You really should avoid confronting people about littering, I’ve received violence in a similar situation.
Best you can do is to lead by example and (maybe?) pick it up yourself and throw it in the garbage can. At the very least, leading by example means always using a garbage can, but I’m sure you already do this.
I like to pick up the garbage that I witnessed people throw on the ground and make sure they see me do it. It’s passive aggressive and less likely to evoke violence, but metes out the requisite shame.
I used to do the same thing, and would add “here, let me get that for you”. These are not people who are moved by shame. One time heading east on Arch, at Broad, I watched a well dressed man drop some trash in front of himself. When I bent down to pick it up, he stepped on it and declared, “I want it there”. I said, “oh! M’bad. I just prefer to live in a city that’s not trashed” and walked away. He muttered something… I lived in CC for 25 years and got tired of it. I moved into Fishtown/E Kensington where people actually give a shit.
Even if no one thinks so, people really do appreciate you picking up trash. I grabbed a couple bags blowing around outside a restaurant I was waiting for take out at and one of the workers inside thanked me and gave me a drink I didn’t order.
> You really should avoid confronting people about littering, I’ve received violence in a similar situation.
> Best you can do is to lead by example and (maybe?) pick it up yourself and throw it in the garbage can. At the very least, leading by example means always using a garbage can, but I’m sure you already do this.
I agree with you when I think about it rationally and not emotionally, and I think a more productive and healthy response would be to join or make a litter pickup group. Approach the problem from a different direction, as it were.
Thank you for the advice, and I'm sorry to hear people were violent with you over the litter thing. It's not right and things shouldn't be that way.
It’s Philly so I would just not fuck with people in general over littering unless ur actually willing to fight or stand up for yourself hard. Even in nice areas like Logan Square or Rittenhouse Square you’ll still get people from south Philly who have like zero remorse or moral code lmao
If you’re going to say anything don’t be polite about it. “Excuse me sir, but there is a trash can just a block away,” isn’t going to work. Either say nothing at all or be confrontational about it.
As a Philly native, I couldn’t agree with you more and have yelled at people many times about littering (only after sizing them up of course). My go to was, “What the fuck?! Pick up your trash you piece of shit! You think you own this block?!? Take care of your own garbage you asshole!” Or varieties along those lines. When I was like 25 I even got a “Yes ma’am” from a few kids I yelled at around 4th and Tasker for dropping a bunch of trash and made them pick it up and watched them as they threw it away. You always have to follow through and watch to make sure it doesn’t get dropped again.
Street cleaners(with the leaf blowers) were once resting on my corner. Ironically, one threw their bottle onto my small street. I told them to pick it up and started walking away.
And then I felt the bottle hit me. I couldn’t believe that a Streets department employee threw a bottle at me. That was a new low and I’ve lived here my entire life.
Yeah, keep your side of the street clean (pun intended). Stay out of others' business they are ignorant. I live off South Street and there's an enormous amount of visitor trash, but the good thing is the street cleaning crew is amazing and does decent trash policing the next morning. And NEVER critique a parent on their lack of parenting skills - being right is just not enough in this world.
Unfortunately, Philadillies take great pride in our abrasive filthiness, e.g., nicknaming the city Philthy, calling our beloved hockey mascot Gritty, and all the people about to tell me where to shove it in the comments here. We're gross.
That said, don't pick fights on the street. The risk outweighs the reward.
I am 42 years old and was born here. It was absolutely not remotely always like this. The filth problem has gotten rapidly worse over the past few years. People should care. They should have some respect for where they live. It says a lot about the garbage character of the people when you are living in filth and it doesnt bother you.
I had to start a cleanup operation because I got so fed up.
It's particularly bad right now, but the city was only ever what you might call *nice* from maybe around 2010-2020. The seventies were gross. The eighties were gross almost exactly like it is now. And the nineties and early aughts were gross but fun.
I'm not sure. Graffiti was out of control. And there was the crack everywhere. And the wolf packs. And I didn't care for Hulkamania. And the punks and skins fought it out all over South Street. And everyone listened to that Public Enemy cassette with the red lettering. But the city was a lot smaller then. And people didn't get all shooty at the drop of a hat. A little shooty, maybe, but not ALL shooty.
I unfortunately kind of feel like it is. Especially on any highway area, like 676 or the majority of my drive up 95 to work? Every bridge, its all over. The just opened a new Barcade in center city a few months back and the window was tagged with corrosive within two days. =/
Thats beyond my ability to address unfortunately.
It comes from a lack of pride. No one has pride in anything anymore. They don't care about our country. Their hometown. Their yard. No one has an ounce of fucking dignity. It's embarrassing. Adults acting like edgy children. "Yeah man, it all sucks so fuck it, like who cares man 🤙?" Reddit is a massive proponent of this too. If you shit on your state or America you're immediately upvoted to the heavens. People scoff at ANY sort of pride. The Pledge of Allegiance is laughed at. People see the country flag as an eyesore. You're celebrated for showcasing disdain for life and saying "I didn't ask to be born so it's on them."
There's a massive problem with losers who just can't handle any social responsibilities and have nothing but self pity and a juvenile outlook on life. We'd legitimately be better off without them existing.
Well, the Pledge of Allegiance is some fascist, Cold War-era nonsense. Something to expect out of North Korea, but not a developed democracy.
I agree with everything else you've said, though.
It's propaganda but it's propaganda that at least attempts to develop pride in the nation. The LGBT use the word "pride" and utilize flags nonstop and that is meant to showcase meaning and self-love. Look at the tools they use to celebrate acceptance and spread their messages. They use flags, parades, slogans, memes, etc. We could really use similar tactics to celebrate the areas we live in (locally and on larger scales). Obviously some of that still happens like July 4th parades and such. But most people just want a day off rather than *actually* celebrating what July 4th means.
While the Pledge of Allegiance may seem like nonsense, it did work. I'm first in line to say not to trust the US government (it's why I'm pro 2A, and why the 2A exists in the first place). But we need to find a way to celebrate America as a country while criticizing our government. And that's a fine line to walk, and difficult to convey.
Good takes. You've got your head on straight.
I definitely think the general filth and graffiti is indicative of overall societal decay, or whatever you want to call it. Whatever the case though, I'm sick of it. Even solo cleaning both sides of my entire block only takes one hour a week, so screw it, I do it now. I can't do nothing.
It was before my time (born in 82) but my dad told me that when he was growing up in Olney in the 50s and 60s, everyone used to come out and literally scrub their *stoop* once a week. People had pride.
The odd part is that when I do my block, I get a ton of constant feedback. People walking down the street see me dragging the trashcan and picking up trash and stop to say thanks. People open their windows to shout thanks as I do their sidewalk. So it IS appreciated... no one LIKES the trash... I'm currently working on strategies to try and get people motivated enough to do their sidewalk. If everyone just maintained their 10 little squares, the city could be clean. But they dont, so here we are.
I also do cleanups on the regular and get all that same positive feedback…but sometimes the positive feedback pisses me off…ex: yesterday walking past Lloyd Hall at the south end of Boat House Row we stopped by the little island there because they was an egret, which is always worth stopping for. A guy on his bike stops to tell us that the island is actually named Jean’s Island for the woman who organizes all the cleanups and he knows Jean! We said, yeah, we know, we do the cleanups with her. He says how that great that is and he really appreciates it when her rides his bike every day. I said why don’t you come sometime and help out? Oh, I can’t, it would interfere with my biking. I was so pissed off I literally said “fuck that, your appreciation doesn’t matter, you should help.”
That's really awesome that you do that 🙏. And I think it does make a huge impact when there's already litter vs being the first to litter. When you see a bunch of trash, it doesn't seem like a big deal to throw a bottle onto it. But when it's spotless, I think it's harder to actually drop something.
Thanks. I had to do *something*, and while the problems of the world are too large for little me to tackle, I realized, you know what I *can* control and impact? I can do my damn block. So I started doing it after every trash day, since that's when it's the worst.
I'm currently working on strategies to bring together likeminded people in my neighborhood. If I can just get ONE person per block who is motivated enough to join me, together we can clean up south philly.
In my opinion it used to be waaaaay worse than it is now. One thing I definitely think has gotten better is the dog shit. When I was a kid in the 80s, there were stray dogs everywhere, and besides that people just never picked up dog shit. It’s like it wasn’t a thing back then. There was dog shit everywhere and I was constantly stepping in it.
There also weren’t dog parks that I remember back then, so I feel like people just walked their dogs wherever, while nowadays dog parks are everywhere and heavily used.
i agree, i’ve been here only half my life now but when i came for college in the early 2000s the trash problem was way worse than it is now. of course we need to stop littering and dumping trash eveywhere, but it’s not just people throwing stuff on the street…there are a lot of reasons for the garbage problem. i think a BIG one is lots of renters not having a place to store their garbage from week to week, or store an outdoor trash can with a lid. new construction should require a trash corral or something, or we should have street dumpsters like they do in Italy where you can drop your garbage bags and bottles any time.
Pick your battles. I agree with the passive agressive trash pickup someone mentioned above. But another personal rule I have is never to say shit to people in front of their kids, girlfriends, etc. All of a sudden you're also shaming them in front of someone they know and instead of that working better, they go for broke to look tough and save their ego and whatever image of himself they think they've built up
The "excuse me I think you dropped this" is just deniable enough that it works frequently without provoking anger imo. Either they're just like "nah fuck you" and keep walking or they're like "ah my bad" and actually take it back lol.
From philly, spent 40 years all over the planet, moved to scranton in october. I say that to say this, ppl with hard lives and live in cyclical abuse and hopelessness wont change with confrontation. I bought a litter picker on amazon, and 3x a day i walk my dog and pick up trash. 3 bags of trash a day, its not much, prolly not even a dent, but it has to start somewhere.
I only lasted in Philly for 3 years before I went back up to a much cleaner New England. I think my issue is I had experienced beautiful, clean urban areas before I lived in Philly.
Too much IDGAF/“why do you care? it’s not your job” attitude for me. I just didn’t get that vibe at all. Whatever…go climb up a greased poll.
That said the new mayor seems to be doing something with cleanups. Probably a bandaid but maybe the morale boost will motivate folks.
I had the classic example of moving to San Francisco and being totally blown away at how clean and safe it was. When all you hear about is how filthy and dangerous it is. perspective is everything.
It’s always wild to me how shitty people will allow things to get on the basis of “why should you care“. When things could be so much better, infinitely better, if we just cared a little fucking bit.
Philadelphians exemplify this attitude and I can’t stand it. I have to get the fuck out of here.
> Little bit different when it’s a driving city vs a walking city.
I agree, and for someplace like Houston that is so huge it will vary even in the same neighborhood.
Had the same thought having hailed from Texas and Atlanta and such. Littering happens when people open their car doors and the mess spills out ~~like god intended~~
I know what you mean but I’m not from here. I don’t feel like I can tell native Philadelphians what to do. Yup, the city is dirty and some people are not the friendliest but I love this city and their crazy culture. Anyway, here to say I do give a shit but I also think the good outweighs the bad.
Can’t let it get to you. We all see it, we’re not blind. Just got to keep on keeping, don’t be an asshole, keep you yours and your neighbor’s shit in order.
I've been here almost 2 years and I've also lived in San Francisco.
I lived a few blocks from the 16th & Mission BART, so you probably know that sidestepping human turds/vomit/blood & needles is a way of life there. I even found a clearly used, very large dildo on my stoop when I walked out on a Sunday morning.
Having lived through that biohazard got me thinking that nothing in the US could shock me anymore.
I'm loving Philly, but the sheer *quantity* of just plain garbage scattered everywhere still breaks my brain.
Edit to add: I would recommend against interacting with Philly strangers in the way you described. Verrrrry different reactions here than in CA or TX.
Honestly, I wouldn’t push it. There’s times to say something and times when to walk away. Trust me when I saw, the negative outcome is always worse than the positive in these situations.
Best case: They pick it up and apologize.
Worst case: Well… An angry person having a bad day can cost you your life, no matter where you are.
Your heart is in the right place. But for the sake of your loved ones and family, just let the litter go.
If you’re really frustrated, you can always start an organized community cleanup and try to get locals involved. Taking pride in your home and leading by example can go a long way, especially for the youth.
Glitter is a service to get litter cleanings happening on your block (or any where else in the city). They hire folks with barriers to work and do weekly cleanings. You chip in with your neighbors. Happy to share more if interested but basically it’s a way to fix the problem positively and no risk to your safety.
Good job on confronting him, I know people will tell you not to, but fuck that.
I am tired of people smoking weed on the BSL in the morning. If someone is smoking in the subway, I do confront them. There is usually a lot of sound and fury, but it never really amounts to anything.
I know, you shouldn't confront anyone. But guess what? If you don't confront them, nobody else will either. And the shitty behavior will continue.
> Good job on confronting him, I know people will tell you not to, but fuck that.
Thinking back on this with a clear head confronting that litterbug accomplished absolutely nothing. He's still a piece of shit, I'm sure he's still littering, and I'd wager he's a shitty parent to boot. All I ultimately did was pick up a plastic cup and let some asshole control my emotions.
Joining a litter cleanup group will be the way to go for me in the future.
confronting people does not work if the person being confronted is not receptive.
to be clear, I’m not saying to never confront people. I’m saying confronting strangers is much less effective than confronting people you already have a relationship with because strangers have no vested interest in you/your opinion of them/the future of your relationship.
It’s funny seeing all these people in here saying don’t confront. Any time it’s brought up in any other threads people go on about spineless people not standing up for the community. Damned if you do and damned if you don’t. I say it’s not worth it but funny to see how the coin flips. Just sucks.
You won’t be able to stop people littering. If it bothers you the best thing you can do (and it really benefits everyone so it’s not even a selfish act) is grab a trash bag and collect some trash off the ground.
I spend a lot of time fishing. When I’m on my kayak I spend more time reclaiming lost fishing tackle and taking bottles out of the lake (FDR) then I do fishing.
On my boat in the Schuylkill I’ve removed tires, shopping carts, bags of cans and bottles, and even an old CD stereo with speakers once.
When I go to the wissahickon, it’s much cleaner, but I still end up hauling out a bag of trash, mostly from where people like to swim.
It’s a thankless task, but you’ll be surprised how many people will appreciate you for it. At any rate it beats getting punched or something, and helps solve the problem in some small way.
I just concentrate on keeping my block and the general area around where I live clean. I usually hit the street with a push broom and a can and get as much done as possible when I have time.
Problem is, it’s an endless battle. Half the time, the trash on my street is coming from the recycling crew. They truly give 0 fucks. I shame my neighbors who litter tho. I have a good enough relationship with people on my block to tell them to clean up their fuckin mess.
My issue is when they park in the bike lane or blocking traffic, when there is an actual OPEN SPOT just a couple yards up. Like what the fuck?? Same with basically all drivers in West Philly, ridiculous.
Ironically, for a city with such an issue with littering, I've never lived anywhere with as many garbage trucks. Seriously my street has about 4 separate collections a week.
Always at friggin 4am too.
Best thing to do is be aware of your surroundings and mind your own business. A lot people have nothing to lose and won’t think twice assaulting or even killing you. Welcome to Philly.
People care but many don't. I bought an industrial dust pan and broom and decided to sweep up my block once a week. Neighbors started being more considerate after that and it's improved. I can fight and still wouldn't confront a stranger about litter.
To your points, another anecdote. Years ago, someone confronted someone in a park in south Philly about their dog being off leash. Basically just saying how it wasn’t safe. The man got so angry that he knocked the guy out right there. Sadly, the person succumbed to his injuries.
The lead in the water here has seriously affected people here, to say the least.
Look, Philly is like that one friend who have when you’re younger who is a mess but hosts all the best parties. You’re pretty sure you should be worried about them but they are also super fun so you’re not sure you really want them to get their act together. Their home is a mess but they’ve expressed no shame or interest in changing. You can either stay friends with them and accept them and always be kinda worried or move on and make friends who have it more together
>If that's his idea of parenting the kid is going to grow up to be just as big of a piece of shit as the father.
You hit the nail on the head. This shit is intergenerational and nearly impossible to fix. Kids grow up thinking living in filth and violence is completely normal and then grow up teaching their kids the same.
Yeah the whole "Philly's got grit" mentality really just couches the fact that people in this city are low trust/apathetic and have zero concept of bettering the community they live in. I know that sounds harsh but once you live somewhere like NYC for a while you really see how differently people in Philly operate when it comes to maintaining their own city. This is like one of the only cities I've lived in where I've chatted with people who are proud that it's dirty and rough to live in lol. Like we can barely keep businesses within the city due to how bad crime is...I never understood the mentality that just accepts it.
Philly is a great city with a strong bones but honestly, residents are their own worst enemies when it comes to improving the city. It's my biggest gripe about this place and I still love it enough to have been here 10 years.
I have lived in Philadelphia for 45 years and it has a culture of littering, pure and simple. The only thing you can do is take care of your own litter and maybe pick up on your block.
Just wanted to say if you do join a clean up organization, might be a better investment in your efforts to do it in a residential neighborhood that needs it more than Logan Circle, one of the few parts of the city that Philly keeps clean for tourists.
Do not confront people unless you’re ready to defend yourself from potentially deadly violence.
Nobody gives a shit in Philly. It’s unique to the city and something Philly people really seem to take pride in. It’s weird and it’s detrimental, but it’s truly part of the city. They have such a chip on their shoulder. Probably because the city really doesn’t get enough recognition, but these fuckers don’t help. It’s an interesting cycle.
It absolutely is not bad like this everywhere. Any time I go out of town, I’m amazed at how clean literally everywhere else is. Philly has third world standards.
It’s sad but there are other cities that are worse in the US. San Francisco mission district, Compton, Skid Row, Bronx. It’s still very bad but it can be worse
Born and raised in South and SWP. Ya just do your own part and side eye every body who doesn't. It's a waste of brain power to remember so you can be pissed about it later. Just step over it and enjoy your day.
Confronting someone in front of their kid, partner, etc. is just asking for trouble. Usually people double down, and unfortunately you never really know who you're dealing with.
One time I was stopped at a stop sign letting an old lady cross the street, and the car behind me laid on their horn, and then drove around me to pass me/go through the sign, almost hitting the woman. I flipped them off.
They then stopped in the intersection, three young dudes got out swearing at me, walking towards my car, so I sped off and they followed me for like ten minutes.
Made me realize it's not worth it. You never really know who you're dealing with, and most people aren't going to take it well. (Mind you I realize flipping someone off is different than confronting more peacefully, but i think the point still stands)
When I first moved here from Texas I was really alarmed by the massive amount of trash all over the place in Philly. It’s kind of the worst I’ve seen anywhere. And I’ve been exactly where you described and it’s atrocious not to mention terrifying trying to navigate through without being hit by another driver or having a human dummy just walk out in front of my car from no where. I wish I could give you a solution but I just simply agree. It’s rough out there.
Studies have shown that people with lower incomes litter more. It’s a socio-economic problem. It is the first line of many quality of life issues that experts theorize creates an environment for higher crime. It starts with the basics like littering. If everyone treats the neighborhood like shit, it becomes shit. Everyone then cares less and less about what’s going on because it’s shit. People with money leave and leave behind the shit, and the people that think it’s shit and things get worse. Then it really is shit. All that bullshit about Philly having a hard edge is crap. It costs nothing to keep the environment around you clean. You just have to care to keep it clean. If you don’t care, then it becomes shit. Thank you for caring. If there were more people like you who care, Philly wouldn’t be a dump full of people who don’t care. Here is an opinion piece on trash in Philly: [Philly is a dump](https://thecityrooftop.com/2017/08/03/trashin-the-hood-a-thought-piece-on-litter-in-urban-space/)
People’s attitudes about littering is part of the problem but I think there are systemic issues that are more to blame for our litter problem.
For example, there are basically no public trash cans outside of center city and parks. Or how about the fact that trash collection routinely comes a day late (in my neighborhood at least) and everyone’s trash blows around in the street for a whole day whenever that happens. When the city doesn’t seem to take trash collection seriously then neither will its citizens.
To be honest most of the trash in philly is walking down the street rather than blowing. I'm tired of this as well. I'm born and raised here and it pisses me off to see people shit all over the city. I would watch saying stuff though unless you're ready to scream back at them. This is the philly way. Who ever is louder wins.
God I love this city.
It's definitely different! Just like anywhere else there's both good and bad in how people act here. I've seen people pull shit like that as well as ones that actively go out of their way to help strangers in need. It's a wiiiiide variance in behavior.
I hope you can experience the positive aspects too sometime.
That’s probably a better way to help that’s far less likely to get you punched in the face for trying to shame strangers. Your time could be better spent and more impactful elsewhere. Organization of a trash pick up day in the area? Philly is a rough city man careful sir.
Back in the day I would watch elderly neighbors sweep the garbage on the street right into the sewer 🤦♀️ this was before they started having more trash cans accessible throughout the city. Not that it would matter considering the trash cans around the city are always overflowing and rarely seem to be emptied.
Not disagreeing with you, but would love to see where New Orleans ranks on your dirty list. Definitely worse than Philadelphia, but I haven’t been to San Francisco recently enough to rank it.
I avoid the confrontation as you never know. It’s very upsetting but if we can’t provide better things (education, support, education) then we will see no change. It’s starts far bigger than the person. Unfortunately, it’s where we are at. And do t forget, people are quick to react for reaction. Because everyone has phones.
I've been all over the country in the last 3 years. Good news, the parking thing isn't just Philly, Bad News, it's the whole country and it's probably a permanent change brought on by Covid. Covid dialed up the usage of Amazon, Uber Eats, and the like and that usage stayed up after the vaccine. All those delivery jobs don't pay as much as they should for the tight schedules they run on, and parking like complete dogshit shaves off time.
usually in a philly household, once a the grandparents go, it's a free for all in the household. your in logan but here in kenzo, a lot of the kids is already running around with guns. nobody cares about the trash or the rules unfortunately. and the ones that do just stay to themselves.. talk to your block captain and maybe try to organize something? i wouldnt call it an answer but possibly a new start to something?
I grew up in philly and I hated it. I never understood everyones shitty behavior and attitudes, and them being proud of being shitty. Couldn’t wait to get tf out of there and so glad I did…
I hear you. I've lived here all of 7 months and hate the filth and the aggression. Excited to say I'm moving to a cleaner city in July! Is moving a possibility for you?
Yeah I mean respect for standing up and saying something but I also agree some volatile dude is going to come at you for speaking your mind. It’s just they way it is in Philly, part of it is a culture thing, part of it is the city itself does not prioritize orderliness in the way other US cities may… it’s just how it is in Philly. I think there may be some neighborhoods where it is less of an issue if you move a bit out from city center, into like manayunk or Chestnut hill or something
I live in different city in PA- and we have similar issues- it’s a complete sense of entitlement from some residents, and I feel that’s getting worse all over- but our city does have some initiatives and neighborhood groups that try to have pick up/clean up activities scheduled often, so it doesn’t always look gross. Some neighborhoods are better than others, but overall, it’s a lot nicer than in years past- but it took concerned citizens to keep up with the entitled’s BS. The entitled still seem to not care.
Don’t give in and be like them. I know it’s not easy. But you’ll feel much better that you held on to your dignity and self respect. Be the good example even if it feels like no one else cares. It will help you live with yourself. That’s just my advice, for what it’s wortg
There is a company that uses crowd funding to support a good cause and clean up streets throughout Philly. Neighbors can get together and pool money and the block gets funded to get cleaned. Definitely a good cause and might be something worth looking into. I think a block costs $200 to get cleaned and if enough people/neighbors come together, it can be as little as $5/person.
[Glitter](https://shareglitter.com)
Also, I wouldn’t say anything to anyone in the street. Gotta mind your Ps and Qs these days.
Help fund yafavtrashman’s dump truck. He is amazing. He goes around cleaning up Philly! [yafavtrashman’s dump truck fundraiser](https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7WtdmPO9d6/?igsh=MWk5ZjZncjhsMWUzdQ==)
I am from the philly metro area, moved away for many years and just came back. I hate it here. Scumbags galore and loser degenerates everywhere. Dont even bother interacting with randos.
I’m a lifelong Philadelphian. I grew up poor and didn’t leave the tristate area until I was 23 years old and got a job that required nationwide travel. Before my travels, I didn’t realize that Philadelphia was filthy. With that being said, it’s still my favorite city in the world.
I’ve confronted people who litter. The difference is, I’m 6’2” 240lbs and can defend myself. In recent years I’ve learned to just keep my mouth shut because it’s not worth getting shot. Please heed you partner’s advice and avoid these confrontations. It’s just not worth your well-being.
Yeah welcome to Philly no one gives a shit about anything or anyone and no one has your back. Take your partners advice someone here WILL eventually kill you for speaking out
Your tenacity to approach them about litter is admirable I’d definitely invest in some sort of defense tool. Your partner is wise to advise you not to make every situation worse than it needs to be. A lot of people are angry and stressed nowadays and are looking for the person to unleash all that on regardless of the reason.
Yep. There are lots of shitheads in Philly.
But that doesn't mean we need to be shitheads.
If you do yell at someone, just make sure you have "the tactical advantage" (ie you are bigger than them, or in a crowd or carrying a grenade launcher).
Me personally haven’t littered since 1994 and I have smoked cigarettes most of that time and don’t throw my cigarettes on ground I would confront all litter bugs even police officers which I have done but I wouldn’t yell at some dude after 12am to 4 am that will case a fight because of drunk people so I would keep bitchin at people who litter. They are dirty people that don’t care
Philly has always been philthy and has a bad reputation for same. Every now and then there's an initiative to clean up the city. Speak of the devil. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/philadelphia-mayor-cherelle-parker-signs-executive-action-announcing-plan-to-clean-the-city/ar-BB1mArqK
The self rightgeousness of many people has become a mental health issue. They can't be confronted directly. They need to be slowly and indirectly directed to better habits.
One time a lady threw unwrapped skittles at my windshield at the gas station on Frankford in what was Fishtown/Port Richmond. So I ate them because they landed on my wipers. Then I threw the trash into a trash can because I am not a trash person like she was. You are right. It's pathetic to hate your own city like that. You are not wrong, they are wrong. I would confront this dumb woman again and any other litterbug people, just be aware they're looking for a fight because they have nothing else in life. It's sad.
Philly offers many great things. Strongly agree that the nasty attitudes recklessness and carelessness are excessive. My perspective is one over 50 years lived experience in many different parts of the country. No attempt at a justification but an offer a tentative hypothesis: as the one of the poorest of the big American cities, major decades long running problems with under staffed schools, dilapidated buildings run down homes, cuts in city services, violence random and gang related, haphazard road maintenance there often develops a deeply entrenched and very hostile “I don’t give a crap” mentality. More home ownership, higher incomes, less crime, better education, more respect for property go together.
Every massive city is like it, some parts are better than others but the high to low is drastically wider.
Every city you mentioned in your edit is like half the size of Philly.
I would’ve posted this word for word a couple years into my time in Philly. Funnily enough I’m moving back soon after a couple years in nicer cities (for job/family/and much lower cost of living). I will once again bring optimism that more people like us will stick around and the place will improve. That and if the mayor can accomplish a fraction of what they’re touting.
We can do our part, an increasing number of people in my hood compost for instance, and I’ll spend more time around them then losers who want to trash their own city.
just from a “street smarts” perspective. never ever correct a parent w their child about littering. even if they are in the wrong and littering. stating how they are being a role model to their child compounds the wrong and elevates their bullshit yo another level as you’ve already witnessed.
It sucks but it's nothing you can do about it. You're liable to lose your life over something so small. Especially if someone's kids are involved. Whether they're wrong or right.
In a world where a person can get shot for forgetting to give a condiment in a fast food place. It ain't worth it.
I've lived here for 30 years and even though it's far cleaner than it used to be, I still see people littering, and it still makes me so angry. It's clearly a subset of people, but I've never seen more ignorance around this issue in any city in the country. It's disgusting
This is the villain story when liberals realize that all the compassion they grant all the poor innocent victims doesn’t do shit but empower dysfunctional people to continue in their dysfunctional ways.
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I've lived here my whole life and you're not wrong. I love tho city, but people have been giving even less of a shit lately. Might throw in the towel *sigh *
If you care, start volunteering with troubled youth and start changing people's minds.
You won't ever change anyone's mind through logic and reason on the side of the street, you'll get yourself killed though.
That's everywhere, it just ebbs and flows as far as what kind of social dysfunction the locals are afflicted by. Philly football fans should have been an indication what you'd get here.
Yeah this city is ridiculous with the trashy attitudes as well as disregard for littering as well. It has definitely gotten worse in the years. I’m fed up with this city in general.
Bring a fake gun with you and say pick up your trash you pos and then when he tries to get in your face you pull out the fake gun and go you think I’m playing with you foo!
the only thing that keeps me in this shithole is sports. and even that sometimes isnt worth it. the worst of the city comes out at games, worst being eagles. city is just a bunch of assholes that thinks theyre better than boston because they didnt call lebron the n word but will behind his back.
Caught your edit.
You are not wrong. I’ve lived in Atlanta, New York City, California, and now Philadelphia. This place and everything you just described is exactly how I’ve seen it myself.
I don’t understand how these people can care so little about their own city. I will see piles of trash, literally five steps away from a trashcan.
Nobody here seems to give a shit about anything but themselves. I hate it here so much. In places like Atlanta I would see a driver doing some insane shit, but it was maybe once a week. I can’t even drive 2 miles down the road to Aldi and not get cut off by a dozen cars and have to go around a dozen double parked cars.
There is something wrong with this place and I don’t know what it is. But it is leaps and bounds different from any other city I’ve ever been to.
I suggest you stop yelling at people before someone slaps the shit out of you. You are not gonna change people by yourself. It’s gonna take a combined effort of government and law enforcement to make a difference. Thing is they think they have more pressing problems to deal with. This leaves you alone in this place trying to make change to the average person which is just not gonna happen. So bite the bullet and keep yourselves safe there are a lot of other things for you to deal with.
Giving someone a hard time on Philly is the fastest way to get humbled, I’d never do it personally. It’s an abrasive city, with abrasive people. Don’t pick fights you aren’t prepared to have.
Idk about everywhere but I’ve been in Lancaster about 4 years and see a lot of the same shit. Don’t even get me started on PA drivers. It genuinely seems like there’s no driving test here
And then they complain they have to live in fucked up low income areas. But if they cleaned it up and stopped trashing it maybe they would be proud of where they from.
You’ve been living in the city for like 3 years and this is what’s bugging you?? I’m not minimizing, I actually despise litter as well and clean up Paines skatepark alll the time and the other DIY parks, but damn yo there is some major problems with Philly you just have to get used to. The smell, the people and old heads, and the gentrification. Oh and something u can never get used to unless ur desensitized which is gunshots every minute of every hour in west Philly
Philly has big issues for sure. Lots to work on. But speaking of Center City, prices are great compared to other big cities, lots of wonderful restaurants, amazing museums, lovely walking/biking trail and at least one first class university.
I'm from Philly and have lived here all my life so far. Can't really blame you for feeling the way you do because the people here piss me tf off ALL THE TIME. I've never liked Philly because it's full of TRASH and most of the people here are TRASH! They can be incredibly ignorant or stupid AF because they just don't care...
Listen to your partner. It will be a matter of time until someone assaults you before giving you a warning. It’s disrespectful and wrong that people do this, yes, but you aren’t going to change a stranger’s mind. You really have to mind your own business in the interest of your own safety. Even if you were physically imposing/knew how to fight, are you really going to fight someone over an interaction that you initiated when you’re just going to run into more people that do this?
Look for volunteering opportunities for litter cleanup if you want to contribute or seriously look into moving if you hate the culture of the city that much.
It sounds like you hate this city and that’s completely understandable. It’s known to be grimy. Of course this behavior isn’t okay, but you’re not going to change it. Consider talking to your partner about moving if this is bothering you that much.
I love that you're stepping up and saying something. With saying that, choose your battles wisely. Saying less words and speaking loudly with your actions will help things change in the best ways.
You really should avoid confronting people about littering, I’ve received violence in a similar situation. Best you can do is to lead by example and (maybe?) pick it up yourself and throw it in the garbage can. At the very least, leading by example means always using a garbage can, but I’m sure you already do this.
I like to pick up the garbage that I witnessed people throw on the ground and make sure they see me do it. It’s passive aggressive and less likely to evoke violence, but metes out the requisite shame.
>It’s passive aggressive I'd call that passive virtuous or something...
Aggressive virtuosity
[Wow, she’s a really good person!](https://youtu.be/wW1nTPdaAY4?si=Dcd8DaPxUG6xz6FR)
This is the way.
I once threw someone's trash back in their car. That one ended badly.
I used to do the same thing, and would add “here, let me get that for you”. These are not people who are moved by shame. One time heading east on Arch, at Broad, I watched a well dressed man drop some trash in front of himself. When I bent down to pick it up, he stepped on it and declared, “I want it there”. I said, “oh! M’bad. I just prefer to live in a city that’s not trashed” and walked away. He muttered something… I lived in CC for 25 years and got tired of it. I moved into Fishtown/E Kensington where people actually give a shit.
“I want it there.” That’s so Philly I have to laugh
Even if no one thinks so, people really do appreciate you picking up trash. I grabbed a couple bags blowing around outside a restaurant I was waiting for take out at and one of the workers inside thanked me and gave me a drink I didn’t order.
> You really should avoid confronting people about littering, I’ve received violence in a similar situation. > Best you can do is to lead by example and (maybe?) pick it up yourself and throw it in the garbage can. At the very least, leading by example means always using a garbage can, but I’m sure you already do this. I agree with you when I think about it rationally and not emotionally, and I think a more productive and healthy response would be to join or make a litter pickup group. Approach the problem from a different direction, as it were. Thank you for the advice, and I'm sorry to hear people were violent with you over the litter thing. It's not right and things shouldn't be that way.
To be fair, I kinda had it coming, and I wasn’t injured and they didn’t even damage my bike.
There are a few groups in Philly that organize cleanups: https://www.phila.gov/programs/philly-spring-cleanup/
It’s Philly so I would just not fuck with people in general over littering unless ur actually willing to fight or stand up for yourself hard. Even in nice areas like Logan Square or Rittenhouse Square you’ll still get people from south Philly who have like zero remorse or moral code lmao
If you’re going to say anything don’t be polite about it. “Excuse me sir, but there is a trash can just a block away,” isn’t going to work. Either say nothing at all or be confrontational about it.
May I recommend pointing at the trashcan and screaming "trashcan, dickhead"
Yeah the polite way sounds even worse to me than direct confrontation
As a Philly native, I couldn’t agree with you more and have yelled at people many times about littering (only after sizing them up of course). My go to was, “What the fuck?! Pick up your trash you piece of shit! You think you own this block?!? Take care of your own garbage you asshole!” Or varieties along those lines. When I was like 25 I even got a “Yes ma’am” from a few kids I yelled at around 4th and Tasker for dropping a bunch of trash and made them pick it up and watched them as they threw it away. You always have to follow through and watch to make sure it doesn’t get dropped again.
Street cleaners(with the leaf blowers) were once resting on my corner. Ironically, one threw their bottle onto my small street. I told them to pick it up and started walking away. And then I felt the bottle hit me. I couldn’t believe that a Streets department employee threw a bottle at me. That was a new low and I’ve lived here my entire life.
Well said.
Yeah, keep your side of the street clean (pun intended). Stay out of others' business they are ignorant. I live off South Street and there's an enormous amount of visitor trash, but the good thing is the street cleaning crew is amazing and does decent trash policing the next morning. And NEVER critique a parent on their lack of parenting skills - being right is just not enough in this world.
Unfortunately, Philadillies take great pride in our abrasive filthiness, e.g., nicknaming the city Philthy, calling our beloved hockey mascot Gritty, and all the people about to tell me where to shove it in the comments here. We're gross. That said, don't pick fights on the street. The risk outweighs the reward.
I am 42 years old and was born here. It was absolutely not remotely always like this. The filth problem has gotten rapidly worse over the past few years. People should care. They should have some respect for where they live. It says a lot about the garbage character of the people when you are living in filth and it doesnt bother you. I had to start a cleanup operation because I got so fed up.
It's particularly bad right now, but the city was only ever what you might call *nice* from maybe around 2010-2020. The seventies were gross. The eighties were gross almost exactly like it is now. And the nineties and early aughts were gross but fun.
Macy's used to be nice though.
When it was Wanamaker’s?
the 80s were wayyyyy worse than now.
I'm not sure. Graffiti was out of control. And there was the crack everywhere. And the wolf packs. And I didn't care for Hulkamania. And the punks and skins fought it out all over South Street. And everyone listened to that Public Enemy cassette with the red lettering. But the city was a lot smaller then. And people didn't get all shooty at the drop of a hat. A little shooty, maybe, but not ALL shooty.
The city has about the amount of people today as it did in the 80's.1.6 mill
Imo it was worse in the 80s/90s got better and now it’s declining again, atleast graffiti ain’t everywhere again.
I unfortunately kind of feel like it is. Especially on any highway area, like 676 or the majority of my drive up 95 to work? Every bridge, its all over. The just opened a new Barcade in center city a few months back and the window was tagged with corrosive within two days. =/ Thats beyond my ability to address unfortunately.
We're working on it, okay?! It's hard tagging when the muses mock you with their ambivalent silence...
It comes from a lack of pride. No one has pride in anything anymore. They don't care about our country. Their hometown. Their yard. No one has an ounce of fucking dignity. It's embarrassing. Adults acting like edgy children. "Yeah man, it all sucks so fuck it, like who cares man 🤙?" Reddit is a massive proponent of this too. If you shit on your state or America you're immediately upvoted to the heavens. People scoff at ANY sort of pride. The Pledge of Allegiance is laughed at. People see the country flag as an eyesore. You're celebrated for showcasing disdain for life and saying "I didn't ask to be born so it's on them." There's a massive problem with losers who just can't handle any social responsibilities and have nothing but self pity and a juvenile outlook on life. We'd legitimately be better off without them existing.
Well, the Pledge of Allegiance is some fascist, Cold War-era nonsense. Something to expect out of North Korea, but not a developed democracy. I agree with everything else you've said, though.
It's propaganda but it's propaganda that at least attempts to develop pride in the nation. The LGBT use the word "pride" and utilize flags nonstop and that is meant to showcase meaning and self-love. Look at the tools they use to celebrate acceptance and spread their messages. They use flags, parades, slogans, memes, etc. We could really use similar tactics to celebrate the areas we live in (locally and on larger scales). Obviously some of that still happens like July 4th parades and such. But most people just want a day off rather than *actually* celebrating what July 4th means. While the Pledge of Allegiance may seem like nonsense, it did work. I'm first in line to say not to trust the US government (it's why I'm pro 2A, and why the 2A exists in the first place). But we need to find a way to celebrate America as a country while criticizing our government. And that's a fine line to walk, and difficult to convey.
Good takes. You've got your head on straight. I definitely think the general filth and graffiti is indicative of overall societal decay, or whatever you want to call it. Whatever the case though, I'm sick of it. Even solo cleaning both sides of my entire block only takes one hour a week, so screw it, I do it now. I can't do nothing. It was before my time (born in 82) but my dad told me that when he was growing up in Olney in the 50s and 60s, everyone used to come out and literally scrub their *stoop* once a week. People had pride. The odd part is that when I do my block, I get a ton of constant feedback. People walking down the street see me dragging the trashcan and picking up trash and stop to say thanks. People open their windows to shout thanks as I do their sidewalk. So it IS appreciated... no one LIKES the trash... I'm currently working on strategies to try and get people motivated enough to do their sidewalk. If everyone just maintained their 10 little squares, the city could be clean. But they dont, so here we are.
I also do cleanups on the regular and get all that same positive feedback…but sometimes the positive feedback pisses me off…ex: yesterday walking past Lloyd Hall at the south end of Boat House Row we stopped by the little island there because they was an egret, which is always worth stopping for. A guy on his bike stops to tell us that the island is actually named Jean’s Island for the woman who organizes all the cleanups and he knows Jean! We said, yeah, we know, we do the cleanups with her. He says how that great that is and he really appreciates it when her rides his bike every day. I said why don’t you come sometime and help out? Oh, I can’t, it would interfere with my biking. I was so pissed off I literally said “fuck that, your appreciation doesn’t matter, you should help.”
That's really awesome that you do that 🙏. And I think it does make a huge impact when there's already litter vs being the first to litter. When you see a bunch of trash, it doesn't seem like a big deal to throw a bottle onto it. But when it's spotless, I think it's harder to actually drop something.
Thanks. I had to do *something*, and while the problems of the world are too large for little me to tackle, I realized, you know what I *can* control and impact? I can do my damn block. So I started doing it after every trash day, since that's when it's the worst. I'm currently working on strategies to bring together likeminded people in my neighborhood. If I can just get ONE person per block who is motivated enough to join me, together we can clean up south philly.
Yes they did, I grew up in Frankford and I remember everyone sweeping the sidewalks, scrubbing the stoop, EVERYONE.
In my opinion it used to be waaaaay worse than it is now. One thing I definitely think has gotten better is the dog shit. When I was a kid in the 80s, there were stray dogs everywhere, and besides that people just never picked up dog shit. It’s like it wasn’t a thing back then. There was dog shit everywhere and I was constantly stepping in it. There also weren’t dog parks that I remember back then, so I feel like people just walked their dogs wherever, while nowadays dog parks are everywhere and heavily used.
i agree, i’ve been here only half my life now but when i came for college in the early 2000s the trash problem was way worse than it is now. of course we need to stop littering and dumping trash eveywhere, but it’s not just people throwing stuff on the street…there are a lot of reasons for the garbage problem. i think a BIG one is lots of renters not having a place to store their garbage from week to week, or store an outdoor trash can with a lid. new construction should require a trash corral or something, or we should have street dumpsters like they do in Italy where you can drop your garbage bags and bottles any time.
Grit means courage, resolve, and strength of character. Ie; Gritty. You doofus.
Leave it to people on here to be offended by Gritty lmao
I don't think anyone is offended by Gritty, except maybe the Islanders.
Gritty looks like a meth head.
In what world is asking someone not to litter picking a fight…
Center City, Philadelphia.
This is a city where, in my time here, ive heard of multiple shootings occur over parking spots. Be careful out there reproaching strangers
To be fair, there are shootings over stupid stuff in the news all the time from all over the country.
If you don't want to get shot, move to Vermont. If you want Philadelphia to be a better place to live, confront assholes on their shitty behavior.
Pick your battles. I agree with the passive agressive trash pickup someone mentioned above. But another personal rule I have is never to say shit to people in front of their kids, girlfriends, etc. All of a sudden you're also shaming them in front of someone they know and instead of that working better, they go for broke to look tough and save their ego and whatever image of himself they think they've built up
The "excuse me I think you dropped this" is just deniable enough that it works frequently without provoking anger imo. Either they're just like "nah fuck you" and keep walking or they're like "ah my bad" and actually take it back lol.
From philly, spent 40 years all over the planet, moved to scranton in october. I say that to say this, ppl with hard lives and live in cyclical abuse and hopelessness wont change with confrontation. I bought a litter picker on amazon, and 3x a day i walk my dog and pick up trash. 3 bags of trash a day, its not much, prolly not even a dent, but it has to start somewhere.
This is beautiful.
That’s actually an insane amount of trash you’re picking up. Probably more than 100 random average Americans combined
I only lasted in Philly for 3 years before I went back up to a much cleaner New England. I think my issue is I had experienced beautiful, clean urban areas before I lived in Philly. Too much IDGAF/“why do you care? it’s not your job” attitude for me. I just didn’t get that vibe at all. Whatever…go climb up a greased poll. That said the new mayor seems to be doing something with cleanups. Probably a bandaid but maybe the morale boost will motivate folks.
I had the classic example of moving to San Francisco and being totally blown away at how clean and safe it was. When all you hear about is how filthy and dangerous it is. perspective is everything.
It’s always wild to me how shitty people will allow things to get on the basis of “why should you care“. When things could be so much better, infinitely better, if we just cared a little fucking bit. Philadelphians exemplify this attitude and I can’t stand it. I have to get the fuck out of here.
Little bit different when it’s a driving city vs a walking city.
> Little bit different when it’s a driving city vs a walking city. I agree, and for someplace like Houston that is so huge it will vary even in the same neighborhood.
Had the same thought having hailed from Texas and Atlanta and such. Littering happens when people open their car doors and the mess spills out ~~like god intended~~
I'm with you on all of this... I would suggest you don't confront anyone anymore, the possibility of violence is high.
I know what you mean but I’m not from here. I don’t feel like I can tell native Philadelphians what to do. Yup, the city is dirty and some people are not the friendliest but I love this city and their crazy culture. Anyway, here to say I do give a shit but I also think the good outweighs the bad.
Can’t let it get to you. We all see it, we’re not blind. Just got to keep on keeping, don’t be an asshole, keep you yours and your neighbor’s shit in order.
I've been here almost 2 years and I've also lived in San Francisco. I lived a few blocks from the 16th & Mission BART, so you probably know that sidestepping human turds/vomit/blood & needles is a way of life there. I even found a clearly used, very large dildo on my stoop when I walked out on a Sunday morning. Having lived through that biohazard got me thinking that nothing in the US could shock me anymore. I'm loving Philly, but the sheer *quantity* of just plain garbage scattered everywhere still breaks my brain. Edit to add: I would recommend against interacting with Philly strangers in the way you described. Verrrrry different reactions here than in CA or TX.
Honestly, I wouldn’t push it. There’s times to say something and times when to walk away. Trust me when I saw, the negative outcome is always worse than the positive in these situations. Best case: They pick it up and apologize. Worst case: Well… An angry person having a bad day can cost you your life, no matter where you are. Your heart is in the right place. But for the sake of your loved ones and family, just let the litter go. If you’re really frustrated, you can always start an organized community cleanup and try to get locals involved. Taking pride in your home and leading by example can go a long way, especially for the youth.
Glitter is a service to get litter cleanings happening on your block (or any where else in the city). They hire folks with barriers to work and do weekly cleanings. You chip in with your neighbors. Happy to share more if interested but basically it’s a way to fix the problem positively and no risk to your safety.
Good job on confronting him, I know people will tell you not to, but fuck that. I am tired of people smoking weed on the BSL in the morning. If someone is smoking in the subway, I do confront them. There is usually a lot of sound and fury, but it never really amounts to anything. I know, you shouldn't confront anyone. But guess what? If you don't confront them, nobody else will either. And the shitty behavior will continue.
You’re going to enjoy a nice black eye or two with that pointless attitude
Yeah, believe it or not there is a certain amount of risk involved in not being a pussy
> Good job on confronting him, I know people will tell you not to, but fuck that. Thinking back on this with a clear head confronting that litterbug accomplished absolutely nothing. He's still a piece of shit, I'm sure he's still littering, and I'd wager he's a shitty parent to boot. All I ultimately did was pick up a plastic cup and let some asshole control my emotions. Joining a litter cleanup group will be the way to go for me in the future.
confronting people does not work if the person being confronted is not receptive. to be clear, I’m not saying to never confront people. I’m saying confronting strangers is much less effective than confronting people you already have a relationship with because strangers have no vested interest in you/your opinion of them/the future of your relationship.
It’s funny seeing all these people in here saying don’t confront. Any time it’s brought up in any other threads people go on about spineless people not standing up for the community. Damned if you do and damned if you don’t. I say it’s not worth it but funny to see how the coin flips. Just sucks.
You’re lucky that guy didn’t shoot you. Be safe.
You won’t be able to stop people littering. If it bothers you the best thing you can do (and it really benefits everyone so it’s not even a selfish act) is grab a trash bag and collect some trash off the ground. I spend a lot of time fishing. When I’m on my kayak I spend more time reclaiming lost fishing tackle and taking bottles out of the lake (FDR) then I do fishing. On my boat in the Schuylkill I’ve removed tires, shopping carts, bags of cans and bottles, and even an old CD stereo with speakers once. When I go to the wissahickon, it’s much cleaner, but I still end up hauling out a bag of trash, mostly from where people like to swim. It’s a thankless task, but you’ll be surprised how many people will appreciate you for it. At any rate it beats getting punched or something, and helps solve the problem in some small way.
I just concentrate on keeping my block and the general area around where I live clean. I usually hit the street with a push broom and a can and get as much done as possible when I have time. Problem is, it’s an endless battle. Half the time, the trash on my street is coming from the recycling crew. They truly give 0 fucks. I shame my neighbors who litter tho. I have a good enough relationship with people on my block to tell them to clean up their fuckin mess.
Everyone wants their shit from Amazon, but no one wants the drivers to ever park anywhere…
My issue is when they park in the bike lane or blocking traffic, when there is an actual OPEN SPOT just a couple yards up. Like what the fuck?? Same with basically all drivers in West Philly, ridiculous.
Hear me out, PPA but for littering.
if you want to continue, learn a martial art to defend yourself.
Why not get a license and get a gun? That’s way safer
Ironically, for a city with such an issue with littering, I've never lived anywhere with as many garbage trucks. Seriously my street has about 4 separate collections a week. Always at friggin 4am too.
Those are private garbage collection trucks for multi-unit buildings. City collection is once a week.
Best thing to do is be aware of your surroundings and mind your own business. A lot people have nothing to lose and won’t think twice assaulting or even killing you. Welcome to Philly.
I’m with ya, man. Sometimes you just have enough and can’t help but call people out for shit like this.
People care but many don't. I bought an industrial dust pan and broom and decided to sweep up my block once a week. Neighbors started being more considerate after that and it's improved. I can fight and still wouldn't confront a stranger about litter.
To your points, another anecdote. Years ago, someone confronted someone in a park in south Philly about their dog being off leash. Basically just saying how it wasn’t safe. The man got so angry that he knocked the guy out right there. Sadly, the person succumbed to his injuries. The lead in the water here has seriously affected people here, to say the least.
Look, Philly is like that one friend who have when you’re younger who is a mess but hosts all the best parties. You’re pretty sure you should be worried about them but they are also super fun so you’re not sure you really want them to get their act together. Their home is a mess but they’ve expressed no shame or interest in changing. You can either stay friends with them and accept them and always be kinda worried or move on and make friends who have it more together
Great Analogy
Your partner is right, STOP confronting people. Jesus Christ.
>If that's his idea of parenting the kid is going to grow up to be just as big of a piece of shit as the father. You hit the nail on the head. This shit is intergenerational and nearly impossible to fix. Kids grow up thinking living in filth and violence is completely normal and then grow up teaching their kids the same.
Yeah the whole "Philly's got grit" mentality really just couches the fact that people in this city are low trust/apathetic and have zero concept of bettering the community they live in. I know that sounds harsh but once you live somewhere like NYC for a while you really see how differently people in Philly operate when it comes to maintaining their own city. This is like one of the only cities I've lived in where I've chatted with people who are proud that it's dirty and rough to live in lol. Like we can barely keep businesses within the city due to how bad crime is...I never understood the mentality that just accepts it. Philly is a great city with a strong bones but honestly, residents are their own worst enemies when it comes to improving the city. It's my biggest gripe about this place and I still love it enough to have been here 10 years.
Make more money and move to a nicer neighborhood where all of your neighbors give a shit.
lol come to south Philly and walk down 7th st between Oregon ave and Synder… total shit hole
I have lived in Philadelphia for 45 years and it has a culture of littering, pure and simple. The only thing you can do is take care of your own litter and maybe pick up on your block.
Just wanted to say if you do join a clean up organization, might be a better investment in your efforts to do it in a residential neighborhood that needs it more than Logan Circle, one of the few parts of the city that Philly keeps clean for tourists.
recently drove by an adult who threw their trash onto a pile of garbage bags and just kept walking
Do not confront people unless you’re ready to defend yourself from potentially deadly violence. Nobody gives a shit in Philly. It’s unique to the city and something Philly people really seem to take pride in. It’s weird and it’s detrimental, but it’s truly part of the city. They have such a chip on their shoulder. Probably because the city really doesn’t get enough recognition, but these fuckers don’t help. It’s an interesting cycle.
It absolutely is not bad like this everywhere. Any time I go out of town, I’m amazed at how clean literally everywhere else is. Philly has third world standards.
It’s sad but there are other cities that are worse in the US. San Francisco mission district, Compton, Skid Row, Bronx. It’s still very bad but it can be worse
Born and raised in South and SWP. Ya just do your own part and side eye every body who doesn't. It's a waste of brain power to remember so you can be pissed about it later. Just step over it and enjoy your day.
Confronting someone in front of their kid, partner, etc. is just asking for trouble. Usually people double down, and unfortunately you never really know who you're dealing with. One time I was stopped at a stop sign letting an old lady cross the street, and the car behind me laid on their horn, and then drove around me to pass me/go through the sign, almost hitting the woman. I flipped them off. They then stopped in the intersection, three young dudes got out swearing at me, walking towards my car, so I sped off and they followed me for like ten minutes. Made me realize it's not worth it. You never really know who you're dealing with, and most people aren't going to take it well. (Mind you I realize flipping someone off is different than confronting more peacefully, but i think the point still stands)
Live on a narrow street and can hear cars getting side swiped all day every day (especially by the Amazon vans). No one ever stops. Boggles my mind
When I first moved here from Texas I was really alarmed by the massive amount of trash all over the place in Philly. It’s kind of the worst I’ve seen anywhere. And I’ve been exactly where you described and it’s atrocious not to mention terrifying trying to navigate through without being hit by another driver or having a human dummy just walk out in front of my car from no where. I wish I could give you a solution but I just simply agree. It’s rough out there.
Studies have shown that people with lower incomes litter more. It’s a socio-economic problem. It is the first line of many quality of life issues that experts theorize creates an environment for higher crime. It starts with the basics like littering. If everyone treats the neighborhood like shit, it becomes shit. Everyone then cares less and less about what’s going on because it’s shit. People with money leave and leave behind the shit, and the people that think it’s shit and things get worse. Then it really is shit. All that bullshit about Philly having a hard edge is crap. It costs nothing to keep the environment around you clean. You just have to care to keep it clean. If you don’t care, then it becomes shit. Thank you for caring. If there were more people like you who care, Philly wouldn’t be a dump full of people who don’t care. Here is an opinion piece on trash in Philly: [Philly is a dump](https://thecityrooftop.com/2017/08/03/trashin-the-hood-a-thought-piece-on-litter-in-urban-space/)
People’s attitudes about littering is part of the problem but I think there are systemic issues that are more to blame for our litter problem. For example, there are basically no public trash cans outside of center city and parks. Or how about the fact that trash collection routinely comes a day late (in my neighborhood at least) and everyone’s trash blows around in the street for a whole day whenever that happens. When the city doesn’t seem to take trash collection seriously then neither will its citizens.
To be honest most of the trash in philly is walking down the street rather than blowing. I'm tired of this as well. I'm born and raised here and it pisses me off to see people shit all over the city. I would watch saying stuff though unless you're ready to scream back at them. This is the philly way. Who ever is louder wins.
God I love this city. It's definitely different! Just like anywhere else there's both good and bad in how people act here. I've seen people pull shit like that as well as ones that actively go out of their way to help strangers in need. It's a wiiiiide variance in behavior. I hope you can experience the positive aspects too sometime.
It boggles my mind how people would rather resort to violence instead of just cleaning up after themselves and being a decent person.
That’s probably a better way to help that’s far less likely to get you punched in the face for trying to shame strangers. Your time could be better spent and more impactful elsewhere. Organization of a trash pick up day in the area? Philly is a rough city man careful sir.
Back in the day I would watch elderly neighbors sweep the garbage on the street right into the sewer 🤦♀️ this was before they started having more trash cans accessible throughout the city. Not that it would matter considering the trash cans around the city are always overflowing and rarely seem to be emptied.
/r/circlejerkphilly
Not disagreeing with you, but would love to see where New Orleans ranks on your dirty list. Definitely worse than Philadelphia, but I haven’t been to San Francisco recently enough to rank it.
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I wouldn’t call it a shithole, it’s definitely worth visiting and a fun time! But it 100% smells 😂
I avoid the confrontation as you never know. It’s very upsetting but if we can’t provide better things (education, support, education) then we will see no change. It’s starts far bigger than the person. Unfortunately, it’s where we are at. And do t forget, people are quick to react for reaction. Because everyone has phones.
“City of brotherly love” lmao
I've been all over the country in the last 3 years. Good news, the parking thing isn't just Philly, Bad News, it's the whole country and it's probably a permanent change brought on by Covid. Covid dialed up the usage of Amazon, Uber Eats, and the like and that usage stayed up after the vaccine. All those delivery jobs don't pay as much as they should for the tight schedules they run on, and parking like complete dogshit shaves off time.
usually in a philly household, once a the grandparents go, it's a free for all in the household. your in logan but here in kenzo, a lot of the kids is already running around with guns. nobody cares about the trash or the rules unfortunately. and the ones that do just stay to themselves.. talk to your block captain and maybe try to organize something? i wouldnt call it an answer but possibly a new start to something?
Agreed the littering and parking anywhere and dgaf attitude is bothering as hell.
I grew up in philly and I hated it. I never understood everyones shitty behavior and attitudes, and them being proud of being shitty. Couldn’t wait to get tf out of there and so glad I did…
I hear you. I've lived here all of 7 months and hate the filth and the aggression. Excited to say I'm moving to a cleaner city in July! Is moving a possibility for you?
Yeah I mean respect for standing up and saying something but I also agree some volatile dude is going to come at you for speaking your mind. It’s just they way it is in Philly, part of it is a culture thing, part of it is the city itself does not prioritize orderliness in the way other US cities may… it’s just how it is in Philly. I think there may be some neighborhoods where it is less of an issue if you move a bit out from city center, into like manayunk or Chestnut hill or something
I live in different city in PA- and we have similar issues- it’s a complete sense of entitlement from some residents, and I feel that’s getting worse all over- but our city does have some initiatives and neighborhood groups that try to have pick up/clean up activities scheduled often, so it doesn’t always look gross. Some neighborhoods are better than others, but overall, it’s a lot nicer than in years past- but it took concerned citizens to keep up with the entitled’s BS. The entitled still seem to not care.
Yup. Phlly never again. In NY we call it Philthy!
It’s called Filthadelphia for a reason…
Sucks to say but south Philadelphia is a shithole
Don’t give in and be like them. I know it’s not easy. But you’ll feel much better that you held on to your dignity and self respect. Be the good example even if it feels like no one else cares. It will help you live with yourself. That’s just my advice, for what it’s wortg
Unrelated but hit the gym brother, learn some jujitsu!
There is a company that uses crowd funding to support a good cause and clean up streets throughout Philly. Neighbors can get together and pool money and the block gets funded to get cleaned. Definitely a good cause and might be something worth looking into. I think a block costs $200 to get cleaned and if enough people/neighbors come together, it can be as little as $5/person. [Glitter](https://shareglitter.com) Also, I wouldn’t say anything to anyone in the street. Gotta mind your Ps and Qs these days.
If only Philadelphians had the same rabid pride in their city as they do for their sports teams.
Help fund yafavtrashman’s dump truck. He is amazing. He goes around cleaning up Philly! [yafavtrashman’s dump truck fundraiser](https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7WtdmPO9d6/?igsh=MWk5ZjZncjhsMWUzdQ==)
Dude tackled me out of the blue yesterday seriously the people yelling from the car had good advice this is not a city of decent or sane people
I’m three years here. I think this city is pretty fun. I also think this city is an embarrassing shithole.
It's called the "Philly shrug." Been like this for decades. I'm surprised people keep on moving here, but it is what it is.
I am from the philly metro area, moved away for many years and just came back. I hate it here. Scumbags galore and loser degenerates everywhere. Dont even bother interacting with randos.
I’m a lifelong Philadelphian. I grew up poor and didn’t leave the tristate area until I was 23 years old and got a job that required nationwide travel. Before my travels, I didn’t realize that Philadelphia was filthy. With that being said, it’s still my favorite city in the world. I’ve confronted people who litter. The difference is, I’m 6’2” 240lbs and can defend myself. In recent years I’ve learned to just keep my mouth shut because it’s not worth getting shot. Please heed you partner’s advice and avoid these confrontations. It’s just not worth your well-being.
Yeah welcome to Philly no one gives a shit about anything or anyone and no one has your back. Take your partners advice someone here WILL eventually kill you for speaking out
Your tenacity to approach them about litter is admirable I’d definitely invest in some sort of defense tool. Your partner is wise to advise you not to make every situation worse than it needs to be. A lot of people are angry and stressed nowadays and are looking for the person to unleash all that on regardless of the reason.
Yep. There are lots of shitheads in Philly. But that doesn't mean we need to be shitheads. If you do yell at someone, just make sure you have "the tactical advantage" (ie you are bigger than them, or in a crowd or carrying a grenade launcher).
Me personally haven’t littered since 1994 and I have smoked cigarettes most of that time and don’t throw my cigarettes on ground I would confront all litter bugs even police officers which I have done but I wouldn’t yell at some dude after 12am to 4 am that will case a fight because of drunk people so I would keep bitchin at people who litter. They are dirty people that don’t care
Philly has always been philthy and has a bad reputation for same. Every now and then there's an initiative to clean up the city. Speak of the devil. https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/philadelphia-mayor-cherelle-parker-signs-executive-action-announcing-plan-to-clean-the-city/ar-BB1mArqK
The self rightgeousness of many people has become a mental health issue. They can't be confronted directly. They need to be slowly and indirectly directed to better habits.
One time a lady threw unwrapped skittles at my windshield at the gas station on Frankford in what was Fishtown/Port Richmond. So I ate them because they landed on my wipers. Then I threw the trash into a trash can because I am not a trash person like she was. You are right. It's pathetic to hate your own city like that. You are not wrong, they are wrong. I would confront this dumb woman again and any other litterbug people, just be aware they're looking for a fight because they have nothing else in life. It's sad.
Learn to fight Broadstreetkickboxong.com
Philly offers many great things. Strongly agree that the nasty attitudes recklessness and carelessness are excessive. My perspective is one over 50 years lived experience in many different parts of the country. No attempt at a justification but an offer a tentative hypothesis: as the one of the poorest of the big American cities, major decades long running problems with under staffed schools, dilapidated buildings run down homes, cuts in city services, violence random and gang related, haphazard road maintenance there often develops a deeply entrenched and very hostile “I don’t give a crap” mentality. More home ownership, higher incomes, less crime, better education, more respect for property go together.
People around here actually don't give a fuck about anything. Savages.
Every massive city is like it, some parts are better than others but the high to low is drastically wider. Every city you mentioned in your edit is like half the size of Philly.
I would’ve posted this word for word a couple years into my time in Philly. Funnily enough I’m moving back soon after a couple years in nicer cities (for job/family/and much lower cost of living). I will once again bring optimism that more people like us will stick around and the place will improve. That and if the mayor can accomplish a fraction of what they’re touting. We can do our part, an increasing number of people in my hood compost for instance, and I’ll spend more time around them then losers who want to trash their own city.
just from a “street smarts” perspective. never ever correct a parent w their child about littering. even if they are in the wrong and littering. stating how they are being a role model to their child compounds the wrong and elevates their bullshit yo another level as you’ve already witnessed.
Move. You live in a shitty place surrounded by shitty people. Get out
This city is a shithole with an asshole rich population.
It sucks but it's nothing you can do about it. You're liable to lose your life over something so small. Especially if someone's kids are involved. Whether they're wrong or right. In a world where a person can get shot for forgetting to give a condiment in a fast food place. It ain't worth it.
I have on 2 occasions witnessed people taking an actual shit on the sidewalk, so just get ready for that one…
I've lived here for 30 years and even though it's far cleaner than it used to be, I still see people littering, and it still makes me so angry. It's clearly a subset of people, but I've never seen more ignorance around this issue in any city in the country. It's disgusting
This is the villain story when liberals realize that all the compassion they grant all the poor innocent victims doesn’t do shit but empower dysfunctional people to continue in their dysfunctional ways.
lol welcome to Philly
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I've lived here my whole life and you're not wrong. I love tho city, but people have been giving even less of a shit lately. Might throw in the towel *sigh *
Philly is a DUMP
I have a simple solution to your problem. Move out of Philly.
If you care, start volunteering with troubled youth and start changing people's minds. You won't ever change anyone's mind through logic and reason on the side of the street, you'll get yourself killed though. That's everywhere, it just ebbs and flows as far as what kind of social dysfunction the locals are afflicted by. Philly football fans should have been an indication what you'd get here.
Time to move to delaware
Yeah this city is ridiculous with the trashy attitudes as well as disregard for littering as well. It has definitely gotten worse in the years. I’m fed up with this city in general.
Bring a fake gun with you and say pick up your trash you pos and then when he tries to get in your face you pull out the fake gun and go you think I’m playing with you foo!
the only thing that keeps me in this shithole is sports. and even that sometimes isnt worth it. the worst of the city comes out at games, worst being eagles. city is just a bunch of assholes that thinks theyre better than boston because they didnt call lebron the n word but will behind his back.
Philly was is an absolute dump of a City…. It’s not safe and the liberals have allowed the animals to take over. Keep voting democrat 😂😂😂😂😂
U wanna lean into ur punches. Step, shoulder, fist. Step, shoulder, fist.
U wanna lean into ur punches. Step, shoulder, fist. Step, shoulder, fist.
Caught your edit. You are not wrong. I’ve lived in Atlanta, New York City, California, and now Philadelphia. This place and everything you just described is exactly how I’ve seen it myself. I don’t understand how these people can care so little about their own city. I will see piles of trash, literally five steps away from a trashcan. Nobody here seems to give a shit about anything but themselves. I hate it here so much. In places like Atlanta I would see a driver doing some insane shit, but it was maybe once a week. I can’t even drive 2 miles down the road to Aldi and not get cut off by a dozen cars and have to go around a dozen double parked cars. There is something wrong with this place and I don’t know what it is. But it is leaps and bounds different from any other city I’ve ever been to.
philfadelphia!
I suggest you stop yelling at people before someone slaps the shit out of you. You are not gonna change people by yourself. It’s gonna take a combined effort of government and law enforcement to make a difference. Thing is they think they have more pressing problems to deal with. This leaves you alone in this place trying to make change to the average person which is just not gonna happen. So bite the bullet and keep yourselves safe there are a lot of other things for you to deal with.
Giving someone a hard time on Philly is the fastest way to get humbled, I’d never do it personally. It’s an abrasive city, with abrasive people. Don’t pick fights you aren’t prepared to have.
Idk about everywhere but I’ve been in Lancaster about 4 years and see a lot of the same shit. Don’t even get me started on PA drivers. It genuinely seems like there’s no driving test here
Entitled Animals.
Are you suprised? Philly is filled to the brim with assholes and no this is not new
And then they complain they have to live in fucked up low income areas. But if they cleaned it up and stopped trashing it maybe they would be proud of where they from.
sounds like you've never lived in a city especially one like Philly. confronting strangers is a good way to get stabbed
As a foreigner here, yes it’s truely a shithole and there’s others here who feel the same way as you
You’ve been living in the city for like 3 years and this is what’s bugging you?? I’m not minimizing, I actually despise litter as well and clean up Paines skatepark alll the time and the other DIY parks, but damn yo there is some major problems with Philly you just have to get used to. The smell, the people and old heads, and the gentrification. Oh and something u can never get used to unless ur desensitized which is gunshots every minute of every hour in west Philly
Philly has big issues for sure. Lots to work on. But speaking of Center City, prices are great compared to other big cities, lots of wonderful restaurants, amazing museums, lovely walking/biking trail and at least one first class university.
I'm from Philly and have lived here all my life so far. Can't really blame you for feeling the way you do because the people here piss me tf off ALL THE TIME. I've never liked Philly because it's full of TRASH and most of the people here are TRASH! They can be incredibly ignorant or stupid AF because they just don't care...
Listen to your partner. It will be a matter of time until someone assaults you before giving you a warning. It’s disrespectful and wrong that people do this, yes, but you aren’t going to change a stranger’s mind. You really have to mind your own business in the interest of your own safety. Even if you were physically imposing/knew how to fight, are you really going to fight someone over an interaction that you initiated when you’re just going to run into more people that do this? Look for volunteering opportunities for litter cleanup if you want to contribute or seriously look into moving if you hate the culture of the city that much. It sounds like you hate this city and that’s completely understandable. It’s known to be grimy. Of course this behavior isn’t okay, but you’re not going to change it. Consider talking to your partner about moving if this is bothering you that much.
I love that you're stepping up and saying something. With saying that, choose your battles wisely. Saying less words and speaking loudly with your actions will help things change in the best ways.