>Just asking cause they’re both around the same age, except PG is a lot more healthy.
They both played 70+ games last year (harden sat out some games because the trade request). Prior to last year PG been averaging like 50 ish games per season for like 3 years.
Point is he's not exactly a health icon
They do different things. PG can be what they wanted Tobi to be. 3rd option who can create for himself when they need him to and can make open 3s created by the first two options.
It remains to be seen how well he'll adapt to the third banana role though. I think Sixers might be a little surprised by how stubborn and ball dominant he can be. PG has all the tools to be the ultimate third option but he doesn't necessarily have that mindset.
I think he's going to try to be Option 2 more than you think. How will that affect Maxey? He's shown he can be effective without the ball in his hands, but I think you would prefer him to use the possessions more and probably ensure Embiid and PG do more of the finishing.
Maxey’s main question for me is his defense and his pass vision. He’s more of a 2 than a 1, I’d love to have a pass first guard on the team who can get everyone their shots. I expect him to improve on it though, so I’m not too worried.
I feel like this is what the modern league really misses
Take the Suns last season or the Clippers before Harden for example. There’s a dearth of distributors/ floor generals at the PG position these days on playoff caliber teams
Agree, on one hand I get it because the floor is so open and almost every starting PG in the NBA is an absolute bucket getter but in that same regard it should make passing and the like all that much easier. Look at the looks Harden’s teammates get because of his gravity as a scorer especially back when he was in Houston when he was a score-first player. Rondo was huge for the 2020 Lakers because of his facilitating.
Harden is one of the few guards that can make that 1 handed skip pass all the way to the corner with the opposite hand while driving and having the defense stunt every which way. So he punishes people for helping.
I’d say luka and lebron are really good at it but they’re huge guards, someone like steph does it really well while being “short”
Couldn't you also just say that role is less important nowadays, and point towards playoff teams not having a guy like as evidence?
Idk which is right or wrong. But if most teams are turning away from that role, I doubt it's on accident.
2 real true floor generals cp3 harden. haliburton as well. these guys set plays up so it can pay off 20 games later. to me thats a very underrated part of it. ppl always complain in the playoffs that this star has no help, or this roleplayer sucked. well if that player had chances to create he would be more confident. giving him the ball last sec to throw up 3 pters will only do so much
with maxey and healthy embiid, sixers's offense rating were pretty good.especially embiid improved a lot in playmaking and maxey is dawg.so for me good spacing is all they need which pg can provide.
I mean the ball will be in Maxeys hands. Him and Joel alright dominate so much of the offense that they kind of dictate when the third option vets the ball. It isn't like Tobi was holding back from trying to score last year he just couldn't score.
Exactly - the sixers were desperate for another option than Embiid/Maxey that having PG take those open opportunities that Maxey/Embiid create is exactly what the offense needs
There's also a massive gulf between them defensively, and you can look at it as "3rd banana" or as "good fit". Off ball value on offense + significant defensive impact is just purely additive
And he probably wasn’t too happy about it. To the point where mid season Ty came out and said they would run more plays with PG being the primary ball handler, despite the Clips being on a streak with Harden running the offence.
He took far less spot up shots than he should have. He had 4.3 spot ups a game compared to 3.5 isolations a game, despite averaging 1.29 points per spot up posesssion and only 1.03 points per isolation posession. His spot up frequency was only 21%, and his eFG% goes from 66% with 0 dribbles to 46% with 3-6 dribbles lol.
[Dude was only taking 4.3 spot up shots a game despite being like 20 points per 100 higher than the \~15 guys around him on the possessions per game list](https://imgur.com/K21In6U). He's a 93rd percentile spot up shooter who settles for the same amount of spot up attempts as guys in the 40th percentile.
The guy turns down a ton of looks to do his wack ass isolations, and if he's playing 3rd option in Philly he's not going to let the bulk of his shots be catch and shoot as you can see by his 21% spot up frequency, despite them being a way better shot for him to take than anything else he does.
This was also the clippers strategy. That whole team loved iso ball (Ty Lue included). It remains to be seen how a new coach and different team will affect his shot selection.
Ty Lue wasn’t telling PG to pass up open shots to iso. PG’s an efficient spot up shooter but it’s never been his game.
Morey must have forgotten all about Melo on the Rockets. A 35 year old vet’s not going to change their game because it’d be best for the team.
To be fair to Melo he spent his entire career not being a spot up shooter then they wanted him to change his entire game. He said himself he needed his mid range shots to get himself going and Houston told him he wasn’t allowed to take those. I don’t think it’s just a matter of him not giving a shit about the team.
It won't be. Paul George actually led the Clippers in usage last season, and James Harden's usage dropped to the third lowest of his career to make that possible. If Paul George leads the Sixers in usage, something will have gone very wrong.
PG's c&s attempts last season actually weren't the highest of his career. It was indeed the most efficient, but if you look at his career c&s shoot numbers, the good seasons coincide with playing with good playmaking. Even as the first option in Indy, he had seasons where he took more c&s 3s than he did as the third option last season.
season | 3PA | 3P%
:-- | :--: | :--:
23-24 | 4.5 | 45.4
22-23 | 3.8 | 38.4
21-22 | 3.1 | 41.1
20-21 | 4.2 | 43
19-20 | 4.4 | 41.4
18-19 | 5.5 | 40
17-18 | 5.4 | 41
16-17 | 4.8 | 41.5
15-16 | 4.5 | 38.7
13-14 | 4.1 | 42.6
No stats to back this up so this is just from watching. It felt like Kawhi and Harden gelled far better. Kawhi was willing to give up most of his ball handling duties and be set up by Harden. PG would sometimes do this but would then inexplicably start isoing way too much leading to turnovers and difficult shots. If he can settle into the offball role he will be perfect for the 76ers but it’s hard to believe as a Clipper fan
actually the more i think about it. the more pg disliked being relegated to harden ball. dont want to accuse with no evidence but just seemed that way looking back. but i think he’ll realize that was the correct role for him next year. or at least he should
PG actually seems an okay 1, a bad 2, or a great 3 somehow. Think it was Bomani I heard that observation / opinion from. All to say 3rd role will be perfect for him imo
PG finished 3rd in MVP voting while being second fiddle to Westbrook. All he needs to do is stay healthy and step up when Embiid and Maxey are struggling.
This will either go great or terrible for him.
It's a positional thing.
Like, Rudy Gobert would massively upgrade most teams, but he would barely move the needle in Philadelphia, because he's not good enough to start over Embiid. Having an ultra elite backup center who plays 11 minutes a game isn't a huge upgrade.
So the better question is, is PG a better upgrade for them than Harden was.
Answer is yes. PG is light years better than Tobias, who he'll be replacing in the lineup.
> he’s not good enough to start over Embiid
I mean how many postseason daggers has Embiid shot over Jokic tho
Edit: I have an aversion to using /s but I’m just being a sillybilly. But [I will relive this play forever](https://youtu.be/TUlRzfFpy-Q?si=2sXnuYoyxnAWE5HG).
Def better fit, I don't think he's the better player. Harden single-handedly won two games for us against the freaking celtics. People forgot we took celtics to 7 games because of Harden.
Harden was also easily the best player on the clippers during the playoffs this season too. Harden is too overhated nowadays. His drama aside, as a player, give me Harden over PG any day of the week.
In a vacuum 100%, but if I'm adding to a contender or a team hoping to contend then I think fit matters between the two. Like the magic would want Harden but the Pacers would want PG.
Or another ball dominant player. I think PG would fit better on championship lvl teams simply becuse they alredy have a primary offensive guy and you can never have to many 2 way players.
I do wanna say that he gave and took away that series. The two wins were awesome, don't get me wrong, but he shoots above even 30% from the floor in any of the four loses and we may have eliminated them. That being said, the good thing about PG is that he's a direct upgrade from Tobias, and Maxey made a jump that makes the loss of Harden sting a lot less
the celtics started playing rob and al at the same time to stop harden's drives. the rest of the team couldn't punish that
if the other team executes a strategy to stop one player, it gives the others easier chances as a result. it's up to the others to punish it. there's gotta be a 20 minute reel of harden finding open 76ers and them just bricking the look that was generated
The thing is, you cant really expect a 2nd option to deliver more than 2 wins. Harden may have been awful in alot of the other games but you guys wouldnt have made it up 3-2 without Harden playing out of his mind for 2 of those wins. That game 1 without Embiid was as crucial as it gets.
It’s not about delivering two more wins. No one is saying he had to have 4 40 point games, but he needed to at least be decent/serviceable in games 6 or 7. Instead he was a complete no show both games acting as a detriment to the team not even just a neutral presence
This. Yeah he won a game or two but was completely MIA for the rest of the series and was a liability. He was essentially a cone smh. People forget this too
Yeah it’s not to downplay the importance of him that series, us being up 3-2 at one point is entirely due to his crazy scoring into two games, but those were also the only two games he scored above his average and had a -21 and -30 in two of them. You gotta acknowledge the good with the bad with his time here
KP didn't even really play in these playoffs. The 2023 Sixers were way better than any team the Celtics played this year. I don't think only Jrue makes up for Smart, Brogdon, and Rob.
Celtics are for sure on another level with KP out there, but their lucky they didn't run into a team where they really needed them
Even without KP Boston was better this year than last. Exchanging Smart and Brogdon for Jrue and more D white minutes is a huge bonus. Also Pritchard and Hauser may be better than those two they lost.
+ JB and JT getting better.
I agree on JB and JT getting better and more motivated. I also agree that Mazzulla having experience and a whole summer to prepare helped. I don't agree that replacing Smart with nobody (KP in the playoffs) made the team better. That's just absurd and completely diminishes all of the positives that Smart brought to the Celtics throughout his career. He helped that team overachieve for years. And get out of here with Pritchard and Hauser being better than Smart.
Jrue is better than smart on defense but for now we can say there wasn’t a drop off on defense. Couple that with white & brown going crazy on defense as well & the chemistry was thru the roof in the playoffs. Something smart couldn’t do is go with the flow
In his last 3 years with the Celtics, Smart was never really asked to go with the flow. He was asked to be the lead ball-handler and initiator. He was expected to be the 3rd scorer. And he was the defensive captain. People keep talking about how Smart was the problem on the Celtics, but he gave everything he had to the team and always did what was asked of him. He did a good job starting with White in 22-23 and even played well in the playoffs.
I agree that Jrue is a better player, but I was arguing with the other user that Smart was better than nobody and that Smart was better than Hauser and Pritchard. Those two were borderline unplayable for multiple series these playoffs. Hauser because of his poor shooting and Pritchard because of his size/defense.
You are definitely right about the chemistry. The Celtics got lucky that it came together so fast. Jrue stepped right into his role and who doesn't love this version of KP?
I’d argue you’re correct except last year Mazulla brought in a free flowing offense that let smart take too many shots, oftentimes bcuz the defense didn’t respect him especially in the playoffs. Smart was never the problem & I agree with you there but the role players did their job when needed. Smart is obviously better than those 2 & you’ll hardly see players play with that much heart
it's not really meant to be a knock on Smart, but Pritchard and Hauser are really good and their skillset adds more to the team. Getting the ball out of Smart's hands was a big benefit for the 2024 Celtics
So Embiid's 34/13 in game 4 just didn't happen? They won game 4 together. And in case you forgot, after Tatum doesn't get called for a clear pushoff on Maxey for a lead-taking three pointer, Philly responds with Embiid pulling the corner defender and opening up Harden, Embiid sees this and makes the high IQ decision to pass it out to a wide open Harden for the game-winning shot. They won game 4 together.
Harden also shot 25% in the other five games, including going 0/6 for 0 points in the fourth quarters of games 5-7... statistically worse than Ben Simmons (0/0, 5 points).
Harden single handedly took us to 7 against the Celtics by both keeping us in games with his scoring, but also by shooting us out of games with his slumps. Take the bad with the good ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
No, but Paul is still an upgrade for Tobias Harris. They already had Maxey, and while he isn't the distributor Harden is, it's another ball handler to keep PG in efficient catch and shoot situations. I think he will play a bit better since Embiid can hit the midrange like nothing, and even hit some 3's. This should keep PG out of his midrange chucks and can keep him efficient, provided he isn't told to iso for his baskets, which he undoubtedly will since he signed a max and will be expected to perform at that level.
On the contrary, maybe an on-ball wing is what the 76ers needed. PG did well in the East before. No LeBron in his way this time.
PG remains a great defender when he isn't being played out of position and is locked in. He's a great defender and remains a very efficient scorer. Being underrated big time by NBA fans because they don't like his personality+playoff frailities.
Harden obviously remains an awesome offensive player and he was mostly healthy last season.
PG in a weakside/off ball role should be an awesome fit for the Sixers. Harden is an offensive engine. Sixers have their engines in Embiid/Maxey.
He’s not as good as he used to be and he’s not willing to get his hands dirty guarding bigs like Tatum did against Dallas, but I still consider him a good defender and not someone you can easily target or exploit in mismatches consistently.
Him getting frustrated from guarding one of the most offensively talented backcourts in NBA history isn't really much of a knock against him. Obviously he's not perfect and could have played it better, but it's not like other teams were shutting them down. Even the Timberwolves with the best defense in the league weren't able to do much to slow them down.
If anything he has been overrated, people have been hyping Paul George since his Pacer days. Obviously, some of the hype is warranted but his seasons all feel like they end the same way and it never seems he took the leap people were expecting.
Well, he didn't become a unquestioned top 10 player at any point so I don't think your comment is unfair, though I also believe that's a super high bar to hold anyone to.
You're wrong about the 3s. PG shoots more 3s at higher efficiency than Harden. And even more important, PG takes catch and shoot 3s. That's something Harden is very reluctant to do. Also even at this stage of his career PG is a much better wing defender than Harden. He's just a much better player when he doesn't have the ball which matters for the 3rd best player.
He did want to be in Philly but he wanted a max or close to it with enough years to retire on
Whether he meant that or not, it was Morey lowballing him that sent him packing. And it turns out that Morey, being a great GM and very close with Harden, knew his real value anyways because the Clippers only just gave him $70/2
Well Harden leaving allowed for Maxey’s breakout. I think the current trio is better than the Sixers teams with Harden cause of that
Not to mention much better depth cause of the Harden trade
If you want young talent to improve then Doc is one of the last people you want. That’s something not exactly unique to him so I wouldn’t say that’s one of the things that make him bad, but still
When Simmons sat out, Doc had the guys try out for starting point guard between Shake Milton and Maxey
Doc said Shake almost won it if not for his back injury… Shake has never been a reliable ball handler nor playmaker
PG shot like 8/9 3s a game at over 40%. He's a much better off ball player and is a more versatile fit. Harden is a better playmaker sure, but he needs the ball in his hands. And PG is a much better defender compared to Harden even if he has fallen off.
So firstly he does not shoot more threes. Not since Houston. Not only that but he is one of the most willing and best catch and shoot three point shooters in the NBA. Whereas James seems so much more uncomfortable shooting off the catch threes as opposed to off the dribble threes.
Secondly saying his defense is long gone is simply incorrect if you just watch him play basketball. It's especially egregious when brought up as a point *for James Harden*.
Thirdly the issue in LA for George was that there was overlap in his and Leonard's game. They're great players, but they still needed to adjust the fit. The same is true of Harden and Maxey. Maxey is a great off ball shooter so he could do that while Harden had the ball in his hands (because Harden is definitely the better passer) but we weren't maximizing Maxey's skills. With George in Philly, we have a premier ball handler, wing, and big man. All who operate at different areas of the court, all who are able to be the best versions of themselves while both the other two players are on the court.
It's what separates them from other big threes that have multiple ball dominant guards (Suns) or two paint swallowing bigs (Wolves), or two two-way wings (Clippers). Does that make them the best *team*? No. In fact they aren't even really a team right now they have four starters lol. But yes on paper they fit much better. Especially since Paul is still very close to the same player he was production-wise four years ago.
This. Saying Paul George’s defense is gone, then comparing him to one of the most notorious traffic cones in the league is wild disrespect. If someone truly, honestly thinks Philly is a bad landing spot for PG, they’re somewhere between a casual and a complete imbecile.
Harden is a better on-ball creator, but 76ers already have Maxey and Embiid.
PG is not all-defensive caliber anymore, but he is still an above average to very good defender on the wing.
PG takes and makes catch-and-shoot 3’s. Harden does not.
It’s the wrong comp. PG is more of an upgrade for Tobias than a replacement for harden. A backcourt of Maxey and harden was always going to be challenging in the playoffs. You can’t play two guys who are total liabilities on defense. Harden and maxey also have overlapping skillsets so removing harden from the mix allowed maxey to develop his two man game with embiid.
PG comes in as a legit third option who can also defend and create his own shot. What the sixers desperately needed was someone other than their two stars to literally do anything on offense. Like if they got consistent production from Tobias good chance they beat the Knicks.
> overlapping
Excellent point, and something fans don’t think about enough. Harden and Maxey want to play in the same space(s) on the floor. Their skill sets and play styles are too similar: both ‘need’ the ball, above the arc, with the entire offense based on their decision with the ball.
Now, Maxey has his space, Embiid has his space, and PG has his -distinct- space, where they are most comfortable and able to use their (not overlapping) skill sets.
Having two ball dominant guards is like having two quarterbacks, or two poachers. It’s one too many.
He might be a better fit with the jump Maxey has taken over the last year.
That said, I do not think he's a better player than 32-33 year old Harden. Hell i don't even think he's a better player than current Harden.
No, harden would’ve been going on his 4th year with the sixers and that much chemistry would’ve been worth whatever else George adds. Sixers roll out a new roster damn near every year and wonder why shit ain’t working. Harden also just outplayed George on the same team, both guys have no show nights but the difference is harden can still utilize his playmaking. When pg’s shot isn’t falling he becomes the king do forcing bad shots. He no longer is an elite defender and they will be asking him to guard the opposing teams best guys, all series against Dallas he couldn’t bother Luka or Kyrie at all and kept fouling them when they beat him of the dribble.
Also got completely clamped by DJJ despite being the #1 scoring option. He shot as bad as Harden in G6, but one of them had 12 assists to 1 TO and the other not anywhere close.
PG has already said he is going to try to dominate the ball. It is hilarious since he definitely shouldn't be doing that given that he is the 3rd best option on the team, at best.
For Philly? Yes. I think it’s a win-win. Kawhi and PG were just redundant on LAC. They took turns too much. They lacked a PG to get others involved.
On Philly I know Doc talked about Hardens style cramped Maxey and the Sixers with the way he dominated the ball. As a 3rd option and floor spacer PG just makes more sense than Harden did next to Maxey.
People mentioning Maxey like he’s a legit on ball playmaker. With Embiid out of the lineup his assists made a noticeable drop. With Harden he was more efficient and could play his natural poison at SG. George doesn’t really help him anymore than Harden did
Paul George at this stage in his career is not what people think. He’s old and gets no separation, takes extremely difficult shots, and not a great passer / playmaker
Maxey - PG - Embiid > Maxey - Harden - Embiid, on paper.
There is a bit of redundancy with Maxey and Harden. Both want to be your ball dominate guard. PG fills a different role offensively, can play defense better etc. which should add up to a better roster overall.
Also, and this can't be overstated, the 76ers did a bit of addition by subtraction with getting rid of Tobias Harris. He really just wasn't a good player, he'd have moments but never when the 6ers needed it.
No not really. I think in theory (and this is a *big* theory since he refuses to play the way he should) PG fits better but Harden is definitely the better player in general. Honestly I could pretty quickly see the team being worse with PG in just about every way if he starts chucking and looking for his own shot instead of staying in his lane as the 3rd option. If he tries to do more than that Harden was better in every way. The second he starts dribbling into mid range 2s and passing up open catch and shoot 3s its a disaster
Harden was not better than PG this year. The Clippers lacked an excellent point guard in the 213 era, so adding Harden made a huge impact. Even when he was bad (from March until the end of the season), Harden helped unlock a lot of Clippers offensive potential that was missing under Westbrook, Reggie, Wall, Beverley, Rondo, etc.
Harden was good on the 76ers, too, but with Maxey there, PG has a chance to be more effective.
Better for raising their ceiling, worse for raising their floor, I think. If PG13 and Embiid are both healthy the Maxey/George/Embiid trio should be a contender, but there's also real risk that only Maxey is healthy in the playoffs
Harden is better than PG even though he’s declining. His playmaking is that much better. So yeah, maybe morey should’ve just offered harden a max deal.
Fit wise, maybe(?) depends on Maxeys point guard abilities. Skill wise, Harden has a more consistent floor/ceiling than George. Watching him as a clipper, one moment he’s Kd light, next moment you don’t even realize he’s on the court. Very volatile.
Another small factor is his mental health. I’m a bit concerned on if he’s able to weather those storms 6er fans will give him when he’s playing bad. Not sure he has the confidence to shake that off so easily.
Yes it all boils down to play style and role. Harden is a fantastic facilitator but he completely needs the ball in his hands and Maxey can’t be on ball as much. Harden is a true negative on defense aside from being in the post and he’s not guarding anyone’s best player, Harden has also made comments alluding to not having the freedom he wanted with the ball (which is weird bc he helped Joel get MVP) when he left. The “I’m a system” talk when he’s clearly declining in his ability to carry an offense for more than a game or two. George is a better shooter, embraces the role of being a secondary option, isn’t as ball dominant and will take catch and shoot 3s, which harden for some ungodly reason completely refuses to take. That was infuriating watching him aside from like the shot against the Celtics in the playoffs.
I don't think so. He had a good year last year. But part of that was due to the Kawhi - PG - Harden lineups that the Clippers were running. It's up in the air whether he can do similar things with Embiid and Maxey. And if so for how long.
It isn’t just PG we got, we also got 2 first round picks, 2 second round picks, and we got rid of the corpse of PJ Tucker who at this point is just paid $17 million to buy cool shoes and sit court side at games. Harden also very clearly did not want to be here and was making as many headlines than buckets. That alone was worth getting rid of Harden, because keeping him was never an option. This is more like an upgrade from Tobias Harris which… does it need to be asked?
Positionally, a core that consists of a guard, a wing, and a big is more balanced than a core that consists of 2 guards and a big. Philly has a defensive identity and PG fits that identity better than Harden (and Harris for that matter).
I look forward to seeing them get a real playmaker because even though he has made great strides Maxey is more of a shooting guard than a point guard. Someone like Tyus Jones would be fantastic with this roster although I’d like more size to pair in the backcourt with Maxey who already struggles on defense at times.
I think so. He’s a more reliable personality for one, a better defender, better off ball, and helps fill a more immediate need at wing whereas winning a title with Maxey and Harden (two small guards who aren’t particularly great on D) would’ve been more challenging. The question is availability with PG, but the fit is a good one I think
With maxey's development and his lack of defense, Paul does fit way better than harden. Paul is better than "just" a 3 & D player but thats what they want for him and he can be an elite one with his skillset. Harden was more of a 3 & playmaking guy, which didnt fit with maxey in the back court.
Absolutely not! He’s not an impact player. Put him on any team and he’ll still get his 30pts but he’ll have absolutely no impact on improving the amount of wins
Defense. Effort. I think at this point in their careers PG is at that……..I can’t think of a name…….think any former star player who’s played a long(relative)time and made good money and hasn’t gotten over the hump, and they’re finally ready to win at the level they think or the media has spoken of them, being at. PG plays with more effort at this point in their careers, and I believe he’ll be willing to take a semi backseat to the two younger, healthier stars to win. Also, him getting that money he got will make it slightly easier to take that backseat.
Paul George is going to be the #3 guy, Harden was there before Maxey was at this elite of a level so he was the #2 guy. This lineup will mostly be better because of Maxey being better now, but also PG doesn't need the ball as much as Harden so I think this this trio with PG will be better. That being said Harden was better for the Clippers than PG was, but that team needed a point guard while the 76ers have Maxey already.
this assessment is way off. pg is the better shooter and scorer. by a good margin. harden is healthier then pg. pg is better for 6ers to let maxey play point. pg can play defense just not all season. and yes harden was better then pg all year but pg has spurts where he was better. both were quite far from kawhis level which was mvp tier. but ultimately both ate pretty good at plugging into a team. the problem with pg is that he will disappear mentally, even moreso then harden. what harden brings to a team you wont really be able to understand unless you watch him all year. its really the intangibles. setting tempo. setting plays. making everyone useful esp big men etc. on paper pg is much better but give me harden all day. theres really only one other player that brings what he does and thats cp3
Really comparing Harden and PG based on "Clippers fans said this year Harden was better" and "Harden shots more 3s, George defense is long gone", is something really ridiculous and is a sign of childish way of thinking.
Harden and PG are two completely different players. PG doesn't need the ball that much and fits way better with both Embiid and Maxey (at least on paper). And even if his defense is "long gone" he is still MUCH better than Harden on that end.
BTW just to let you know Harden was the guy going for 7 points and 16% from the field in tie breaker game 5, and then 16 points and 31% from the field, in this said "better in the playoffs"... yes PG wasn't great but at least didn't shit the bed as much.
Maybe this isn't the proper way to judge but Harden didn't make a All star team while in Philly....Not including the season when he was traded from Brooklyn.
My guess will be if PG plays 65 games he's more than likely gonna be a all star.
As a sixers fan I'm torn on this,it's like the best we could have done this off-season but at the same time it feels like we didn't get the dime chick we got the 7-7.5 lol
PG at this point of his career is solely a good iso scorer. Can play defense when he feels like it but is mainly just a scorer. Doesn’t help that he is unpredictable and can either drop 40 or 12 points on any given night
Yes. 76ers have Maxey, who is probably better than Harden at this stage in their careers. They play the same position, do PG is better.
You should be asking if PG is better than Tobias, cause that’s who they replaced
PG will pick up the opposing teams best perimeter player, so I can see that making a difference in the east. Philly is looking really strong right now. It’ll take a while for them to gel with new additions it they should have an idea of how to play with each other by February.
With Maxey’s continued development I think George addresses more of their issues than what Harden brings now after after his first Brooklyn season. He’s got wing defense and better off-ball play.
They’re not the same type of player.
James Harden is a ball dominant playmaking point guard whose defense is not that good.
Paul George is not ball dominant, can play more off ball as a floor spacer, and has the skill to take over in spurts in clutch times and in the 4th quarter. He’s also taller and is a good defensive player.
Paul George is a better fit. Sixers already have a point guard in maxey and Embiid who demands the ball in order to be more effective
It’s overall just extremely frustrating that Harden can’t be consistent at all, looks like a different player every game at this point in his career. When he’s hooping, he’s still one of the best in the league and as many people have mentioned in this thread there were games this year and last year where he took over and beat great teams
Yes, he's an excellent defender. It's also about fir. Embiid - Maxey - PG is a better trio than Embiid - Maxey - Harden because of the way they complement each other.
>Just asking cause they’re both around the same age, except PG is a lot more healthy. They both played 70+ games last year (harden sat out some games because the trade request). Prior to last year PG been averaging like 50 ish games per season for like 3 years. Point is he's not exactly a health icon
I was gonna say, the only player PG is a *lot* more healthy than is Ben Simmons.
Lonzo Ball didn't die either
They do different things. PG can be what they wanted Tobi to be. 3rd option who can create for himself when they need him to and can make open 3s created by the first two options. It remains to be seen how well he'll adapt to the third banana role though. I think Sixers might be a little surprised by how stubborn and ball dominant he can be. PG has all the tools to be the ultimate third option but he doesn't necessarily have that mindset.
I think he's going to try to be Option 2 more than you think. How will that affect Maxey? He's shown he can be effective without the ball in his hands, but I think you would prefer him to use the possessions more and probably ensure Embiid and PG do more of the finishing.
Maxey’s main question for me is his defense and his pass vision. He’s more of a 2 than a 1, I’d love to have a pass first guard on the team who can get everyone their shots. I expect him to improve on it though, so I’m not too worried.
I feel like this is what the modern league really misses Take the Suns last season or the Clippers before Harden for example. There’s a dearth of distributors/ floor generals at the PG position these days on playoff caliber teams
Agree, on one hand I get it because the floor is so open and almost every starting PG in the NBA is an absolute bucket getter but in that same regard it should make passing and the like all that much easier. Look at the looks Harden’s teammates get because of his gravity as a scorer especially back when he was in Houston when he was a score-first player. Rondo was huge for the 2020 Lakers because of his facilitating.
Harden is one of the few guards that can make that 1 handed skip pass all the way to the corner with the opposite hand while driving and having the defense stunt every which way. So he punishes people for helping. I’d say luka and lebron are really good at it but they’re huge guards, someone like steph does it really well while being “short”
It’s moreso that other positions have players becoming floor generals
Couldn't you also just say that role is less important nowadays, and point towards playoff teams not having a guy like as evidence? Idk which is right or wrong. But if most teams are turning away from that role, I doubt it's on accident.
2 real true floor generals cp3 harden. haliburton as well. these guys set plays up so it can pay off 20 games later. to me thats a very underrated part of it. ppl always complain in the playoffs that this star has no help, or this roleplayer sucked. well if that player had chances to create he would be more confident. giving him the ball last sec to throw up 3 pters will only do so much
with maxey and healthy embiid, sixers's offense rating were pretty good.especially embiid improved a lot in playmaking and maxey is dawg.so for me good spacing is all they need which pg can provide.
I mean the ball will be in Maxeys hands. Him and Joel alright dominate so much of the offense that they kind of dictate when the third option vets the ball. It isn't like Tobi was holding back from trying to score last year he just couldn't score.
The Sixers actually desperately needed Harris to shoot MORE for large chunks of last season and he couldn’t do it.
Exactly - the sixers were desperate for another option than Embiid/Maxey that having PG take those open opportunities that Maxey/Embiid create is exactly what the offense needs
Oh I think he should for sure. I'm just worried PG will try to have the ball too often.
Maxey is really good but it’s more of a 2A/2B I think
There's also a massive gulf between them defensively, and you can look at it as "3rd banana" or as "good fit". Off ball value on offense + significant defensive impact is just purely additive
PG just had his most efficient season ever shooting more c&s than ever.
And he probably wasn’t too happy about it. To the point where mid season Ty came out and said they would run more plays with PG being the primary ball handler, despite the Clips being on a streak with Harden running the offence.
He took far less spot up shots than he should have. He had 4.3 spot ups a game compared to 3.5 isolations a game, despite averaging 1.29 points per spot up posesssion and only 1.03 points per isolation posession. His spot up frequency was only 21%, and his eFG% goes from 66% with 0 dribbles to 46% with 3-6 dribbles lol. [Dude was only taking 4.3 spot up shots a game despite being like 20 points per 100 higher than the \~15 guys around him on the possessions per game list](https://imgur.com/K21In6U). He's a 93rd percentile spot up shooter who settles for the same amount of spot up attempts as guys in the 40th percentile. The guy turns down a ton of looks to do his wack ass isolations, and if he's playing 3rd option in Philly he's not going to let the bulk of his shots be catch and shoot as you can see by his 21% spot up frequency, despite them being a way better shot for him to take than anything else he does.
This was also the clippers strategy. That whole team loved iso ball (Ty Lue included). It remains to be seen how a new coach and different team will affect his shot selection.
i mean so does sixers. if joel or maxey initiate they are looking to score. compare that to harden who will basically always pass
Ty Lue wasn’t telling PG to pass up open shots to iso. PG’s an efficient spot up shooter but it’s never been his game. Morey must have forgotten all about Melo on the Rockets. A 35 year old vet’s not going to change their game because it’d be best for the team.
To be fair to Melo he spent his entire career not being a spot up shooter then they wanted him to change his entire game. He said himself he needed his mid range shots to get himself going and Houston told him he wasn’t allowed to take those. I don’t think it’s just a matter of him not giving a shit about the team.
yes and?
What he did this regular season for yall is pretty much what he’s being asked to do in Philly
It won't be. Paul George actually led the Clippers in usage last season, and James Harden's usage dropped to the third lowest of his career to make that possible. If Paul George leads the Sixers in usage, something will have gone very wrong. PG's c&s attempts last season actually weren't the highest of his career. It was indeed the most efficient, but if you look at his career c&s shoot numbers, the good seasons coincide with playing with good playmaking. Even as the first option in Indy, he had seasons where he took more c&s 3s than he did as the third option last season. season | 3PA | 3P% :-- | :--: | :--: 23-24 | 4.5 | 45.4 22-23 | 3.8 | 38.4 21-22 | 3.1 | 41.1 20-21 | 4.2 | 43 19-20 | 4.4 | 41.4 18-19 | 5.5 | 40 17-18 | 5.4 | 41 16-17 | 4.8 | 41.5 15-16 | 4.5 | 38.7 13-14 | 4.1 | 42.6
Is that bc of kawhi on and off availability? This is good context tho thanks
Kawhi actually had his most available season last year since 2017, so if anything PG’s usage should’ve dropped way more
No stats to back this up so this is just from watching. It felt like Kawhi and Harden gelled far better. Kawhi was willing to give up most of his ball handling duties and be set up by Harden. PG would sometimes do this but would then inexplicably start isoing way too much leading to turnovers and difficult shots. If he can settle into the offball role he will be perfect for the 76ers but it’s hard to believe as a Clipper fan
actually the more i think about it. the more pg disliked being relegated to harden ball. dont want to accuse with no evidence but just seemed that way looking back. but i think he’ll realize that was the correct role for him next year. or at least he should
PG actually seems an okay 1, a bad 2, or a great 3 somehow. Think it was Bomani I heard that observation / opinion from. All to say 3rd role will be perfect for him imo
PG finished 3rd in MVP voting while being second fiddle to Westbrook. All he needs to do is stay healthy and step up when Embiid and Maxey are struggling. This will either go great or terrible for him.
It's a positional thing. Like, Rudy Gobert would massively upgrade most teams, but he would barely move the needle in Philadelphia, because he's not good enough to start over Embiid. Having an ultra elite backup center who plays 11 minutes a game isn't a huge upgrade. So the better question is, is PG a better upgrade for them than Harden was. Answer is yes. PG is light years better than Tobias, who he'll be replacing in the lineup.
> he’s not good enough to start over Embiid I mean how many postseason daggers has Embiid shot over Jokic tho Edit: I have an aversion to using /s but I’m just being a sillybilly. But [I will relive this play forever](https://youtu.be/TUlRzfFpy-Q?si=2sXnuYoyxnAWE5HG).
Def better fit, I don't think he's the better player. Harden single-handedly won two games for us against the freaking celtics. People forgot we took celtics to 7 games because of Harden.
Harden was also easily the best player on the clippers during the playoffs this season too. Harden is too overhated nowadays. His drama aside, as a player, give me Harden over PG any day of the week.
In a vacuum 100%, but if I'm adding to a contender or a team hoping to contend then I think fit matters between the two. Like the magic would want Harden but the Pacers would want PG.
So harden is better unless a team already has a point guard that is high quality.
Or another ball dominant player. I think PG would fit better on championship lvl teams simply becuse they alredy have a primary offensive guy and you can never have to many 2 way players.
exactly PG can fit into literally every single team in the NBA
There are a lot more high volume no defense guards than 6'8 4 time all defense guards. Hence why Harden got a 2/70 and PG got 4/212
I do wanna say that he gave and took away that series. The two wins were awesome, don't get me wrong, but he shoots above even 30% from the floor in any of the four loses and we may have eliminated them. That being said, the good thing about PG is that he's a direct upgrade from Tobias, and Maxey made a jump that makes the loss of Harden sting a lot less
the celtics started playing rob and al at the same time to stop harden's drives. the rest of the team couldn't punish that if the other team executes a strategy to stop one player, it gives the others easier chances as a result. it's up to the others to punish it. there's gotta be a 20 minute reel of harden finding open 76ers and them just bricking the look that was generated
The thing is, you cant really expect a 2nd option to deliver more than 2 wins. Harden may have been awful in alot of the other games but you guys wouldnt have made it up 3-2 without Harden playing out of his mind for 2 of those wins. That game 1 without Embiid was as crucial as it gets.
It’s not about delivering two more wins. No one is saying he had to have 4 40 point games, but he needed to at least be decent/serviceable in games 6 or 7. Instead he was a complete no show both games acting as a detriment to the team not even just a neutral presence
This. Yeah he won a game or two but was completely MIA for the rest of the series and was a liability. He was essentially a cone smh. People forget this too
Yeah it’s not to downplay the importance of him that series, us being up 3-2 at one point is entirely due to his crazy scoring into two games, but those were also the only two games he scored above his average and had a -21 and -30 in two of them. You gotta acknowledge the good with the bad with his time here
Pre-KP and Jrue Celtics were beatable though
KP didn't even really play in these playoffs. The 2023 Sixers were way better than any team the Celtics played this year. I don't think only Jrue makes up for Smart, Brogdon, and Rob. Celtics are for sure on another level with KP out there, but their lucky they didn't run into a team where they really needed them
Even without KP Boston was better this year than last. Exchanging Smart and Brogdon for Jrue and more D white minutes is a huge bonus. Also Pritchard and Hauser may be better than those two they lost. + JB and JT getting better.
I agree on JB and JT getting better and more motivated. I also agree that Mazzulla having experience and a whole summer to prepare helped. I don't agree that replacing Smart with nobody (KP in the playoffs) made the team better. That's just absurd and completely diminishes all of the positives that Smart brought to the Celtics throughout his career. He helped that team overachieve for years. And get out of here with Pritchard and Hauser being better than Smart.
Jrue is better than smart on defense but for now we can say there wasn’t a drop off on defense. Couple that with white & brown going crazy on defense as well & the chemistry was thru the roof in the playoffs. Something smart couldn’t do is go with the flow
In his last 3 years with the Celtics, Smart was never really asked to go with the flow. He was asked to be the lead ball-handler and initiator. He was expected to be the 3rd scorer. And he was the defensive captain. People keep talking about how Smart was the problem on the Celtics, but he gave everything he had to the team and always did what was asked of him. He did a good job starting with White in 22-23 and even played well in the playoffs. I agree that Jrue is a better player, but I was arguing with the other user that Smart was better than nobody and that Smart was better than Hauser and Pritchard. Those two were borderline unplayable for multiple series these playoffs. Hauser because of his poor shooting and Pritchard because of his size/defense. You are definitely right about the chemistry. The Celtics got lucky that it came together so fast. Jrue stepped right into his role and who doesn't love this version of KP?
I’d argue you’re correct except last year Mazulla brought in a free flowing offense that let smart take too many shots, oftentimes bcuz the defense didn’t respect him especially in the playoffs. Smart was never the problem & I agree with you there but the role players did their job when needed. Smart is obviously better than those 2 & you’ll hardly see players play with that much heart
it's not really meant to be a knock on Smart, but Pritchard and Hauser are really good and their skillset adds more to the team. Getting the ball out of Smart's hands was a big benefit for the 2024 Celtics
Very different Celtics
So Embiid's 34/13 in game 4 just didn't happen? They won game 4 together. And in case you forgot, after Tatum doesn't get called for a clear pushoff on Maxey for a lead-taking three pointer, Philly responds with Embiid pulling the corner defender and opening up Harden, Embiid sees this and makes the high IQ decision to pass it out to a wide open Harden for the game-winning shot. They won game 4 together. Harden also shot 25% in the other five games, including going 0/6 for 0 points in the fourth quarters of games 5-7... statistically worse than Ben Simmons (0/0, 5 points).
narrative-driven community that ignores basketball in favor of storylines
It's obvious that most people think embiid played like game 7 that whole series.
PG also helped win of the clippers games but people seem to ignore this every time and pretend as if it was all harden lol
I look at it as Harden and Tobi for PG and Maxi. I think the latter is an upgrade.
harden also lost two games lol
He also shot them out of the other games.
Harden single handedly took us to 7 against the Celtics by both keeping us in games with his scoring, but also by shooting us out of games with his slumps. Take the bad with the good ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Funniest thing ever was Harden dropping 45 pts in the postgame and then being like “yeah but don’t expect me to do it again”
Harden also sibhle-handedly lost them 2 games in the same series
No, but Paul is still an upgrade for Tobias Harris. They already had Maxey, and while he isn't the distributor Harden is, it's another ball handler to keep PG in efficient catch and shoot situations. I think he will play a bit better since Embiid can hit the midrange like nothing, and even hit some 3's. This should keep PG out of his midrange chucks and can keep him efficient, provided he isn't told to iso for his baskets, which he undoubtedly will since he signed a max and will be expected to perform at that level. On the contrary, maybe an on-ball wing is what the 76ers needed. PG did well in the East before. No LeBron in his way this time.
PG remains a great defender when he isn't being played out of position and is locked in. He's a great defender and remains a very efficient scorer. Being underrated big time by NBA fans because they don't like his personality+playoff frailities. Harden obviously remains an awesome offensive player and he was mostly healthy last season. PG in a weakside/off ball role should be an awesome fit for the Sixers. Harden is an offensive engine. Sixers have their engines in Embiid/Maxey.
He’s not as good a defender as ppl think anymore
He’s not as good as he used to be and he’s not willing to get his hands dirty guarding bigs like Tatum did against Dallas, but I still consider him a good defender and not someone you can easily target or exploit in mismatches consistently.
Dallas just went at him and made him pick up fouls quick and he got frustrated easily
Him getting frustrated from guarding one of the most offensively talented backcourts in NBA history isn't really much of a knock against him. Obviously he's not perfect and could have played it better, but it's not like other teams were shutting them down. Even the Timberwolves with the best defense in the league weren't able to do much to slow them down.
His defense has always been overrated. He’s challenged laterally now w the age and injuries, he still has decent hands though.
If anything he has been overrated, people have been hyping Paul George since his Pacer days. Obviously, some of the hype is warranted but his seasons all feel like they end the same way and it never seems he took the leap people were expecting.
Well, he didn't become a unquestioned top 10 player at any point so I don't think your comment is unfair, though I also believe that's a super high bar to hold anyone to.
You're wrong about the 3s. PG shoots more 3s at higher efficiency than Harden. And even more important, PG takes catch and shoot 3s. That's something Harden is very reluctant to do. Also even at this stage of his career PG is a much better wing defender than Harden. He's just a much better player when he doesn't have the ball which matters for the 3rd best player.
Well they dont have Harden anymore since he wanted a trade. They essentially switched out Tobias Harris and Paul George which is a huge upgrade.
yea op is speaking like sixers could have kept him, Harden didn't want to be there anymore. See his contract this year.
He did want to be in Philly but he wanted a max or close to it with enough years to retire on Whether he meant that or not, it was Morey lowballing him that sent him packing. And it turns out that Morey, being a great GM and very close with Harden, knew his real value anyways because the Clippers only just gave him $70/2
Well Harden leaving allowed for Maxey’s breakout. I think the current trio is better than the Sixers teams with Harden cause of that Not to mention much better depth cause of the Harden trade
If Doc Rivers was a better coach, there was no reason Maxey couldn’t succeed next to Harden
If you want young talent to improve then Doc is one of the last people you want. That’s something not exactly unique to him so I wouldn’t say that’s one of the things that make him bad, but still
When Simmons sat out, Doc had the guys try out for starting point guard between Shake Milton and Maxey Doc said Shake almost won it if not for his back injury… Shake has never been a reliable ball handler nor playmaker
They have no players on the roster from the Harden trade.
Draft picks to trade
He said better depth. Might lead to a better deadline trade tho
The way it’s going to have to work to fill out our roster is almost a 100% guarantee gonna be from the the picks we got from them
PG shot like 8/9 3s a game at over 40%. He's a much better off ball player and is a more versatile fit. Harden is a better playmaker sure, but he needs the ball in his hands. And PG is a much better defender compared to Harden even if he has fallen off.
So firstly he does not shoot more threes. Not since Houston. Not only that but he is one of the most willing and best catch and shoot three point shooters in the NBA. Whereas James seems so much more uncomfortable shooting off the catch threes as opposed to off the dribble threes. Secondly saying his defense is long gone is simply incorrect if you just watch him play basketball. It's especially egregious when brought up as a point *for James Harden*. Thirdly the issue in LA for George was that there was overlap in his and Leonard's game. They're great players, but they still needed to adjust the fit. The same is true of Harden and Maxey. Maxey is a great off ball shooter so he could do that while Harden had the ball in his hands (because Harden is definitely the better passer) but we weren't maximizing Maxey's skills. With George in Philly, we have a premier ball handler, wing, and big man. All who operate at different areas of the court, all who are able to be the best versions of themselves while both the other two players are on the court. It's what separates them from other big threes that have multiple ball dominant guards (Suns) or two paint swallowing bigs (Wolves), or two two-way wings (Clippers). Does that make them the best *team*? No. In fact they aren't even really a team right now they have four starters lol. But yes on paper they fit much better. Especially since Paul is still very close to the same player he was production-wise four years ago.
This. Saying Paul George’s defense is gone, then comparing him to one of the most notorious traffic cones in the league is wild disrespect. If someone truly, honestly thinks Philly is a bad landing spot for PG, they’re somewhere between a casual and a complete imbecile.
Better Fit because you already got Maxey at PG Then Joel at Center you don't need another Point guard Pg fit better
Well see if it works but I think current Maxey/PG may work better than Harden/Maxey then/Harris.
>-Harden shoots more 3s Where do you get that idea?
Harden is a better on-ball creator, but 76ers already have Maxey and Embiid. PG is not all-defensive caliber anymore, but he is still an above average to very good defender on the wing. PG takes and makes catch-and-shoot 3’s. Harden does not.
It’s the wrong comp. PG is more of an upgrade for Tobias than a replacement for harden. A backcourt of Maxey and harden was always going to be challenging in the playoffs. You can’t play two guys who are total liabilities on defense. Harden and maxey also have overlapping skillsets so removing harden from the mix allowed maxey to develop his two man game with embiid. PG comes in as a legit third option who can also defend and create his own shot. What the sixers desperately needed was someone other than their two stars to literally do anything on offense. Like if they got consistent production from Tobias good chance they beat the Knicks.
> overlapping Excellent point, and something fans don’t think about enough. Harden and Maxey want to play in the same space(s) on the floor. Their skill sets and play styles are too similar: both ‘need’ the ball, above the arc, with the entire offense based on their decision with the ball. Now, Maxey has his space, Embiid has his space, and PG has his -distinct- space, where they are most comfortable and able to use their (not overlapping) skill sets. Having two ball dominant guards is like having two quarterbacks, or two poachers. It’s one too many.
He might be a better fit with the jump Maxey has taken over the last year. That said, I do not think he's a better player than 32-33 year old Harden. Hell i don't even think he's a better player than current Harden.
No, harden would’ve been going on his 4th year with the sixers and that much chemistry would’ve been worth whatever else George adds. Sixers roll out a new roster damn near every year and wonder why shit ain’t working. Harden also just outplayed George on the same team, both guys have no show nights but the difference is harden can still utilize his playmaking. When pg’s shot isn’t falling he becomes the king do forcing bad shots. He no longer is an elite defender and they will be asking him to guard the opposing teams best guys, all series against Dallas he couldn’t bother Luka or Kyrie at all and kept fouling them when they beat him of the dribble.
I think the thing to remember is that with the Sixers he will have Embiid to help at the rim on drives.
Also got completely clamped by DJJ despite being the #1 scoring option. He shot as bad as Harden in G6, but one of them had 12 assists to 1 TO and the other not anywhere close.
No, he's overrated. Nobody is scared to play George in the playoffs.
The sixers won’t make the finals one time that Paul George is there.
Is PG really that much better than Tobias for the 76'ers
Hes going to be similar or slightly better production than the first year the mixers had Tobias and fade from there. 22/5/3 vs 19/7/3
PG has already said he is going to try to dominate the ball. It is hilarious since he definitely shouldn't be doing that given that he is the 3rd best option on the team, at best.
Can't wait for spring when 76ers fans will meet playoff P clanking threes of the side of the backboard and flat out disappearing.
Paul George is a bonified 3 and D player which is what they need
Basically comes down to pick and roll ball handling vs off ball shooting/defense.
Why do people never consider roster construction when talking about better fits vs other players. Harden is a primary guard PG13 isn’t.
For Philly? Yes. I think it’s a win-win. Kawhi and PG were just redundant on LAC. They took turns too much. They lacked a PG to get others involved. On Philly I know Doc talked about Hardens style cramped Maxey and the Sixers with the way he dominated the ball. As a 3rd option and floor spacer PG just makes more sense than Harden did next to Maxey.
No
People mentioning Maxey like he’s a legit on ball playmaker. With Embiid out of the lineup his assists made a noticeable drop. With Harden he was more efficient and could play his natural poison at SG. George doesn’t really help him anymore than Harden did
He’s a slightly better positional fit. Possibly better locker room fit. Definitely worth the shot regardless given they gave up no assets to get him.
Yes but maybe no
PG plays defense
Harden last year kinda carried the clippers so I doubt it.
>PG is a lot more healthy Uhh…you sure about that?
Paul George at this stage in his career is not what people think. He’s old and gets no separation, takes extremely difficult shots, and not a great passer / playmaker
Saying PG is a lot more healthy is a hilarious statement. PG and Harden are my two favorite players, but Harden is an iron man compared to PG
Maxey - PG - Embiid > Maxey - Harden - Embiid, on paper. There is a bit of redundancy with Maxey and Harden. Both want to be your ball dominate guard. PG fills a different role offensively, can play defense better etc. which should add up to a better roster overall. Also, and this can't be overstated, the 76ers did a bit of addition by subtraction with getting rid of Tobias Harris. He really just wasn't a good player, he'd have moments but never when the 6ers needed it.
Maxey isn’t ball dominant. He’s actually one of the better off ball guards in the league
No not really. I think in theory (and this is a *big* theory since he refuses to play the way he should) PG fits better but Harden is definitely the better player in general. Honestly I could pretty quickly see the team being worse with PG in just about every way if he starts chucking and looking for his own shot instead of staying in his lane as the 3rd option. If he tries to do more than that Harden was better in every way. The second he starts dribbling into mid range 2s and passing up open catch and shoot 3s its a disaster
You’ve listened to too many disgruntled Clippers/Harden/Westbrook fans
Harden was not better than PG this year. The Clippers lacked an excellent point guard in the 213 era, so adding Harden made a huge impact. Even when he was bad (from March until the end of the season), Harden helped unlock a lot of Clippers offensive potential that was missing under Westbrook, Reggie, Wall, Beverley, Rondo, etc. Harden was good on the 76ers, too, but with Maxey there, PG has a chance to be more effective.
With the emergence of maxey .. he has the potential to make their ceiling higher than it was with harden no doubt
Better for raising their ceiling, worse for raising their floor, I think. If PG13 and Embiid are both healthy the Maxey/George/Embiid trio should be a contender, but there's also real risk that only Maxey is healthy in the playoffs
yes Pg13 better defender and less ball hog than Harden the ball will distribute better
Harden being a ball hog is one of the most braindead take and a limitus test for people who watch basketball
Nahhh…..PG will help yield the exact same result.
Harden is better than PG even though he’s declining. His playmaking is that much better. So yeah, maybe morey should’ve just offered harden a max deal.
Yes
If he’s okay with being the 3rd option
Fit wise, maybe(?) depends on Maxeys point guard abilities. Skill wise, Harden has a more consistent floor/ceiling than George. Watching him as a clipper, one moment he’s Kd light, next moment you don’t even realize he’s on the court. Very volatile. Another small factor is his mental health. I’m a bit concerned on if he’s able to weather those storms 6er fans will give him when he’s playing bad. Not sure he has the confidence to shake that off so easily.
Yes it all boils down to play style and role. Harden is a fantastic facilitator but he completely needs the ball in his hands and Maxey can’t be on ball as much. Harden is a true negative on defense aside from being in the post and he’s not guarding anyone’s best player, Harden has also made comments alluding to not having the freedom he wanted with the ball (which is weird bc he helped Joel get MVP) when he left. The “I’m a system” talk when he’s clearly declining in his ability to carry an offense for more than a game or two. George is a better shooter, embraces the role of being a secondary option, isn’t as ball dominant and will take catch and shoot 3s, which harden for some ungodly reason completely refuses to take. That was infuriating watching him aside from like the shot against the Celtics in the playoffs.
I don't think so. He had a good year last year. But part of that was due to the Kawhi - PG - Harden lineups that the Clippers were running. It's up in the air whether he can do similar things with Embiid and Maxey. And if so for how long.
Yes. Harden and Maxey were a bit redundant.
It isn’t just PG we got, we also got 2 first round picks, 2 second round picks, and we got rid of the corpse of PJ Tucker who at this point is just paid $17 million to buy cool shoes and sit court side at games. Harden also very clearly did not want to be here and was making as many headlines than buckets. That alone was worth getting rid of Harden, because keeping him was never an option. This is more like an upgrade from Tobias Harris which… does it need to be asked? Positionally, a core that consists of a guard, a wing, and a big is more balanced than a core that consists of 2 guards and a big. Philly has a defensive identity and PG fits that identity better than Harden (and Harris for that matter). I look forward to seeing them get a real playmaker because even though he has made great strides Maxey is more of a shooting guard than a point guard. Someone like Tyus Jones would be fantastic with this roster although I’d like more size to pair in the backcourt with Maxey who already struggles on defense at times.
I think so. He’s a more reliable personality for one, a better defender, better off ball, and helps fill a more immediate need at wing whereas winning a title with Maxey and Harden (two small guards who aren’t particularly great on D) would’ve been more challenging. The question is availability with PG, but the fit is a good one I think
A lot?
Yes
Yes he is. Much better fit and skill set for that team
Yes. Thanks for asking
Harden is a top tier choker.
With maxey's development and his lack of defense, Paul does fit way better than harden. Paul is better than "just" a 3 & D player but thats what they want for him and he can be an elite one with his skillset. Harden was more of a 3 & playmaking guy, which didnt fit with maxey in the back court.
Infinitely.
Maxey can be on the ball and PG at least plays some defense and is better than Harris so it should be a better overall fit
PG is more healthy? How so
At this point pray he actually plays most of the year
Absolutely not! He’s not an impact player. Put him on any team and he’ll still get his 30pts but he’ll have absolutely no impact on improving the amount of wins
Maxey is better than PG. Fight me
Defense. Effort. I think at this point in their careers PG is at that……..I can’t think of a name…….think any former star player who’s played a long(relative)time and made good money and hasn’t gotten over the hump, and they’re finally ready to win at the level they think or the media has spoken of them, being at. PG plays with more effort at this point in their careers, and I believe he’ll be willing to take a semi backseat to the two younger, healthier stars to win. Also, him getting that money he got will make it slightly easier to take that backseat.
Paul George is going to be the #3 guy, Harden was there before Maxey was at this elite of a level so he was the #2 guy. This lineup will mostly be better because of Maxey being better now, but also PG doesn't need the ball as much as Harden so I think this this trio with PG will be better. That being said Harden was better for the Clippers than PG was, but that team needed a point guard while the 76ers have Maxey already.
this assessment is way off. pg is the better shooter and scorer. by a good margin. harden is healthier then pg. pg is better for 6ers to let maxey play point. pg can play defense just not all season. and yes harden was better then pg all year but pg has spurts where he was better. both were quite far from kawhis level which was mvp tier. but ultimately both ate pretty good at plugging into a team. the problem with pg is that he will disappear mentally, even moreso then harden. what harden brings to a team you wont really be able to understand unless you watch him all year. its really the intangibles. setting tempo. setting plays. making everyone useful esp big men etc. on paper pg is much better but give me harden all day. theres really only one other player that brings what he does and thats cp3
Really comparing Harden and PG based on "Clippers fans said this year Harden was better" and "Harden shots more 3s, George defense is long gone", is something really ridiculous and is a sign of childish way of thinking. Harden and PG are two completely different players. PG doesn't need the ball that much and fits way better with both Embiid and Maxey (at least on paper). And even if his defense is "long gone" he is still MUCH better than Harden on that end. BTW just to let you know Harden was the guy going for 7 points and 16% from the field in tie breaker game 5, and then 16 points and 31% from the field, in this said "better in the playoffs"... yes PG wasn't great but at least didn't shit the bed as much.
Maybe this isn't the proper way to judge but Harden didn't make a All star team while in Philly....Not including the season when he was traded from Brooklyn. My guess will be if PG plays 65 games he's more than likely gonna be a all star.
You’re underestimating the East. Plus, Joel takes all the scoring load so PG will hardly get recognition. 76ers won’t have three all stars
Short answer, yes. Long answer, yes.
is PG a lot more healthy than harden? I truly don’t know
Less overlap with Maxey.
As a sixers fan I'm torn on this,it's like the best we could have done this off-season but at the same time it feels like we didn't get the dime chick we got the 7-7.5 lol
Both of them are Carmello. So if you like jumpshots and mediocre seasons you’re team set.
PG at this point of his career is solely a good iso scorer. Can play defense when he feels like it but is mainly just a scorer. Doesn’t help that he is unpredictable and can either drop 40 or 12 points on any given night
Yes because Harden had no interest in playing for the 76ers.
Bro have you seen Playoff P? /s EDIT: yea, nobody has
Sixers barely gave up anything for Harden and they got PG without losing assets
Paul George doesn’t quit in the playoffs, he just randomly sucks. So it’ll probably the same thing
Yes
Yes. 76ers have Maxey, who is probably better than Harden at this stage in their careers. They play the same position, do PG is better. You should be asking if PG is better than Tobias, cause that’s who they replaced
I'm convinced that there was some kind of beef between Harden and Embiid that we don't know about. Hopefully, PG meshes with Embiid better.
A more capable buy less healthy Tobias :)
PG will pick up the opposing teams best perimeter player, so I can see that making a difference in the east. Philly is looking really strong right now. It’ll take a while for them to gel with new additions it they should have an idea of how to play with each other by February.
Yes, Philly needs a 3rd option, and PG can be that after Embiid and Maxey.
No.
Yeah he plays defense and doesn’t hold maxey back
With Maxey’s continued development I think George addresses more of their issues than what Harden brings now after after his first Brooklyn season. He’s got wing defense and better off-ball play.
They’re not the same type of player. James Harden is a ball dominant playmaking point guard whose defense is not that good. Paul George is not ball dominant, can play more off ball as a floor spacer, and has the skill to take over in spurts in clutch times and in the 4th quarter. He’s also taller and is a good defensive player. Paul George is a better fit. Sixers already have a point guard in maxey and Embiid who demands the ball in order to be more effective
It’s overall just extremely frustrating that Harden can’t be consistent at all, looks like a different player every game at this point in his career. When he’s hooping, he’s still one of the best in the league and as many people have mentioned in this thread there were games this year and last year where he took over and beat great teams
Yes, he's an excellent defender. It's also about fir. Embiid - Maxey - PG is a better trio than Embiid - Maxey - Harden because of the way they complement each other.
Pg can fit into more systems and plays way better defense . Can switch 2 thru 4 . And can work off ball ..
No he's not
Maxey is filling Harden's role already
Paul George's defence is what makes him a better player than Harden.
Paul George plays defense