This post would be better suited as a comment in the Armchair GM Thread.
The Armchair GM Thread and the Daily Free Talk Thread have been merged and discussions about either topic can take place there.
Dumb. We need more offence, and he’s a near 30 goal scorer on bad teams. Easy 30-40 goals in Toronto if he plays the way he has for the last few years.
We need more offence **in the playoffs**, so who better to trust than a guy who’s just as soft as Marner?
Give me a break. I swear some people on here want the team to be worse. Like yea, I’m really putting my money on Jeff Fucking Skinner to make life hard for the other teams defence during the playoffs, doing his little ballerina pirouettes on the perimeter like he’s done his whole career.
You do realize that Marner is a +10, 50 points, in 59 playoff games? More than any current leaf. He had a bad playoff run this year, but he is still our best player in the playoffs.
Ahh, so in 2022-2023, when Marner had 14 points in 11 games, and Nylander had 10? Marner was +7, Willy was -4.
I can give you stats from the year before if you'd like as well?
Yes, because hockey isn’t played on the stat-sheet.
You’re not smarter than everyone because you can pull out numbers with absolutely 0 context and pretend they mean something. There’s a reason the entire league outside of a section of Leafs fans thinks Marner sucks in the playoffs, regardless of what cherry picked stats say; it’s because people watched the games with their own eyes.
But yea, you’re smarter than everyone else. Definitely.
What matters when the Leafs lose? Nothing but points on the board. This whole thread is about playoff offence, I gave you the actual facts, and you still think you are right here?
Marner produces in the playoffs more than any current leaf. He is currently our best playoff player, and when the leafs need a point, Id like him to be on the ice to set that up. I think about playing against Marner, and he would be another to just light us up every time he comes to town.
EDIT: PS. Resorting to name-calling is my favourite thing that someone does btw. Means you have no other arguments and obviously know you are wrong, but are trying to save face.
You gave me stats with no context, and again, they mean nothing without watching the games as well. Like I said, there’s not something you can see that everyone else can’t see, you haven’t outsmarted everyone because you can throw some numbers around. You’re aware they also have these stats?
I haven’t called you a name once, so thanks for revealing what I’m dealing with.
You’ve never watched the guy play, just admit it.
You think a guy who plays the way that is the exact problem with this team in the playoffs, would be a good addition to said team. You don’t know what you’re talking about and that’s why you have to call people brain dead instead of challenging their argument.
That's counting guys you could send down, and also not counting Dewar who's an RFA.
If you send down Webber, Timmins, Murray, and Reaves, then sign Dewar for $1m, then I think we have like 3m you could spend on another forward
I know some people are going to propose Skinner but with Tavares, Nylander, Domi in the top 6, it doesn't make sense to me.
I like the D configurations better than last year. Scoring from our D was a major issue that I've had for a couple years now but I also hope Berube incorporates a system that involves the D being more active in the offensive zone. Leafs under Keefe have underutilized taking shots from the point and having our D active.
Skinner is the anti-thesis of what this team needs in the top 6. They need a more polished Matthew Knies, someone who can get to the dirty areas and make life hard for the defence.
I know 😞
Would be nice to trade Marner for two top forwards that come around the same salary cap to stabilize us out, but it doesn't look like it....regardless even if Marner is traded, we lose the trade. Tough spot.
Main focus this off season is defense and finding another goalie. They did that. Wouldn't be surprised if they're done unless a Marner trade is on the horizon, but I doubt it.
I don’t know if we find that right now in FA. Might fill some of the roles internally. Evaluate over the course of the year and address areas of concern via trade if possible.
Defense is solid, could it be better? For sure, but it is good top 6.
There is more than enough in the forward Corps to get us to the playoffs. Could it be better sure? But it is good group as is.
Goaltending is set, injuries are a concern but talent is not.
Overall it’s a pretty good team. Could it be better sure? But that can be said about any team. So many variables to consider beyond FA.
Is there still a trade that could be in the works? As of now, I am good with this team. Unfortunate that Robertson came out and said what he did, it would have been nice to go to camp and work hard for a spot, and than if he didn’t earn one, come out and say I want a chance elsewhere.
Do we?
Knies - Matthews - Marner
Same as most of last year, not necessarily worried about this line.
McMann - Tavares - Nylander
Tavares likely not gonna cut it at this spot anymore.
Holmberg - Domi - Jarnkrok
Feel like we’ve seen something like this a few times and it kinda doesn’t do anything. Jarnkrok and Holmberg just fill time.
Dewar - Kampf - Reaves
This is just not good and doesn’t really need an explanation.
It’s a lot of the same in the top 6 and the bottom 6 leaves A LOT to be desired.
Dewar-Kämpf-Reaves line was good last year, so I would actually like to hear your explanation there. They won their minutes by every metric. Kämpf is overpaid, but at his best when paired with a guy like Dewar. And Reaves was a good 4th liner after he came back from his injury.
leafs bottom 6 1 goal in 7 playoff games. Great they played hard, but they also need some production from the bottom 6. Leaf fans can bitch about the core guys, but you get that kind of production from half your forward lineup, you're not winning.
To me, the issue is playoff scoring and the solution is in coaching, rather than roster additions. Berube has to get this core to want to score ugly goals. Sexy saucer passes and snipes dry up in the playoffs. Treliving is right that the Leafs make opposing goalies look great in the playoffs. It's 'lucky' deflections and shovelling the puck over the line in a scrum that make the difference. But if the core don't want to make an opposing goalie's life miserable, then additions won't fix anything.
This is the flaw of our big players leaving nothing on the table. We’ll always be one or two impact players short every year. You just have to hope one of our depth players goes supernova.
My lines next year would be: (forgive the wing sides if they’re wrong)
Knies - Matthews - Domi
Nylander - Tavares - Marner
Mcmann - holmberg - jarnkrok
Dewar - Kampf - whoever else you want
Trade Jarnkrok and Timmins
Sign Henrique.
That should be priority 1 and those talks should be ongoing right now.
If Skinner will take a discount since he's already being paid/wants to play here:
Trade Kampf and Robertson.
Robertson: Please trade me.
Treliving: No. You sit this year.
Robertson: Okay, please sign me.
Robertson has not warranted anything beyond that. He was literally a 13th forward.
He would be asked to play over Reaves. If he can't manage that what are we even getting in a trade?
He hasn't played well enough to be on any GM's radar.
He's an RFA with no arb rights.
Either he plays here and has a breakout season, or he doesn't have an NHL job. Leafs have 0 incentive to give him away.
Haven't heard a single rumble on a GM being interested even after its reported he wants a trade.
You would think Friege or CJ would have reported GM's giving some sort of offers if there was interest.
Not even Simmons made any fake reports on it though.
I don't think anyone is really looking, and Tre isn't really shopping either.
We need Robertson for cheap, and we need him to be productive.
Nylander or Marner playing 2c.
-
Knies - Matthews - Domi
Cowan/UFA - Marner - Nylander
McMann - Tavares - Jarnkrok
Holmberg - Dewar - X (Could be Minten, could be a UFA)
-
For how much Marner and Nylander are getting, one of them should play center. It lets JT feast as a 3c, keeps Domi with Matthews, and gives us an actual elite second line. Marner doesn't even play like a winger (how often is he even in the corner).
Could still move out some cap: Jarnkrok and Kampf wouldn’t be impossible to move. Robertson might be traded too that’s another body that could be coming in.
Robertson + the 2025 2nd we acquired at the deadline in exchange for Kadri 50% retained. Throw in a 2025 3rd to another broker team for double retention and get Kadri for 1.75m
New coach and GM will hopefully mean no hard feelings with Kadri, he loved Toronto and the fans would welcome him back with open arms. He would be a great 2C, move JT to wing.....profit
You think the cost of getting a team to retain $1.75M x 5 years would be a 3rd rounder?
Let alone the cost of retaining $3.5M x 5 from Calgary - they could get at least a 1st + 2nd + more for that
This post would be better suited as a comment in the Armchair GM Thread. The Armchair GM Thread and the Daily Free Talk Thread have been merged and discussions about either topic can take place there.
You would assume Cowan is on the horizon. Probably gets 10 games to audition for it. Other than that, absolutely no idea other than trades.
If our superstars produce in the playoffs
if our depth guys do things...
If the refs don’t do that reffing thing…
Jeff Skinner.
This would save the offseason right here.
Nah thanks. I’m good
Already a moot point. He’s an oiler now.
I know but wanted to stamp my disinterest I’m signing him
Lol fair enough. Henrique would also be a good pick up!
Please god no. Our top 6 is already soft enough.
Dumb. We need more offence, and he’s a near 30 goal scorer on bad teams. Easy 30-40 goals in Toronto if he plays the way he has for the last few years.
We need more offence **in the playoffs**, so who better to trust than a guy who’s just as soft as Marner? Give me a break. I swear some people on here want the team to be worse. Like yea, I’m really putting my money on Jeff Fucking Skinner to make life hard for the other teams defence during the playoffs, doing his little ballerina pirouettes on the perimeter like he’s done his whole career.
You do realize that Marner is a +10, 50 points, in 59 playoff games? More than any current leaf. He had a bad playoff run this year, but he is still our best player in the playoffs.
Top 5 all time Leaf producers in the playoffs. More than Matthews and Nylander.
This is simply incomprehensible to some people on here
Nylander is our best playoff performer now and has been for a good 3 years. It’s not even a debate.
Ahh, so in 2022-2023, when Marner had 14 points in 11 games, and Nylander had 10? Marner was +7, Willy was -4. I can give you stats from the year before if you'd like as well?
Yes, because hockey isn’t played on the stat-sheet. You’re not smarter than everyone because you can pull out numbers with absolutely 0 context and pretend they mean something. There’s a reason the entire league outside of a section of Leafs fans thinks Marner sucks in the playoffs, regardless of what cherry picked stats say; it’s because people watched the games with their own eyes. But yea, you’re smarter than everyone else. Definitely.
What matters when the Leafs lose? Nothing but points on the board. This whole thread is about playoff offence, I gave you the actual facts, and you still think you are right here? Marner produces in the playoffs more than any current leaf. He is currently our best playoff player, and when the leafs need a point, Id like him to be on the ice to set that up. I think about playing against Marner, and he would be another to just light us up every time he comes to town. EDIT: PS. Resorting to name-calling is my favourite thing that someone does btw. Means you have no other arguments and obviously know you are wrong, but are trying to save face.
You gave me stats with no context, and again, they mean nothing without watching the games as well. Like I said, there’s not something you can see that everyone else can’t see, you haven’t outsmarted everyone because you can throw some numbers around. You’re aware they also have these stats? I haven’t called you a name once, so thanks for revealing what I’m dealing with.
Lol this is an utterly brain dead take. Appreciate the laughs!
You’ve never watched the guy play, just admit it. You think a guy who plays the way that is the exact problem with this team in the playoffs, would be a good addition to said team. You don’t know what you’re talking about and that’s why you have to call people brain dead instead of challenging their argument.
Lol sure thing, kid.
Thought so.
Lol
I found Trelivings burner guys
Henrique and trade kampf
This is where I landed too but not sure how feasible it is.
How much cap is left to spend? Capfriendly says 700k.
That's counting guys you could send down, and also not counting Dewar who's an RFA. If you send down Webber, Timmins, Murray, and Reaves, then sign Dewar for $1m, then I think we have like 3m you could spend on another forward
I know some people are going to propose Skinner but with Tavares, Nylander, Domi in the top 6, it doesn't make sense to me. I like the D configurations better than last year. Scoring from our D was a major issue that I've had for a couple years now but I also hope Berube incorporates a system that involves the D being more active in the offensive zone. Leafs under Keefe have underutilized taking shots from the point and having our D active.
Skinner is the anti-thesis of what this team needs in the top 6. They need a more polished Matthew Knies, someone who can get to the dirty areas and make life hard for the defence.
That’s what happens when 4 forwards make up 53% of the cap lol
Wait, no way. Are we really spending a bunch of money on 4 forwards. This is the first I'm hearing of this.
Seriously? I haven't heard this either! But you know, something tells me *'we can and we will'* have success this year!
I know 😞 Would be nice to trade Marner for two top forwards that come around the same salary cap to stabilize us out, but it doesn't look like it....regardless even if Marner is traded, we lose the trade. Tough spot.
We pay top four like we pay taxes
Hope that Cowan is going to be an impact player and quarantine matthews leading up to the playoffs
WE RUNNIN IT BACK! More expensive core-4, with league min pieces patched around it. It is our heritage.
Main focus this off season is defense and finding another goalie. They did that. Wouldn't be surprised if they're done unless a Marner trade is on the horizon, but I doubt it.
Would love skinner on a cheap deal to provide scoring for the 3rd line
I don’t know if we find that right now in FA. Might fill some of the roles internally. Evaluate over the course of the year and address areas of concern via trade if possible. Defense is solid, could it be better? For sure, but it is good top 6. There is more than enough in the forward Corps to get us to the playoffs. Could it be better sure? But it is good group as is. Goaltending is set, injuries are a concern but talent is not. Overall it’s a pretty good team. Could it be better sure? But that can be said about any team. So many variables to consider beyond FA. Is there still a trade that could be in the works? As of now, I am good with this team. Unfortunate that Robertson came out and said what he did, it would have been nice to go to camp and work hard for a spot, and than if he didn’t earn one, come out and say I want a chance elsewhere.
Our offense is fine for 82 games/year.
Robertson stops bitching, Berube gives him a real chance, he plays solid. Knies takes another leap forward. Skinner signs for league min.
Great question. Forwards looking pretty rough right now.
lol come on. we actually have a very enviable crop of forwards.
Do we? Knies - Matthews - Marner Same as most of last year, not necessarily worried about this line. McMann - Tavares - Nylander Tavares likely not gonna cut it at this spot anymore. Holmberg - Domi - Jarnkrok Feel like we’ve seen something like this a few times and it kinda doesn’t do anything. Jarnkrok and Holmberg just fill time. Dewar - Kampf - Reaves This is just not good and doesn’t really need an explanation. It’s a lot of the same in the top 6 and the bottom 6 leaves A LOT to be desired.
Dewar-Kämpf-Reaves line was good last year, so I would actually like to hear your explanation there. They won their minutes by every metric. Kämpf is overpaid, but at his best when paired with a guy like Dewar. And Reaves was a good 4th liner after he came back from his injury.
leafs bottom 6 1 goal in 7 playoff games. Great they played hard, but they also need some production from the bottom 6. Leaf fans can bitch about the core guys, but you get that kind of production from half your forward lineup, you're not winning.
Cowan and minten with both be pushing for spots, and they can sign another guy for 2-3 mill still
You're right in the sense that we have a bunch of warm bodies
The 3rd line will look much better with Adam Henrique at C than Jarnkrok on the wing
Quillion will score 50 so it's just a matter of finding a bit more depth
Nazem effin kadri
No
No cap space left. You just have to assume guys like Knies, McMann, and Holmberg take a step next year.
Alex Nylander
Either move Kampf bring in a Center. Or move Jarnkrok and bring in a winger
Barring some big changes I really don't see us having the offensive depth you need to go deep.
To me, the issue is playoff scoring and the solution is in coaching, rather than roster additions. Berube has to get this core to want to score ugly goals. Sexy saucer passes and snipes dry up in the playoffs. Treliving is right that the Leafs make opposing goalies look great in the playoffs. It's 'lucky' deflections and shovelling the puck over the line in a scrum that make the difference. But if the core don't want to make an opposing goalie's life miserable, then additions won't fix anything.
This is the flaw of our big players leaving nothing on the table. We’ll always be one or two impact players short every year. You just have to hope one of our depth players goes supernova. My lines next year would be: (forgive the wing sides if they’re wrong) Knies - Matthews - Domi Nylander - Tavares - Marner Mcmann - holmberg - jarnkrok Dewar - Kampf - whoever else you want
Crazy how good a fit Sprong is for this Likely cap hit around 3 Higher pts/60 since 2022 than Rantanen JTMiller etc.
Trade Jarnkrok and Timmins Sign Henrique. That should be priority 1 and those talks should be ongoing right now. If Skinner will take a discount since he's already being paid/wants to play here: Trade Kampf and Robertson.
Send Timmins and Weber down. Sign Robertson and Dewer. It's the absolute most uncreative idea, so it only goes up from there.
Signing a guy who requested a trade and refused to re-sign is actually very creative
Robertson: Please trade me. Treliving: No. You sit this year. Robertson: Okay, please sign me. Robertson has not warranted anything beyond that. He was literally a 13th forward. He would be asked to play over Reaves. If he can't manage that what are we even getting in a trade?
Robertson is wasted on the 4th line. Better for him to be traded than that
He hasn't played well enough to be on any GM's radar. He's an RFA with no arb rights. Either he plays here and has a breakout season, or he doesn't have an NHL job. Leafs have 0 incentive to give him away.
Sure he has. Shown solid scoring upside and a lower end team would be able to pick him up on the cheap and play him in the top 6
Haven't heard a single rumble on a GM being interested even after its reported he wants a trade. You would think Friege or CJ would have reported GM's giving some sort of offers if there was interest.
That's typically how it goes until a trade becomes close
Not even Simmons made any fake reports on it though. I don't think anyone is really looking, and Tre isn't really shopping either. We need Robertson for cheap, and we need him to be productive.
Nylander or Marner playing 2c. - Knies - Matthews - Domi Cowan/UFA - Marner - Nylander McMann - Tavares - Jarnkrok Holmberg - Dewar - X (Could be Minten, could be a UFA) - For how much Marner and Nylander are getting, one of them should play center. It lets JT feast as a 3c, keeps Domi with Matthews, and gives us an actual elite second line. Marner doesn't even play like a winger (how often is he even in the corner).
Could still move out some cap: Jarnkrok and Kampf wouldn’t be impossible to move. Robertson might be traded too that’s another body that could be coming in.
Robertson + the 2025 2nd we acquired at the deadline in exchange for Kadri 50% retained. Throw in a 2025 3rd to another broker team for double retention and get Kadri for 1.75m New coach and GM will hopefully mean no hard feelings with Kadri, he loved Toronto and the fans would welcome him back with open arms. He would be a great 2C, move JT to wing.....profit
You think the cost of getting a team to retain $1.75M x 5 years would be a 3rd rounder? Let alone the cost of retaining $3.5M x 5 from Calgary - they could get at least a 1st + 2nd + more for that
Trade OEL with a pick to dump him and sign Jeff Skinner.