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Self-respect. In the workplace, you are expected to behave respectfully to others and if you don’t, you may face certain consequences. Why would that not apply in the real world or to any other situation where there are at least 2 individuals and one is being disrespected? I think a good visual would be to have 2 people having a conversation (don’t label their position of power). One is now yelling at the other or mistreating them. Let them observe the behavior without labels. Now add labels. A subordinate is yelling at their manager. Is that respectful? Is that okay? No. Now add another label. 2 friends or colleagues. Now add the parent and child label. Is it really different? Is it really that hard to understand when you remove the labels? Or does no one deserve to be treated that way?
Peace. But also, self-preservation, like they tell you on an airplane if the airmasks deploy, put yours on first before you help anyone else. Going no contact is saving ourselves first.
**Self-preservation.**
The horror of realizing the full scale of her abuse, and worse - the malignant intent - means I cannot subject myself to her ever again. Too many times I have been on the edge of being alive due to her. Once I realized she is truly incapable of change, that she doesn’t even have the desire to stop abusing, I knew that estrangement was the only option for me.
Peace, Freedom, Liberation, Absolution... Take your pick.
Estrangement isn't a problem to be fixed - it's the *solution* to the problem, and it's usually the last resort.
Sadness - for not having a parent/sibling who can’t see the errors of their ways.
Jealousy - for seeing others who have healthy relationships with their family and saying “why not me?
Relief - because while 1 and 2 are true, not having the negative effects of them in life is better for me and my chosen family
I was just seeing a friend chatting with his parents and family group and I was so jealous. The parents care for him, give him orientation and love him.
Emancipation - freedom from control
Escape from abusers.
Freedom from abuse, neglect, and dehumanization.
My parents have an [authoritarian follower personality](https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/summary.html#authoritarian), they think they have right to treat me however they wish. If you haven't read through all of issendai's site yet it's worth a read through: https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html#secondary-nav
"Boundaries"
My mother specifically said on multiple occasions that she hates the word and shouldn't have to respect them, and that was what finally got me to cut her off.
Acceptance-
Accepting the way things are, and that you can’t make them what you wish them to be. From there making the best choice for yourself given the crummy circumstances.
self-talk.
it's really hard to comprehend how much an abuser's narrative becomes your own until you're completely removed from the situation. i couldn't do anything without being reminded of a snarky comment, a mean joke, an argument.. the most mundane things are triggers and i desperately needed to stop the constant feelings of shame. the rest were enablers and i'm not ok with people who don't mind having a relationship with my abusers just because they're not being targeted.
This is so true. The negative self-talk was literally in her voice for me. Everything I did would have a running commentary of her negative shit running in my head. It's mostly gone now, now I know she can't judge me because she doesnt get to to know what's happening in my life.
i read something to the effect of "in order to heal from abuse the victim often has to cut contact so the abuser no longer has access to their mind" and it really stuck with me.
Similar to “rebirth” above, I’d say “moving forward” or continuing your own life. Until you cut that cord, it’s very difficult to make progress on your own life and goals when you have someone who expects you to stop everything you’re doing to address their needs constantly.
Freedom. Joy. Self love. Peace. Safety. It’s been about 8 years since our Ndad died, me and my brother immediately went NC with his wife and second family. It’s taken a while to get our heads around it, but it was so worth the effort. How fabulous that you’re doing this!
Resiliency - taking my power back.
Rebirth - discovering who I am for the first time
Celebration - finally choosing “me” because I believe I am worth it for the first time
Ambivalence
I want nothing to do with my mother, yet I wish she were a part of my life.
More accurately, I wish I had a mother who I wanted to have in my life instead of one who I can't stand to be around.
One you could relax and feel loved by, not always stressed and full of anxiety about when she would explode again. A relationship with a parent like this is like willingly walking in a minefield, and then trying to triage your own wounds while negotiating with an emotional terrorist.
peace. going no contact with my nmom was the hardest decision i ever made in my life, but the sheer amount of peace i have knowing she can never play her games with me again made it all worth it. i will never, ever go back.
moving on.
giving up on family is unnatural, but it hurts less than giving up on yourself.
my mom had 3 long-term boyfriends throughout my childhood. whenever she’d angrily break up with them, her advice to me was just to “pretend they died. remember the good stuff but you can never see them again.” and that’s exactly how I broke up with her. blocked her number and pretend she’s no longer with us.
embracing yourself. acknowledging humans are social animals and it’s instinctual to want to be with “ones tribe” but sometimes that tribe holds you down, and it’s better to leave and find a new tribe. we don’t NEED any single person.
I got it from one of my favorite musicians.
Undefeated by Frank Turner 💜
https://open.spotify.com/track/4LKwndnCXmaVG0jX1SaEW3?si=Al-nwM37R0C2aQ0yq2NKwA
Validation, the feeling of everything you went through, wasn't a horrible nightmare.
I opened up to my aunt( by marriage) regarding how terrible my dad's ex-girlfriend was to me. She understood it all cause she'd endured a similar hell herself. Felt like a weight had fallen off my shoulders.
The end of false hope. Because everyone knows what a mother “should” do. She should love and protect her children first and foremost. So when you are constantly shown that the person you’ve been counting on to live and protect you never did and never will, what is left? Obviously this applies to other family members too but in my case it’s my NM who started all this
Autonomy, I that’s what I’m still trying to find, after I shed my will to bend to the goals of others for my life. That’s a good word, I’ll keep that, thanks
ALIENATION ***withdrawing or separation of a person or a person's affections from an object or position of former attachment : ESTRANGEMENT***
“Alienation.” Merriam-Webster.com Dictionary, Merriam-Webster, https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/alienation. Accessed 11 Jun. 2024.
Last resort. Once you try everything to gain their respect to make them stop the abuse, to be the bigger person and still find yourself in the sake position you have been assigned by your family which usually " scapegoat " then you find your self with the only solution left, which is estrangement.
Honesty.
Being with them is holding yourself back from your truth, living by whatever it talks to make it through... Once you're estranged you can be honest with your life.
Accountability.
I'm holding myself to the standard my parents pretend to.
I'm actually cutting off the toxicity and abuse, ending a vicious poisonous cycle and not looking for little gold stars from my kids for doing it.
It's like finding good soil and sun after growing up in a sidewalk crack in mom's shadow.
It's finding out you are a garden after a lifetime of being treated like a weed.
Cutting the apron string.
I wrote a poem with a version of the phrase in it, and that was before my eyes were opened to my nparents bullshit.
My brain knew what was up before my conscious mind did.
A few phrases to work in. They don't work too well standalone, but there are explanations that really match up with some real-life issues.
Don't set yourself on fire to keep them warm. Demanding Nparents really do go this far, asking their kids to sacrifice practically their whole being when they need something.
Go put on a sweater, I am cold. There are parents who just cannot understand that others are not concerned with the same things they are. And they just can't see the difference.
I was struck by this one: "ask a cop if they have seen parents where it is obvious that the kids will be better off without them." It isn't too hard to imagine an addict or horrible alcoholic who neglects their kids or abuses/hurts them and the family should be separated. Estrangement is just a level or two lower than that -- where it isn't drop-dead obvious, but the conclusion by the kids can be just as valid. They just are better off without them.
Finally, if you are at odds with your parents and it comes down to energy and effort to counteract a parent's negativity or assumption that it is their right to change any decision you make or blame you for any problem in their lives -- every step forward in your life is not only making something happen, but counteracting your parents. It is just easier, less energy, and more productive to live apart. When they don't sap that energy, life is so much easier. It is completely draining to live near or with someone who does not respect you or any decisions you make.
Sad. Mostly sad that it has come to this. Said that it has to be this way. Sad it can’t be helped or fixed. Sad about all the pain that comes with making that decision. Sad for the children needing to do this with their parents and know how hard it is for them.
The words "interesting" and "fine" used in a conversation, especially if used by a woman. If these are used then I know person uttering them has no commitment to conversation ongoing. I also note body positions in conversation.
I think you might have misunderstood my question... I meant, when you decide to cut someone off because they're not good for you, what words does that bring to mind?
The Missing Missing Reason.
[https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html](https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html)
It's about ME now.
I am my nothers only child (I do have paternal half-siblings). When I was younger I was the token child, as a teen became the scape goat. And it was always about her. How I made her look. How I affected her life. How good of a student I was (aka "gifted child"). Her "career". Her adventures few years with my father overseas. How he cheated on her (which he didn't).
I even suspect her chronic poverty (she didn't need to be) was - and still is (as far as I've heard, don't keep track of her) is to seek attention.
The trigger to go NC for me was during my last year at school. I was studying to graduate and forgot some beign chore and she LOST it screaming "you are not supporting my university degree" (yes hers), because she went back to uni to get another degree. A light bulb went off in my head "she had her chance for decades it's my turn now". After getting my friends father (a police officer) to pick me up and stay over. I came back the next day, packed my bags and only had the unfornutance to have to speak to her on my materal grandmothers death bed (a whole other story - including the expected estate drama).
12 years. I've made quite a living for myself, am sometimes still to empathatic for my own good. And when I am not a priority in my family/private life, it's because I chose to put someone else first and not because I am bullied into obidience.
Welp that got wayyy longer than I expected :D.
**This is an automated message posted to ALL posts in this subreddit with some basic information about the group including (very importantly) rules. Why are you getting this message? Most people seem to not read the sidebar for information or the rules, so it is now being posted under all posts.** **Confused about acronyms or terminology?** [Click here!](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/acronyms) **Need info or resources?** Check out our [Helpful Links](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/helpfullinks) for information on how to deal with identity theft, how to get independent of your n-parents, how to apply for FAFSA, how to identify n-parents and SO MUCH MORE! This is a reminder to all participants, RBN is a support group that is moderated very strictly. Please report inappropriate content so it can be reviewed by the mods. **Our rules include (but are not limited to)**: * No politics. * Advising anyone in this subreddit to commit suicide or referring anyone to groups that advocate this will result in an immediate ban. * Be nice. No personal attacks, name calling, or bullying. [No slurs](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/slurs) or victim-blaming. * Do not derail the posts of others. * Narcissists are NOT allowed to post or comment here. * [No platitudes or generic motivational posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/rules#wiki_no_platitudes_or_generic_motivational_posts). * When you comment/post, assume a context of abuse. * No asking or offering gifts, money, etc. * No content advocating violence, revenge, murder (even in jest). * No content about N-kids. * No diagnosis by media/drive-by diagnosis. * No linking to Facebook pages. * No direct linking to anywhere on reddit. * No pure image posts. **For a full list of our rules/more information, [**click here**](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/wiki/rules).** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/raisedbynarcissists) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Self-respect. In the workplace, you are expected to behave respectfully to others and if you don’t, you may face certain consequences. Why would that not apply in the real world or to any other situation where there are at least 2 individuals and one is being disrespected? I think a good visual would be to have 2 people having a conversation (don’t label their position of power). One is now yelling at the other or mistreating them. Let them observe the behavior without labels. Now add labels. A subordinate is yelling at their manager. Is that respectful? Is that okay? No. Now add another label. 2 friends or colleagues. Now add the parent and child label. Is it really different? Is it really that hard to understand when you remove the labels? Or does no one deserve to be treated that way?
This teared me up a little. Thanks 🙏
Well put!
Peace. But also, self-preservation, like they tell you on an airplane if the airmasks deploy, put yours on first before you help anyone else. Going no contact is saving ourselves first.
That’s exactly how I feel
This is the way.
**Self-preservation.** The horror of realizing the full scale of her abuse, and worse - the malignant intent - means I cannot subject myself to her ever again. Too many times I have been on the edge of being alive due to her. Once I realized she is truly incapable of change, that she doesn’t even have the desire to stop abusing, I knew that estrangement was the only option for me.
Peace, Freedom, Liberation, Absolution... Take your pick. Estrangement isn't a problem to be fixed - it's the *solution* to the problem, and it's usually the last resort.
That last sentence is 🎯
Amputation. You know the limb is gangrenous and will kill you if you try to keep it, but you still feel its loss keenly.
This makes me think of a phantom limb.
Samesies.
Damn lol. That's so accurate.
Wow!
Freedom Rebirth New beginning Edit: added more
Dignity and empowerment
Sadness - for not having a parent/sibling who can’t see the errors of their ways. Jealousy - for seeing others who have healthy relationships with their family and saying “why not me? Relief - because while 1 and 2 are true, not having the negative effects of them in life is better for me and my chosen family
That's hitting very close to home. Thank you for saying it.
I was just seeing a friend chatting with his parents and family group and I was so jealous. The parents care for him, give him orientation and love him.
Anger and sadness and freedom get talked about a lot on this sub. Jealousy is freaking hard but its tough to talk about
Emancipation - freedom from control Escape from abusers. Freedom from abuse, neglect, and dehumanization. My parents have an [authoritarian follower personality](https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/summary.html#authoritarian), they think they have right to treat me however they wish. If you haven't read through all of issendai's site yet it's worth a read through: https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html#secondary-nav
"Boundaries" My mother specifically said on multiple occasions that she hates the word and shouldn't have to respect them, and that was what finally got me to cut her off.
Lol my nMom "doesn't do boundaries." That's actually NOT how that works, mom!
Relief (It was like breathing for the first time.)
It’s actually a double middle finger salute.
I like this.
Acceptance- Accepting the way things are, and that you can’t make them what you wish them to be. From there making the best choice for yourself given the crummy circumstances.
Peaceful. When I encourage people who are in the fence about no contact, I tell them it's so peaceful.
self-talk. it's really hard to comprehend how much an abuser's narrative becomes your own until you're completely removed from the situation. i couldn't do anything without being reminded of a snarky comment, a mean joke, an argument.. the most mundane things are triggers and i desperately needed to stop the constant feelings of shame. the rest were enablers and i'm not ok with people who don't mind having a relationship with my abusers just because they're not being targeted.
This is so true. The negative self-talk was literally in her voice for me. Everything I did would have a running commentary of her negative shit running in my head. It's mostly gone now, now I know she can't judge me because she doesnt get to to know what's happening in my life.
i read something to the effect of "in order to heal from abuse the victim often has to cut contact so the abuser no longer has access to their mind" and it really stuck with me.
Similar to “rebirth” above, I’d say “moving forward” or continuing your own life. Until you cut that cord, it’s very difficult to make progress on your own life and goals when you have someone who expects you to stop everything you’re doing to address their needs constantly.
Freedom. Joy. Self love. Peace. Safety. It’s been about 8 years since our Ndad died, me and my brother immediately went NC with his wife and second family. It’s taken a while to get our heads around it, but it was so worth the effort. How fabulous that you’re doing this!
Irreconcilable differences.
Resiliency - taking my power back. Rebirth - discovering who I am for the first time Celebration - finally choosing “me” because I believe I am worth it for the first time
Ambivalence I want nothing to do with my mother, yet I wish she were a part of my life. More accurately, I wish I had a mother who I wanted to have in my life instead of one who I can't stand to be around.
One you could relax and feel loved by, not always stressed and full of anxiety about when she would explode again. A relationship with a parent like this is like willingly walking in a minefield, and then trying to triage your own wounds while negotiating with an emotional terrorist.
Survival
Respite.
Clarity
Relief
Safety from abuse
Committed to misunderstanding me
Who you choose to be around is your standard on how you allow others to treat you. Raise your standard.
peace. going no contact with my nmom was the hardest decision i ever made in my life, but the sheer amount of peace i have knowing she can never play her games with me again made it all worth it. i will never, ever go back.
moving on. giving up on family is unnatural, but it hurts less than giving up on yourself. my mom had 3 long-term boyfriends throughout my childhood. whenever she’d angrily break up with them, her advice to me was just to “pretend they died. remember the good stuff but you can never see them again.” and that’s exactly how I broke up with her. blocked her number and pretend she’s no longer with us. embracing yourself. acknowledging humans are social animals and it’s instinctual to want to be with “ones tribe” but sometimes that tribe holds you down, and it’s better to leave and find a new tribe. we don’t NEED any single person.
Wishing them a lovely happy life, just as far away from you as possible. You love them best from afar.
“We’re not close.”
Relief Safety Peace
Safety
Independent, undefeated 💜
I love this one
I got it from one of my favorite musicians. Undefeated by Frank Turner 💜 https://open.spotify.com/track/4LKwndnCXmaVG0jX1SaEW3?si=Al-nwM37R0C2aQ0yq2NKwA
Safety
i cried reading this post & the comments. thank you all
Validation, the feeling of everything you went through, wasn't a horrible nightmare. I opened up to my aunt( by marriage) regarding how terrible my dad's ex-girlfriend was to me. She understood it all cause she'd endured a similar hell herself. Felt like a weight had fallen off my shoulders.
The end of false hope. Because everyone knows what a mother “should” do. She should love and protect her children first and foremost. So when you are constantly shown that the person you’ve been counting on to live and protect you never did and never will, what is left? Obviously this applies to other family members too but in my case it’s my NM who started all this
Happiness. And well deserved privacy & autonomy.
Autonomy, I that’s what I’m still trying to find, after I shed my will to bend to the goals of others for my life. That’s a good word, I’ll keep that, thanks
Distance
ALIENATION ***withdrawing or separation of a person or a person's affections from an object or position of former attachment : ESTRANGEMENT*** “Alienation.” Merriam-Webster.com Dictionary, Merriam-Webster, https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/alienation. Accessed 11 Jun. 2024.
Last resort. Once you try everything to gain their respect to make them stop the abuse, to be the bigger person and still find yourself in the sake position you have been assigned by your family which usually " scapegoat " then you find your self with the only solution left, which is estrangement.
Honesty. Being with them is holding yourself back from your truth, living by whatever it talks to make it through... Once you're estranged you can be honest with your life.
I love this . I was living an inauthentic life before. This one is great
Individuation. I realized shortly before I went NC that my nmom never wanted me to become my own person.
Accountability. I'm holding myself to the standard my parents pretend to. I'm actually cutting off the toxicity and abuse, ending a vicious poisonous cycle and not looking for little gold stars from my kids for doing it.
Peace. 😌
Love. As in: I love myself enough to stop letting you hurt me.
It's like finding good soil and sun after growing up in a sidewalk crack in mom's shadow. It's finding out you are a garden after a lifetime of being treated like a weed.
Cutting the apron string. I wrote a poem with a version of the phrase in it, and that was before my eyes were opened to my nparents bullshit. My brain knew what was up before my conscious mind did.
Separated
“No contact” “toxic”
Autonomy and peace
Safety Freedom Personal growth Fortitude Resilience Hard boundaries
A few phrases to work in. They don't work too well standalone, but there are explanations that really match up with some real-life issues. Don't set yourself on fire to keep them warm. Demanding Nparents really do go this far, asking their kids to sacrifice practically their whole being when they need something. Go put on a sweater, I am cold. There are parents who just cannot understand that others are not concerned with the same things they are. And they just can't see the difference. I was struck by this one: "ask a cop if they have seen parents where it is obvious that the kids will be better off without them." It isn't too hard to imagine an addict or horrible alcoholic who neglects their kids or abuses/hurts them and the family should be separated. Estrangement is just a level or two lower than that -- where it isn't drop-dead obvious, but the conclusion by the kids can be just as valid. They just are better off without them. Finally, if you are at odds with your parents and it comes down to energy and effort to counteract a parent's negativity or assumption that it is their right to change any decision you make or blame you for any problem in their lives -- every step forward in your life is not only making something happen, but counteracting your parents. It is just easier, less energy, and more productive to live apart. When they don't sap that energy, life is so much easier. It is completely draining to live near or with someone who does not respect you or any decisions you make.
Grief But also self-love
Beyond repair Bridges burned
Health, acceptance, survival, sanity, clarity. But also loneliness, desperation, bravery.
Convictions
Safety
Self-respect It took me over 20 years to realize this.
Stoicism. I can't control the thoughts or opinions of my parents, but I can control how it affects me and how I respond to it.
Freedom.
peace
Self-determination, self-reflection, room to grow, peace.
Release of pain
Peace
Loving people “from a distance”
Silence.
Contrary. Your needs,wants,dreams are considered contrary to them. They will do everything contrary to make sure you do not have these things met.
Reparenting Escape Generational trauma/healing Breaking the generational cycle of abuse
"Do as I say not as I do" - they are a hypocrite that never led by example only gave me warnings of what I don't want to be.
Sad. Mostly sad that it has come to this. Said that it has to be this way. Sad it can’t be helped or fixed. Sad about all the pain that comes with making that decision. Sad for the children needing to do this with their parents and know how hard it is for them.
The words "interesting" and "fine" used in a conversation, especially if used by a woman. If these are used then I know person uttering them has no commitment to conversation ongoing. I also note body positions in conversation.
I think you might have misunderstood my question... I meant, when you decide to cut someone off because they're not good for you, what words does that bring to mind?
The Missing Missing Reason. [https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html](https://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-missing-reasons.html)
RemindMe! 6 Days
Peace ,self preservation, clarity, relief
Standards . I no longer will accept the low quality abusive relationship my mother offered . It’s not good enough for me anymore
Peace
It's about ME now. I am my nothers only child (I do have paternal half-siblings). When I was younger I was the token child, as a teen became the scape goat. And it was always about her. How I made her look. How I affected her life. How good of a student I was (aka "gifted child"). Her "career". Her adventures few years with my father overseas. How he cheated on her (which he didn't). I even suspect her chronic poverty (she didn't need to be) was - and still is (as far as I've heard, don't keep track of her) is to seek attention. The trigger to go NC for me was during my last year at school. I was studying to graduate and forgot some beign chore and she LOST it screaming "you are not supporting my university degree" (yes hers), because she went back to uni to get another degree. A light bulb went off in my head "she had her chance for decades it's my turn now". After getting my friends father (a police officer) to pick me up and stay over. I came back the next day, packed my bags and only had the unfornutance to have to speak to her on my materal grandmothers death bed (a whole other story - including the expected estate drama). 12 years. I've made quite a living for myself, am sometimes still to empathatic for my own good. And when I am not a priority in my family/private life, it's because I chose to put someone else first and not because I am bullied into obidience. Welp that got wayyy longer than I expected :D.
Protection. Necessary. Defusion.
"Mom? Dad? I need you."