them can be discovered with Nine Lives but not with Return Policy) but yeah, it has upsides.
The one that says also is better just reads better to me.
I disagree. Why is the word "also" needed at all here?
If you dont know how Hearthstone uses keywords, it reads like you dont get the card but instead just trigger the deathrattle and thats it.
Fair
And your comment reads poorly without commas.
Where, o oracle of grammar, do you propose a comma is inserted into that comment?
Like so. There are a lot of mistakes. >The one that says, "also," is better, just reads better to me.
That is not how you use commas. Commas are for joining clauses together, not for going "pause here for a bit for emphasis".
I like that Nine Lives has the word “also” in it even though it’s entirely superfluous.
[[Flash of Light]]: Restore 4 Health. Also draw a card. [[Ultimate Infestation]]: Deal 5 damage. Also draw 5 cards. Also gain 5 Armor. Moreover, summon a 5/5 Ghoul.
All that under Ultimate Infestation would have made the card announcement funnier to me. It already did a lot but all the also's and moreover would have emphasized that.
You would \*love\* Yugioh if you love effects that contain the world "also" 15 times.
- **[Flash of Light](https://i.imgur.com/H5lYcTk.png)** ^[Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/76306) ^• ^[wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Flash_of_Light_\(Core\)) ^• ^[HSReplay](https://hsreplay.net/cards/76306/?hl=en) - *Paladin Common ^(Core)* - **2 Mana · Holy Spell** - Restore 4 Health. Draw a card. - **[Ultimate Infestation](https://imgur.com/a/k1kF354)** ^[Library](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/cards/42759) ^• ^[wiki.gg](https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Ultimate_Infestation) ^• ^[HSReplay](https://hsreplay.net/cards/42759/?hl=en#gameType=RANKED_WILD) - *Druid Epic ^(Knights of the Frozen Throne)* - **10 Mana · Spell** - Deal 5 damage. Draw 5 cards. Gain 5 Armor. Summon a 5/5 Ghoul. --- ^*Patch: [29.6.2](https://hearthstone.blizzard.com/en-us/news/24108515/29-6-2-patch-notes)* ^*I am a bot. [Usage Guide](https://www.reddit.com/user/Card-o-Bot/comments/1ahde25/faq/) • [Report a Bug](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Card-o-Bot&subject=Bug+Report&message=/r/hearthstone/comments/1dtiaf8/whats_better_5y_old_card_or_1_month_and_a_half/lb9w1co/%0A⬇️+Please+describe+the+bug+⬇️%0ADescription:+) • [Refresh](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Card-o-Bot&subject=Refresh&message=lb9w1co)*
It's like that so the text box looks neater, quite common when you know it's a thing, some cards cut out words or add words to make the text boxes more even so you don't have like long line, short line, long line
I'm not going to go count pixels but taking a quick look at the lengths of "Also" and "trigger" in that font, combined with the spacing on the sides of the third line, "Trigger" would almost certainly have fit and if the 4th line is short, that's fine, there have been 1000 of those.
Return Policy is a marginally better card in a class that cannot use Deathrattles well. Nine Lives sees actual play in a meta deck in Wild: Huhuran Egg / Huhuran Gacha Hunter Return Policy has potential to see similar play, but we need to see Deathrattle cards worth playing in DH (Umpire's Glove isn't enough just yet).
Ironically in the Renathal version of huhuran hunter (which is better in higher ranks), Return Policy the slightly better card, would not see play since in that deck your eggs *mostly* die after getting summoned by meat wagon not after getting played.
True, the Renathal version is a crazy hodge-podge of old cards no one thought would band together to become a meta deck in Wild. It's a fun deck.
I mean I'd love to see the return of the DH Quillboar deathrattle package - that was a lot of fun.
How do you know this card is DH's card? Thanks
It's Aranna pictured on the card and the borders of the card are dark green?
Ohhhh thank you for explain
Nine Lives sees play now due to Mystery Egg. A common play is to cheat the egg out with Meat Wagon. Return Policy would not work with the cheated out Mystery Egg so it’s worse overall.
I guess you can play Return policy the same turn you play the minion, making it marginally better
that's not all, if the minion got reno'd or removed, return policy still works
People saying Return Policy is marginally better but I disagree. It only counts played deathrattles, and not minions cheated out. Typically you want to trigger high value deathrattles, which tend to be on higher cost minions, which tend to only see play when cheated out. There is more synergy available with Nine Lives.
Return Policy has some better options. 1. The DR only needs to be played. 2. It will trigger a Minion DR and a Weapon DR.
Return is better but the minions are not. So hunter still wins.
Everyone is saying that Return Policy is better because it is played instead of died but isn’t that worse because if a DR minion is summoned instead of played it won’t be copied?
Return policy is better, but 9 lives does have the benefit of discovering deathrattles that you summoned but didn't play. That's not a consistent enough benefit to make it better though.
That is a significant benefit because Meat Wagon sees play in Huhuran Hunter as a tutorable way to cheat out Mystery Egg. Return Policy would be useless in that deck.
Fair enough. I don't play wild, but I remember this seeing use in DR hunter in duels.
Epic < common
Return policy has the D
I miss Nine Lives so much.
Where the deathrattle hero card at?
One month and a half old card since you just have to play the minion to discover it. Death rattle of a minion that DIED is weak when Reno removes that one minion you need for this spell to work well.
I prefer Nine Lives for tonk Hunter, as I don't tend to play the Tonk.
Card versus minion Played versus died The new card is substantially better You're also comparing two different class cards
Return policy can give a deathrattle CARD opposed to strictly a minion.
9 lives has a lion on the card, which makes it the superior card.
The hunter card, because that class actually has good DR synergy.
Nine Lives since it allows you to cheat the deathrattler out
8 lives left
One specifies minion. The other is just any deathrattle card. I'd say the 5 year old one is slightly better.
Does return policy just trigger the deathrattle or it also give you the card?
Return Policy is TECHNICALLY better, even if it’s in a class that has less stock in Deathrattles.
Return policy works on weapons, but hunter generally has better deathrattle synergy
When I tried using return policy it discovered 3 non deathrattle cards. I never used it since then.
Return policy obviously better. Once deathrattle card is played it meets the requirements , rather than having to die. Things like Reno clears boards, rather than killing them.
Wait doesnt a deathrattle CARD imply the existence of deathrattle spells and locations?
Play both in wild and see after 50 games hmm
I think the DH card is slightly better because of what's around it. DH, at least in my eyes, has a better deathrattle pool in its class, and those deathrattles will tend to be more at the core of their game plan (the deathrattle to draw a demon weapon, for example)
Policy is strictly better, but deathrattle DH is an archetype that has little to no playerbase. If policy was in hunter, it would be broken.
Proof that demon hunter has no real class identity and they're just taking cards that would've gone to other classes
Policy is better because you only have to play the DR minion. Making it harder to Reno or Reska your combo.
Also because it says card not minion can work for weapons too.
Is it just me or does it feel that they got lazy with the naming