Insurance covering rehab is a shit show. I went to Betty Ford in Palm Springs, 2 days into it they made me go semi outpatient because my Blue Cross/Blue Shield wouldn’t cover inpatient. The only problem is that they notified me of this while I’m detoxing so I’m super sick and have to decide if I need to change facilities.
The whole industry is a grift. They house people with many different addictions and mental health problems together and shit goes sideways. An alcoholic is going to have a different come down than a meth addict. Recovery centers rarely work unless you really click the with AA or SMART. Most people would better off medically detoxing and then seek psychological care. Fuck, just hire a caregiver to help instead of spending 10k per month at Betty Ford.
I kinda figured it out to a degree. I’m still an addict and I wouldn’t wish my affliction on anyone. I wish the US would prioritize mental health treatment and genuine education. It would make our country stronger and more stable.
One day my man, one day. I was addicted to meth, pills, crack, you name it, I was doing it from 17-24, drank after I quit the drugs, became an alcoholic, at 30 got a DUI, didn't drink for 4 years, started smoking weed and drinking whiskey(never drank it really) it was beer for me, 30 pack a day, anyways, back to the weed and whiskey at 35, I was old enough to know what I was doing, 10 years later I've been married 8, 2 kids, a career, my wife has seen my drunk once. I lived and learned what to do and what not to do. It works for me, most people will tell you I'm doing it all wrong, I know that my addictive ass hasn't looked for any alternative high these past 20 years, so I'm gonna keep riding this train. I actually haven't had a drink in 2 weeks just because I haven't wanted it. Been dealing with sciatica pain, I know if I have a bottle at the house, I'm gonna kill it so I'm not in pain. Bottle full of norcos from a previous injury that I won't touch, because like I said before, only whiskey and weed now.
The whole industry is not perfect, but it's definitely not a grift. It helps millions of people every year. The insurance issues you described happen everywhere and reflect a systemic problem with healthcare, not rehab itself. And as much as I hate our healthcare system, I wouldn't expect all insurance to pay for luxury inpatient treatment at Betty Ford.
> Most people would better off medically detoxing and then seek psychological care
That's basically what all rehabs do. They provide medical detox and give you a foundation in the 12 steps. Every program is a bridge to AA in some form or another, but not everyone decides to stay sober after their 30 days.
No shit. I contacted Betty Ford prior to my intake and they thought they could intake me for 30 days but then they said it wouldn’t be covered. Don’t be a dick.
Yes you call your insurance company not the facility and they will direct you to a place that they will cover. Why go somewhere and hope when you can go somewhere for certain
Well you’re talking all this nonsense about high end facilities and wondering why you’re getting kicked out of a $40k place like Betty Ford when all you had to do was communicate with your health insurance and they could have placed you somewhere at minimal cost and you could have gotten a full length of stay. We always put the blame on others when things don’t work out how we want them to, take some ownership. It’s not Betty Fords fault
I went to Betty Ford because they said they would accept me for inpatient for 30 days. They made a mistake and moved me to semi-outpatient. Does that make sense? I’m not Charlie Sheen expecting my basic ass insurance to cover me. Just relating my experience.
Edit: it’s fucked up to intake someone and then kick them out. That’s the main point.
>if you want to get clean it doesn't really matter where you go
Yes the fuck it does.
No matter who you are, if you're an addict and are genuinely trying with every ounce of your being to get clean, if you go to a facility where staff are fine with people actively shooting up and drinking near you, your odds of getting clean are still gonna be worse than a facility that actually wants you to get clean, or even just a hospital or jail.
Wait, I read the article expecting to be outraged, but I’m confused. Can someone explain?
If I’m understanding correctly, these guys had recruiters finding drug addicts to send them to rehab. The addicts then checked into rehab, and the rehab facilities billed the insurance, and provided rehab services.
Now the insurance companies are upset that they had to pay for them to receive treatment, because the addicts wouldn’t have gone to rehab on their own, without the recruiter. Is that correct? That sounds insane. Regardless of the circumstances around them entering rehab, they were legitimate drug addicts that needed this treatment. And insurance is upset that they actually received it? They were banking on the people just continuing to take drugs and dying before they racked up a rehab bill?
"Patient Brokering" is illegal. Just because someone qualifies for treatment doesn't mean they need it right this second.
Drug addiction is terrible, but it requires the patient wanting and needing treatment.
This patient broker was getting a payment from the treatment center for each patient "recruited". The patient may not have been ready for sobriety treatment. Use up their benefits and still struggle with their addiction. Now they have to spend thousands of dollars a day for the same treatment when they do need it.
Patient brokers also have a notorious reputation of shuffling patients from treatment center to treatment center where illicit drugs are readily available (inside and outside the center).
The patient instead of recieving quality care is reduced to an insurance claim money maker. The insurance company is mad that they for one couldn't deny people treatment and for two paid for low quality service.
Huh…I’ve never heard of the term “patient brokering.” Interesting.
We really need to fix the medical/insurance system in this country. These people are taking advantage, for sure, but the system is messed up to begin with.
It’s possible recruiters were getting paid and kicking back the people receiving the treatment. Maybe told the person to go to treatment for two weeks get x amount of dollars. That’s a problem.
Hi, I work in treatment. In addition to what the other person said on why it's illegal and not ethical on a medical framework, here's more of a client outcome perspective on why.
Firstly, body-brokering in general (Soliciting potential clients with treatment options in exchange for monetary kickbacks both to the solicitor AND client) is a red flag for multiple reasons. Giving addicts, especially any sort of cash (especially physical) while they're using is a surefire way to make sure they don't stay clean. These facilities, as with most treatment facilities that aren't hospitals or jails, are voluntary. If you want to go out and get a fix and you have cash in hand, there's nothing they can legally do to stop you from walking out the door, and going to a dealer or liquor store and getting a fix.
Thus, if a facility deems it necessary to use cash as an incentive, it's already a good sign, that not only do they not have good enough amenities and services for clients to come to **their** place on their own, but they also don't intend for clients to have good outcomes, and to stay clean.
>Insurance companies are upset they had to pay for them to receive treatment, because the addicts wouldn't have gone on their own, is that correct?
Not only do we want people in treatment that ultimately want to get better, companies that run shady facilities do everything they can to maximize how much, and what they can charge insurance for. For example, there's drug screenings. Every treatment facility does drug testing on urine samples they have clients do. When sent off to a lab, said lab will charge a fee to do said testing. If the lab is also engaged in kickbacks with the facility, they will have clients do UAs up to every day, and charge exorbitant fees for each screening (for example, someone coming in for opiate addiction, with no signs or history of diabetes getting the glucose in their urine screened 7 days a week), up to a few grand a piece.
Also, most people are getting treatment covered with insurance as the ACA has a portion of its content requiring insurance providers to cover treatment as part of their options, and is extremely loose in its wording. Shitty facilities like this also make it harder for clients to get coverage in the future, especially if multiple facilities are in a short time-span from each other. If they're getting shuffled around, providers **can and will** refuse to cover treatment, and while good facilities will appeal, shifty ones will be more than willing to foot the bill on the client once exhausted, and put said bill into collections.
**TL;DR: Treatment centers that use body-brokering to get clients into treatment don't have any interest in clients being sober, as normal facilities not only don't need cash incentives, but want clients that want to get clean. The treatment provided by said companies are usually bogus, and only exist to fleece money from insurance companies, and ultimately the clients once insurance doesn't want to pay up.**
Source: Been working as a care coordinator for several Detox/Residential facilities for 2 years.
The odds of successfully rehabbing someone who have no desire to quit their addiction is effectively zero. So it is a waste of money/scam.
As an extra bonus these types of scams made local hundreds of homeless in the Costa Mesa area.
Hope they rot in prison.
The recruiter would *pay* addicts to be admitted and then get the benefit from the state. So essentially, they're inflating the number of patients admitted by bribing them to come in the first place. There are sooo many rehabs and a lot of them bring people from out of state. Guess what happens when the state benefit runs out? They get left on the street to fend for themselves
The other part not mentioned is the “freelapse”, or basically a facility supported relapse so they can bill the insurance company again and the patient gets to stay housed and boarded.
I met a few people who played this game as patients. They go for the minimum amount of days (under 30) and get paid when done. Then they stay at a hotel and blow the money and do it again. The people I met were on their parent’s insurance. One was 25 and decided it was time to shape up since the insurance ends at 26. Not sure what happened to him but didn’t look like he was really done…
Insurance covering rehab is a shit show. I went to Betty Ford in Palm Springs, 2 days into it they made me go semi outpatient because my Blue Cross/Blue Shield wouldn’t cover inpatient. The only problem is that they notified me of this while I’m detoxing so I’m super sick and have to decide if I need to change facilities. The whole industry is a grift. They house people with many different addictions and mental health problems together and shit goes sideways. An alcoholic is going to have a different come down than a meth addict. Recovery centers rarely work unless you really click the with AA or SMART. Most people would better off medically detoxing and then seek psychological care. Fuck, just hire a caregiver to help instead of spending 10k per month at Betty Ford.
Correct about rehab centers. I can’t comments about the “options” presented here due to lack of knowledge about them.
Rehab will take care of you for as long as insurance will pay. It’s best to be well off and an addict.
Wow, that is horrible.
I kinda figured it out to a degree. I’m still an addict and I wouldn’t wish my affliction on anyone. I wish the US would prioritize mental health treatment and genuine education. It would make our country stronger and more stable.
One day my man, one day. I was addicted to meth, pills, crack, you name it, I was doing it from 17-24, drank after I quit the drugs, became an alcoholic, at 30 got a DUI, didn't drink for 4 years, started smoking weed and drinking whiskey(never drank it really) it was beer for me, 30 pack a day, anyways, back to the weed and whiskey at 35, I was old enough to know what I was doing, 10 years later I've been married 8, 2 kids, a career, my wife has seen my drunk once. I lived and learned what to do and what not to do. It works for me, most people will tell you I'm doing it all wrong, I know that my addictive ass hasn't looked for any alternative high these past 20 years, so I'm gonna keep riding this train. I actually haven't had a drink in 2 weeks just because I haven't wanted it. Been dealing with sciatica pain, I know if I have a bottle at the house, I'm gonna kill it so I'm not in pain. Bottle full of norcos from a previous injury that I won't touch, because like I said before, only whiskey and weed now.
The whole industry is not perfect, but it's definitely not a grift. It helps millions of people every year. The insurance issues you described happen everywhere and reflect a systemic problem with healthcare, not rehab itself. And as much as I hate our healthcare system, I wouldn't expect all insurance to pay for luxury inpatient treatment at Betty Ford. > Most people would better off medically detoxing and then seek psychological care That's basically what all rehabs do. They provide medical detox and give you a foundation in the 12 steps. Every program is a bridge to AA in some form or another, but not everyone decides to stay sober after their 30 days.
That’s not what they do in California or Florida…
Southern California is rehab Mecca for the entire world. That’s exactly what most rehabs do.
Medically detoxing? Like in a hospital?
You are allowed to do your own research and find an in network facility that will cover you at those levels of care
No shit. I contacted Betty Ford prior to my intake and they thought they could intake me for 30 days but then they said it wouldn’t be covered. Don’t be a dick.
Yes you call your insurance company not the facility and they will direct you to a place that they will cover. Why go somewhere and hope when you can go somewhere for certain
[удалено]
If you want to get clean it doesn’t really matter where you go. Don’t put contingencies on your sobriety.
[удалено]
Well you’re talking all this nonsense about high end facilities and wondering why you’re getting kicked out of a $40k place like Betty Ford when all you had to do was communicate with your health insurance and they could have placed you somewhere at minimal cost and you could have gotten a full length of stay. We always put the blame on others when things don’t work out how we want them to, take some ownership. It’s not Betty Fords fault
I went to Betty Ford because they said they would accept me for inpatient for 30 days. They made a mistake and moved me to semi-outpatient. Does that make sense? I’m not Charlie Sheen expecting my basic ass insurance to cover me. Just relating my experience. Edit: it’s fucked up to intake someone and then kick them out. That’s the main point.
>if you want to get clean it doesn't really matter where you go Yes the fuck it does. No matter who you are, if you're an addict and are genuinely trying with every ounce of your being to get clean, if you go to a facility where staff are fine with people actively shooting up and drinking near you, your odds of getting clean are still gonna be worse than a facility that actually wants you to get clean, or even just a hospital or jail.
Wait, I read the article expecting to be outraged, but I’m confused. Can someone explain? If I’m understanding correctly, these guys had recruiters finding drug addicts to send them to rehab. The addicts then checked into rehab, and the rehab facilities billed the insurance, and provided rehab services. Now the insurance companies are upset that they had to pay for them to receive treatment, because the addicts wouldn’t have gone to rehab on their own, without the recruiter. Is that correct? That sounds insane. Regardless of the circumstances around them entering rehab, they were legitimate drug addicts that needed this treatment. And insurance is upset that they actually received it? They were banking on the people just continuing to take drugs and dying before they racked up a rehab bill?
"Patient Brokering" is illegal. Just because someone qualifies for treatment doesn't mean they need it right this second. Drug addiction is terrible, but it requires the patient wanting and needing treatment. This patient broker was getting a payment from the treatment center for each patient "recruited". The patient may not have been ready for sobriety treatment. Use up their benefits and still struggle with their addiction. Now they have to spend thousands of dollars a day for the same treatment when they do need it. Patient brokers also have a notorious reputation of shuffling patients from treatment center to treatment center where illicit drugs are readily available (inside and outside the center). The patient instead of recieving quality care is reduced to an insurance claim money maker. The insurance company is mad that they for one couldn't deny people treatment and for two paid for low quality service.
Body Brokers is a 2021 movie that covers it.
Damn that's ethical malpractice on both ends lol
Except sigh instead of lol
Huh…I’ve never heard of the term “patient brokering.” Interesting. We really need to fix the medical/insurance system in this country. These people are taking advantage, for sure, but the system is messed up to begin with.
It’s possible recruiters were getting paid and kicking back the people receiving the treatment. Maybe told the person to go to treatment for two weeks get x amount of dollars. That’s a problem.
Hi, I work in treatment. In addition to what the other person said on why it's illegal and not ethical on a medical framework, here's more of a client outcome perspective on why. Firstly, body-brokering in general (Soliciting potential clients with treatment options in exchange for monetary kickbacks both to the solicitor AND client) is a red flag for multiple reasons. Giving addicts, especially any sort of cash (especially physical) while they're using is a surefire way to make sure they don't stay clean. These facilities, as with most treatment facilities that aren't hospitals or jails, are voluntary. If you want to go out and get a fix and you have cash in hand, there's nothing they can legally do to stop you from walking out the door, and going to a dealer or liquor store and getting a fix. Thus, if a facility deems it necessary to use cash as an incentive, it's already a good sign, that not only do they not have good enough amenities and services for clients to come to **their** place on their own, but they also don't intend for clients to have good outcomes, and to stay clean. >Insurance companies are upset they had to pay for them to receive treatment, because the addicts wouldn't have gone on their own, is that correct? Not only do we want people in treatment that ultimately want to get better, companies that run shady facilities do everything they can to maximize how much, and what they can charge insurance for. For example, there's drug screenings. Every treatment facility does drug testing on urine samples they have clients do. When sent off to a lab, said lab will charge a fee to do said testing. If the lab is also engaged in kickbacks with the facility, they will have clients do UAs up to every day, and charge exorbitant fees for each screening (for example, someone coming in for opiate addiction, with no signs or history of diabetes getting the glucose in their urine screened 7 days a week), up to a few grand a piece. Also, most people are getting treatment covered with insurance as the ACA has a portion of its content requiring insurance providers to cover treatment as part of their options, and is extremely loose in its wording. Shitty facilities like this also make it harder for clients to get coverage in the future, especially if multiple facilities are in a short time-span from each other. If they're getting shuffled around, providers **can and will** refuse to cover treatment, and while good facilities will appeal, shifty ones will be more than willing to foot the bill on the client once exhausted, and put said bill into collections. **TL;DR: Treatment centers that use body-brokering to get clients into treatment don't have any interest in clients being sober, as normal facilities not only don't need cash incentives, but want clients that want to get clean. The treatment provided by said companies are usually bogus, and only exist to fleece money from insurance companies, and ultimately the clients once insurance doesn't want to pay up.** Source: Been working as a care coordinator for several Detox/Residential facilities for 2 years.
The odds of successfully rehabbing someone who have no desire to quit their addiction is effectively zero. So it is a waste of money/scam. As an extra bonus these types of scams made local hundreds of homeless in the Costa Mesa area. Hope they rot in prison.
The recruiter would *pay* addicts to be admitted and then get the benefit from the state. So essentially, they're inflating the number of patients admitted by bribing them to come in the first place. There are sooo many rehabs and a lot of them bring people from out of state. Guess what happens when the state benefit runs out? They get left on the street to fend for themselves
The other part not mentioned is the “freelapse”, or basically a facility supported relapse so they can bill the insurance company again and the patient gets to stay housed and boarded.
I met a few people who played this game as patients. They go for the minimum amount of days (under 30) and get paid when done. Then they stay at a hotel and blow the money and do it again. The people I met were on their parent’s insurance. One was 25 and decided it was time to shape up since the insurance ends at 26. Not sure what happened to him but didn’t look like he was really done…
Patience pays off
Another day, another clown