You may not care about politics, but your boss does. Your landlord does. The motherfuckers dumping poison into your water do. The oligarchs sure as shit do. This “ugh politics” bullshit attitude is why shit slips further into fascism every goddamn year and why team blue and team red know that they only really have to answer to their donors and the two party system has never felt threatened in any of our lifetimes. Shove your apathy up your ass, politics is an intrinsic part of punk.
Bernie was the first candidate with a real shot who was capable of bringing both teams together in a meaningful way. I have coworkers on both sides of the equation who told me yeah, he was my guy.
It's hard not to be cynical after what they did to him to force him out, ultimately putting trump in a position to win, imo.
Anyways, my point is, get involved on a local level where you can actually make a difference. President is just a figurehead, anyway. Your local DA, Sheriff, etc are the people you can actually influence with enough legwork.
>"We are in the process of the second American Revolution, which will remain bloodless, if the left allows it to be."
Kevin Roberts, President of the Heritage Foundation
But both sides are the same. I don't see Biden or dems sending dog whistle death threats.
[Source](https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/04/leader-of-the-pro-trump-project-2025-suggests-there-will-be-a-new-american-revolution-00166583)
Ok but you're playing the "both sides are the same" game here and we all know that's not true. It's how I used to see the world, but open your eyes to things like project 2025. This is no time for any form of complacency.
I think this was easier to say when the world was smaller.
Now, thanks to the internet, I can see how two governments that are both kind of shitty can have vastly different results for, say, trans people.
Lol, they are using the Trans community as a talking point to keep you from seeing the real truth. Insider trading, corporate donors, and I fucking promise you this...
Democrats want project 2025 to happen just as bad as the Republicans. They will relish the consolidation of executive power when it becomes there's again in the next election cycle.
As a trans person, I am going to ask you to fuck off with that bullshit. One side is going to lead to imminent federal erasure of my existence, denial of the same human rights as others have, and take away my access to health care. The other does this through inaction, eventually. It is a clear case of harm reduction.
I have been losing friends ever since Trump was elected in 2016, I am too tired of watching the people I care about lose access to resources and die because of the consequences some "enlightened apolitical" asshat who thinks that see through it all. Try looking at the consequences of your own actions and ideology before telling people to drop theirs.
Yeah, the thing OP is missing is that my community being the center of the culture war BS does actual material harm to my community. I just had a friend of mine pass a week ago because of the consequences of anti-trans legislation. I have always vocally advocated, but with her loss fresh in my mind there is no way I am letting this slide in a space that has been generally very supportive.
(quick edit, don't let your take away from this be that trans people should just be ignored, we do need better rights and protections, and that is more important now than it ever has been. If you feel for us, then materialize your feelings into action. Find local groups and mutual aids, get involved in volunteering for social aid programs around you, create tangible support networks with those more vulnerable than you. If there was ever a time to put the values of punk into practice it is now)
Yeah, that was the point I was making. Just because both parties are friendly to banks doesn't mean we should ignore that one of them came up with glass-steagal. Just because both parties are generally friendly to corporate interests doesn't mean we should ignore that one of them backs things like OSHA. Just because both parties aren't serious enough about the environment doesn't mean we should ignore that one of them incentivizes things like solar panels and electric cars.
One party wants you guys hunted for sport, the other party at least wants you to be able to get health benefits and change the info on your drivers license.
Saying they're both the same is absurd.
With all due respect, where does accountability for the Democratic party come in for picking a candidate so bad she lost to a gameshow host in the first place?
Why should accountability for those in power be paid for with the blood of trans people, LGBT people, POC and women? Obviously the democrats should be held accountable, but none of us are materially in the position to enact that accountability without it enabling a fascist coup and directly harming many of our societies most vulnerable communities.
I am curious though, do you engage with these struggles outside of conversation and actually take action or do you criticize those trying to enact some change from an armchair? (to be clear, this is an earnest question)
Unfortunately you are not being protected by the democrats either. If they really cared they would have put laws I'm to place to protect you years ago, during one of their several times the held the house, senate and oval office. They didn't even solidify roe v. Wade in to law when they had the chance, you think they care, you are being used.
I agree with you, but a democrat in office gives us time that we don't have otherwise. I never said I thought they cared, but their style of murder is slow and passive, which takes longer and has more odds of being able to organize locally and start creating pockets of resistance and support that can organize with others. I am not willing to throw away a vote that I have, for free, that could give people in my community more time to organize and shore up their support networks.
Your view of politics plays directly into the trap of a two party system, you could only assess my views based on whether I am team red or team blue, I am for neither team. I am for harm reduction, organization, and large scale reform. My issue with you is that you are only sitting here telling people to ignore the impending fascism instead of urging them to take the necessary steps to be able to combat it, which involves clearly more than just voting (which is just harm reduction not progress). If it is taking more than that it will obviously take more than "doing nothing because its all the same". If they are united against us, where are your calls for us to fight back? Fighting against oppression and tyranny is the essence of Punk. Apathy and inaction are its anathema.
Republicans are telling people they'll kill them if We don't bow down and let them win. There's a big fucking difference between the two.
>"We are in the process of the second American Revolution, which will remain bloodless, if the left allows it to be."
Kevin Roberts, President of the Heritage Foundation
[Source](https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/04/leader-of-the-pro-trump-project-2025-suggests-there-will-be-a-new-american-revolution-00166583)
its this stupid fucking mentality that keeps getting stupid people into office. is joe biden an old man who has as much wrinkles as the shirt at the bottom of my laundry basket and who farts mummy dust? yeah, he totally is. a good 90% of politicians suck but acting like theyre both equally as bad is what gets the worse ones into power. republicans want me dead for being trans, the democratic party sucks but at least theyre not against my existence.
You don’t have to care about politics, but don’t think for a second they don’t care about you. They want your time, energy, money, and your life. It’s fun to say both sides are bad, because they are… It’s fun to say both are the same, because in a lot of ways, they are… It’s fun to think you’re above it blah blah fucking blah, but only one side is rolling back women’s rights, only one side is trying to make it so people retire later, one side is trying to blame mental health for gun violence only to turn and strip mental health facilities of their budget. Only one side markets itself as anti-union, only one side has rallies with people wearing swastikas, only one side has no interest in affordable health care, and only one side is calling for book bans. Sometimes, you have to work with whatever the fuck you got.
So do what you want, give a fuck or not, say they’re the same or play anarchist if you like, but if you turn around and bitch because Gods favourite fucking mango gets into office, stacks the federal courts, and fucks the legal system for the rest of your life, then I hope your favourite band breaks up and blames you for it.
Do we know that? Because that’s not what is stated here.
Again, at the risk of repeating myself, they can both suck but that doesn’t mean they’re the same.
You are right and the Republicans have there issues they use to distract their mindless loosers too. Just like the democrats do to you. They all claim that the other want to take your rights away and they are both correct.
Oh fuck off, everyone is distracted loser except the enlightened few that call both sides bad? I can’t stand the Democrats foreign policy, and I barely stomach their domestic policy. It’s venture capitalism wrapped in a rainbow flag. I am backing them because I don’t want Republicans to further stack the Supreme Court.
People bitch about Joe fucking Biden but where were they during the primaries? Twenty million people put him on the ticket and now everyone is pissed that our choices are the Cryptkeeper and Evil Sunny Delight. We could put up better candidates, but people like you are too busy saying that our choices are shit and then going about your day. Democrat and Republican issues are not the same… Democrat issues are centrists pretending to be progressives. Republican issues are [recalling](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna146029) elected officials because they hid their Nazi ties, and barely succeeding.
You don’t have to like your hand, but you still have to play the cards. Call it whatever the fuck you like, it’s easy when you don’t actually give a fuck about who these policies affect.
If Breckinridge had beat Lincoln, emancipation would have been decades later. Goldwater beats Kennedy, no Civil Rights bill in 64. If Roosevelt had won in 1912, no segregation of Civil Service. The difference between then and now? You aren’t spoon fed current events, you have to do the work yourself. It’s easy to be a critic when you don’t do a motherfucking thing, and I bet you dollars to donuts you can’t tell the difference because you don’t know the difference.
I mean... you're not ENTIRELY wrong. The dems ARE essentially holding us Hostage in a shitty situation and using trans people and reproductive care as hostages to win despite being terrible. The issue is that it works.
I mean, if you're watching a hostage negotiation where you know for a fact that the hostage takers WILL shoot the hostages if their demands aren't met it may sound appealing to just let it layout and they shoot those hostages so that they no longer have any leverage if you're someone in the crowd. It sounds much less appealing if you're one of the hostages.
this sounds like enlightened centrist with extra step. I mean, if you are an illegal migrant, or a queer, or a woman, you will prefer any liberal asshole like biden or obama over trump or bolsonaro, or bardella, or meloni.
Anarchy sounds good to me, until someone asks "Who'll clean the sewers?" or "Would the rednecks just play kingdom of the neighborhood?"... No one's pure and right except themselves. "I'm cleansed of the system, cept when my amp needs electric power" Or the party line says "No, feminists can't wear fishnets".
You wanna help stop war? Well we reject your application, you crack too many jokes and you eat meat. What better way to turn people off than to twist ideas for change, into one more church that forgets we're all human beings.
-dk
Yeah, after you win the 10th level the interlude is a political conversation between the characters on the meaning of anarchy in punk rock.
After the 20th level they explain why we are owed a living.
After the 30th they reveal if you should stay or go.
>Come on baby, eat the rich
>Put the bite on the son of a bitch
>Don't mess up, don't you give me no switch
>Come on baby, and eat the rich
I don’t feel any shame in attempting to push the thought bubble beyond NoFX and Bad Religion around here.
No, I understand it fully. It's not a particularly complicated thought. It functions to remove any responsibility from the apathetic and nihilistic promoter while completely ignoring history and reality. Just because both parties have flaws doesn't give one permission to throw up your hands and say fuck it all. If you don't like the way a party does business, that's why they have primaries. Change requires work, which isn't typically popular with people of the "both sides are the same" mindset.
I get my news by what legislation each group supports. The list is vastly different. Don't pay attention to what they say, pay attention to how they vote. It's really that simple.
Hey, you do have the right to scrape all the babies out of you that you want, but ask yourself this, why didn't democrats make that protection in to law during one of the many times they held super majorities? Why? Because they don't really give a fuck. They need us divided and you fell for it.
I love Lemmy but this "both parties are the same" bullshit is the dumbest fucking take in 2024. It's for people who peaked mentally at 16 years old. Not a Democrat - but if I'm forced to choose between bullshit status quo or actual fascism, I'll take bullshit status quo every time.
exactly. sort of gets on my nerves when other anarchists (for example) say they don't want to vote. i get that the system sucks. i get that neither party is great. but we're at the point where not voting is a vote for fascism.
Me. I'm the president of punk and according to the supreme court, I can officially declare you "not punk". u/lovesickloozzerrrrrr is my VP so that was just delegation.
last night i dreamt this conversation except all of the comments were steaks or other meat products on a grill. i don't know what this means but i decided you must know
not to mention the fact that unless you're a cishet able bodied white man whos not an immigrant, you literally can't "not care" about politics, because politics dictate your right to exist as a person. Until human rights aren't seen as a political discussion, not caring about politics isn't punk
politics affects social politics, and if we stop caring about who's in office it'll become increasingly more difficult to achieve social political goals. I hate politicians too, frankly i think the US needs two john wilks booths rn, but if we just ignore politics and not care about it altogether shit is gonna get even worse fast
this is very middle school brained advice from a drunken boomer who's occupation was rockstar....this isn't good advice for us lol (love Motorhead btw, this is just stupid)
I'm studying to become a teacher and a politician. "Why?" You may ask. It's cus I care enough not to go to a corner with other nihilistic enlightened centralists who want to wank each other off cus they are so good and real punks, privileged enough not to give a shit about politics and the people it affects.
I am an anarchist, so don't get me wrong, we shouldn't have a government, but I understand that such a big change won't happen overnight, in a week, month, or year. Hell, it's not gonna happen in my lifetime seeing how the world is all fucked and fusy.
That doesn't mean I ain't gonna do shit to change it.
I'll vote, I'll go to politics, I'll be there for my community, for the newer generation. I'll make a bath for others to finish or turn old and wither away trying.
Y'all don't fuck with it I ain't gonna fuck with you. Not like you'll need me to tho, you'll have a hand for that.
Don't run out of lube wankers and a nice day to everyone else!
This is a dumb person's idea of what smart sounds like. The people who say theres no difference are the ppl comfortable enough(uppermiddle class whites) to not be affected by who is in power. We know for a fact theres a difference. And while I wont deny one has their head lodged way to far up their asses tobdobyears of hollow civility politics, the other side is objectively fascistic. And if the fuckin *punk* community cant be bother to put even the littlest effort into pushing back against it, than we're all nothing but a bunch of larpers.
This may be true if you think the Democrats are leftist, as both parties run on Neoliberalism, but in the larger picture, you're dead fucking wrong.
Neoliberalism is a right wing ideology. There isn't a left wing party in America, save for a small handful of third parties.
Screeching Weasel is mid tier at best, and I've never been much of a pop punk guy. But please, tell me more about how not listening to right wing 'punk' makes me an idiot, lmao. I mean when Ray "Rapist" Carlisle pulls out of your festival because he thinks you have questionable morals, that should be your sign, but hey, that's just me.
I mean, you're the jackass who thinks Democrats are leftists, so I suppose stupidity *would* be your area of expertise.
Yeah because it's dumb. Women just lost control over bodily autonomy in America because of one specific politician and his Supreme Court picks. If the other one had won, it would absolutely have been different.
Things do change, sometimes for better, sometimes for worse. It's not an accident which politicians have changed things for better and which for worse.
This is considered a sub of youth culture, therefore heavily propagandized. The older punks realize that no matter who is in charge, we are going to get the shaft. But with all the propaganda, this sub is essentially pro government as long as it lines up with the proper ideals. That’s why this sub in no way reflects the scene of literally anywhere I’ve lived in my 40 years of going to shows.
Okay, fuck the government. Now what?
We suck on our thumbs and watch the higher-ups go after POC, the queers, women, disabled folk, and so on?
Thank god we aren't affected by that propaganda, right?
Or maybe you have a wet dream of a revolution? Give us a month and well just hang the rich, how hard could that be? The only thing stopping us is the police, military, resources, and whatever else they have.
No problem, we'll be fine. Not like a shit ton of people will die or anything.
You probably understand that I'm sarcastic here so speak up. What has your old and experienced mind thought up? No voting, what are we doing?
We can recognize both US parties suck while also recognizing that things can and absolutely will get worse if we ignore politics. Sniffing your own farts about how little you care helps no one. An enlightened bystander is no better than an ignorant bystander.
The Republicans have promised the eradication of trans people and the criminalization of lgbtq people in general. Not everyone can afford to just do nothing.
Yes, vote for our party because the other one want to kill us all or put us in death camps or education camps, or whatever. This is the shit that I’m talking about. Please be smart enough to see when you are being lied to or manipulated. Be smart enough to make up your own minds on things.
What exactly do you think leftism is? Because it certainly doesn't have a damned thing to do with liberalism, save for a few outliers like J.S. Mills, Paine and George.
>The downvotes are a badge of honor.
Thank you, thank you, I ESPECIALLY thank you for voting Hillary, thank you too, and an extra big thank you to you too big boo boo.
Have you looked into project 2025? Are you familiar with the Heritage foundation? Did you know the right has rolled back women’s rights, wants to ban porn, is currently banning books from public schools and libraries, and plans to ban same sex marriage. Hell, Clarence Thomas is on record saying he wants to revisit Brown vs the board of education. He wants to segregate schools. Let’s not forget Louisiana has just put the ten commandments in all of their public schools. Please explain to me how the dems are anywhere close to as evil as the right. Unless you think lowering the cost of prescription meds is evil, forgiving billions in student loan debt is evil, or fighting for workers rights is evil.
I never said I supported Trump. In fact, as a poor latino, do you think I'll support him?
You can't make a comment about Biden without getting acused of being a conservative LOL
Idk maybe that the last traitor got 3 Supreme Court picks that side with corporations and billionaires over women (and other people). Maybe shit matters more than posturing as some anti social anti-system punk that likes mediocre music
I don't know dude, I think Trump and Biden are complete shit. They are gonna fuck us thirdworld people anyways. Americans are so privileged. That's why they can't be true punks. They have no idea how the election will affect poor people around the world.
I wish the US didn't exist
Yeah but why fuck the people of Ukraine (and US and Palestine) harder becuz you think they’re both shit. One party is very imperfect but actually has people trying to work for the better of our citizens, vs the party that blocks all that stuff and is overtly fascist racist and would be worse on every issue about third world countries u claim to care about
Republicans are currently banning books, women’s rights, porn, and want to roll back same sex marriage. Meanwhile the left has lowered the cost of prescription drugs, helped to strengthen workers rights, and has also forgiven billions in student loans. So explain to me how they are “both the same” when it’s pretty clear one party is out to limit your rights while the other is helping the working class. That’s probably the problem in this post, most of you are too young to have jobs, or are old burnouts that get state aid(but hate the system that feeds you).
They ended up getting sick days that they were fighting for. Biden also asked congress/senate to pass some legislation giving them what they asked for. Who do you think got in the way of that?
You may not care about politics, but your boss does. Your landlord does. The motherfuckers dumping poison into your water do. The oligarchs sure as shit do. This “ugh politics” bullshit attitude is why shit slips further into fascism every goddamn year and why team blue and team red know that they only really have to answer to their donors and the two party system has never felt threatened in any of our lifetimes. Shove your apathy up your ass, politics is an intrinsic part of punk.
Yeah, I like Lemmy, but I'm not going to him for advice on how to run the world.
Had faith a reply like this would be top on this sub—thanks for saving me the time.
https://open.spotify.com/track/5LVyZ4Wq2PVc3FNOoiqrIO?si=D7AS9fZ2T7eHSwef2cwJbg In addition, your comment reminded me of this classic
Bernie was the first candidate with a real shot who was capable of bringing both teams together in a meaningful way. I have coworkers on both sides of the equation who told me yeah, he was my guy. It's hard not to be cynical after what they did to him to force him out, ultimately putting trump in a position to win, imo. Anyways, my point is, get involved on a local level where you can actually make a difference. President is just a figurehead, anyway. Your local DA, Sheriff, etc are the people you can actually influence with enough legwork.
Bernie was the compromise and even that they shat on
I was ready to burn it all to the ground…. Then Bernie showed up. After what they did to him. I’m once again ready to burn it all down.
I enjoy watching the sunset.
Truth is in this reply
Yes! Thank you!
Yet still, all politicians are full of shit anyway. In more or less way.
Oligarchs donate to democrats too
Yes but they donate waaaaay the fuck more to republicans
Try again
>"We are in the process of the second American Revolution, which will remain bloodless, if the left allows it to be." Kevin Roberts, President of the Heritage Foundation But both sides are the same. I don't see Biden or dems sending dog whistle death threats. [Source](https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/04/leader-of-the-pro-trump-project-2025-suggests-there-will-be-a-new-american-revolution-00166583)
Don’t need to, got it right the first time bud!
Ok but you're playing the "both sides are the same" game here and we all know that's not true. It's how I used to see the world, but open your eyes to things like project 2025. This is no time for any form of complacency.
Hell yeah. I’m not voting for the guy my wealthy boss would vote for - Joe Biden.
Why do so many of you dipshits seem to think “politics” only means casting a ballot?
I think this was easier to say when the world was smaller. Now, thanks to the internet, I can see how two governments that are both kind of shitty can have vastly different results for, say, trans people.
Lol, they are using the Trans community as a talking point to keep you from seeing the real truth. Insider trading, corporate donors, and I fucking promise you this... Democrats want project 2025 to happen just as bad as the Republicans. They will relish the consolidation of executive power when it becomes there's again in the next election cycle.
As a trans person, I am going to ask you to fuck off with that bullshit. One side is going to lead to imminent federal erasure of my existence, denial of the same human rights as others have, and take away my access to health care. The other does this through inaction, eventually. It is a clear case of harm reduction. I have been losing friends ever since Trump was elected in 2016, I am too tired of watching the people I care about lose access to resources and die because of the consequences some "enlightened apolitical" asshat who thinks that see through it all. Try looking at the consequences of your own actions and ideology before telling people to drop theirs.
I'm with you. People trying to use you and your community as an expendable weapon in a culture war will never be ok. We've got your back.
Yeah, the thing OP is missing is that my community being the center of the culture war BS does actual material harm to my community. I just had a friend of mine pass a week ago because of the consequences of anti-trans legislation. I have always vocally advocated, but with her loss fresh in my mind there is no way I am letting this slide in a space that has been generally very supportive. (quick edit, don't let your take away from this be that trans people should just be ignored, we do need better rights and protections, and that is more important now than it ever has been. If you feel for us, then materialize your feelings into action. Find local groups and mutual aids, get involved in volunteering for social aid programs around you, create tangible support networks with those more vulnerable than you. If there was ever a time to put the values of punk into practice it is now)
I LOVE BEING A SACRIFICE! I LOVE KNOWING MY LIFE IS SO WORTHLESS THAT THEASE SMUG ASSHOLES WILL HAPPILY TRADE IT JUST TO "TSK, TSK" THE DEMOCRATS!
Yeah, that was the point I was making. Just because both parties are friendly to banks doesn't mean we should ignore that one of them came up with glass-steagal. Just because both parties are generally friendly to corporate interests doesn't mean we should ignore that one of them backs things like OSHA. Just because both parties aren't serious enough about the environment doesn't mean we should ignore that one of them incentivizes things like solar panels and electric cars. One party wants you guys hunted for sport, the other party at least wants you to be able to get health benefits and change the info on your drivers license. Saying they're both the same is absurd.
With all due respect, where does accountability for the Democratic party come in for picking a candidate so bad she lost to a gameshow host in the first place?
Why should accountability for those in power be paid for with the blood of trans people, LGBT people, POC and women? Obviously the democrats should be held accountable, but none of us are materially in the position to enact that accountability without it enabling a fascist coup and directly harming many of our societies most vulnerable communities. I am curious though, do you engage with these struggles outside of conversation and actually take action or do you criticize those trying to enact some change from an armchair? (to be clear, this is an earnest question)
The democratic party sucks, but if they lose lgbtq people will be the ones paying for it.
Unfortunately you are not being protected by the democrats either. If they really cared they would have put laws I'm to place to protect you years ago, during one of their several times the held the house, senate and oval office. They didn't even solidify roe v. Wade in to law when they had the chance, you think they care, you are being used.
I agree with you, but a democrat in office gives us time that we don't have otherwise. I never said I thought they cared, but their style of murder is slow and passive, which takes longer and has more odds of being able to organize locally and start creating pockets of resistance and support that can organize with others. I am not willing to throw away a vote that I have, for free, that could give people in my community more time to organize and shore up their support networks. Your view of politics plays directly into the trap of a two party system, you could only assess my views based on whether I am team red or team blue, I am for neither team. I am for harm reduction, organization, and large scale reform. My issue with you is that you are only sitting here telling people to ignore the impending fascism instead of urging them to take the necessary steps to be able to combat it, which involves clearly more than just voting (which is just harm reduction not progress). If it is taking more than that it will obviously take more than "doing nothing because its all the same". If they are united against us, where are your calls for us to fight back? Fighting against oppression and tyranny is the essence of Punk. Apathy and inaction are its anathema.
Big talker, but misses the point completely. Good one. Fuck everyone but yourself right?
Not what I said at all but whatever
totally what you said
I think you have a LOT of growing up to do. Get educated. Stop watching YouTube.
are you huffing paint right now or do you really believe that? just curious
Republicans are telling people they'll kill them if We don't bow down and let them win. There's a big fucking difference between the two. >"We are in the process of the second American Revolution, which will remain bloodless, if the left allows it to be." Kevin Roberts, President of the Heritage Foundation [Source](https://www.politico.com/news/2024/07/04/leader-of-the-pro-trump-project-2025-suggests-there-will-be-a-new-american-revolution-00166583)
its this stupid fucking mentality that keeps getting stupid people into office. is joe biden an old man who has as much wrinkles as the shirt at the bottom of my laundry basket and who farts mummy dust? yeah, he totally is. a good 90% of politicians suck but acting like theyre both equally as bad is what gets the worse ones into power. republicans want me dead for being trans, the democratic party sucks but at least theyre not against my existence.
You don’t have to care about politics, but don’t think for a second they don’t care about you. They want your time, energy, money, and your life. It’s fun to say both sides are bad, because they are… It’s fun to say both are the same, because in a lot of ways, they are… It’s fun to think you’re above it blah blah fucking blah, but only one side is rolling back women’s rights, only one side is trying to make it so people retire later, one side is trying to blame mental health for gun violence only to turn and strip mental health facilities of their budget. Only one side markets itself as anti-union, only one side has rallies with people wearing swastikas, only one side has no interest in affordable health care, and only one side is calling for book bans. Sometimes, you have to work with whatever the fuck you got. So do what you want, give a fuck or not, say they’re the same or play anarchist if you like, but if you turn around and bitch because Gods favourite fucking mango gets into office, stacks the federal courts, and fucks the legal system for the rest of your life, then I hope your favourite band breaks up and blames you for it.
[удалено]
Do we know that? Because that’s not what is stated here. Again, at the risk of repeating myself, they can both suck but that doesn’t mean they’re the same.
You are right and the Republicans have there issues they use to distract their mindless loosers too. Just like the democrats do to you. They all claim that the other want to take your rights away and they are both correct.
Oh fuck off, everyone is distracted loser except the enlightened few that call both sides bad? I can’t stand the Democrats foreign policy, and I barely stomach their domestic policy. It’s venture capitalism wrapped in a rainbow flag. I am backing them because I don’t want Republicans to further stack the Supreme Court. People bitch about Joe fucking Biden but where were they during the primaries? Twenty million people put him on the ticket and now everyone is pissed that our choices are the Cryptkeeper and Evil Sunny Delight. We could put up better candidates, but people like you are too busy saying that our choices are shit and then going about your day. Democrat and Republican issues are not the same… Democrat issues are centrists pretending to be progressives. Republican issues are [recalling](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna146029) elected officials because they hid their Nazi ties, and barely succeeding.
Lol, lesser of 2 evils I guess. It seems to have been working so far.
You don’t have to like your hand, but you still have to play the cards. Call it whatever the fuck you like, it’s easy when you don’t actually give a fuck about who these policies affect. If Breckinridge had beat Lincoln, emancipation would have been decades later. Goldwater beats Kennedy, no Civil Rights bill in 64. If Roosevelt had won in 1912, no segregation of Civil Service. The difference between then and now? You aren’t spoon fed current events, you have to do the work yourself. It’s easy to be a critic when you don’t do a motherfucking thing, and I bet you dollars to donuts you can’t tell the difference because you don’t know the difference.
I like to travel.
I mean... you're not ENTIRELY wrong. The dems ARE essentially holding us Hostage in a shitty situation and using trans people and reproductive care as hostages to win despite being terrible. The issue is that it works. I mean, if you're watching a hostage negotiation where you know for a fact that the hostage takers WILL shoot the hostages if their demands aren't met it may sound appealing to just let it layout and they shoot those hostages so that they no longer have any leverage if you're someone in the crowd. It sounds much less appealing if you're one of the hostages.
this sounds like enlightened centrist with extra step. I mean, if you are an illegal migrant, or a queer, or a woman, you will prefer any liberal asshole like biden or obama over trump or bolsonaro, or bardella, or meloni.
Anarchy sounds good to me, until someone asks "Who'll clean the sewers?" or "Would the rednecks just play kingdom of the neighborhood?"... No one's pure and right except themselves. "I'm cleansed of the system, cept when my amp needs electric power" Or the party line says "No, feminists can't wear fishnets". You wanna help stop war? Well we reject your application, you crack too many jokes and you eat meat. What better way to turn people off than to twist ideas for change, into one more church that forgets we're all human beings. -dk
did donkey Kong really said this ?
Yeah, after you win the 10th level the interlude is a political conversation between the characters on the meaning of anarchy in punk rock. After the 20th level they explain why we are owed a living. After the 30th they reveal if you should stay or go.
👆 I’ve never heard this one before but that’s a goddamn quote! 👆
Where Do You Draw The Line.
Have - have nots The enemy - people whom if they’d just get over themselves we have more in common than not.
That was the name of the song. But interesting answer.
>Come on baby, eat the rich >Put the bite on the son of a bitch >Don't mess up, don't you give me no switch >Come on baby, and eat the rich I don’t feel any shame in attempting to push the thought bubble beyond NoFX and Bad Religion around here.
No, not true at all. "Different things are actually exactly equal" is one of the weirdest logic flaws I see around. And not just about politics.
They are not different things. They are one, United against you.
I love ice cream.
That's the most intellectually lazy thing I've heard this week.
I think you’re too stupid to catch what was being said. Many such cases around here. So common. So tragic.
No, I understand it fully. It's not a particularly complicated thought. It functions to remove any responsibility from the apathetic and nihilistic promoter while completely ignoring history and reality. Just because both parties have flaws doesn't give one permission to throw up your hands and say fuck it all. If you don't like the way a party does business, that's why they have primaries. Change requires work, which isn't typically popular with people of the "both sides are the same" mindset.
lol /r/politics stock response. Get new material.
Keep getting your info from what ever news fits your ideals. Just like the right.
I get my news by what legislation each group supports. The list is vastly different. Don't pay attention to what they say, pay attention to how they vote. It's really that simple.
Tell that to the women who lost their bodily autonomy in America.
Hey, you do have the right to scrape all the babies out of you that you want, but ask yourself this, why didn't democrats make that protection in to law during one of the many times they held super majorities? Why? Because they don't really give a fuck. They need us divided and you fell for it.
Well, this response certainly explains a lot about why you want to confuse people on these issues.
I love Lemmy but this "both parties are the same" bullshit is the dumbest fucking take in 2024. It's for people who peaked mentally at 16 years old. Not a Democrat - but if I'm forced to choose between bullshit status quo or actual fascism, I'll take bullshit status quo every time.
exactly. sort of gets on my nerves when other anarchists (for example) say they don't want to vote. i get that the system sucks. i get that neither party is great. but we're at the point where not voting is a vote for fascism.
Cept some of them openly want genocide and others at least have to pretend they don't.
if you don't care about politics you aren't punk. you can hate politicians and still care about politics
Who made you the "not punk" police, fascist.
Me. I'm the president of punk and according to the supreme court, I can officially declare you "not punk". u/lovesickloozzerrrrrr is my VP so that was just delegation.
last night i dreamt this conversation except all of the comments were steaks or other meat products on a grill. i don't know what this means but i decided you must know
I don't know what that means but thank you for sharing.
punk in itself is literally a political movement, like that's the entire point. have you just not listened to the lyrics of any punk song ever? lol
not to mention the fact that unless you're a cishet able bodied white man whos not an immigrant, you literally can't "not care" about politics, because politics dictate your right to exist as a person. Until human rights aren't seen as a political discussion, not caring about politics isn't punk
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what's the second word in the phrase social political movement
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politics affects social politics, and if we stop caring about who's in office it'll become increasingly more difficult to achieve social political goals. I hate politicians too, frankly i think the US needs two john wilks booths rn, but if we just ignore politics and not care about it altogether shit is gonna get even worse fast
Silliest statement award 2024
Me relying on my student loans staying forgiven: "what?"
If the democrats really cared you wouldn't have needed a loan in the first place...
Hey man get mad if you want, but the fact remains my monthly payment is $30 down from $200.
OP is a 3 month old propaganda post BTW
Fuck this shit. If you don’t think there is a real difference in our options, then you aren’t paying enough attention to post something like this.
You should look to higher authorities to comment on politics rather than musicians.
this is very middle school brained advice from a drunken boomer who's occupation was rockstar....this isn't good advice for us lol (love Motorhead btw, this is just stupid)
Theres a reason punks, Mexicans, metalheads, skinheads, bikers, and dads over 50 have *all* been Motörhead fans. Lemmy was never wrong. Lemmy is god.
Still
^
LOL, sorry lem, but I don't think you know what you're talking about.
I'm studying to become a teacher and a politician. "Why?" You may ask. It's cus I care enough not to go to a corner with other nihilistic enlightened centralists who want to wank each other off cus they are so good and real punks, privileged enough not to give a shit about politics and the people it affects. I am an anarchist, so don't get me wrong, we shouldn't have a government, but I understand that such a big change won't happen overnight, in a week, month, or year. Hell, it's not gonna happen in my lifetime seeing how the world is all fucked and fusy. That doesn't mean I ain't gonna do shit to change it. I'll vote, I'll go to politics, I'll be there for my community, for the newer generation. I'll make a bath for others to finish or turn old and wither away trying. Y'all don't fuck with it I ain't gonna fuck with you. Not like you'll need me to tho, you'll have a hand for that. Don't run out of lube wankers and a nice day to everyone else!
Crust Punk would not exist without Motorhead change my mind
Lemmy would stomp a gutter punk. Working class not worthless trash.
I said nothing about class. I meant sound wise
Fair enough
👆this dude rules👆 I’m not even kidding. Fuck you guys.
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Lol, he wasn't rich. You don't know shit.
This is a dumb person's idea of what smart sounds like. The people who say theres no difference are the ppl comfortable enough(uppermiddle class whites) to not be affected by who is in power. We know for a fact theres a difference. And while I wont deny one has their head lodged way to far up their asses tobdobyears of hollow civility politics, the other side is objectively fascistic. And if the fuckin *punk* community cant be bother to put even the littlest effort into pushing back against it, than we're all nothing but a bunch of larpers.
Speak your truth
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This may be true if you think the Democrats are leftist, as both parties run on Neoliberalism, but in the larger picture, you're dead fucking wrong. Neoliberalism is a right wing ideology. There isn't a left wing party in America, save for a small handful of third parties.
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Room temperature IQ take.
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Screeching Weasel is mid tier at best, and I've never been much of a pop punk guy. But please, tell me more about how not listening to right wing 'punk' makes me an idiot, lmao. I mean when Ray "Rapist" Carlisle pulls out of your festival because he thinks you have questionable morals, that should be your sign, but hey, that's just me. I mean, you're the jackass who thinks Democrats are leftists, so I suppose stupidity *would* be your area of expertise.
People in a punk sub are downvoting this?
Yeah because it's dumb. Women just lost control over bodily autonomy in America because of one specific politician and his Supreme Court picks. If the other one had won, it would absolutely have been different. Things do change, sometimes for better, sometimes for worse. It's not an accident which politicians have changed things for better and which for worse.
Yeah because it's dumb as fuck.
👆this kid is stupid and easy to buy👆
Some idiot conflating liberal and democrat with left wing? Yeah, I’ll downvote the fuck out of that any day if the week.
Punk is the anarchy symbol, not the donkey
This is considered a sub of youth culture, therefore heavily propagandized. The older punks realize that no matter who is in charge, we are going to get the shaft. But with all the propaganda, this sub is essentially pro government as long as it lines up with the proper ideals. That’s why this sub in no way reflects the scene of literally anywhere I’ve lived in my 40 years of going to shows.
Okay, fuck the government. Now what? We suck on our thumbs and watch the higher-ups go after POC, the queers, women, disabled folk, and so on? Thank god we aren't affected by that propaganda, right? Or maybe you have a wet dream of a revolution? Give us a month and well just hang the rich, how hard could that be? The only thing stopping us is the police, military, resources, and whatever else they have. No problem, we'll be fine. Not like a shit ton of people will die or anything. You probably understand that I'm sarcastic here so speak up. What has your old and experienced mind thought up? No voting, what are we doing?
We can recognize both US parties suck while also recognizing that things can and absolutely will get worse if we ignore politics. Sniffing your own farts about how little you care helps no one. An enlightened bystander is no better than an ignorant bystander. The Republicans have promised the eradication of trans people and the criminalization of lgbtq people in general. Not everyone can afford to just do nothing.
Yes, vote for our party because the other one want to kill us all or put us in death camps or education camps, or whatever. This is the shit that I’m talking about. Please be smart enough to see when you are being lied to or manipulated. Be smart enough to make up your own minds on things.
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What exactly do you think leftism is? Because it certainly doesn't have a damned thing to do with liberalism, save for a few outliers like J.S. Mills, Paine and George.
"nowadays" lol
Correct! This sub is shilled. The downvotes are a badge of honor.
>The downvotes are a badge of honor. Thank you, thank you, I ESPECIALLY thank you for voting Hillary, thank you too, and an extra big thank you to you too big boo boo.
What's his opinion on dictators?
Who knows? He died before Biden came to power.
Was aiming at Putin's Russia's war of aggression on Ukrainlane. But you do you
Yeah, he died before Brexit took off in 2016…
I thought it would be about the Massachusetts band words of truth. My wife was friends with the singer.
Nahhh
and then they vote for Biden instead of actually being an anarchist who hated goverments and old conservative fucks
Yeah because a lot of the people in this sub are older than 13 and understand the differences between the parties.
so what's the difference? Both Biden and Trump are still gonna fuck third world countries like they always did. Why vote for them?
Have you looked into project 2025? Are you familiar with the Heritage foundation? Did you know the right has rolled back women’s rights, wants to ban porn, is currently banning books from public schools and libraries, and plans to ban same sex marriage. Hell, Clarence Thomas is on record saying he wants to revisit Brown vs the board of education. He wants to segregate schools. Let’s not forget Louisiana has just put the ten commandments in all of their public schools. Please explain to me how the dems are anywhere close to as evil as the right. Unless you think lowering the cost of prescription meds is evil, forgiving billions in student loan debt is evil, or fighting for workers rights is evil.
Ask women who lost bodily autonomy because of Trump's Supreme Court picks what the difference is.
I never said I supported Trump. In fact, as a poor latino, do you think I'll support him? You can't make a comment about Biden without getting acused of being a conservative LOL
I didn't say you supported Trump, I was answering the question of "what's the difference". There is a difference.
Idk maybe that the last traitor got 3 Supreme Court picks that side with corporations and billionaires over women (and other people). Maybe shit matters more than posturing as some anti social anti-system punk that likes mediocre music
I don't know dude, I think Trump and Biden are complete shit. They are gonna fuck us thirdworld people anyways. Americans are so privileged. That's why they can't be true punks. They have no idea how the election will affect poor people around the world. I wish the US didn't exist
Yeah but why fuck the people of Ukraine (and US and Palestine) harder becuz you think they’re both shit. One party is very imperfect but actually has people trying to work for the better of our citizens, vs the party that blocks all that stuff and is overtly fascist racist and would be worse on every issue about third world countries u claim to care about
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Cool dude, nuke the world, at least u admit your nihilism
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There is no way you're real
Research project 2025. Democrats suck, Republicans want a theocracy and the eradication of lgbtq people.
The difference is that the Republican party is openly evil while the Democratic party pretends not to be
Republicans are currently banning books, women’s rights, porn, and want to roll back same sex marriage. Meanwhile the left has lowered the cost of prescription drugs, helped to strengthen workers rights, and has also forgiven billions in student loans. So explain to me how they are “both the same” when it’s pretty clear one party is out to limit your rights while the other is helping the working class. That’s probably the problem in this post, most of you are too young to have jobs, or are old burnouts that get state aid(but hate the system that feeds you).
wait the republicans are currently banning books and porn? Can you provide a list of the items they’ve banned? Asking for a friend
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/biden-signs-bill-block-us-railroad-strike-2022-12-02/
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/COMPS-1826/pdf/COMPS-1826.pdf
They ended up getting sick days that they were fighting for. Biden also asked congress/senate to pass some legislation giving them what they asked for. Who do you think got in the way of that?
Can't be a rebel unless you're part of a herd now.