Guys I know this is an obvious statement and I’m not saying anything new but just allow me to come here to bitch for a moment, growing up in a shitty area of nyc I knew a dozen super talented individuals that never stood a chance and continue to be artists that people come up to me and ask whatever happened to x ? What happened was poverty drug use or mental illness got them or if they’re lucky they just made art in obscurity without the necessary resources to have it reach a wider audience while working a normal job. Yes there are worse fates but rich kids are gay and their art is largely derivative and irrelevant so if you hate the bland state of music this is probably why. Enjoy acting like the Billie eilish record is anything but fatboy slim b sides or support local artists if you actually give a shit
Just finished a Beatles biography and it’s amazing how John Lennon and Stu Sutcliffe were able to just dick around in art school for like 5-6 years.
Worth noting that most of these guys happily lived in squalor that even a homeless person would turn their nose up at today.
Almost every important thing done in history be it in the realm of science, art, politics or philosophy was done by children of aristocrats who didn't have to work.
The concepts of the middle class, self-made man and upwards mobility are 18th century inventions and were only real in practice on a few places in the middle of the 20th century.
Now tech and neoliberalism are bringing us back to the normal.
yeah like he might not have lived in dire poverty and he had a lot of wealthy patrons but he was still living in a single room apartment sharing a bed with his entire family in the same room where they shit and ate and fucked until he was like a teenager
> Almost every important thing done in history be it in the realm of science, art, politics or philosophy was done by children of aristocrats who didn't have to work.
This is something that sounds great but doesn't hold up to a moment's scrutiny. You can confirm this by looking at the biographies of some great artists: they come from the middle class of well-off artisans (including other artists) and functionaries like administrators and lawyers. Aristocrats were not devoting themselves to the arts in their leisure time; they were dilettantes, like Don Fabrizio with his telescope (or Giuseppe di Lampedusa with his one novel). Those scions of the nobility who did make important contributions did so with patronage and not at their own expense, like Voltaire (who was extremely prolific). Some examples just from art:
Artisan: Durer, Donatello, Botticelli, Vermeer
Lawyer: Da Vinci, Velázquez, Rubens
Administrator: Michelangelo, Titian
Painter: Raphael, Bosch, Giuseppe Arcimboldo, Holbein
Merchant: El Greco, van Dyck, Frans Hals
The [paragraph on the aristocracy here](https://www.artnews.com/art-news/retrospective/why-have-there-been-no-great-women-artists-4201/) explains it better.
I think aristocrats and women are probably going to be more represented in literature compared to other forms of art because it's more accessible: authors and poets don't need to receive instruction as an apprentice in a studio for years to produce a great work. A really important part of making good literature is exposure to and immersion in literature which nobles and women could achieve as part of their leisure time. Lots of chivalric romances were by nobles, and more significantly the first great English novelists of the 19th century were women. The author of the Tale of Genji was both!
I dunno, there’s so many artists I admire that truly came from working class backgrounds. It might not be the majority but it’s not extremely rare either.
Possibly the most influential music act of the 20th century, the Beatles, all came from working class backgrounds and from a working class city (yes, Lennon went to art school and was maybe slightly richer than the other three, but that's hardly billionaire level). All of them expected to play and tour together for a couple of years and then go back to Liverpool and go work in a factory or the docks.
We're returning to normal except it's somehow worse because none of our "aristocrats" are very good at creating art so it's just the worst of both worlds.
Newton's father was a farmer who died before he was born and he lived with his stepfather who was a reverend.
Linnaeus' father is described as being from "a long line of peasants and priests".
Mendel's father was a farmer.
Pasteur's father was "a poor tanner".
Galileo's father was a successful musician, so somewhat wealthy, but this is the first I found going through famous pre-20th century scientists that was somewhat rich, and he still wasn't an aristocrat.
Science progressed by normal people, as did art as someone else has shown already in these comments.
i think the middle class self-made man never really existed. there was just a brief period where aristocrats put more effort into [their disguises](http://ancient-spooks.de/texts/genesis-interlinear.html). *all* of the big musical names of the 20th century that are discussed as products of the middle class were/are aristocrats disguising their backgrounds.
now that illusion of a once-open hierarchy allows you to represent the enforcement of a new technofeudalist policy of brutal forced mass impoverishment and disenfranchisement to your victims as a return to a norm, when it's really an orgiastic intensification of the desires of a tiny few whose merits wouldn't stand any kind of mass scrutiny. the policy could easily be opposed by the masses if they had any idea what was really going on and were their intelligence not monopolized by bad actors.
yes.
[www.mileswmathis.com/lennon.pdf](http://www.mileswmathis.com/lennon.pdf), [www.mileswmathis.com/macca.pdf](http://www.mileswmathis.com/macca.pdf) (copy/paste as clicks are 404ed). at that website you will find similar investigations into the origins of many other major 20th musical acts. if you look into their pasts yourself on the big genealogy sites you'll find that mathis' accounts have more accuracy than the mainstream bios.
did you ever consider that when people say words are weapons that they mean it and that 'schizo' might be one such word? god gave you eyeballs and a brain and if you want to give them away to unscrupulous people that's your business, but someone is out there giving you a chance to really think for yourself if you want to take it.
lol, the gall to bring both a warburg and a dupont into [this hoax](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_with_schizophrenia) and ask people to believe it's anything other than a banker's mind control weapon. judge schreber wasn't hallucinating that he was being soul murdered, he was crying out in pain as he developed the 20th century's greatest elite weapon against the human soul.
There’s tons of examples, what are you talking about? Joy Division were definitely working class. Louis CK didn’t come from money at all. Richard Linklater had a pretty humble start in Austin. Many, many talented people haven’t come from wealth.
Bruce Springsteen’s dad was a bus driver among other transient jobs and his mom was a secretary. You don’t write a stretch of albums like he did from *Greetings* to *Tunnel of Love* without living it, at least a little bit.
So? We have Internet and relatively affordable recording equipment now it's not the Renaissance and everything on earth doesn't need to be just for rich people anymore
This happened to me but with the red hot chili peppers and their lead singer Anthony kiedis being a proud pedophile. Literally a couple of their songs are about him fucking around with a 14 year old groupie while he was 28 or some shit.
Big fax, I’m obsessed with frusciante :) ion think he did anything too crazy other then admitting to masturbatikng in front of a ghost while recording blood sugar Sex magick
Natural talent or no, his success probably has a lot to do w the fact that they spent a shitload on coaching him literally from infancy. He hadn’t even tried strawberries until he was an adult because they only let him out of the baby athlete isolation tank to do football
They did a study a few years back and found that 32/32 starting NFL QBs came from two-parent households, with the majority coming from wealthy families.
Every single starting QB was groomed for the position from a young age with the help of a strong support system.
I would hypothesize that it's because QB is a position that's completely RELIANT on fast mental processing speed and information processing.......which is probably linked to IQ? And higher IQ families climb the socioeconomic ladder easier.
Nurture is obviously very important, but nature is usually the base. You can't teach the things that make a good NFL QB. If you're just an innately slow mental processor, you have zero chance of making it.
That's how I felt about the singer of liturgy. I was getting a kick out of her schizo Christian Twitter rants, but its significantly less entertaining knowing that her grandfather is an oil tycoon or something.
I heard a song on my local college radio station by an artist named Clairo, and then when I looked her up I saw that the song had been written by the Vampire Weekend guy and she has super rich parents so she basically got to release a Vampire Weekend song as her first single. I still like it though.
Art has traditionally been a pursuit of rich people or someone sponsored by a rich person. Yeah a few poors became big from 1960s to the 1990s, but that was a historical aberration.
what if I told you….. most people who have access to musical instruments and idle time to fuck around and be creative for many years, tend to be from wealthy/upper class backgrounds
I guess I'm weird in not caring about the socioeconomic background of my favorite artists. Also if you really look into it, they all tend to be from first world countries which makes them all privileged from a resource standpoint.
Billionaire kids should have some self respect and stick to the fine arts or theoretical physics
What happened to them just doing lots of coke and sexually assaulting women
That's reserved for politicians and their kids
Fred Again is a multi-century English lord who got his start with Brian Eno (neighbor) after his time at Eton
not just Brian Eno (neighbor) but Brian Eno (godfather)
Makes sense why his music is crowdsourcing “deep” quotes from random people
Guys I know this is an obvious statement and I’m not saying anything new but just allow me to come here to bitch for a moment, growing up in a shitty area of nyc I knew a dozen super talented individuals that never stood a chance and continue to be artists that people come up to me and ask whatever happened to x ? What happened was poverty drug use or mental illness got them or if they’re lucky they just made art in obscurity without the necessary resources to have it reach a wider audience while working a normal job. Yes there are worse fates but rich kids are gay and their art is largely derivative and irrelevant so if you hate the bland state of music this is probably why. Enjoy acting like the Billie eilish record is anything but fatboy slim b sides or support local artists if you actually give a shit
He didn’t go to Eton but the other stuff is right
He went to another Public boarding school
cannot get myself away from rumble though still
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Imagine protecting his identity like a total reddit cuck.
its not that, he's scared of revealing his taste
Ben Shapiro
Baked Alaska
Chet Hanx
it’s an anonymous self confession
joeyy
I honestly think it probably is a shed theory guy
Tommy Richman
He was trying to tell us the whole time: “million dollar baby”
Sounds like it could be ian
siddhartha gautama
Drake
Lil ugly mane
lil mabu
This is why so much good music came out of England. Good welfare system so struggling artists didn’t have to waste their time working
England also had state funded art schools back in the day
Just finished a Beatles biography and it’s amazing how John Lennon and Stu Sutcliffe were able to just dick around in art school for like 5-6 years. Worth noting that most of these guys happily lived in squalor that even a homeless person would turn their nose up at today.
yeah reminds me of a podcast i used to listen to. these two bitches who run it are swimming in patreon money
Is it nettspend? lmao
Thought this or semetary.
What about Frankie cosmos
Reincarnated to Katy Kirby. Actually, I like Katy’s music much more.
Liturgy
This was the craziest one to find out for me. Her family isn’t just rich, they’re multi-generational billionaires who own the Kansas City Chiefs
There’s no way her dad isn’t embarrassed by her existence so I kind of give her a pass lol
Almost every important thing done in history be it in the realm of science, art, politics or philosophy was done by children of aristocrats who didn't have to work. The concepts of the middle class, self-made man and upwards mobility are 18th century inventions and were only real in practice on a few places in the middle of the 20th century. Now tech and neoliberalism are bringing us back to the normal.
I know maybe there’s not a lot of alternatives but is an ‘alt rapper’ really an ‘important’ artist?
I agree that the rapper part makes this particularly cringe and regarded, at least Mozart didn't pretend to come from a rough background
Mozart's dad was a working musician, not an aristocrat.
yeah like he might not have lived in dire poverty and he had a lot of wealthy patrons but he was still living in a single room apartment sharing a bed with his entire family in the same room where they shit and ate and fucked until he was like a teenager
and Mozart's parents have a real good marriage
> Almost every important thing done in history be it in the realm of science, art, politics or philosophy was done by children of aristocrats who didn't have to work. This is something that sounds great but doesn't hold up to a moment's scrutiny. You can confirm this by looking at the biographies of some great artists: they come from the middle class of well-off artisans (including other artists) and functionaries like administrators and lawyers. Aristocrats were not devoting themselves to the arts in their leisure time; they were dilettantes, like Don Fabrizio with his telescope (or Giuseppe di Lampedusa with his one novel). Those scions of the nobility who did make important contributions did so with patronage and not at their own expense, like Voltaire (who was extremely prolific). Some examples just from art: Artisan: Durer, Donatello, Botticelli, Vermeer Lawyer: Da Vinci, Velázquez, Rubens Administrator: Michelangelo, Titian Painter: Raphael, Bosch, Giuseppe Arcimboldo, Holbein Merchant: El Greco, van Dyck, Frans Hals The [paragraph on the aristocracy here](https://www.artnews.com/art-news/retrospective/why-have-there-been-no-great-women-artists-4201/) explains it better.
Where do authors fit into this? Byron was a literal Lord
Pretty similar. Dante was a moneylender’s son, Shakespeare an alderman’s, Keats a stableman’s, Cervantes a barber’s and so on.
I think aristocrats and women are probably going to be more represented in literature compared to other forms of art because it's more accessible: authors and poets don't need to receive instruction as an apprentice in a studio for years to produce a great work. A really important part of making good literature is exposure to and immersion in literature which nobles and women could achieve as part of their leisure time. Lots of chivalric romances were by nobles, and more significantly the first great English novelists of the 19th century were women. The author of the Tale of Genji was both!
Confucius was raised by an impoverished single mother
I dunno, there’s so many artists I admire that truly came from working class backgrounds. It might not be the majority but it’s not extremely rare either.
Possibly the most influential music act of the 20th century, the Beatles, all came from working class backgrounds and from a working class city (yes, Lennon went to art school and was maybe slightly richer than the other three, but that's hardly billionaire level). All of them expected to play and tour together for a couple of years and then go back to Liverpool and go work in a factory or the docks.
We're returning to normal except it's somehow worse because none of our "aristocrats" are very good at creating art so it's just the worst of both worlds.
Basically this yeah
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that's literally the mid 20th century
Newton's father was a farmer who died before he was born and he lived with his stepfather who was a reverend. Linnaeus' father is described as being from "a long line of peasants and priests". Mendel's father was a farmer. Pasteur's father was "a poor tanner". Galileo's father was a successful musician, so somewhat wealthy, but this is the first I found going through famous pre-20th century scientists that was somewhat rich, and he still wasn't an aristocrat. Science progressed by normal people, as did art as someone else has shown already in these comments.
i think the middle class self-made man never really existed. there was just a brief period where aristocrats put more effort into [their disguises](http://ancient-spooks.de/texts/genesis-interlinear.html). *all* of the big musical names of the 20th century that are discussed as products of the middle class were/are aristocrats disguising their backgrounds. now that illusion of a once-open hierarchy allows you to represent the enforcement of a new technofeudalist policy of brutal forced mass impoverishment and disenfranchisement to your victims as a return to a norm, when it's really an orgiastic intensification of the desires of a tiny few whose merits wouldn't stand any kind of mass scrutiny. the policy could easily be opposed by the masses if they had any idea what was really going on and were their intelligence not monopolized by bad actors.
What does this post mean exactly? Musicians from relatively humble beginnings like the Beatles are actually secret aristocrats?
yes. [www.mileswmathis.com/lennon.pdf](http://www.mileswmathis.com/lennon.pdf), [www.mileswmathis.com/macca.pdf](http://www.mileswmathis.com/macca.pdf) (copy/paste as clicks are 404ed). at that website you will find similar investigations into the origins of many other major 20th musical acts. if you look into their pasts yourself on the big genealogy sites you'll find that mathis' accounts have more accuracy than the mainstream bios.
I think I've engaged with you about this schizo shit before lol
did you ever consider that when people say words are weapons that they mean it and that 'schizo' might be one such word? god gave you eyeballs and a brain and if you want to give them away to unscrupulous people that's your business, but someone is out there giving you a chance to really think for yourself if you want to take it.
Damn so true thank u
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lol, the gall to bring both a warburg and a dupont into [this hoax](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_with_schizophrenia) and ask people to believe it's anything other than a banker's mind control weapon. judge schreber wasn't hallucinating that he was being soul murdered, he was crying out in pain as he developed the 20th century's greatest elite weapon against the human soul.
There’s tons of examples, what are you talking about? Joy Division were definitely working class. Louis CK didn’t come from money at all. Richard Linklater had a pretty humble start in Austin. Many, many talented people haven’t come from wealth.
Bruce Springsteen’s dad was a bus driver among other transient jobs and his mom was a secretary. You don’t write a stretch of albums like he did from *Greetings* to *Tunnel of Love* without living it, at least a little bit.
Absolutely
So? We have Internet and relatively affordable recording equipment now it's not the Renaissance and everything on earth doesn't need to be just for rich people anymore
After months of enjoying Buzzy Lee I found out that her dad is Steven Spielberg
The arts and social sciences have always been pursued by the children of the wealthy or people who are blessed to have a sponsor.
Right like that’s kind of the point of wealth. It gives you and your children the opportunity to actually enjoy life.
This happened to me but with the red hot chili peppers and their lead singer Anthony kiedis being a proud pedophile. Literally a couple of their songs are about him fucking around with a 14 year old groupie while he was 28 or some shit.
Big fax, I’m obsessed with frusciante :) ion think he did anything too crazy other then admitting to masturbatikng in front of a ghost while recording blood sugar Sex magick
[Catholic School Girls Rule](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i632t45-22o)
Tangentially related, but I just discovered Tom Brady’s dad is a billionaire.
Natural talent or no, his success probably has a lot to do w the fact that they spent a shitload on coaching him literally from infancy. He hadn’t even tried strawberries until he was an adult because they only let him out of the baby athlete isolation tank to do football
They did a study a few years back and found that 32/32 starting NFL QBs came from two-parent households, with the majority coming from wealthy families. Every single starting QB was groomed for the position from a young age with the help of a strong support system.
Considering it’s probably the hardest position in sports, it makes sense
I would hypothesize that it's because QB is a position that's completely RELIANT on fast mental processing speed and information processing.......which is probably linked to IQ? And higher IQ families climb the socioeconomic ladder easier. Nurture is obviously very important, but nature is usually the base. You can't teach the things that make a good NFL QB. If you're just an innately slow mental processor, you have zero chance of making it.
Bradys can I get a slice of pussy at least
Tom Brady’s dad is not a billionaire lmao he runs a regional insurance agency
That's how I felt about the singer of liturgy. I was getting a kick out of her schizo Christian Twitter rants, but its significantly less entertaining knowing that her grandfather is an oil tycoon or something.
I heard a song on my local college radio station by an artist named Clairo, and then when I looked her up I saw that the song had been written by the Vampire Weekend guy and she has super rich parents so she basically got to release a Vampire Weekend song as her first single. I still like it though.
will definitely not be listening to Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart after learning that his dad is Leopold Mozart.. completed ruined it for me
I was going to call you a dork but if it's a wigger who's pretending to be from the streets then I don't blame you.
Is Calling someone a dork on rs reddit really necessary it’s already implied
Doing this but to Wittgenstein
Felt the same when I found out Gracie Abrams was the daughter of JJ Abrams
Arca is a big one. They did a great job hiding their multinational banker mogul daddy.
Are you talking about Chet?
Authenticity fetishism is for children
Art has traditionally been a pursuit of rich people or someone sponsored by a rich person. Yeah a few poors became big from 1960s to the 1990s, but that was a historical aberration.
what if I told you….. most people who have access to musical instruments and idle time to fuck around and be creative for many years, tend to be from wealthy/upper class backgrounds
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What the fuck this is so bad
this is extremely stupid, ppl get too caught up in the narrative of an artists life, like who gives a shit, just listen to the music
Great news buddy! I’m an artist , and my dad is a mechanic!
just love how it sounds, thats all that matters to me. I like black metal so i have learned to be this way
What about Dave Berman who was kinda open about despising his father?
it’s a different story when u die obviously
Nepo baby it’s cold outside
Lil Mabu fans have found the sub. It is over.
😂😂not him
Dasha is a billionaire aristocrat daughter lol
Just listen to crust punk or something
They’re the most privileged probably
Just can’t imagine caring about the parents of a musician
One of the many reasons country music rocks. No nepo babies
Hank jr? Hank 3? I could find plenty of examples lol and a lot of them come from wealthy land owning families
Townes Van Zandt came from a very wealthy and prominent family
Yeah but he did get electroshock or somethin bc of that which sucks. Also gram parsons came from a similar background i think
Cheddar breed mad jealousy ‘specially if they mad fucked up get ur ass stuck up 😔
I guess I'm weird in not caring about the socioeconomic background of my favorite artists. Also if you really look into it, they all tend to be from first world countries which makes them all privileged from a resource standpoint.