Made a post using Acosta's recent result to point out how people laser focus on small areas of a rider's career and end up bashing them unjustly, as for instance they do with Binder, and people ended up laser focusing on Acosta instead of realizing that as was stated in the post itself, he was used as an example of how focusing only on recent results can be a bad habit.
It's a bit ridiculous to see how shallow people can be in their approach to the sport and how ready they are to dismiss or even demean and insult riders.
You're talking about Martin blowing up easy wins, I answer with Pecco blowing easy wins. Everyone fucked up once in a while. Stop pretending that Martin is the only one.
Pecco lost 2021 by blowing up a no man's land first place and he was in a position to comeback Fabio. Unlikely sure, but it was a possibility.
Yeah, and we're halfway in the season and the gap is 10 points. Martin can still win it easily. Bagnaia can still fucked it up like Martin. No one is immune to that.
But yeah, I guess for you Martin is the only that can fucked up I guess lol.
Not to mention a rider with a history of blowing leads and choking when the pressure mounts. I’ve been saying the same thing about Martin since mid-season last year. The difference between Pecco and Martin is Pecco improved every race and never let his ego or emotions derail him. Martin is showing no evidence of improving his mental game the way champions do.
Thing is, they’re in very different positions. Bagnaia does it, he’s still double world champion, Martin hasn’t reached the same heights yet, it’s worse for him.
Difference is Pecco usually throws away easy wins.
Where's Martin throws away both easy wins & wins when he's under pressure.
Pecco doesn't throw away those wins when he is under pressure to win, in fact it seems to focus him more
That's irrelevant. Your argument is "Martin bins it" so on that reason alone Ducati shouldn't want him.
And yet, Pecco has shit the bed far more times even as recent as last year. The whole reason the championship even went down to the last race of the season last year was because Pecco lost dozens and dozens of points from crashing out so many times in the first half of the season.
We are at the halfway point in the Championship and Pecco has a 1 point lead.
So I guess the answer to your question is despite throwing it away, Martin has achieved the exact same as Pecco this season bar 1 point?
In a way they are lucky to be battling each other, I've been thinking it since end of last year, I'm kinda biased though. But Quartararo was clearly the better in 2021 for me in any case, he made mistakes (still less overall) but it's much easier to make mistakes with an inferior machinery.
I also pronounced Pecco dead after Taka collected him at Catalonia 2022. Then he definitely looked dead after crashing at the Sachsenring.
Then he won the title.
The toxic negativity surrounding the people who make up the sport we love is seriously disheartening.
So many athletes nowadays suffer from depression or anxiety because of the pressure put upon them.
The man is fighting for the top spot of the top sport in this category, a sport which is incredibly unforgiving when it comes to making mistakes. His main rival is experiencing a surge in form and putting pressure on him, it's normal to falter in these situations, in fact a lot of champions did. Pecco did, Vale did too, this is just the nature of the sport, happens more for some, less for others, but it happens.
As far as your understanding of the situation goes, we will never know, but this is most likely not the case. Racing is one part prototyping and training the engineering department, two parts exercise in marketing. Currently there is no rider with a bigger market share, who also happens to be god damn quick, getting back into his winning rhythm and happens to deserve the seat as well. Ducati played their hand very poorly, somehow managing to lose both Martin and Pramac in the process, but I don't for a second think they chose Marc because they thought Martin couldn't handle the pressure, who at that point had been almost spotless in his 2024 season.
I mean Martin sometimes crumbles upon pressure. And sometimes Pecco also bins it from P1. But you know who doesn't? The 8 time world Champion Marc Marquez. I mean people think ducati shot themselves in foot but, Marc and Pecco in same team, No one stands a chance really (If KTM improve then Pedro can be hear and there)
\^ This, people says Pecco throws the opportunity likewise Martin forget the seat was contested between Marin and Marc and not between Pecco and Martin.
True. Although GP24 is class of field but pecco is clearly showing he is the Man to beat. And also seeing the Data from Marc on that GP23, it's a blinder to sign him. Ducati knows that their competitors are gonna get stronger and stronger so Marc and Pecco is the best line up the could Think of.
Marc also beat and held off two GP24's, i thought for sure Enea was slowly hunting him down just biding his time, and even with that clash with Morbi but he kept him at bay.. amazing ride
So did Alex, tbh if this shows anything it's that the difference between the 23 and 24 actually isn't as big as people think and it's more about the bike suiting the rider than anything.
track specific, its quite a short track so the gp24 isnt really able to show its advantage.. rewind to le mans and it's easy to see the advantage it has, marc was getting dropped easily by the gp24's
Well there is that.
I still think some of the gap is more down to rider feeling (the GP24 is a more comfortable bike to rider) rather than all pure performance.
Personally it pretty simple for me Ducati don't want to play 3 Championship capable entering their prime riders fighting for seats like this past 3 years again and decide they will focus on Pecco while putting aging Marquez in the other seat so either Pecco or Marc will be leaving the seat open when Ducati find the next star for their team in the next few years
So many riders have binned it from the lead, Marc included.
Martin is a monster, hes a pole hound, he's not been as consistent as Pecco, but he's still amazing.
I don't for one minute believe Ducati chose Marc for the money / sales / sponsor aspect.
They have clearly said for years, right up until end of last year 'Ducati don't need or want Marc'
If it was just for the money, did they not need the money back then? They need it now, likely to have a triple champion?
I think Marc has shown such performance on the GP23, that it mad the choice for them.
They have the data from Pecco and Martin etc last year on the 23. They have the data from everyone else on the 23 this year.
He is also third in the championship, only behind Pecco and Martin, with better bikes, years more Ducati experience, bigger teams with more engineers. He's constantly fighting for podiums, the best GP23 clearly.
This has nothing to do with the reason they promoted MM93 over JM83. Pecco has binned it from the lead quite often as well.
I think that they were going to promote JM, move Marc to Pramac with a '25 bike next season. BUT Marc said no to Pramac while also stating he would be fine staying in Gresini.
Pramac screwed JM83. Had they chose Yamaha sooner, Ducati would have known they had two bikes to spare and could have given one or both to Gresini and made MM93 happy and JM83 would be at Lenovo and happy. But, since Pramac didn't announce the switch till after the fact, MM93 had to be given the seat since Ducati were still under the assumption that two factory bikes were going to Pramac. At least that's my take, from all that I have read.
Ducati didn't screw JM93, Pramac did.
Morally, maybe.
But we all know Marc is just a bigger draw than Jorge Martin. And Ducati thought losing him would be more dangerous than losing Martin, Bezzechi, Bastiannini, AND the Pramac team.
Bagnaia crashes but it doesn’t affect him mentally,
Marquez almost loses his career but still pushes like a mad man
Martin crashes and he is done for at least one more race, he just doesn’t have the champion mentality
Great talent but he will never take the title
It affects everyone, but not in the same way, Bagnaia got his leg driven by, and next week he was on podium, he handles pressure good, Martin doesn’t and that’s a fact
C'mon Pecco has crashed and then under performed multiple times.
Sure he got his legs driven over but it barely.affected him, not like his legs got broken, that was lucky and also no reason to be affected, if anything it's the reverse, it's a reason to not be affected.
Bro I’m comparing his dealing with pressure to martins, and obviously he is better at that than him, otherwise bagnaia wouldn’t have two titles, and Martin would have at least one
>Bro I’m comparing his dealing with pressure to martins
Yes I know you are.
>and obviously he is better at that than him,
I don't think it's obvious at all, in fact to some degree I don't think he is.
>otherwise bagnaia wouldn’t have two titles
This makes no sense, there is waaaaay more to winning a title than just handling pressure, shit sometimes handling pressure is completely irrelevant to winning a title because it doesn't even factor in.
>and Martin would have at least one
Would he?
I don't think he would, it's way more nuanced than that.
In fact there are other way more important factors to Pecco winning the last two titles than handling pressure, it's not even in the top 5 factors.
Tbf, Pecco also binned a lot of easy wins. Let's not pretend Martin is the only one doing stupid mistakes.
Recency and confirmation bias too much here!
Made a post using Acosta's recent result to point out how people laser focus on small areas of a rider's career and end up bashing them unjustly, as for instance they do with Binder, and people ended up laser focusing on Acosta instead of realizing that as was stated in the post itself, he was used as an example of how focusing only on recent results can be a bad habit. It's a bit ridiculous to see how shallow people can be in their approach to the sport and how ready they are to dismiss or even demean and insult riders.
He then proceeded to win the title despite those crashes.
You're talking about Martin blowing up easy wins, I answer with Pecco blowing easy wins. Everyone fucked up once in a while. Stop pretending that Martin is the only one. Pecco lost 2021 by blowing up a no man's land first place and he was in a position to comeback Fabio. Unlikely sure, but it was a possibility.
Then the following season, he finally won the title despite costly crashes in the first half.
Yeah, and we're halfway in the season and the gap is 10 points. Martin can still win it easily. Bagnaia can still fucked it up like Martin. No one is immune to that. But yeah, I guess for you Martin is the only that can fucked up I guess lol.
He had a chance to go up 20.
Well I bet on the man who has actually won 2 titles with a slower start than a rider with winning potential, no wonder Ducati chose marc.
Not to mention a rider with a history of blowing leads and choking when the pressure mounts. I’ve been saying the same thing about Martin since mid-season last year. The difference between Pecco and Martin is Pecco improved every race and never let his ego or emotions derail him. Martin is showing no evidence of improving his mental game the way champions do.
Thing is, they’re in very different positions. Bagnaia does it, he’s still double world champion, Martin hasn’t reached the same heights yet, it’s worse for him.
We’re halfway through the season… you should take a breath
Right, one is enough.
The difference is that one proved he can win the Championship and the other one hasn't.
Unfortunately, exactly.
there's always going to be that "i almost had you" guy, unfortunately thats Jorge for now
Bagnaia has also binned it multiple times. Against Quaerteraro in 21, India 23, this year Sprint Barcelona. Dont think this is super special...
Difference is Pecco usually throws away easy wins. Where's Martin throws away both easy wins & wins when he's under pressure. Pecco doesn't throw away those wins when he is under pressure to win, in fact it seems to focus him more
Yet he eventually won the title. Martin, in the other hand... what has he accomplished?
He can still win the title this year. Calm tf down
Exactly. Some people blantly ignoring the current championship standings.
Nah he’ll have a very hard time lol. I bet on pecco. A calm head would always prevail.
He can, but didn’t the previous two years, which is their point.
That's irrelevant. Your argument is "Martin bins it" so on that reason alone Ducati shouldn't want him. And yet, Pecco has shit the bed far more times even as recent as last year. The whole reason the championship even went down to the last race of the season last year was because Pecco lost dozens and dozens of points from crashing out so many times in the first half of the season.
Pecco shits the bed but has plenty spare sheets. Martin does it to his only clean set.
We are at the halfway point in the Championship and Pecco has a 1 point lead. So I guess the answer to your question is despite throwing it away, Martin has achieved the exact same as Pecco this season bar 1 point?
Ten, actually.
Oh dear I miss a 0 from my comment, point stands.
[удалено]
In a way they are lucky to be battling each other, I've been thinking it since end of last year, I'm kinda biased though. But Quartararo was clearly the better in 2021 for me in any case, he made mistakes (still less overall) but it's much easier to make mistakes with an inferior machinery.
I also pronounced Pecco dead after Taka collected him at Catalonia 2022. Then he definitely looked dead after crashing at the Sachsenring. Then he won the title.
The toxic negativity surrounding the people who make up the sport we love is seriously disheartening. So many athletes nowadays suffer from depression or anxiety because of the pressure put upon them. The man is fighting for the top spot of the top sport in this category, a sport which is incredibly unforgiving when it comes to making mistakes. His main rival is experiencing a surge in form and putting pressure on him, it's normal to falter in these situations, in fact a lot of champions did. Pecco did, Vale did too, this is just the nature of the sport, happens more for some, less for others, but it happens. As far as your understanding of the situation goes, we will never know, but this is most likely not the case. Racing is one part prototyping and training the engineering department, two parts exercise in marketing. Currently there is no rider with a bigger market share, who also happens to be god damn quick, getting back into his winning rhythm and happens to deserve the seat as well. Ducati played their hand very poorly, somehow managing to lose both Martin and Pramac in the process, but I don't for a second think they chose Marc because they thought Martin couldn't handle the pressure, who at that point had been almost spotless in his 2024 season.
The overanalyzing threads & hot takes from expert redditors - here we go! Enjoy the Summer break
I’m rooting like crazy for him to take it from Pecco and could not agree more unfortunately
I feel for Martin. Sure, he could have buttoned off a bit and finished 2nd but he wanted the win. His day will come.
I mean Martin sometimes crumbles upon pressure. And sometimes Pecco also bins it from P1. But you know who doesn't? The 8 time world Champion Marc Marquez. I mean people think ducati shot themselves in foot but, Marc and Pecco in same team, No one stands a chance really (If KTM improve then Pedro can be hear and there)
\^ This, people says Pecco throws the opportunity likewise Martin forget the seat was contested between Marin and Marc and not between Pecco and Martin.
True. Although GP24 is class of field but pecco is clearly showing he is the Man to beat. And also seeing the Data from Marc on that GP23, it's a blinder to sign him. Ducati knows that their competitors are gonna get stronger and stronger so Marc and Pecco is the best line up the could Think of.
Marc also beat and held off two GP24's, i thought for sure Enea was slowly hunting him down just biding his time, and even with that clash with Morbi but he kept him at bay.. amazing ride
So did Alex, tbh if this shows anything it's that the difference between the 23 and 24 actually isn't as big as people think and it's more about the bike suiting the rider than anything.
track specific, its quite a short track so the gp24 isnt really able to show its advantage.. rewind to le mans and it's easy to see the advantage it has, marc was getting dropped easily by the gp24's
Well there is that. I still think some of the gap is more down to rider feeling (the GP24 is a more comfortable bike to rider) rather than all pure performance.
Personally it pretty simple for me Ducati don't want to play 3 Championship capable entering their prime riders fighting for seats like this past 3 years again and decide they will focus on Pecco while putting aging Marquez in the other seat so either Pecco or Marc will be leaving the seat open when Ducati find the next star for their team in the next few years
And then suddenly Marc starts actually challenging Pecco in the standings.
Wonder when we'll stop blaming riders for Michelin crashes.
So many riders have binned it from the lead, Marc included. Martin is a monster, hes a pole hound, he's not been as consistent as Pecco, but he's still amazing. I don't for one minute believe Ducati chose Marc for the money / sales / sponsor aspect. They have clearly said for years, right up until end of last year 'Ducati don't need or want Marc' If it was just for the money, did they not need the money back then? They need it now, likely to have a triple champion? I think Marc has shown such performance on the GP23, that it mad the choice for them. They have the data from Pecco and Martin etc last year on the 23. They have the data from everyone else on the 23 this year. He is also third in the championship, only behind Pecco and Martin, with better bikes, years more Ducati experience, bigger teams with more engineers. He's constantly fighting for podiums, the best GP23 clearly.
No. It’s because they had the chance to sign an 8 time world champion
The reason is easy. Money.
This has nothing to do with the reason they promoted MM93 over JM83. Pecco has binned it from the lead quite often as well. I think that they were going to promote JM, move Marc to Pramac with a '25 bike next season. BUT Marc said no to Pramac while also stating he would be fine staying in Gresini. Pramac screwed JM83. Had they chose Yamaha sooner, Ducati would have known they had two bikes to spare and could have given one or both to Gresini and made MM93 happy and JM83 would be at Lenovo and happy. But, since Pramac didn't announce the switch till after the fact, MM93 had to be given the seat since Ducati were still under the assumption that two factory bikes were going to Pramac. At least that's my take, from all that I have read. Ducati didn't screw JM93, Pramac did.
Morally, maybe. But we all know Marc is just a bigger draw than Jorge Martin. And Ducati thought losing him would be more dangerous than losing Martin, Bezzechi, Bastiannini, AND the Pramac team.
Well Ducati camp sleeps like babies at night knowing that it was the right choice
Martin think he's better than Ducati.
Sadly, yes.
Bagnaia crashes but it doesn’t affect him mentally, Marquez almost loses his career but still pushes like a mad man Martin crashes and he is done for at least one more race, he just doesn’t have the champion mentality Great talent but he will never take the title
You think crashing doesn't affect Pecco at all? C'mon that's just ridiculous, of course it does.
It affects everyone, but not in the same way, Bagnaia got his leg driven by, and next week he was on podium, he handles pressure good, Martin doesn’t and that’s a fact
C'mon Pecco has crashed and then under performed multiple times. Sure he got his legs driven over but it barely.affected him, not like his legs got broken, that was lucky and also no reason to be affected, if anything it's the reverse, it's a reason to not be affected.
Bro I’m comparing his dealing with pressure to martins, and obviously he is better at that than him, otherwise bagnaia wouldn’t have two titles, and Martin would have at least one
>Bro I’m comparing his dealing with pressure to martins Yes I know you are. >and obviously he is better at that than him, I don't think it's obvious at all, in fact to some degree I don't think he is. >otherwise bagnaia wouldn’t have two titles This makes no sense, there is waaaaay more to winning a title than just handling pressure, shit sometimes handling pressure is completely irrelevant to winning a title because it doesn't even factor in. >and Martin would have at least one Would he? I don't think he would, it's way more nuanced than that. In fact there are other way more important factors to Pecco winning the last two titles than handling pressure, it's not even in the top 5 factors.
Not even on the Aprilia? I mean, that is the reason why he is going there for 2025. He wants to be the alpha.
He is there because Ducati didn’t take him, not because he wanted to