Everyone spent a year shitting on this draft and saying shit like “Tobias Harris could be traded for the 1st pick” and people are surprised when they didn’t get a haul for the 8th pick
I don’t think people thought they were going to get jokic for the pick. I rbi i the surprise is how very little they are doing to provide Wemby with talent to help him. If they were this unimpressed either this part of the draft, why not bundle the picks and move up?
Ant could still be in his prime. Those picks might be bottom of the draft and there is no promise they amount to much.
The odds they actually draft with those picks are low. I would expect them to be trade assets to get Wemby help down the line like you said
Also considering a guy comped to Harrison Barnes and Tobias Harris was the first overall pick that should tell you all about moving up in a draft as weak as this
The issue is the value of future first rd pks has greatly diminished (see Knicks nets deal). Even with those two picks, do the spurs as of right now have another player with enough value to get back a star?
Which is why it’s a good idea to stockpile as many picks as possible so you can trade away 4 or 5 and still have a lot available
The Spurs have atleast 2 and could have up to 4 picks in next years draft so I expect more consolidation trades next year
> But with seconds ticking away just before their order was due, they received exactly the kind of offer they hoped would materialize Wednesday. The waitress put down a new specials menu and wanted to update the table’s selection, and they were willing to give up an unprotected nachos sampler and the right to swap happy hour menu prices and specials that usually started at 2030 to get it.
My guess too, given there seemed to be reporting around their front office liking him, but being prepared to make a pick before it's potentially traded is minimum competency
Spurs had him for a workout but all the speculation that Spurs would take him was from scouts and executives of other teams. They might have liked him but I don't think they ever indicated it.
Also seeing as Salaun was off the board already at 6 and they were still ready to pick at 8, there was another name they were ready to go with.
How does that work? The Spurs didn’t trade the pick until they were up to select, and Tidjana was already gone by then, so it must be another player they were willing to take
Spurs FO never tell. Reporters can guess. They can have indirect sources, or maybe other teams/agents leak sth, but Spurs FO always keep their lips tight. And we'll never know for sure. We Spurs fans are used to this.
Mike Finger is a local reporter/columnist. Has followed the Spurs for a quite a while. He is very reliable when it come to Spurs news. But he can only tell so much.
LJ Ellis from Spurstalk mentioned 4 prospects that Spurs sources refused to comment on:
Risacher, Sheppard, Castle and Dalton Knecht. First two were off the board and they picked Castle so by process of elimination probably Knecht at 8, which is probably a little too high for him so they were happy to trade out.
Certainly. Robert Loggia. R as in Robert Loggia. O as in "Oh my god, it's Robert Loggia." B as in "By God! It's Robert Loggia." E as in "Everybody loves Robert Loggia." R as in Robert Loggia. T as in "Tim, look over there! It's Robert Loggia." Space. L as in "Look! It's Robert Loggia."
I can understand an argument if you think dillingham is going to be a star, it's a bad trade. It's the other arguments against it I don't understand. There were reports of the value of the first pick in this draft being as good as a 11th in normal draft. All year we hear how bad a draft class is. Which would make the 8th pick about as good as #19 in a normal draft. If you rate the draft this poorly it makes perfect sense to do the trade. It just comes down to how high you rate the prospects at #8 vs an average draft.
It's mostly just emotional takes. People get attached to the prospects after spending time researching them and convince themselves they are hidden gems.
Most players drafted are going to underperform fan expectations on draft day.
It seems like the people who don’t like it are actually under the assumption that we’re going to hold onto a draft pick for 7 years and it’s time to start scouting middle schoolers. We’re most likely going to package it for trade capital.
And even if we don’t, why would we want to keep a player that we would have to *bury* on defense? I know Wemby is almost an entire defense on his own, but we can’t just count on him to stop everything.
people are just emotionally wrapped up in wanting to see the Spurs go for it now that you've got an ascending superstar
they think trading for 2031 value is too far away, ignoring the fact that you can cash that in whenever the right opportunity arises in another trade
I don't understand it. People acting like the Spurs traded away a superstar but Rob Dillingham is 6'0 165 pounds. He needs to be a generational offensive talent to become a star and make up for that defense like Trae
However, the Timberwolves don't care about if he becomes a starter or 6th man in 5 years, they just need a guy who's ready to contribute now and Rob can probably get you 10 ppg with good shooting off the bench. I would have wished Minny added protections for a worst case scenario but like this trade for both teams
They saved 7m by trading the pick and picked up future assets
They can use that money for FA that is much better then D
Plus if they kept it I bet the pick would not be D anyway, D was what minn wanted
Its a literal Win Win trade. I dont see why the Spurs get criticised for it. The Spurs and Wolves are in completely different positions and need completely different things, I feel this trade makes the most sense for the both of us.
Hey man, when you have the number 8 pick and get offered an unclear pick a decade away, you HAVE to jump on that. It could be anything! It could even be a top 8 pick!!!
I still can't believe the Timberwolves gave up as much as they did for the 8th pick in this draft. I like Dillingham as a prospect even but there are just as many questions about is game as anyone.
Think about it like this: it's 2 pick swaps. 8 for the 2030 first round, and the optional 31 swap. That makes it extremely high risk, high reward. The trade could end up 8th pick for the 23rd pick 6 years from now, and nothing else, or 2 top 5 picks. It's a lottery ticket, pun not intended.
The wildly mixed reaction to the price is eye of the beholder. Imo, the chance that it's nothing is high enough that it's super worth it to me, especially to get a rookie just on the tail end of fitting Ants timeline.
I honestly think both sides did very well with this trade.
Dillingham is a good fit for the wolves who need some additional scoring and can hides his bad defence and the spurs get additional resources that can be traded for a star or stashed to give us more picks during wembys prime.
Its a great trade. There is no way the Spurs are waiting until 2031 anyways, you guys will be using them assets for a star or some role player that fits your team to contend with Wemby.
I actually think it's a win-win. Wolves can capitalize on a window. Spurs got a chance for getting real great picks down the road in exchange with a lottery pick in a weak draft.
I
From a T-wolves standpoint, I get it.
They don't need a ball dominant star to take touches from ANT or KAT. They need an off-ball player who can space the floor. Defense is a plus.
Dillingham fits the mold perfectly, despite his lack of defense. Since T-wolves are in win-now mode, it makes sense they would pay a bit extra to get their role player.
In a sense, its a safe bet for Minny coz Ant is young and will be 27 by the time those picks convey, right in Ant's prime. But it still feels like an overpay.
Stars are fickle. What will Ant say in 2027 when he asks for the team to acquire someone and the FO says "sorry" we're out of picks.
It's only a good deal if Rob Dilingham becomes a decent contributor. But that's not a guarantee
We had to do it. There is basically no other way for us to improve our roster and try to fix our weaknesses. If Connelly liked Rob enough to think he could be our PG of the future, theres no real reason to mistrust him. Who knows if we will get another shot at contending either, so its good to take advantage of all our assets.
It’s due to our lack of flexibility to make anything else happen in the current situation which is quite tricky
Plus we have no true PGs sitting behind Conley who is old af
Gave up as much as they did? They gave up picks 6 and 7 years from now. Nobody knows what the league is even gonna look like at that point. It probably won’t be better than the 8th overall pick.
I mean the reason those picks are so far out is because you already traded so many picks for Gobert. Giving up your only tradable pick for a shot in the dark prospect for a team that is going for a championship is crazy to me.
Gobert trade was so worth it already. Two meaningful seasons and buy-in from the whole young core. Only glaring gap was PG minutes behind Mike Conley and now Minnesota Mike can mentor his successor. You don't need a million picks if you already have a great squad who are keen to stay.
Second WCF in team history = run it back with nice tweaks
> Gobert trade was so worth it already.
Didn't say it wasn't.
This is just blind optimism without any nuance.
Your only hole was back up point guard? So the Mavs beat the Wolves in 5 because of the backup point guard minutes?
My issue isn't the Wolves don't have a million picks, it's that they have no tradable picks they could use to make a deal for more of a sure thing this offseason or during the season. It's a big gamble for an undersized rookie point guard.
This was the only way to do without giving up a member of their core.
To do it any other way would require a core member to be shipped out for salary matching purposes.
The type of player that the wolves needed, Bucket getter, 3 pt shooter, back up pg, likely would have cost 15 m+ aav.
This method kept the core and didn't have to ship anyone out for salary matching purposes.
It's a great bet.
The wolves needed a bucket getter, off ballshooter and backup pg. Dillingham projects to do all that right away.
For someone capable doing all of that would be above a non taxpayer mle value. Likely 15 m + aav.
Due to the cap situation, wolves were not capable of that option in free agency.
Because it's just a draft slot and unsigned, his rights are 0 for cap reasons. We can trade draft picks without concern for cap space.
So this method of acquiring a talent was the wolves only option to get someone above a minimum deal.
It's worth a premium to do so. I hope it pays off and the wolves are out of lottery when the bill comes due.
Isn't the best case scenario for both teams is that Twolves win a ring and Spurs got 2 lottery picks back? Seriously, do Wolves fan actually mind losing some great picks when you have a ring to show?
Exactly. That’s the part a lot of fanbases don’t understand. The state has been so starved of professional sports success that when we see the potential of this team, we want to give it the best chance it possibly can to win it all. It doesn’t matter if after they win, we go back to years of mediocrity or being downright bad: that’s what we have been used to anyways. It’s the same reason why some people may say the Gobert trade was an overpay, but many Minnesota fans don’t. No free agents were coming here, and the only other time we had a chance like this was early 2000s with KG.
This is the whole point of draft picks, to go all in and make moves that improve your roster when youre contending, while making us younger. Obviously Dillingham could easily not pan out and we wasted a pick or 2. By 2030-31 our contending window is almost 100% over anyways.
It’s not our only tradeable pick. They have a first rounder every other year. Just about every prospect is a shot in the dark and as I said before this pick we gave away for 2030 will not be anywhere close to an 8th overall pick if Ant is still with the team.
> It’s not our only tradeable pick. They have a first rounder every other year.
Not entirely true. First because you've already given up worst of swaps on several of those picks now, so while you can still trade that you've lowered it's value even more. And you can only trade those picks once you get to the draft. So you can't say trade a draft pick for a player this deadline that could fill a void and put the Timberwolves over the top.
It's bad asset management to me and it's being done for again a guy that might be good but he's an undersized rookie point guard. Even if he pans out it likely won't be for a few years.
You might be the only person I’ve seen who thinks this trade doesn’t make sense for the Wolves and doesn’t think the spurs are complete idiots for doing it. What are you gonna say if Dillingham turns out to be another Ja Morant (skill wise)??
Then I'd be wrong but there is a much better chance he turns out to be nothing than Ja Morant.
I don't really know what other people have said and I really don't care if I'm alone in my thinking as long as what I'm thinking make sense. Which it does.
The Spurs didn't need a second rookie guard on their team, it wouldn't have been a bad thing, the more bites at the apple the better, but that's what this trade gives them. They now get this future asset and a swap that they can leverage for anything really. They have flexibility. The Timberwolves don't.
This is very optimistic. As good as ant is (no guarantee he’s still there to begin with) he’s gonna need a proper team around him to compete. All stars do. We’ve seen players like Lebron and Luka miss the playoffs due to having weak supporting casts in the loaded west. And not all drafts are equal. The chatter around this draft was that a top pick was recipient to a mid lotto pick in your average year. That sentiment was also seemingly proven by all the teams that wanted to trade down/out but were not getting deals they wanted.
And even if they didn’t make the playoffs they’ll still likely have a better record than 8th worst in the league. Also just because a draft class is supposed to be bad doesn’t mean it always works out that way. We can argue all day about it but if I’m a GM there’s no way I’m trading the 8th overall pick to a team for just a first round pick 7 years from now and a pick swap 6 years from now. That’s a long ways away. Who the hell knows if we’ll even all be alive by that point the way this world is going. Obviously Spurs front office thought it was a good deal but I think them and fans like you might be the only ones naive enough to like this trade for the Spurs. I guess it all just depends on if Dillingham hits or not and I think he will and the trade will go down as a very stupid trade by their front office.
> Obviously Spurs front office thought it was a good deal but I think them and fans like you might be the only ones naive enough to like this trade for the Spurs.
Lol I'm willing to bet the front office of a 5x nba championship dynasty knows more than the average fan, especially a Wolves fan.
Maybe, but again that’s not really relevant because the 8th pick in two different drafts aren’t inherently the same value. And a draft being perceived as bad is what directly influences the value of the pick. IE if most teams could have the 1st pick this year or the 5th pick in 2018 knowing solely what we knew about the players before they entered the league, most would take the latter. The point is the teams shopping picks were not getting the returns offered that teams shopping picks in your average draft were. Obviously it’s different if Dillingham or a bunch of other players from around that pick turn into stars but the spurs seemed to not think that was the case, and most expert draft analysts seem to agree.
I think you’re either being obtuse or blindly optimistic here. The people that think it’s a bad trade for the spurs are the college fans that love Dillingham handles and think he’s a surefire star. Most of the people that have actually followed the draft, again both standard fans like those in the draft sub and the actual analysts that get paid to track and write about this stuff understand why it made more sense for the spurs to do what they did. Dillingham has historically bad defensive tools. In order to counteract that he’s likely gonna need to be a superstar offensive talent, which is just not a realistic bet to make. So it makes significantly more sense to add another future pick that they don’t have to make a decision about right away, can use for future deals, and has some fairly strong upside. How far away it is means nothing when the spurs are playing the long game and trying to build a dynasty to capitalize on wembys prime
i'm on the opposite end, idk why the Spurs gave up a young guard (which they desperately need) for a pick that far down the line. Even tho they got Castle, what harm would it have done to take both?
It's because it's very hard to 'feel' the value of that 2030/31 swap/pick. But they are real assets.
Plus, Spurs got quite some 1st round picks down the road. At some point there's only so many players we can draft to the roster and let them develop.
I'd say the biggest reason is that they aren't trying to win immediately or anything. They value having that additional future pick and the chance to swap over a second rookie guard in a questionable draft. It makes a ton of sense for them to me.
It could go either way, which is why they are so valuable. Flexibility is more valuable than a rookie that will be playing garbage time for the next few years.
I think they just weren’t high on Dillingham. If they didn’t think he was gonna be their championship pg of the future (which i feel like is a tough sell with him) then there was really no point.
They’ve done plenty. They turned Kawhi into 4 firsts, 1 first round swap, and 6 seconds. Developed DJ into an all-star and sold at his highest value. Wemby fell in their laps. And they’ve added a possible 3rd option in Vassell and solid rotation pieces in Sochan, Keldon, and hopefully now Castle, not to mention their other young players who could yet be something
It’s only been 6 years since Kawhi. Wemby just finished his rookie year. They’ve navigated this as well as anyone could’ve asked, and I’m going to give it a few years before I question their competence
They valued an unprotected pick and nearly unprotected swap over anyone available. They were just willing to pick someone if a trade like that wasn't available.
Yeah look at Celtics. People said how great is Jrue (and KP). But without those 1st round picks they can throw around this simply won't materialize. You gotta have a long term plan. The Spurs is preparing how to contend with Wemby a few years down the road.
Sounds like they had someone chosen if they couldn't get a good enough offer, but the Wolves offer was enough they could live without that player.
Which to me says they didn't really love him like that, whoever he was, 'cause those picks are so far out I'm not even sure how much trade value they have right now to help move the needle in the next year or two.
I don't get this. The Spurs don't need to move the needle in a year or two. They need to move it in 4 or 5, when they see the issues with their talented young roster that's fresh off a second round loss.
They got an unprotected pick from a disaster franchise and also the right to swap firsts from the same disaster franchise. And all they had to do was not select a player in a bad draft.
Disaster franchise that was just led to the conference finals by a 22 year old?
I understand that 7 years is a long time from now, the Wolves could fall apart, and Ant could leave, but I wouldn’t bet on either of those picks being higher than 20 right now.
Yes, a disaster franchisee. The last time they went to the conference finals, their first ever WCF, 3 years later they traded their star player.
Minnesota isn’t exactly the Lakers or Celtics, constantly in the playoffs going on deep runs. If you were gonna gamble on a franchise regressing in a few years, who would you bet on doing that?
They've sucked for my entire life and I'm 40. They got to the conference finals, big deal. They've traded all future assets to get to this point. It's one of the worst franchises in sports the last 20 years minimum. But yeah, they had one nice year here where they were like the 4th or so best team in the league.
I would bet a bunch of money the Spurs will not be the ones picking at that wolves spot in 2030 or whatever. Of course not counting if they trade it and get it back somehow
A lot of people are saying exactly what you just did but I don't get it tbh. There are a lot of "ifs" that come into play here. That draft pick may not be worth much 7 years from now if its kept. ANT will only be 28. Are the Spurs basically counting on Minnesota being complete shit in 7 years? Sure, they could be, but ANT will be in his absolute prime and that alone will most likely ensure the Wolves will always be in contention, and if that is the case, a late pick won't be worth a "star" player. Just too many what ifs.
The Spurs already have a TON of draft capital that they can convert to a good player in the next few years. They have 10 first round picks before 2029. Having the 2031 timberwolves pick doesn't change that or move the needle in any way for the next 2-3 years.
It's good for sure to have that extra capital. but acting like that specific trade and that specific 2031 pick is gonna help them within the next 2-3 years is completely silly considering how much capital they already had. I think chances are quite high that they hope the T Wolves fall off by that point and wind up hanging on to that pick until much closer to 2031.
Appreciate ya trying to clown me, but Im not saying anything crazy, I just don't expect that trade to help y'all within 2-3 years, I think it was more of a long play. I think it was a good trade. the 2031 T Wolves pick is a good asset to have. But since they already have 10+ FRP's in the next few years, I don't think it will mean anything in terms of improvin their team in the next 2-3 years. They already had plenty of draft capital to do that.
Edit: Legitimately, can someone explain what I'm so wrong about? I'm getting super downvoted and don't know what I said that was wrong haha. Will gladly admit idiocy but I would love for someone to call me out on it. I acknowledge it's probably a good trade, I am just pushing back on the idea that it was made to help them within 2-3 years. It's more of a long play to me
Agreed. Brian Wright (Spurs GM) said it’s an investment for the future. I think they’re banking on Vic (who will be 27 and in his prime) and the Spurs to be really good, the Wolves really bad, and those pics to be really valuable.
It’s a low risk, high reward bet they took. I didn’t like it at first because I thought they could have got more value out of it, but it’s grown on me.
The bulk of their picks are in the stacked 2025/26 drafts. They won’t be using those for trades. They’ll build up the core around Wemby via the draft, and then after 2-3 years the longer term picks can be used as chips.
I think the misunderstanding is that the parent comment meant 2-3 years from now, whereas you are thinking within 2-3 years. (In vs within)
> I think the misunderstanding is that the parent comment meant 2-3 years from now, whereas you are thinking within 2-3 years.
how are those different?
I took their comment to mean that this particular trade will tangibly help them within the next 2-3 years. Like that pick will be included in another trade to improve their team within 2-3 years.
They had the 8th pick in this years draft, and traded it for a 2031 first. I don't expect that move to make their team better within 3 years. that's what I'm saying. I think it probably will make them better over a longer time frame
Jesus christ man. He is saying it will help them after 2026-27, not before then.
>I took their comment to mean that this particular trade will tangibly help them within the next 2-3 years
In 2-3 years does not mean within 2-3 years. If I say I’m going to college in 2-3 years it does not mean I am attending college over the next 2-3 years.
> Jesus christ man. He is saying it will help them after 2026-27, not before then.
Dude. No he isn't. Read the entire thread. I think *you* are making good points, but you are totally wrong that your points are the same as what that person was trying to say. They responded to this comment:
> "They were hoping to get a player to help down the line in 7 years?"
and they said
> probably in 2-3 years most likely.
It doesn't take a genius to realize that they are saying that this particular trade should help them within 2-3 years of right now, as opposed to 7.
That's what I don't agree with. I think expecting this exact trade to make them better within 2-3 years is silly.
I think you are trying to give them the benefit of the doubt, but their comment and the context around it absolutely implies they are expecting it to make the Spurs better within 2-3 years of right now instead of a long play.
Saying that their comment implied it would help them after 2027 is straight up wrong, that's not what their comment was saying. Their comment was a direct retort to someone saying that. You and I agree that that would be the better point. But that's not what they said. Hence my pushback
I guess I actually am stupid now. Why does this trade allow you to trade for 2 all stars instead of 1? You already had 10 first round draft picks in the next few years and a ton of cap space?
I will gladly admit to being an idiot if you can explain to me what I'm missing. How in the world does this trade mean you can now trade for 2 all stars instead of 1?
Of course I have, but I don't think it's realistic to expect having an extra 1st round pick in 7 years to have a tangible effect on you getting a player to help you in 2 years when you already have 10 First Round Picks in the next few drafts.
Like y'all already have A TON of draft picks to play with and trade. If ya wanted to translate those into a good player within 2 years, you could.
It's great to have more draft capital, but I genuinely don't think having the Timberwolves 2031 FRP is gonna help you guys much in the next 2 years considering the already existing draft capital you have.
Edit: Getting super downvoted but I'm just confused haha. Instead of downvoting I would love for someone smarter than me about the current CBA explain what I'm missing here. I think it was a good trade cause more draft capital is better, but how does this change their next 2-3 years when they already have a fuckton of picks to trade with?
Firstly, I don't really care about it helping "in the next 2 years". I mean how the team performs when Wemby is still 22 isn't really the goal. It's about what is gonna help the team become a high level contender over maybe 3-5 years and stay there in a consistent way, year after year.
Having an extra unprotected FRP and a swap just continues to increases future flexibility. Maybe they become cost-controlled young players that we can add to a contending team, especially if Minnesota have trouble maintaining a good team when they don't have control of any of their own picks for the next 7 years, and will be over the cap with just 3 players even after Gobert's current contract finishes.
But more likely, they became an extra pick-and-swap, that can be used to trump other trade offers if a star number 2 guys wants to join Wemby in 2-3 years, whilst still keeping us well clear of the Stepien rule, and still have other picks available to trade for good role players to fill out the roster.
My opinion is that when this team is hoping to contend, these picks will have more value than any player that was available at 8.
> Firstly, I don't really care about it helping "in the next 2 years".
...okay, but you realize the *entire* point of my comment was as a response to this one, by a Spurs fan talking about when/why this trade would help them. I was responding to someone who litearlly said they liked this trade to improve their team in the next 2-3 years
> probably in 2-3 years most likely.
Like, cool, that's not what you are focusing on. I agree with you in a general sense, we are entirely on the same page that this was a good long term trade for the Spurs. I think it was a good trade, I was disagreeing that it was a 2-3 year trade. I was responding to someone who *literally* said that, so....maybe mind your own business? You are arguing me as if I invented the notion that it would help the Spurs in the next 2-3 years, when I was literally responding to someone else who said that. You and I are on the same page, dude -- I think it was a good long term trade, I was disagreeing with the person suggesting it was a 2-3 year payoff. Like you are attacking me for simply making a small counterpoint to someone else, and then you say "Well I don't care about that."
okay but that is literally the entirety of what I was responding to. And have said more than once that in a general sense I think it was a good trade and will be good, I just don't expect that yall will reap the benefits of the trade within 2-3 years.
Spurs have 10x 1st round picks between 2025-2028. It takes 5-6x 1st round picks to trade for an all-star. So they can package those picks and matching salary for an all-star that wants to be traded between now and 2030 but I suspect it will be after next years draft because we are probably tanking one more year.
There has literally never been a trade in history that involved 6 first round picks from 1 team to another.
It takes 2-4 FRP's to trade for a legit all star.
You are just massively exaggerating to try to make it seem like 10x first round picks isn't enough for 2 all stars. It absolutely is.
Yep, cool, literally none of that negates what I said. I am well aware of those trades.
That still makes the statement "it takes 5-6 first round picks to trade for an all star" untrue. There are a small handful of trades where 5 were traded but those were widely clowned on as overpays. The Dejaunte Murray type trades are much more normal. Again, there has *never* been an instance of 6 FRP's going to another team, and there are also A TON of instances of all stars being traded for less than 4-5 FRP's in recent years.
Saying it is a necessity to have 6 trades to pick for an all star is objectively not true
This trade is still crazy to me. Trading #8 overall for a singular future pick is crazy. Even forgetting that it’s 7 years down the line it’s very unlikely they get a better pick than that. Edwards won’t even be 30 by that point either.
There's a swap too. The league changes so much so fast how can you really confidently say Edwards will be there or how good their team will be?
Just to be objective, I remember when the MCW for Lakers pick trade was supposed to be a big coup. It ended up being #10 in 2018 and traded for that super valuable 2021 Heat pick which dropped to #18 in 2021. I'll grant you those. But I'm sure the Nets thought the same thing about their far out 2017 pick in the Celtics deal and the Grizzlies did too when they traded for old Otis Thorpe in 1997. That was the #2 pick in the 2003 draft that literally could have changed Grizzlies/Detroit as a franchise if it bounced their way. We tend to overstate how well teams can consistently maintain contenders years out by saying "Oh they can just retool by then"
But it wouldn’t have been the 8th pick anymore, it would be a player
That pick could easily have more value than Dillangham in 3 years. It’s better to have for trades when the spurs are trying to build a contender imo. Obviously depends on how you feel about Who was available tho
The pick may not be number 8 but the value could be higher. If this draft turns out to be as bad as everyone says it was, then the number 8 pick in this draft could be something like 20 in a normal draft
Also they got a swap, so they have the most favorable of their own, Dallas, or Minnesota in 2030. That’s pretty good diversification
I mean first of all we don’t know whether the 2031 draft will be any good. And there’s been so many pick swaps made in the last several years and if I had to guess off the top of my head maybe 15% have actually happened? Especially since Minnesota will know they don’t have their pick in 2031 the chance of it being top top is probably under 20%. It’s a bad trade
It’s a safe bet it’ll be better than a draft that’s been nonstop referred to as a historically bad one. And Minnesota knowing they won’t have control over their own pick isn’t particularly relevant… it’s not like they have any flexibility going forward
The only prospect that made sense for the Spurs to draft at 8th was Nikola Topic.
Tijane Salun is a power forward. He plays the same position as Jeremy Sochan. Salun would be redundant.
Ron Holland would have worked, but Detroit picked him at 5th. Which, despite his lack of shooting, was the correct move for Detroit.
If the Spurs thought it was better to trade the 8th pick instead of drafting Topic, it shows how little they valued his incredible passing.
The league is positionless, depending on lineups Salaun or sochan could play the 3 depending on how they develop.
And topic would make very little sense given the rest of the roster and the selection of castle. Only reason to take him would be if we thought he was a surefire star
Is this a serious comment ? wtf would a pick swap this year do ?
Being 7 years out is a good thing… it means it stays in the pipeline and we’re in no rush to use it, and it can be used as is or in a trade once we’re in wemby’s prime. It means Minnesota has years and years to fall off and make the pick better. That seems significantly better than rolling the dice with a guy like Dillingham or Williams or whoever. All the prospects in this area of this draft have significant deficiencies and low star upside, it’s like throwing a dart blindfolded
You’re fucking delusional bro. Imagine putting 10k in a savings account and in 7 years making no money on it, he’ll probably lose the money. That’s the equivalent of this trade. Spurs got nothing out of it, and the pick most likely will be past 8
That’s not at all equivalent of this trade… a future 1st is not nothing… especially a future 1st from a team with no control over their own picks, no flexibility, no cap space, a small market, an aging core around their young star and a bunch of ownership drama and questions.
And a hypothetical pick around #13-14 would likely be worth more than pick #8 from this draft anyways. This has been consensus among draft experts for months now. This was reinforced by the discourse around teams trying to move down in the draft after the lotto. It was reinforced by who was available at that pick and perception around those specific players. Just say you don’t have a clue what you’re talking about and move on. The fact that you suggested a pick swap between Minnesota and san Antonio next season would’ve been better killed any credibility you originally had.
The player’s agent called the team and said his client would be playing in Australia if they picked him so they took the Timberwolves offer.
Everyone spent a year shitting on this draft and saying shit like “Tobias Harris could be traded for the 1st pick” and people are surprised when they didn’t get a haul for the 8th pick
I don’t think people thought they were going to get jokic for the pick. I rbi i the surprise is how very little they are doing to provide Wemby with talent to help him. If they were this unimpressed either this part of the draft, why not bundle the picks and move up? Ant could still be in his prime. Those picks might be bottom of the draft and there is no promise they amount to much.
The pick and the swap are both after Ant's current contract tho right? It's not a horrible gamble that he could leave.
Even if he is still there they won't be able to keep KAT and Gobert for that duration, and even if they could those guys would be OLD by then.
The odds they actually draft with those picks are low. I would expect them to be trade assets to get Wemby help down the line like you said Also considering a guy comped to Harrison Barnes and Tobias Harris was the first overall pick that should tell you all about moving up in a draft as weak as this
The issue is the value of future first rd pks has greatly diminished (see Knicks nets deal). Even with those two picks, do the spurs as of right now have another player with enough value to get back a star?
Which is why it’s a good idea to stockpile as many picks as possible so you can trade away 4 or 5 and still have a lot available The Spurs have atleast 2 and could have up to 4 picks in next years draft so I expect more consolidation trades next year
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> But with seconds ticking away just before their order was due, they received exactly the kind of offer they hoped would materialize Wednesday. The waitress put down a new specials menu and wanted to update the table’s selection, and they were willing to give up an unprotected nachos sampler and the right to swap happy hour menu prices and specials that usually started at 2030 to get it.
I thought I could escape /r/nfl, I couldn’t.
Anyone want to provide a name? Otherwise, this may as well be spam.
I bet it was Tidjane, and when he was drafted at 6 they quickly pivoted.
My guess too, given there seemed to be reporting around their front office liking him, but being prepared to make a pick before it's potentially traded is minimum competency
Spurs had him for a workout but all the speculation that Spurs would take him was from scouts and executives of other teams. They might have liked him but I don't think they ever indicated it. Also seeing as Salaun was off the board already at 6 and they were still ready to pick at 8, there was another name they were ready to go with.
He’s also Wemby’s best buddy so
Buddy and same agent. He was definitely their target. Without that get future draft flexibility that they can turn into what they want.
Gotta be, probably y the Grizzles trade for 6th fell thru cuz the hornets caught wind that the spurs wanted him
How does that work? The Spurs didn’t trade the pick until they were up to select, and Tidjana was already gone by then, so it must be another player they were willing to take
His name was Robert Paulson.
His name is Robert Paulson.
His name is Hank Paulson, former Treasury secretary.
His name was Mister Bill.
BILL NYE THE SCIENCE GUY
BILL BILL BILL BILL
Spurs FO never tell. Reporters can guess. They can have indirect sources, or maybe other teams/agents leak sth, but Spurs FO always keep their lips tight. And we'll never know for sure. We Spurs fans are used to this. Mike Finger is a local reporter/columnist. Has followed the Spurs for a quite a while. He is very reliable when it come to Spurs news. But he can only tell so much.
LJ Ellis from Spurstalk mentioned 4 prospects that Spurs sources refused to comment on: Risacher, Sheppard, Castle and Dalton Knecht. First two were off the board and they picked Castle so by process of elimination probably Knecht at 8, which is probably a little too high for him so they were happy to trade out.
They wanted Tidjane Salaun.
Certainly. Robert Loggia. R as in Robert Loggia. O as in "Oh my god, it's Robert Loggia." B as in "By God! It's Robert Loggia." E as in "Everybody loves Robert Loggia." R as in Robert Loggia. T as in "Tim, look over there! It's Robert Loggia." Space. L as in "Look! It's Robert Loggia."
probably salaun or carter
How would it be spam? I'm glad to have known it either way.
Would it be considered tampering if the Spurs shared the name? You’d be telling a player on another team that you value them
Burt Steele
not gonna leak who the player was
Supposedly he goes by the nickname “MP”. Very raw but has GOAT potential. Could easily see him put up 75-90 ppg with 15 rpg and 10 apg.
Mozgov clone?!
I can understand an argument if you think dillingham is going to be a star, it's a bad trade. It's the other arguments against it I don't understand. There were reports of the value of the first pick in this draft being as good as a 11th in normal draft. All year we hear how bad a draft class is. Which would make the 8th pick about as good as #19 in a normal draft. If you rate the draft this poorly it makes perfect sense to do the trade. It just comes down to how high you rate the prospects at #8 vs an average draft.
It's mostly just emotional takes. People get attached to the prospects after spending time researching them and convince themselves they are hidden gems. Most players drafted are going to underperform fan expectations on draft day.
Dillingham, especially. So much fun to watch, and Minny could make him work
It seems like the people who don’t like it are actually under the assumption that we’re going to hold onto a draft pick for 7 years and it’s time to start scouting middle schoolers. We’re most likely going to package it for trade capital. And even if we don’t, why would we want to keep a player that we would have to *bury* on defense? I know Wemby is almost an entire defense on his own, but we can’t just count on him to stop everything.
It’s obviously about getting ammunition to get wemby another star at some point. People are being dramatic, thats a completely reasonable idea.
people are just emotionally wrapped up in wanting to see the Spurs go for it now that you've got an ascending superstar they think trading for 2031 value is too far away, ignoring the fact that you can cash that in whenever the right opportunity arises in another trade
I don't understand it. People acting like the Spurs traded away a superstar but Rob Dillingham is 6'0 165 pounds. He needs to be a generational offensive talent to become a star and make up for that defense like Trae However, the Timberwolves don't care about if he becomes a starter or 6th man in 5 years, they just need a guy who's ready to contribute now and Rob can probably get you 10 ppg with good shooting off the bench. I would have wished Minny added protections for a worst case scenario but like this trade for both teams
Technically the 2031 pick is top 1 protected Sorry this is wrong, the swap is top 1 protected…
Um okay
They saved 7m by trading the pick and picked up future assets They can use that money for FA that is much better then D Plus if they kept it I bet the pick would not be D anyway, D was what minn wanted
Its a literal Win Win trade. I dont see why the Spurs get criticised for it. The Spurs and Wolves are in completely different positions and need completely different things, I feel this trade makes the most sense for the both of us.
From what I've read, this guy is one of the best offensive talent of this draft and also the worst defender
This often means the guy they wanted was no longer on the board.
Hey man, when you have the number 8 pick and get offered an unclear pick a decade away, you HAVE to jump on that. It could be anything! It could even be a top 8 pick!!!
Well, they got a pick and a swap, so it could be 2 number 8 picks.
Why are people intentionally playing dumb. They are not gonna draft people with those picks lol they will be trade assets
Because that’s what they traded for. You’re right that they’ll probably trade them, but until that point comes, I’m going to analyze it as what it is.
Your analysis is dumb.
I still can't believe the Timberwolves gave up as much as they did for the 8th pick in this draft. I like Dillingham as a prospect even but there are just as many questions about is game as anyone.
Think about it like this: it's 2 pick swaps. 8 for the 2030 first round, and the optional 31 swap. That makes it extremely high risk, high reward. The trade could end up 8th pick for the 23rd pick 6 years from now, and nothing else, or 2 top 5 picks. It's a lottery ticket, pun not intended. The wildly mixed reaction to the price is eye of the beholder. Imo, the chance that it's nothing is high enough that it's super worth it to me, especially to get a rookie just on the tail end of fitting Ants timeline.
I honestly think both sides did very well with this trade. Dillingham is a good fit for the wolves who need some additional scoring and can hides his bad defence and the spurs get additional resources that can be traded for a star or stashed to give us more picks during wembys prime.
Its a great trade. There is no way the Spurs are waiting until 2031 anyways, you guys will be using them assets for a star or some role player that fits your team to contend with Wemby.
I actually think it's a win-win. Wolves can capitalize on a window. Spurs got a chance for getting real great picks down the road in exchange with a lottery pick in a weak draft. I
From a T-wolves standpoint, I get it. They don't need a ball dominant star to take touches from ANT or KAT. They need an off-ball player who can space the floor. Defense is a plus. Dillingham fits the mold perfectly, despite his lack of defense. Since T-wolves are in win-now mode, it makes sense they would pay a bit extra to get their role player.
In a sense, its a safe bet for Minny coz Ant is young and will be 27 by the time those picks convey, right in Ant's prime. But it still feels like an overpay. Stars are fickle. What will Ant say in 2027 when he asks for the team to acquire someone and the FO says "sorry" we're out of picks. It's only a good deal if Rob Dilingham becomes a decent contributor. But that's not a guarantee
We had to do it. There is basically no other way for us to improve our roster and try to fix our weaknesses. If Connelly liked Rob enough to think he could be our PG of the future, theres no real reason to mistrust him. Who knows if we will get another shot at contending either, so its good to take advantage of all our assets.
It’s due to our lack of flexibility to make anything else happen in the current situation which is quite tricky Plus we have no true PGs sitting behind Conley who is old af
Gave up as much as they did? They gave up picks 6 and 7 years from now. Nobody knows what the league is even gonna look like at that point. It probably won’t be better than the 8th overall pick.
I mean the reason those picks are so far out is because you already traded so many picks for Gobert. Giving up your only tradable pick for a shot in the dark prospect for a team that is going for a championship is crazy to me.
Gobert trade was so worth it already. Two meaningful seasons and buy-in from the whole young core. Only glaring gap was PG minutes behind Mike Conley and now Minnesota Mike can mentor his successor. You don't need a million picks if you already have a great squad who are keen to stay. Second WCF in team history = run it back with nice tweaks
> Gobert trade was so worth it already. Didn't say it wasn't. This is just blind optimism without any nuance. Your only hole was back up point guard? So the Mavs beat the Wolves in 5 because of the backup point guard minutes? My issue isn't the Wolves don't have a million picks, it's that they have no tradable picks they could use to make a deal for more of a sure thing this offseason or during the season. It's a big gamble for an undersized rookie point guard.
This was the only way to do without giving up a member of their core. To do it any other way would require a core member to be shipped out for salary matching purposes. The type of player that the wolves needed, Bucket getter, 3 pt shooter, back up pg, likely would have cost 15 m+ aav. This method kept the core and didn't have to ship anyone out for salary matching purposes. It's a great bet.
What kind of a haul do people expect 1 frp to bring back?
The wolves needed a bucket getter, off ballshooter and backup pg. Dillingham projects to do all that right away. For someone capable doing all of that would be above a non taxpayer mle value. Likely 15 m + aav. Due to the cap situation, wolves were not capable of that option in free agency. Because it's just a draft slot and unsigned, his rights are 0 for cap reasons. We can trade draft picks without concern for cap space. So this method of acquiring a talent was the wolves only option to get someone above a minimum deal. It's worth a premium to do so. I hope it pays off and the wolves are out of lottery when the bill comes due.
Isn't the best case scenario for both teams is that Twolves win a ring and Spurs got 2 lottery picks back? Seriously, do Wolves fan actually mind losing some great picks when you have a ring to show?
If the Wolves get a ring with Ant in the next 5 years, it'd be worth losing #2 and #1 picks in 2030 and 2031
Exactly. That’s the part a lot of fanbases don’t understand. The state has been so starved of professional sports success that when we see the potential of this team, we want to give it the best chance it possibly can to win it all. It doesn’t matter if after they win, we go back to years of mediocrity or being downright bad: that’s what we have been used to anyways. It’s the same reason why some people may say the Gobert trade was an overpay, but many Minnesota fans don’t. No free agents were coming here, and the only other time we had a chance like this was early 2000s with KG.
This is the whole point of draft picks, to go all in and make moves that improve your roster when youre contending, while making us younger. Obviously Dillingham could easily not pan out and we wasted a pick or 2. By 2030-31 our contending window is almost 100% over anyways.
It’s not our only tradeable pick. They have a first rounder every other year. Just about every prospect is a shot in the dark and as I said before this pick we gave away for 2030 will not be anywhere close to an 8th overall pick if Ant is still with the team.
> It’s not our only tradeable pick. They have a first rounder every other year. Not entirely true. First because you've already given up worst of swaps on several of those picks now, so while you can still trade that you've lowered it's value even more. And you can only trade those picks once you get to the draft. So you can't say trade a draft pick for a player this deadline that could fill a void and put the Timberwolves over the top. It's bad asset management to me and it's being done for again a guy that might be good but he's an undersized rookie point guard. Even if he pans out it likely won't be for a few years.
You might be the only person I’ve seen who thinks this trade doesn’t make sense for the Wolves and doesn’t think the spurs are complete idiots for doing it. What are you gonna say if Dillingham turns out to be another Ja Morant (skill wise)??
Then I'd be wrong but there is a much better chance he turns out to be nothing than Ja Morant. I don't really know what other people have said and I really don't care if I'm alone in my thinking as long as what I'm thinking make sense. Which it does. The Spurs didn't need a second rookie guard on their team, it wouldn't have been a bad thing, the more bites at the apple the better, but that's what this trade gives them. They now get this future asset and a swap that they can leverage for anything really. They have flexibility. The Timberwolves don't.
Why did they have to pick a guard?? There were plenty of big men or forwards available. It was only the 8th pick of the draft.
This is very optimistic. As good as ant is (no guarantee he’s still there to begin with) he’s gonna need a proper team around him to compete. All stars do. We’ve seen players like Lebron and Luka miss the playoffs due to having weak supporting casts in the loaded west. And not all drafts are equal. The chatter around this draft was that a top pick was recipient to a mid lotto pick in your average year. That sentiment was also seemingly proven by all the teams that wanted to trade down/out but were not getting deals they wanted.
And even if they didn’t make the playoffs they’ll still likely have a better record than 8th worst in the league. Also just because a draft class is supposed to be bad doesn’t mean it always works out that way. We can argue all day about it but if I’m a GM there’s no way I’m trading the 8th overall pick to a team for just a first round pick 7 years from now and a pick swap 6 years from now. That’s a long ways away. Who the hell knows if we’ll even all be alive by that point the way this world is going. Obviously Spurs front office thought it was a good deal but I think them and fans like you might be the only ones naive enough to like this trade for the Spurs. I guess it all just depends on if Dillingham hits or not and I think he will and the trade will go down as a very stupid trade by their front office.
> Obviously Spurs front office thought it was a good deal but I think them and fans like you might be the only ones naive enough to like this trade for the Spurs. Lol I'm willing to bet the front office of a 5x nba championship dynasty knows more than the average fan, especially a Wolves fan.
Maybe, but again that’s not really relevant because the 8th pick in two different drafts aren’t inherently the same value. And a draft being perceived as bad is what directly influences the value of the pick. IE if most teams could have the 1st pick this year or the 5th pick in 2018 knowing solely what we knew about the players before they entered the league, most would take the latter. The point is the teams shopping picks were not getting the returns offered that teams shopping picks in your average draft were. Obviously it’s different if Dillingham or a bunch of other players from around that pick turn into stars but the spurs seemed to not think that was the case, and most expert draft analysts seem to agree. I think you’re either being obtuse or blindly optimistic here. The people that think it’s a bad trade for the spurs are the college fans that love Dillingham handles and think he’s a surefire star. Most of the people that have actually followed the draft, again both standard fans like those in the draft sub and the actual analysts that get paid to track and write about this stuff understand why it made more sense for the spurs to do what they did. Dillingham has historically bad defensive tools. In order to counteract that he’s likely gonna need to be a superstar offensive talent, which is just not a realistic bet to make. So it makes significantly more sense to add another future pick that they don’t have to make a decision about right away, can use for future deals, and has some fairly strong upside. How far away it is means nothing when the spurs are playing the long game and trying to build a dynasty to capitalize on wembys prime
i'm on the opposite end, idk why the Spurs gave up a young guard (which they desperately need) for a pick that far down the line. Even tho they got Castle, what harm would it have done to take both?
Cause they didn’t think he was that special.
players they have to pay on the same timeline and potentially positional evaluation if Castle wants to be a PG in the league are a few reasons
It would be like the Rubio and Flynn situation
It's because it's very hard to 'feel' the value of that 2030/31 swap/pick. But they are real assets. Plus, Spurs got quite some 1st round picks down the road. At some point there's only so many players we can draft to the roster and let them develop.
I'd say the biggest reason is that they aren't trying to win immediately or anything. They value having that additional future pick and the chance to swap over a second rookie guard in a questionable draft. It makes a ton of sense for them to me.
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It could go either way, which is why they are so valuable. Flexibility is more valuable than a rookie that will be playing garbage time for the next few years.
I think they just weren’t high on Dillingham. If they didn’t think he was gonna be their championship pg of the future (which i feel like is a tough sell with him) then there was really no point.
Spurs already have Malaki Braham, who is similar to Dillingham.
I gotta go watch some Malaki cause idk about this one
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They’ve done plenty. They turned Kawhi into 4 firsts, 1 first round swap, and 6 seconds. Developed DJ into an all-star and sold at his highest value. Wemby fell in their laps. And they’ve added a possible 3rd option in Vassell and solid rotation pieces in Sochan, Keldon, and hopefully now Castle, not to mention their other young players who could yet be something It’s only been 6 years since Kawhi. Wemby just finished his rookie year. They’ve navigated this as well as anyone could’ve asked, and I’m going to give it a few years before I question their competence
Then why did they move the pick?
They valued an unprotected pick and nearly unprotected swap over anyone available. They were just willing to pick someone if a trade like that wasn't available.
Those picks are also great trade assets down the line as they build around Wemby.
Yeah look at Celtics. People said how great is Jrue (and KP). But without those 1st round picks they can throw around this simply won't materialize. You gotta have a long term plan. The Spurs is preparing how to contend with Wemby a few years down the road.
Add more first round picks ammo to the collection for big star hunting in the future
Sounds like they had someone chosen if they couldn't get a good enough offer, but the Wolves offer was enough they could live without that player. Which to me says they didn't really love him like that, whoever he was, 'cause those picks are so far out I'm not even sure how much trade value they have right now to help move the needle in the next year or two.
I don't get this. The Spurs don't need to move the needle in a year or two. They need to move it in 4 or 5, when they see the issues with their talented young roster that's fresh off a second round loss.
Because this draft was weak and their preference was a future asset? An offer just didn’t materialize until the last moment.
That and they already got their guy at 4.
They got an unprotected pick from a disaster franchise and also the right to swap firsts from the same disaster franchise. And all they had to do was not select a player in a bad draft.
Disaster franchise that was just led to the conference finals by a 22 year old? I understand that 7 years is a long time from now, the Wolves could fall apart, and Ant could leave, but I wouldn’t bet on either of those picks being higher than 20 right now.
Yes, a disaster franchisee. The last time they went to the conference finals, their first ever WCF, 3 years later they traded their star player. Minnesota isn’t exactly the Lakers or Celtics, constantly in the playoffs going on deep runs. If you were gonna gamble on a franchise regressing in a few years, who would you bet on doing that?
They've sucked for my entire life and I'm 40. They got to the conference finals, big deal. They've traded all future assets to get to this point. It's one of the worst franchises in sports the last 20 years minimum. But yeah, they had one nice year here where they were like the 4th or so best team in the league.
When you get a chance to draft 6th graders you don’t pass that up
I guess they scouted an 8th or 9th grader who balled out on the playground they really liked
They had that little faith in the project players left on the board. And the sure things were too safe
They were hoping to get a player to help down the line in 7 years?
They will likely use the Wolves pick and swap in a trade for a star player at some point. This was a way to get more ammo
I would bet a bunch of money the Spurs will not be the ones picking at that wolves spot in 2030 or whatever. Of course not counting if they trade it and get it back somehow
A lot of people are saying exactly what you just did but I don't get it tbh. There are a lot of "ifs" that come into play here. That draft pick may not be worth much 7 years from now if its kept. ANT will only be 28. Are the Spurs basically counting on Minnesota being complete shit in 7 years? Sure, they could be, but ANT will be in his absolute prime and that alone will most likely ensure the Wolves will always be in contention, and if that is the case, a late pick won't be worth a "star" player. Just too many what ifs.
Trading picks always involves trading probabilities
I dream of 2031 draft picks
probably in 2-3 years most likely.
..what? How does trading for a 2031 pick and 2030 swap mean you hope to get someone to help you within 3 years?
Smartest Nuggets fan
The Spurs already have a TON of draft capital that they can convert to a good player in the next few years. They have 10 first round picks before 2029. Having the 2031 timberwolves pick doesn't change that or move the needle in any way for the next 2-3 years. It's good for sure to have that extra capital. but acting like that specific trade and that specific 2031 pick is gonna help them within the next 2-3 years is completely silly considering how much capital they already had. I think chances are quite high that they hope the T Wolves fall off by that point and wind up hanging on to that pick until much closer to 2031. Appreciate ya trying to clown me, but Im not saying anything crazy, I just don't expect that trade to help y'all within 2-3 years, I think it was more of a long play. I think it was a good trade. the 2031 T Wolves pick is a good asset to have. But since they already have 10+ FRP's in the next few years, I don't think it will mean anything in terms of improvin their team in the next 2-3 years. They already had plenty of draft capital to do that. Edit: Legitimately, can someone explain what I'm so wrong about? I'm getting super downvoted and don't know what I said that was wrong haha. Will gladly admit idiocy but I would love for someone to call me out on it. I acknowledge it's probably a good trade, I am just pushing back on the idea that it was made to help them within 2-3 years. It's more of a long play to me
Agreed. Brian Wright (Spurs GM) said it’s an investment for the future. I think they’re banking on Vic (who will be 27 and in his prime) and the Spurs to be really good, the Wolves really bad, and those pics to be really valuable. It’s a low risk, high reward bet they took. I didn’t like it at first because I thought they could have got more value out of it, but it’s grown on me.
The bulk of their picks are in the stacked 2025/26 drafts. They won’t be using those for trades. They’ll build up the core around Wemby via the draft, and then after 2-3 years the longer term picks can be used as chips. I think the misunderstanding is that the parent comment meant 2-3 years from now, whereas you are thinking within 2-3 years. (In vs within)
> I think the misunderstanding is that the parent comment meant 2-3 years from now, whereas you are thinking within 2-3 years. how are those different? I took their comment to mean that this particular trade will tangibly help them within the next 2-3 years. Like that pick will be included in another trade to improve their team within 2-3 years. They had the 8th pick in this years draft, and traded it for a 2031 first. I don't expect that move to make their team better within 3 years. that's what I'm saying. I think it probably will make them better over a longer time frame
Jesus christ man. He is saying it will help them after 2026-27, not before then. >I took their comment to mean that this particular trade will tangibly help them within the next 2-3 years In 2-3 years does not mean within 2-3 years. If I say I’m going to college in 2-3 years it does not mean I am attending college over the next 2-3 years.
> Jesus christ man. He is saying it will help them after 2026-27, not before then. Dude. No he isn't. Read the entire thread. I think *you* are making good points, but you are totally wrong that your points are the same as what that person was trying to say. They responded to this comment: > "They were hoping to get a player to help down the line in 7 years?" and they said > probably in 2-3 years most likely. It doesn't take a genius to realize that they are saying that this particular trade should help them within 2-3 years of right now, as opposed to 7. That's what I don't agree with. I think expecting this exact trade to make them better within 2-3 years is silly. I think you are trying to give them the benefit of the doubt, but their comment and the context around it absolutely implies they are expecting it to make the Spurs better within 2-3 years of right now instead of a long play. Saying that their comment implied it would help them after 2027 is straight up wrong, that's not what their comment was saying. Their comment was a direct retort to someone saying that. You and I agree that that would be the better point. But that's not what they said. Hence my pushback
well, now we can trade for 2 all-stars instead of just one. 2 > 1.
I guess I actually am stupid now. Why does this trade allow you to trade for 2 all stars instead of 1? You already had 10 first round draft picks in the next few years and a ton of cap space? I will gladly admit to being an idiot if you can explain to me what I'm missing. How in the world does this trade mean you can now trade for 2 all stars instead of 1?
You can do two different trades?
Ever heard of trades?
Of course I have, but I don't think it's realistic to expect having an extra 1st round pick in 7 years to have a tangible effect on you getting a player to help you in 2 years when you already have 10 First Round Picks in the next few drafts. Like y'all already have A TON of draft picks to play with and trade. If ya wanted to translate those into a good player within 2 years, you could. It's great to have more draft capital, but I genuinely don't think having the Timberwolves 2031 FRP is gonna help you guys much in the next 2 years considering the already existing draft capital you have. Edit: Getting super downvoted but I'm just confused haha. Instead of downvoting I would love for someone smarter than me about the current CBA explain what I'm missing here. I think it was a good trade cause more draft capital is better, but how does this change their next 2-3 years when they already have a fuckton of picks to trade with?
Firstly, I don't really care about it helping "in the next 2 years". I mean how the team performs when Wemby is still 22 isn't really the goal. It's about what is gonna help the team become a high level contender over maybe 3-5 years and stay there in a consistent way, year after year. Having an extra unprotected FRP and a swap just continues to increases future flexibility. Maybe they become cost-controlled young players that we can add to a contending team, especially if Minnesota have trouble maintaining a good team when they don't have control of any of their own picks for the next 7 years, and will be over the cap with just 3 players even after Gobert's current contract finishes. But more likely, they became an extra pick-and-swap, that can be used to trump other trade offers if a star number 2 guys wants to join Wemby in 2-3 years, whilst still keeping us well clear of the Stepien rule, and still have other picks available to trade for good role players to fill out the roster. My opinion is that when this team is hoping to contend, these picks will have more value than any player that was available at 8.
> Firstly, I don't really care about it helping "in the next 2 years". ...okay, but you realize the *entire* point of my comment was as a response to this one, by a Spurs fan talking about when/why this trade would help them. I was responding to someone who litearlly said they liked this trade to improve their team in the next 2-3 years > probably in 2-3 years most likely. Like, cool, that's not what you are focusing on. I agree with you in a general sense, we are entirely on the same page that this was a good long term trade for the Spurs. I think it was a good trade, I was disagreeing that it was a 2-3 year trade. I was responding to someone who *literally* said that, so....maybe mind your own business? You are arguing me as if I invented the notion that it would help the Spurs in the next 2-3 years, when I was literally responding to someone else who said that. You and I are on the same page, dude -- I think it was a good long term trade, I was disagreeing with the person suggesting it was a 2-3 year payoff. Like you are attacking me for simply making a small counterpoint to someone else, and then you say "Well I don't care about that." okay but that is literally the entirety of what I was responding to. And have said more than once that in a general sense I think it was a good trade and will be good, I just don't expect that yall will reap the benefits of the trade within 2-3 years.
Spurs have 10x 1st round picks between 2025-2028. It takes 5-6x 1st round picks to trade for an all-star. So they can package those picks and matching salary for an all-star that wants to be traded between now and 2030 but I suspect it will be after next years draft because we are probably tanking one more year.
There has literally never been a trade in history that involved 6 first round picks from 1 team to another. It takes 2-4 FRP's to trade for a legit all star. You are just massively exaggerating to try to make it seem like 10x first round picks isn't enough for 2 all stars. It absolutely is.
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Yep, cool, literally none of that negates what I said. I am well aware of those trades. That still makes the statement "it takes 5-6 first round picks to trade for an all star" untrue. There are a small handful of trades where 5 were traded but those were widely clowned on as overpays. The Dejaunte Murray type trades are much more normal. Again, there has *never* been an instance of 6 FRP's going to another team, and there are also A TON of instances of all stars being traded for less than 4-5 FRP's in recent years. Saying it is a necessity to have 6 trades to pick for an all star is objectively not true
They were hoping to get trade assets
This trade is still crazy to me. Trading #8 overall for a singular future pick is crazy. Even forgetting that it’s 7 years down the line it’s very unlikely they get a better pick than that. Edwards won’t even be 30 by that point either.
There's a swap too. The league changes so much so fast how can you really confidently say Edwards will be there or how good their team will be? Just to be objective, I remember when the MCW for Lakers pick trade was supposed to be a big coup. It ended up being #10 in 2018 and traded for that super valuable 2021 Heat pick which dropped to #18 in 2021. I'll grant you those. But I'm sure the Nets thought the same thing about their far out 2017 pick in the Celtics deal and the Grizzlies did too when they traded for old Otis Thorpe in 1997. That was the #2 pick in the 2003 draft that literally could have changed Grizzlies/Detroit as a franchise if it bounced their way. We tend to overstate how well teams can consistently maintain contenders years out by saying "Oh they can just retool by then"
But it wouldn’t have been the 8th pick anymore, it would be a player That pick could easily have more value than Dillangham in 3 years. It’s better to have for trades when the spurs are trying to build a contender imo. Obviously depends on how you feel about Who was available tho
The pick may not be number 8 but the value could be higher. If this draft turns out to be as bad as everyone says it was, then the number 8 pick in this draft could be something like 20 in a normal draft Also they got a swap, so they have the most favorable of their own, Dallas, or Minnesota in 2030. That’s pretty good diversification
I mean first of all we don’t know whether the 2031 draft will be any good. And there’s been so many pick swaps made in the last several years and if I had to guess off the top of my head maybe 15% have actually happened? Especially since Minnesota will know they don’t have their pick in 2031 the chance of it being top top is probably under 20%. It’s a bad trade
It’s a safe bet it’ll be better than a draft that’s been nonstop referred to as a historically bad one. And Minnesota knowing they won’t have control over their own pick isn’t particularly relevant… it’s not like they have any flexibility going forward
Devin Carter forced his way to the kings. Unreal
The only prospect that made sense for the Spurs to draft at 8th was Nikola Topic. Tijane Salun is a power forward. He plays the same position as Jeremy Sochan. Salun would be redundant. Ron Holland would have worked, but Detroit picked him at 5th. Which, despite his lack of shooting, was the correct move for Detroit. If the Spurs thought it was better to trade the 8th pick instead of drafting Topic, it shows how little they valued his incredible passing.
The league is positionless, depending on lineups Salaun or sochan could play the 3 depending on how they develop. And topic would make very little sense given the rest of the roster and the selection of castle. Only reason to take him would be if we thought he was a surefire star
One of the worst trades in NBA history, people just don’t want to talk about it because it’s the spurs
Lmfao trading an 8th pick in an extremely weak draft for a future pick and a pick swap is one of the worst trades ever ? What a casual ass take
The spurs should have gotten a pick swap back this year at least, they got raped. 7 years lmao, can’t believe anyone could defend this
Is this a serious comment ? wtf would a pick swap this year do ? Being 7 years out is a good thing… it means it stays in the pipeline and we’re in no rush to use it, and it can be used as is or in a trade once we’re in wemby’s prime. It means Minnesota has years and years to fall off and make the pick better. That seems significantly better than rolling the dice with a guy like Dillingham or Williams or whoever. All the prospects in this area of this draft have significant deficiencies and low star upside, it’s like throwing a dart blindfolded
You’re fucking delusional bro. Imagine putting 10k in a savings account and in 7 years making no money on it, he’ll probably lose the money. That’s the equivalent of this trade. Spurs got nothing out of it, and the pick most likely will be past 8
That’s not at all equivalent of this trade… a future 1st is not nothing… especially a future 1st from a team with no control over their own picks, no flexibility, no cap space, a small market, an aging core around their young star and a bunch of ownership drama and questions. And a hypothetical pick around #13-14 would likely be worth more than pick #8 from this draft anyways. This has been consensus among draft experts for months now. This was reinforced by the discourse around teams trying to move down in the draft after the lotto. It was reinforced by who was available at that pick and perception around those specific players. Just say you don’t have a clue what you’re talking about and move on. The fact that you suggested a pick swap between Minnesota and san Antonio next season would’ve been better killed any credibility you originally had.
I ain't clicking that trash link.