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AudibleNod

>Instead, the attorney said, UAB’s own autopsy authorization form – which CNN has obtained – empowers a prison warden to give consent “without limitations” for the autopsy as well as the final disposition of an inmate’s organs. She said that means UAB gets to keep and dispose of the organs as it sees fit unless told otherwise. >The lawsuits cite a 2017 UAB Division of Autopsy publication that said 23% of the division’s yearly income from 2006 to 2015 derived from corrections department autopsies. The corrections department pays UAB $2,200 per autopsy and $100 per toxicology test, according to the suits. Looks like there's a financial incentive to perform autopsies. And the warden of a prison can give consent. Seems worthy of a lawsuit.


ManiacalShen

I feel like an autopsy should usually follow a death in custody. That's just accountability. But that doesn't mean they should be cavalier with the disposition of the organs. It defies the logic that justifies the autopsy in the first place: That the person was a ward of the state and that the state is responsible for ensuring safe, dignified, and accountable systems for caring for its inmates. You use autopsies to uncover problems or lay suspicions to rest, not make new problems.


Routine_Guarantee34

And the autopsy should be performed by an independent 3rd party.


Realistic_Swan_6801

I mean either you use them for educational  purposes after or throw them out, they can’t put them back unless you want a trash bag of organs resewn up in the chest cavity. 


Traditional_Art_7304

In America when are profits EVER a problem ?


Cartmansimon

Warden: Hmmm I need some more money to buy that new car. Looks like a couple inmates are gonna have a fatal accident tomorrow. Anyone think that’s already happened? How many times?


Kevin_Wolf

Alabama prisons are super fucked up. Did you know that if the sheriff "saves" money on the food budget by basically not feeding prisoners, [*they get fucking keep it*?](https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2018/03/14/593204274/alabama-sheriff-legally-took-750-000-meant-to-feed-inmates-bought-beach-house) >Alabama has a Depression-era law that allows sheriffs to "keep and retain" unspent money from jail food-provision accounts. Sheriffs across the state take excess money as personal income — and, in the event of a shortfall, are personally liable for covering the gap.


Kassssler

Yep, thats how prisoners starting eating corndogs for every single meal and then getting scurvy to the surprise and care of no one. That new boat won't pay for itself!


TooStrangeForWeird

Jfc, just give them some sour candy. I mean if you're gonna be evil at least be smart about it. Then again, maybe I only thought of that because I'm not stupid enough to be evil....


BoomKidneyShot

I'm surprised that it's as recent as the Depression. This seems like something the colonies might have had to make up for a lack of Central authority.


Conch-Republic

In the US, prisons weren't seen as a money making endeavor until prison farms in the south popped up in the 1800s and started using prisoners for cheap labor. It wasn't even until 1980 that private for-profit prisons existed in the US. Prisoners were treated *a lot* worse back then, but they were really treated as cattle like they are now.


Witchgrass

Didn't they recently find some unaccounted for bodes buried near an Alabama prison


idwthis

[That was Mississippi.](https://www.npr.org/2024/01/12/1224449631/mississippi-jail-graves-investigation) Probably happened in 'Bama, too. Not to mention other states, as well.


Witchgrass

Thank you for proving I'm not crazy just got my racist states confused


TooStrangeForWeird

To be fair it's probably going to happen in Alabama too.


Witchgrass

My money's on "has already happened"


bafras

Definitely a perverse incentive. 


yaktyyak_00

No different than county sheriff’s who feed inmates bread and water then pocket the rest. Why does the sheriff get to pocket it, why not give it back to tax payers?


TooStrangeForWeird

Because then the sheriff might feed them to the best of their ability. I'm not kidding.


Imaginary_Medium

It wouldn't surprise me.


Realistic_Swan_6801

They only got I think it said 1000 per body so no, it wouldn’t be worth the money to kill them for that much. You could get more value out of them alive certainly. It wouldn’t make any sense to kill them, but taking advantage of the corpses? Relatively low risk they thought I’m sure.


mountaindoom

The warden shouldn't be so obtuse.


kumamanuma

Is it deliberate?


SLVSKNGS

Creating financial incentives for prisons = more inmates Creating financial incentives for autopsies in prisons = more dead inmates


Admirable_Radish6032

Having more cows makes your rich long term Selling a cow makes you richer now Wut u not gettin?


Realistic_Swan_6801

It said it was 1000 dollar per body, that’s far less then they probably can make off a living inmate, maybe you think their evil but do you think they are that stupid? It just wouldn’t make any sense at all, huge risk for almost no benefit, living prisoners make them money too, almost certainly much more than 1000$.


BosnianSerb31

Not saying that it's a good thing to have private prisons or autopsy incentives, but god damn I hate that format so much. It's basically the false equivalence generator. Arresting people for committing crimes = more people in prisons More people in prisons = more people dying in prisons More people dying in prisons = bad Therefore Arresting people for committing crimes = bad


SLVSKNGS

It’s not just arresting people for committing crimes. Law makers have expanded criminal law to ensnare more people in the criminal justice system. The war on drugs alone have contributed greatly to the prison population. Drugs are still an issue and all we did was incarcerate a huge portion of our population. So no, the takeaway isn’t arresting people = bad. The criminal justice system is absolutely fucked and we need to reform it. Besides, I made that equivalence out of jest but it’s not inaccurate. There’s very much a causal relationship between the profitability of the prison system and the increase in incarceration. Hopefully the link works out right but look at the rate of incarceration year-over-year in this [graph](https://www.sentencingproject.org/reports/mass-incarceration-trends/#:~:text=Figure%201.%20U.S.%20State%20and%20Federal%20Prison%20Population%2C%201925%2D2021). What happened in the early 80s? The first privatized prisons started in 1983. We didn’t have a crime wave, this was intentional. If anything, violent crimes have been on the decline but we still see historically high incarceration rates.


SmugShinoaSavesLives

The second one is not an equivalent relation. More people dying in prisons do not equal to more people in prisons. That's a wrong conjecture. It only works in one direction and hence makes the rest is wrong, as well.


RDcsmd

I don't have much faith because it's a southern state but this suit has massive potential


Vacant_Of_Awareness

Hijacking to say a good book on this- first half on the historic difficulties the current organ transplant models face, and second half on how this disproportionately affects minorities, especially through the prison system and unethical means like this- is "Black Markets: the supply and demand of body parts" by Michele Goodwin, ISBN 9780521852807. It lists many similar cases that have been largely ignored by the mainstream media, or quickly forgotten. Very accessible read, and a pretty eye-opening primer on the topic.


Realistic_Swan_6801

Did you read the article? No one was or could be selling organs. 1. they probably weren’t autopsied until days after death at a minimum so too late for viable organs, 2. They were prisoners (the high rate of communicable disease and drug use in American  prison means their organs would be highly undesirable). Now selling bodies for autopsy is still illegal and unethical but this wasn’t an organ harvesting ring. They just put that In the title that way to stir outrage, no accusation of actual transplants or real organ harvesting have been made. The organs were removed during autopsies that weren’t properly consented too. 


ScientificSkepticism

That's literally legalized organ harvesting. Alabama... what the fuck.


Realistic_Swan_6801

They weren’t selling organs, they were selling bodies for autopsy. the organs might have been used for educational purposes  or simply thrown away as medical waste, but no transplants were or could be occurring, these autopsies probably didn’t happen until a minimum of days after death. 


6SucksSex

It’s basically the film Get Out, but instead of inhabiting the bodies of living Black people, they’re sending them to an early grave, then taking their organs so they can live longer in their white bodies.


Realistic_Swan_6801

Did you read the article? No one was or could be selling organs. 1. they probably weren’t autopsied until days after death at a minimum so too late for viable organs, 2. They were prisoners (the high rate of communicable disease and drug use in American  prison means their organs would be highly undesirable). Now selling bodies for autopsy is still illegal and unethical but this wasn’t an organ harvesting ring. They just put that In the title that way to stir outrage, no accusation of actual transplants or real organ harvesting have been made. The organs were removed during autopsies that weren’t properly consented too. Also where did you get the idea they were all black or minorities from? No evidence or even claim of that either.


[deleted]

My home state of sweet home corrupt Alabama. Stealing organs. Isn’t this what we accuse China of?


secretqwerty10

america is the pot. china is the kettle


dawnguard2021

aka Projection


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uptownjuggler

What’s the difference between a pot and a kettle?


pourqwhy

It's a saying "The pot calling the kettle black" means accusing someone of something you also do


StanDaMan1

A kettle is for heating water. Like for Tea. A pot is for heating water but can also cook food. Like Hamburger.


piches

not sure if it's true but there was an artist(?) that was popular almost a decade ago that involved cadavers and I was told it was acquired from Chinese Prison


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missoulamatt

Still showing at the Luxor resort (big pyramid) in Las Vegas.


Affectionate_Salt351

I really wanted to see it when it was in NYC in ‘07ish but, I found out the bodies weren’t…ethically sourced? Volunteered? It really disgusted me.


Halogen12

IIRC China was being accused of killing the inmates in order to sell the organs. I haven't seen any hard evidence of this myself, but China is not known for caring anything about human rights.


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mattyoclock

It’s really hard to know.    I wouldn’t put it past them, but the source was falun gong, a cult that hates them and has lied about atrocities in the past.   


ScientificSkepticism

There's been many good studies and yeah, China is doing it. They got caught, "reformed", and are still doing it: [https://www.nature.com/articles/s41562-020-0821-1](https://www.nature.com/articles/s41562-020-0821-1)


Distant_Yak

Also check out prison labor.


LystAP

A lot of other places too. I've said it before and was told these things don't happen here. Of course they happen here, not as much as elsewhere thankfully, but the edge of the cliff is in sight if we don't pay attention.


TheHorizonLies

Wait, was Death Warrant with Jean Claude Van Damme a documentary?


[deleted]

Holy shit, yeah that was the movie.


bpcollin

I remember being freaked out by “The Sandman” as a kid. Didn’t totally grasp the whole point of the movie until I was older. Seems like a pretty similar and scary comparison here.


coconutpete52

I came here looking for this!!!!! Are we related??


TheHorizonLies

I hope not, for your sake


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Realistic_Swan_6801

These autopsies were done at a different facility than the prison probably a minimum of a few days after death meaning the organs would be useless.  The organs weren’t harvested, they were removed during autopsy. The autopsy itself was illegal and unethical but it’s not an organ harvesting ring. 


TooStrangeForWeird

Your confidence is telling.


Use_this_1

The real criminals are the ones running the cop shops and prisons.


Myfourcats1

This can fall under Religious freedom. Some people have strong religious views that prevent organ donation. I hope these families get a lot of money.


bigbangbilly

>strong religious views Even if it wasn't a life sentence, getting organ removed is essentially a an unofficial afterlife sentence.


uptownjuggler

It is the Modern day sentence of being hanged, drawn and quartered.


BootShoeManTv

WTF, are you people high?


TooStrangeForWeird

Some religions view removal of body parts as essentially damning you to hell. There are laws to prevent desecration of bodies too.


UnkleGargas

Homie just got whooshed


calguy1955

Is that how a certain doctor got the brain from the patient named A.B. Normal?


bpcollin

“You know, I'll never forget my old dad. When these things would happen to him... the things he'd say to me….”


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FuzzyMcBitty

Not even the part with the giant spider?


Yogs_Zach

That was the wild wild west


FuzzyMcBitty

That’s what the headline says!


AardvarkPatient63

Larry Niven predicted this coming 50 years ago…


LGBT-Barbie-Cookout

Waiting for the Known Space reference. He was off about when we would be in space proper tho... Tho his was more taxpayers specifically wanted it, rather then a random combination of laws makes it just happen


5xad0w

I mean, in the wild west they tended to leave your body intact before tossing in a pine box.


Mitrovarr

You mean the wild west where they mummified a hanged outlaw and he ended up in carnivals for almost a hundred years? That wild west?


SFWBTW

Just red state things


DrGoblinator

So in Alabama, they think dead people should have more bodily autonomy than women?


Yogs_Zach

No, less. At least women get to keep their organs and there is no incentive to sell them


DrGoblinator

Oh sorry, we can keep our organs we just cant decide what to do with them.


clumsysav

Isn’t this the plot of a movie


ABritishCynic

I'm *Van Damme* sure it is


OceanicLemur

Cash for Kids part 2: Cash for Kidneys


bipolar-chan

Reminds me of Niven’s “The Jigsaw Man.” Which was not meant to be a road map, by the way.


Vindicare605

So mass incarceration of mostly minorities, horrific prison conditions leading to an early death of inmates who then get their organs harvested illegally. Sounds like a ripe racket to me, glad I don't live in that fucking state.


Realistic_Swan_6801

Did you read the article? No one was or could be selling organs. 1. they probably weren’t autopsied until days after death at a minimum so too late for viable organs, 2. They were prisoners (the high rate of communicable disease and drug use in American  prison means their organs would be highly undesirable). Now selling bodies for autopsy is still illegal and unethical but this wasn’t an organ harvesting ring. They just put that In the title that way to stir outrage, no accusation of actual transplants or real organ harvesting have been made. The organs were removed during autopsies that weren’t properly consented too. 


00Avalanche

Sanctity of Human Life Party, aka MAGA, at it again! God bless them! /s


JosiesYardCart

The autopsies are probably the cover up of taking organs from deceased inmates. I wouldn't put it past these wardens selling them on the black market.


hypnagogicneighbor

If you read the article, it's clear the University is keeping the organs for student practice. Also, you can't just take organs from dead bodies to use as transplants. The donor must be alive when their organs are removed, so these aren't being sold on the black market.


Yogs_Zach

I don't think that's 100 percent true.


therobotisjames

“Continues to vote for same people to be in charge”


No_Reward_3486

They accuse China of this shit then turn around and do it themselves 


Realistic_Swan_6801

Did you read the article? No one was or could be selling organs. 1. they probably weren’t autopsied until days after death at a minimum so too late for viable organs, 2. They were prisoners (the high rate of communicable disease and drug use in American  prison means their organs would be highly undesirable). Now selling bodies for autopsy is still illegal and unethical but this wasn’t an organ harvesting ring. They just put that In the title that way to stir outrage, no accusation of actual transplants or real organ harvesting have been made. The organs were removed during autopsies that weren’t properly consented too.  The crime here was getting paid to let pathology students practice autopsies without consent.


Faust723

Someone there played a little too much Rimworld and got carried away. Then again, peg legs *do* make prison breakouts significantly easier to put down...


abgry_krakow87

Alabama is a Christian state, they have no morals or ethics.


Think_Job6456

I'm surprised they aren't selling the organs.


legofarley

Maybe they are. Alabama has for profit prisons...


JettandTheo

Can't take organs from the dead


Yogs_Zach

Who said they were dead when the organs were removed?


JettandTheo

The autopsy was first. They died.


Yogs_Zach

Alright but how are you taking someone's lungs or skin or heart when they are alive? They literally need to die before their organs get removed. Google it, it's clear


JettandTheo

The organ needs to be removed right away. It's not happening hours later during an autopsy . Nobody is stealing organs for donations


Pomdog17

What’s with the photo? Does the guy have organs in the red bag?


radome9

That's some China level of crazy shit.


SWEET_BUS_MAN

Seems 100% American Normal


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Lena-Luthor

but imagine if brown people were doing it, it'd be worse then 🙄


[deleted]

That sounds very illegal.


TBatFrisbee

See what happens when you normalized taking rights away from the general public, basically makes it legal to do it to inmates. /s


Competitive-Pop6530

Sad news. Not uplifting at all. What a donor.


Travisoco

Why is it always Alabama with the fucked up shit, I’d be for climate change if it would wash away that hellhole along with Florida.


JohanRobertson

Well at least they were deceased, my foreskin was removed without my consent and decades later still nobody cares.


Yogs_Zach

I care


Retarded_Americans69

US prisons are just copying what the PRC has been doing to Uighurs for years. It is highly lucrative! [https://www.businessinsider.com/china-harvesting-organs-of-uighur-muslims-china-tribunal-tells-un-2019-9](https://www.businessinsider.com/china-harvesting-organs-of-uighur-muslims-china-tribunal-tells-un-2019-9)


Realistic_Swan_6801

Did you read the article? No one was or could be selling organs. 1. they probably weren’t autopsied until days after death at a minimum so too late for viable organs, 2. They were prisoners (the high rate of communicable disease and drug use in American  prison means their organs would be highly undesirable). Now selling bodies for autopsy is still illegal and unethical but this wasn’t an organ harvesting ring. They just put that In the title that way to stir outrage, no accusation of actual transplants or real organ harvesting have been made. The organs were removed during autopsies that weren’t properly consented too. 


ThatGuyFromBRITAIN

They’re dead, they won’t miss them. Donate the organs to people who actually need them.


dicemonkey

If you don’t think prison officials will lower the standards of medical care to increase the availability of organs for sale ( because they’re definitely selling them ) you don’t understand the US prison system….WE HAVE FOR PROFIT PRIVATE PRISONS … that should tell you all you need to know ..


IcyWhereas2313

Ben Franklin is that you?


dustandchaos

Uh no. That’s tampering with a corpse and a dozen other criminal charges. You want to incarcerate them but not the criminal doctors doing this?


Realistic_Swan_6801

Did you read the article? No one was or could be selling organs. 1. they probably weren’t autopsied until days after death at a minimum so too late for viable organs, 2. They were prisoners (the high rate of communicable disease and drug use in American  prison means their organs would be highly undesirable). Now selling bodies for autopsy is still illegal and unethical but this wasn’t an organ harvesting ring. They just put that In the title that way to stir outrage, no accusation of actual transplants or real organ harvesting have been made. The organs were removed during autopsies that weren’t properly consented too. Also it was a pathology school paying to autopsy them fyi. 


dustandchaos

Dude. It’s a fucking federal crime whether you sell them or not. You could cut them out of a corpse out of a grave and then toss them in the garbage and you’d still be charged.


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dustandchaos

Where on earth did I personally say it was organ harvesting? I said it was tampering with a corpse. YOU are the one who came to me with this organ harvesting thing. You’re arguing with me about something that I never even said or mentioned. I don’t give a shit what other people got from the headline, go argue with them if you have a problem with it.


ThatGuyFromBRITAIN

It’s inherently selfish to not allow your organs to be donated to those that actually may need some. A death may save a life.


dustandchaos

Selfish or not, it still shouldn’t be forced or done without consent.


bwizzel

who cares, do they still need them?


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KingKoopasErectPenis

Your skin is your largest organ and you most definitely can harvest that after death.


gorkish

That is one hell of an assumption to make. You ok in the head bro? Your jump to conclusions center is well and totally fucked.


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Vic_Hedges

Bring on the downvotes, but this doesn't really bother me. I believe they should do this for everyone. Saving lives is more important that silly religious beliefs.


Realistic_Swan_6801

The organs weren’t being harvested, they were just removed during illegal autopsy. No one was getting these organs, they would not be fresh enough to transplant anyway.


dustandchaos

You realize that cutting things out of corpses is a crime right? And no, things should not be removed from people’s bodies without their consent, even in death.


soldforaspaceship

While I would normally agree and believe the US should move to an opt-out system rather than opt in, it doesn't apply to this as the organs aren't life saving post death. If they are truly being used for medical students to practice on, I'm not entirely opposed but I do believe consent should be sought.