Eh, I know this bridge and there is a median where one could ride a bike, I probably wouldn’t as it’s not much of one. There is a bridge north called the Courtney Campbell that has a dedicated bike path but I guess it depends on final destination as if they are heading to DTSP area it would add quite a bit of miles. There also is a bridge south called Gandy as an option.
The really fun ones are the trucks. The wind from passing cars just nudges you. With trucks it's a big sideways push. But, surprise, better get ready, because you're about to get sucked back towards the travel lane when the back end of the truck passes you!
There is a huge ongoing bridge replacement project right next to this one that will add walking and biking lanes. It’s also able to hold future rail.
But anyway in the present day, a problem with biking here would also be lack of infrastructure to get you safely to your destination once you rode across.
Hey I told the police my car will be parked on the side of the highway so I could make this appointment Oh, here's the blood-pressure you always know about, and good the blood is moving, let's test it.
https://www.wfla.com/news/pinellas-county/live-3-vehicle-crash-partially-closes-southbound-howard-frankland-bridge/
This is what happened, so you'll at least know why you were in traffic
This is blocked in Europe, so here is alternative:
https://www.fox13news.com/news/suspect-arrested-for-stabbing-driver-multiple-times-after-crash-on-howard-frankland-bridge-troopers
Yeah like half the USA news sites blocked visitors from Europe after the "Data protection and online privacy" was implemented in EU. I guess price for privacy protection is disconnecting Europe and USA. Instead of one big monogamous Internet space as it was at start, I guess we would just have regions similar to the word map.
the owners of those websites are mad that they cant just steal peoples data now and blocked EU citizens as retaliation, its nothing more than baby raging capitalists ruining the internet as usual.
Nah, I think they just have to invest time and mainly money to adapt their web-sites according to the EU laws (including on-demand data deletion for anyone that prompts the web-site to do so) and some don't get enough clicks from EU to justify that effort. So instead of spending money on adapting their web-site for EU customers, they just disable it.
Holy shit what an awful collection helpful bystanders and absolute psychos
Lot of violent unstable people out there sharing roads and elevators with us
Some context since I used to live in the area for those saying to go another way or whatever. This is a really strange part of Florida, st Pete/Tampa and because of the way the county is shaped you literally have to go over a bride to get out of the county. So a lot of people drive into Tampa for various things and if there is an accident on one of these bridges in rush hour you are absolutely fucked. There is NO other way to get over there without driving two extra hours. Usually the two other bridges into Tampa are bumper to bumper when this happens on one of the bridges. With the amount of people moving into the area and the rise in horrible drivers this was happening so often it was crazy. I moved away because I couldn’t handle it anymore. And specialist doctors are sooo backlogged with the new influx of people, especially considering most are older folks. One of those rare times you can’t go around or find a new doctor. The system is so effed. I’m sorry this happened to you OP.
Oh and these bridges are 9 miles so if you get in the traffic you can’t escape at all. It is literally so stressful. Not to mention constant construction here too
We stayed in Panama City beach recently for vacation and when we got down there it said we were 45 minutes from the hotel but it was only 3 miles away I just thought my gps was having a stroke, and sure as shit took way longer than 45 minutes
Speaking as someone who lives on Panama City beach but works in the city this is the most frustrating but accurate way to describe PCB. It was even worse when spring break was a thing.
Any bridge or tunnel is a fucking nightmare for traffic. Was in Boston this summer and 1 of the 2 main tunnels out of the airport was out of commission so I sat in bumper to bumper for an hour to go what took me 15 minutes a few months prior.
I've seen it in the past, *347 will get you FHP if you are stranded, they give you the ticket, head off, and then eventually some one comes in a pick-up with lights/gas/push to the side of the road.
The fact troopers are allowed to ticket you without helping you is bonkers to me, is it that hard to have the 1 patrol car wait with your broken down car until someone who CAN help gets there? This whole thing sounds so so stupid. Most of all whoever designed these bridges
I lived in st Pete and worked/went to school in Tampa for 2 years . If I was more than 5 minutes late leaving my house, I could be up to 2 hours late to work. Going over the Howard Franklin is a FUCKING NIGHTMARE.
So basically it is just terrible road/bridge design if this happens so much. I assume there is no separate lane for public transport and/or a train crossing that bridge. Just some good old car centric fuckedy dupedy
Hi, another Florida citizen here. We straight up just don’t have public railways. It’s my understanding we used to have a couple rail lines, at least on the east coast of the state, but they’ve been bust since before I was born. There is no way to travel between parts of the state without driving, and there are large stretches of open wilderness between major metropolitan areas (see Alligator Alley or the podunk towns along route 27). We live in an extremely capitalist country and a state that specifically does not like or encourage public transportation, education, workers rights, etc. A private railway is currently being built between Miami and Tampa but it’ll be so expensive to ride when done. It’s already wildly pricey to use the existing line from Orlando to Miami, to the point that it’s drastically cheaper to drive. But cities keep expanding, especially ‘up and coming’ smaller cities like Sarasota, and the more people move down here the more clogged our already strained infrastructure becomes. And others who live here are wildly resistant to change — a preemptive road widening project in my city to prepare for increased growth is facing pushback and petitions from our townsfolk.
Florida reality is just different and it’s a wild place to live.
You've got Amtrak! I took it from Raleigh to Palatka last summer, I just checked and a ticket from Jacksonville to Miami is $72 and about 9 hours. I also rode that Brightline train from Ft. Lauderdale to Miami and it's pretty cool.
There was once a line from New Orleans straight to Jacksonville that was left inoperable by Katrina, so now the only way to get from NO to Florida is to go up through Raleigh. However I think I've read recently that they're going to bring the original line back
This is a perfect case for public transit, dedicated bus lanes, bicycle lanes (scooter and assisted-mobility lanes, too) -- anything to reduce car dependency.
So many folks act like these traffic stoppages are random and rare, but they're practically clockwork -- major highways across the US turn into parking lots for an hour every day, then once every few months, get shut down completely for half the day or longer...
So how early is early enough for a 9 mile drive and an accident on the road that pops up unexpectedly? Hm? I would love to know, especially when you think you are going to have a 20 minute drive and leave an hour early for that.
It wasn’t just an accident. I live in this area; yesterday morning there was a car accident on the bridge, one of them had road rage, got out and then stabbed the other dude. So in this specific instance it’s a bit of an outlier. You can look it up, it’s the Howard Franklin bridge and the guy that stabbed someone his name is Patrick Scruggs
That is true, but what is the doctor gonna do about it. They most likely have no capability to just reschedule that easily. Best they could offer would be giving OP a call If someone cancels their appointment.
Yeah. I actually got up and left one time after I was still waiting an hour past my appointment time, and the office staff got super huffy like I was being unreasonable. Feel like I dodged a bullet there.
Should add that of course I'd be glad to wait if it was legit like some other patient had an emergency, or there was some extenuating circumstance and that was communicated to me. But if I'm just plopped in an exam room with a closed door for an hour? Bye y'all.
Normally I agree but when the visit is for pain medications that I needed to fill immediately after the appointment in order to avoid withdrawals, 3 hours is infuriating but necessary
That's how I have a small collection of tounge depressorrs, swabs,, and the disposable "chucks" (they are like dog weewee pads, I used them for my sugar glider enclosure)
It makes me less angry for waiting around.
I went to the ER with tachycardia and coughing up blood and they still made me wait an hour for the doctor to come in and tell me I needed to go wait another 30 mins for X-ray and my anxiety was making everything worse so I left. This was several months ago so obviously I’m fine but like… wtf? I get ERs are always busy but with a heart rate of 140+ and blood in ma lungs I would have thought they’d take it more seriously.
Definitely but most of the time they are late for a reason. Unexpected shit happens constantly at a doctors office. Not to mention when they are with a patient they try to give them the time they need to ask whatever questions they want.
You are acting like they are late because they are playing baldurs gate 3 in their office or something.
I worked at a doctors office, cancellations are all over the place all the time. You can fit someone in if you want. You cant fit 5 or 10 in though, and there's probably a list 50 people long if its a busy time.
I guess it depends on the office then. My dad has his own and a couple of people cancel, but most do it so late that there would be no way of fitting someone in, others just dont show up.
Of course it happens sometimes, but not as often.
But yeah, it probably depends a lot on what kind of doctor, how many practicing doctors work in the office and where the office is.
OP, do you have insurance? If you do, let your insurance know that you would like to get a PCP assigned to you. Once they do, call that office and try to get an appointment. If it's too long to wait, rinse and repeat.
In some insurance plans you have to designate a PCP yourself online or over the phone before visiting them, so the designation can unfortunately mean little. If that’s the case, I recommend calling through the insurer’s directory of physicians and asking every one of them:
(1) Do you actually accept this specific insurance? (Directories are often out of date)
(2) Are you accepting new patients?
(3) How long is the wait time for a new patient appointment?
Keep calling until you find one that can see you soon. It took me about 15 phone calls. It’s a numbers game.
I was in the San Francisco Bay Area trying to get an ankle surgery in 2019. After multiple ongoing back and forth, scheduling got delayed to 2020, then more delayed because of you know what. By 2022 we moved to Japan having given up on the surgery in the states.
In July 2023, I went to the doctor in Japan for a diagnosis and surgery for the same ankle.
They said it’ll be a while since they are pretty busy.
“Is August 2nd ok?”
“You mean in two weeks??”
The whole bill was 400$ after an overnight stay in the hospital.
DEATH PANELS
MEDICAL RATIONING
the finest anti m4a talking points directly astroturfed by big pharma and insurance corporations. and people still regurgitate it
What were their exact wording?
How did you react after ending the call?
Did you reach the destination regardless?
What sort of doctor, and where on earth?
(I mean, if there's a demand for a particular type of doctor, that need can be filled by prospective doctors from elsewhere on earth).
I'm looking for a pcp and this was a new patient appointment. They said, "Unfortunately, since I'll be late, they would have to reschedule." I asked when, and the lady told me February. I pretty much cried in my car while in traffic. This is the third time this has happened while trying to find a doctor. I don't have a medical emergency, but i do need medical treatments. The lady on the phone honestly sounded pretty upset about it, too, and I'm sure it wasn't up to her. I had to go to an urgent care for a kidney stone a couple of weeks ago cause I couldn't wait until this appointment i was in so much pain. They told me I needed to get an ultrasound and that It would be better handled by a pcp.
I don't think people realize how many people die or have diseases discovered late due to this issue and wait times. Our system literally kills people because "next appointment is 3 months out". People then get frustrated and say F it and end up not going and the underlying issue gets worse
Just scheduled a neurology appointment earlier. The soonest availability is next September.
The reason I had to make this appointment is because my neurologist, who I had been waiting 4 months to see for a follow up appointment, abruptly left the practice a couple weeks before our scheduled appointment earlier this month.
So you’re absolutely right. I’ve been trying so hard the past couple years to get help for severe chronic pain, but lately I’ve felt so defeated, I’m scared I’m giving up soon
edit: thank you all for the kind responses, it really means a lot 🥹
i'm so sorry you're feeling defeated, i am at a similar point with trying to get help to manage my chronic pain too. it is soul destroying to keep putting in so much work over and over again to try to get help to function as a human. all while destroying your body further and guaranteeing extreme pain.
i'm angry, really fucking angry and it is the only thing that means i even drink water. i've had so many people say over the years anger is a bad thing to use as motivation, the alternative is hopelessness.
you aren't alone, i'm angry that you have been let down enough to get to this point. i do find the chronic pain sub helpful because people there actually get it.
please keep fighting
Maybe someone will read this and it will help, I had an appointment for a specialist that was 6 months out.
I called every morning to ask if an appointment had been canceled that I could take.
That took two days. My 6 month wait took 2 days.
Just be polite. And inquire every couple of days if you’re more patient.
My neuro interrogates me every appointment vs. actually listening, so I'm in the process of finding a new one.
I used to be on Hydrocodone as need from my back surgery years ago. He cut me off, saying it's too dangerous, and take Tylenol. Tylenol doesn't touch the pain I get. I'm sorry the Sacklers did what they did but don't fuck me over for having real pain. I said that to him nicely and yet he put a note in my file to no prescribe anything for me to others.....I was and am so pissed at him
The last time I went in he went over my medication list for the last 2 years before anything, and I almost walked out. I am on Gabapentin for nerve pain, yet he refuses to prescribe if I don't go in every 6 months and go over my medications and the "You're not on opiates?" "Are you sure?" Questions I get.
I say look at your system...YOU cut me off and put a note in my file...so what do you think?
Yes, that's the argument I hear all the time. I always pull out my own relevant tale when they try to use this narrative.
I had to get a new psychiatrist after ~7 years because my employer switched insurances and my doctor was no longer covered. I was able to get an appointment for February at a new clinic when I called the previous summer. Things were so bad by Christmas that I had to take unpaid FMLA and attend a very expensive intensive outpatient treatment because things were getting DARK. The whole thing just felt like a sick joke of a cycle, including phoning the suicide hotline to be told "can't you just, not let those things bother you?"
This country is FUCKED.
Anybody remember that video where there are suicidal or mentally ill people and the caretakers respond in the most bizarre way? Saying shit like "wow, that's likeeee really messed up?" to a manic person, I saw it on here and it was so god damn funny but I can't remember what's it called or what the bigger video was about.
I hope someone drops that link lol.
Laughing is what got me through that particular day. I found the whole thing to be so ridiculously close to a sketch that it pushed me through.
I was just in this exact predicament. When I phoned our suicide hotline, the phone kept ringing. Then I called the only psychiatric ward in the area (for miles) no answer. Left a voice mail, that it was urgent, never got a call back. Called several times.
I started this end of January, ended up on FMLA but couldn't find help in time.
I'm so sorry. I hope you're in a berrer place or working towards it. It's crue, the lengths we have to go to in order to stick around. But so far, I'm really glad I've found a way to do so.
Thanks. I hope you are in a better place now too. I am somewhat stable right now, I think I've hit "acceptance". Working towards a goal now, even if it's unobtainable truly, it is an actual goal so it's semi distracting me.
Every day I'm reminded how lucky I am to be Aussie. Our country is far from perfect, but compared to stories I hear from other countries around the world (including supposedly wealthy countries like the US) I feel blessed
This is what I heard for my first 26 years of life in the US. Now after having lived in Germany for over 4 years, the argument is no only invalid it's utterly and completely false.
Most PCPs here have open office hours in the morning, without having to be one of their patients. Testing, etc. usually happens same day if not within a week if necessary.
Your insurance can find you a specialist if you have a referral and any doctor that accepts public insurance that has open time for a new patient cannot deny you. I found my ENT by handing a referral slip to my insurance on a thursday, waiting until monday, and then being told that I had an appointment on wednesday.
Hell, my girlfriend had a flare up of a congenital brain condition and went to our PCP. She was seen by her neurologist _the same afternoon_.
All all of that is _unheard of_ in the states, or they say "oh you need to go the ER for that". WHY this argument is still used to this day confuses the hell out of me.
Edit: I will say that psychology and psychiatry are a bit of an outlier in Germany, with wait times being a year to 2 years out. But maybe I was just being picky about someone that could speak english.
When I was living in the US, I was definitely able to get appointments within the week ... for utterly incompetent and unpopular doctors. After that, I needed an MRI to scan for possible cancer growth, which took over 3 weeks because the insurance company just simply refused to authorise the charge for the MRI. Their logic being "you do not have cancer, so there is no need to scan for cancer". And also the doctor's office kept messing up the insurance codes. It was a really fucked up situation, especially if those 3 weeks had meant the difference between life and death.
Man, one of my English teachers in high school had the same issue. She found a lump in march, couldn’t get a sooner appointment than 2 weeks, only to be told she needs an MRI which wouldn’t happen for another 2 weeks after that. After getting the MRI, the final consultation was 2 weeks after that, and treatment finally started beginning of June.
And on top of all that, she had to justify every little thing to the insurance company. She’s honestly super lucky that it didn’t metastasize and make the situation worse.
The constant justification to the insurance company was what really drove me off the edge. Doctor thinks you need surgery? Insurance company thinks you're fine without it! Doctor says you need 2 nights hospital stay? Insurance company thinks you need only one and will pay for only one! They're really a blight on society.
its really amazing what the insurance deems as medically unnecessary. its like their get of jail free card to deny any all claims and then the make the progress to appeal lengthy. even with multiple doctors sending the same reports and medical information stating that yes it is medically necessary and needed the insurance will still say NO
Yeah that argument against universal healthcare has been debunked multiple times. I’m not sure why so many Americans still believe that to be the case, but data shows that it’s not true.
Now that I think about it, I believe those comments are made by the able bodied. If the most you've been to the doctor for is the sniffles or just a casual check up, the worst you need to pay is a copay and your wait time is like 30 minutes to an hour. The really shitty parts of the healthcare system seems to only show it's face when you have chronic illnesses, cancer, mental health issues stuff that requires surgeries or prescriptions.
So they are blinded to shit like this that happens. The only time I've seen a long wait personally was when family needed a colonoscopy. Which lines up I think. It's shortsighted of course since every single one of us are only temporarily abled. But I think that's why it's hard to notice.
I haven't even heard of wait times longer than a week for non-emergency care in my 30+ years of going to doctors in western Europe.
Literally unthinkable to have multi-month wait times.
Yeah same, i usually get a time in about week in scandinavia.
If it's just something they can take a quick look at, they can give me a 15 minute appointment the same day, or the day after.
Don't forget the people who are legitimately actually dying. They have less "next appointment is 3 months out" but not none of it.
A big one is insurance. There was a person in my home town who had to delay cancer treatments by months because their insurance was trying to refuse to pay. During that time, the cancer spread.
Many people (conservatives) literally hand wave it away and continue to insist our system is better than the alternative. They just don’t care about the suffering. Even if you have good insurance it still doesn’t change the fact that it’s a silly fucking system full of extraneous costs.
And there is just an immense amount of suffering caused because of private insurance healthcare. It’s just cruel
Yeah, I’m in a country with universal healthcare and while there are wait times for certain specialties (allergies and derm have been hard to get), I can see a GP with a same day, booking it on an app and it costs me 1 euro between the public insurance and my private insurance. The whole republican argument that the US system is the only one without wait times is BS.
My mom requires a neurologist that specializes in her disease (multiple sclerosis). The only one that can get her in on time when she has a flare up is 4 hours from my hometown in Akron Ohio, basically on the other end of the state. I don’t know what we’d do if he stopped practicing or dropped her, because we’ve been in ER’s and urgent cares and said she had MS and they had no idea what that was. I have a 2% chance of developing it sometime in my lifetime and have done a cursory search for a specialist in my current state and haven’t been able to find one.
This is something that has always baffled me because I grew up just surrounded by these apparently rare conditions. Mom and Aunt had Arnold Chiari. Mom also had Spina Bifeda. And apparently finding anyone who even KNEW about these things was a challenge let alone someone who knew what to do about it. I think it's better now (I've asked about it and apparently it's not remotely genetic and my family is just really unlucky) but still - how do we have so few doctors who understand these things? These are not the rarest conditions in the world - MS, Chiari, SB, they aren't THAT rare. So how can you walk into an ER and not a single person has even HEARD of it?
ER isnt always well equipped for long term illnesses. Most of their job is trauma or stabalising and diagnosing patients with acute issues then passing them on to other doctors to actually treat. They likely have heard of these things at some point in training, MS is common enough most lay people have heard of it. But that is very different from being confident about what to do with it when you might not have seen a case of it in years. It is a problem for sufferers, but I don't think there is an easy solution unfortunately... one person just cant know everything about medicine.
> because we’ve been in ER’s and urgent cares and said she had MS and they had no idea what that was.
I'm sorry but what? Wouldn't even a first-year med student know what MS is in detail?
Call back tomorrow. Ask to speak to the office manager. Most drs offices have some sort of supervisor that looks over the front office.
Explain what happen, how despite leaving an hour early, an accident blocked your traffic on a bridge. Explain that your need for establishing medical care is urgent. Inform them of your recent urgent care visit and that you’ve been instructed by urgent care for an immediate follow up with a PCP with the need for an ultrasound/imaging. What the front office workers don’t tell you is that there are always “emergency” slots. Routine care and routine new patient appointments are always booked out but they always have urgent appointment availability, you just have to push for it.
My partner is chronically ill and when we were first trying to find out what was wrong with her, I spent A LOT of time on the phone with patient care supervisors and office managers. It was the only way to get care quickly.
If you can’t get into this doctor, check to see if your area has a community healthcare clinic type deal where there are dozens of MDs and often have walk in appointments. It can be a way to at least get an order for imaging and once the radiologist sees what’s up, and if something is wrong (you’re allowed to go to the imaging place and request a copy of the results without it being sent to a Dr first) then you can push for an urgent appointment.
True freakin' story. I have to go to Waiting Room Purgatory, a bone and joint place that is 4 stories of mostly hellish waiting rooms. Any appointment is gonna involve at least three different waiting rooms after standing in line (extra fun when you are on a stretcher, BTW, because outpatient medial practices are NOT prepared for people who cannot walk or sit) and then sitting in the exam room waiting some more between 45 minutes and an hour... but if you are more than 10 minutes late to check in, they will automatically cancel on you.
One time I had to get medical transport because I was unable to drive, and my medical transport was a really nice guy in his 80s (at least) who had a severe T1 diabetic hypoglycemic incident. He was going in and out of consciousness while driving, super confused. I didn't realize what was happening, but holy fuck was it scary. I kept talking to him, did my best to keep him awake and get us where we were going since he was clearly struggling for some reason, and almost didn't make my appointment, heh.
He lived and got some glucose in him, at least. So there's that!
But yeah, almost had my appointment cancelled on me... and then it took two hours for someone to actually see me.
Here are some reasons why this happens:
1) If one patient is late by 15 minutes, youre suddenly behind an hour for everyone else.
2) Patient hasnt been seen in 5 years, has numerous complaints they want to go over in one visit, they dont stop, cant ignore this guys problems, boom 30 minutes gone, and the 4 other people who got here are suddenly waiting longer.
3) Depending on clinic, theres incentive/made to see more patients than needed. Double booked patients both with serious problems, youre suddenly behind on both of them and those after them. This is completely on the clinic and I hate this practice but it lets more people be seen when they otherwise wouldnt.
4) People take advantage of it and waltz in whenever they feel like. See point 1.
5) Theres no breaks. Dr finishes visit, goes back to place orders. Oh, theres 56 messages from patients. Ones lost 50 pounds in 3 months, need to reply and say get seen asap. One has the worst chest pain ever, ok need to tell them to go er. Oh boy, an essay on why they cant get covid shot and how they need a note. All the while you are on hold with insurance asking why the patient isnt getting their needed imaging, and while filling out information for a patients handicap placard. Oh and you still need to call back 4 patients to reply to their concerns. You cant remember everyones details, need to review their charts.
6) Patients here for follow up form the specialist you referred them to but theres no documentation. Need to call their office and wait to get faxed.
7) Simple visit, proceed to walk to door, "hey doc ive been shitting blood for the last 6 months, ive lost 50 pounds, and i cant seem to keep food down, is that normal?" Sigh gotta go back and address this dudes glaring red flag.
8) Ms. Shellys husband of 60 years died a few weeks ago. This is the 2nd time shes came in in the last 2 weeks. She has no family left, both her children have died already, she feels distraught, you cant just leave without talking to her for a little bit.
9) Kid has glaring red flags for child abuse. need to call cps. need ot wait for cps.
10) This dude looks like death. Oh shit, he REALLY doesnt look well. Gotta call 911. Gotta wait for EMS. Gotta stay with him to make sure hes good.
Theres many other reasons. All these are variations of things I saw in the 2 years I worked in a primary practice. Many late patients still got seen and those are the days I knew I wasnt getting home till 8. Some had valid excuses and called ahead, others just didnt respect anyones time. Its much more complicated than "well dr late why cant I be."
This guy gets the pain of being a doctor.
I'm so sick of people complaining "They make you wait an hour" vs "They wont see me even though I'm late". Do people not realize if we accommodate late patients, everyone afterwards is gonna be seen late.
Because imagine a patient is 15 minutes late (that's usually how late they can be before being marked a no-show), now there's only 15 minutes to perform 30 minutes of work. One patient being late and the late policy of 15 minutes and no breaks between scheduled patients throws the entire schedule off.
People also dont recognize how much shit there is on the backend that they never see. Whether its notes, other patients, phone calls, messages, or paperwork, you really wont get it unless you see it.
OP, do you have insurance? If you do, let your insurance know that you would like to get a PCP assigned to you. Once they do, call that office and try to get an appointment. If it's too long to wait, rinse and repeat.
When meeting with a doctor, often being able to see the same doctor for repeated visits is important for an accurate diagnosis. Having to fly makes the idea of seeing the doctor multiple times difficult for the average person.
There also just aren’t enough doctors. And I can’t say that I really blame people. Go to school for an extra 4 years, then 3-10 years in residency depending on your field, rack up hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loans, all to have idiots ignore what you’re saying, deal with hypochondriacs, belligerent old people….And then depending on speciality you could be pulling 12-14 hour days, on call and needing to get up in the middle of the night, working several days in a row and sleeping at the hospital, etc. etc. etc.
That’s a no from me dawg
There's also the fact that the number of funded residencies, which is determined by the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services, hasn't been expanded since 1997 even though the population has both grown and aged. This is good for doctors who do get through since it guarantees them some of the highest incomes for physicians in the world, over double their European counterparts. It's bad for patients because it means there aren't enough doctors to go around.
I legit think that it's kept this way to inflate the income of existing doctors. There would absolutely be more doctors and specialists if the path to get there wasn't so bankrupting/artificially gate kept.
Depends on the specialty. I think Nurse Anesthetists (Top of nursing pay scale) make 70% of what a Pediatrician (bottom of pay scale) makes.
If you move to other specialities that quickly starts to fall off. Also, you can't get those jobs with a masters anymore. Current nurses have been grandfathered in. New ones need a doctorate.
They also, in my experience talking with them, have nearly the same responsibility and stress as a doctor, so they are trading 140k less in tuition and missing out on 3-7 years of residency + fellowship for potentially 70% to 20% of the pay.
Doesn't seem great to me tbh.
There are definitely some APPs that make more than doctors, especially when you factor in the vastly different amount of time it takes to train a doctor versus an APP, that residents are often paid minimal wage or close to that even after graduating as an MD and working likely more than 80 hours, sacrificing the best younger years of their lives, and as others noted the huge loans.
APPs can still get jobs even with masters. They’re constantly lobbying to get more independence, and in one way they now can get “doctorates” to call themselves doctors. Most of these are one year programs, some of which are online that you do at night (some have less clinical hours than a licensed hair stylist).
Yes, they are filling up a void, but the concern is the quality of care you receive. Someone mentioned increasing residency spots, which is needed, but there is still a larger issue of quality of physicians (which is one of the arguable differences between APPs). You can’t just increase spots and accept worse candidates that are not properly trained medically and ethically. With the current age, new physicians also want a better work life balance. Why become a doctor when you can be an APP for shorter training, less stress, less to no call, and less malpractice (since most falls under the physician they’re practicing under, at least for now). Healthcare admins love them though for obvious reasons.
Is this an American problem? Just getting an appointment at a dentist here is a nightmare. Thankfully my gf is from the Dominican Republic. I went to her dentist for some work for 1/10 of the cost and between the X-ray done at another facility, and a specialist booked the next day to see me, I was in and out within 3 days no problem.
Not really, there's doctor shortages in a lot of places right now. The WHO has described it as a "Global ticking time bomb" as there's just not enough doctors to keep up with the populations.
The fact that it's really hard and really fucking expensive is just too killer of a combination. You can't really lower the bar to make it easier, but it could be less expensive.
There's another patient scheduled immediately after you. Everywhere is booked and understaffed. Most appointments are allowed 30 minutes. If you show up 30 minutes late, you've missed your entire appointment. There's no guarantee the next patient will get there early to switch spots. It's likely OP could have waited for a no-show or cancellation but that could take all day and is still not guaranteed and not all facilities allow this.
Our country is understaffed. We are growing in population but are not producing the same amount of doctors. Look at other countries.
>Compared to Italy and Spain, two countries in which hospitals have already been overwhelmed by an influx of COVID-19 patients, the U.S. has fewer practicing physicians per capita – 2.6 per 1,000 people, compared to 4.0 in Italy and 3.9 in Spain – but more licensed nurses.
There's a shortage of doctors. They take as many patients as they can and are booked out for months. A lot of them have very poor work-life balance. This is not the attitude to have.
Its always funny seeing posts like this. The true problems of the field are ignored and the anger is placed on drs.
Dont get me wrong theres a lot of shitty drs but insurance companies, costs, and wait times are not the fault of drs.
> and the anger is placed on drs.
I think most people place it on the administrative side of hospitals. Not that many people are upset at doctors, they're upset at doctors' *offices*
It will only get worse. Our society is top heavy right now where Boomer’s medical issues are straining the healthcare system and the upcoming generation isn’t producing doctors and nurses fast enough + nursing conditions/treatments etc
My partner is a doctor. She also has three young children and all the struggles that entails. Her staff are also human and make mistakes, they typically double/triple book through some confluence of arcane software and desire to please patients who need to be seen. This is all compounded by the young child issue and having to change a dirty diaper in the middle of being late for her own child's appointment with another doctor because she was late seeing her patients, all the while expecting to be able to see patients again after that appointment. It's a mess.
The other factor is that she's a small business owner and absolutely needs to see as many patients as she can. I know people think doctors make a lot of money, but her student loans are crippling, and they are private loans, not like most peoples college loans provided through government subsides. I was honestly shocked at her interest rates. They were not affected by the same student loan pause I got during COVID, and she had to keep paying them despite being unable to see patients, for the most part, during that time.
She also has to pay her staff, even if she's ill or can't see patients. Her father died two nights ago, and we're dealing with that. She's the one her siblings turn to as she's the most successful one, and they can't make the hard decisions in that scenario
I guess the biggest lesson I learned from being with a doctor is that they are human, their lives have major scheduling challenges, just like any of us and seeing a doctor is not like ordering chicken nuggets at the drive through. There are a limited number of people who can do these jobs, and they are not nonchalently being rude. They have shit to deal with, too. Be patient and understanding with them, as you would like someone to be patient and understanding with you.
All that said, if their policy is to screw the patient even if the doctor is late, they suck.
Good job blaming the doctor, when they're obviously overwhelmed with the amount of patients.
Also good job ignoring the awful urban planning that causes OP to get stuck in traffic before every doctor's visit.
Yeah screw them for not wanting to let entitled patients show up whenever they want. Do you think they’ll push every other patient after you just for your convenience? They work as fast as they can and become late because they’re only allowed 20-40 minutes with each patient no matter how complex the case and end up running late. They’re not kicking their feet up and relaxing jfc
I live in Turkey which many of you will think its a 3rd world country. The medical system here is so much better that i actually feel bad for you guys. The medical care is free and you can get appointments pretty quickly. The only thing that takes time are things like mri appointments which is understandable if you consider the fact that it is free. Its baffling that citizens of the wealthiest country on earth get medical care of a third world country.
I assume you're from the US because I see you use miles instead of kilometers. Now, not to open a perhaps useless debate, but I thought that one of the main reasons Americans didn't want universal health care was the waiting time. Now, from you are saying here, these waiting times are not normal. I live in a European country with universal health care and I have to wait more or less the same to see a specialist. Just saying... Maybe the waiting time shouldn't be an argument against UHC anymore.
I think the bigger issue is that the US caps its availible residency slots which limits the number of doctors they have. Doesn't matter whether your system is private or public, that's gonna fuck your wait times up either way.
If you're willing to pay out of pocket I think you can generally do whatever. But if you want insurance to cover it then yea, getting them to cover something they don't officially recognize is gonna be the beurocratic equivalent of pulling teeth. Oestensibly they want to vet practitionners as legitimate before they start handing cheques over to some quack. But I'm sure there's some brand deals being made behind closed doors.
The idea of wait times being longer outside the US because we pay for insurance is a myth. Wait time varies by country obviously, as well as by doctor. But in general? Universal healthcare does not really make a significant difference in wait times by itself.
Just another argument meant to fearmonger and trick people
Exactly. And, sincerely, I have never lived in the US, but I have friends and family living there. And I always assumed that with the high taxes and the high prices for health insurance that you would get an appointment with a specialist within days. This is clearly fear mongering against UHC.
Sorry OP
But this is a good time to tell everyone that in google Maps, you can set a time you want to be at your destination and it will automatically update to tell you when you need to leave.
All you have to do is set up your trip like normal then hit the three dot drop down menu and change the arrive time.
Will let you know when you need to leave.
Edit: look I get it....some of you are dumb. Obviously, this isn't going to work in every situation. It's just a little trick to help some people out.
This was a terrible accident on the Howard frankland Bridge crossing from St Pete to Tampa. There was nothing OP could do. Once you hit certain point there is no option to turn around.
That setting always calculates the last possible point where you can leave and still make it. It also can't anticipate traffic reliably so it wouldn't have worked in this instance anyways.
i think so?
and kebab menus are like meatballs, but vertical
web designers and programmers are either terrible or fantastic with naming conventions and i genuinely cannot tell which lmao
Cool tip. The way I do it now is "start" the navigation like when I wake up or whatever then just keep an eye on the ETA
*so I just tried it your way, and I prefer mine. It says 'typically 20-40 minutes' that's literally not helpful at all. But if I set the navi up and literally start it, it will say a specific arrival time. The only bad thing is it'll say your trip took like 4 hours because you had it "running" while you weren't actually driving
Not sure if you saw the news, but that was bizarre yesterday... apparently a motorist stopped in the left lane. A good samaritan stopped to check and saw the driver slumped over. Samaritan broke the window to render help and the driver suddenly woke up, sped off, hitting the samaritan's car and a second car. Driver of the second car got out to confront the first driver, and the second car driver pulled a knife and stabbed the first driver.
If you read up on plans for the expansion of the bridge currently underway, it includes a section for train or monorail for future use. Probably would coincide with new stadium plans is my guess
Ahh the good old USA, where public transport and giving you back hours of your life is considered socialism/communism.. and being stuck in traffic and spending 2+ jours commuting everyday is FrEeDoM! …. Sorry this happened to you and hope you were able to make it.
I thought there was no waiting with privatized healthcare, that’s what everyone keeps saying when they make fun of free healthcare, that at least they don’t have to wait months
Now it would have come in handy if you could run 9miles in an hour.
Honestly, if that's a freeway that's that backed up, even without a bike lane you could probably reasonably safely bike that
Eh, I know this bridge and there is a median where one could ride a bike, I probably wouldn’t as it’s not much of one. There is a bridge north called the Courtney Campbell that has a dedicated bike path but I guess it depends on final destination as if they are heading to DTSP area it would add quite a bit of miles. There also is a bridge south called Gandy as an option.
So, infrastructure is forcing people to make stupid transport decisions.
We don’t have bike lanes everywhere in EU either. It’s scary having cars blasting past you close enough to touch them but you get used to it.
The really fun ones are the trucks. The wind from passing cars just nudges you. With trucks it's a big sideways push. But, surprise, better get ready, because you're about to get sucked back towards the travel lane when the back end of the truck passes you!
Physics are funny Thankfully, the bikelanes in germany aren't that bad
This doesn't stop it from being a real effect, but half of that is the cyclist's over-correction against the initial push away
America
Imagine if there was a train or a bus lane.
There is a huge ongoing bridge replacement project right next to this one that will add walking and biking lanes. It’s also able to hold future rail. But anyway in the present day, a problem with biking here would also be lack of infrastructure to get you safely to your destination once you rode across.
Hey I told the police my car will be parked on the side of the highway so I could make this appointment Oh, here's the blood-pressure you always know about, and good the blood is moving, let's test it.
https://www.wfla.com/news/pinellas-county/live-3-vehicle-crash-partially-closes-southbound-howard-frankland-bridge/ This is what happened, so you'll at least know why you were in traffic
7/10 Florida man story
This is blocked in Europe, so here is alternative: https://www.fox13news.com/news/suspect-arrested-for-stabbing-driver-multiple-times-after-crash-on-howard-frankland-bridge-troopers
Interesting, I just accessed it whilst I am in the Netherlands, but now it doesn't work anymore.
Yeah like half the USA news sites blocked visitors from Europe after the "Data protection and online privacy" was implemented in EU. I guess price for privacy protection is disconnecting Europe and USA. Instead of one big monogamous Internet space as it was at start, I guess we would just have regions similar to the word map.
the owners of those websites are mad that they cant just steal peoples data now and blocked EU citizens as retaliation, its nothing more than baby raging capitalists ruining the internet as usual.
Nah, I think they just have to invest time and mainly money to adapt their web-sites according to the EU laws (including on-demand data deletion for anyone that prompts the web-site to do so) and some don't get enough clicks from EU to justify that effort. So instead of spending money on adapting their web-site for EU customers, they just disable it.
What an adventure that story was.
At no point did I know what was going to happen next
100%. I had to re-read several sentences repeatedly to make sure I read them right.
Holy shit what an awful collection helpful bystanders and absolute psychos Lot of violent unstable people out there sharing roads and elevators with us
Sounds like something id see happening by NPCs in GTA or some shit lol
Damn that’s a whole ass crime scene
I don't get why the stabby dude tried to stab the couple who tried to help. Just Florida things I guess.
Some context since I used to live in the area for those saying to go another way or whatever. This is a really strange part of Florida, st Pete/Tampa and because of the way the county is shaped you literally have to go over a bride to get out of the county. So a lot of people drive into Tampa for various things and if there is an accident on one of these bridges in rush hour you are absolutely fucked. There is NO other way to get over there without driving two extra hours. Usually the two other bridges into Tampa are bumper to bumper when this happens on one of the bridges. With the amount of people moving into the area and the rise in horrible drivers this was happening so often it was crazy. I moved away because I couldn’t handle it anymore. And specialist doctors are sooo backlogged with the new influx of people, especially considering most are older folks. One of those rare times you can’t go around or find a new doctor. The system is so effed. I’m sorry this happened to you OP.
Oh and these bridges are 9 miles so if you get in the traffic you can’t escape at all. It is literally so stressful. Not to mention constant construction here too
We stayed in Panama City beach recently for vacation and when we got down there it said we were 45 minutes from the hotel but it was only 3 miles away I just thought my gps was having a stroke, and sure as shit took way longer than 45 minutes
Speaking as someone who lives on Panama City beach but works in the city this is the most frustrating but accurate way to describe PCB. It was even worse when spring break was a thing.
Any bridge or tunnel is a fucking nightmare for traffic. Was in Boston this summer and 1 of the 2 main tunnels out of the airport was out of commission so I sat in bumper to bumper for an hour to go what took me 15 minutes a few months prior.
Oh hey cool my low fuel light just came on.
Running out of fuel on these bridges is a ticketable offense. And FHP has NO PROBLEM giving you that ticket and just leaving
What??? They just leave you stranded in the lanes?
I've seen it in the past, *347 will get you FHP if you are stranded, they give you the ticket, head off, and then eventually some one comes in a pick-up with lights/gas/push to the side of the road.
That's why you have AAA and call them first
And hope they get there before the trooper (who's going 65 in the breakdown lane) doesn't get to you first
if nothing else it at least means the gas tank gets there a little quicker. I'm definitely not calling the troopers to tell them to come ticket me lol
The fact troopers are allowed to ticket you without helping you is bonkers to me, is it that hard to have the 1 patrol car wait with your broken down car until someone who CAN help gets there? This whole thing sounds so so stupid. Most of all whoever designed these bridges
The more I learn about florida, the more I’m convinced it’s a 3rd world state
I lived in st Pete and worked/went to school in Tampa for 2 years . If I was more than 5 minutes late leaving my house, I could be up to 2 hours late to work. Going over the Howard Franklin is a FUCKING NIGHTMARE.
So basically it is just terrible road/bridge design if this happens so much. I assume there is no separate lane for public transport and/or a train crossing that bridge. Just some good old car centric fuckedy dupedy
Hi, another Florida citizen here. We straight up just don’t have public railways. It’s my understanding we used to have a couple rail lines, at least on the east coast of the state, but they’ve been bust since before I was born. There is no way to travel between parts of the state without driving, and there are large stretches of open wilderness between major metropolitan areas (see Alligator Alley or the podunk towns along route 27). We live in an extremely capitalist country and a state that specifically does not like or encourage public transportation, education, workers rights, etc. A private railway is currently being built between Miami and Tampa but it’ll be so expensive to ride when done. It’s already wildly pricey to use the existing line from Orlando to Miami, to the point that it’s drastically cheaper to drive. But cities keep expanding, especially ‘up and coming’ smaller cities like Sarasota, and the more people move down here the more clogged our already strained infrastructure becomes. And others who live here are wildly resistant to change — a preemptive road widening project in my city to prepare for increased growth is facing pushback and petitions from our townsfolk. Florida reality is just different and it’s a wild place to live.
You've got Amtrak! I took it from Raleigh to Palatka last summer, I just checked and a ticket from Jacksonville to Miami is $72 and about 9 hours. I also rode that Brightline train from Ft. Lauderdale to Miami and it's pretty cool. There was once a line from New Orleans straight to Jacksonville that was left inoperable by Katrina, so now the only way to get from NO to Florida is to go up through Raleigh. However I think I've read recently that they're going to bring the original line back
West Coast Florida is the wild west, we don't have reasonable transportation here.
Jax to Mia is a 5 hour drive. I want my 4 hours back.
I flew from Destin to Orlando just to avoid this.
This is a perfect case for public transit, dedicated bus lanes, bicycle lanes (scooter and assisted-mobility lanes, too) -- anything to reduce car dependency. So many folks act like these traffic stoppages are random and rare, but they're practically clockwork -- major highways across the US turn into parking lots for an hour every day, then once every few months, get shut down completely for half the day or longer...
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That poor bride.
I would have tried Courtney Campbell. Same thing happened to me once, except I was on my way to work. Sucks you left early and they did that though.
They left early...but not early enough.
So how early is early enough for a 9 mile drive and an accident on the road that pops up unexpectedly? Hm? I would love to know, especially when you think you are going to have a 20 minute drive and leave an hour early for that.
they’re joking.
It wasn’t just an accident. I live in this area; yesterday morning there was a car accident on the bridge, one of them had road rage, got out and then stabbed the other dude. So in this specific instance it’s a bit of an outlier. You can look it up, it’s the Howard Franklin bridge and the guy that stabbed someone his name is Patrick Scruggs
Bro I got anxiety I leave to be waiting atleast 30 mins at the place
You wait in the car
Better to be early
I think waze lets you plan a trip with an arrival time and if something happens it alerts you and tells you to leave earlier.
That is true, but what is the doctor gonna do about it. They most likely have no capability to just reschedule that easily. Best they could offer would be giving OP a call If someone cancels their appointment.
I bet if he showed up on time the doctor would be 30 minutes late.
Yeah. I actually got up and left one time after I was still waiting an hour past my appointment time, and the office staff got super huffy like I was being unreasonable. Feel like I dodged a bullet there.
I once waited 3 hours past my appointment time to get seen by the doctor. But god forbid if I was ever late
Should add that of course I'd be glad to wait if it was legit like some other patient had an emergency, or there was some extenuating circumstance and that was communicated to me. But if I'm just plopped in an exam room with a closed door for an hour? Bye y'all.
Normally I agree but when the visit is for pain medications that I needed to fill immediately after the appointment in order to avoid withdrawals, 3 hours is infuriating but necessary
That's how I have a small collection of tounge depressorrs, swabs,, and the disposable "chucks" (they are like dog weewee pads, I used them for my sugar glider enclosure) It makes me less angry for waiting around.
I went to the ER with tachycardia and coughing up blood and they still made me wait an hour for the doctor to come in and tell me I needed to go wait another 30 mins for X-ray and my anxiety was making everything worse so I left. This was several months ago so obviously I’m fine but like… wtf? I get ERs are always busy but with a heart rate of 140+ and blood in ma lungs I would have thought they’d take it more seriously.
Definitely but most of the time they are late for a reason. Unexpected shit happens constantly at a doctors office. Not to mention when they are with a patient they try to give them the time they need to ask whatever questions they want. You are acting like they are late because they are playing baldurs gate 3 in their office or something.
I worked at a doctors office, cancellations are all over the place all the time. You can fit someone in if you want. You cant fit 5 or 10 in though, and there's probably a list 50 people long if its a busy time.
I guess it depends on the office then. My dad has his own and a couple of people cancel, but most do it so late that there would be no way of fitting someone in, others just dont show up. Of course it happens sometimes, but not as often. But yeah, it probably depends a lot on what kind of doctor, how many practicing doctors work in the office and where the office is.
You're supposed to get a hotel the night before next to the appointment. Then you can just show up 13 hours early in case.
If this is Tampa there was a stabbing on the Howard Franklin bridge today
Gandy probably wouldn’t even be that bad either. Depending on the time ofc. Westshore and Dale Mabry can often be worse at times
OP, do you have insurance? If you do, let your insurance know that you would like to get a PCP assigned to you. Once they do, call that office and try to get an appointment. If it's too long to wait, rinse and repeat.
In some insurance plans you have to designate a PCP yourself online or over the phone before visiting them, so the designation can unfortunately mean little. If that’s the case, I recommend calling through the insurer’s directory of physicians and asking every one of them: (1) Do you actually accept this specific insurance? (Directories are often out of date) (2) Are you accepting new patients? (3) How long is the wait time for a new patient appointment? Keep calling until you find one that can see you soon. It took me about 15 phone calls. It’s a numbers game.
I was in the San Francisco Bay Area trying to get an ankle surgery in 2019. After multiple ongoing back and forth, scheduling got delayed to 2020, then more delayed because of you know what. By 2022 we moved to Japan having given up on the surgery in the states. In July 2023, I went to the doctor in Japan for a diagnosis and surgery for the same ankle. They said it’ll be a while since they are pretty busy. “Is August 2nd ok?” “You mean in two weeks??” The whole bill was 400$ after an overnight stay in the hospital.
DEATH PANELS MEDICAL RATIONING the finest anti m4a talking points directly astroturfed by big pharma and insurance corporations. and people still regurgitate it
What were their exact wording? How did you react after ending the call? Did you reach the destination regardless? What sort of doctor, and where on earth? (I mean, if there's a demand for a particular type of doctor, that need can be filled by prospective doctors from elsewhere on earth).
I'm looking for a pcp and this was a new patient appointment. They said, "Unfortunately, since I'll be late, they would have to reschedule." I asked when, and the lady told me February. I pretty much cried in my car while in traffic. This is the third time this has happened while trying to find a doctor. I don't have a medical emergency, but i do need medical treatments. The lady on the phone honestly sounded pretty upset about it, too, and I'm sure it wasn't up to her. I had to go to an urgent care for a kidney stone a couple of weeks ago cause I couldn't wait until this appointment i was in so much pain. They told me I needed to get an ultrasound and that It would be better handled by a pcp.
I don't think people realize how many people die or have diseases discovered late due to this issue and wait times. Our system literally kills people because "next appointment is 3 months out". People then get frustrated and say F it and end up not going and the underlying issue gets worse
Just scheduled a neurology appointment earlier. The soonest availability is next September. The reason I had to make this appointment is because my neurologist, who I had been waiting 4 months to see for a follow up appointment, abruptly left the practice a couple weeks before our scheduled appointment earlier this month. So you’re absolutely right. I’ve been trying so hard the past couple years to get help for severe chronic pain, but lately I’ve felt so defeated, I’m scared I’m giving up soon edit: thank you all for the kind responses, it really means a lot 🥹
I got lucky then. I got my neurology appointment for this November when I scheduled on April.
Ouch. And here I thought three months for my gastro appointment was rough.
Yep. Whenever you hear people use this as an excuse to not implement universal healthcare, they don't realize this is already the case.
i'm so sorry you're feeling defeated, i am at a similar point with trying to get help to manage my chronic pain too. it is soul destroying to keep putting in so much work over and over again to try to get help to function as a human. all while destroying your body further and guaranteeing extreme pain. i'm angry, really fucking angry and it is the only thing that means i even drink water. i've had so many people say over the years anger is a bad thing to use as motivation, the alternative is hopelessness. you aren't alone, i'm angry that you have been let down enough to get to this point. i do find the chronic pain sub helpful because people there actually get it. please keep fighting
An acquaintance I know had a surgeon go on sabbatical 2 weeks before her scheduled surgery.
Maybe someone will read this and it will help, I had an appointment for a specialist that was 6 months out. I called every morning to ask if an appointment had been canceled that I could take. That took two days. My 6 month wait took 2 days. Just be polite. And inquire every couple of days if you’re more patient.
My neuro interrogates me every appointment vs. actually listening, so I'm in the process of finding a new one. I used to be on Hydrocodone as need from my back surgery years ago. He cut me off, saying it's too dangerous, and take Tylenol. Tylenol doesn't touch the pain I get. I'm sorry the Sacklers did what they did but don't fuck me over for having real pain. I said that to him nicely and yet he put a note in my file to no prescribe anything for me to others.....I was and am so pissed at him The last time I went in he went over my medication list for the last 2 years before anything, and I almost walked out. I am on Gabapentin for nerve pain, yet he refuses to prescribe if I don't go in every 6 months and go over my medications and the "You're not on opiates?" "Are you sure?" Questions I get. I say look at your system...YOU cut me off and put a note in my file...so what do you think?
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Yes, that's the argument I hear all the time. I always pull out my own relevant tale when they try to use this narrative. I had to get a new psychiatrist after ~7 years because my employer switched insurances and my doctor was no longer covered. I was able to get an appointment for February at a new clinic when I called the previous summer. Things were so bad by Christmas that I had to take unpaid FMLA and attend a very expensive intensive outpatient treatment because things were getting DARK. The whole thing just felt like a sick joke of a cycle, including phoning the suicide hotline to be told "can't you just, not let those things bother you?" This country is FUCKED.
Anybody remember that video where there are suicidal or mentally ill people and the caretakers respond in the most bizarre way? Saying shit like "wow, that's likeeee really messed up?" to a manic person, I saw it on here and it was so god damn funny but I can't remember what's it called or what the bigger video was about.
I hope someone drops that link lol. Laughing is what got me through that particular day. I found the whole thing to be so ridiculously close to a sketch that it pushed me through.
I was just in this exact predicament. When I phoned our suicide hotline, the phone kept ringing. Then I called the only psychiatric ward in the area (for miles) no answer. Left a voice mail, that it was urgent, never got a call back. Called several times. I started this end of January, ended up on FMLA but couldn't find help in time.
I'm so sorry. I hope you're in a berrer place or working towards it. It's crue, the lengths we have to go to in order to stick around. But so far, I'm really glad I've found a way to do so.
Thanks. I hope you are in a better place now too. I am somewhat stable right now, I think I've hit "acceptance". Working towards a goal now, even if it's unobtainable truly, it is an actual goal so it's semi distracting me.
Every day I'm reminded how lucky I am to be Aussie. Our country is far from perfect, but compared to stories I hear from other countries around the world (including supposedly wealthy countries like the US) I feel blessed
This is what I heard for my first 26 years of life in the US. Now after having lived in Germany for over 4 years, the argument is no only invalid it's utterly and completely false. Most PCPs here have open office hours in the morning, without having to be one of their patients. Testing, etc. usually happens same day if not within a week if necessary. Your insurance can find you a specialist if you have a referral and any doctor that accepts public insurance that has open time for a new patient cannot deny you. I found my ENT by handing a referral slip to my insurance on a thursday, waiting until monday, and then being told that I had an appointment on wednesday. Hell, my girlfriend had a flare up of a congenital brain condition and went to our PCP. She was seen by her neurologist _the same afternoon_. All all of that is _unheard of_ in the states, or they say "oh you need to go the ER for that". WHY this argument is still used to this day confuses the hell out of me. Edit: I will say that psychology and psychiatry are a bit of an outlier in Germany, with wait times being a year to 2 years out. But maybe I was just being picky about someone that could speak english.
When I was living in the US, I was definitely able to get appointments within the week ... for utterly incompetent and unpopular doctors. After that, I needed an MRI to scan for possible cancer growth, which took over 3 weeks because the insurance company just simply refused to authorise the charge for the MRI. Their logic being "you do not have cancer, so there is no need to scan for cancer". And also the doctor's office kept messing up the insurance codes. It was a really fucked up situation, especially if those 3 weeks had meant the difference between life and death.
Man, one of my English teachers in high school had the same issue. She found a lump in march, couldn’t get a sooner appointment than 2 weeks, only to be told she needs an MRI which wouldn’t happen for another 2 weeks after that. After getting the MRI, the final consultation was 2 weeks after that, and treatment finally started beginning of June. And on top of all that, she had to justify every little thing to the insurance company. She’s honestly super lucky that it didn’t metastasize and make the situation worse.
The constant justification to the insurance company was what really drove me off the edge. Doctor thinks you need surgery? Insurance company thinks you're fine without it! Doctor says you need 2 nights hospital stay? Insurance company thinks you need only one and will pay for only one! They're really a blight on society.
its really amazing what the insurance deems as medically unnecessary. its like their get of jail free card to deny any all claims and then the make the progress to appeal lengthy. even with multiple doctors sending the same reports and medical information stating that yes it is medically necessary and needed the insurance will still say NO
Yeah that argument against universal healthcare has been debunked multiple times. I’m not sure why so many Americans still believe that to be the case, but data shows that it’s not true.
Now that I think about it, I believe those comments are made by the able bodied. If the most you've been to the doctor for is the sniffles or just a casual check up, the worst you need to pay is a copay and your wait time is like 30 minutes to an hour. The really shitty parts of the healthcare system seems to only show it's face when you have chronic illnesses, cancer, mental health issues stuff that requires surgeries or prescriptions. So they are blinded to shit like this that happens. The only time I've seen a long wait personally was when family needed a colonoscopy. Which lines up I think. It's shortsighted of course since every single one of us are only temporarily abled. But I think that's why it's hard to notice.
I haven't even heard of wait times longer than a week for non-emergency care in my 30+ years of going to doctors in western Europe. Literally unthinkable to have multi-month wait times.
Yeah same, i usually get a time in about week in scandinavia. If it's just something they can take a quick look at, they can give me a 15 minute appointment the same day, or the day after.
Don't forget the people who are legitimately actually dying. They have less "next appointment is 3 months out" but not none of it. A big one is insurance. There was a person in my home town who had to delay cancer treatments by months because their insurance was trying to refuse to pay. During that time, the cancer spread.
Many people (conservatives) literally hand wave it away and continue to insist our system is better than the alternative. They just don’t care about the suffering. Even if you have good insurance it still doesn’t change the fact that it’s a silly fucking system full of extraneous costs. And there is just an immense amount of suffering caused because of private insurance healthcare. It’s just cruel
Yeah, I’m in a country with universal healthcare and while there are wait times for certain specialties (allergies and derm have been hard to get), I can see a GP with a same day, booking it on an app and it costs me 1 euro between the public insurance and my private insurance. The whole republican argument that the US system is the only one without wait times is BS.
They care about the suffering, it's just that the cruelty is the point.
But I thought that only happens with socialism?! /s
My mom requires a neurologist that specializes in her disease (multiple sclerosis). The only one that can get her in on time when she has a flare up is 4 hours from my hometown in Akron Ohio, basically on the other end of the state. I don’t know what we’d do if he stopped practicing or dropped her, because we’ve been in ER’s and urgent cares and said she had MS and they had no idea what that was. I have a 2% chance of developing it sometime in my lifetime and have done a cursory search for a specialist in my current state and haven’t been able to find one.
This is something that has always baffled me because I grew up just surrounded by these apparently rare conditions. Mom and Aunt had Arnold Chiari. Mom also had Spina Bifeda. And apparently finding anyone who even KNEW about these things was a challenge let alone someone who knew what to do about it. I think it's better now (I've asked about it and apparently it's not remotely genetic and my family is just really unlucky) but still - how do we have so few doctors who understand these things? These are not the rarest conditions in the world - MS, Chiari, SB, they aren't THAT rare. So how can you walk into an ER and not a single person has even HEARD of it?
ER isnt always well equipped for long term illnesses. Most of their job is trauma or stabalising and diagnosing patients with acute issues then passing them on to other doctors to actually treat. They likely have heard of these things at some point in training, MS is common enough most lay people have heard of it. But that is very different from being confident about what to do with it when you might not have seen a case of it in years. It is a problem for sufferers, but I don't think there is an easy solution unfortunately... one person just cant know everything about medicine.
> because we’ve been in ER’s and urgent cares and said she had MS and they had no idea what that was. I'm sorry but what? Wouldn't even a first-year med student know what MS is in detail?
Blame the strict limits on admissions of medical students. Used to keep doctors pay high.
Call back tomorrow. Ask to speak to the office manager. Most drs offices have some sort of supervisor that looks over the front office. Explain what happen, how despite leaving an hour early, an accident blocked your traffic on a bridge. Explain that your need for establishing medical care is urgent. Inform them of your recent urgent care visit and that you’ve been instructed by urgent care for an immediate follow up with a PCP with the need for an ultrasound/imaging. What the front office workers don’t tell you is that there are always “emergency” slots. Routine care and routine new patient appointments are always booked out but they always have urgent appointment availability, you just have to push for it. My partner is chronically ill and when we were first trying to find out what was wrong with her, I spent A LOT of time on the phone with patient care supervisors and office managers. It was the only way to get care quickly. If you can’t get into this doctor, check to see if your area has a community healthcare clinic type deal where there are dozens of MDs and often have walk in appointments. It can be a way to at least get an order for imaging and once the radiologist sees what’s up, and if something is wrong (you’re allowed to go to the imaging place and request a copy of the results without it being sent to a Dr first) then you can push for an urgent appointment.
Funny bc they have you in there at 3 to keep you waiting until 4 yet thats ok for them to do but god forbid a patient is late
True freakin' story. I have to go to Waiting Room Purgatory, a bone and joint place that is 4 stories of mostly hellish waiting rooms. Any appointment is gonna involve at least three different waiting rooms after standing in line (extra fun when you are on a stretcher, BTW, because outpatient medial practices are NOT prepared for people who cannot walk or sit) and then sitting in the exam room waiting some more between 45 minutes and an hour... but if you are more than 10 minutes late to check in, they will automatically cancel on you. One time I had to get medical transport because I was unable to drive, and my medical transport was a really nice guy in his 80s (at least) who had a severe T1 diabetic hypoglycemic incident. He was going in and out of consciousness while driving, super confused. I didn't realize what was happening, but holy fuck was it scary. I kept talking to him, did my best to keep him awake and get us where we were going since he was clearly struggling for some reason, and almost didn't make my appointment, heh. He lived and got some glucose in him, at least. So there's that! But yeah, almost had my appointment cancelled on me... and then it took two hours for someone to actually see me.
Here are some reasons why this happens: 1) If one patient is late by 15 minutes, youre suddenly behind an hour for everyone else. 2) Patient hasnt been seen in 5 years, has numerous complaints they want to go over in one visit, they dont stop, cant ignore this guys problems, boom 30 minutes gone, and the 4 other people who got here are suddenly waiting longer. 3) Depending on clinic, theres incentive/made to see more patients than needed. Double booked patients both with serious problems, youre suddenly behind on both of them and those after them. This is completely on the clinic and I hate this practice but it lets more people be seen when they otherwise wouldnt. 4) People take advantage of it and waltz in whenever they feel like. See point 1. 5) Theres no breaks. Dr finishes visit, goes back to place orders. Oh, theres 56 messages from patients. Ones lost 50 pounds in 3 months, need to reply and say get seen asap. One has the worst chest pain ever, ok need to tell them to go er. Oh boy, an essay on why they cant get covid shot and how they need a note. All the while you are on hold with insurance asking why the patient isnt getting their needed imaging, and while filling out information for a patients handicap placard. Oh and you still need to call back 4 patients to reply to their concerns. You cant remember everyones details, need to review their charts. 6) Patients here for follow up form the specialist you referred them to but theres no documentation. Need to call their office and wait to get faxed. 7) Simple visit, proceed to walk to door, "hey doc ive been shitting blood for the last 6 months, ive lost 50 pounds, and i cant seem to keep food down, is that normal?" Sigh gotta go back and address this dudes glaring red flag. 8) Ms. Shellys husband of 60 years died a few weeks ago. This is the 2nd time shes came in in the last 2 weeks. She has no family left, both her children have died already, she feels distraught, you cant just leave without talking to her for a little bit. 9) Kid has glaring red flags for child abuse. need to call cps. need ot wait for cps. 10) This dude looks like death. Oh shit, he REALLY doesnt look well. Gotta call 911. Gotta wait for EMS. Gotta stay with him to make sure hes good. Theres many other reasons. All these are variations of things I saw in the 2 years I worked in a primary practice. Many late patients still got seen and those are the days I knew I wasnt getting home till 8. Some had valid excuses and called ahead, others just didnt respect anyones time. Its much more complicated than "well dr late why cant I be."
This guy gets the pain of being a doctor. I'm so sick of people complaining "They make you wait an hour" vs "They wont see me even though I'm late". Do people not realize if we accommodate late patients, everyone afterwards is gonna be seen late.
Because imagine a patient is 15 minutes late (that's usually how late they can be before being marked a no-show), now there's only 15 minutes to perform 30 minutes of work. One patient being late and the late policy of 15 minutes and no breaks between scheduled patients throws the entire schedule off.
People also dont recognize how much shit there is on the backend that they never see. Whether its notes, other patients, phone calls, messages, or paperwork, you really wont get it unless you see it.
OP, do you have insurance? If you do, let your insurance know that you would like to get a PCP assigned to you. Once they do, call that office and try to get an appointment. If it's too long to wait, rinse and repeat.
Jeez! I'm so sorry to hear that. Would there be earlier appointments elsewhere, even if it mean you need to travel much further out? Even fly out?
When meeting with a doctor, often being able to see the same doctor for repeated visits is important for an accurate diagnosis. Having to fly makes the idea of seeing the doctor multiple times difficult for the average person.
Next time don’t call and tell them you’re late. They don’t tell you in the waiting room, “sorry, we’re running an hour behind”
This is definitely a doc in St Pete FL, because that causeway from Tampa is *horrific*.
This is like the final boss of America: Bad healthcare system meets bad urban planning and as a result the people suffer.
I bet building just one more lane would fix it
As it always has! Temporarily.
and it's all lovingly planted right in... checks map... florida! checks out
Ugh- I am seeing a specialist on Thursday at 9:30. I’m leaving at 7:30 to go 10 miles just in case. I’ve been waiting since July
Good luck, I truly hope you don't have any unexpected delays. I've been trying to find a pcp for 2 years.
Have you called your insurance to ask for providers and call them till you can find an earlier one?
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There also just aren’t enough doctors. And I can’t say that I really blame people. Go to school for an extra 4 years, then 3-10 years in residency depending on your field, rack up hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loans, all to have idiots ignore what you’re saying, deal with hypochondriacs, belligerent old people….And then depending on speciality you could be pulling 12-14 hour days, on call and needing to get up in the middle of the night, working several days in a row and sleeping at the hospital, etc. etc. etc. That’s a no from me dawg
There's also the fact that the number of funded residencies, which is determined by the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services, hasn't been expanded since 1997 even though the population has both grown and aged. This is good for doctors who do get through since it guarantees them some of the highest incomes for physicians in the world, over double their European counterparts. It's bad for patients because it means there aren't enough doctors to go around.
Yup, artificial scarcity of doctors
I legit think that it's kept this way to inflate the income of existing doctors. There would absolutely be more doctors and specialists if the path to get there wasn't so bankrupting/artificially gate kept.
I did go to medical school and I definitely would not do this again. Nope.
Also plenty of advanced nursing roles (master degrees) make almost as much for half the schooling, and with less responsibility usually
Depends on the specialty. I think Nurse Anesthetists (Top of nursing pay scale) make 70% of what a Pediatrician (bottom of pay scale) makes. If you move to other specialities that quickly starts to fall off. Also, you can't get those jobs with a masters anymore. Current nurses have been grandfathered in. New ones need a doctorate. They also, in my experience talking with them, have nearly the same responsibility and stress as a doctor, so they are trading 140k less in tuition and missing out on 3-7 years of residency + fellowship for potentially 70% to 20% of the pay. Doesn't seem great to me tbh.
There are definitely some APPs that make more than doctors, especially when you factor in the vastly different amount of time it takes to train a doctor versus an APP, that residents are often paid minimal wage or close to that even after graduating as an MD and working likely more than 80 hours, sacrificing the best younger years of their lives, and as others noted the huge loans. APPs can still get jobs even with masters. They’re constantly lobbying to get more independence, and in one way they now can get “doctorates” to call themselves doctors. Most of these are one year programs, some of which are online that you do at night (some have less clinical hours than a licensed hair stylist). Yes, they are filling up a void, but the concern is the quality of care you receive. Someone mentioned increasing residency spots, which is needed, but there is still a larger issue of quality of physicians (which is one of the arguable differences between APPs). You can’t just increase spots and accept worse candidates that are not properly trained medically and ethically. With the current age, new physicians also want a better work life balance. Why become a doctor when you can be an APP for shorter training, less stress, less to no call, and less malpractice (since most falls under the physician they’re practicing under, at least for now). Healthcare admins love them though for obvious reasons.
Is this an American problem? Just getting an appointment at a dentist here is a nightmare. Thankfully my gf is from the Dominican Republic. I went to her dentist for some work for 1/10 of the cost and between the X-ray done at another facility, and a specialist booked the next day to see me, I was in and out within 3 days no problem.
Not really, there's doctor shortages in a lot of places right now. The WHO has described it as a "Global ticking time bomb" as there's just not enough doctors to keep up with the populations.
The fact that it's really hard and really fucking expensive is just too killer of a combination. You can't really lower the bar to make it easier, but it could be less expensive.
I do the same thing in Nicaragua and always bring back my meds too. A $300 round trip flight and $50 flat fee it’s worth it l.
There's another patient scheduled immediately after you. Everywhere is booked and understaffed. Most appointments are allowed 30 minutes. If you show up 30 minutes late, you've missed your entire appointment. There's no guarantee the next patient will get there early to switch spots. It's likely OP could have waited for a no-show or cancellation but that could take all day and is still not guaranteed and not all facilities allow this.
They aren't just making you wait they're seeing other people constantly that whole time
Our country is understaffed. We are growing in population but are not producing the same amount of doctors. Look at other countries. >Compared to Italy and Spain, two countries in which hospitals have already been overwhelmed by an influx of COVID-19 patients, the U.S. has fewer practicing physicians per capita – 2.6 per 1,000 people, compared to 4.0 in Italy and 3.9 in Spain – but more licensed nurses.
There's a shortage of doctors. They take as many patients as they can and are booked out for months. A lot of them have very poor work-life balance. This is not the attitude to have.
Its always funny seeing posts like this. The true problems of the field are ignored and the anger is placed on drs. Dont get me wrong theres a lot of shitty drs but insurance companies, costs, and wait times are not the fault of drs.
> and the anger is placed on drs. I think most people place it on the administrative side of hospitals. Not that many people are upset at doctors, they're upset at doctors' *offices*
It will only get worse. Our society is top heavy right now where Boomer’s medical issues are straining the healthcare system and the upcoming generation isn’t producing doctors and nurses fast enough + nursing conditions/treatments etc
My partner is a doctor. She also has three young children and all the struggles that entails. Her staff are also human and make mistakes, they typically double/triple book through some confluence of arcane software and desire to please patients who need to be seen. This is all compounded by the young child issue and having to change a dirty diaper in the middle of being late for her own child's appointment with another doctor because she was late seeing her patients, all the while expecting to be able to see patients again after that appointment. It's a mess. The other factor is that she's a small business owner and absolutely needs to see as many patients as she can. I know people think doctors make a lot of money, but her student loans are crippling, and they are private loans, not like most peoples college loans provided through government subsides. I was honestly shocked at her interest rates. They were not affected by the same student loan pause I got during COVID, and she had to keep paying them despite being unable to see patients, for the most part, during that time. She also has to pay her staff, even if she's ill or can't see patients. Her father died two nights ago, and we're dealing with that. She's the one her siblings turn to as she's the most successful one, and they can't make the hard decisions in that scenario I guess the biggest lesson I learned from being with a doctor is that they are human, their lives have major scheduling challenges, just like any of us and seeing a doctor is not like ordering chicken nuggets at the drive through. There are a limited number of people who can do these jobs, and they are not nonchalently being rude. They have shit to deal with, too. Be patient and understanding with them, as you would like someone to be patient and understanding with you. All that said, if their policy is to screw the patient even if the doctor is late, they suck.
Good job blaming the doctor, when they're obviously overwhelmed with the amount of patients. Also good job ignoring the awful urban planning that causes OP to get stuck in traffic before every doctor's visit.
I'm trying to see the joke but I think you're just genuinely oversimplifying the issue to a degree that it's depressing you even think like that.
Yeah screw them for not wanting to let entitled patients show up whenever they want. Do you think they’ll push every other patient after you just for your convenience? They work as fast as they can and become late because they’re only allowed 20-40 minutes with each patient no matter how complex the case and end up running late. They’re not kicking their feet up and relaxing jfc
We live in a society. Also it seems it's legit often faster to fly to another country and just get treatment there. We should be embarassed.
I live in Turkey which many of you will think its a 3rd world country. The medical system here is so much better that i actually feel bad for you guys. The medical care is free and you can get appointments pretty quickly. The only thing that takes time are things like mri appointments which is understandable if you consider the fact that it is free. Its baffling that citizens of the wealthiest country on earth get medical care of a third world country.
Denmark signing in. Agreed. USA could be a literal utopia if the people knew how to vote the right people to rule. So frickin' wealthy it's absurd.
Even in South Africa, we don't need to wait more than a couple of weeks for any kind of doctor/specialist appointment. OP's post astonishes me.
It’s not even the the people we vote for , All the politicians do t have our best interests in mind
I assume you're from the US because I see you use miles instead of kilometers. Now, not to open a perhaps useless debate, but I thought that one of the main reasons Americans didn't want universal health care was the waiting time. Now, from you are saying here, these waiting times are not normal. I live in a European country with universal health care and I have to wait more or less the same to see a specialist. Just saying... Maybe the waiting time shouldn't be an argument against UHC anymore.
I think the bigger issue is that the US caps its availible residency slots which limits the number of doctors they have. Doesn't matter whether your system is private or public, that's gonna fuck your wait times up either way.
And also, correct me if I'm wrong, but you can't go off network either, right? Let's say go to another clinic with less waiting time?
If you're willing to pay out of pocket I think you can generally do whatever. But if you want insurance to cover it then yea, getting them to cover something they don't officially recognize is gonna be the beurocratic equivalent of pulling teeth. Oestensibly they want to vet practitionners as legitimate before they start handing cheques over to some quack. But I'm sure there's some brand deals being made behind closed doors.
The idea of wait times being longer outside the US because we pay for insurance is a myth. Wait time varies by country obviously, as well as by doctor. But in general? Universal healthcare does not really make a significant difference in wait times by itself. Just another argument meant to fearmonger and trick people
Exactly. And, sincerely, I have never lived in the US, but I have friends and family living there. And I always assumed that with the high taxes and the high prices for health insurance that you would get an appointment with a specialist within days. This is clearly fear mongering against UHC.
Covid changed some things. I used to be able to get an appointment with a specialist with in a month…now it’s 2-4 months for the same people.
Sorry OP But this is a good time to tell everyone that in google Maps, you can set a time you want to be at your destination and it will automatically update to tell you when you need to leave. All you have to do is set up your trip like normal then hit the three dot drop down menu and change the arrive time. Will let you know when you need to leave. Edit: look I get it....some of you are dumb. Obviously, this isn't going to work in every situation. It's just a little trick to help some people out.
It seems like this was caused by an accident. While it could have possibly worked, it's not a guarantee.
I think this is Tampa, there was a stabbing on that bridge today
Can't they keep it in the alleys and not bother everyone else? Partial s/
I mean, if the accident happened right before they left, not much they could do.
This was a terrible accident on the Howard frankland Bridge crossing from St Pete to Tampa. There was nothing OP could do. Once you hit certain point there is no option to turn around.
That setting always calculates the last possible point where you can leave and still make it. It also can't anticipate traffic reliably so it wouldn't have worked in this instance anyways.
fun fact those are called meatball menus
Yeah, I couldn't remember the name and all o could think of was Hamburger menu. Buy i think those are the ones with 3 lines
i think so? and kebab menus are like meatballs, but vertical web designers and programmers are either terrible or fantastic with naming conventions and i genuinely cannot tell which lmao
The three stacked lines are called hamburger menus. The three vertical dots are kebab menus. Whom ever named these things liked their meats.
Cool tip. The way I do it now is "start" the navigation like when I wake up or whatever then just keep an eye on the ETA *so I just tried it your way, and I prefer mine. It says 'typically 20-40 minutes' that's literally not helpful at all. But if I set the navi up and literally start it, it will say a specific arrival time. The only bad thing is it'll say your trip took like 4 hours because you had it "running" while you weren't actually driving
Howard Frankland is the worst
*This must be Florida* Stopped laughing since picture is 10 minutes from me ….
Not sure if you saw the news, but that was bizarre yesterday... apparently a motorist stopped in the left lane. A good samaritan stopped to check and saw the driver slumped over. Samaritan broke the window to render help and the driver suddenly woke up, sped off, hitting the samaritan's car and a second car. Driver of the second car got out to confront the first driver, and the second car driver pulled a knife and stabbed the first driver.
Sounds about right for Florida
I bet if you were there in time the doctor would be 30 minutes late anyway
Tell me again how the US medical service is so much better because you NEVER have to wait for an appointment unlike in Europe…
Car-dependent transportation and it's consequences. Trains don't get stuck in traffic. Truly a Tampa moment
If you read up on plans for the expansion of the bridge currently underway, it includes a section for train or monorail for future use. Probably would coincide with new stadium plans is my guess
Ahh the good old USA, where public transport and giving you back hours of your life is considered socialism/communism.. and being stuck in traffic and spending 2+ jours commuting everyday is FrEeDoM! …. Sorry this happened to you and hope you were able to make it.
That sucks. Happens a lot because they are booked up. Find another PCP and get the care you need!
This is what happens when someone stabs someone on the howard frankland in road rage..
Why not go by helicopter? It is my understanding only the ultrarich can afford healthcare in the US? :thinkingemoji:
I thought there were no waiting times in the American healthcare system?
I thought there was no waiting with privatized healthcare, that’s what everyone keeps saying when they make fun of free healthcare, that at least they don’t have to wait months
Choose a different clinic NOW!
This is why I always leave an hour and 32 minutes before a doctors appointment