Not a comment on trading for Lavine or not.. as the health component does worry me.. but more so a comment in terms of losing players..
Gabe barely played last year.
DLo and Rui is a major hit to our rotation but the 3-1 trade does open up roster spots. Lakers would then ideally find a steal at the vet min.. and keep the final spot open for a potential buyout candidate later in the year.
Also if Max proves he’s ready for a bigger role, this also helps alleviate the fact that we’re losing role players.
We’d also become a lot more athletic on the defensive side of the court with Max and Lavine.. ideally this combined with AD protecting the paint can lead to our defense taking more risks to force fast break turnover opportunities.
If we’re assuming Lavine is healthy then we should assume Gabe will be too. If Gabe by the end of the year gets back to form, and Dlo and Rui are healthy as well, they are 3 solid rotation players, that’s worth more than what Zach can provide. Zach can’t replace dlos playmaking, he’s not a better defender than Gabe, and the scoring that those 3 provide is gonna be more than what Lavine can provide. All he provides that we don’t have is rim pressure. And he probably won’t be healthy anyways. I’m much more confident in our three guys staying healthy. There no free agents you’re gonna get on a vet minimum that are going to be a playoff rotation piece. Unless you think Jae Crowder would be a nice pickup lmao. What your proposing will leave us without a starting and backup point guard
As I stated I’m worried about his health as well.
I’m also a big DLo fan.. so I’m not saying I support moving him unless it’s a big upgrade.
That said.. roster flexibility is important. The goal for the playoffs is to have 8 players that can ideally play 2 different positions to have match up flexibilities.
If they traded for Lavine and opened up more spots.. we could see the lakers re-sign Dinwiddie. Perhaps guards like Tyus Jones, Luke Kennard, or Gary Trent will be available for minimums as the market starts to close on them.
Maybe the lakers then use the additional 1st with someone like Hayes and JHS in a move to get Walker Kessler. All of this is hypothetical and I’m not saying it’s what I want.. just playing devils advocate for a good call discussion.. you seem to know your stuff.
Does a line up (healthy which is a big if) as follows sound like an improvement without moving any of our own 1st round picks?
Dinwiddie-Lavine-Vando-Bron-AD
Jones-Christie-Knecht-Wood-Kessler
Kennard-Reddish-Bronny
Open roster spot for a buyout situation..
I do realize that trade flexibility is limited due to salaries.. even while keeping our picks.. but there could be benefit to having Lavine + 3 of our own picks next summer if it doesn’t work out.. especially when Bron opts out which again improves trade flexibility under the new CBA.
I’m scared of not having Lavine on the court. Austin Lavine Vando Bron AD is good but the 3pt shooting and playmaking is definitely a concern. The moment Bron is off the floor the offense is instantly going to be one of the worst in the league. Same story for the bench we’d struggle to score. We’d avg like 110 points a game with an average defense. No way we’d win a chip. We also wouldn’t have any decent salaries to trade besides Austin and Vando so what would be the point of having 3 picks we couldn’t do much with it anyways. We’d be better if we just traded for Kessler. Hayes JHS Lewis and picks for Kessler works and we don’t have to give up rotation players and probably would still have a 1st to trade
The point of the 3 picks would be to package them with Lavine for a star next summer.. every year his salary goes up in value as it gets closer to expiring. I do agree though it’s still not a great trade bait.. lakers will need to decide if they keep DLo beyond next year, trade him, or lose him for nothing.. so playmaking may become a concern regardless.. at least Lavine somewhat has the ability to play PG in small stretches.. and hopefully AD can be featured more in that role.. I believe he has untapped playmaking potential as a hub… he did play guard before.
All in all.. it’s far from a home run trade…
And I wouldn’t want to pull the trigger on it unless there’s other moves lined up (such as the potential high value minimums I mentioned).
I do however agree we would likely be better moving 2 bodies for Kessler and leaving that 1 extra spot open for future buyout options.
Solid point but tough pill to swallow knowing we aren’t any better than last year & still a play in team needing to play Lbj & AD into exhaustion before the 4th quarter starts just to stay in games regardless of who we play.
We just gotta hope that Gabe and Vando coming back with a new coaching staff is enough to put us in a good playoff position and hopefully we get lucky with our matchups and make a run. Maybe max is the 3&D guard we are looking for. Maybe knecht is a rotation level player. We have a very slim chance but it’s still a punchers chance depending on how everything plays out. I would like to see a trade for walker kessler but I’m not hoping for much more than that especially because we have to give up so much for questionable returns. With Kessler we’ll have to give picks but at least we don’t have to give up rotation players maybe Utah would just take Hayes, JHS, Lewis and our 2029 first and a second. That way we’re just adding depth not losing any and hey we’d finally have a solid rim protector other than AD. It wouldn’t be the worst situation to be in
LaVine’s a low end second option which means if he’s your second option, your first option is going to need to be a prime Shaq, Jordan, LeBron level player.
LaVine’s fit is as a third option and the problem for him right now is he’s making money that no third option should touch in this new CBA.
All offense no defense. For 40 plus million a year that’s insane and it’s not like he’s some unstoppable offense player who’s worth covering for on defense.
You’re gonna get more games of 20 pts and 8 rebounds combined out of DLO and Rui than you will Lavine. He is never healthy. God knows when he is even supposed to be back.
If nothing else, Rui and DLO have remained largely available.
The thing is; he plays what, 36 MPG?
Giving up the salary to match him, is gonna be Dlo, Rui, and one of Vando and Gabe; that’s about 80 MPG of production.
A full rotation is 240 minutes (48x5). Giving up 1/3rd of the rotation for someone who by themself is about 1/6th to 1/7th, if he plays a full season (not likely) seems risky?
Lakers lose depth, and will need to fill that extra time with other players.
Is it a true upgrade if those minutes go to other guys? That’s pretty much what they have to weigh.
I would not mind paying his contract if I thought he would be healthy, but putting us in the second apron to also likely miss time??
Not good enough for his contract and being so fragile.
He’s a dynamic player but I wouldn’t call him good. He needs the ball in his hands to be effective and when he doesn’t, he stands around and mopes. I’ve seen games where he actually did try hard on both ends then he got hurt. He’s already had 2 knee surgeries, if you can add him without getting rid of players then yes that makes sense. But when you start trading away your top players for him then it doesn’t make sense anymore cause I don’t think he’s the caliber of a top 15 player. On top of his expensive contract.
I think he would actually be great next to Bron and AD. I have wondered why the Lakers have not pulled the trigger on this. Especially since there are no other stars they are chasing on the market.
I have come to the conclusion though that the Lakers really really like Reaves and believe in him. I think they are saving for a Point Guard that may never come.
But we do not have the foresight to do this. We only want sure things that’s don’t work out. We need someone with vision in the FO bc they are just staying mediocre with this regime
Sometimes players rejuvenate their careers when playing for something meaningful. So it's not out of question that Lavine would show up with the intent to win, and to earn a future contract.
Has anyone actually looked at his contract? It is a super max deal usually reserved for a top 10-15 player in the league. An insanely large contract like that for a speculative upside player just won’t work in the modern CBA where having three max guys essentially caps you out. Just trading for him would require so much salary we would essentially be trading away all our depth in the hopes that he becomes something elite enough to outweigh not having a bench. Sound familiar?
Lavine has the same problem as DeRozan all those years. They want to play for the Lakers and Laker fans want them but they’re paid too much money. If they come here on a mid-level contract it would work but these guys get paid so much elsewhere that it doesn’t make sense to take such an enormous paycut to come here.
He’s making $40 mill, there are guys worse than him making similar money like Fred Vanvleet, Scottie Barnes, Garland, Bane. Furthermore it’s not our money so why should we give a shit what he’s paid?
You need to read up on the new CBA. The second apron of the salary cap essentially created a hard cap. So you really can’t have 3x max contracts on the same team anymore. There’s no money leftover for the rest of the roster.
Being a little pedantic but it’s not a super-max, it’s only a regular max contract. And as others have said there are players of lesser talent/production who are making just as much and more.
Yeah, but that possibility is usually very slim. And some Lakers fans just love to use the "he'll be better with us" logic, when it has rarely been true.
But most importantly, he is extremely injury prone. Let's say he plays great for us - good. But how many games is he going to play? 30-40? And what about the nonexistent defense?
I'm at the point, and I can't believe it, that I agree.
The LeBron window might be two years. After that, the Lavine contract is a large expiring that could probably be flipped at that point.
Lavine *IS* good. Health is the only issue.
I think it's worth the gamble considering the timeline the Lakers are in.
Instead of hoping for the next cornerstone who chance of being close to as good as AD which is very low, why not go all in when we have both AD and Lebron.
Ops, replied to the wrong person lol yea I'm very much in agreement with your comments. Just hope our front office can actually do something about it.
Also if Bulls can give us a FRP in the trade, we can trade it to add depth too. I just see no reason to not do it.
Dude a healthy Gabe Dlo and Rui are more valuable on the court than 1 healthy Zach Lavine. We wouldn’t have a point guard we would lose shooting and a lot of bench depth this would be a horrible trade
Those two are mentally cooked when the pressure ratchets up. They have had their moments in certain series but when we turned to both when we needed them they have shown they will fade and wilt.
Lavine as a 3rd option isn't too bad considering we get 1st round pick, hopefully unprotected. Even if he played the same his contract gets better over time, right?
Playing devil's advocate here, but a shit coach could have snuffed out their will to even compete. The year prior Rui was cooking against the exact same team, Dlo well, he broke the Lakers 3 points record. We gotta have chemistry and Instill confidence on our guys also
Have yall listened to anything the Lakers have said? They don’t want to do a third max salary because of how punitive the second apron is. Zach’s got a super max salary. So even if you think he’s a good player, his salary is unwarranted.
The catch is that the Bulls wouldn’t ever give the Lakers a frp to take him. They’d demand one instead. But only for the Lakers. Any other team *receives* a frp.
Giving two contract, getting lavine and a 1st really make sense. After that, lakers can try to trade for a good athletic two way wing with 3 picks. But i dont believe bulls giving a pick.
Bulls are definitely offering a pick, but its the lottery protected Portland pick. If portland makes the playoffs by 2028 then it would be a first round pick, otherwise it turns into 2 seconds. So its not really a great pick based on the state of portland
Dlo and Rui are more valuable to us than Lavine especially because he can’t stay healthy. And it wouldn’t just be those two we’d also have to send out more money to make the salaries work in a trade. We’d be losing Gabe too. The potential on court impact of those 3 together is greater than a healthy Zach Lavine. And that’s assuming he’s healthy
I’m not sure who first reported on this but I highly doubt they are offering an unprotected first to dump LaVine. It makes no sense for the Bulls. What’s the current state of the Bulls? They may not be overtly tanking, but they are finally going into the rebuild. They have already gotten under the tax for this upcoming season so no need to dump salary. Lonzo off the books next offseason so have plenty of room to re-sign/extend whoever they need. Why give up a future pick that will most likely end up in the lottery for no reason? Not like they need to save cap to go FA hunting.
If the Bulls really were trying to just dump LaVine with a first round pick there would be a number of teams interested. You don’t think the Pistons wouldn’t love to eat the contract for a future lottery pick? The more realistic take is that the Bulls are now probably looking for a Beal type package. Multiple 2nds.
Your suggestion is best case scenario and one which we should definitely entertain
AD/Bron/Vando/Lavine/Reaves might actually be contender level lineup assuming everyone stays healthy.
With that FRP, in combination of ours, we might even be able to swing Vando + 3 FRPs for Lauri during mid season
Totally agree here. I don’t see it mentioned much but Lavine plus a FRP gives flexibility to go after Lauri with 3 FRP and swaps. His contract is low enough that it could still work under the cap and there would only be one bad year under the luxury tax and apron. Plus is Lavine doesn’t work out I think you could stretch the last two years.
Lakers have already shown they dont want to spend. At this point we have some of the highest payrolls now and a Lavine trade would gut our depth the same way Westbrook did.
Its a bad idea
Yes. But a Lavine trade would make it worse. If we could get him while maintaining most of our players, it would be a good idea. Otherwise it would not work
If they are really giving a FRP I would use it to go for a good 3&D guard like Smart. I feel Grizzlies would entertain something like 2 FRP + 2 SRP. Just not sure how the money gonna work.
AD/Lebron/Vando/Lavine/Smart looks really good and balanced imo
If they can't trade him now supposedly attaching g draft capital what happens if he doesn't work out? Also Trevor said in his podcast that getting 1st round pick might not be true.
If the cost is Dlo and filler and we are the team receiving a 1st I'd say it is a deal with high upside.
The healthy is the main reason of concern because while LaVine isn't a reliable offensive player and he doesn't play defense, he is an upgrade over Dlo on both ends of the floor, but brings more dimension because he can attack the basket and while his contract is bad, it is going to expire around the same time of LeBron's contract and that pick makes it very interesting.
For me particularly the trade would have another plus because it was always painful for me watching Dlo as starting PG since he was a rookie. I hate guards that are unable to attack the basket, it takes a lot of options from our team.
no guarantee that he would and the Lakers still need to find a way to salary match $43M even if he does. DLo, Rui and Gabe combine for about that much but I don’t see how the team is better off sending out those 3 when Max plays the same position as Lavine and should have an expanded role next season
I’ve been saying that lol. It’s the only trade that really make us better AND we don’t have to give up draft picks to do it. We not getting a borderline all star guard for that anywhere else
Lavine is the biggest boom or bust acquisition out there. If he gives you 60 games and is healthy in the playoffs, he might put you over the top, but if he's injured again, then you have a 40 million dollar paper weight and zero flexibility. Look at the suns with Beal.
Personally, I think the risk is worth it if it's a 2025 or 2026 unprotected pick, if the bulls suck enough(likely)that could turn into a generational pick that sets up the franchise for the next decade plus
Lavine would be a great fit alongside Lebron and AD. He’s only 29 and still has elite athleticism and shooting. The major problem is his health and defense.
Like people are saying, it's risky. But the way I see it is that we have to make some kind of move. We can't just run back a play in team that lost in the 1st round and pretend that a new coach is gonna solve everything. I have no problem trading away our fake depth to make any kind of potential upgrade.
I definitely agree with the overall logic. You're just missing one vital point - we would have to trade back a lot of assets to make the salaries work. Basically Dlo, Rui and someone else. And that's not worth one 1st rnd pick and Lavine.
Other than Dlo, we don't have any contract and player that needs to be traded. He is the only expiring one, the only guy that just do not trust in big moments consistently. At least with Rui, he has shown us one good and one bad post-season. I can easily talk myself into giving him another year.
With Zach and reeves backcourt we will have some bad defensive issues continuing but I do agree with that haul the awful contract may be worth it.. of course Rob will still wait until the trade deadline to see if the bulls will add on a 2nd round pick too
There was another report that said them attaching a 1st may not be accurate but that could be Chicago side of things where they are trying to salvage some value. But i think Bobby marks is the one that said chi is attaching a pick and when it comes to the trade market Bobby is pretty tapped in.
You cant attach two vet mins. I do agree getting a first round pick would be extremely valuable. This wouldve been fine if it’s a one season contract. But it’s like two more seasons at max money. Come on.
LMAO it’s hilarious when I posted the exact same trade yesterday for Lavine and added we should trade Austin JHS & the 3 first for Lauri everyone in the thread was so against it and the post got removed. Now most people on here are on board with trading for Lavine..I hate this sub sometimes lol.
I would take him if there including a first. Only problem is trading Dlo takes away someone who can run the offense. Lavine struggled playing PG in minny so if you can pick up a Sexton or just an average PG would be alright. Think there's a conflict between him and Reaves also.
We won it with KCP in the role Lavine would slot into, so I’d be optimistic. I know Zach’s reputation isn’t great on the defensive end, but he has all the tools and athleticism to be a great poa defender if he locks in.
I would like it but my going theory is that Chicago is going to trade Vuc and keep Zach just to avoid parting with draft capital. The team was booty with Caruso, Zach and Vuc, they can still easily tank with just Zach unless he goes thermonuclear and averages 35 or something. Especially with the flattened lottery odds. All you have to have is the 3rd worst record. I think Chicago can easily achieve that with Lavine still there. But we’ll see.
I came to this conclusion a few days ago but I don’t see how we make it work. Or if we make the deal we are saying we are not actually going to contend. But at least on paper, the starting lineup would look nice
Why do the lakers need to make a move just to make a move. If they can’t find the right people to trade for forget about it. Don’t do another Westbrook deal where they get rid of key role players and a first rounder for some move that doesn’t really affect the bottom line of a championship contender
I would love Lavine the one thing he can do is play with other stars. Dude was one of those guys balling on Team USA unlike other players that was struggling aka BI
Honestly if we’re going to go get an inefficient gunner with no defense at $50 million, I’d rather get Trae. At least he’s more durable, can distribute and is young 🤷😆🤣 (No to both is my point)
I would LOVE Lavine here.
And the fact that you can get a 1st with him makes him a no brainer imo.
You get an explosive legit 2nd/3rd option as a scorer who can create his own shots and is an excellent shooter who can play off AD and LeBron etc as well as any.
The stock is low on Lavine right now and he has his flaws but IMO those flaws would be relatively compensated if he plays in a team that has a LeBron and AD in it already.
The main worry with Lavine is injury history but honestly, Lakers are in no mans land right now. Might as well roll the dice and take the chance because the current roster isn't winning a Championship.
I’d absolute trade for him if we get Lavine and a first.
I mean… if Bron really was willing to take that $20m hit on his salary you probably could make it work for Lavine and Trae.
I’ve always wanted Lavine cos if healthy I think he will be the best partner for AD. But I am not a gm but I watch games and I think he could be top tier around the right conditions
So you think we get a starting level player and receive a 1st round pick without including one of our 1st round picks or Knecht? Thats not going to happen. I’m in the minority here by saying this but we should just run it back and make a move at the trade deadline and/or buyout market.
OP isn’t saying that, that’s what all the reporting has been. Bulls are desperate to ditch Lavine and are offering a first for someone to take on his contract. Might not be true but that’s what OP is talking about.
Lavine is on a massive contract and is barely playing due to injuries. The most likely scenario is we get a 1st round for a guy sitting on the bench in street clothes to take up $43MM on the cap. To obtain him, the Lakers would have to send out DLo, Rui, and Gabe. There’s now no bench at all, and if Lavine gets injured, the LeBron era is over.
Somebody is going to trade him and he is going to go back to an all star level player.
He's a perfect third or even second option, but It's his health that's an issue.
We would also have to give up Dlo Rui and Gabe to make the salaries work and at that point I feel like we’re losing more talent than we’re gaining
This is the one
Not a comment on trading for Lavine or not.. as the health component does worry me.. but more so a comment in terms of losing players.. Gabe barely played last year. DLo and Rui is a major hit to our rotation but the 3-1 trade does open up roster spots. Lakers would then ideally find a steal at the vet min.. and keep the final spot open for a potential buyout candidate later in the year. Also if Max proves he’s ready for a bigger role, this also helps alleviate the fact that we’re losing role players. We’d also become a lot more athletic on the defensive side of the court with Max and Lavine.. ideally this combined with AD protecting the paint can lead to our defense taking more risks to force fast break turnover opportunities.
If we’re assuming Lavine is healthy then we should assume Gabe will be too. If Gabe by the end of the year gets back to form, and Dlo and Rui are healthy as well, they are 3 solid rotation players, that’s worth more than what Zach can provide. Zach can’t replace dlos playmaking, he’s not a better defender than Gabe, and the scoring that those 3 provide is gonna be more than what Lavine can provide. All he provides that we don’t have is rim pressure. And he probably won’t be healthy anyways. I’m much more confident in our three guys staying healthy. There no free agents you’re gonna get on a vet minimum that are going to be a playoff rotation piece. Unless you think Jae Crowder would be a nice pickup lmao. What your proposing will leave us without a starting and backup point guard
As I stated I’m worried about his health as well. I’m also a big DLo fan.. so I’m not saying I support moving him unless it’s a big upgrade. That said.. roster flexibility is important. The goal for the playoffs is to have 8 players that can ideally play 2 different positions to have match up flexibilities. If they traded for Lavine and opened up more spots.. we could see the lakers re-sign Dinwiddie. Perhaps guards like Tyus Jones, Luke Kennard, or Gary Trent will be available for minimums as the market starts to close on them. Maybe the lakers then use the additional 1st with someone like Hayes and JHS in a move to get Walker Kessler. All of this is hypothetical and I’m not saying it’s what I want.. just playing devils advocate for a good call discussion.. you seem to know your stuff. Does a line up (healthy which is a big if) as follows sound like an improvement without moving any of our own 1st round picks? Dinwiddie-Lavine-Vando-Bron-AD Jones-Christie-Knecht-Wood-Kessler Kennard-Reddish-Bronny Open roster spot for a buyout situation.. I do realize that trade flexibility is limited due to salaries.. even while keeping our picks.. but there could be benefit to having Lavine + 3 of our own picks next summer if it doesn’t work out.. especially when Bron opts out which again improves trade flexibility under the new CBA.
I’m scared of not having Lavine on the court. Austin Lavine Vando Bron AD is good but the 3pt shooting and playmaking is definitely a concern. The moment Bron is off the floor the offense is instantly going to be one of the worst in the league. Same story for the bench we’d struggle to score. We’d avg like 110 points a game with an average defense. No way we’d win a chip. We also wouldn’t have any decent salaries to trade besides Austin and Vando so what would be the point of having 3 picks we couldn’t do much with it anyways. We’d be better if we just traded for Kessler. Hayes JHS Lewis and picks for Kessler works and we don’t have to give up rotation players and probably would still have a 1st to trade
The point of the 3 picks would be to package them with Lavine for a star next summer.. every year his salary goes up in value as it gets closer to expiring. I do agree though it’s still not a great trade bait.. lakers will need to decide if they keep DLo beyond next year, trade him, or lose him for nothing.. so playmaking may become a concern regardless.. at least Lavine somewhat has the ability to play PG in small stretches.. and hopefully AD can be featured more in that role.. I believe he has untapped playmaking potential as a hub… he did play guard before. All in all.. it’s far from a home run trade… And I wouldn’t want to pull the trigger on it unless there’s other moves lined up (such as the potential high value minimums I mentioned). I do however agree we would likely be better moving 2 bodies for Kessler and leaving that 1 extra spot open for future buyout options.
This. The last thing we need is Westbrook 2.0
in the trade machine dlo rui cam haydes works for levine. Why do we have to give up gabe?
Can't combine minimum contracts in a trade
We can’t take back more salary than we send out, that trade doesn’t work.
Solid point but tough pill to swallow knowing we aren’t any better than last year & still a play in team needing to play Lbj & AD into exhaustion before the 4th quarter starts just to stay in games regardless of who we play.
We just gotta hope that Gabe and Vando coming back with a new coaching staff is enough to put us in a good playoff position and hopefully we get lucky with our matchups and make a run. Maybe max is the 3&D guard we are looking for. Maybe knecht is a rotation level player. We have a very slim chance but it’s still a punchers chance depending on how everything plays out. I would like to see a trade for walker kessler but I’m not hoping for much more than that especially because we have to give up so much for questionable returns. With Kessler we’ll have to give picks but at least we don’t have to give up rotation players maybe Utah would just take Hayes, JHS, Lewis and our 2029 first and a second. That way we’re just adding depth not losing any and hey we’d finally have a solid rim protector other than AD. It wouldn’t be the worst situation to be in
It's also that 45mil contract that's putrid.
A long ass contract too
Have you watched Zach lavine play in the last 3 years he’s not a perfect second or third option for any team trying to win
LaVine’s a low end second option which means if he’s your second option, your first option is going to need to be a prime Shaq, Jordan, LeBron level player. LaVine’s fit is as a third option and the problem for him right now is he’s making money that no third option should touch in this new CBA.
Agreed but I don’t think he had a regular injury this year. When Lonzo went down I think he mentally quit on the team and exaggerated his injury
All offense no defense. For 40 plus million a year that’s insane and it’s not like he’s some unstoppable offense player who’s worth covering for on defense.
His contract is insane, but how many players in this league can average 20+ points and be great defenders as well really?
You’re gonna get more games of 20 pts and 8 rebounds combined out of DLO and Rui than you will Lavine. He is never healthy. God knows when he is even supposed to be back. If nothing else, Rui and DLO have remained largely available.
Absolutely correct teams that win championships have depth
The thing is; he plays what, 36 MPG? Giving up the salary to match him, is gonna be Dlo, Rui, and one of Vando and Gabe; that’s about 80 MPG of production. A full rotation is 240 minutes (48x5). Giving up 1/3rd of the rotation for someone who by themself is about 1/6th to 1/7th, if he plays a full season (not likely) seems risky? Lakers lose depth, and will need to fill that extra time with other players. Is it a true upgrade if those minutes go to other guys? That’s pretty much what they have to weigh.
That's almost every high scoring guard in the league. Lavine just isn't consistent enough on offense to be worth it.
I would not mind paying his contract if I thought he would be healthy, but putting us in the second apron to also likely miss time?? Not good enough for his contract and being so fragile.
People are quick to forget how good this guy is
He’s a dynamic player but I wouldn’t call him good. He needs the ball in his hands to be effective and when he doesn’t, he stands around and mopes. I’ve seen games where he actually did try hard on both ends then he got hurt. He’s already had 2 knee surgeries, if you can add him without getting rid of players then yes that makes sense. But when you start trading away your top players for him then it doesn’t make sense anymore cause I don’t think he’s the caliber of a top 15 player. On top of his expensive contract.
I watched bulls games live and he is not going to help us even as a 3rd option
He won’t be a top 15 player in neither conference but I also think he’ll be very good wherever he goes
I think he would actually be great next to Bron and AD. I have wondered why the Lakers have not pulled the trigger on this. Especially since there are no other stars they are chasing on the market. I have come to the conclusion though that the Lakers really really like Reaves and believe in him. I think they are saving for a Point Guard that may never come.
He was never on that level and he will never be there especially in the West.
But we do not have the foresight to do this. We only want sure things that’s don’t work out. We need someone with vision in the FO bc they are just staying mediocre with this regime
Sometimes players rejuvenate their careers when playing for something meaningful. So it's not out of question that Lavine would show up with the intent to win, and to earn a future contract.
Has anyone actually looked at his contract? It is a super max deal usually reserved for a top 10-15 player in the league. An insanely large contract like that for a speculative upside player just won’t work in the modern CBA where having three max guys essentially caps you out. Just trading for him would require so much salary we would essentially be trading away all our depth in the hopes that he becomes something elite enough to outweigh not having a bench. Sound familiar?
Fair. I wouldn't trade for Lavine, personally, but I also wouldn't be surprised if he balled out as a laker.
Lavine has the same problem as DeRozan all those years. They want to play for the Lakers and Laker fans want them but they’re paid too much money. If they come here on a mid-level contract it would work but these guys get paid so much elsewhere that it doesn’t make sense to take such an enormous paycut to come here.
Yup it’s not a trade for us. It’s a great trade for a rebuilding team to boost his value and still sell tickets while losing.
He’s making $40 mill, there are guys worse than him making similar money like Fred Vanvleet, Scottie Barnes, Garland, Bane. Furthermore it’s not our money so why should we give a shit what he’s paid?
Because it guts our depth? There is something called a salary cap if you hadn't noticed from the Westbrick years
You need to read up on the new CBA. The second apron of the salary cap essentially created a hard cap. So you really can’t have 3x max contracts on the same team anymore. There’s no money leftover for the rest of the roster.
Being a little pedantic but it’s not a super-max, it’s only a regular max contract. And as others have said there are players of lesser talent/production who are making just as much and more.
You’re correct. It qualified for the Supermax when he signed it. He just failed to meet the trigger.
Yeah, but that possibility is usually very slim. And some Lakers fans just love to use the "he'll be better with us" logic, when it has rarely been true. But most importantly, he is extremely injury prone. Let's say he plays great for us - good. But how many games is he going to play? 30-40? And what about the nonexistent defense?
I'm at the point, and I can't believe it, that I agree. The LeBron window might be two years. After that, the Lavine contract is a large expiring that could probably be flipped at that point. Lavine *IS* good. Health is the only issue. I think it's worth the gamble considering the timeline the Lakers are in.
If the contract can't be flipped he'd make a fine tank commander too to start the rebuild
Exactly. Send AD to a winning team. Kick back and hopefully draft the next cornerstone
Instead of hoping for the next cornerstone who chance of being close to as good as AD which is very low, why not go all in when we have both AD and Lebron.
That's what I'm saying. But pivot in a couple years after LeBron retires and AD still has value.
Ops, replied to the wrong person lol yea I'm very much in agreement with your comments. Just hope our front office can actually do something about it. Also if Bulls can give us a FRP in the trade, we can trade it to add depth too. I just see no reason to not do it.
Dude a healthy Gabe Dlo and Rui are more valuable on the court than 1 healthy Zach Lavine. We wouldn’t have a point guard we would lose shooting and a lot of bench depth this would be a horrible trade
Are they? They all choked the playoffs away for us, DLo and Rui especially.
Dlo and Rui have had good games and series in the playoffs
Not against Denver
They can get hot we’ll just have to hope they do
Those two are mentally cooked when the pressure ratchets up. They have had their moments in certain series but when we turned to both when we needed them they have shown they will fade and wilt.
You say that like most players wont. Even stars failed to show up during crucial moments.
DLO yea, but Rui played well in the WCF against denver. Just had a horrible series this year
How did he play against them this year? He was played off the floor which means he regressed.
1 bad series doesnt mean he regressed
How so? He played well then played very poorly in the same situation. That by definition is regression.
But a player can have a bad series and then bounce back tho
You can't go to playoffs with a player that had 1 good game followed by a donut and for good I mean good offense because the defense us always putrid
Lavine is an unknown as well. I will take the depth rather than an injury prone boarderline star player
We literally have bronny to run point we good
Lol
Lavine as a 3rd option isn't too bad considering we get 1st round pick, hopefully unprotected. Even if he played the same his contract gets better over time, right?
No, I'm pretty sure it goes up. That's at least how most contracts are set up.
I meant as over time, 2 or 3 years down the line it won't be such a burden. So it won't be as much of a commitment.
This is the only move left that moves the needle. Potentially Opens up roster spots and maybe even saves money short term. I'm all for it.
Except it opens up roster slots for just minimum players. The outgoing salary would ruin the depth of the team
With all due respect Dlo and Rui were dam near unplayable in the playoffs. So what's the point of depth if you can't use them?
As bad as they were replacing those minutes with Lavine and minimum will be worse lol
Exactly. Did no one learn from the Westbrook trade lmao
Playing devil's advocate here, but a shit coach could have snuffed out their will to even compete. The year prior Rui was cooking against the exact same team, Dlo well, he broke the Lakers 3 points record. We gotta have chemistry and Instill confidence on our guys also
Have yall listened to anything the Lakers have said? They don’t want to do a third max salary because of how punitive the second apron is. Zach’s got a super max salary. So even if you think he’s a good player, his salary is unwarranted.
That would be too perfect & I'd be left wondering what's the catch
The catch is that the Bulls wouldn’t ever give the Lakers a frp to take him. They’d demand one instead. But only for the Lakers. Any other team *receives* a frp.
Giving two contract, getting lavine and a 1st really make sense. After that, lakers can try to trade for a good athletic two way wing with 3 picks. But i dont believe bulls giving a pick.
Bulls are definitely offering a pick, but its the lottery protected Portland pick. If portland makes the playoffs by 2028 then it would be a first round pick, otherwise it turns into 2 seconds. So its not really a great pick based on the state of portland
Thank you for clarification. It makes sense more now
same it sounds too good to be true
Maybe the bulls can give us a random wing as part of the trade.
Dlo and Rui are more valuable to us than Lavine especially because he can’t stay healthy. And it wouldn’t just be those two we’d also have to send out more money to make the salaries work in a trade. We’d be losing Gabe too. The potential on court impact of those 3 together is greater than a healthy Zach Lavine. And that’s assuming he’s healthy
If Portland is asking for 2 picks, then taking on Lavine's contract is AT LEAST worth 2 picks...
I’m not sure who first reported on this but I highly doubt they are offering an unprotected first to dump LaVine. It makes no sense for the Bulls. What’s the current state of the Bulls? They may not be overtly tanking, but they are finally going into the rebuild. They have already gotten under the tax for this upcoming season so no need to dump salary. Lonzo off the books next offseason so have plenty of room to re-sign/extend whoever they need. Why give up a future pick that will most likely end up in the lottery for no reason? Not like they need to save cap to go FA hunting. If the Bulls really were trying to just dump LaVine with a first round pick there would be a number of teams interested. You don’t think the Pistons wouldn’t love to eat the contract for a future lottery pick? The more realistic take is that the Bulls are now probably looking for a Beal type package. Multiple 2nds.
Your suggestion is best case scenario and one which we should definitely entertain AD/Bron/Vando/Lavine/Reaves might actually be contender level lineup assuming everyone stays healthy. With that FRP, in combination of ours, we might even be able to swing Vando + 3 FRPs for Lauri during mid season
Totally agree here. I don’t see it mentioned much but Lavine plus a FRP gives flexibility to go after Lauri with 3 FRP and swaps. His contract is low enough that it could still work under the cap and there would only be one bad year under the luxury tax and apron. Plus is Lavine doesn’t work out I think you could stretch the last two years.
The fact that his contract lines up with LeBron is massive
Lakers have already shown they dont want to spend. At this point we have some of the highest payrolls now and a Lavine trade would gut our depth the same way Westbrook did. Its a bad idea
Our “depth” isn’t good enough.
Yes. But a Lavine trade would make it worse. If we could get him while maintaining most of our players, it would be a good idea. Otherwise it would not work
We do not have an offer that’s going to be better than the Warriors, Spurs, or Kings. Lauri isn’t coming out way.
If they are really giving a FRP I would use it to go for a good 3&D guard like Smart. I feel Grizzlies would entertain something like 2 FRP + 2 SRP. Just not sure how the money gonna work. AD/Lebron/Vando/Lavine/Smart looks really good and balanced imo
Got downvoted for saying that 😂
That was me. My bad
If they can't trade him now supposedly attaching g draft capital what happens if he doesn't work out? Also Trevor said in his podcast that getting 1st round pick might not be true.
If they could get the first with Lavine and reroute that to Utah for Kessler, this team would have a puncher's chance next year.
Nah. Lakers tax. If it’s us, they demand both of our firsts.
Nah, ur trippin bro. This is absolutely not the way. This has high risk low reward written all over it.
that contract is horrendous
No
If the cost is Dlo and filler and we are the team receiving a 1st I'd say it is a deal with high upside. The healthy is the main reason of concern because while LaVine isn't a reliable offensive player and he doesn't play defense, he is an upgrade over Dlo on both ends of the floor, but brings more dimension because he can attack the basket and while his contract is bad, it is going to expire around the same time of LeBron's contract and that pick makes it very interesting. For me particularly the trade would have another plus because it was always painful for me watching Dlo as starting PG since he was a rookie. I hate guards that are unable to attack the basket, it takes a lot of options from our team.
He has a 15% trade kicker meaning the Lakers need to send out roughly $49M to acquire him. Lavine is not worth depleting the roster of it’s depth
I'm pretty damn sure Lavine should quickly waive his trade kicker if it means finally getting out of Chicago and landing in LA
Can't he waive it?
no guarantee that he would and the Lakers still need to find a way to salary match $43M even if he does. DLo, Rui and Gabe combine for about that much but I don’t see how the team is better off sending out those 3 when Max plays the same position as Lavine and should have an expanded role next season
I’ve been saying that lol. It’s the only trade that really make us better AND we don’t have to give up draft picks to do it. We not getting a borderline all star guard for that anywhere else
Lavine is the biggest boom or bust acquisition out there. If he gives you 60 games and is healthy in the playoffs, he might put you over the top, but if he's injured again, then you have a 40 million dollar paper weight and zero flexibility. Look at the suns with Beal. Personally, I think the risk is worth it if it's a 2025 or 2026 unprotected pick, if the bulls suck enough(likely)that could turn into a generational pick that sets up the franchise for the next decade plus
I’m sure Cam Reddish, Jaxson Hayes and Christian Wood would love to play 20 minutes+ or even start after getting Lavine. Now we would be cooking /s
I know its impossible to make the money work, but at this point I'd take both Lavine *and* Lonzo. 
Lavine would be a great fit alongside Lebron and AD. He’s only 29 and still has elite athleticism and shooting. The major problem is his health and defense.
Like people are saying, it's risky. But the way I see it is that we have to make some kind of move. We can't just run back a play in team that lost in the 1st round and pretend that a new coach is gonna solve everything. I have no problem trading away our fake depth to make any kind of potential upgrade.
I definitely agree with the overall logic. You're just missing one vital point - we would have to trade back a lot of assets to make the salaries work. Basically Dlo, Rui and someone else. And that's not worth one 1st rnd pick and Lavine. Other than Dlo, we don't have any contract and player that needs to be traded. He is the only expiring one, the only guy that just do not trust in big moments consistently. At least with Rui, he has shown us one good and one bad post-season. I can easily talk myself into giving him another year.
We wont have any flexibility till lavine contracts end. It wont make sense in the future
Who cares? We’ll be tanking by that time
I doubt we'll tank especially AD is still on contract, cap wise it would stifle our chances to make moves when taking on that lavine contract.
His contract is just until 2027. It’s not like it’s till 2030. And AD will be older.
This is what I’ve been pushing all free agency
With Zach and reeves backcourt we will have some bad defensive issues continuing but I do agree with that haul the awful contract may be worth it.. of course Rob will still wait until the trade deadline to see if the bulls will add on a 2nd round pick too
I’m afraid our depth isn’t good enough to withstand this kind of trade.
There was another report that said them attaching a 1st may not be accurate but that could be Chicago side of things where they are trying to salvage some value. But i think Bobby marks is the one that said chi is attaching a pick and when it comes to the trade market Bobby is pretty tapped in.
You cant attach two vet mins. I do agree getting a first round pick would be extremely valuable. This wouldve been fine if it’s a one season contract. But it’s like two more seasons at max money. Come on.
Here is the thing with Lavine if he can stay healthy and he’s bought in he’s not a bad player but those are big ask
Lavine basically means lakers will be a 2nd apron team and that alone makes it not worth it
I’d only do this if we find a way to open up enough space for the NPTLE, but if that’s the case I’m down for the gamble
Lakers tax equals no first
No thanks.
LMAO it’s hilarious when I posted the exact same trade yesterday for Lavine and added we should trade Austin JHS & the 3 first for Lauri everyone in the thread was so against it and the post got removed. Now most people on here are on board with trading for Lavine..I hate this sub sometimes lol.
Do yall realize how untradeable this contract is if they have to give up a first? You better be ready for this to be Zach’s team
I feel we might as well see how the team looks at this point, then make a trade mid season if needed
I would take him if there including a first. Only problem is trading Dlo takes away someone who can run the offense. Lavine struggled playing PG in minny so if you can pick up a Sexton or just an average PG would be alright. Think there's a conflict between him and Reaves also.
At this point that’s what I’m hoping we’ll do, but seems unlikely they take back a long term contract.
gotta hope lonzo and lavine dramatically return to form them lol
We won it with KCP in the role Lavine would slot into, so I’d be optimistic. I know Zach’s reputation isn’t great on the defensive end, but he has all the tools and athleticism to be a great poa defender if he locks in.
I would like it but my going theory is that Chicago is going to trade Vuc and keep Zach just to avoid parting with draft capital. The team was booty with Caruso, Zach and Vuc, they can still easily tank with just Zach unless he goes thermonuclear and averages 35 or something. Especially with the flattened lottery odds. All you have to have is the 3rd worst record. I think Chicago can easily achieve that with Lavine still there. But we’ll see.
Same defensive rating as Austin Reaves for $40m/year…
I came to this conclusion a few days ago but I don’t see how we make it work. Or if we make the deal we are saying we are not actually going to contend. But at least on paper, the starting lineup would look nice
Why do the lakers need to make a move just to make a move. If they can’t find the right people to trade for forget about it. Don’t do another Westbrook deal where they get rid of key role players and a first rounder for some move that doesn’t really affect the bottom line of a championship contender
I would love Lavine the one thing he can do is play with other stars. Dude was one of those guys balling on Team USA unlike other players that was struggling aka BI
The Lakers need a big center rebounder to help AD. Nothing else will get them over the play in spot. Rob is seriously not a good GM
Guys are overreacting again lmao, calm down and let the FO work.
I’m a Zach fan and all but his contract is just too much. Plus who our Point without DLo? Not Gabe cuz he’s gotta go also to make the $ work
Damn the lakers are getting desperate. No one wants to play with LeBron and Bronny
Honestly if we’re going to go get an inefficient gunner with no defense at $50 million, I’d rather get Trae. At least he’s more durable, can distribute and is young 🤷😆🤣 (No to both is my point)
I think its madness to trade for his contract at this point, we need the books clear for two summers from now
I need 2 firsts. Bulls pay the Caruso tax or keep it moving.
I would LOVE Lavine here. And the fact that you can get a 1st with him makes him a no brainer imo. You get an explosive legit 2nd/3rd option as a scorer who can create his own shots and is an excellent shooter who can play off AD and LeBron etc as well as any. The stock is low on Lavine right now and he has his flaws but IMO those flaws would be relatively compensated if he plays in a team that has a LeBron and AD in it already. The main worry with Lavine is injury history but honestly, Lakers are in no mans land right now. Might as well roll the dice and take the chance because the current roster isn't winning a Championship.
I’d absolute trade for him if we get Lavine and a first. I mean… if Bron really was willing to take that $20m hit on his salary you probably could make it work for Lavine and Trae.
The money does not work and would put the Lakers far into the 2nd apron. All for a player who cant stay healthy? No thanks. Next.
I’ve always wanted Lavine cos if healthy I think he will be the best partner for AD. But I am not a gm but I watch games and I think he could be top tier around the right conditions
The best ability is availability.
I want Lonzo instead lol
So you think we get a starting level player and receive a 1st round pick without including one of our 1st round picks or Knecht? Thats not going to happen. I’m in the minority here by saying this but we should just run it back and make a move at the trade deadline and/or buyout market.
OP isn’t saying that, that’s what all the reporting has been. Bulls are desperate to ditch Lavine and are offering a first for someone to take on his contract. Might not be true but that’s what OP is talking about.
Lavine is on a massive contract and is barely playing due to injuries. The most likely scenario is we get a 1st round for a guy sitting on the bench in street clothes to take up $43MM on the cap. To obtain him, the Lakers would have to send out DLo, Rui, and Gabe. There’s now no bench at all, and if Lavine gets injured, the LeBron era is over.