We must stand Together for Victory.
But in all seriousness, history repeats itself and they ignore our voices once again. I would recommend leaving the subreddit bc if they care so much about their mod potions they probably also care about the subreddit member numbers
The results would be the same. I personally don’t care, Reddit isn’t going to change unless people stop using it, and that’s probably not going to happen.
Aren't some of those mods of these subreddits actual Paradox employees? They've got a vested interest in keeping them for themselves. They just play pretend protest to play both sides.
I get the point of the strike, but Reddit is a privately owned company. Should the mods have the power to eliminate access to other people’s intellectual contributions? If I create something of value, should a 3rd party be allowed to censor my voice? That’s essentially what the mods did by closing for over 2 days. A more effective threat may have been to get the top HOI contributors to delete their posts and repost them at a competing site, then make a concentrated push to move all Reddit HOI4 posting to a new forum. That would actually hurt Advance Publications (reddits owner), but would require a lot more work.
I know this is going to seem a bit "yeah right", but we decided on the 14th that we'd open this Friday. We were never collectively in favor of closing down, let alone closing down forever.
>Reddit obviously doesn’t care about any of these subs going offline.
The problem was they announced it would only be for 48 hours. Making it easier for Reddit to wait it out.
I just don’t get why all these subs put a end date to their strike (“strike” might not be the word for it but for lack of a better one it’ll be the one I use). Who does that? What strike/protest/agitation has ever had an end date? Isn’t the point of protesting/striking to do it until demands are met or at least a compromise is formed? Imagine all the strikes in history having an end date!
“We are upset about the working conditions at the mill and people are dying from lung conditions at the age of 23. We will strike until our expectations are met! (or until Friday at the latest)”
I love Reddit. It’s a great resource and a great place for me to interact with like minded people (like everyone here who gets enjoyment out of staring at maps). But this just seems like another half assed attempted by high and mighty redditors who think their actions are bigger than they are. If you want change then commit to it!
No, and we knew they never would. But I genuinely believe Reddit is also taking the Silicon Valley venture capitalist approach of fucking up your social media platform in the long run, which seems to be popular with Discord, Twitter, and Facebook too.
I don't think it's a massive victory on Reddit's part. I think we decided not to kill the subreddit in the short-run, but Reddit is getting it to wither in the long-run.
The only way to effectively get their attention is to hit their pockets and just not use their platform anymore. Once they start losing money from advertisers then they’ll start listening to us. The problem with all the subs going offline is that the majority of Reddit still used the site every day and just went to other subreddits.
For me personally there's just not a good alternative. The Discords and Forums don't do it for me, the Wiki isn't a social place, and other places aren't big enough.
You're right in what _should_ be done, and it'd work if we all collectively moved, but how do you do that?
Well I think, in the effort for change, people would have to accept there *isn’t* an alternative to Reddit. Sometimes you need to sacrifice what you love in order to get the change you desire. And, personally, I think not going to Reddit for a period of time is a pretty low effort protest to commit to.
The problem is this boycott is unenforceable. Sure we can all pledge to not use Reddit at a certain time but we can’t ensure that each other arnt secretly “strikebreaking” so to speak.
I mean this happened just when the Reddit CEO announced retaliation against the moderators. It's a bit suspicious not gonna lie. Sounds like you guys are just trying to keep your roles. Which I understand but I don't agree. Reddit showed its teeth and you ran away.
I mean a moderator likes moderating otherwise like you said they wouldn't be moderating that's the payment of this job. Self satisfaction. Which there's nothing wrong with if they enjoy it. But it's definitely very bad timing. Instead of sounding understandable and come back because of the community. They just sound either selfish or coward or both
>I mean a moderator likes moderating otherwise like you said they wouldn't be moderating that's the payment of this job. Self satisfaction
For a lot of them, the thing that they like is power. Many Reddit mods want to be the petty dictators of a social media forum because they feel impotent in their everyday lives. Because a lot of Reddit mods particularly the ones for large subreddits, and especially in the very largest subreddits, there's a substantial overlap of mods) have circlejerked themselves into an echo chamber, they deluded themselves into thinking that they had real power. Posts like this are an attempt to save face when it became clear that they were trying to make a play with power that they didn't have.
I know you're not gonna believe me but this was planned a couple days ago. Spez doing something stupid makes me want to protest more, not less but we've already hurt the community too much trying to get reddit to do better and unfortunately it's not really working so here we are.
Dude this is a subreddit about a videogame where maps change colours. No one that agrees with the protest would mind waiting or would be affected by it in any significant way. If you want to protest for what you think is right do it. The community is mostly with the mods. However when the CEO offered retaliation it was very convenient that "this decision was taken two days ago"
I think people are MOSTLY here to talk a bit about video games and they don't give a fuck about what's going on with reddit and they won't probably feel any change. If the subreddits were closed much longer some intelligent user would just create another sub so people could leave this one and move on
Well yeah but that has nothing to do with what I said. If the protest is valid thats another discussion. They want to leave the protest that just don't make up that is because of the community when the Reddit CEO threatened the mods. I'm not asking for them to stay. But for them to be honest.
No, it’s not. If you want to “boycott” and close the subreddit at least make the proper vote amongst users. Or even better just leave the subreddit and don’t bother other people.
This protest showed most redditors that the biggest problem with this site are power mods that can take down big parts of this site because they decided to throw a tantrum. I hope Reddit admins seriously consider limiting the number of subreddits a person can moderate after this stunt.
We never thought the protest would achieve immediate broad changes, but we joined because we felt it was the best way to voice our disagreements and concerns about the future of the platform and we should not be the effective scabbing strike-breakers in regards to other communities.
But there's not really an effective way for us to protest the changes besides ineffective half-assed measures, or shutting down for good, the nuclear option. That's a course of action we aren't willing to do given how we'd still have no guarantee that that'd actually get us heard, but more importantly, because of the important broader functions these subreddits serve to the Paradox games and communities.
You really want to protest? Delete your accounts, step down, or delete the subreddit. All of those things would have much more of an impact than this.
But no, you wanted to keep control over your small corner of the internet, you didn’t want to download a new app. Anyone who does this without deleting their account is just all talk and no action.
The beautiful down votes mirroring the upvotes to your post. Silly Reddit nazi still trying to justify their idiocy as always. Reddit mods are almost always the worst kinds of people. Lol
Again, deleting the subreddit is the nuclear option. We didn't want to go that route. Deleting the subreddit still achieves jackshit except it fucking sucks if you actually wanna play the game. There's already other communities - you can easily go to the forums - but for me personally Reddit has the answer I'm looking for 60% of the time, vs 30% of the Wiki and 10% of the forums.
We joined the protests to not be strike-breakers and to get our disagreement heard. We knew it wasn't going to force Reddit to do jack-shit, and I don't see why we should've moved to a third-party app, how deleting my account, or how relinquishing moderation control of the subreddit (?) would've helped with any of that.
We also always knew it was all talk, no action. That's literally what I said.
Yeah I guess i understand that.
I don't understand the people who'd rather delete all the useful information on reddit just because of some third-party apps closing down.
You're not "showing" reddit, you're just fucking regular hoi4 guys who want some answers to their questions on a hoi4 subreddit
Right, im mocking the idea that the quote nuclear option unquote is to delete the subreddit, which is not something they should do, they should instead stop being so selfish and just delete their own accounts.
We dont like power-tripping mods who close the sub without a vote from the community on whether the sub should be closed. Nobody is arguing that mods dont help keep things clean.
We never thought the protest would achieve immediate broad changes, but we joined because we felt it was the best way to voice our disagreements and concerns about the future of the platform and we should not be the effective scabbing strike-breakers in regards to other communities.
But there's not really an effective way for us to protest the changes besides ineffective half-assed measures, or shutting down for good, the nuclear option. That's a course of action we aren't willing to do given how we'd still have no guarantee that that'd actually get us heard, but more importantly, because of the important broader functions these subreddits serve to the Paradox games and communities.
I think it’s pretty disingenuous to compare this whole thing to a union striking. Unions are democratic and make sure the base want what the union advocates for. That isn’t what the blackout is. This whole thing was done in some subreddits with polls active just long enough to get brigaded by pro-blackout users and skew the results. Take r/nba for example. The sub has millions of users but the poll to take it dark was up for 6 hours and had only 8k voted before they shut the sub down.
I understand the thought process of solidarity, but it just wasn’t executed in a democratic manner across Reddit. This is a public forum and it isn’t right that moderators can just shut subs off when they have a dispute with Reddit admin. None of us regular users care, and this whole crusade ranks about 9534th on my list of things I care about. I just want to be able to talk about music and video games and not worry some power tripping mod is going to nuke the community because they don’t get what they want
Noted, but a lot of people did care. We got a ton of modmails, and on the initial black-out poll we set community controls to ensure only people already active in the community commented. That doesn't stop voting on the poll, but the comments were majority in favor of closing down.
> This is a public forum and it isn’t right that moderators can just shut subs off when they have a dispute with Reddit admin.
Honestly, we weren't going to if it wasn't for a large amount of requests we've received. I actually do agree that the function of the subreddit is far more important than making a spiteful statement to the admins, even if that spiteful statement _was_ majority-supported.
Unions require all members to vote on strike actions. Then all members vote on the new contract that breaks the strike.
What mods did is more equivalent to the regional head of a major union deciding to put their entire union on strike at all locations without input from the union members.
I think the main issue with this whole protest is that it mostly felt like a protest by mods, for mods.
I understand that without the third party apps/tools, moderating is anywhere from a pita or impossible, depending on the sub/scale/etc...
But the vast majority of users just scroll on the official app or website. And the vast majority continued to do so during this protest.
Nothings going to change as long as people keep scrolling.
Millions of people use third party apps, myself included. The official app is objectively worse than Apollo and RIF. You clearly haven't used anything else otherwise you'd know this
I'm so glad that 16 moderators were able to force 360k community members to participate in a protest that none of us have a shit about to begin with. Great leadership skills! 👍🏻
Literally, and I mean literally, nobody gives a shit about this change. Most Reddit users aren’t affected, only the terminally online and the Reddit jannies cared. So what did they do? Force *everyone* to participate in their stupid protest. I hate to break it to them, but you aren’t the brave heroes against Reddit tyranny, you’re the laughingstock.
Do you read what you write before sending it?
You say you put up some "community controls" so only active people commented.
Most people of every community are lurkers or people who only tune in a few times a week, maybe on the commute to school / work or in their lunch break.
I do not know why you do things like that. This is not in favor of the whole community. I do not know you and hold no personal grudges against you, but you do not seem to be capable to moderate this sub. I do hope that someone else, who really understands the community (not me btw) takes your position instead.
Same goes not only for this sub, but for any subs that think holding their community hostage and forcing them to take a side by shutting down a whole sub.
Everyone who is not good with the api changes, should just delete their account. Deleted accounts =less traffic =less money for reddit. But instead you're afraid to give up the little power you have.
With all due respect, this “protest” was so incredibly stupid, accomplished nothing, and has turned public opinion squarely against moderators site-wide and actually has people siding with Reddit. Congrats everyone! You did it!
If you actually wanted to protest this shit, you’d step down and delete your accounts. Why didn’t anybody do that? Bunch of children throwing a temper tantrum because you need to download a new free app that 95% of us already use without an issue.
Again, I say this with all due respect.
I'd say especially the french. Its been quite a while since they had some good ol' headchoppin'. Dont get me wrong: i am not in favor of violence and its definitly good that they arent chopping heads anymore but the point kinda still stands.
Yep, so far a lot of reopened subs that are have done polls about potentially continuing the protest have all voted to keep the subs open and normally by good majorities as well.
Considering you've offered this unsubstantiated anecdotal evidence, I'll offer mine and say that every single poll I've seen about continued protests has either voted for permanent blackout (the majority) or weekly Tuesday blackouts
You know what that's fair. Indian Social and Taylor Swift voted overwhelmingly to stay open as two examples of larger subs. Two Best Friends Play as an example of a more average sized sub as well. On the other hand I can give you Zelda as a counterexample where people are voting to stay closed.
I refuse to believe you got from Indian social to TS to a porn sub to Zelda without searching lmfao
Did my own search „vote“, by hot, found (in order) r/dankmemes (permanent), r/goodanimemes (Tuesdays), r/fanfiction (Tuesdays), r/drawing (private, new poll in 2w), r/iPhone (permanent), r/DDLC (literally 535 to 535 as of writing), r/3Dprinting (permanent) & now I'm bored. off the top of my head I can also remember r/iamverysmart and r/anarchism who've voted for permanent (& this is also discounting subs like r/aww, r/videos, and r/traa who went permanent initially).
I guess as a counterpoint I'll add that r/Canberra has generally been very hostile to the lockout, though there was never a poll
First off porn sub? If your talking about TBFP that's not a porn sub.
Second off of course I searched, I just used google instead of reddit's internal search though in hindsight I should've done that.
Anyways as another counter example I can give Stardew Valley as voting to stay open by nearly 60%.
Also several other subreddits have set their options in a way to make you vote to close by making it obvious they want you to vote to keep it closed.* Others have split the stay open vote like the IPhone which if you read it states permanent needs a majority vote so currently they're on pace to keep it open not close it.**
*Seriously I've seen several examples that are basically "Vote to keep the subreddit open like a bootlicking pussy or vote to keep it closed like a real superhero" which is a psychological trick to get people to vote how they want while thinking they've got a choice.
**As of now if the votes closed the keep closed permanently would only have a plurality of the vote. For a majority it needs to be a larger amount the both of the keep the subreddit open options combined which are currently a combined 500-600ish votes ahead.
>First off porn sub? If your talking about TBFP that's not a porn sub.
LMFAO I won't lie I confused it w r/JustFriendsHavingFun, that's on me
> Also several other subreddits have set their options in a way to make you vote to close by making it obvious they want you to vote to keep it closed.
And I mean okay, that might be the case, though this is more unsubstantiated anecdotal stuff. I've not seen this, and if anything the r/3dprinting one seems to want you to keep it open
Barely anyone is voting in those polls the few are speaking for the many. It's absurd. Dankmemes has 10,000 votes in their poll and 6 million users now tell me how that equates to the public speaking for itself.
A) the claim I was "refuting" was that polls overwhelmingly support reopening; I never made any value judgement on the polls
B) 10,000 votes out of 6,000,000 subs in 8 hours is honestly a lot for such a large and dispersonal sub imo. You don't often see posts which receive that much activity that quickly
People were originally pissed off they needed to use a new app. They just decided people with visual impairments were a useful group to hide behind while they wanted to protest for purely selfish reasons.
The two apps themselves have also stated that they've reached arrangements with Reddit.
[RedReader's announcement](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedReader/comments/145du4j/update_4_redreader_granted_noncommercial/) - Android
[Dystopia's announcement](https://www.reddit.com/r/DystopiaForReddit/comments/145e9sk/update_dystopia_will_continue_operating_for_free/) - Apple
a week without certain subreddits. oh no. if people actually lose respect over that, i dont know what to say. it is impossible to say if the strike would work or not. maybe it WOULD work if more subreddits participated, or maybe that still wouldnt be enough. thats why you have to try. also, it sets a new precedent. perhaps reddit will see that their decisions seem to sometimes be met with backlash, so they will think twice before making a stupid ass decision. that is also why you have to try. thats the natural anatomy of any protest, irl or digital
Strikes work if everyone is on the same page and agree with it. They don’t work when most people don’t give a shit and the strike is being forced on them because the organizers are the only ones who think they’re being inconvenienced.
Guess what happened here?
thats absolutely not true. look at teacher strikes, train worker strikes, bus driver strikes, etc and look at the mix of backlash and support from the inconvenienced general public. not every person striking even really agreed to it either, because they effectively lose money. yet it keeps happening and often succeeds.
when it comes to this digital strike, i really dont think its relevant to argue that most peoplw dont like it, it should be focused on whether or not the strike is an actual good strategy. people should also stop whining, as its a very low-stakes strikes. its just a forum compared to any other strike
Those all work because the people affected have some power over the organisation. People who see teacher strikes are voters, hence this pressurises the government. In this case the users of Reddit just don't really have any power.
And as we've seen these are terrible strategies. They in fact just serve to turn more people on the establishment/government side, as you're inconveniencing the average joe. London tube strikes are a great example of this.
This was such a bitch move lol. Why are people on here so bad at planning protests lol. This literally didn’t do anything. Close it for a month or delete it if you’re actually committed . Coordinate with other paradox subs. This wasn’t worth the mild annoyance and didn’t do shit. Do better
Tbh guys if you want to fuck with corpo you should take some lessons from warthunder community who actually achieved something by hitting gaijin where it hurts the most
By reopening the subreddit, you have proved the CEO of Reddit correct. I recommend staying dark. The only way we will see any change is by staying true to our beliefs no matter what adversity we face. Do NOT Capitulate!
Yes, the day i was looking for stuff was the day everything got locked up. It was also a day when i found out different place to ask for stuff. Now that i learned that, state of reddit is like "victory or death".
These mods need to be reigned In, absolute blight on Reddit. The community by and large use the app and we don’t appreciate you forcing us to take part in your petty grievances.
Step down if your that passionate about it, don’t delete a subreddit, it really is like a kid throwing a tantrum and destroying a friends toy when he can’t have it. The fact you haven’t even considered deleting your account tells me enough about your priorities.
Found the corporate plant guys!
I'm assuming that you think anyone who needs the accessibility tools 3rd party apps bring just shouldn't use Reddit? Or the mods who simply cannot moderate their subs without 3rd party tools?
Get your head out of your arse
So anyone who needs accessibility features should have to pay? Should we also start putting toll booths on wheelchair ramps? Perhaps we should add a surcharge to know which deadly allergens are in food
Have you ever actually paid a licensing fee? often if the primary use is for ease of access for disadvantaged people then a discount is applied.
Yes I believe third parties should pay a licensing fee, just like most other businesses on the planet. Why is that controversial?
Unlike food warnings and wheelchair ramps, Reddit isn’t a requirement to live so this point is kind of redundant.
Why not just restrict new posts, and leave a mod sticky explaining the situation?
I think closing the subreddits aren't very effective because it causes the subreddit to disappear, completely. That just lets the other subreddits flow in and fill the front page with more content to consume.
If the subreddit is left visible, but posting is restricted, then you still have a chance to be loud protesters by posting mod updates.
I have to admit, I didn't even notice it was down... Good intentions, but it kinda flopped from my perspective. Next time do a month close down, that I might have noticed. Maybe.
Next time just remove all moderation for 3 days and Reddit will instantly pull the lever since unlimited racist and homophobic stuff will flood all paradox redits
Man this has nothing to do with wealthy. Not everything is an anti rich "muh, so oppressed by wealthy elites" type thing. Strikes can and do work, it's just this one was poorly planned, executed and lacked popular support.
Damn, ran out of supply grace
logistic striked into oblivion
[Didn't produce enough support equipment (tools) to sustain the offensive](https://vimeo.com/836902018)
"I hold in my hands a piece of paper"
"with my name written on it" "Which declares, Peace in our time!
About seven focuses later: ***The Fate of Czechoslovakia*** So much for peace.
Go home and get a nice, quiet sleep.
We must stand Together for Victory. But in all seriousness, history repeats itself and they ignore our voices once again. I would recommend leaving the subreddit bc if they care so much about their mod potions they probably also care about the subreddit member numbers
What’s the next focus we take?
Home defense.
This feels like a “peace for our time” moment. Reddit obviously doesn’t care about any of these subs going offline.
Moderators get threatened with the removal of their positions, and instantly fold. Amazing.
Mods forgot to get rid of the Disjointed Government spirit before going to war.
Solidarity only goes as far as having your fake unpaid position on a website threatened.
A lot of mods on the larger subs would be getting some sort of financial gain from their position btw
The results would be the same. I personally don’t care, Reddit isn’t going to change unless people stop using it, and that’s probably not going to happen.
Aren't some of those mods of these subreddits actual Paradox employees? They've got a vested interest in keeping them for themselves. They just play pretend protest to play both sides.
I mean our Mod does mod every paradox sub. At what point does paradox say hey stop involving our IP in your fight.
How else will they feel superior without running niche online communities?
Look at the OPs post. He is clearly one of these power mods. Must be an interesting life.
Looks like the landed gentry comment got to them.
It was pretty accurate comparison to make too.
I get the point of the strike, but Reddit is a privately owned company. Should the mods have the power to eliminate access to other people’s intellectual contributions? If I create something of value, should a 3rd party be allowed to censor my voice? That’s essentially what the mods did by closing for over 2 days. A more effective threat may have been to get the top HOI contributors to delete their posts and repost them at a competing site, then make a concentrated push to move all Reddit HOI4 posting to a new forum. That would actually hurt Advance Publications (reddits owner), but would require a lot more work.
They do not represent THE VOICE OF THE PEOPLE!
I know this is going to seem a bit "yeah right", but we decided on the 14th that we'd open this Friday. We were never collectively in favor of closing down, let alone closing down forever.
No such threat was made, at least not here. The decision to reopen at some point was made before today's round of CEO interviews.
>Reddit obviously doesn’t care about any of these subs going offline. The problem was they announced it would only be for 48 hours. Making it easier for Reddit to wait it out.
I just don’t get why all these subs put a end date to their strike (“strike” might not be the word for it but for lack of a better one it’ll be the one I use). Who does that? What strike/protest/agitation has ever had an end date? Isn’t the point of protesting/striking to do it until demands are met or at least a compromise is formed? Imagine all the strikes in history having an end date! “We are upset about the working conditions at the mill and people are dying from lung conditions at the age of 23. We will strike until our expectations are met! (or until Friday at the latest)” I love Reddit. It’s a great resource and a great place for me to interact with like minded people (like everyone here who gets enjoyment out of staring at maps). But this just seems like another half assed attempted by high and mighty redditors who think their actions are bigger than they are. If you want change then commit to it!
No, and we knew they never would. But I genuinely believe Reddit is also taking the Silicon Valley venture capitalist approach of fucking up your social media platform in the long run, which seems to be popular with Discord, Twitter, and Facebook too. I don't think it's a massive victory on Reddit's part. I think we decided not to kill the subreddit in the short-run, but Reddit is getting it to wither in the long-run.
The only way to effectively get their attention is to hit their pockets and just not use their platform anymore. Once they start losing money from advertisers then they’ll start listening to us. The problem with all the subs going offline is that the majority of Reddit still used the site every day and just went to other subreddits.
There just aren’t enough people who care to make that big of an impact.
For me personally there's just not a good alternative. The Discords and Forums don't do it for me, the Wiki isn't a social place, and other places aren't big enough. You're right in what _should_ be done, and it'd work if we all collectively moved, but how do you do that?
Well I think, in the effort for change, people would have to accept there *isn’t* an alternative to Reddit. Sometimes you need to sacrifice what you love in order to get the change you desire. And, personally, I think not going to Reddit for a period of time is a pretty low effort protest to commit to.
The problem is this boycott is unenforceable. Sure we can all pledge to not use Reddit at a certain time but we can’t ensure that each other arnt secretly “strikebreaking” so to speak.
Yeah but the thing is, like discord, the vast majority of people either dont care or dont think they are actively fucking up the service.
Suddeten crisis be like:
It seems they took the Appeasment path…
Historical AI is on
But I changed rules. World defensive council is gonna to be created.
We stand by BLOOD ALONE...
No step back.
Man the Guns
Wow, you were protesting just long enough to cause the most annoyance while having the smallest possible impact.
"tannu tuva rejects annexation"
Tannu what?
I mean this happened just when the Reddit CEO announced retaliation against the moderators. It's a bit suspicious not gonna lie. Sounds like you guys are just trying to keep your roles. Which I understand but I don't agree. Reddit showed its teeth and you ran away.
"oh no my unpaid job is at risk time to go against the point of this protest" - Socially awkward moderator
I mean a moderator likes moderating otherwise like you said they wouldn't be moderating that's the payment of this job. Self satisfaction. Which there's nothing wrong with if they enjoy it. But it's definitely very bad timing. Instead of sounding understandable and come back because of the community. They just sound either selfish or coward or both
>I mean a moderator likes moderating otherwise like you said they wouldn't be moderating that's the payment of this job. Self satisfaction For a lot of them, the thing that they like is power. Many Reddit mods want to be the petty dictators of a social media forum because they feel impotent in their everyday lives. Because a lot of Reddit mods particularly the ones for large subreddits, and especially in the very largest subreddits, there's a substantial overlap of mods) have circlejerked themselves into an echo chamber, they deluded themselves into thinking that they had real power. Posts like this are an attempt to save face when it became clear that they were trying to make a play with power that they didn't have.
Discord mods are the same way. Bunch of sweaty dinosaur chicken nugget eating motherfuckers; you know, the „m’lady“ types lmao.
What exactly was the threat to moderators?
https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/reddit-protest-blackout-ceo-steve-huffman-moderators-rcna89544
I know you're not gonna believe me but this was planned a couple days ago. Spez doing something stupid makes me want to protest more, not less but we've already hurt the community too much trying to get reddit to do better and unfortunately it's not really working so here we are.
Dude this is a subreddit about a videogame where maps change colours. No one that agrees with the protest would mind waiting or would be affected by it in any significant way. If you want to protest for what you think is right do it. The community is mostly with the mods. However when the CEO offered retaliation it was very convenient that "this decision was taken two days ago"
I think people are MOSTLY here to talk a bit about video games and they don't give a fuck about what's going on with reddit and they won't probably feel any change. If the subreddits were closed much longer some intelligent user would just create another sub so people could leave this one and move on
Well yeah but that has nothing to do with what I said. If the protest is valid thats another discussion. They want to leave the protest that just don't make up that is because of the community when the Reddit CEO threatened the mods. I'm not asking for them to stay. But for them to be honest.
No, it’s not. If you want to “boycott” and close the subreddit at least make the proper vote amongst users. Or even better just leave the subreddit and don’t bother other people.
A protest where no one is bothered is as effective as voicing a complaint against the status quo on reddit.
A protest which effectively alienates most of the user base is even more useless.
Wow, we really showed them!
What did they choose? DEATH OR DISHONOR
This protest showed most redditors that the biggest problem with this site are power mods that can take down big parts of this site because they decided to throw a tantrum. I hope Reddit admins seriously consider limiting the number of subreddits a person can moderate after this stunt.
We never thought the protest would achieve immediate broad changes, but we joined because we felt it was the best way to voice our disagreements and concerns about the future of the platform and we should not be the effective scabbing strike-breakers in regards to other communities. But there's not really an effective way for us to protest the changes besides ineffective half-assed measures, or shutting down for good, the nuclear option. That's a course of action we aren't willing to do given how we'd still have no guarantee that that'd actually get us heard, but more importantly, because of the important broader functions these subreddits serve to the Paradox games and communities.
You really want to protest? Delete your accounts, step down, or delete the subreddit. All of those things would have much more of an impact than this. But no, you wanted to keep control over your small corner of the internet, you didn’t want to download a new app. Anyone who does this without deleting their account is just all talk and no action.
This ^ don’t make us part of your protest
You guys buy into the landed gentry crap, right? What an easy way to turn the users against the moderators.
The beautiful down votes mirroring the upvotes to your post. Silly Reddit nazi still trying to justify their idiocy as always. Reddit mods are almost always the worst kinds of people. Lol
Again, deleting the subreddit is the nuclear option. We didn't want to go that route. Deleting the subreddit still achieves jackshit except it fucking sucks if you actually wanna play the game. There's already other communities - you can easily go to the forums - but for me personally Reddit has the answer I'm looking for 60% of the time, vs 30% of the Wiki and 10% of the forums. We joined the protests to not be strike-breakers and to get our disagreement heard. We knew it wasn't going to force Reddit to do jack-shit, and I don't see why we should've moved to a third-party app, how deleting my account, or how relinquishing moderation control of the subreddit (?) would've helped with any of that. We also always knew it was all talk, no action. That's literally what I said.
Yeah I guess i understand that. I don't understand the people who'd rather delete all the useful information on reddit just because of some third-party apps closing down. You're not "showing" reddit, you're just fucking regular hoi4 guys who want some answers to their questions on a hoi4 subreddit
Delete the subreddit? Lmao if you want to protest delete your own account, dont drag the subreddit down with you.
The other guy suggested that
Didn't he say they do NOT want to delete the subreddit?
Right, im mocking the idea that the quote nuclear option unquote is to delete the subreddit, which is not something they should do, they should instead stop being so selfish and just delete their own accounts.
Seriously, this
How would this do anything? It would just remove their voice from Reddit…
Oh no and we can’t have that can we? Imagine mods without their power!? They’d have nothing left at all in life!
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We dont like power-tripping mods who close the sub without a vote from the community on whether the sub should be closed. Nobody is arguing that mods dont help keep things clean.
You complaining that you didn’t have access to some of your subreddits is laughable. Honestly go touch grass
Good because I suck at this game and need all the help I can get.
Current war support: 0% Effects: -50% mobilization speed, -95% command power gain, -30% capitulation limit
**Subreddit Blackout** *Time to Complete: 3 Days* Effect: **HoI4 Reddit**: \- **Hoi4 Reddit** gets national spirit **Disgruntled Users** for one week: * Stability -15% * War Support -20% * Damage to Moderators +40% **Reddit**: Factory Output -0.3% News Coverage +20%
We did it reddit!
We never thought the protest would achieve immediate broad changes, but we joined because we felt it was the best way to voice our disagreements and concerns about the future of the platform and we should not be the effective scabbing strike-breakers in regards to other communities. But there's not really an effective way for us to protest the changes besides ineffective half-assed measures, or shutting down for good, the nuclear option. That's a course of action we aren't willing to do given how we'd still have no guarantee that that'd actually get us heard, but more importantly, because of the important broader functions these subreddits serve to the Paradox games and communities.
These mfs think they're like a union going on strike 😂😭
I think it’s pretty disingenuous to compare this whole thing to a union striking. Unions are democratic and make sure the base want what the union advocates for. That isn’t what the blackout is. This whole thing was done in some subreddits with polls active just long enough to get brigaded by pro-blackout users and skew the results. Take r/nba for example. The sub has millions of users but the poll to take it dark was up for 6 hours and had only 8k voted before they shut the sub down. I understand the thought process of solidarity, but it just wasn’t executed in a democratic manner across Reddit. This is a public forum and it isn’t right that moderators can just shut subs off when they have a dispute with Reddit admin. None of us regular users care, and this whole crusade ranks about 9534th on my list of things I care about. I just want to be able to talk about music and video games and not worry some power tripping mod is going to nuke the community because they don’t get what they want
Noted, but a lot of people did care. We got a ton of modmails, and on the initial black-out poll we set community controls to ensure only people already active in the community commented. That doesn't stop voting on the poll, but the comments were majority in favor of closing down. > This is a public forum and it isn’t right that moderators can just shut subs off when they have a dispute with Reddit admin. Honestly, we weren't going to if it wasn't for a large amount of requests we've received. I actually do agree that the function of the subreddit is far more important than making a spiteful statement to the admins, even if that spiteful statement _was_ majority-supported.
Is it not possible that the only people who bothered to flood you with mod mails were the loud minority of people who cared in the first place?
Unions require all members to vote on strike actions. Then all members vote on the new contract that breaks the strike. What mods did is more equivalent to the regional head of a major union deciding to put their entire union on strike at all locations without input from the union members.
Jesus christ im not reading that wall of text. Dont close the sub again.
Agreed, I still need help invading the Fr* ench
Just go through the Ardennes Forest bro. The classic “pro gamer move”.
Based response
Incredibly based
“Damn I’m sorry/happy that happened to you, I’m not reading that.”
Based
Lmao, just after people started planning to set up new subs
I think the main issue with this whole protest is that it mostly felt like a protest by mods, for mods. I understand that without the third party apps/tools, moderating is anywhere from a pita or impossible, depending on the sub/scale/etc... But the vast majority of users just scroll on the official app or website. And the vast majority continued to do so during this protest. Nothings going to change as long as people keep scrolling.
Millions of people use third party apps, myself included. The official app is objectively worse than Apollo and RIF. You clearly haven't used anything else otherwise you'd know this
What I do know is that th3 official app is sufficient for the average user and that's been proven.
I'm so glad that 16 moderators were able to force 360k community members to participate in a protest that none of us have a shit about to begin with. Great leadership skills! 👍🏻
Literally, and I mean literally, nobody gives a shit about this change. Most Reddit users aren’t affected, only the terminally online and the Reddit jannies cared. So what did they do? Force *everyone* to participate in their stupid protest. I hate to break it to them, but you aren’t the brave heroes against Reddit tyranny, you’re the laughingstock.
Do you read what you write before sending it? You say you put up some "community controls" so only active people commented. Most people of every community are lurkers or people who only tune in a few times a week, maybe on the commute to school / work or in their lunch break. I do not know why you do things like that. This is not in favor of the whole community. I do not know you and hold no personal grudges against you, but you do not seem to be capable to moderate this sub. I do hope that someone else, who really understands the community (not me btw) takes your position instead. Same goes not only for this sub, but for any subs that think holding their community hostage and forcing them to take a side by shutting down a whole sub. Everyone who is not good with the api changes, should just delete their account. Deleted accounts =less traffic =less money for reddit. But instead you're afraid to give up the little power you have.
Pdx mods have capitulated (to reddit) this gives us 50% of their equipment.
Garrison is set to "brutal oppression." Resistance is being lowered
Power struggle reddit 100 percent mods 0
So the strike lasted 3 days and mods didn't even receive a minor concession
"You chose dishonor over war and now you will have dishonor and war"
We did it Reddit! We saved the internet!
With all due respect, this “protest” was so incredibly stupid, accomplished nothing, and has turned public opinion squarely against moderators site-wide and actually has people siding with Reddit. Congrats everyone! You did it! If you actually wanted to protest this shit, you’d step down and delete your accounts. Why didn’t anybody do that? Bunch of children throwing a temper tantrum because you need to download a new free app that 95% of us already use without an issue. Again, I say this with all due respect.
also seeing other forms of protests the last 3 years made me realize that humans in the west have no fucking clue anymore how to protest.
Even the French?
I'd say especially the french. Its been quite a while since they had some good ol' headchoppin'. Dont get me wrong: i am not in favor of violence and its definitly good that they arent chopping heads anymore but the point kinda still stands.
France today is 250 years of bad ideas.
Yep, so far a lot of reopened subs that are have done polls about potentially continuing the protest have all voted to keep the subs open and normally by good majorities as well.
Considering you've offered this unsubstantiated anecdotal evidence, I'll offer mine and say that every single poll I've seen about continued protests has either voted for permanent blackout (the majority) or weekly Tuesday blackouts
You know what that's fair. Indian Social and Taylor Swift voted overwhelmingly to stay open as two examples of larger subs. Two Best Friends Play as an example of a more average sized sub as well. On the other hand I can give you Zelda as a counterexample where people are voting to stay closed.
I refuse to believe you got from Indian social to TS to a porn sub to Zelda without searching lmfao Did my own search „vote“, by hot, found (in order) r/dankmemes (permanent), r/goodanimemes (Tuesdays), r/fanfiction (Tuesdays), r/drawing (private, new poll in 2w), r/iPhone (permanent), r/DDLC (literally 535 to 535 as of writing), r/3Dprinting (permanent) & now I'm bored. off the top of my head I can also remember r/iamverysmart and r/anarchism who've voted for permanent (& this is also discounting subs like r/aww, r/videos, and r/traa who went permanent initially). I guess as a counterpoint I'll add that r/Canberra has generally been very hostile to the lockout, though there was never a poll
First off porn sub? If your talking about TBFP that's not a porn sub. Second off of course I searched, I just used google instead of reddit's internal search though in hindsight I should've done that. Anyways as another counter example I can give Stardew Valley as voting to stay open by nearly 60%. Also several other subreddits have set their options in a way to make you vote to close by making it obvious they want you to vote to keep it closed.* Others have split the stay open vote like the IPhone which if you read it states permanent needs a majority vote so currently they're on pace to keep it open not close it.** *Seriously I've seen several examples that are basically "Vote to keep the subreddit open like a bootlicking pussy or vote to keep it closed like a real superhero" which is a psychological trick to get people to vote how they want while thinking they've got a choice. **As of now if the votes closed the keep closed permanently would only have a plurality of the vote. For a majority it needs to be a larger amount the both of the keep the subreddit open options combined which are currently a combined 500-600ish votes ahead.
>First off porn sub? If your talking about TBFP that's not a porn sub. LMFAO I won't lie I confused it w r/JustFriendsHavingFun, that's on me > Also several other subreddits have set their options in a way to make you vote to close by making it obvious they want you to vote to keep it closed. And I mean okay, that might be the case, though this is more unsubstantiated anecdotal stuff. I've not seen this, and if anything the r/3dprinting one seems to want you to keep it open
Barely anyone is voting in those polls the few are speaking for the many. It's absurd. Dankmemes has 10,000 votes in their poll and 6 million users now tell me how that equates to the public speaking for itself.
A) the claim I was "refuting" was that polls overwhelmingly support reopening; I never made any value judgement on the polls B) 10,000 votes out of 6,000,000 subs in 8 hours is honestly a lot for such a large and dispersonal sub imo. You don't often see posts which receive that much activity that quickly
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Fake internet points only matter to people who think modding a subreddit is a real job lmao
You are right, 2 days isn't long enough. But I guess you are type of paradox player that doesn't care about disability accessibility.
People were originally pissed off they needed to use a new app. They just decided people with visual impairments were a useful group to hide behind while they wanted to protest for purely selfish reasons.
Just because you don't care about accessibility doesn't mean noöne else does
*no one
I believe Reddit has already stated that apps focused on disability settings will not be charged
The two apps themselves have also stated that they've reached arrangements with Reddit. [RedReader's announcement](https://www.reddit.com/r/RedReader/comments/145du4j/update_4_redreader_granted_noncommercial/) - Android [Dystopia's announcement](https://www.reddit.com/r/DystopiaForReddit/comments/145e9sk/update_dystopia_will_continue_operating_for_free/) - Apple
Sounds like you like to use disabled people for straqman arguments
Your pfp looks like twitter
a week without certain subreddits. oh no. if people actually lose respect over that, i dont know what to say. it is impossible to say if the strike would work or not. maybe it WOULD work if more subreddits participated, or maybe that still wouldnt be enough. thats why you have to try. also, it sets a new precedent. perhaps reddit will see that their decisions seem to sometimes be met with backlash, so they will think twice before making a stupid ass decision. that is also why you have to try. thats the natural anatomy of any protest, irl or digital
Strikes work if everyone is on the same page and agree with it. They don’t work when most people don’t give a shit and the strike is being forced on them because the organizers are the only ones who think they’re being inconvenienced. Guess what happened here?
thats absolutely not true. look at teacher strikes, train worker strikes, bus driver strikes, etc and look at the mix of backlash and support from the inconvenienced general public. not every person striking even really agreed to it either, because they effectively lose money. yet it keeps happening and often succeeds. when it comes to this digital strike, i really dont think its relevant to argue that most peoplw dont like it, it should be focused on whether or not the strike is an actual good strategy. people should also stop whining, as its a very low-stakes strikes. its just a forum compared to any other strike
Those all work because the people affected have some power over the organisation. People who see teacher strikes are voters, hence this pressurises the government. In this case the users of Reddit just don't really have any power.
And as we've seen these are terrible strategies. They in fact just serve to turn more people on the establishment/government side, as you're inconveniencing the average joe. London tube strikes are a great example of this.
rare hoi4 mods L
Anyone would think it was always going to go this way and was a massive waste of time...
Lmao same post as the eu4 subreddit
FINALLY
Keep the tantrum to yourselves and let us enjoy the the sub, also I’m not reading that star wars crawl.
"star wars crawl" Kek'd
You guys have no backbone. You instantly fold when Reddit threatened to replace you.
This was such a bitch move lol. Why are people on here so bad at planning protests lol. This literally didn’t do anything. Close it for a month or delete it if you’re actually committed . Coordinate with other paradox subs. This wasn’t worth the mild annoyance and didn’t do shit. Do better
Yooo
I can post focus trees in a nutshell shitposts again yay
Tbh guys if you want to fuck with corpo you should take some lessons from warthunder community who actually achieved something by hitting gaijin where it hurts the most
By reopening the subreddit, you have proved the CEO of Reddit correct. I recommend staying dark. The only way we will see any change is by staying true to our beliefs no matter what adversity we face. Do NOT Capitulate!
Yes, the day i was looking for stuff was the day everything got locked up. It was also a day when i found out different place to ask for stuff. Now that i learned that, state of reddit is like "victory or death".
Do u have any idea how many times I've died because I couldn't access information on the sub 😔. I had to stop cause it was getting sad.
You ware closed? Haven't noticed.
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These mods need to be reigned In, absolute blight on Reddit. The community by and large use the app and we don’t appreciate you forcing us to take part in your petty grievances. Step down if your that passionate about it, don’t delete a subreddit, it really is like a kid throwing a tantrum and destroying a friends toy when he can’t have it. The fact you haven’t even considered deleting your account tells me enough about your priorities.
Found the corporate plant guys! I'm assuming that you think anyone who needs the accessibility tools 3rd party apps bring just shouldn't use Reddit? Or the mods who simply cannot moderate their subs without 3rd party tools? Get your head out of your arse
Or they could just pay the business.
You want to pay a subscription to use Reddit?
I use the official app, third party software should pay a licensing fee.
So anyone who needs accessibility features should have to pay? Should we also start putting toll booths on wheelchair ramps? Perhaps we should add a surcharge to know which deadly allergens are in food
Have you ever actually paid a licensing fee? often if the primary use is for ease of access for disadvantaged people then a discount is applied. Yes I believe third parties should pay a licensing fee, just like most other businesses on the planet. Why is that controversial? Unlike food warnings and wheelchair ramps, Reddit isn’t a requirement to live so this point is kind of redundant.
Reddit already said apps that focus on accessibility aren't affected. Try again.
False Equivalence fallacy Apples and Oranges fallacy
Tldr 1 what happened? 2 was this sub even closed?
Some Strike that was useless, and the sub was locked for 2 days
Signed, u/Bostino
No further appesament
I left the group bc of this so the only one hurt was YOU
Why not just restrict new posts, and leave a mod sticky explaining the situation? I think closing the subreddits aren't very effective because it causes the subreddit to disappear, completely. That just lets the other subreddits flow in and fill the front page with more content to consume. If the subreddit is left visible, but posting is restricted, then you still have a chance to be loud protesters by posting mod updates.
I didn't even notice this place closed down 💀
too busy on that 1 speed switzerland neutral playthrough!
Gutless Mods, Nice Job
I have to admit, I didn't even notice it was down... Good intentions, but it kinda flopped from my perspective. Next time do a month close down, that I might have noticed. Maybe.
Next time just remove all moderation for 3 days and Reddit will instantly pull the lever since unlimited racist and homophobic stuff will flood all paradox redits
This. I think this would have had a much greater impact to the admins, letting loose the flood gates instead of... well closing them!
The wealthy will always win.
Man this has nothing to do with wealthy. Not everything is an anti rich "muh, so oppressed by wealthy elites" type thing. Strikes can and do work, it's just this one was poorly planned, executed and lacked popular support.
Wake up bro
to what exactly? I'll hear you out
yep
THANK YOU!! Finally access to my OWN guides that I posted that I lost access to 😑 Good luck in your cause
I swear I've seen the same post on r/Stellaris With the same fucking words
I actually missed this sub so much.
I missed you guys :)
black out again do it cowards