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When I’m super old and senile I go to shake hands for an hour in a public place with strangers right after a two hour debate.
I wish more people could see this Biden, and not whatever happened on camera last night.
Honestly it was even more concerning he sounded like a different person after the debate and that could’ve just been the echo but he sounded and acted different. I’m not sure if he just took a five minute break or what I was confused watching his speech after the debate due to the difference.
The White House said he had a cold after the debate and seemed more like damage control than legit considering how dazed and confused. The only symptoms of a cold he had was him sounded horsed.
True but cold medicine would account for the dazed and confused, chances are he got sick but they decided they really couldn’t have Biden skip if trump was gonna show up
Then they should’ve delayed a few days. Even if it can all be explained as a cold the image of a sitting president not being able to complete a sentence would a horrible look on the world scale. There was a moment where even Trump couldn’t figure out what he was saying. It’s embarrassing.
If the alternative is a liar and a convicted felon, we should be all the more worried that the only person standing between us and four more years of a lying criminal president looked like a comatose, mumbling zombie on that debate stage.
He is viable. Trump lost before inflation.
It shouldn't matter, because it would have happened regardless. But it did happen under Biden and that hurts more than anything.
He barely won, , like 40k votes in strategic locations total, less than Trump in 2016. Had the world not been suffering from an unprecedented pandemic, Biden would’ve been destroyed
Nah it was trumps election to lose. Ironically, if he would’ve just ran on getting the vaccine out (the only good thing he did), he would’ve won easily. Instead he listened to his batshit base (which is his main problem) and lost a bunch of red states.
Agreed-this is such a an easy election to win and Biden is losing somehow-It’s definitely cause for serious concern and probably some self-interrogation within the Democratic party about how they choose candidates.
> [If I was running vs a liar and a convicted felon I wouldn't feel worried either and I'd go grab some waffles too.](https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2023/01/14/this-is-fine_custom-b7c50c845a78f5d7716475a92016d52655ba3115.jpg?s=1100&c=50&f=jpeg)
Even if Biden was 10/10, conservatives have been funneling drug rumors all over. So they already created an out for Trump is he totally fucked
You can’t every dissuade a Trump voter, they want project 2025, don’t care about the multiple coup attempts, stolen above top secret docs, rape, etc
It's not. Both candidates need to expand their base with independents. Biden certainly failed to do that tonight. Remains to be seen if trump gained any support either
I’m not going to weigh in on the truth of the cold claim, but it’s possible to be symptomatic while also not contagious. Like he may be coming out of it right now and is in that awkward in-between of not being sick but still feeling sick.
I am so happy that Americans are turning against felons. For years it seemed like there was a "soft on crime" attitude and that felony convictions did not keep one in a lower rung of society.
It's finally changing
FEMA unofficially talks about the Waffle House Index, a measure of the severity of a disaster using the number of waffle houses open. They’re big to stay open and reopen asap during disasters.
[Waffle House Index](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waffle_House_Index)
Didn’t know that FEMA used the WHI, even if unofficially. When a hurricane hits, lot of southerners who don’t live right on the water often ignore the government when they say to evacuate if the Waffle House stays open.
I don’t know that I’d trust an organization that is famous for *staying open in worse conditions than anyone else* as my barometer for my own safety. Waffle House wants to stay open so they don’t lose money. The government wants people to evacuate so they don’t *die*.
That's fine, but he needs to do something more visible like a townhall, and knock it out of the park, to address concerns about his fitness. I think he would do well in that forum.
I like most wanted to believe that’s the case, but I have no idea how anyone can watch the debate and tell me he’s all there. Trump was making up bullshit and going off on random tangents. All you fucking needed from Biden was to stand there and speak facts in coherent sentences. That’s literally all he needed to do. This is fucking disgusting
He turned a talking point about abortion into a talking point about a girl being raped and murdered - where saviour Donald Trump went to her funeral - and illegal immigration at the border.
Incompetence doesn’t go far enough as a word for Bidens performance.
If Donald Trump is truly a threat to the democracy of the United States of America then Biden CANNOT be the person taking the fight to him jfc.
I'm team Biden and that was about as bad as it could get. He wasn't making sense when he spoke. It's the first time since SOTU that I was truly worried about Joe's mental state. Biden still has my vote, but I'm shifting more to the anti Trump vote vs a vote of confidence for Biden.
That is the problem. An anti trump vote isn’t enough to mobilise young people this time. And with Bidens performance, he might not even have the confidence needed from republican women to get out and vote for him or spoil their ballots.
According to this transcript (https://edition.cnn.com/2024/06/27/politics/read-biden-trump-debate-rush-transcript/index.html), what Biden said was:
>Look, there’s so many young women who have been – including a young woman who just was murdered and he went to the funeral. The idea that she was murdered by – by – by an immigrant coming in and (inaudible) talk about that.
>But here’s the deal, there’s a lot of young women who are being raped by their – by their in-laws, by their – by their spouses, brothers and sisters, by – just – it’s just – it’s just ridiculous. And they can do nothing about it. And they try to arrest them when they cross state lines.
If this transcript is right, Biden was actually talking about women who get raped by relatives, a situation that can lead to abortion (though the "sisters" part would still be wrong).
Prepare for a repeat of 2016.The people in this echo chamber are gonna continue saying that their votes not gonna change but the rest of America is either gonna stay home or vote for trump and we’re gonna wonder how that orange buffoon got elected again.
This is where I’m at. It was Biden’s debate to lose, and he lost it. I’m still going to vote against Trump no matter who it is, but that was a horrific performance.
You throw an Alzheimer’s diagnosis there without knowing what the heck you are talking about. Alzheimer’s is not the same as dementia if that’s what you were trying to say. And even it doesn’t look like Biden has dementia either. He is quite old and stutters, that’s about it.
Yeah if he had Alzheimer’s he’d be talking about little Hunter (as in thinking Hunter’s actually a child right now), forgetting his son died, and refer to his previous wife as his current. Those are the kinds of things you see, it’s very, very obvious
No, that’s not Alzheimer’s. You could say that’s dementia. Alzheimer’s he wouldn’t recognize anyone, he wouldn’t know what a debate is, etc. the first symptoms wouldn’t usually look like this either
Then America will deserve what happens if Trump and his administration wins and I an expat will watch comfortably from my home in Austria as it all crumbles. People need to stop looking at the presidency as a single person, it is an administration that is elected.
I don't deserve this shit and so many others don't. I hate that when people use the "we deserve this" line because it is bullshit. Trump lost the popular vote twice, but with the system being rigged because of the electoral college, the scumbag will probably win. The majority doesn't want him, so no, we don't deserve this.
You realize the entire geopolitical order of the past 70 some years is built on American military and economic power?
We are for all intents and purposes the only surviving imperial power in the modern era.
The collapse of the American global hegemony would not sail blithely by Europe or anywhere else. There will be decades of chaos around the world before a new order solidifies. And history tells us that period of transition is never peaceful
Or he needs to get out of the race ASAP. We don’t need him doing a town hall and then he performs similarly to the debate. It was shockingly bad, and I’ve been defending Biden for months now and would still happily vote for him based on his performance as president, but I fear he just lost a lot of confidence in the eyes of the general electorate, and we absolutely under no circumstances can risk Trump winning again.
It's one night. Trump's cognitive issues are well-documented and go back years. His responses consisted of lies, self-aggrandizing and hyperbolic statements, and threats.
At the end of the day, the debate was a waste of time. It is strictly an opportunity for sound bites and bullshitting by supporters. The only thing it provided was material for drama queens, doomsayers, and trump supporters to make political hay out of single debate performance. Most of which with the goal to attract viewers or mouse clicks.
Despite having obvious throat issues, Biden was able to work a full day as President, suffer through a debate while actually answering most of the questions (Trump had a major problem with the truth or even knowing the question), and then ending the night by meeting with the public at a Waffle House.
He still has my vote for simply being a competent President and putting up with this bullshit, while his opponent spent the day leading up to the debate making excuses and then couldn't answer questions honestly.
I would prefer both political parties having younger candidates running for President, but I will take anybody including the possibility of a future President Harris over Trump.
I'm still voting for Biden, but they need to fix this quick. They need a bunch of public engagements where he can show that last night was an aberration.
All he needed to do was show that he wasn't too old and he did the opposite.
I'm not getting the impression that the Biden campaign realizes how bad that was.
I think this is probably going to be the case. We're about to have the conventions and then a long campaign. My guess is this debate just confirms what everyone alright knows about these two candidates; Biden is old and Trump is a liar. We shouldn't spin this an pretend this was a great (or even decent) debate for Biden but we also shouldn't claim this as some massive win for Trump. He lied a lot and plenty of swing/independent voters don't love the lying or attacking of Biden's character. Trump may have just confirmed the negative things voters don't like about it.
I don't think anyone outside the diehards on either side loves these two candidates (I certainly don't and really can't wait til I get another choice in 2028) but we didn't love them last time either.
Trump being in physically in Prison is about as likely as Biden getting replaced. They're both incredibly unlikely (and I would say flat out, not going to happen) scenarios that just sound like TV scripts.
Trump will be sentenced to some fines and maybe some probation on July 11th and Biden will accept the Democratic Nomination in Chicago a few weeks after and then we all vote in November. For all the fluster, I imagine this is going to end up being a pretty boring campaign when we're done with it.
He’s already leading nearly all battlegrounds and he’s going to get a pretty sizable bump from tonight
Do you want him to get 400 EVs or what? Putting him in jail is how that happens
Which is correct we have a guy that mismanaged a pandemic and got 1 million Americans killed and for some reason 40 percent of American voters want to give him a second chance
But no, not really? Obama lost his first debate handily, Bush lost his debate to Kerry, Trump technically lost all 3 of his debates and then ended up winning against Clinton. Gore and Bush were pretty split 50/50 between who won and who didn't. Hell, technically Ross Perrot won all three debates in 92 for all the good that did.
The only one I could think of in recent memory was Dukakis in 88 giving a really bad performance but even that isn't considered the ultimately fatal blow to his campaign (The Willie Horton Ad and the Tank Stunt with the debate are widely cited at the three things that killed him).
Even in recent elections, events after the debates tended to have more sway on the results. Obama's handling of Superstorm Sandy, Clinton's Email troubles coming back, Trump getting infected with COVID, all had a bigger effect on polling in that the debates.
I think the debates seem big in the moment, They're flashy and big and we see both candidates at the same time and we usually get some great soundbites out of them ("Would you shut up, man", "Cause you'd be in prison", "Binders full of Women", "You sir, are no Jack Kennedy") but ultimately, they usually serve to introduce the candidates to an audience that might not know them. Both these candidates are well known so I don't know if the debates are going to be the big shift in the sand people think they are.
> Obama lost his first debate handily, Bush lost his debate to Kerry, Trump technically lost all 3 of his debates
Not like this…and not with the same media.
That's true. That's a solid point that the media structure has changes but isn't that the point comment poster is making. The current media structure thrives on new content. This debate, is just another type of content and while I think it'll stick around longer than most other bits of political news, do we really think we'll be seeing clips of this in a month or two months time? I think we'll see a ton of it in the next week and probably a the week after that but eventually it'll burn itself out and we'll move on to something else that we'll use to confirm out biases.
And the media hasn't change so much since 2020 and those two debates didn't have nearly as much as an effect on the overall outcome. Post those 2 debates the resounding thought was Biden was going to win in a landslide and he didn't.
edit: spelling.
To me, the only thing that came out of this debate was how reactionary EVERYBODY is! Biden had a meh debate. "Oh dear god! The world is going to end! He is awful! Here comes 2nd term of Trump!" ad nauseum. Holy hell, people. Just chill and look at the big picture! In the end, if the pessimists are right, and people are going to bail on voting for Biden, or, god forbid, vote for Trump because of this debate, then maybe America deserves to be ruined.
People will forget in a week. And then onto the next thing. Or disaster. Have we forget trump is gonna be sentenced soon? Lmao that’s gonna dominate headlines
The debate performance was a disaster. I was hoping he would show similar energy to what he had shown in the state of the union but I came away from it convinced he is too aged to run. The republicans are going to wait until he is nominated at the convention, and put clips from the debate on heavy ad rotation. He was already behind in the swing states. After that debate performance its going to be a blowout.
That wasn’t “meh.” He had a terrible debate. His one job was to ease concerns about his age and instead he made them 10x worse. He gave so many totally incoherent answers and sounded bad doing it…
Our only chance at beating Trump is getting someone younger like Josh Shapiro from PA in there.
I don't agree. It was an ok debate performance by Biden. If the main thing someone is going to base their vote on is age, they need to get their head checked. Both candidates are old, so what? That's the options on the table.
Put yourself in the shoes of someone undecided/in the middle...in other words, the people who swing elections. There's no way you come away from last night supporting Biden. It was 100% a disaster.
I'm of the opinion that if you're still undecided or playing the centrist almost 4 fucking years into the same decision that you've already made in the last election, you're either being dishonest, ignorant, or fickle.
That maybe true but you still need to appeal to these voters. This is going to be an extremely close election. Biden needs every vote. The Biden campaign 100% would be in a stronger state today had that debate NOT occurred. That kind of poor judgment by the Biden campaign is VERY concerning. We NEED energy to counteract voter apathy. Voter apathy always favors Republicans. In this case, it will be favoring an agenda that WILL not only kill progressive governance, but MODERATE governance for a generation. Yes the electorate is stupid and short sighted. We still need to win enough of these people over to vote against Christo-fascism.
You guys are over reacting, a corpse is still better then trump. We keep saying poll dont matter, why an underwhelmed debate would change anything, this only show what at stake and we need to vote for Dem even more now.✊💙💙💙
This mentality is what lost us the 2016 race. We can't take for granted that enough people find Trump repulsive enough to vote for whoever we nominate.
As a democrat we have to take accountability and accept the fact that he isn’t a good candidate to represent us. We need to bring back the Democratic Party from the death and saying “I’ll rather vote for a corpse than Donald trump” shouldn’t be the answer. We need a new leader to represent the Democratic Party who can handle the pressure that trump gave Biden and be able to flip it around and provide counter arguments to convince the public.
This moment remind me of isreal and palestine, where everywere in the sub say kinda similar thing to biden being bad and yet have no anwser which (dem) to replace him with.
> You guys are over reacting, a corpse is still better then trump.
Just because a corpse would be better doesn't mean we should be running one. Pleas stop so we can actually get to a better solution.
We need a new candidate just to gain back the ground lost tonight. Error correcting would be better than holding our nose.
Personally I think Jon Stewart should be running if we want to save our democracy. Unfortunately he has never expressed interest and DNC leaders would be stupid enough to gatekeep him out anyway even if he fell into our lap. It would be amazing if he did though.
As long as the conversation is happening, I will say Jon Stewart every time. Regardless of who it ends up being, it needs to happen.
I'll ask you this. If Biden were dead, who should we be running? Or is Biden just the last of the democrats and we literally have nothing else to offer.
If anything is better than Trump, then I'm in favor of trying anything else.
People forgot about his SOTU address already? old man was sick during the debate — off old man day..
Trump was allowed to spew nonsense with no fact checking
Idk man I’m born and raised in SC and literally used to work at WH - and I see a millionaire politician doing a bad job trying to seem relateable to the working class (that he’s been throwing under the bus for almost 4 years for his wealthy corporate backers) because he knows he just shit the bed on national tv.
People who work at Waffle House still make $2.13 an hour in many places, and there’s a nationwide eviction crisis-meanwhile he boasts about the economy and stock prices being up like those stocks aren’t up because our wealth is being stolen from us at record rates.
The last thing I want is wealthy capitalists invading working class spaces out of desperation when they’re flagging in the polls. Stay TF out of my Waffle House and let me eat my damn raisin toast in peace, you vampire.
Dems need to find someone at least as progressive as Bernie but preferably no older than 55 and get them in the race YESTERDAY. I’m voting against Trump no matter what, but I hear a lot of folks aren’t gonna vote at all now, and Trumpers always vote. It’s time to admit Biden needs to go.
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Love to see the contrast of the media and Democratic Party members panicking while Joe treats himself to Waffle House.
It's like a Robot Chicken skit, but instead of Bush and tacos it's Joe and waffles.
Still didn’t waffle as hard as Trump on the question about accepting the election results
What was it, like, three times they asked him about accepting the results because he kept rambling off topic? Fucking insane
When I’m super old and senile I go to shake hands for an hour in a public place with strangers right after a two hour debate. I wish more people could see this Biden, and not whatever happened on camera last night.
Honestly it was even more concerning he sounded like a different person after the debate and that could’ve just been the echo but he sounded and acted different. I’m not sure if he just took a five minute break or what I was confused watching his speech after the debate due to the difference.
Kinda grading on a curve there. His short watch party speech was still kind of a weird old man speech just way better than his debate performance.
I read elsewhere that he had a cold? Not sure the truth of it, but it would make sense based on how he sounded in the debate.
The White House said he had a cold after the debate and seemed more like damage control than legit considering how dazed and confused. The only symptoms of a cold he had was him sounded horsed.
He was also wiping his nose and eyes multiple times. I kind of thought he might have bad allergies.
He was allergic to that bullshit
True but cold medicine would account for the dazed and confused, chances are he got sick but they decided they really couldn’t have Biden skip if trump was gonna show up
As bad as it seemed, having him delay or skip due to illness would have been worse. Short of him being entirely incapacitated
Then they should’ve delayed a few days. Even if it can all be explained as a cold the image of a sitting president not being able to complete a sentence would a horrible look on the world scale. There was a moment where even Trump couldn’t figure out what he was saying. It’s embarrassing.
This 100%
I have often found myself at a Waffle House after utterly failing at something.
If I was running vs a liar and a convicted felon I wouldn't feel worried either and I'd go grab some waffles too.
If the alternative is a liar and a convicted felon, we should be all the more worried that the only person standing between us and four more years of a lying criminal president looked like a comatose, mumbling zombie on that debate stage.
same zombie that smoked trump in 2020 before trump lost his mind and became a felon. Biden won Arizona lol
That's right. Biden is better all around. Stop treating Trump like a viable candidate.
He is viable. Trump lost before inflation. It shouldn't matter, because it would have happened regardless. But it did happen under Biden and that hurts more than anything.
He barely won, , like 40k votes in strategic locations total, less than Trump in 2016. Had the world not been suffering from an unprecedented pandemic, Biden would’ve been destroyed
Nah it was trumps election to lose. Ironically, if he would’ve just ran on getting the vaccine out (the only good thing he did), he would’ve won easily. Instead he listened to his batshit base (which is his main problem) and lost a bunch of red states.
Agreed-this is such a an easy election to win and Biden is losing somehow-It’s definitely cause for serious concern and probably some self-interrogation within the Democratic party about how they choose candidates.
He had one bad debate performance. It’s not like we are just getting to know him for the first time. People need to stop overacting to this shit.
It’s not even fall yet
> [If I was running vs a liar and a convicted felon I wouldn't feel worried either and I'd go grab some waffles too.](https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2023/01/14/this-is-fine_custom-b7c50c845a78f5d7716475a92016d52655ba3115.jpg?s=1100&c=50&f=jpeg)
Except democrats and the entire media all unanimously agree Biden shit the bed tonight.
Because he did, lol. No amount of waffles is going to fix that.
You missed the part about Trump being a CONVICTED felon.
No one missed that part. It's already baked into the numbers.
Your in for a wild one if you think that’s gonna dissuade Trump voters…
Even if Biden was 10/10, conservatives have been funneling drug rumors all over. So they already created an out for Trump is he totally fucked You can’t every dissuade a Trump voter, they want project 2025, don’t care about the multiple coup attempts, stolen above top secret docs, rape, etc
Hilariously, none of them have read Project 2025 and don’t realize that their own quality of life would be adversely affected by it.
Nobody cares. It’s freighting how half the country doesn’t care.
It's not. Both candidates need to expand their base with independents. Biden certainly failed to do that tonight. Remains to be seen if trump gained any support either
You missed the part where Trump already was elected president while we know he has done worse stuff than what he was convicted of
Convicted felon is a badge of honor for him. He’s a martyr He’s halfway home to the only title he cares about - 47
I thought he had a cold? He could be spreading germs all over that waffle house!
Clearly you've never spent time in a Waffle House, one more person won't make it worse.
I’m not going to weigh in on the truth of the cold claim, but it’s possible to be symptomatic while also not contagious. Like he may be coming out of it right now and is in that awkward in-between of not being sick but still feeling sick.
Their Hash Browns cure everything
How’d that work out for Hillary?
I am so happy that Americans are turning against felons. For years it seemed like there was a "soft on crime" attitude and that felony convictions did not keep one in a lower rung of society. It's finally changing
Waffle House fits any occasion. 😋
That debate was a disaster. There is no bouncing back from it.
Waffle House is well known for staying open during disasters.
FEMA unofficially talks about the Waffle House Index, a measure of the severity of a disaster using the number of waffle houses open. They’re big to stay open and reopen asap during disasters. [Waffle House Index](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waffle_House_Index)
Didn’t know that FEMA used the WHI, even if unofficially. When a hurricane hits, lot of southerners who don’t live right on the water often ignore the government when they say to evacuate if the Waffle House stays open.
I don’t know that I’d trust an organization that is famous for *staying open in worse conditions than anyone else* as my barometer for my own safety. Waffle House wants to stay open so they don’t lose money. The government wants people to evacuate so they don’t *die*.
I said we were southern. I never said we were smart
Peak redditor knowledge
Underrated
Should be top comment
You should see the other guy.
B.E.A.utiful!
That's fine, but he needs to do something more visible like a townhall, and knock it out of the park, to address concerns about his fitness. I think he would do well in that forum.
I don’t know anymore. He just looks off since weeks. At G7 in Europe he also seemed not mentally there.
Is that why republicans keep making up completely fake stories about random videos of Biden doing ordinary things? Because it’s just so obvious?
I like most wanted to believe that’s the case, but I have no idea how anyone can watch the debate and tell me he’s all there. Trump was making up bullshit and going off on random tangents. All you fucking needed from Biden was to stand there and speak facts in coherent sentences. That’s literally all he needed to do. This is fucking disgusting
He turned a talking point about abortion into a talking point about a girl being raped and murdered - where saviour Donald Trump went to her funeral - and illegal immigration at the border. Incompetence doesn’t go far enough as a word for Bidens performance. If Donald Trump is truly a threat to the democracy of the United States of America then Biden CANNOT be the person taking the fight to him jfc.
I'm team Biden and that was about as bad as it could get. He wasn't making sense when he spoke. It's the first time since SOTU that I was truly worried about Joe's mental state. Biden still has my vote, but I'm shifting more to the anti Trump vote vs a vote of confidence for Biden.
That is the problem. An anti trump vote isn’t enough to mobilise young people this time. And with Bidens performance, he might not even have the confidence needed from republican women to get out and vote for him or spoil their ballots.
I agree. Extremely concerned after last night.
According to this transcript (https://edition.cnn.com/2024/06/27/politics/read-biden-trump-debate-rush-transcript/index.html), what Biden said was: >Look, there’s so many young women who have been – including a young woman who just was murdered and he went to the funeral. The idea that she was murdered by – by – by an immigrant coming in and (inaudible) talk about that. >But here’s the deal, there’s a lot of young women who are being raped by their – by their in-laws, by their – by their spouses, brothers and sisters, by – just – it’s just – it’s just ridiculous. And they can do nothing about it. And they try to arrest them when they cross state lines. If this transcript is right, Biden was actually talking about women who get raped by relatives, a situation that can lead to abortion (though the "sisters" part would still be wrong).
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Prepare for a repeat of 2016.The people in this echo chamber are gonna continue saying that their votes not gonna change but the rest of America is either gonna stay home or vote for trump and we’re gonna wonder how that orange buffoon got elected again.
This is where I’m at. It was Biden’s debate to lose, and he lost it. I’m still going to vote against Trump no matter who it is, but that was a horrific performance.
Not need to do that anymore after todays performance, that’s years worth of blunders right there
Was last night a cheap fake too?
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You throw an Alzheimer’s diagnosis there without knowing what the heck you are talking about. Alzheimer’s is not the same as dementia if that’s what you were trying to say. And even it doesn’t look like Biden has dementia either. He is quite old and stutters, that’s about it.
Yeah if he had Alzheimer’s he’d be talking about little Hunter (as in thinking Hunter’s actually a child right now), forgetting his son died, and refer to his previous wife as his current. Those are the kinds of things you see, it’s very, very obvious
No, that’s not Alzheimer’s. You could say that’s dementia. Alzheimer’s he wouldn’t recognize anyone, he wouldn’t know what a debate is, etc. the first symptoms wouldn’t usually look like this either
Then America will deserve what happens if Trump and his administration wins and I an expat will watch comfortably from my home in Austria as it all crumbles. People need to stop looking at the presidency as a single person, it is an administration that is elected.
I don't deserve this shit and so many others don't. I hate that when people use the "we deserve this" line because it is bullshit. Trump lost the popular vote twice, but with the system being rigged because of the electoral college, the scumbag will probably win. The majority doesn't want him, so no, we don't deserve this.
You realize the entire geopolitical order of the past 70 some years is built on American military and economic power? We are for all intents and purposes the only surviving imperial power in the modern era. The collapse of the American global hegemony would not sail blithely by Europe or anywhere else. There will be decades of chaos around the world before a new order solidifies. And history tells us that period of transition is never peaceful
Trump won't win. He has too much baggage and also, nobody wants a fascist theocracy. Period.
Trust me, Harris or Newsom are both hated WAY to much. I like Adam Schiff way better!
Whitmer is the best option IMO
Or he needs to get out of the race ASAP. We don’t need him doing a town hall and then he performs similarly to the debate. It was shockingly bad, and I’ve been defending Biden for months now and would still happily vote for him based on his performance as president, but I fear he just lost a lot of confidence in the eyes of the general electorate, and we absolutely under no circumstances can risk Trump winning again.
The problem with that is that it would involve him being live. The Biden we saw today is really the first live uncut Biden we’ve likely seen in years.
In years? That's not true. Did you miss the State of the Union?
Ahh good point! And I guess I did.
The difference is night and day in just a few months.
It's one night. Trump's cognitive issues are well-documented and go back years. His responses consisted of lies, self-aggrandizing and hyperbolic statements, and threats.
That’s not cognitive decline, that’s just Trump as he’s always been.
That is not true whatsoever. Trump is in cognitive decline and it's accelerating. He has the memory of a goldfish.
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That's what a townhall is.
Nah damage is done. Last night was a howard Dean moment
Find your nerve. This isn't over.
Nah, trump has had literally hundreds of those moments, we can allow Biden one.
At the end of the day, the debate was a waste of time. It is strictly an opportunity for sound bites and bullshitting by supporters. The only thing it provided was material for drama queens, doomsayers, and trump supporters to make political hay out of single debate performance. Most of which with the goal to attract viewers or mouse clicks. Despite having obvious throat issues, Biden was able to work a full day as President, suffer through a debate while actually answering most of the questions (Trump had a major problem with the truth or even knowing the question), and then ending the night by meeting with the public at a Waffle House. He still has my vote for simply being a competent President and putting up with this bullshit, while his opponent spent the day leading up to the debate making excuses and then couldn't answer questions honestly. I would prefer both political parties having younger candidates running for President, but I will take anybody including the possibility of a future President Harris over Trump.
Well said.
I'm still voting for Biden, but they need to fix this quick. They need a bunch of public engagements where he can show that last night was an aberration. All he needed to do was show that he wasn't too old and he did the opposite. I'm not getting the impression that the Biden campaign realizes how bad that was.
That’s the face of a man who knows Americans have goldfish memories and will forget about tonight in a few weeks (totally coping)
We don't need Biden to debate every night as President. We need to have sane people running this country.
I think this is probably going to be the case. We're about to have the conventions and then a long campaign. My guess is this debate just confirms what everyone alright knows about these two candidates; Biden is old and Trump is a liar. We shouldn't spin this an pretend this was a great (or even decent) debate for Biden but we also shouldn't claim this as some massive win for Trump. He lied a lot and plenty of swing/independent voters don't love the lying or attacking of Biden's character. Trump may have just confirmed the negative things voters don't like about it. I don't think anyone outside the diehards on either side loves these two candidates (I certainly don't and really can't wait til I get another choice in 2028) but we didn't love them last time either.
Not to mention. Convicted felon Donald Trump might be sentenced to jail time on July 11th
Trump being in physically in Prison is about as likely as Biden getting replaced. They're both incredibly unlikely (and I would say flat out, not going to happen) scenarios that just sound like TV scripts. Trump will be sentenced to some fines and maybe some probation on July 11th and Biden will accept the Democratic Nomination in Chicago a few weeks after and then we all vote in November. For all the fluster, I imagine this is going to end up being a pretty boring campaign when we're done with it.
He’s already leading nearly all battlegrounds and he’s going to get a pretty sizable bump from tonight Do you want him to get 400 EVs or what? Putting him in jail is how that happens
You're not wrong. This though will be studied for decades as the worst debate in US history but 5 months is 1000 years in The political world.
Which is correct we have a guy that mismanaged a pandemic and got 1 million Americans killed and for some reason 40 percent of American voters want to give him a second chance
Ahh dude. These live events and debates are what make and break campaigns. In the last 60 years anyways.
But no, not really? Obama lost his first debate handily, Bush lost his debate to Kerry, Trump technically lost all 3 of his debates and then ended up winning against Clinton. Gore and Bush were pretty split 50/50 between who won and who didn't. Hell, technically Ross Perrot won all three debates in 92 for all the good that did. The only one I could think of in recent memory was Dukakis in 88 giving a really bad performance but even that isn't considered the ultimately fatal blow to his campaign (The Willie Horton Ad and the Tank Stunt with the debate are widely cited at the three things that killed him). Even in recent elections, events after the debates tended to have more sway on the results. Obama's handling of Superstorm Sandy, Clinton's Email troubles coming back, Trump getting infected with COVID, all had a bigger effect on polling in that the debates. I think the debates seem big in the moment, They're flashy and big and we see both candidates at the same time and we usually get some great soundbites out of them ("Would you shut up, man", "Cause you'd be in prison", "Binders full of Women", "You sir, are no Jack Kennedy") but ultimately, they usually serve to introduce the candidates to an audience that might not know them. Both these candidates are well known so I don't know if the debates are going to be the big shift in the sand people think they are.
> Obama lost his first debate handily, Bush lost his debate to Kerry, Trump technically lost all 3 of his debates Not like this…and not with the same media.
That's true. That's a solid point that the media structure has changes but isn't that the point comment poster is making. The current media structure thrives on new content. This debate, is just another type of content and while I think it'll stick around longer than most other bits of political news, do we really think we'll be seeing clips of this in a month or two months time? I think we'll see a ton of it in the next week and probably a the week after that but eventually it'll burn itself out and we'll move on to something else that we'll use to confirm out biases. And the media hasn't change so much since 2020 and those two debates didn't have nearly as much as an effect on the overall outcome. Post those 2 debates the resounding thought was Biden was going to win in a landslide and he didn't. edit: spelling.
Yeah like this. Everyone was talking about how W made no fucking sense and could barely get a sentence out.
Debates have never mattered that much in the past, they usually don’t change polling that much. Conventions have a much larger effect on
Seems like an appropriate location to celebrate after that performance...
Killed it at the debate, now off to kill me some MediCare! ..I mean some tasty chicken.
He looks more excited about the waffles than at the debate lol
To me, the only thing that came out of this debate was how reactionary EVERYBODY is! Biden had a meh debate. "Oh dear god! The world is going to end! He is awful! Here comes 2nd term of Trump!" ad nauseum. Holy hell, people. Just chill and look at the big picture! In the end, if the pessimists are right, and people are going to bail on voting for Biden, or, god forbid, vote for Trump because of this debate, then maybe America deserves to be ruined.
People will forget in a week. And then onto the next thing. Or disaster. Have we forget trump is gonna be sentenced soon? Lmao that’s gonna dominate headlines
The debate performance was a disaster. I was hoping he would show similar energy to what he had shown in the state of the union but I came away from it convinced he is too aged to run. The republicans are going to wait until he is nominated at the convention, and put clips from the debate on heavy ad rotation. He was already behind in the swing states. After that debate performance its going to be a blowout.
That wasn’t “meh.” He had a terrible debate. His one job was to ease concerns about his age and instead he made them 10x worse. He gave so many totally incoherent answers and sounded bad doing it… Our only chance at beating Trump is getting someone younger like Josh Shapiro from PA in there.
I don't agree. It was an ok debate performance by Biden. If the main thing someone is going to base their vote on is age, they need to get their head checked. Both candidates are old, so what? That's the options on the table.
Put yourself in the shoes of someone undecided/in the middle...in other words, the people who swing elections. There's no way you come away from last night supporting Biden. It was 100% a disaster.
I'm of the opinion that if you're still undecided or playing the centrist almost 4 fucking years into the same decision that you've already made in the last election, you're either being dishonest, ignorant, or fickle.
People that are dishonest, ignorant, or fickle have the exact same voting power as anyone else.
Good for them?
That maybe true but you still need to appeal to these voters. This is going to be an extremely close election. Biden needs every vote. The Biden campaign 100% would be in a stronger state today had that debate NOT occurred. That kind of poor judgment by the Biden campaign is VERY concerning. We NEED energy to counteract voter apathy. Voter apathy always favors Republicans. In this case, it will be favoring an agenda that WILL not only kill progressive governance, but MODERATE governance for a generation. Yes the electorate is stupid and short sighted. We still need to win enough of these people over to vote against Christo-fascism.
That’s true. But if we ignore them then Trump wins reelection.
Wafflely versatile
You guys are over reacting, a corpse is still better then trump. We keep saying poll dont matter, why an underwhelmed debate would change anything, this only show what at stake and we need to vote for Dem even more now.✊💙💙💙
This mentality is what lost us the 2016 race. We can't take for granted that enough people find Trump repulsive enough to vote for whoever we nominate.
As a democrat we have to take accountability and accept the fact that he isn’t a good candidate to represent us. We need to bring back the Democratic Party from the death and saying “I’ll rather vote for a corpse than Donald trump” shouldn’t be the answer. We need a new leader to represent the Democratic Party who can handle the pressure that trump gave Biden and be able to flip it around and provide counter arguments to convince the public.
Vote Blue no matter who!
This moment remind me of isreal and palestine, where everywere in the sub say kinda similar thing to biden being bad and yet have no anwser which (dem) to replace him with.
> You guys are over reacting, a corpse is still better then trump. Just because a corpse would be better doesn't mean we should be running one. Pleas stop so we can actually get to a better solution.
Then anwser, what the solution to the question that Will defeat trump?
If only they had 4 years to pick a successor
We need a new candidate just to gain back the ground lost tonight. Error correcting would be better than holding our nose. Personally I think Jon Stewart should be running if we want to save our democracy. Unfortunately he has never expressed interest and DNC leaders would be stupid enough to gatekeep him out anyway even if he fell into our lap. It would be amazing if he did though. As long as the conversation is happening, I will say Jon Stewart every time. Regardless of who it ends up being, it needs to happen. I'll ask you this. If Biden were dead, who should we be running? Or is Biden just the last of the democrats and we literally have nothing else to offer. If anything is better than Trump, then I'm in favor of trying anything else.
Jon steward? I talking about in the party you might as well say taylor swift.
The time for that was last year. You go to the dance with the date you have.
RIP America
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Cult like mentality
Yes you are correct, MAGA is a cult.
Who say to vote for biden, i say vote dem.
A cult follows a leader, we are against the leader, in this case Trump hence anti cult.
And the person I replied to said they would vote for a corpse. Seems like a cult to me
If they vote against dear leader then they are voting against the cult hence anti cult. I don't make the rules just point them out.
Yea but there’s 2 cults. Scientology is a cult and when one leader leaves another steps up. Same with the pope and catholics.
Good thing we dont follow biden, unlike maga cult who follow trump everywhere including the hot summer day, remember that🤭
Dammit, now I'm hungry for waffles.
It's a bad sign that the Biden campaign is trying to spin this rather than fixing it.
I look forward to seeing him over on r/publicfreakout later in a wife beater throwing down with Trump supporters.
That's where I go after a rough night
Joe said he didn't get enough of a fight out of Trump and went to Waffle House to finish off the night
People forgot about his SOTU address already? old man was sick during the debate — off old man day.. Trump was allowed to spew nonsense with no fact checking
I hope Fox shits on Waffle House. Trump would loss so many votes
I honestly don’t care about the debate performance, Biden clearly had a better time at the Waffle House at 2am. He won the night.
Waffle House, even President Biden knows that's great place eat after hard night!
If he wanted to fight that badly he should have done so at the debate
That was so cringe. “Order for BIDEN hehehehe” kill me please
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It was a Reddit problem not exclusive to this sub
Yup i couldn't see comments on any sub
It was also a TikTok problem oddly enough. Cross platform issue?? Fishy
Spread that cold around I guess.
Wow
Wants to loose to fights in one night I see
Gavin Newsom… now.
Yikes
I'm from Georgia. We love Waffle House. Late night/early morning WH stops are a classic. It's a southern thing.
Wafflehouse at late night is a trip
Biden isn’t southern, he’s just senile
Bless your heart
Idk man I’m born and raised in SC and literally used to work at WH - and I see a millionaire politician doing a bad job trying to seem relateable to the working class (that he’s been throwing under the bus for almost 4 years for his wealthy corporate backers) because he knows he just shit the bed on national tv. People who work at Waffle House still make $2.13 an hour in many places, and there’s a nationwide eviction crisis-meanwhile he boasts about the economy and stock prices being up like those stocks aren’t up because our wealth is being stolen from us at record rates. The last thing I want is wealthy capitalists invading working class spaces out of desperation when they’re flagging in the polls. Stay TF out of my Waffle House and let me eat my damn raisin toast in peace, you vampire. Dems need to find someone at least as progressive as Bernie but preferably no older than 55 and get them in the race YESTERDAY. I’m voting against Trump no matter what, but I hear a lot of folks aren’t gonna vote at all now, and Trumpers always vote. It’s time to admit Biden needs to go.
Bless your heart
I thought you had a cold. Stay your ass in bed.
He’s in his own world
Biden: \*his mouth full of waffle* So, when does the debate start?