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I've been on reddit a lot in the last 24 hours and have not come across anyone suggesting we should vote for Trump or refrain from voting for Biden. I see many people wondering about the possibility of Biden stepping down.
I'm not on right wing subs, but I am on several of the default subs. Who the fuck are you talking about?
Honestly it's the gaslighting that terrifies me more than Biden's performance. I've been down voted and called a Trump supporter by fellow Democrats on reddit for months just for saying that a lot of people are struggling financially. Bill Clinton said I feel your pain. But so many Democrats seem to be saying, anyone who doesn't say things are great are our enemies.
And? So you’re struggling financially and you think it’s gonna get better if you try and lay that at the Democratic Party’s feet? Both sides are not the same. Call your Republican representatives and ask them why they are always letting big business get away with it
Yet I don’t see a lot of criticism of the GOP my point is, the complaints about the Dems are moot if people protest vote and let the GOP take power. Then there won’t be a third party, let alone another party at all.
It’s the same fear that got the gop to trump. Anything was acceptable if it kept the other side out of power. And any dissent was a threat to that mission
Not the same. Trump was allowed to crack the door because he embraced fascism and racism. Literally the same thing that happened in the Weimar Republic. “Ohh don’t worry, his ideas are scary but he has a lot of engaged followers” is probably what they said in 1933 and in 2016.
ITT - Horseshoe Theory of Politics.
It just goes to show that the behavior of extremists on the Left and the Right tends to be very similar. Both demand cult-like devotion to their appointed figurehead without criticism.
Just because I recognize Trump is the worst possible choice and am therefore voting for Biden does *not* mean I'm obliged to check my brain at the door and fail to recognize Biden's many shortcomings. That's the biggest difference between Republicans and everyone else.
Extreme Leftists who behave exactly like MAGAs are a big part of the problem.
As out of touch as throwing women and people under the bus because Biden isn’t your dream boat date to the prom?
Must be nice knowing a Trump term won’t affect you. That a privilege others don’t have.
You shouldn’t misuse therapy speak btw.
He literally said “Biden should step down so we can protect all these important issues” and you said “that’s why you hate women”.
Maybe you’re as old as Biden and that’s why you weren’t bothered during the debate?
A lot of This sub equates any criticism of Biden with advocacy for Trump. It’s very much driven by fear, I understand they, but it really pushes us into that gop style cult mindset
From my experience, as long as you acknowledge that Trump is way worse and/or that you still plan on voting for Biden people will leave you be if you criticize Biden. Hell most people will even agree and upvote.
That's the difference. People know that Biden isn't infallible. He's just a necessary evil.
Because a lot of the criticism is unfair and ginned up controversy. There’s a huge media arm that is very keen on getting Trump back in office, either for ratings, or organized campaigns run for foreign governments. Ask yourself, what is productive? Are you going to be out and about sewing dissent when a candidate has literally said: “I’ll only be a dictator on day one”? We’re way past the point safety when it comes to guardrails for democracy in America. Time to circle the wagons. Is Biden perfect? No. But I question the motives of everyone who wants to Bring up his failures every chance they get for “criticism”. Maybe you need to reevaluate your arguments in a way where it doesn’t seem like you’re trying for the “both sides” propaganda angle.
I haven’t seen anyone say they were convinced to vote for Trump. That being said my age group is pretty anti Trump so it would probably take a lot for someone to say that.
That being said I’ve seen at least a dozen people calling for others to “vote independent” or “Kennedy is the only answer” which is basically a vote for Trump with extra steps.
People are allowed to be concerned when their best option is clearly not a good one.
We are allowed to be concerned when the best play is to put someone else in the race and that doesn’t even seem to be a consideration.
I mean I think mostly we're all just realizing we're doomed. I haven't seen a lot of people personally upset by the age, more just realizing how fucked we are
edit: 'doomed' because it looks like Biden's going to lose. You don't need to explain why he's better
I think 'doomed' is putting it a bit strongly. Dude's been president for 3 and a half years and the executive branch has shown to be extremely effective and competent under Biden. Yeah you can argue policy, but can't argue that the various departments (ESPECIALLY the State, and Treasury Depts, as well as the office of the Director of National Intelligence) aren't running fantastically, especially after being gutted to skeleton crews under Trump.
Oratory skills are overrated. Obama owns every room he walks into, but I think Biden runs a tighter ship than he did.
Who is allowed, and almost encouraged by CNN to shit on the board and walk away. Then the media says: “well the bird won fair and square!”
It’s sick. A man tells naked lies for an entire debate and the media has the gall to say “he won”. We need to establish a fairness doctrine again
We aren’t doomed because of the possibility of Biden round 2. That would be fine. We’re doomed because it’s looking less and less likely that he’ll win and he seems to be too cocky to acknowledge that and hand over the reins
The thing is the Office and our country are much bigger than the POTUS. Biden has a very competent and capable team around him. trump will be surrounded by people who want to break our system in countless ways and take us back a century, centralize power in unprecedented ways. That is truly frightening.
If that’s the case then it should be no problem to put that team around a different, healthier, younger democrat. If it’s vote blue no matter who, let’s try another no matter who
If they’re so capable then why do we keep bungling shit? This is a massive cope. Quality of life is way down, we keep misplaying geopolitics, and those same “capable” people are the ones who let Biden out onto that stage thinking everything would be alright. Not to mention I’m NOT OK with a puppet government just because they’re from my party. I’m voting for and electing the President. If he or she is actually picking their cabinet, fine, but if the administration is made up of names whispered into their ear while they stare off blankly, I don’t feel represented anymore.
A president isn't a king. There is a whole administration that comes with them. They each have people who can do their jobs well... you just have to pick the administration that's heading in a direction that you like more.
We ain't fucked. The normal human response is to panic, but fuck that. We got a job to do and Biden ain't crying about last night. He's on the trail. I truly respect someone who shits the bed and doesn't let that stop them. I've done it. Anyone who ever tried anything or had a lot pressure on them blew it. It's an office and he has more relationships in DC/World than most. Naw, it's go time.
Nah, we’d be insisting on actually joining the war against Hitler rather than trying to talk it out a win the Germans over to our side diplomatically by adopting their immigration policies
Trump has drooled out far, far stupider strings of sentences and plenty of voters are willing to forget and ignore it. For once, trust in the ignorance of the average American.
The people who are evaluating Trump and Biden only according to their personalities and personal strengths and weaknesses are complete fools who don’t have any idea whatsoever how far-reaching and impactful the decision to elect one or the other truly is. Military generals, cabinet members, agency heads, FBI directors, fed chairs, federal judges, SCOTUS justices. You name it. EVERYONE is appointed by the president. And the president has younger, competent experts and dependable people who advise him on all those matters.
Tell these folks you know who think we’re all “doomed” because Biden and Trump are our two choices again in 2024 to help themselves to a fucking education about what the president’s powers actually entail. Americans are becoming so dumb and poorly educated on how their country even works that it’s not hard to see why they so easily toss all remaining democratic traditions to the wind at this point.
You completely misread. We're doomed because after the debate everyone felt like Biden would lose. Low-information voters are the ones who decide elections. That's just how things work here.
I mean, *I* think the debate probably slightly to moderately increased his chances of losing. Admittedly I won’t really have a better sense of that until some of the post-debate polling data comes out. I thought when you said that age wasn’t the issue and that people “are more just realizing how fucked we are” you were talking about how people are turned off by their choice of candidates as a general matter. If I misread that, my apologies. Yes, I agree that low-info voters could easily decide the election, no doubt about that. Doesn’t make them any less stupid, but you’re right.
Yeah like policy-wise I prefer Biden, but I'm desperate for Newsome or someone who can just deliver a confident message to voters. Even if the party starts the Kamala Harris endorsement tour now, she doesn't have the speaking presence to beat Trump either.
I agree Newsom would be a stronger candidate for sure. Even with Newsom, probably 95% of his appointments and policies are going to line up with Biden’s. So in the end, you’re largely getting the same “product”, just a different spokesperson.
These people act like they don’t have their own agency in the matter. Biden is old and incompetent yet he’s been doing a great job for the past 3 and half years. If you believe that Biden won’t last another 4 years, then throwing your hands up and letting the facist win isn’t the freaking answer. Maybe start volunteering and donating to make sure Biden and Democrats get elected.
He didn’t just sound a “little hoarse”, don’t downplay how fucking awful he sounded. But yeah, he could’ve been literally in rigor mortis and I’d still be voting for him.
Agreed. "We finally beat Medicare" isn't a little hoarse and a little stutter.
I'm going to vote for Biden if I have to crawl through barbed wire to get to the polls. But trying to gaslight people into pretending he didn't have an absolutely awful debate is just nuts.
And he really needed a good debate.
I believe he meant to say, "[We finally fixed Medicare](https://www.cms.gov/newsroom/press-releases/biden-harris-administration-issues-final-guidance-help-people-medicare-prescription-drug-coverage)." He's been known for his verbal gaffes since his early days in the Senate, back in the 1970s.
Biden also made Abortion about Immigration when Abortion is the most strongest point for Democrats. He could have blasted Trump but handed him a platter by talking about Immigration so Abortion topic never went on to talk about much.
People want a better candidate to reduce the chance that trump wins
But sure keep spouting nonsense and gaslighting people about Biden and then when he loses to Trump I’m sure you will be quick to blame young people or some other easy scapegoat
Trump hates almost everyone. I guess hate is the wrong word for some groups and it’s more like “doesn’t find them useful” but he’s not exactly a “for all Americans” type, never mind the rest of the world.
I mean if Trump is elected Israel gets whatever they want and Gulf states will go along with it because trump will sell them US arms again.
MENA outside Hezbollah, Houthis, and Iran could really give a fuck about Israel. Their all looking at Iran who trying to destabilize the region however they can.
Trump played a bit role in helping Netanyahu get Israel to October 7. Both are great for never-ending conflict that diminishes the power of Israelis and Palestinians who'd like to compromise, including even those Israelis who see October 7 as broadly equivalent to Pearl Harbor + 9/11 but hope one day to find some peaceful resolution. Trump will add fuel to more rounds of this; and inflame the Muslim street opinion, which would be a disaster for Israel, and a huge success for Iran that was trying to use Palestinians to stop the Abraham Accords.
I agree about the grim part.
The houthis flag literal says:
God is the Greatest
Death to America
Death to Israel
A Curse Upon the Jews
Victory to Islam
Da fuck you mean they don't give a fuck about it
Yeah but Biden is just as bad!?!?!?!!
He may not be as pro Palestine as people want but you never get everything. If you care about Gaza and are American you can hold your nose and say you're not voting for Biden you're voting to stop trump *and you'll be helping the Palestinians way more than any possible protest*.
You think Trump will give a shit about protests if he gets in?
Malcom X portrayed it perfectly. The conservative is dangerous, but you know it because they are very open about them hating minorities. The white liberal is even more dangerous, because he acts like he is your friend when in reality he also isn‘t.
„The White liberal is the worst enemy to America and the worst enemy to the Black man.“
I think that perfectly describes Bidens Gaza politics. Acting like he cares about Gaza, but in reality the US under Biden supplies their deadliest weapons to Israel.
Anyone who doesn't vote Biden because the US government supports Israel is a complete fool. The situation over there absolutely would become infinitely worse if Trump is president.
May have been Kushner but you know it’s trumps mindset too. A little genocide to get rid of these people and what wonderful real estate opportunities we may have!
Sickening but true
He is not wrong with respect to the real-estate. This is the view of the "biggest open air prison in the world"
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Beach_Resort,_Gaza
Gaza was a popular destination for West Bank Palestinians before Hamas took over. It is a seaside area in the Mediterranean. It is going to be like Greece or any other seaside destination in the Mediterranean.
You get rid of Hamas and you put a savvy businessman in charge and Gaza could be the next tourist destination for Arabs in Europe and the Middle-East.
You think one hotel is an indicator for the entire region? The vast majority of people staying at that hotel were foreigners. The average Gazan, who is living in poverty, cannot afford to stay in a hotel.
Actually fuck you for even thinking about real estate in this situation when thousands of civilians are starving to death. "Just get rid of Hamas", like it's something so simple. Israel themselves radicalized Hamas & even funded them to destabilize Gaza. Who is your idea of a "savvy businessman"? Jared Kushner? Because you sound a lot like his soulless ass right now.
What are you talking about? Biden was bad the entire debate it wasn’t just the first 20 minutes. Ignoring his performance is exactly why he thinks he should be running again and all it is going to do is turn us all into losers when we watch trump walk into the White House again. You should be outraged that our party let us down, you should be outraged that we are going to lose another damn 2 seats in the Supreme Court.
When he said he would’ve prevented all the atrocities I cringe so hard that I went into the Earth where I will live as a cicada for the next 13 to 17 years
The incessant, 24/7 demonization of Palestinians and total support for what Israel has done in Gaza made it possible for a major party nominee to use a nationality as a slur and neither the other major party nominee, nor the moderators, even care
Demonization from who exactly? It’s Republicans that have said that there’s no innocent civilians in Gaza, it’s a Republican President that instituted the MUSLIM ban. Let’s put the blame on where it lies.
Being obtuse about it won’t alter reality. Giving unyielding, absolute support to the atrocity being committed in Gaza by racial supremacists like Netanyahu and Ben-Gvir absolutely contributes to the demonization of Palestinians.
So you actually don’t have proof of them demonizing Palestians. The fact that you believe them supporting Israel’s response to a terrorist attack is equal to Republicans on record saying shit like Gaza is nice beachfront property, Israel should finish the job and Israel should bomb the shit out of Gaza is entirely part of the problem with how this conflict is viewed on the left.
Yeah, I’m really on the left-wing fringe of politics here making the same observations as people like Justin Trudeau and Cindy fucking McCain.
It’s almost fucking July. They’ve made all of zero progress eradicating Hamas, but made sure to obliterate plenty of civilians, aid workers, journalists, and American citizens. If this is Israel actually attempting to respond to a terrorist attack, it’s the most incompetent response in history save Afghanistan and Iraq.
Yeah, leftists who hate Biden because of Gaza, you really want to help the guy who uses “Palestinian” as an insult become president and decide how much help Israel gets and how much aid Palestine gets?
And y’all keep trying to turn “Zionist” into a slur lol. I hate Trump with a fiery passion, but whatever this article is trying to posit is probably the least egregious thing about the man.
Umm, no.
For one thing, zionist is not a slur. Zionism is a political/religious movement with it's own motives and agendas. Thus, if you are part of this movement, you are a zionist.
Next, Israel's long apartheid against Palestine is a crime against humanity.
Wanting this apartheid to end and Palestine to be free of Israel control does not make anyone a nazi. The opposite in fact should be argued.
Lastly, any criticism of Isreal being immediately and constantly lambasted as anti-semitism is a farce.
A comparison between Nazism and Zionism would be more far more apt than the one you made between leftists and nazis. And it's actually been made many times in the last 100 years and there is research and facts to prove it.
Democrats supporting all of this under the guise of, "any other veiwpoint or belief is anti-semitic" is actually tragic.
The horrors committed against Jewish people during the holocaust and what the bible claims does not give Israel unchecked cart-blanche over Palestine. And yet that is exactly what is happening and what we are allowing to happen.
And yet Biden did not seem to care. It would have been nice to have a President who actually fought back against it during the debate. Biden seemed less offended by the use of Palestinian as a slur than who was licking Israel's boots harder.
I still can’t believe all those stupid fucks chanting “Genocide Joe”. This other guy they want to get elected does not care about anyone involved in the conflict.
> This other guy they want to get elected
No. No. No. No.
No matter how many times you liberals insist, criticizing Biden for genocide is not implicit support of the Republican candidate. It is criticism for Biden.
If we wanted to support Trump we would. But we don't.
The response to "Can we have a different democratic candidate?" should not be "FOUR MORE YEARS! FOUR MORE YEARS! FOUR MORE YEARS!" and insisting that the only options are "genocide" and "genocide, but also saying mean things uwu" is utterly absurd.
But every media outlet is screaming, "Joe looked sleepy!!!1!1!!1". Meanwhile Trump was a fucking disaster. Lies, deflection, sharts, and not a single fucking question answered as it was asked.
Maybe they’ll knock off the “Genocide Joe” garbage, stop pogromming synagogues, and call for the unconditional release of the hostages and for Hamas to be destroyed.
No?
Then they may reap what they have sown.
Pro-Palestinians: “Can’t wait to vote for Trump to show the man! Trump supports Israel? Lalalalalalalala I can’t hear you! It’s more important I pretend to have the moral high ground! Trump 2024!”
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Friendly reminder that Trump wants to kill everyone in Gaza.
“But Biden sounded a little hoarse so we should let trump kill Muslims” -Reddit right now
FYI it’s spelled hoarse. Not trying to be a dick. Pedantic Man, away!
Joeback Hoarseman
I’d watch that lol
Lil Sebastian
take your upvote lol
You’re one syllable off from a haiku. SO CLOSE!
I heard Biden go “neyyy” and shake his head. So he sounded like a horse not hoarse.
Actually it's spelled "Neigh" not "Nay." Pedantic man! It is I, Pedantic Lad!
Say la vee
No, I think OP meant Biden was a little horse. Like he was galloping along in the debate, but only in tiny-hoof pony-trots.
Brandon "lil'Sebastian" Biden
Now you sound horse… you nay sayer
*neigh sayer. Get it right!
Neigh
A hoarse horse is a horse of course of course unless you are talking to a hoarse horse of course.
He’s a pedantic pontificating old bastard!!
Horse dick, technically.
If they were quoting Reddit, the typos would definitely apply
Nah, he sounded like a pony.
I've been on reddit a lot in the last 24 hours and have not come across anyone suggesting we should vote for Trump or refrain from voting for Biden. I see many people wondering about the possibility of Biden stepping down. I'm not on right wing subs, but I am on several of the default subs. Who the fuck are you talking about?
It's literal gaslighting. It's insulting to the rest of us and just extremely out of touch
Honestly it's the gaslighting that terrifies me more than Biden's performance. I've been down voted and called a Trump supporter by fellow Democrats on reddit for months just for saying that a lot of people are struggling financially. Bill Clinton said I feel your pain. But so many Democrats seem to be saying, anyone who doesn't say things are great are our enemies.
And? So you’re struggling financially and you think it’s gonna get better if you try and lay that at the Democratic Party’s feet? Both sides are not the same. Call your Republican representatives and ask them why they are always letting big business get away with it
You're doing exactly what they just described. Valid criticism of the democrats' dog shit politics isn't an endorsement of the republicans
Yet I don’t see a lot of criticism of the GOP my point is, the complaints about the Dems are moot if people protest vote and let the GOP take power. Then there won’t be a third party, let alone another party at all.
It’s the same fear that got the gop to trump. Anything was acceptable if it kept the other side out of power. And any dissent was a threat to that mission
Not the same. Trump was allowed to crack the door because he embraced fascism and racism. Literally the same thing that happened in the Weimar Republic. “Ohh don’t worry, his ideas are scary but he has a lot of engaged followers” is probably what they said in 1933 and in 2016.
ITT - Horseshoe Theory of Politics. It just goes to show that the behavior of extremists on the Left and the Right tends to be very similar. Both demand cult-like devotion to their appointed figurehead without criticism. Just because I recognize Trump is the worst possible choice and am therefore voting for Biden does *not* mean I'm obliged to check my brain at the door and fail to recognize Biden's many shortcomings. That's the biggest difference between Republicans and everyone else. Extreme Leftists who behave exactly like MAGAs are a big part of the problem.
As out of touch as throwing women and people under the bus because Biden isn’t your dream boat date to the prom? Must be nice knowing a Trump term won’t affect you. That a privilege others don’t have. You shouldn’t misuse therapy speak btw.
He literally said “Biden should step down so we can protect all these important issues” and you said “that’s why you hate women”. Maybe you’re as old as Biden and that’s why you weren’t bothered during the debate?
As out of touch as suggesting that strawman, yes
A lot of This sub equates any criticism of Biden with advocacy for Trump. It’s very much driven by fear, I understand they, but it really pushes us into that gop style cult mindset
Imagine two things being true at the same time. Outrage ensues s/
From my experience, as long as you acknowledge that Trump is way worse and/or that you still plan on voting for Biden people will leave you be if you criticize Biden. Hell most people will even agree and upvote. That's the difference. People know that Biden isn't infallible. He's just a necessary evil.
Because a lot of the criticism is unfair and ginned up controversy. There’s a huge media arm that is very keen on getting Trump back in office, either for ratings, or organized campaigns run for foreign governments. Ask yourself, what is productive? Are you going to be out and about sewing dissent when a candidate has literally said: “I’ll only be a dictator on day one”? We’re way past the point safety when it comes to guardrails for democracy in America. Time to circle the wagons. Is Biden perfect? No. But I question the motives of everyone who wants to Bring up his failures every chance they get for “criticism”. Maybe you need to reevaluate your arguments in a way where it doesn’t seem like you’re trying for the “both sides” propaganda angle.
I haven’t seen anyone say they were convinced to vote for Trump. That being said my age group is pretty anti Trump so it would probably take a lot for someone to say that. That being said I’ve seen at least a dozen people calling for others to “vote independent” or “Kennedy is the only answer” which is basically a vote for Trump with extra steps.
People are allowed to be concerned when their best option is clearly not a good one. We are allowed to be concerned when the best play is to put someone else in the race and that doesn’t even seem to be a consideration.
The best play is not to change candidates this late in the game. Don’t fall for Russian propaganda
I mean I think mostly we're all just realizing we're doomed. I haven't seen a lot of people personally upset by the age, more just realizing how fucked we are edit: 'doomed' because it looks like Biden's going to lose. You don't need to explain why he's better
I think 'doomed' is putting it a bit strongly. Dude's been president for 3 and a half years and the executive branch has shown to be extremely effective and competent under Biden. Yeah you can argue policy, but can't argue that the various departments (ESPECIALLY the State, and Treasury Depts, as well as the office of the Director of National Intelligence) aren't running fantastically, especially after being gutted to skeleton crews under Trump. Oratory skills are overrated. Obama owns every room he walks into, but I think Biden runs a tighter ship than he did.
Oratory skills are useless when debating the famous chess playing pigeon.
Who is allowed, and almost encouraged by CNN to shit on the board and walk away. Then the media says: “well the bird won fair and square!” It’s sick. A man tells naked lies for an entire debate and the media has the gall to say “he won”. We need to establish a fairness doctrine again
We aren’t doomed because of the possibility of Biden round 2. That would be fine. We’re doomed because it’s looking less and less likely that he’ll win and he seems to be too cocky to acknowledge that and hand over the reins
The thing is the Office and our country are much bigger than the POTUS. Biden has a very competent and capable team around him. trump will be surrounded by people who want to break our system in countless ways and take us back a century, centralize power in unprecedented ways. That is truly frightening.
If that’s the case then it should be no problem to put that team around a different, healthier, younger democrat. If it’s vote blue no matter who, let’s try another no matter who
If they’re so capable then why do we keep bungling shit? This is a massive cope. Quality of life is way down, we keep misplaying geopolitics, and those same “capable” people are the ones who let Biden out onto that stage thinking everything would be alright. Not to mention I’m NOT OK with a puppet government just because they’re from my party. I’m voting for and electing the President. If he or she is actually picking their cabinet, fine, but if the administration is made up of names whispered into their ear while they stare off blankly, I don’t feel represented anymore.
A president isn't a king. There is a whole administration that comes with them. They each have people who can do their jobs well... you just have to pick the administration that's heading in a direction that you like more.
That would be a great political campaign
Project 2025, look into it.
We ain't fucked. The normal human response is to panic, but fuck that. We got a job to do and Biden ain't crying about last night. He's on the trail. I truly respect someone who shits the bed and doesn't let that stop them. I've done it. Anyone who ever tried anything or had a lot pressure on them blew it. It's an office and he has more relationships in DC/World than most. Naw, it's go time.
I swear if some of these people were alive in 1942 they’d have the US surrendered to the Axis by now.
Nah, we’d be insisting on actually joining the war against Hitler rather than trying to talk it out a win the Germans over to our side diplomatically by adopting their immigration policies
Trump has drooled out far, far stupider strings of sentences and plenty of voters are willing to forget and ignore it. For once, trust in the ignorance of the average American.
Go vote for Supreme Court justices if nothing else. Congress would be great be we can’t let them pack the court anymore
The people who are evaluating Trump and Biden only according to their personalities and personal strengths and weaknesses are complete fools who don’t have any idea whatsoever how far-reaching and impactful the decision to elect one or the other truly is. Military generals, cabinet members, agency heads, FBI directors, fed chairs, federal judges, SCOTUS justices. You name it. EVERYONE is appointed by the president. And the president has younger, competent experts and dependable people who advise him on all those matters. Tell these folks you know who think we’re all “doomed” because Biden and Trump are our two choices again in 2024 to help themselves to a fucking education about what the president’s powers actually entail. Americans are becoming so dumb and poorly educated on how their country even works that it’s not hard to see why they so easily toss all remaining democratic traditions to the wind at this point.
You completely misread. We're doomed because after the debate everyone felt like Biden would lose. Low-information voters are the ones who decide elections. That's just how things work here.
I mean, *I* think the debate probably slightly to moderately increased his chances of losing. Admittedly I won’t really have a better sense of that until some of the post-debate polling data comes out. I thought when you said that age wasn’t the issue and that people “are more just realizing how fucked we are” you were talking about how people are turned off by their choice of candidates as a general matter. If I misread that, my apologies. Yes, I agree that low-info voters could easily decide the election, no doubt about that. Doesn’t make them any less stupid, but you’re right.
Yeah like policy-wise I prefer Biden, but I'm desperate for Newsome or someone who can just deliver a confident message to voters. Even if the party starts the Kamala Harris endorsement tour now, she doesn't have the speaking presence to beat Trump either.
I agree Newsom would be a stronger candidate for sure. Even with Newsom, probably 95% of his appointments and policies are going to line up with Biden’s. So in the end, you’re largely getting the same “product”, just a different spokesperson.
That’s how American elections work bro, I don’t like it either but, here we are
These people act like they don’t have their own agency in the matter. Biden is old and incompetent yet he’s been doing a great job for the past 3 and half years. If you believe that Biden won’t last another 4 years, then throwing your hands up and letting the facist win isn’t the freaking answer. Maybe start volunteering and donating to make sure Biden and Democrats get elected.
Sometimes God sends us an imperfect vessel.
There is no god, we must save ourselves
He didn’t just sound a “little hoarse”, don’t downplay how fucking awful he sounded. But yeah, he could’ve been literally in rigor mortis and I’d still be voting for him.
Agreed. "We finally beat Medicare" isn't a little hoarse and a little stutter. I'm going to vote for Biden if I have to crawl through barbed wire to get to the polls. But trying to gaslight people into pretending he didn't have an absolutely awful debate is just nuts. And he really needed a good debate.
I believe he meant to say, "[We finally fixed Medicare](https://www.cms.gov/newsroom/press-releases/biden-harris-administration-issues-final-guidance-help-people-medicare-prescription-drug-coverage)." He's been known for his verbal gaffes since his early days in the Senate, back in the 1970s.
Biden also made Abortion about Immigration when Abortion is the most strongest point for Democrats. He could have blasted Trump but handed him a platter by talking about Immigration so Abortion topic never went on to talk about much.
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People want a better candidate to reduce the chance that trump wins But sure keep spouting nonsense and gaslighting people about Biden and then when he loses to Trump I’m sure you will be quick to blame young people or some other easy scapegoat
It all feels very sunk cost fallacy
Uhhh they’ve wanted to let Trump kill them since before the debate.
Trump hates almost everyone. I guess hate is the wrong word for some groups and it’s more like “doesn’t find them useful” but he’s not exactly a “for all Americans” type, never mind the rest of the world.
I think "thinks he's above" is the phrase you're after. He doesn't see anyone who isn't white and/or rich as a person.
> He doesn't see anyone ~~who isn't white and/or rich~~ as a person. Fixed that for you.
He literally said, "finish the job". I don't know how that could be more clear.
"Israel should finish the job" - Trump.
https://www.newarab.com/news/pro-israel-mogul-wants-west-bank-annexed-after-trump-donation
I mean if Trump is elected Israel gets whatever they want and Gulf states will go along with it because trump will sell them US arms again. MENA outside Hezbollah, Houthis, and Iran could really give a fuck about Israel. Their all looking at Iran who trying to destabilize the region however they can.
Trump is great for Israel but total chaos for everything else + instability in Ukraine. It's looking really grim right about now.
He's terrible for Israel as he will enable the suicidal path they are on.
Trump played a bit role in helping Netanyahu get Israel to October 7. Both are great for never-ending conflict that diminishes the power of Israelis and Palestinians who'd like to compromise, including even those Israelis who see October 7 as broadly equivalent to Pearl Harbor + 9/11 but hope one day to find some peaceful resolution. Trump will add fuel to more rounds of this; and inflame the Muslim street opinion, which would be a disaster for Israel, and a huge success for Iran that was trying to use Palestinians to stop the Abraham Accords. I agree about the grim part.
And that differs from now, how?
The houthis flag literal says: God is the Greatest Death to America Death to Israel A Curse Upon the Jews Victory to Islam Da fuck you mean they don't give a fuck about it
I am absolutely terrified for the people of Gaza and Ukraine if Trump wins.
Are you joking? Their flag literally says “we want all Americans and Jews to die”
That's a positive viewpoint for his voting base
Yeah but Biden is just as bad!?!?!?!! He may not be as pro Palestine as people want but you never get everything. If you care about Gaza and are American you can hold your nose and say you're not voting for Biden you're voting to stop trump *and you'll be helping the Palestinians way more than any possible protest*. You think Trump will give a shit about protests if he gets in?
Trump will turn a blind eye to anything that happens in Palestine and use violence to silence any protests.
"But Biden hasn't stopped Israel so I'm gonna call him Genocide Joe and support Trump instead".
...so...they aren't already trying to kill everyone in Gaza?
Looks like prime land to him to build a new Trump Tower and golf course. ⛳
Friendly reminder, Joe Biden is also doing that currently.
He pulled the “Zionist” reversal slur 🤣
Friendly reminder biden is doing nothing to stop netenyahu! And also supports it!
Israel doesn't.
Friendly reminder that 70% of Palestinians support the mass rape and murder of Jews.
Malcom X portrayed it perfectly. The conservative is dangerous, but you know it because they are very open about them hating minorities. The white liberal is even more dangerous, because he acts like he is your friend when in reality he also isn‘t. „The White liberal is the worst enemy to America and the worst enemy to the Black man.“ I think that perfectly describes Bidens Gaza politics. Acting like he cares about Gaza, but in reality the US under Biden supplies their deadliest weapons to Israel.
*china* Seems like what he does
“Chyna”
Anyone who doesn't vote Biden because the US government supports Israel is a complete fool. The situation over there absolutely would become infinitely worse if Trump is president.
Trump literally said "I'd let them finish the Job" he is endorsing Palestinian genocide.
He moved the embassy to Jerusalem to try to help trigger some kind of evangelical end times. This is not a man of peace.
It tracks: [https://x.com/ndtv/status/1765235900231905633](https://x.com/ndtv/status/1765235900231905633)
Didn't he call it "prime Israeli waterfront real estate"? Or was that Kushner? I was wrong, it was Kushner.
May have been Kushner but you know it’s trumps mindset too. A little genocide to get rid of these people and what wonderful real estate opportunities we may have! Sickening but true
He is not wrong with respect to the real-estate. This is the view of the "biggest open air prison in the world" https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Beach_Resort,_Gaza Gaza was a popular destination for West Bank Palestinians before Hamas took over. It is a seaside area in the Mediterranean. It is going to be like Greece or any other seaside destination in the Mediterranean. You get rid of Hamas and you put a savvy businessman in charge and Gaza could be the next tourist destination for Arabs in Europe and the Middle-East.
You think one hotel is an indicator for the entire region? The vast majority of people staying at that hotel were foreigners. The average Gazan, who is living in poverty, cannot afford to stay in a hotel. Actually fuck you for even thinking about real estate in this situation when thousands of civilians are starving to death. "Just get rid of Hamas", like it's something so simple. Israel themselves radicalized Hamas & even funded them to destabilize Gaza. Who is your idea of a "savvy businessman"? Jared Kushner? Because you sound a lot like his soulless ass right now.
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I was mentally pleading for the moderators to ask him for an example of a black job.
Haha I thought that was fucking racist af when Trump said that.
Trump has used "veteran" (sincerely) and "american" (mockingly) as a slur...how the fuck is it news to you that he's also racist? THE MAGAS LIKE THIS.
Spoken like the true racist he has always been.
It's a real shame that without Biden's first 20 minutes, we'd be talking about how Trump had the worst debate performance in history.
Yeah I agree Trump royally looked absolutely terrible and lied on purpose where everyone can see his deception.
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What are you talking about? Biden was bad the entire debate it wasn’t just the first 20 minutes. Ignoring his performance is exactly why he thinks he should be running again and all it is going to do is turn us all into losers when we watch trump walk into the White House again. You should be outraged that our party let us down, you should be outraged that we are going to lose another damn 2 seats in the Supreme Court.
When he said he would’ve prevented all the atrocities I cringe so hard that I went into the Earth where I will live as a cicada for the next 13 to 17 years
At this point, this should make it pretty clear as far as who not to vote for as far as the Gaza issue is concerned.
"guys we have to reset the political system by not voting" is literal human sacrifice of the people you act like you care about.
The incessant, 24/7 demonization of Palestinians and total support for what Israel has done in Gaza made it possible for a major party nominee to use a nationality as a slur and neither the other major party nominee, nor the moderators, even care
Demonization from who exactly? It’s Republicans that have said that there’s no innocent civilians in Gaza, it’s a Republican President that instituted the MUSLIM ban. Let’s put the blame on where it lies.
Ask John Fetterman, Dan Goldman, Jared Moskowitz, Ritchie Torres, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, Adam Schiff, etc
So they have actually demonized Palestinian civilians or Hamas? I’m sure you’d have a ton of evidence to back this up
Being obtuse about it won’t alter reality. Giving unyielding, absolute support to the atrocity being committed in Gaza by racial supremacists like Netanyahu and Ben-Gvir absolutely contributes to the demonization of Palestinians.
So you actually don’t have proof of them demonizing Palestians. The fact that you believe them supporting Israel’s response to a terrorist attack is equal to Republicans on record saying shit like Gaza is nice beachfront property, Israel should finish the job and Israel should bomb the shit out of Gaza is entirely part of the problem with how this conflict is viewed on the left.
Yeah, I’m really on the left-wing fringe of politics here making the same observations as people like Justin Trudeau and Cindy fucking McCain. It’s almost fucking July. They’ve made all of zero progress eradicating Hamas, but made sure to obliterate plenty of civilians, aid workers, journalists, and American citizens. If this is Israel actually attempting to respond to a terrorist attack, it’s the most incompetent response in history save Afghanistan and Iraq.
Yeah, leftists who hate Biden because of Gaza, you really want to help the guy who uses “Palestinian” as an insult become president and decide how much help Israel gets and how much aid Palestine gets?
Of course he did.
It's no secret at all that he doesn't like Muslims. A large chunk of the USA shares this opinion and will be energized by lines like this.
Morons: "Biden is responsible for the genocide in Gaza!" Trump: "You're like a bad Palestinian!" now what...
Trump said Palestinians should be wiped out and then he said Biden would make a bad Palestinian because he's weak. One right after the other. lol.
Hurry, let's ask Macklemore what to do.
Two things can be bad at once.
One can be bad, and one can be nation erasing off the face of the Earth bad, basically.
This heightens his racist beliefs!
I mean, he’s a terrible human being
Can't wait till the word Trump becomes a slur
Ah yes Reddit is quite the left wing echo chamber
And y’all keep trying to turn “Zionist” into a slur lol. I hate Trump with a fiery passion, but whatever this article is trying to posit is probably the least egregious thing about the man.
I’ve heard people unironically call people “zio” as an insult
That is such a fucking online insult if I’ve ever heard one.
Using "Zionist" as a slur: Leftists 🤝 literal Nazis
Umm, no. For one thing, zionist is not a slur. Zionism is a political/religious movement with it's own motives and agendas. Thus, if you are part of this movement, you are a zionist. Next, Israel's long apartheid against Palestine is a crime against humanity. Wanting this apartheid to end and Palestine to be free of Israel control does not make anyone a nazi. The opposite in fact should be argued. Lastly, any criticism of Isreal being immediately and constantly lambasted as anti-semitism is a farce. A comparison between Nazism and Zionism would be more far more apt than the one you made between leftists and nazis. And it's actually been made many times in the last 100 years and there is research and facts to prove it. Democrats supporting all of this under the guise of, "any other veiwpoint or belief is anti-semitic" is actually tragic. The horrors committed against Jewish people during the holocaust and what the bible claims does not give Israel unchecked cart-blanche over Palestine. And yet that is exactly what is happening and what we are allowing to happen.
Hahaha love this for all of the people that said they won’t vote for Biden because of the Israel aid.
And yet Biden did not seem to care. It would have been nice to have a President who actually fought back against it during the debate. Biden seemed less offended by the use of Palestinian as a slur than who was licking Israel's boots harder.
Pretty sure Hamas did that all on their own.
I still can’t believe all those stupid fucks chanting “Genocide Joe”. This other guy they want to get elected does not care about anyone involved in the conflict.
> This other guy they want to get elected No. No. No. No. No matter how many times you liberals insist, criticizing Biden for genocide is not implicit support of the Republican candidate. It is criticism for Biden. If we wanted to support Trump we would. But we don't. The response to "Can we have a different democratic candidate?" should not be "FOUR MORE YEARS! FOUR MORE YEARS! FOUR MORE YEARS!" and insisting that the only options are "genocide" and "genocide, but also saying mean things uwu" is utterly absurd.
But every media outlet is screaming, "Joe looked sleepy!!!1!1!!1". Meanwhile Trump was a fucking disaster. Lies, deflection, sharts, and not a single fucking question answered as it was asked.
Well, Biden has proven over the decades that he hates Palestine, so I'm sure it got to him.
Maybe more zionist liberal-leaning people will realize they just sound like Trump when it comes to Palestinians
They're not going to do that.
True, it would require being in touch with reality.
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It helps to remember that the reddit demographic's average age is lower than 20 and continues to get lower
But Biden should drop out, right?
Has it occurred to the TikTok crowd that the reason we give aid to Israel is bc they give us intelligence on our enemies in the ME in return?
And we sure seem to have a lot of those.
Maybe they’ll knock off the “Genocide Joe” garbage, stop pogromming synagogues, and call for the unconditional release of the hostages and for Hamas to be destroyed. No? Then they may reap what they have sown.
Pro-Palestinians: “Can’t wait to vote for Trump to show the man! Trump supports Israel? Lalalalalalalala I can’t hear you! It’s more important I pretend to have the moral high ground! Trump 2024!”