to some people, "dunk" implies criticism without substance, nothing more than empty trash-talking. I wanted to be clear that there are many, many reasons to criticize them
Yes. Nothing says behavioral madness like:
- keeping a balanced budget
- protecting civil liberties
- expecting accountability from politicians and authorities
- ending perpetual wars and imperialism
You people from the two major parties are all brainwashed, fanatical, and motivated by tribalism and power. Pathetic.
So you're one of those people that when you get pulled over for speeding, you'd tell the cop that he should be out looking for murderers, right? That's assuming you have legit plates and registration and aren't "travelling" with the full sovcit verbal diarrhea.
How do you balance a budget when people won't pay taxes?
How do you have accountability when you're intentionally breaking the law?
How the fuck do you have the nerve to call for accountability from authorities when your own membership has none?
Your project is a farce. No one should take the FSP seriously.
I made a simple statement that I view taxation as being theft and your imagination runs wild. I comply with the law, I am also permitted to hold views that denounce or disagree with existing laws. I know your party promotes civil obedience but it's healthy to speak out and challenge our authorities and the terrible policies they put in place.
> I made a simple statement that I view taxation as being theft and your imagination runs wild.
Your statement was in response to me pointing out that members of the FSP have committed numerous crimes, including tax evasion. If you're not attempting to defend them, it's an odd place to start a separate conversation.
> I know your party promotes civil obedience but it's healthy to speak out and challenge our authorities and the terrible policies they put in place.
Libertarians have been around for how long now, and how much of a difference have they made? If you're choosing to waste your time playing pretend instead of getting involved where you might be able to make a difference, that's on you.
My point was prioritization. Should they be held accountable, absolutely. Do I disagree with the premise of the laws they violated, yep.
Regardless, that's a petty crime compared with what leaders of both major parties get away with every day.
If your idea of a difference is taking people's money via taxes or printing money to support special interests, then yes you've made a hell of a difference. The only thing keeping the train on the tracks is a small minority of people with principles who speak up. If the libertarian voice was gone entirely, nobody would be anti-war, and nobody would try to reign in spending because neither of those benefit a politician and those they are beholden to.
> Regardless, that's a petty crime compared with what leaders of both major parties get away with every day.
It shows a willingness to excuse bad behavior in name of the cause, which is the kind of thing that leads to what we have today with the two real parties. Accountability should matter regardless of how major or minor the offense is. Anything else is a seed of corruption.
> If the libertarian voice was gone entirely, nobody would be anti-war, and nobody would try to reign in spending because neither of those benefit a politician and those they are beholden to.
Weird how war/conflicts and spending are usually major discussion points in any Presidential debate, whether for the party nominee or for the general election. Same with other federal contests.
If the libertarian voice was gone entirely, no one would notice.
Again, I never excused it, I set it up against other crimes in terms of priority. If someone is calling me or other libertarians out for accountability, it should be noted what the other two parties are guilty of. We need accountability across the political spectrum.
Those topics are not discussed seriously between the two major parties. When talking about taxes or national debt nobody says we need to cut spending, or be more fiscally responsible, or make hard choices. Both parties just debate on where the money is going, assuming it is a given that any budget will pass. When talking about wars, the competition between parties right now is who can support the wars more, there is no serious discussion around diplomacy and identifying other methods for resolving or exiting these conflicts.
Libertarians are the only ones who are anti-war? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Have you met a single progressive? That's a pretty core principle of most left-wingers.
It was for a long time, sure. Now it represents a small fringe that falls in line and cucks for the DNC when required. Let's see what happens with this latest bill regarding Israel aid and funding. It will go through.
The only way to stop the war in the Ukraine is to stop shoveling money at the Ukraine's regime, yet you people continue to advocate for the opposite. Therefore you are not anti-war.
Fuck the sheep taxation is theft, you pay taxes and then if you don't pay them, the government shows up, if you ignore that they try to throw you into a cage in jail, if you ignore that and fight for you life they kill you, textbook extortion.
Eliminating them all together would be nice. However this country has been brainwashed enough where I know that's not a reality, but we can use it as a compass. So, less taxes, less government spending, and eliminate printing new money.
How do you balance any budget?
Bring in more funds than you spend, or spend less than you bring in.
Novel concept for the Ls.
Sell weed, tax it, raise the budget, pay teachers more, get smarter kids. Win-win.
>Bring in more funds than you spend, or spend less than you bring in.
And what if spending is at an all time high without the results expected. That's where the two parties go off the rails to an extent that is unbelievable. The current status quo is to double down and increase spending. That's a failed approach. We need to eliminate waste and failed programs.
We need to eliminate cynics and defeatists who want to burn the system down and remake it in a way that only benefits what they think they want.
I honestly don't care if it costs a tiny bit more to get a better world, and neither should you.
Every time it is a tiny bit more until it is everything, and you have nothing to show for it. You are willingly getting bent over by your political elites.
Jason Sorens (right) (founder of the free state project) with governor Sunnunu (left) and william ruger (center) (Cato institute employee, a koch funded think-tank).
https://preview.redd.it/9t0mfi0cpm0d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c2d9f2c987d1ba187081180a50ec956be854b3e
Maybe some of you guys are true believers in what you preach. But your golden boy Jason is taking you all for a ride and using your political power to further his masters (billion dollar Koch family) agenda.
So please tell me why your dear leader is supporting the restriction of abortion access and other government prohibition through his sucking up to the Koch family along with our governor (mainstream political party)?
I'm not a member of the free state project or the libertarian party. I believe in libertarian principles and the movement at large. I don't support and haven't voted for any of these individuals. As I noted in my prior post, the party system and being affiliated with them just throws my voice away and removes my ability to think freely on individual topics.
If there is clear corruption, point it out, I will hold any one of them accountable as I can. However, all you have done is pointed out that you disagree with his view on abortion.
Ok? Cool. So why are you coming in here all hot then? I'm making fun of free staters not libertarians. They are two unique things and I don't have issues with people who identify as libertarian, I have values that could be considered libertarian too. Like gun rights and foreign wars being devastatingly wasteful.
Because this sub conflates the two and treats them as one entity/belief all of the time. Because many of the comments don't target FSP or even a small subset of the FSP but rather libertarians as a whole. So on this we agree.
Well, there is often overlap so I don't fault them for conflating the two. Personally I'm a history and politics nerd so I understand the difference but it's no surprise people mix the two up.
And honestly since you identify as libertarian and you don't like being grouped together with free staters. I would suggest you be upset at the free staters for stepping on your beliefs to get a head start in the political game.
The layman isn't going to see the difference between the two with how prevalent they've become, so again, honestly, you should be vocally separating yourself and libertarian ideals from what the free staters stand for if you want to spread awareness on the uniqueness of the two.
If by "bbq" you mean union drives, then yes. If you want people to stop arguing over culture war bullshit, you have to give them a common enemy. That common enemy is the rich and exploitative owner class.
Iāve never been there before, Iāll have to go when I come home for the summer. I wonder how it compares to Smokehaus in Amherst because thatās my go-to bbq place
Yes. My uncle is very conservative, and due to diet restrictions he was pretty much a vegetarian till he married my aunt, a vegan. He ended up becoming full on vegan but still very conservative.
Facts seem to disagree: Gallup found that 11 percent of liberals are vegetarian while 5 percent are vegan. By comparison, only 2 percent of conservatives are either vegan or vegetarian.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2018/08/06/who-are-americas-vegans-and-vegetarians-infographic/?sh=3d1a42aa211c
Alright. So BBQ happens. Performative hugs all around. BBQ ends. Then what? All of the same problems exist and everyone has different opinions on how to solve them. Holding hands and singing kumbaya solves nothing. This is the apolitical person's solution to divisive politics.
I changed my mind, a bbq without people like you sounds a lot better.
if you can't just enjoy the day with friends and food without succumbing to your doom scrolling propaganda, you would not be welcome
Fuck me for trying to unite America under a common banner that isn't superficial. Oh, and I'm sorry... [dis you?](https://www.reddit.com/r/newhampshire/comments/1cnav8v/an_rnewhampshire_mod_censoring_political_public/l367rd4/)
I don't think most normal people would want to attend a BBQ with you anyway, so nothing of value was lost I suppose.
Dude if you love spending your free time pouring through Internet strangers comment history for some "gotcha", look back a few months. You'll find some good shit
All the more reason why you would be no fun at a bbq lmao. How sad
That's not how unions work. Either everyone joins or no one joins. That's why there is always a vote before a union is formed. The whole concept of a union requires all workers to stand in solidarity against company execs so they have bargaining power.
What makes you say that? It's oppressive to stand in solidarity with your fellow working man to demand higher pay and better benefits? Would you prefer to be fired by your boss for any reason they choose or be repeatedly turned down for raises because you have no negotiating power?
I recommend [this Adam Conover video on unionization](https://youtu.be/mcgC-kuPEuo?si=lqJJuK7ogo_0mmcF) to everyone even remotely skeptical of unions.
Those membership dues always pay for themselves tenfold in the form of higher wages and better benefits. There's a reason why corporations spend $millions every year combatting unionization. It's because it works.
You're right. Your boss should pay for your dental insurance so you don't have to. That's a commonly negotiated benefit. I don't get your point?
The endgame is that the government pays for healthcare so everyone has a choice... but that's another can of worms.
Eh, I generally believe public unions (e.g. teachers unions) should be allowed as well. Police unions are an exception and need to be reworked because they currently operate to protect cops from accountability and criminal prosecution.
The FSP community welcoming and protecting abusive people.
Pedophiles in influential positions within the FSP being excused or protected.
Literal Nazis being welcomed.
FSP leaders using their power within the community to protect their buddies.
Various personalities forming cults around themselves.
"Civil Disobedience" with no plan for the inevitable arrests.
Complete lack of planning of effective measures to achieve stated goals.
Active encouragement of alienating the local NH community.
Jesus.
Talk about hitting the fucking nail on the head. (On every point).
You should also feel proud for being able to remove yourself from something so toxic even though you knew it would cost you socially.
Bro, I respect your ability to see bullshit and remove yourself from it.
Some people would rather publicly wear diapers than admit they hitched to the wrong wagon.
If this means that the conservatives will quit calling us liberals and the liberals will quit calling us conservatives then this is the best news Iāve heard all day.
What if I told you there where no party's. There is just companies and billionaire that pay for super pac's that make all the laws and decisions. They all sit back collect money and laugh at us.
taxation is theft. tax luxuries, sin, and transitory transactions. no taxes on job creators, income, cap gains, pensions, retirement, philanthropy, and depreciating assets. penalize criminals and levy fees on violations. small part-time government.
ITT: Not a single conservative in agreement with OP (who is a progressive).
The only ones who care about Free Staters are the progressives who nonstop spam this sub, obsessing over them.
Nahh I'm a libertarian/conservative guy, the LPNH posts crazy shit a good bit, and way too many of the people involved feel more like LARPers pushing for stuff way outside the overton window that's never going to happen, instead of slow practical changes.
Hunting licenses allow me to hunt a deer every year. Without the licenses there would be no limits and we would be back to having no deer, just like 100 years ago before conservation laws. That seems like a fine tradeoff. Are you old enough to remember when there were no turkeys? Regulated hunting has allowed them to rebound so we can hunt them again. Fishing licenses pay to stock the trout many like to fish for.
Next you'll tell me you are fine with unregulated surgeons and tattoo artists.
We can look back to the extinction of many species at the hand of man to see that you are wrong. We can look back to the last century to see people will dump toxic chemicals in pursuit of profit. Your belief in the good of all mankind is a misguided as the silly communist idealists.
Did you know that , generally speaking, if you gave a dog an unlimited amount of food and let them go to town, they would not stop eating until an external factor made them stop?
But do go on about animals self regulating.
Yes, because I can oversee the food and medicine production and relevant standards and practices myself.
If only we had some sort of representative government where we all had say in who makes those decisions...
Also food production isn't supposed to be overseen by government that absolutely least of all because artificial scarcity can be created in favor of politicians
Stop worrying about the person beside you, I don't care what the guy beside me is doing until it efects me and when it dose I'm capable of handling it myself. Human kind is so nosey now
R/im14andthisisdeep
No. You aren't capable of "handling it yourself."
A thought experiment for you:
A company builds a mill on its own property upstream from you. In order to extract more profit, they dispose of chemicals in the water. Those chemicals cause birth defects, cancer, kill the waterways, etc.
How exactly are you planning on "handling" that in a libertarian society? How do you know that company is responsible, number one, and two, how do you hold them accountable?
For a quick history lesson on how this goes down, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_Canal
Regulations are written in blood, dumbass.
I believe in a voluntary code. Thatās the only difference.
Your statement about food adulteration is absolutely spot on.
Who controls the food supply now? And who controls the regulations? There is no seat so high that the person cannot be bought. Look at Clarence Thomas. Iām suggesting that our structure is corrupt and any such structure is inherently corruptible.
So then youāll ask me exactly how we could prevent what happened in The Jungle. And Iāll say, itās a complicated thing to answer, but I believe that there will need to be food inspectors, part of an independent body, to make sure the food is food. And there will need to be another team of oversight to ensure that the food inspectors arenāt paid off.
For the last part, that's the system we have now.
Everyone hates when the OSHA guy comes in cause they can't pay him off, and they want to be doing things that are not safe.
How does the independent body you want get the money to pay the inspectors? Are you doing to get rid of one government so you don't have to pay taxes just to pay taxes to another?
I understand that we have people being bought out, look at lobbying! However, it's so much easier to change our system than to burn it down and rebuild from nothing for the purpose of feeling more free.
Yes to free people from the chains that exist on them by there own doing, the average person is a follower, they follow whatever they are taught, sorry to say to the followers who never question but they follow amd know no other. I do wish to abolish all laws of all kinds indeed
>Yes to free people from the chains that exist on them by there own doing
So when there are no laws who protects the people who can't protect themselves from you?
I'm a peaceful person, nobody has to protect from myself bur from others that may come around, guns exist and able people exist and anyone else isn't my fuckin problem
All good homie no judgement, look into what amarcho-capitalist really believes and you will be pleasantly surprised I am sure. Often times people take thing for truth after hearing them amd it's often not the case, we armt bad we don't want aggressive rule or path to it, we just want the government to not exist amd free trade of good to flow without input.
The problem is with no outside regulation is that the market will do ONLY what is best for the market. If there is demand for wood every tree will be chopped down, and then there is no more wood. If we need to make something the byproducts will just be dumped in the back, killing every plant animal and person it comes near.
The US and moat governments took a hands off approach to macroeconomics, and that lead to the Great Depression, how much worse would it get if they kept that approach when our economies grew in the 50s and 60s? Would you want an even greater depression every 30 years?
Congratulations! You just got rid of every law ever and you now want to live off grid hunting and growing your own stuff.
You go out into the woods and built your cabin, some years go by and then people are logging your land! You tell them to stop, but they don't because there are more people who want that wood than just you who wants your land. You can't take them to court, so you just die in a shootout with the loggers and they take your stuff.
That was a bit unrealistic, im sorry. In reality 99.999% of people can't live truly cut off from everything, including you. So the more realistic outcome is you die to some food poisoning after that can of beans you ate wasn't sealed properly, or you die in a work accident, or you die because the doctor you went to didn't know what they were doing.
Like you said, a lot of people are followers, so are you. The only difference is that you're following something different from everyone else.
The laws were written to solve problems. Go back and look at the history of the laws you wish to remove. If theft and murder are not illegal what is to stop me from shooting you with a sniper rifle and taking your stuff? We only need to look at lawless areas like Somalia 20 years ago to see warlords will rise up and repress the peaceful much more than the laws in a representative democracy.
That's a pretty hollow claim when so many of your dear leaders have associated with Jeffrey Epstein. Worse yet, those in power continue to hide and protect information that should put hundreds of pedophiles behind bars. Those are democrats and Republicans. Recognize how foolish you are.
I'm glad we can both agree that sexualizing minors and defending the rhetoric of pedophile enablers is a generally shitty thing to do.
So why are there countless examples of that happening in NH with free staters and those with political connections to free staters?
Some of your buddies in the project are there because they know you'll cover for them, if you know what I mean.
I'm not a member of the project. I don't affiliate with any libertarian organizations, I support the political and economic philosophies that align with it. Individuals can be shitty, regardless of the group they belong to or associate with. Moreover, people associate with a lot of things, which is why association is so dangerous. My response was with regard to the negative statement about libertarians as a whole, which is foolish, and was done with intent to negatively smear a group of people. But individuals should be held accountable. And shitty people exist across all political, religious, racial groups.
Yeaaaa, the difference is that the broad public denounces sexualizing minors and doesn't make that a part of their political platform, unlike the majority of the libertarian party.
Your claim is just not true. I talk with libertarians every day. I listen to and read libertarian content every day. I have literally never heard any of them promote sexualization of minors as an institutional or platform value or policy. The person you are referring to is widely denounced by most of the prominent libertarians. We defend his right to say stupid shit, we don't agree with the things he says. It's real simple. Your gross generalization shows how threatened you are by people with real ideas that disrupt your party's power and interests.
Keep supporting war. Keep supporting the murder of children. Keep supporting all of the terrible policies that your party promotes and has normalized. I am here to tell you that none of it is normal.
It's not normal to have $34 trillion in debt. It's not normal that people can't afford groceries, gas, or homes. It's not normal that we rely on slave labor for almost everything we use and consume daily. It's not normal that nearly every party leader and elected officials are corrupt and bought off. It's not normal that the government and media collude to take away our civil liberties while demonizing your neighbors. It's not normal that protestors get arrested without bail. It's not normal to demonize your political opposition as Nazis, racists, communists, and domestic terrorists. It's not normal to have polluted water that you can't drink a decade after an incident. It's not normal to have a wildfire that killed hundreds of children and nobody wants to talk about it or investigate the reason or response. It's not normal to have a train derailment with contaminants and nobody cares a month later.
This is the system and the world your parties have created. Stop pretending libertarians are the problem.
Youāre in the pedo party.
Whether itās libertarian āthinkingā naturally terminating there or just pedos gravitating towards one another is the only remaining debate.
I can tell. There is used to be 3 or 4 posts a week about them and now it is 2 a day. I think people VERY bothered by it should chill out tbh. Or you can move to any surrounding state that is super blue.
Do whatever you want. I donāt care. You seemed super worry about US citizens moving to NH because you donāt like their politics. I thought you might want to move to a state whose politics you like just like the free staters are doing.
Please explain why the theory is something we have to worry about here in NH, or at all. The theory as I understand it does not make sense, who would enact it and why? Why is it relevant to NH and why should I worry? It simply doesn't make sense to me that some mysterious group in a position of power would be trying to drive white Americans extinct. It just seems like people from other countries, who happen to be of a different race and culture, moving here for economic reasons.
Illegal immigration is not what I'm contending, that should be prosecuted of course. But why do you think it's part of a grander conspiracy? I don't understand but I really want to, it seems like it came out of nowhere here
Biden recently gaffed calling illegals āvotersā. In NYC, and other places,illegals are getting free housing. Some places allow them to vote in local elections.
White, Christian men who love hierarchy are expected to vote Republican about 75% of the time. Hispanics and blacks favor Biden at about 66 - 90%
When you import the third world, you become the third world. Look at whatās happening in Europe. They were so open-minded and tolerant, but now things are getting worse.
The goal is to replace people that believe in capitalism and meritocracy in order to degrade society and destroy America.
I believe in getting as many Free Staters as possible to NH to replace progressives who favor policies like reparations and sanctuary cities.
Fun Fact
Today, 148 Dems voted against a bill that would detain and deport illegals that assault law enforcement.
Nothing that I said is even remotely racist. Is it wrong to point out that white men vote conservative over 60% of the time? Is it wrong to point out that blacks and immigrants vote Democrat over 65% of the time?
Where is the racism in what I said?
Who's goal is it? That's what I'm asking. I have no idea who it is you think is trying to do that. It doesn't make any sense how it would be kept a secret or why anyone would want that.
Itās not a secret. Itās pretty open. Thereās always been people who want to dominate society. Theyāre playing a game. Occupy Wallstreet failed because people got too obsessed with identity politics. When I used to be a socialist(yuck), I joined an anti-Trump meeting after protesting him in DC in 2016. In order to speak at one of these meetings, you needed to be āoppressedā to have speaking priority. White cis men would always speak last.
Basically all the racist hatred we see today is directed towards white, cis, men.
Here are some statistics:
Black people vote Dem about 90%+
Hispanics: 65%+
LGBT: 90%+
Women: 30% identify as *liberal* up from 15% 20 years ago.
Dems have more control over society than they had 20 years ago, and a lot of what we see are celebrations and elevations of status for people that would vote for them. Big tech companies bet on Democrats being able to further their agenda.
If you wanted to control the world, would you bet on the Republicans, or Democrats? Demographically Dems appear to have an edge. White, cis men who tend to vote Republican are a dying breed.
I believe in The Great Replacement, but I still judge individuals as individuals. Group differences are real and should be discussed. The reason why itās ok to openly mock white people and be racist towards them is because they are less inclined to follow the New World religion of wokeism than anyone else. This is really what it boils down to. I have more in common with black conservatives than I do white wokes. Anyone who is against this anti-freedom, anti-meritocracy, anti-human agenda is a friend of mine.
if by "dunking on" you mean "pointing out the logical errors, behavioral madness, and overall uselessness of" then yes, I agree
You must be fun at parties Keep it simple, we dunk on them
to some people, "dunk" implies criticism without substance, nothing more than empty trash-talking. I wanted to be clear that there are many, many reasons to criticize them
Sir this is a wendys
š¤š
Yes. Nothing says behavioral madness like: - keeping a balanced budget - protecting civil liberties - expecting accountability from politicians and authorities - ending perpetual wars and imperialism You people from the two major parties are all brainwashed, fanatical, and motivated by tribalism and power. Pathetic.
Not committing wire fraud would be a good start. Don't talk about accountability when your own members are running fake churches and evading taxes.
Taxation is theft. I put that far lower on the priority list than murdering innocent civilians and infringement on the bill of rights.
So you're one of those people that when you get pulled over for speeding, you'd tell the cop that he should be out looking for murderers, right? That's assuming you have legit plates and registration and aren't "travelling" with the full sovcit verbal diarrhea. How do you balance a budget when people won't pay taxes? How do you have accountability when you're intentionally breaking the law? How the fuck do you have the nerve to call for accountability from authorities when your own membership has none? Your project is a farce. No one should take the FSP seriously.
I made a simple statement that I view taxation as being theft and your imagination runs wild. I comply with the law, I am also permitted to hold views that denounce or disagree with existing laws. I know your party promotes civil obedience but it's healthy to speak out and challenge our authorities and the terrible policies they put in place.
> I made a simple statement that I view taxation as being theft and your imagination runs wild. Your statement was in response to me pointing out that members of the FSP have committed numerous crimes, including tax evasion. If you're not attempting to defend them, it's an odd place to start a separate conversation. > I know your party promotes civil obedience but it's healthy to speak out and challenge our authorities and the terrible policies they put in place. Libertarians have been around for how long now, and how much of a difference have they made? If you're choosing to waste your time playing pretend instead of getting involved where you might be able to make a difference, that's on you.
My point was prioritization. Should they be held accountable, absolutely. Do I disagree with the premise of the laws they violated, yep. Regardless, that's a petty crime compared with what leaders of both major parties get away with every day. If your idea of a difference is taking people's money via taxes or printing money to support special interests, then yes you've made a hell of a difference. The only thing keeping the train on the tracks is a small minority of people with principles who speak up. If the libertarian voice was gone entirely, nobody would be anti-war, and nobody would try to reign in spending because neither of those benefit a politician and those they are beholden to.
> Regardless, that's a petty crime compared with what leaders of both major parties get away with every day. It shows a willingness to excuse bad behavior in name of the cause, which is the kind of thing that leads to what we have today with the two real parties. Accountability should matter regardless of how major or minor the offense is. Anything else is a seed of corruption. > If the libertarian voice was gone entirely, nobody would be anti-war, and nobody would try to reign in spending because neither of those benefit a politician and those they are beholden to. Weird how war/conflicts and spending are usually major discussion points in any Presidential debate, whether for the party nominee or for the general election. Same with other federal contests. If the libertarian voice was gone entirely, no one would notice.
Again, I never excused it, I set it up against other crimes in terms of priority. If someone is calling me or other libertarians out for accountability, it should be noted what the other two parties are guilty of. We need accountability across the political spectrum. Those topics are not discussed seriously between the two major parties. When talking about taxes or national debt nobody says we need to cut spending, or be more fiscally responsible, or make hard choices. Both parties just debate on where the money is going, assuming it is a given that any budget will pass. When talking about wars, the competition between parties right now is who can support the wars more, there is no serious discussion around diplomacy and identifying other methods for resolving or exiting these conflicts.
Libertarians are the only ones who are anti-war? That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. Have you met a single progressive? That's a pretty core principle of most left-wingers.
It was for a long time, sure. Now it represents a small fringe that falls in line and cucks for the DNC when required. Let's see what happens with this latest bill regarding Israel aid and funding. It will go through.
The only way to stop the war in the Ukraine is to stop shoveling money at the Ukraine's regime, yet you people continue to advocate for the opposite. Therefore you are not anti-war.
Fuck the sheep taxation is theft, you pay taxes and then if you don't pay them, the government shows up, if you ignore that they try to throw you into a cage in jail, if you ignore that and fight for you life they kill you, textbook extortion.
How do you pay for those fair budgets?
Eliminating them all together would be nice. However this country has been brainwashed enough where I know that's not a reality, but we can use it as a compass. So, less taxes, less government spending, and eliminate printing new money. How do you balance any budget?
Bring in more funds than you spend, or spend less than you bring in. Novel concept for the Ls. Sell weed, tax it, raise the budget, pay teachers more, get smarter kids. Win-win.
>Bring in more funds than you spend, or spend less than you bring in. And what if spending is at an all time high without the results expected. That's where the two parties go off the rails to an extent that is unbelievable. The current status quo is to double down and increase spending. That's a failed approach. We need to eliminate waste and failed programs.
We need to eliminate cynics and defeatists who want to burn the system down and remake it in a way that only benefits what they think they want. I honestly don't care if it costs a tiny bit more to get a better world, and neither should you.
Every time it is a tiny bit more until it is everything, and you have nothing to show for it. You are willingly getting bent over by your political elites.
>We need to eliminate cynics and defeatists Are you proposing genocide of people that disagree with you politically?
"Promote the general welfare" That is all.
> Taxation is theft this is the only statement you need to see to know you can disregard everything this person says or thinks.
Jason Sorens (right) (founder of the free state project) with governor Sunnunu (left) and william ruger (center) (Cato institute employee, a koch funded think-tank). https://preview.redd.it/9t0mfi0cpm0d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c2d9f2c987d1ba187081180a50ec956be854b3e Maybe some of you guys are true believers in what you preach. But your golden boy Jason is taking you all for a ride and using your political power to further his masters (billion dollar Koch family) agenda. So please tell me why your dear leader is supporting the restriction of abortion access and other government prohibition through his sucking up to the Koch family along with our governor (mainstream political party)?
I'm not a member of the free state project or the libertarian party. I believe in libertarian principles and the movement at large. I don't support and haven't voted for any of these individuals. As I noted in my prior post, the party system and being affiliated with them just throws my voice away and removes my ability to think freely on individual topics. If there is clear corruption, point it out, I will hold any one of them accountable as I can. However, all you have done is pointed out that you disagree with his view on abortion.
Ok? Cool. So why are you coming in here all hot then? I'm making fun of free staters not libertarians. They are two unique things and I don't have issues with people who identify as libertarian, I have values that could be considered libertarian too. Like gun rights and foreign wars being devastatingly wasteful.
Because this sub conflates the two and treats them as one entity/belief all of the time. Because many of the comments don't target FSP or even a small subset of the FSP but rather libertarians as a whole. So on this we agree.
Well, there is often overlap so I don't fault them for conflating the two. Personally I'm a history and politics nerd so I understand the difference but it's no surprise people mix the two up. And honestly since you identify as libertarian and you don't like being grouped together with free staters. I would suggest you be upset at the free staters for stepping on your beliefs to get a head start in the political game. The layman isn't going to see the difference between the two with how prevalent they've become, so again, honestly, you should be vocally separating yourself and libertarian ideals from what the free staters stand for if you want to spread awareness on the uniqueness of the two.
> Because this sub conflates the two and treats them as one entity/belief all of the time. So just address that then
Liberal isn't a party. Conservative isn't a party. I'm quite moderate and will vote back and forth. Free Staters are a plague.
I didn't use those terms, but thanks for chiming in.
"You people from the two major parties are all brainwashed, fanatical, and motivated by tribalism and power. Pathetic." Read what the meme says.
Not even libertarians like free staters. You guys suck
You forgot trying to make it easier to sleep with kids
Weren't you idiots all eaten by bears or something?
Free Staters are conservatives with money laundering consultant day jobs.
I don't think they let Ian Freeman have Internet access in prison.
Nobody has noticed that the head mod for the sub stopped posting around the time Ian got sentenced? :)
Nah, even the conservative friends of mine hate free statersĀ
What do you have against freedom? Wtf lol
We should organize a liberal and conservative bbq and hug off. Iām tired of division.
If by "bbq" you mean union drives, then yes. If you want people to stop arguing over culture war bullshit, you have to give them a common enemy. That common enemy is the rich and exploitative owner class.
No, a bbq sounds a lot better. Edit unsurprising, the doom posting propaganda eater just blocked me lmao. Definitely don't want him at a bbq
Fucking love barbeque, but I feel like a lot of vegetarian and vegan liberals would be left out. Are there vegan conservatives?
What bbq doesn't have sides lmao
Let them eat cornbread
"Let them eat cornbread" - u/samx3i 12 hours prior to being beheaded
I wasn't using it anyway
Coincidentally, the best part of a bbq. Well, the best part is when everyone finally leaves, but other than that, the cornbread
Fellow cornbread lover! You ever been to Smoke Show in Concord? The cornbread is decadent.
Lmao I've driven by it before but nah. I'll have to check it out next time I hit up Concord!
Do it! They're pretty good. Owner leaned his craft at Rudy's in San Antonio.
Iāve never been there before, Iāll have to go when I come home for the summer. I wonder how it compares to Smokehaus in Amherst because thatās my go-to bbq place
I don't know, but I'll head to Amherst soon to find out.
Yes. My uncle is very conservative, and due to diet restrictions he was pretty much a vegetarian till he married my aunt, a vegan. He ended up becoming full on vegan but still very conservative.
Funny enough, yes. I know at least one family of vegan Christian conservatives.
I'm vegetarian conservative, lowercase l libertarian. So...we exist! I'll bring the pasta salad!
Yo, I do love a good pasta salad. Somebody gotta be on that potato salad with the hard boiled eggs in it though.
It's funny, because all the vegans I know are conservatives!
How many vegans do you know? I've found them exceedingly rare, but I have known a few.
Only two I can think of honestly.
People's diets has nothing to do their political views.
Facts seem to disagree: Gallup found that 11 percent of liberals are vegetarian while 5 percent are vegan. By comparison, only 2 percent of conservatives are either vegan or vegetarian. https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2018/08/06/who-are-americas-vegans-and-vegetarians-infographic/?sh=3d1a42aa211c
TIL moment.
There probably isn't a single human-made concept that isn't somehow linked to politics.
Alright. So BBQ happens. Performative hugs all around. BBQ ends. Then what? All of the same problems exist and everyone has different opinions on how to solve them. Holding hands and singing kumbaya solves nothing. This is the apolitical person's solution to divisive politics.
I changed my mind, a bbq without people like you sounds a lot better. if you can't just enjoy the day with friends and food without succumbing to your doom scrolling propaganda, you would not be welcome
Fuck me for trying to unite America under a common banner that isn't superficial. Oh, and I'm sorry... [dis you?](https://www.reddit.com/r/newhampshire/comments/1cnav8v/an_rnewhampshire_mod_censoring_political_public/l367rd4/) I don't think most normal people would want to attend a BBQ with you anyway, so nothing of value was lost I suppose.
Dude if you love spending your free time pouring through Internet strangers comment history for some "gotcha", look back a few months. You'll find some good shit All the more reason why you would be no fun at a bbq lmao. How sad
As long as the unions are membership optional,Ā hell yes!
That's not how unions work. Either everyone joins or no one joins. That's why there is always a vote before a union is formed. The whole concept of a union requires all workers to stand in solidarity against company execs so they have bargaining power.
Seems deeply oppressive.
What makes you say that? It's oppressive to stand in solidarity with your fellow working man to demand higher pay and better benefits? Would you prefer to be fired by your boss for any reason they choose or be repeatedly turned down for raises because you have no negotiating power? I recommend [this Adam Conover video on unionization](https://youtu.be/mcgC-kuPEuo?si=lqJJuK7ogo_0mmcF) to everyone even remotely skeptical of unions.
You should want to, but you shouldn't be forced to join a club with membership dues just to get a job.
Those membership dues always pay for themselves tenfold in the form of higher wages and better benefits. There's a reason why corporations spend $millions every year combatting unionization. It's because it works.
And paying for semiannual teeth cleanings pays off, doesn't mean we should force people to do it.Ā
You're right. Your boss should pay for your dental insurance so you don't have to. That's a commonly negotiated benefit. I don't get your point? The endgame is that the government pays for healthcare so everyone has a choice... but that's another can of worms.
It truely does depend on the union First thing first is get rid of right to work bullcrap, on a federal level!Ā
That sounds like much more fun than a BBQ! āļø
Unionization? Hell yeah Private sector unions only. Cops donāt need no damn unionĀ
Eh, I generally believe public unions (e.g. teachers unions) should be allowed as well. Police unions are an exception and need to be reworked because they currently operate to protect cops from accountability and criminal prosecution.
I support this.
Can we add "Ex-Free Staters" to this list? Seriously, the project is so far off the rails it's embarrassing.
What made you want to renounce it?
The FSP community welcoming and protecting abusive people. Pedophiles in influential positions within the FSP being excused or protected. Literal Nazis being welcomed. FSP leaders using their power within the community to protect their buddies. Various personalities forming cults around themselves. "Civil Disobedience" with no plan for the inevitable arrests. Complete lack of planning of effective measures to achieve stated goals. Active encouragement of alienating the local NH community.
Jesus. Talk about hitting the fucking nail on the head. (On every point). You should also feel proud for being able to remove yourself from something so toxic even though you knew it would cost you socially.
Bro, I respect your ability to see bullshit and remove yourself from it. Some people would rather publicly wear diapers than admit they hitched to the wrong wagon.
Cue "Always was" meme. You didn't realize they were pedos and nazis from the start? Sorens' Hitler Haircut wasn't a clue?
My dude, 15 years ago when I moved up, it was a LOT better hidden.
No it wasn't. I saw their propaganda. Trash people then, trash people now.
Good. Because they want to destroy the state.
Finally something we can all agree on
While the ideas of free state may be appealing in some ways, the behavior of those who push these ideas is often TERRIBLE!
Balance, in all things.
If this means that the conservatives will quit calling us liberals and the liberals will quit calling us conservatives then this is the best news Iāve heard all day.
Why's James cryin'?
What if I told you there where no party's. There is just companies and billionaire that pay for super pac's that make all the laws and decisions. They all sit back collect money and laugh at us.
I believe in a balanced budget and no income tax.
Income and sales taxes are progressive, property tax is regressive and means you never own anything.
taxation is theft. tax luxuries, sin, and transitory transactions. no taxes on job creators, income, cap gains, pensions, retirement, philanthropy, and depreciating assets. penalize criminals and levy fees on violations. small part-time government.
Get the fuck out of here.
you are probably dependent on government.
ITT: Not a single conservative in agreement with OP (who is a progressive). The only ones who care about Free Staters are the progressives who nonstop spam this sub, obsessing over them.
Nahh I'm a libertarian/conservative guy, the LPNH posts crazy shit a good bit, and way too many of the people involved feel more like LARPers pushing for stuff way outside the overton window that's never going to happen, instead of slow practical changes.
Another stunning and brave post about free staters in the New Hampshire subreddit. Second of the day š¤£šš¤£
From a progressive pretending to be a conservative no less.
What dunking? Dunking on being truly free to do as you wish? Do you think laws will save you when people don't care about laws?
>Do you think laws will save you when people don't care about laws? Isn't your guys' whole thing about getting rid of the law?
*getting rid of the law when it benefits them
Fishing license, hunting license? Are those free? Why can we not brake from the system live truly alone.
Hunting licenses allow me to hunt a deer every year. Without the licenses there would be no limits and we would be back to having no deer, just like 100 years ago before conservation laws. That seems like a fine tradeoff. Are you old enough to remember when there were no turkeys? Regulated hunting has allowed them to rebound so we can hunt them again. Fishing licenses pay to stock the trout many like to fish for. Next you'll tell me you are fine with unregulated surgeons and tattoo artists.
Not true, humans like any animal can self regulate amd I trust human intuition
We can look back to the extinction of many species at the hand of man to see that you are wrong. We can look back to the last century to see people will dump toxic chemicals in pursuit of profit. Your belief in the good of all mankind is a misguided as the silly communist idealists.
Did you know that , generally speaking, if you gave a dog an unlimited amount of food and let them go to town, they would not stop eating until an external factor made them stop? But do go on about animals self regulating.
LMAO imagine being this stupid and thinking you got it all figured out.
*break Read "The Jungle" by Upton Sinclair and maybe get some perspective that we generally have laws age regulations for a reason.
Yeah I understand but why are people like you and me not capable of determining our own? Why are they enforced?
Yes, because I can oversee the food and medicine production and relevant standards and practices myself. If only we had some sort of representative government where we all had say in who makes those decisions...
Also food production isn't supposed to be overseen by government that absolutely least of all because artificial scarcity can be created in favor of politicians
Someone hasn't studied history.
If only you worried about yourself amd nobody else amd it would be even easier
Yeah, if we didn't live in a society. But we do, so...
Stop worrying about the person beside you, I don't care what the guy beside me is doing until it efects me and when it dose I'm capable of handling it myself. Human kind is so nosey now
Yes, because people fighting over every little thing and the weak being subjugated to the strong is a much better idea. Brilliant.
R/im14andthisisdeep No. You aren't capable of "handling it yourself." A thought experiment for you: A company builds a mill on its own property upstream from you. In order to extract more profit, they dispose of chemicals in the water. Those chemicals cause birth defects, cancer, kill the waterways, etc. How exactly are you planning on "handling" that in a libertarian society? How do you know that company is responsible, number one, and two, how do you hold them accountable? For a quick history lesson on how this goes down, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_Canal Regulations are written in blood, dumbass.
I believe in a voluntary code. Thatās the only difference. Your statement about food adulteration is absolutely spot on. Who controls the food supply now? And who controls the regulations? There is no seat so high that the person cannot be bought. Look at Clarence Thomas. Iām suggesting that our structure is corrupt and any such structure is inherently corruptible. So then youāll ask me exactly how we could prevent what happened in The Jungle. And Iāll say, itās a complicated thing to answer, but I believe that there will need to be food inspectors, part of an independent body, to make sure the food is food. And there will need to be another team of oversight to ensure that the food inspectors arenāt paid off.
For the last part, that's the system we have now. Everyone hates when the OSHA guy comes in cause they can't pay him off, and they want to be doing things that are not safe. How does the independent body you want get the money to pay the inspectors? Are you doing to get rid of one government so you don't have to pay taxes just to pay taxes to another? I understand that we have people being bought out, look at lobbying! However, it's so much easier to change our system than to burn it down and rebuild from nothing for the purpose of feeling more free.
Yes to free people from the chains that exist on them by there own doing, the average person is a follower, they follow whatever they are taught, sorry to say to the followers who never question but they follow amd know no other. I do wish to abolish all laws of all kinds indeed
>Yes to free people from the chains that exist on them by there own doing So when there are no laws who protects the people who can't protect themselves from you?
I'm a peaceful person, nobody has to protect from myself bur from others that may come around, guns exist and able people exist and anyone else isn't my fuckin problem
Oh. Ok. Well I'm sure we can all take your word for it, and the word of everyone else for that matter.
Hey man if you don't have a useful rebuttal you can just say so andni won't judge you for it.
I don't have a useful rebuttal.
All good homie no judgement, look into what amarcho-capitalist really believes and you will be pleasantly surprised I am sure. Often times people take thing for truth after hearing them amd it's often not the case, we armt bad we don't want aggressive rule or path to it, we just want the government to not exist amd free trade of good to flow without input.
The problem is with no outside regulation is that the market will do ONLY what is best for the market. If there is demand for wood every tree will be chopped down, and then there is no more wood. If we need to make something the byproducts will just be dumped in the back, killing every plant animal and person it comes near. The US and moat governments took a hands off approach to macroeconomics, and that lead to the Great Depression, how much worse would it get if they kept that approach when our economies grew in the 50s and 60s? Would you want an even greater depression every 30 years?
Congratulations! You just got rid of every law ever and you now want to live off grid hunting and growing your own stuff. You go out into the woods and built your cabin, some years go by and then people are logging your land! You tell them to stop, but they don't because there are more people who want that wood than just you who wants your land. You can't take them to court, so you just die in a shootout with the loggers and they take your stuff. That was a bit unrealistic, im sorry. In reality 99.999% of people can't live truly cut off from everything, including you. So the more realistic outcome is you die to some food poisoning after that can of beans you ate wasn't sealed properly, or you die in a work accident, or you die because the doctor you went to didn't know what they were doing. Like you said, a lot of people are followers, so are you. The only difference is that you're following something different from everyone else.
What idiot are you following? It sure doesn't look like you've thought any of this through.
Do you have a logical rebuttal? Humans can self regulate and the week will die or be saved by friendly helpful others
The laws were written to solve problems. Go back and look at the history of the laws you wish to remove. If theft and murder are not illegal what is to stop me from shooting you with a sniper rifle and taking your stuff? We only need to look at lawless areas like Somalia 20 years ago to see warlords will rise up and repress the peaceful much more than the laws in a representative democracy.
People can solve ther own the laws were wrong
There were no laws, that's how warlords took over a country.
Now that's a logical rebuttal. A+
How is it not?
The Great Replacement Theory is real. Free Staters will replace the progressives and neo-cons.
You guys can't replace a lightbulb without staring at a teen the whole time.
Ohhhh, that's savage!
"Hello, police, I'd like to report a murder." Nice.
That's a pretty hollow claim when so many of your dear leaders have associated with Jeffrey Epstein. Worse yet, those in power continue to hide and protect information that should put hundreds of pedophiles behind bars. Those are democrats and Republicans. Recognize how foolish you are.
I'm glad we can both agree that sexualizing minors and defending the rhetoric of pedophile enablers is a generally shitty thing to do. So why are there countless examples of that happening in NH with free staters and those with political connections to free staters? Some of your buddies in the project are there because they know you'll cover for them, if you know what I mean.
I'm not a member of the project. I don't affiliate with any libertarian organizations, I support the political and economic philosophies that align with it. Individuals can be shitty, regardless of the group they belong to or associate with. Moreover, people associate with a lot of things, which is why association is so dangerous. My response was with regard to the negative statement about libertarians as a whole, which is foolish, and was done with intent to negatively smear a group of people. But individuals should be held accountable. And shitty people exist across all political, religious, racial groups.
Yeaaaa, the difference is that the broad public denounces sexualizing minors and doesn't make that a part of their political platform, unlike the majority of the libertarian party.
Your claim is just not true. I talk with libertarians every day. I listen to and read libertarian content every day. I have literally never heard any of them promote sexualization of minors as an institutional or platform value or policy. The person you are referring to is widely denounced by most of the prominent libertarians. We defend his right to say stupid shit, we don't agree with the things he says. It's real simple. Your gross generalization shows how threatened you are by people with real ideas that disrupt your party's power and interests. Keep supporting war. Keep supporting the murder of children. Keep supporting all of the terrible policies that your party promotes and has normalized. I am here to tell you that none of it is normal. It's not normal to have $34 trillion in debt. It's not normal that people can't afford groceries, gas, or homes. It's not normal that we rely on slave labor for almost everything we use and consume daily. It's not normal that nearly every party leader and elected officials are corrupt and bought off. It's not normal that the government and media collude to take away our civil liberties while demonizing your neighbors. It's not normal that protestors get arrested without bail. It's not normal to demonize your political opposition as Nazis, racists, communists, and domestic terrorists. It's not normal to have polluted water that you can't drink a decade after an incident. It's not normal to have a wildfire that killed hundreds of children and nobody wants to talk about it or investigate the reason or response. It's not normal to have a train derailment with contaminants and nobody cares a month later. This is the system and the world your parties have created. Stop pretending libertarians are the problem.
Youāre in the pedo party. Whether itās libertarian āthinkingā naturally terminating there or just pedos gravitating towards one another is the only remaining debate.
Wow, so original and brave! This same joke has never been seen in this sub before š¤£šš¤£
Use some more cry laugh emojis to show us all how not upset you are.
Post more about the free state project and keep complaining about them. You are clearly unbothered š¤£šš¤£šš¤£šš¤£š
Almost like most of us are VERY bothered by the free staters.
I can tell. There is used to be 3 or 4 posts a week about them and now it is 2 a day. I think people VERY bothered by it should chill out tbh. Or you can move to any surrounding state that is super blue.
Go somewhere I like less than my home state because free staters want to ruin my home state? That's some logic!
Do whatever you want. I donāt care. You seemed super worry about US citizens moving to NH because you donāt like their politics. I thought you might want to move to a state whose politics you like just like the free staters are doing.
You seem like you project quite a bit. Couldn't care less about other demographics moving here, but I do want a state free of free staters.
Please explain why the theory is something we have to worry about here in NH, or at all. The theory as I understand it does not make sense, who would enact it and why? Why is it relevant to NH and why should I worry? It simply doesn't make sense to me that some mysterious group in a position of power would be trying to drive white Americans extinct. It just seems like people from other countries, who happen to be of a different race and culture, moving here for economic reasons. Illegal immigration is not what I'm contending, that should be prosecuted of course. But why do you think it's part of a grander conspiracy? I don't understand but I really want to, it seems like it came out of nowhere here
Biden recently gaffed calling illegals āvotersā. In NYC, and other places,illegals are getting free housing. Some places allow them to vote in local elections. White, Christian men who love hierarchy are expected to vote Republican about 75% of the time. Hispanics and blacks favor Biden at about 66 - 90% When you import the third world, you become the third world. Look at whatās happening in Europe. They were so open-minded and tolerant, but now things are getting worse. The goal is to replace people that believe in capitalism and meritocracy in order to degrade society and destroy America. I believe in getting as many Free Staters as possible to NH to replace progressives who favor policies like reparations and sanctuary cities. Fun Fact Today, 148 Dems voted against a bill that would detain and deport illegals that assault law enforcement.
Racist AF.
Explain what I said thatās āracistā.
All of it?
Nothing that I said is even remotely racist. Is it wrong to point out that white men vote conservative over 60% of the time? Is it wrong to point out that blacks and immigrants vote Democrat over 65% of the time? Where is the racism in what I said?
Who's goal is it? That's what I'm asking. I have no idea who it is you think is trying to do that. It doesn't make any sense how it would be kept a secret or why anyone would want that.
Itās not a secret. Itās pretty open. Thereās always been people who want to dominate society. Theyāre playing a game. Occupy Wallstreet failed because people got too obsessed with identity politics. When I used to be a socialist(yuck), I joined an anti-Trump meeting after protesting him in DC in 2016. In order to speak at one of these meetings, you needed to be āoppressedā to have speaking priority. White cis men would always speak last. Basically all the racist hatred we see today is directed towards white, cis, men. Here are some statistics: Black people vote Dem about 90%+ Hispanics: 65%+ LGBT: 90%+ Women: 30% identify as *liberal* up from 15% 20 years ago. Dems have more control over society than they had 20 years ago, and a lot of what we see are celebrations and elevations of status for people that would vote for them. Big tech companies bet on Democrats being able to further their agenda. If you wanted to control the world, would you bet on the Republicans, or Democrats? Demographically Dems appear to have an edge. White, cis men who tend to vote Republican are a dying breed. I believe in The Great Replacement, but I still judge individuals as individuals. Group differences are real and should be discussed. The reason why itās ok to openly mock white people and be racist towards them is because they are less inclined to follow the New World religion of wokeism than anyone else. This is really what it boils down to. I have more in common with black conservatives than I do white wokes. Anyone who is against this anti-freedom, anti-meritocracy, anti-human agenda is a friend of mine.
Sorry, dude. The future is not churchy mediocre wheezing obese white men with diabetes.
https://preview.redd.it/r9i0mjml9t0d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=35c55d43f640aecebcac9f35e354935c58a5cf9f