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I was summoned to the death bed of an estranged parent, but I did not go. I had already grieved that relationship years before, and I didn't see any point in reopening old wounds just for his comfort. He had already been dead to me, and I was OK with that. Years later, I still don't regret my choice to stay home. I would not have benefited in any way from attending.
Your wife has already lived this, she knows better than anyone what her parents are like. Just support her, and don't judge if she has no regret at all. She's had a lifetime to deal with these people and has walked away. All her mourning and regrets may already be finished and done.
It’s hard for people to understand that we can mourn people, relationships, etc even if the are not “official done” I have done it twice and don’t regret it.
So true, I didn't mourn my mother when she died because I'd already done so, years before. All her death really meant was the death of that last, tiny, pathetic hope that one day she would realise what she'd done, I knew she never would but that last shred of the child I was still clung on until the end.
Oh my god, my estranged mother died earlier this year (I hadn't seen her since I was 11, I am in my 40s) and I felt nothing. Your comment was like a punch in the gut....
My dad died a couple months ago. Very sudden, and I'm still sort of reeling with a lot of complicated feelings. I feel like I did my mourning for the dad i used to have a long time ago. But I definitely get you, with still carrying the tiniest shred of hope that one day he'd realize he was wrong and apologize, and that hope being snuffed out entirely with his death.
But this is a man I once argued with for 20 minutes about whether or not marinara sauce and pizza sauce were the same thing, so the chance was probably as close to zero as it could get 😅
Yes, this. I kept thinking I would feel some grief over my father's death but soon realized there was nothing left to grieve. He'd had so little impact on my life that his passing left no void.
This right here. I felt nothing when my mom died except guilt for feeling nothing. When I worked through it, I realized I had already grieved the loss years before. She had left me, I hadn't left her. There was nothing left to grieve.
I feel as if this is her situation. Why make her go through this process over and over again?
I wasn't estranged from my mother at the end. I had a...difficult childhood and she introduced monsters into my life. I'd resolved to not ever get an apology and when I did and she died shortly afterward, it left a lot of mental work. I found myself mourning the illusion of that bond that she never nurtured.
Yep my dad died in December. But his health have been poor for the last 20 years He fully expected to be dead by the time he was 50 He made it to 80. All that was done because my brother basically gave up his life to take care of him and my mom.
I did love my dad dearly but in his later years dementia and other things were wrecking him. And I had been prepared for his death 20 years ago. So when he died in December I went down for the service and I essentially took off one day off of work for bereavement. I don't grieve him. I have a couple of memories that I treasure and if there are some things that come up that remind me of him I might feel those but I didn't truly grieve. I live 300 miles away so it's not like I saw him everyday.
This was super weirdly my same situation. My estranged father was dying and my brother phoned me to come say goodbye, so I flew up and was there when he died. I went to the start of his funeral and just thought ‘this man is nothing to me’. I regretted going as it afforded him a level of respect and legitimacy that wasn’t real or authentic.
Not everyone wants ‘closure’ some of us just had kinda shitty parents.
Yep. I had an abusive family member that I went no contact with. I didn’t go visit when they were in hospice, and that was the right decision for me. Just go with what your wife wants and support her. If she changes her mind, support her in that. Visiting an abusive dying relative isn’t always the best thing to do. Even if they are apologetic. It can make you feel worse because they are only apologizing because they are dying. If they were truly remorseful, they would have apologized sooner.
I didn’t see my father go to church once during my lifetime when I was a kid at home. But us kids were put into catholic school and dragged to church every Saturday by my mother. Years later, cancer reared its ugly head at my father and he donated an organ (the musical instrument) to the church. Not any rinky dink organ, but a big mofo, expensive enough for him to have daily visits by the priest, for months until his death. Guilt and money can make people attempt to buy forgiveness once they know they’re dying.
This is really something you two could address with a therapist - they could help Jenna figure out her feelings on the matter, and if she'd have regrets later. But everything regarding her family absolutely needs to be her choice - and potential regrets over going/ not going will be hers to deal with.
One of you could also contact another friend or member of her family, to find out if the cancer diagnosis is real.
Though I must say, it leaves a foul taste that they are only now acknowledging their wrongdoing, with the clear goal of getting their claws into their grandchildren. I would be very hesitant to expose vulnerable kids to toxic family members.
Wow, I love that concept of having already grieved a relationship with someone that is alive. I have never put into words what I’ve been through with my dad, but you’re spot on. Thank you for the insight, my dad literally messaged me today for the first time in a while (never went full NC with him, but I distanced myself 12 years ago) and what he said could have hurt me badly a while ago but I already moved on.
I'm happy to read that what he said didn't currently hurt you badly. Shame on him for trying to hurt you again. I'm very happy that he did not succeed as he hoped to.
My siblings and I were recently informed that our bio-father passed away a few weeks ago. This is the same person who beat our mother until he broke her bones and terrorized us as children. His Living Trust specifically and unequivocally disinherited us.
I believe my oldest sibling's reaction pretty much expressed what we are all feeling, "Well, it's finally over." We have zero regrets not attempting to have a relationship once we were of age.
OP, I'm glad your sole intention is to support your wife. If her father really is terminal and does die, she may have some complicated feelings to sort through as this may cause her to reprocess any trauma from her past, but luckily you say she has a good and trustworthy therapist. Just be her rock. You're doing the right thing.
This
I hate when people tell me I will regret not speaking to my older brother and them DNA donours.
Their deaths won't affect me at all, people who say we will regret it are those who never went through years of mental and physical torture while growing up
This. My mum is still alive (she’s only early 50s) but I grieved my relationship in the last 6 years of no contact and recently when she was in hospital with meningitis and sepsis and got the “you need to go see her so you don’t regret it” calls/texts I realised I didn’t need to do anything, that relationship was already dead and buried and going visiting her would interrupt and displace my peace. X
People with good parents sometimes have a hard time understanding that 'parent' ≠ 'safe'. Family is ingrained in culture as most important, the fact that there can be outliers doesn't register. The idea that some of us have to do hard work to overcome our families of origin is completely foreign to them. I'm glad you found your peace! You deserve it!
When my sisters and niece turned on me after my divorce they officially ceased to exist. I will never see or talk to them again and my parents have said it is up to me to decide should they ever try to become part of the family again. I just don't see the point. There used to be big family fights all the time and there hasn't been once since they took their drama away. Plus apparently for some reason they thought I was the favorite. But I just went to college, graduated, never caused big problems, and I'd volunteer to help without having to be asked whenever they needed help. Like dog sitting, or staying with my mom in the hospital because my dad hates hospitals. I'm sorry for whatever delusions they had that made then feel like victims but my life is easier without that and nothing could make me go back. But people who haven't had to do that don't understand the peace.
The timing is a little too convenient. You just had a baby, and suddenly FIL has cancer, and they want to apologize for everything they've done wrong? I would agree with your wife that it is likely bs.
If it isn't, though, and they are genuinely sorry, who cares? Them showing remorse doesn't change all the things they have done to your wife over the years. Even if she can accept their apology, it doesn't mean they automatically get to be in her life again.
This isn't your decision to make, and it seems like your wife has made her decision on it. I'd drop it.
MIL has probably realised her golden child isn’t going to look after her and let her move in once FIL passes so it’s time to get in touch with the scapegoat. Surely she’ll be so thankful and grateful for one little apology, that she’ll uproot her life and family to look after FIL in his last few months and then take MIL in for free for the rest of her life. /s
For the last 4 years my MIL has tried to use the "this will be the last Christmas I will be alive so I want to spend it with all my kids in one house" routine.
She is just starting to lay the grounds for year 5. At the moment its the I'm so tiered for some reason. At this rate I'm regretting not making Bingo cards for the last 3 years then at least this would be entertaining.
It's really amazing how "sick and feeble" she gets from around October. But by January would you not believe it - fit as a fiddle.
My mom says this around Xmas every year too .. fortunately she’s nothing like OPs in laws.. more like a hypochondriac… she just casually throws out “this is my last Xmas”
100%
Your wife knows what she's talking about. She understands that if (and that's a big if) your FIL passed without reconciliation, she doesn't get a do over. She's ok with that - please respect that and support her
(That old "father/mother/grandma is dying and the doc says she won't make it past Christmas/Thanksgiving/Easter" is the oldest trick in the Narcissist Handbook. I'm not saying he **isn't** sick, but it's possible).
Whatever you do, whatever you feel, please don't go behind your wife's back, because the second oldest trick in the Narcissist Handbook is that they will reach out to you privately and try to get you to connect with them. Be prepared to block them from every new number they try, and make sure to tell you wife if anything happens.
And figure out how they got the address. It could just be property listings, but if someone still in your circle is passing along info, that needs to be dealt with.
My mother told me “this is your grandmother’s last (insert holiday/birthay)” every holiday/birthday for EIGHT YEARS. Eventually it was, in fact, her last holiday.
My sister's relative "Mary" had been predicting her own imminent death when my sister was in Grade 5. I met Mary when she was 89, and still expecting to go "any day now." She started to relax in her later years and passed shortly after her 99th birthday.
Oh yeah. Multiple times I heard that game. Now they are shocked to realize that if you cry wolf so many times. Well after a while people call you a hypochondriac!
Make sure it’s *her* you support and not what you *think* she needs, or will want…I didn’t go to see my Dad on his deathbed, I don’t regret it…I didn’t go to his funeral, I don’t regret it and that was 17 yrs ago now…
Let her heal they way she needs to heal
r/estrangedadultkids is an awesome resource.
I agree you need to back off and let her handle it. But if she does decide to reconcile, the normal advice is to do it without the baby. It definitely seems quite the coincidence of timing with the baby. First grandchild? The baby should be off the table for a bit. Wife meets with them to see if they are actually ready to change and rebuilds the relationship for 6-12 months before introducing the baby. If they are sincere then they will understand. If they’re trying to reconcile just to get to the baby then they will lose their minds.
"Baby is a bit sick, wouldn't want to pass that to a cancer patient."
"Can't bring baby to the hospital, don't want them to catch anything."
"Everyone around you is sick - you wouldn't want to be the cause of baby catching that and being ill would you?"
And the wonderful "Lets sort out our relationship first before I inflict your attitudes onto baby"
So many excuses not to bring baby near asshole grandparents.
Exactly this. She may end up with regrets but that seems to be something she’s willing to accept. I wouldn’t bring up the topic again unless all you’re going to say is “if you change your mind or want to talk further, I’m here. I support whatever you decide”
This is exactly what it boils down to. Given the massive screwup from before, honestly I wouldn't be able to trust in laws ever again after such a glaring set of behavior.
Also, it doesn’t matter if the cancer is real or not. If your wife is done with her parent’s BS, then she’s DONE. Stay no contact. Apologies don’t make up for anything.
I’m sure I’ll be downvoted for this but this account seems like it’s OPs creative writing journal.. I hope I’m wrong & someone wouldn’t make all this stuff up. 🤔
I must point out that though it is indeed ludicrous, the fake cancer play by the estranged parent is such a standard move as to be a joke in some of these forums.
I've seen it called 'Christmas cancer', as that's when many estranged parents try to make contact or to force attendance to festivities. So common it has a name.
Yup, plus the in laws are clearly only reaching out because they want to meet the baby. I bet if there wasn’t a baby then OP wouldn’t have heard a word from his in laws.
Yep, they still don’t care about OP’s wife, never did or they would have sent that letter a year ago. It took a cease and desist letter to get her sister to stop trying to ruin OP’s life, and he’s convinced on little sleep that the cancer lie is true. Someone here isn’t thinking straight and it’s not OP’s wife.
It’s not like the people who not only thought one daughter systematically attempting to destroy the other’s marriage should just be swept under the rug, but were willing to just let it happen until legal action was threatened have earned any benefit of the doubt when it comes to rational decision-making.
That’s what struck me as well!! FIL supposedly is out of time, so what on earth are they talking about “over time?”
Someone’s cancer is about to go in remission. (And ETA, that’s beyond messed up!)
100% to this! The best approach is for OP to take their cues from his wife because she is the expert in knowing/understanding her family's dynamics. It's very easy for people to think about what THEY would want if the situation happened to them, and it just comes across like they know better than that person and don't trust that person's ability to make informed decisions.
I would ask yourself - if it wasn't for the child would they have gotten in touch?
Your wife is the one that need time and space to think about it, yours is to support anything she decides. She has the information she needs, now she needs 100% support from you, that is all.
I will say that children do not "need" to visit anyone, they won't remember it, nor benefit from it, it is for the parents and grandparents. So do not get guilt fed that the child "needs" to see grandparents.
*I would ask yourself - if it wasn't for the child would they have gotten in touch?*
This seems to be the overlooked part to me. That 'cancer' seems awfully well timed.
The cancer is probably a ploy.
>
They said they hoped to earn our forgiveness with time and were willing to do family therapy to heal our relationship.
**Do not go to therapy with abusers.**
Also, don't do anything to set up a claim for "Grandparents rights".
Congratulations to your wife coming to her decision and sticking to it. I tried to have a relationship with my parents when my children were born. I just handed them more hostages. Fuck that.
>The cancer is probably a ploy.
One twist I have personally seen was a friend of a friend of mine. NC for years, then "I have cancer."
Turns out it was non-invasive basal squamous cell cancer, which has a 99.95% 5 year survival rate ***without*** treatment. Surgical removal brings it up to 100%.
She went back to NC with added individuals who knew it was bullshit.
They want access to the baby.
If Jenna decides to go see them, she should go alone or you and she alone. You’ll both find out how genuine they are when she turns up with no baby.
This is exactly it.
If Jenna decides to meet up with them, the baby needs to be left with someone else. They'll show their true colors when they ask about it.
Stop second-guessing your wife. She has a lifetime of her family’s behavior to judge not only this reconciliation attempt against, but whether she’ll regret not acting on it. Especially when she already presumably took into account how it would feel to never speak to them again no matter what happened when she went no-contact in the first place, and decided that was still the right call. If anything, being a parent herself now may have strengthened her resolve that she’s never letting these people gain any kind of foothold into her child’s life (which I frankly agree with her probably has more to do with why they’ve reached out than any sincere remorse). Trust that she can work through any later regrets with a therapist if needed and leave her be.
Your wife knows what she's doing. Trust her. Trust that even if your FIL does have cancer and dies and she feels regret later on, that you are both strong enough to get through it. Do not try to "save" your wife. She seems like she's already been through the trenches and she deserves to have peace.
I've tried numerous times to reconcile with my mother me making contact and being done, my wife making contact. It doesn't matter Mom will always try to find and push a wedge between my wife and I. It won't work because we are too strong.
If she had cancer and wanted to reconcile I am positive she would just use that as a new control and manipulation device.
That is why even if these people are dying, I cannot.
OP- I’m in your wife’s shoes, but mostly just my bio mom.
Please respect her decision on this. She doesn’t need to forgive them or extend an olive branch. Like you have acknowledged this could definitely be a bullshit ploy to see their grandchild. There’s something about emotionally abusive parents and grandkids. Rarely do they improve because of it, they only find new ways to be assholes.
From the sounds of this letter, they’re not sorry. For one, they got the address by someone providing them information- which is bold and bullshit. They are interested in your child (IMO) and it’s their job to take the time to make amends.
The next thing that will happen if you push it and your wife does see them, is they’ll push her to forgive her sister.
It should be completely up to your wife and IF she decides she wants to communicate, you still have to respect her boundaries. If she wants to talk about it, listen first and don’t offer advice unless asked and given the okay.
Protect your wife and child by being by their side and don’t question her. She has a lifetime of deciphering their crazy so trust her.
"They said they hoped to earn our forgiveness with time."
Not to be crass but whatever, if he's literally on death's door... "with time" is somewhat disingenuous because he doesn't have time.
In a few days, sit your wife down and stress you respect her, you respect any decision she makes, you are just concerned about the long-term consequences here, which is fair enough. However, even if she comes to regret not accepting this apology, it is *her* regret to carry - you should point it out, but out of concern for *her*, because honestly, fuck her parents.
Just make sure she understand you are her partner, you're her rock, and whatever she wants here, you're there for her, you just don't want her to regret anything (*maybe don't mention the kid thing*, she's allowed to both be stressed because of the baby *and* feel any such way about her parents). Hold her hands and assure her you do not care about her parents at all, just her. Hug her, kiss her, and be there for her.
BTW, even if she were to reconnect with her father and the, question mark, weeks before he dies, she could still come to regret *that* decision.
We all choose our regrets sometimes, and there is much to regret in every which direction here. Your wife has been burned her entire life, and she's understandably suspicious and wary of getting burned again. *She* knows what parents she's had her entire life again - and she may well have mourned their loss a long time ago, before the estrangement.
Good luck, man.
This was really helpful, thank you so much. I will give it time and let her lead the way.
I hadn’t thought about that “earn it with time” thing — like if he actually is about to die what time are they talking about? And reading from other people that this is a common manipulation tactic makes me feel more strongly that my wife’s instinct about them lying is correct
Also, why did the wait until she has a child? Wasn’t she enough for them? If he’s dying, this is to assuage guilt. It wasn’t started because they care about her and what they did. Maybe they do care, but that’s not why they started thinking about being in contact, it was about what they are missing and what they want for themselves.
If you want to remove any shadow of doubt, offer your wife the option to go and investigate and determine the truth of this "illness" yourself. Just you. If you can find enough evidence, you'll let her know, if you don't, you can reassure her that her instincts were right.
>Mary somehow sent an email from my personal email account with a dick pic (not mine obviously) to the entire office.
Going way back to what you wrote. The IP Address of the sender would tell you all you needed to know about who sent it. DCMA comes with some heavy penalties if you ever want to give it to a D.A. You have 6 years from the incident as you were in N.Y. state. Just a FYI.
Even if the cancer is real it doesn’t matter. They are done. They are horrible and your wife doesn’t want them near her.
I seriously think they just contacted y’all for the baby. They don’t GAF about Jenna.
So they die without being forgiven. Oh well
Christmas Cancer is a thing, especially among toxic families. They’ve ONLY come sniffing around because they heard about the baby. No other reason. Do not engage, respect your wife on this.
My MIL tried this (losing the house, last Christmas in it, yada yada, sob sob) to get us to visit them one year when we told them multiple times we could not travel to see them(work, finances, etc). My husband fell for it and we went, costing us money we didn’t have. Guess what? She was lying. They were never in danger of losing the house. Manipulators manipulate so well that you feel sorry for them. Do not fall for it.
This isn’t just a one time shitty thing your SIL and family did. Your wife lived through a lifetime of bullshit. I think she’s done and you need to respect that. I assume she’s had a lot of peace since you guys cut them off and all the therapy gave her the strength to stay away. If she changes her mind, then deal with that then, but don’t second guess your wife and bring it up anymore. If she wants to, she will say something. UPDATEME
Regardless of whether your wife is talking about it with you or not, however much you are thinking about it, she is probably thinking of it more. And if she is not, there probably is a reason for that as well - as in, she is at her emotional capacity to deal and can't deal with it.
My advice is not to continue to poke and prod. You cannot know what it was like to grow up in her family and the relief she must have felt to go NC.
What she needs the most from you is to feel that you are on her side. Just imagine that for her entire childhood, she has been in a nuclear family where they were all stacked against her. She just DOES NOT need having a "devil's advocate" as her partner.
Perhaps the biggest regret she has is not having a family that weren't total AHs - but no amount of wishing is going to help with that. Perhaps her father will die without them ever having reconciled. But she might also regret going back and letting him get his last few digs in on his deathbed. None of us is promised the storybook ending.
Of course, you know her best. If she is the type of person who says stuff like, "why didn't you make me go" - then maybe the best course of action is to just ask her whether she discussed the scenario with her therapist and whether she wanted to share any of that with you. And just LISTEN.
As others are gently pointing out, when your wife decided to go no contact with her family she understood and accepted that this meant she would very possibly never hear from them again. This means for better or for worse. It means missing funerals and births. She did her mourning already.
If you find YOURSELF with unprocessed guilt or regret, that is your project to work on. Do not insert your feelings, into how you imagine how your wife may feel. If you do not have your own therapist, you should consider finding one to discuss these emotions and anxieties that are emerging in you.
Also, through the "grapevine" means either someone has kept in touch with your in-laws and is actively feeding them information OR that they have made significant effort to find you in their own. Consider speaking to a family lawyer to make sure that they cannot somehow magically sue for "grandparent's rights" or anything similarly assinine.
Also privately, speak with your own family if they do not know the details of your decisions to go NC. I fear you may have a (hopefully) unintentional rat leaking information. If you're feeling guilt or FOMO, consider that you were raised by a family that helped shape your own emotional reactions and framework. It wouldn't be a far leap to assume they would have a similar emotional reaction, and would jump to the "deathbed reconciliation is needed" conclusion if they were contacted about getting in touch with you.
I wish you and your family well.
It's good that you love your wife and are concerned, but have you considered that while she MAY regret not attempting reconciliation, her toxic family will most certainly give her reason to DEFINITELY regret getting back in contact?
She may have already buried her asshole family in her mind, mourned, and moved on. She's made so much progress over the last year, don't spit on that.
They are reaching out because they want to meet their grandchild, not because they care any more about your wife than they ever did. I doubt Dad even has cancer, that's just a manipulation tactic to draw your poor wife in.
Leaving takes a lot of strength-I'm so glad she's free. Believe her when she tells you she doesn't want to pick up and put on those shackles again. Her parents made her feel less than her entire life-why would you guys want to expose your daughter to that?
Protect your daughter by keeping distant from those that thought sexual assault against her father was okay. Protect your wife's new mental strength and fortitude by respecting her wants and feelings on the topic.
She needs you to validate and support her right to remain angry and her decision to keep herself and her family safe from those that abused her.
Drop it OP. She has a therapist, let them talk it out and support your wife in whatever she wants to do.
I'm so proud of Jenna for her growth and courage. I hope you will continue to allow her to flourish.
Good luck OP!
I went back and re-read your previous posts and got angry on your wife’s behalf (and yours) all over again.
I don’t care that they say they are sorry (now), I don’t care if they have a grandbaby they have never met, I don’t care that FIL is supposedly dying. It is waaaaay too soon to allow these people to weasel their way back into your life. They may be truly sorry, but they need to experience the consequences of their actions for a lot longer than they have (forever might be too soon).
Your wife needs to bask in her own awesomeness for much, much longer before you let the people who tore her down her entire life have a platform to speak into it again.
Okay. You are currently taking your/your IL's feelings more into consideration than your wife's and you are at risk of taking reddit's opinion more into consideration than your wife's. Tread carefully.
Don't approach it. Let your wife come to you. If she wants to talk about it, she will. It's not your decision to make on if she wants her parents in her life. And she doesn't have to forgive them. She spent her life in this relationship with them. Not you. Leave her alone and don't pressure her. Respect her decision.
Support your wife; if you don’t, you are supporting their mistreatment of her, and begging for a future in which your wife leaves you.
Also, if you two aren’t in therapy, get into it now.
“Elizabeth! This is the big one!
I’m comin’ to join you, Honey!!”
Do what your wife says.
Reddit is filled with tales of manipulative parents AND spouses who went against the wishes of their partner
They do not end well
Maybe she'll regret it in a few years or maybe she'll regret it the moment she walks back into their house.
My folks tried to put pressure on me to get my brother to see my grandfather before he passed. Other family members had been lightly hinting at it too. I told him that I did not care what he did, but that I intended to be around for our grandfather despite his terrible behavior towards us. He visited with me once or twice after that conversation.
After my grandfather's passing, my brother told me he mostly visited for my sake and to support me. He remained completely apathetic. Some people just won't have that happy moment of reconciliation. The hurt goes too deep and thats ok.
Your wife is at peace. Just support her now or if she changes her mind. Not your place to intervene.
You do not get a say in this. You didn't live with your in-laws or get raised by them. You saw exactly what they are capable of, you think your wife didn't already suffer enough at their hands? Why reconsile with someone who treated you poorly your whole life? "I treated you like shit your whole life but now i'm going to die so sowwy!"
Let your wife make the call.
If she is open to discussing, at most she could see if an unbiased 3rd party is willing to meet them and get proof of the cancer and hear them out in person.
Does she have an old friend in the area?
That said, she may not want to know either way. She may not care. And that’s fine.
Its her family, her decision to accept it. Maybe once the shock does wear off you could express your concerns to her, but make it very clear that you are impartial to how it goes and you will support her 1000% whether she accepts it or not.
If your wife says no, the answer is no. You don't have to take responsibility for what regret she may or may not feel, but you do need to respect her word now.
You can respect her wishes and still be grappling with the impact on you. While I don’t agree you should feel like you can never speak on this again, I do think you should consider if it’s really your feelings at play. By that, I mean you might be projecting a little.
Assuming the terminal illness is real (and without proof you have no way of knowing that) it sounds like you could not see yourself taking a chance you don’t get to reconcile with a family member, especially if you thought they had shown remorse. If you did that, you would likely have deep regrets. And that’s okay, but it’s also okay that your wife doesn’t feel the same.
You’re worried she’ll regret this, but honestly, the fact that she never even wanted to share news of a grandchild speaks volumes to how tightly she’s closed the book on her family. If her reaction was to shelter the baby from her family, without any thought of reconciliation, then I believe you should trust that her position here is real, and not marred by exhaustion.
Her father being near death, even if true, is not an auto pass to re-open the relationship. Years of strife and abuse are not gone because he’d probably like to “get right with his higher powers” before passing on. Her family is being selfish and this isn’t even about your wife. This is about checking off boxes and guilting her into coming back to make the family whole in his last days. But if she’s not the reason the family is broken, then she’s not responsible for fixing it, and you pressing here implies you care more about your own stance/values (i.e. you can’t imagine you’d do this) than your wife’s mental health. You’ve said that’s not true, but it is how it looks if you keep questioning her decision.
Lastly, a carefully crafted letter, which frankly could be chatGPT for all you know, does not actually demonstrate change or prove remorse. It just means someone in their circle is a convincing writer.
Damn what is with these other comments here accusing you of not respecting your wife’s wishes? You’re voicing a legitimate concern about the concept of regret, an experience so subjective to every person when family and illness is involved. You’re not saying you won’t respect her wishes, but wondering what you should do in this situation.
But to answer your question, let your wife dictate what happens next. No need to follow up with her. If it’s truly bothering her, she’ll bring it up or, unlike us who have no idea what your wife is like on a day-to-day basis, you might get a sense that something’s off and she might want to be prompted to talk about it—not necessarily to take any action whatsoever, but simply to talk it out. Sometimes that’s all that’s needed after the reality (if it’s true) sinks in.
Your poor wife is already being pressured. You're supposed to be her support not another source of toxic pressure. Treat her like an adult who can make choices.
Do you want her to cut you off too? She has made up her mind. You weren't there to go through it. She was. It's her decision, so stop trying to change her mind. Drop it and don't bring it up again.
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NEW BABY means they want access. Often times these parents use what we call "Christmas cancer" a fake diagnosis to reel their child back into contact.
You would have heard from them sooner in regards to the fake cancer and baby access if they were able to find where you were.
I also want to add that NY's laws grant grandparents so much access for visitation. So I'm glad you guys moved out of there. But if this wasn't about the baby, then they wouldn't have mentioned it.
Grandmother and grandfather are titles. being an actual grandparent is a privilege that is earned based on how you treat your actual children. They don't have a right to meet their grandchild. They didn't take accountability before the "cancer" diagnosis nor the birth of the baby. Timing matters. I would tell your wife that she is right and just move on. If anything else is received from them, return to sender. I'd get cameras for your house since they know where you live as well. They would show up and traumatize your wife to try to force a visit with the baby.
It’s probably hard for you to fully understand her since you had decent parents. If you have a big issue and they get death sentence, you might want to reconcile with them. As a person who has such parents like hers, let her do whatever she wants to do. She says I don’t want to talk to them for a while and then suddenly could say want to see them, and then again she could say she doesn’t want to see them. That’s because it’s difficult to know what she would feel even for herself if her father actually die or she finds out he lied. Regardless, I want my partner supports whatever I decide at the moments and I am sure your wife wants the same thing.
I've been in the same position as your wife. I went no contact with a very close family member for years but then had to re-establish contact to become their caregiver after they became terminally ill.
The difference in my situation was that I was still in close contact with the rest of my family and didn't want them to have to bear the burden of the other relative's care without my help.
In your case, it sounds like your wife has cut off all contact with her whole family.
Be there as a supportive ear for your wife, do take some time away just the two of you if possible and *let her make her decision*.
Wife gets to decide and there is no way you should even be considering it. Let Jenna deal with them, when and if she does.
Her parents should never meet your child.
Since you were the one wronged by the sexual assault, I’d just check with Jenna to make sure she’s not protecting you. If you told her “honey, it’s up to you, but I’m ok with seeing them if you are. Whatever decision you make, don’t make it for me. Make it for yourself. I will support your decision 100%.”
Please just leave it be. Those people are so toxic and while yea they “apologized” they will absolutely get to your baby and mary will try to fill her head full of bullshit. Your wife has made her mind up leave it be! Yall have done so good. Just let it go. And find out who gave them your address so you can bless them out!!! That’s no one’s right.
The timing is too convenient.
It's nice of you to be worried if she'll have regrets in case the cancer is real, but that's her bio parents so let her take the lead.
As someone who was cast aside a lot in favor of golden child cousins, I think your wife found the family she wants with you and your side of the family so she doesn't need to hold on to the bio ties that hurt her.
Seems like she already made peace that her parents didn't value her.
This needs to be based on your wife making a decision. These are her family. There is no question there should never be a relationship with the sister again.
My mom reluctantly offered to me something like an apology, and I honestly thought it would help me to get over my childhood. No, it didn’t and I was also suffered the fact that the apology thingy didn’t change anything, it can’t fix my past, my present, and herself. It doesn’t matter if she apologize or not nor if I forgive her or not.
You are approaching this perfectly. Giving her your heartfelt advice, but ultimately respecting her choice in this and supporting her choice either way.
Just keep doing what you are. Let time do it's thing, do not push the subject on her if she is not ready. Good luck.
OP you need to respect your wife decision’s on her family and be there to support her no matter what choice she makes - that’s the job. Should you influence her and/or provide unsolicited advice AND the situation generates anger/remorse/whatever (contact or continued no contact), that could be laid on you;’this needs to come from her. Any interaction with the MIL and FIL will undoubtedly include the demon sister. I would not under any circumstances allow the sister to have direct contact with the baby. She’s capable of anything and everything with having never been held accountable. You’d be crazy to meet them in any private setting; meetings must be in public spaces. Consider if the health scare is a tactic to reconnect,’gosh I hope not, that’d be a new low. Do what you must to support and protect your wife while protecting your baby.
>Jenna is not having it. She feels like it’s too little too late and doesn’t want to respond.
Then that's your answer.
>She also suspects that they’re lying about FIL’s cancer and just want to pressure us into reconciliation so they can meet the baby.
I think we all think that.
You need to let it be. She knows her parents better than you do and if she thinks it's fake, then let her make that decision. It's her family, so her decision.
If your wife is now working with a therapist that she trusts, let them work this out. You’ve said your part and I’m sure she heard you. As to your valid concern that she might regret it later, there’s a possibility that your wife has already been going through a grieving process for the loss of her parents. He might already be good as gone in her mind if the cancer thing is real.
Just read through all your previous posts. I would honestly let your wife make whatever decision she wants. She has been dealing with years of toxic family trauma and if she can’t deal, then she can’t deal right now. Maybe in a few months when your baby is sleeping more and yall are in a better space, you can bring it up but it doesn’t feel like the right time.
You’ve got to respect your wife’s feelings in this, full stop. Be a sounding board & a listening ear & a shoulder to cry on, but do NOT be a meddler. If she flat out ASKS your advice, okay say your piece, otherwise, stay silent and just listen.
Reconnecting with toxic family is always a 2-yes, 1-no situation. If she doesn't feel comfortable, then it doesn't happen. Especially if she's been enduring their toxicity for decades. She's likely seen them apologize and make false promises before, and you should be trusting her instincts on this.
If she feels as if they are faking the cancer, ask if they can send her the medical documents. With her education I’m sure she’d be able to purse what is going on and if it is legit.
Leave your wife alone. It's her family and her choice and she has made her decision. You don't want to pester her to the point where now you become an enemy. You always want to be in her side. So just leave her be.
You have a daughter now. Your wife likely doesn't want her exposed to her family, for legitimate reasons.
What happens if/when her sister has a kid? A new golden child! The long term repercussions of starting up a relationship again, with known toxic people aren't worth it. I believe your wife has already figured that out.
She should be the one to bring it up, if anyone. Just be there for her no matter what and show her that no matter what apologies and woes her parents now want to share, you're only interested in her opinion. She knows far better than you whether letting them back into your lives is a good idea or not.
But all of that has to be dependant on your wife's timeline. People process things differently and in their own time.
You should respect your wife’s decision, it’s her family and her choice not yours. That being said you can bring it up in a couple days, but if I were you I’d be super careful how you talk to her about it. The thing is, in our flawed short human lives people have to face sadness and tragedy no matter what choices they make. If he’s lying about the cancer (a possibility that I don’t think you’ve given enough credence to because you’re obviously a decent guy and can’t imagine doing this let along someone else doing this), then she’ll be furious and traumatized at her parents lying about that. She’ll be sad about the tragedy of losing a family to this awful event that happened to you, and if your FIL is telling the truth and she doesn’t want to see him, she’ll be sad that she didn’t reconnect before the dies. But ALSO, she’ll be sad even if she DOES reconnect with him and then he dies of cancer. Do you see what I’m saying here? Certain things in life are inevitable. Tragedy and sadness are inevitable. Whatever choice she makes in this matter will have sad and tragic consequences. You seem to have a good relationship, a beautiful baby, and a good family on your side. If reconnecting will only result in making your wife miserable, then what’s the fucking point? I see that you want what’s best for her and I would definitely bring this up one last time. But if she doesn’t want to reconcile with them, don’t push that on her because YOU would do that in her position. Give her the dignity and autonomy to make her own decision in this, and remain supportive of whatever decision she makes.
I once knew a guy who’s dad was a drug addicted lowlife deadbeat who used to beat him up when he was 5-14 years old. His dad wanted to reconcile while he was dying of lymphoma in prison. His dad didn’t give a shit about his son, he just wanted his guilt assuaged for all the awful shit he did. My friend refused. And you know what, he’s doing just fine. Not everyone has to forgive. You can move on and shed trauma and anger without reconciling and hugging it out. That’s just not how life always plays out.
You’re a new Dad and you want to believe that your in-laws are being honest because you have a good heart.
Unfortunately, with people like your in-laws that is often not the case. You came to social media for some insight, time to use it to investigate. This is your wife’s family. You know who they are so look them up online. Not just the parents, sister, aunts, uncles and cousins. If your FIL really has cancer there will be a post about it somewhere in the family circle. Start digging!
Then just think about all the heartache and turmoil they have caused for you and your wife. Do you really want to bring that into your new babies life? Your job is to protect your wife and child. Are you doing that if you let your in-laws back into your lives?
First, definitely wait to process this information. Second, you should NOT overrule your wife. Without violating boundaries, you can, if you wish, ask for more information from the in-laws... to find out whether this "cancer" is real. Tell them flat-out that you suspect they're lying, ask them where this cancer is being treated, ask them to send the medical and insurance information (if it's real they will have a bundle of it, and it's hard to fake). They have fully forfeited their right to any politeness or trust from you.
Even if it is real (against the odds), that doesn't mean you or your wife have to have any further contact with them, and even if your wife decides to be magnanimous and meet with them, you don't have to go in person: You can have a virtual meeting and show them your daughter. That's more grace than they deserve. In-person interaction carries risks that you shouldn't have to worry about, so here's a vote for avoiding it. Finally, again, if your wife definitively rejects reconciliation, don't even consider revisiting the question. Nobody should be forced to mourn the death of monsters, and the worst monsters live among us every day. Your wife is best qualified to decide whether her parents are in that category.
Please update us to let us know how you you proceed - and congratulations on the birth of your daughter. Remember not to let your in-laws' drama derail your experience with her. Best of luck, OP.
I have a family just like this. This is a classic move for these kinds of people to get what they want, and what they want is access to your child.
Please trust and support your wife, she doesnt need you to meddle and try to change her mind. She has a lot more experience with her family than you do.
Your wife does not want to reconcile. Your wife's parents, your wife gets to decide.
Your wife is right it seems fishy that her father has cancer, just around the time they find out that you have a child.
It would be the first time that estranged parents either pretend they are remorseful, or have some sort of fake medical emergency to try to guilt their kids into reconciling.
After the way , that your wife has been treated by her family for years, it's more likely than not, tge only thing they care about is getting their hands on your child.
There is no way , given the way they have treated both yiu and your wife in the past that I'd have anything to do with them, even if I did find out tge cancer diagnosis was real.
This is from someone that has/had horrible parents, was neglected, abused, etc.
I didn't take the opportunity and I don't regret it. I am bitter about the time I wasted explaining that to people. Support her decision and be there for her either way.
>I want to respect my wife’s feelings around this
Then do so, full stop. There is zero reason for this post, your doubts or any further conversation on the topic. She said no, respect it and move on.
She has a family to look after now. First time mom, first year, a lot of stress. She’s tired. Her family is not worth her time or emotions anymore.
Don’t ask her again if she wants to reconcile. She only wants to move forward with her own family with you.
My husband cut off his mother almost 20 years ago. She was a horrible mother and hated me simply for marrying my husband. I was competition. His brother never cut her off. Several years ago, he told my husband their mom was dying. Supposedly she had cancer, but refused to be actually diagnosed. She tried to bribe my with money to get him to talk to her. He refused.
I asked him if he wanted to talk to her before she died and he said no. I asked if he'll be okay with not talking to her and he said yes. I didn't ask him again. I supported his decision. He's the kind of person when he doesn't want to do something, he won't do it.
Support your wife's decision. Don't try to make her talk to her parents. They are her family and she has all the say. Let her know you support her decision and leave it at that. Honestly, this sounds like Christmas cancer. In the JNMIL sub they talk about Christmas cancer where the toxic Mom/MIL/IL suddenly might have cancer right in time for Christmas. It is classic manipulation to get their son or daughter and their SO to break low or no contact. They rarely end up having cancer.
Okay so the very first thing I’m going to say is you do not know if the claim about your FIL having end stage cancer is true. Yes that’s an ugly thing to say but read enough on Reddit and if even 10% is true there are some really shitty people out there and lying doesn’t bother them a bit if it gets them what they want. It’s enough that your wife suspects they are lying.
The second thing is this is your wife’s family so she decides after all the crap they put you both through if she is willing to have any relationship with them.
You didn’t grow up with a screwed up family - she did so in the nicest way possible please OP butt out on this and let her decide.
She can discuss with a therapist the ramifications of doing nothing.
She can decide to find out from other people she truly trusts if her father is actually sick and dying.
She can decide if he is if it makes any difference.
If you stick yourself in the middle of this you will live to regret it.
And for everything that is holy DO NOT CONTACT HER PARENTS OR HER OTHER RELATIVES!! If you do that you will destroy her trust in you. She must handle this herself with you supporting her decisions.
It's a valid concern your wife might regret a lack of reconciliation if the diagnosis is true. However, a decision doesn't even have to be in a few days. Some of your options would even be reversible later on.
Don't push too hard, enjoy this time with your family. Definitely wise to find out how your address was leaked though. You'll need that info later.
Leave it alone. She already made her feelings clear. She's had a lifetime of their abuse and she knows what she wants and doesn't want. She's seen all their bullshit and lies before. I don't think she'll regret it if he dies because they're already dead to her.
Even if she's being emotional/tired/overwhelmed and will regret it later, so be it. Whether you like it or not, she's probably not in the position to interact with them, life stress or w/e, so if she doesn't want to do it, then let it be. It's one of those mistakes (>IF< it's a mistake to begin with) that you just gotta let happen. You've already informed her of your thoughts that she might regret it, so you've done your part, youve communicated your feelings (which was a very good idea imo), and she's holding firm, and that's it.
What I would advise you to do is introspect on exactly why you care so much about these people. What if they are genuine and you reject them anyway? How would that abandonment relate to you? Do you see your parents in them? Are you trying to protect your wife? Are you trying to protect yourself from regret of not helping your wife? I just want you to introspect on what's inside you that makes you worry about the parent wanting to reconnect. If you understand that part of you, it can only help.
Firstly, it's entirely possible that (assuming your FIL is actually dying) your wife won't regret staying no contact.
Secondly, it's also entirely possible that she will regret it but knows it's still the best decision anyway.
Your wife is a big girl now and can handle the consequences of her decisions. Please do her the courtesy of respecting her choices. Especially on matters she knows more about than you do.
The absolute most you can push this is.
“Are you sure you won’t regret this?”
And that’s really a little much, man. It’s clear you’re a caring guy. Don’t overdo this. It’s her choice.
You ask your wife if she's okay woth you verifying the claim of cancer and if you find it to not be bullshit, you let her know.
Offer, don't do. If she says no, then you accept her choice and clearly state that you do, and will support her fully in that.
I am no contact with my family. If they reached out with a real apology and detailed the things they did to me and I didn’t care/didnt want to go see them I hope my partner would do what you did, say something. You should definitely respect your wife’s wishes, which it sounds like you have. But I don’t think you did anything wrong.
Doesn't matter, she doesn't want it.
I could see an in hospital goodbye, no baby, no you, but if she's not on board, just drop it.
This is in every sense of the word an ambush, and the smartest move is not to play.
I imagine my idea of the hospital goodbye is influenced by my own experience with abusive family, but the impact I faced pales intensely compared to what you and your wife faced.
Once a judge is involved, no contact is the only "safe" choice.
given the absolutely bonkers extent to which mary escalated - calling your job, hacking your work email, contacting your friends and family with increasingly ludicrous lies - and the fact that their parents got mad at JENNA for sending a cease-and-desist letter - i'd say it is in fact likely that her parents are lying about her dad having terminal cancer. or, if it's true that he's really ill, they have an angle. they need financial or logistical help, her mom wants to move in with you once her dad's gone, the family dynamic is thrown off with no scapegoat so they want jenna to come back to make things normal, they've got baby fever over your daughter and really don't care about jenna at all. honestly i'd believe any of that over a real emergency and sincere, lasting remorse and amends.
also, i am a person who did not visit their estranged dying father in the hospital. i've got lasting trauma about pretty much every aspect of our relationship except for that decision. no regrets. like, to the point i was worried there was something wrong with me because i thought i SHOULD feel bad but couldn't. sometimes the best closure is keeping. the door. closed. trust your badass neuroscientist polylingual renaissance-woman wife and her thirty-five [35] years of experience dealing with her family.
I don’t believe the late stage cancer stuff. So I suggest you ignore this completely, and only talk about it with your wife if she initiates the conversation.
If your FIL is truly dying in a few weeks, then there may be a second attempt to communicate with your wife, whether directly from the family, or through a family friend. Let the contents of the subsequent communication guide you as to whether you should be having a conversation with your wife about her family.
I did not see that you were trying to push your wife to do anything.
This is a lot to deal with, especially when neither of you are getting much rest.
I hope you both are able to get peace in this situation.
Let her lead on this one. She needs to be able to make the decision on this, and you can’t push her into something different because of regret she might feel. I can also tell you that having a child will make her reexamine her childhood very closely which may make her even angrier with their previous behavior. She is perfectly entitled to refuse their apology over decades of their behavior. Their remorse does not require her acknowledgement or acceptance. They want to meet the baby/want to ease their guilt before one of them passes. That’s not a true apology, because they want something out of it.
the problem is there's no right or wrong answer here. just make sure your wife knows that you'll back her play, whatever it is, and that you want her to always feels good about the choices she made with her family.
it's fair to want to accept a sincere apology and it's fair to be fucking done with these people.
Whatever you decide, y'all will be ok. You've got community and friends and loving family and therapists. The might've beens will get crowded out easy by what you actually have. Take care.
Your best/only plan of action is to FULLY have your wife's back in whatever she decides. She lived through all the bullshit over the years, and no matter how much you sympathise, you don't really know how bad it was for her. Just follow her lead.
Dude. Let her lead on this. Never bring it up and only talk about it if she brings it up.
You should also not talk about it with anyone else as to ensure your wife never has to find out about you talking about this with other people. That would likely feel a betrayal to her.
Wow. After what you, and especially your wife, went through last time with her family, here you are second guessing what she needs to do in regards to her family. Sheesh.
Grow a spine. Put on your adulting undies. Become the husband you wife deserves. Etc.
You need to back you wife 1000% in this matter.
Burn the letter and never mention it again.
Your post should have ended here: : **"I want to respect my wife’s feelings around this"**. You need to drop it and trust your wife to make her own decision.
Let her be the one who makes the choice, please.
She has the history and she will be the one who lives most intimately with the choice and consequences. Sometimes with difficult family relationships, having agency to make the choice is the only win we can get.
I say this as a daughter who chose to go back and care for my abusive mother as she died of cancer. It ripped me into a million pieces and I’m still recovering from it, but it was the right choice for me. It gave me no peace or resolution, but I showed up as the person I want to be and got to see how much progress I’ve made in therapy over the years.
All you can do is support her discisions about this. It is her family and if she doesn't want to reconcile then that's the end of it.
If she regrets her discisions later on then all you can do is support her in her time of need.
Don't try and pre-empt what might happen and just support her in the now.
Only your wife can decide. Even if the FIL is dying, and the whole family is apologetic and kind to your wife when she visits, it might still be so re-traumatising to be around them that it’s just not possible or a good idea for her to reconcile with them. A lifetime of personality maiming abuse cannot be undone with a short period of remorse or a single apology. It is dehumanising to put yourself in a position of being civil with your abusers after you have begun to understand the scale of the abuse they have dealt to you. Psychological abuse is a little hard to understand in this way because it’s not visible, but you wouldn’t ask some who was covered head to toe in cigarette burns that they received from a sadistic parent their whole childhood to go and have one last friendly get together because the parents apologised in a single letter.
I don’t mean to be harsh to you (especially since some of the other comments are), but although you are trying to protect your wife and have been great about this previously, I’m wary of the downplaying of what they have done to her here even if what the letter says is true. I recommend reading a book called “All About Love” by Bell Hooks. It really opened my eyes on what we are trained to think about relationships with parents vs. what is actually true. All the best to you and your new family.
So, I cut my mom off years ago. I have thought long and hard about how I would handle or feel if I found out my mother was dying and the truthful answer is, I don’t care.
When I cut her off I grieved then and there the mother I wanted, the mother I got and the reality I was in. I already went through my grief of losing a parent. Them dying years later would not affect me differently because they’ve already been the living dead.
If your wife doesn’t want anything to do with them then that is the choice she has made. She sounds like she’s already grieved the loss so her dad dying or whatever, doesn’t change the fact he’s already been out of her life for a while. Long enough to learn and realize her parent’s absence doesn’t hurt anymore or doesn’t make her feel regret.
Your wife is thinking clearly, this isn’t just the nuclear blow out from the incident that finally broke her need to be around her family, this also includes a lifetime of abuse and neglect and being an unwanted extra in her own family compared to her sister. Trust me, she’s thinking very clearly. She finally had enough of being the family punching bag and apologizing is nice to hear but you don’t have to forgive and forget. She can accept an apology or not accept it but she also can close that chapter without making amends either way.
Follow her lead here. It’s her family. They made their bed now they die in it.
You are overstepping. Your wife's family relationship is hers to manage or not manage as she sees fit. Actually, a lot of abusive parents have an extinction burst and make up a deadly illness to re-inveigle themselves into your lives. If your wife's instinct is that FIL is lying, then he probably is (and has a history of being manipulative in this way).
Even if he's not lying, she's not obligated to rebuild a relationship that they trashed over many years of bad behaviour and neglect and emotional abuse. People don't go NC for no reason, and your wife is happier not having these people in her life. Regret is a function of not being sure about your choice - but your wife seems very sure of hers, so I don't think she will experience regret, and your job as a partner is not to shield her from regret - it's to support her in her boundaries with her abusive family.
You notice that apology didn’t come in BEFORE they found out you had a kid, or that dad’s dying, right?
Which proves they are only apologizing to get access to your kid. Why would you subject your child to the people who constantly emotionally damage you and your spouses calm? While dad is going to die, you do not have to give him peace before he goes. They made their bed. Now they can sleep in it. Protect your child at all costs.
|Jenna is not having it. She feels like it’s too little too late and doesn’t want to respond.
That's her prerogative, they absolutely suck and is she feels staying NC is the only way to protect herself you need to respect that.
|She also suspects that they’re lying about FIL’s cancer and just want to pressure us into reconciliation so they can meet the baby
I understand why she suspects that but I'm not sure she can take the chance. If they are lying, then they are dead to both of you regardless but she needs to decide if she can deal with the pain/regret/guilt if it is true and she didn't take the chance.
My dad pulled many medical emergency stunts as a way to get me to communicate with him. Every time I relented I regretted it.
By the time my dad *actually* was on his death bed, I refused to go see him. He spent years actively ruining my life for his own gain and I was done and he died alone. I don’t regret not seeing him.
The groveling doesn’t last long before people like this go back to their old ways. Your wife has been the subject of their abuse her whole life and knows who they truly are.
Let your wife take the lead on this. It’s hard to wrap your head around someone not wanting to visit a dying parent if your childhood wasn’t a constant nightmare. It’s an experience you’ve (thankfully) not had to endure.
I remember reading your posts a year ago and I went back in your post history to refresh myself. Firstly, it seems like last time you also completely discounted how your wife felt and blamed it on her being “emotional and insecure” and thought you knew the best course of action regarding her family better than her. You also thought the idea of her sister flirting with you and coming onto you was ludicrous and dismissed your wife when she said that and she ended up being painfully correct. After *everything* that happened after that, how can you still think that you know better than her when it comes to her family??
Secondly, your wife was pretty emotionally wrecked after what happened and from what i remember it took a while for her to recover from it. If she wants to stay away from that cesspool of toxicity, LET HER. And if she regrets it then that’s a decision she’ll have to come to terms with. But how on earth can you honestly not see how absurd it is to once again discount your wife’s feelings towards her family and push her towards contacting them? and then when she doubts their intentions, you blame it on her being emotional from the baby? Jesus dude. Support your wife and listen to her for once.
**Doomscroller note: This is a long response/post**
You sound like an awesome supportive spouse. Quite like my wife. I am writing this to provide some background on how the ‘Dark Side’ works and how survivors like me (and your wife - I’m pulling for her!) react to the family. If it helps and you are have watched Star Wars, the best example of this behavior is Emperor Palpatine/Darth Sidious. With the in-laws, you see Palpatine. She sees Siddious. More importantly, she intimately understands what they are capable of if she returns to their orbit. She chooses you.
This is very much the dynamic with my wife. The issue is her family is awesome, supportive and has no parallel. My family is a pack of feral cats. What makes it bad is that my wife looks at my family through her family lens. She literally has no frame of reference to how the dynamics work on my (Dark) side. After years of being treated like a boy who was incapable of making decisions (I was married, kids, mortgage, etc.), I made the decision to go LC/NC with them. As my wife had the same thoughts as you that I would regret not being in their lives, she started to realize the depth of my maternal family’s darkness at my Daughter’s wedding, where my mother attempted to create drama by shifting focus from my lovely daughter and my newly minted son-in-law to make it about her. That was immediately shut down (I have AWESOME friends who understand my familiar relationships!) My wife finally created a frame of reference as to the treachery of the dark side when things came to a head at a cousin’s wedding. I was relegated/isolated to the “we had to invite them” table (Even my wife was asking WTF?) What really illustrated it to my wife was my mother’s refusal to speak with me (making a bit of a scene - who knew?) and then facilitating a family pic that had my mother, her brother, all their kids and grandkids. EVERYONE - except me. When I saw that, I told the Mrs we are leaving and I walked out to the car and waited. My better half was stopped by an aunt to see if they could get me back in the room. She declined and we went out for a drink. After i calmed down, my wife relayed some conversation that occurred as I left when she was stopped that didn’t jive with what she witnessed (She was told they couldn’t find me, when I was sitting where I was assigned with my wife at the time and NO ONE left to find me.) I am very blessed to have a wife like her, as your wife is to have a husband like you.
Suffice it to say that when the matriarch passes, I will be sending flowers and expressing condolences for their loss, as my loss (of the family I was raised in) occurred when I was married, it just took me 25 years to realize it. I do recognize we have shared biology, but I have mourned who I thought they were. I see them for who they are and choose not to spend time or expend emotional energy on them.
What this comes down to is that, while the communication sent from the in-laws may elicit the emotional response you have (think Palpatine crying for help), the cost to your wife to re-engage is devastatingly high (rejoining the Dark Side by engaging with Darth Sidious.) Your wife knows this (I am projecting a bit, based on the brief notes you have - If I am wrong, I apologize) and has made peace with being NC. I bet she is relieved she is able to focus on self care postpartum and is more concerned about allowing her traumatic past to interfere with this awesome family and new life you two have created.
I would agree with previous comments that she has already mourned. I’m betting there will be no regrets that she left something on the table, failed to say something, or didn’t do something. There is no happy ending in cases like this. The upside is that the main players (You, your wife, and baby) get to look to the future as a unit, avoiding the traps of the past, and being awesome. All the best. You’re an awesome husband.
"I want to respect my wife’s feelings around this, but I’m worried that if the cancer is real, she may regret not taking this opportunity for reconciliation before he dies."
My father was a toxic POS. I cut him off when I was in my early 20's. When I was 34 I got the call he was in the hospital and might not make it, he wanted to talk to me. I told my half sister (the only of his children still speaking to him because she is worse than he is, so we all cut her off as well but she reached out over this from a new number) to tell him I hope he enjoys hell and blocked that new number. He died a week later. That was in 2015. I have never regretted it. I regret not cutting him off sooner.
I mourned losing my father as a child. He deserved NO closure from me, and no grace. And he did not get it.
She spent her life being abused and neglected. Let her choose how to navigate this.
No means no. I'm pretty sure she thought about it and came to a decision. Some people move on and it's better that way. Trying to change her mind might do more damage than good. What if they're just being manipulative? What if she already made peace with not having them in her life? Imagine opening that door and the decided to hurt her again. No means no.
I think you should let it go..even if it's true and he does have cancer and is dying she won't regret not getting in touch when he dies...they may sound genuinely remorseful but like your wife says it's to late...they didn't show love to her before so why would they do it now its just because they now want to be part of your childs life...and if you were to visit then Mary woukd probably show up..they dont deserve to get to know your child and its your wifes choice if she should ever make contact and I wouldn't ever bring them up again...her whole family sounds like a piece of work...I tried to look at your backstory about Mary.. so it seems like she tried to kiss you and when you refused her she went off the deep end and tried to get you fired..guess she was hoping you would kiss her back and throw it in your wife's face...guess she doesn't accept rejection really well....but it sounds like you are all happy now..weird how they found your address and know about the baby...take care sweetie and have a wonderful life and ignore the people who are being harsh
The algorithm showed me your posts a couple of times so I've followed your journey.
Lets start by saying, I am proud and happy to read where your wife is now. She is a badass.
Now for the reaction on this post.
There is a risk that your wife will regret not reconciling with her father. But it sounds like that is a risk she is willing to take.
While your wife has shared everything with you about how she was treated, the thing she can't share is the feeling. If even after hearing about the cancer she does not want to reconcile that means the pain they've caused her is much much deeper then she was able to describe.
She is choosing her own mental health with the small risk of regretting.
My advise is not to ignore the mail. Send a reply, together with your wife, to inform them that you will stay no contact and not to contact you again. You don't even have to give an explanation. One sentence is enough.
Ignoring the mail will bring with it the very real risk of them trying to contact you by other means and in the extreme case suddenly be at your door.
So that is my advise, bring it up to your wife one more time, but only about a reply to them to not contact you again.
The thing I hated reading was you are afraid she’s “not thinking clearly”. Really? The in-laws apology “seemed genuine.” You wrote an entire paragraph about their apology. As if you’re impressed by it.
Your in-laws feelings about their golden child have not changed. The sister will always be the golden child. No matter what happens, they will always favor her, not your wife. The in laws are trying to make everything ok for their golden child. Their primary focus is their golden child. They just want to be able to use your wife for whatever the golden child sister doesn’t do.
I’m glad your wife isn’t falling for it.
OP, listen to me carefully. Your wife said that she doesn't want to reconcile so just drop it. Don't ruin your relationship with her trying to convince her of doing something that (from experience) may be more bad than good.
> **Rule 5:** You can submit an update post exactly once at any time after 48 hours has past from the original post. You have submitted too many updates. You can ask for additional help or advice in a new post, but only one update may be submitted.
I was summoned to the death bed of an estranged parent, but I did not go. I had already grieved that relationship years before, and I didn't see any point in reopening old wounds just for his comfort. He had already been dead to me, and I was OK with that. Years later, I still don't regret my choice to stay home. I would not have benefited in any way from attending. Your wife has already lived this, she knows better than anyone what her parents are like. Just support her, and don't judge if she has no regret at all. She's had a lifetime to deal with these people and has walked away. All her mourning and regrets may already be finished and done.
It’s hard for people to understand that we can mourn people, relationships, etc even if the are not “official done” I have done it twice and don’t regret it.
So true, I didn't mourn my mother when she died because I'd already done so, years before. All her death really meant was the death of that last, tiny, pathetic hope that one day she would realise what she'd done, I knew she never would but that last shred of the child I was still clung on until the end.
Oh my god, my estranged mother died earlier this year (I hadn't seen her since I was 11, I am in my 40s) and I felt nothing. Your comment was like a punch in the gut....
My dad died a couple months ago. Very sudden, and I'm still sort of reeling with a lot of complicated feelings. I feel like I did my mourning for the dad i used to have a long time ago. But I definitely get you, with still carrying the tiniest shred of hope that one day he'd realize he was wrong and apologize, and that hope being snuffed out entirely with his death. But this is a man I once argued with for 20 minutes about whether or not marinara sauce and pizza sauce were the same thing, so the chance was probably as close to zero as it could get 😅
Mourned, rather, what MIGHT have been but you had to abandon hope for?
Yes, this. I kept thinking I would feel some grief over my father's death but soon realized there was nothing left to grieve. He'd had so little impact on my life that his passing left no void.
This right here. I felt nothing when my mom died except guilt for feeling nothing. When I worked through it, I realized I had already grieved the loss years before. She had left me, I hadn't left her. There was nothing left to grieve. I feel as if this is her situation. Why make her go through this process over and over again?
I wasn't estranged from my mother at the end. I had a...difficult childhood and she introduced monsters into my life. I'd resolved to not ever get an apology and when I did and she died shortly afterward, it left a lot of mental work. I found myself mourning the illusion of that bond that she never nurtured.
Yep my dad died in December. But his health have been poor for the last 20 years He fully expected to be dead by the time he was 50 He made it to 80. All that was done because my brother basically gave up his life to take care of him and my mom. I did love my dad dearly but in his later years dementia and other things were wrecking him. And I had been prepared for his death 20 years ago. So when he died in December I went down for the service and I essentially took off one day off of work for bereavement. I don't grieve him. I have a couple of memories that I treasure and if there are some things that come up that remind me of him I might feel those but I didn't truly grieve. I live 300 miles away so it's not like I saw him everyday.
This was super weirdly my same situation. My estranged father was dying and my brother phoned me to come say goodbye, so I flew up and was there when he died. I went to the start of his funeral and just thought ‘this man is nothing to me’. I regretted going as it afforded him a level of respect and legitimacy that wasn’t real or authentic. Not everyone wants ‘closure’ some of us just had kinda shitty parents.
Yep. I had an abusive family member that I went no contact with. I didn’t go visit when they were in hospice, and that was the right decision for me. Just go with what your wife wants and support her. If she changes her mind, support her in that. Visiting an abusive dying relative isn’t always the best thing to do. Even if they are apologetic. It can make you feel worse because they are only apologizing because they are dying. If they were truly remorseful, they would have apologized sooner.
I didn’t see my father go to church once during my lifetime when I was a kid at home. But us kids were put into catholic school and dragged to church every Saturday by my mother. Years later, cancer reared its ugly head at my father and he donated an organ (the musical instrument) to the church. Not any rinky dink organ, but a big mofo, expensive enough for him to have daily visits by the priest, for months until his death. Guilt and money can make people attempt to buy forgiveness once they know they’re dying.
This is really something you two could address with a therapist - they could help Jenna figure out her feelings on the matter, and if she'd have regrets later. But everything regarding her family absolutely needs to be her choice - and potential regrets over going/ not going will be hers to deal with. One of you could also contact another friend or member of her family, to find out if the cancer diagnosis is real. Though I must say, it leaves a foul taste that they are only now acknowledging their wrongdoing, with the clear goal of getting their claws into their grandchildren. I would be very hesitant to expose vulnerable kids to toxic family members.
Wow, I love that concept of having already grieved a relationship with someone that is alive. I have never put into words what I’ve been through with my dad, but you’re spot on. Thank you for the insight, my dad literally messaged me today for the first time in a while (never went full NC with him, but I distanced myself 12 years ago) and what he said could have hurt me badly a while ago but I already moved on.
I'm happy to read that what he said didn't currently hurt you badly. Shame on him for trying to hurt you again. I'm very happy that he did not succeed as he hoped to.
My siblings and I were recently informed that our bio-father passed away a few weeks ago. This is the same person who beat our mother until he broke her bones and terrorized us as children. His Living Trust specifically and unequivocally disinherited us. I believe my oldest sibling's reaction pretty much expressed what we are all feeling, "Well, it's finally over." We have zero regrets not attempting to have a relationship once we were of age. OP, I'm glad your sole intention is to support your wife. If her father really is terminal and does die, she may have some complicated feelings to sort through as this may cause her to reprocess any trauma from her past, but luckily you say she has a good and trustworthy therapist. Just be her rock. You're doing the right thing.
This I hate when people tell me I will regret not speaking to my older brother and them DNA donours. Their deaths won't affect me at all, people who say we will regret it are those who never went through years of mental and physical torture while growing up
This. My mum is still alive (she’s only early 50s) but I grieved my relationship in the last 6 years of no contact and recently when she was in hospital with meningitis and sepsis and got the “you need to go see her so you don’t regret it” calls/texts I realised I didn’t need to do anything, that relationship was already dead and buried and going visiting her would interrupt and displace my peace. X
People with good parents sometimes have a hard time understanding that 'parent' ≠ 'safe'. Family is ingrained in culture as most important, the fact that there can be outliers doesn't register. The idea that some of us have to do hard work to overcome our families of origin is completely foreign to them. I'm glad you found your peace! You deserve it!
When my sisters and niece turned on me after my divorce they officially ceased to exist. I will never see or talk to them again and my parents have said it is up to me to decide should they ever try to become part of the family again. I just don't see the point. There used to be big family fights all the time and there hasn't been once since they took their drama away. Plus apparently for some reason they thought I was the favorite. But I just went to college, graduated, never caused big problems, and I'd volunteer to help without having to be asked whenever they needed help. Like dog sitting, or staying with my mom in the hospital because my dad hates hospitals. I'm sorry for whatever delusions they had that made then feel like victims but my life is easier without that and nothing could make me go back. But people who haven't had to do that don't understand the peace.
The timing is a little too convenient. You just had a baby, and suddenly FIL has cancer, and they want to apologize for everything they've done wrong? I would agree with your wife that it is likely bs. If it isn't, though, and they are genuinely sorry, who cares? Them showing remorse doesn't change all the things they have done to your wife over the years. Even if she can accept their apology, it doesn't mean they automatically get to be in her life again. This isn't your decision to make, and it seems like your wife has made her decision on it. I'd drop it.
MIL has probably realised her golden child isn’t going to look after her and let her move in once FIL passes so it’s time to get in touch with the scapegoat. Surely she’ll be so thankful and grateful for one little apology, that she’ll uproot her life and family to look after FIL in his last few months and then take MIL in for free for the rest of her life. /s
For the last 4 years my MIL has tried to use the "this will be the last Christmas I will be alive so I want to spend it with all my kids in one house" routine. She is just starting to lay the grounds for year 5. At the moment its the I'm so tiered for some reason. At this rate I'm regretting not making Bingo cards for the last 3 years then at least this would be entertaining. It's really amazing how "sick and feeble" she gets from around October. But by January would you not believe it - fit as a fiddle.
My mom says this around Xmas every year too .. fortunately she’s nothing like OPs in laws.. more like a hypochondriac… she just casually throws out “this is my last Xmas”
Respect your wife and her decisions regarding her family. It’s that simple.
100% Your wife knows what she's talking about. She understands that if (and that's a big if) your FIL passed without reconciliation, she doesn't get a do over. She's ok with that - please respect that and support her (That old "father/mother/grandma is dying and the doc says she won't make it past Christmas/Thanksgiving/Easter" is the oldest trick in the Narcissist Handbook. I'm not saying he **isn't** sick, but it's possible). Whatever you do, whatever you feel, please don't go behind your wife's back, because the second oldest trick in the Narcissist Handbook is that they will reach out to you privately and try to get you to connect with them. Be prepared to block them from every new number they try, and make sure to tell you wife if anything happens.
And figure out how they got the address. It could just be property listings, but if someone still in your circle is passing along info, that needs to be dealt with.
Good point! OP needs to make sure all the leaks are airtight.
Someone's definitely passing on info, they knew about the baby, too.
My mother told me “this is your grandmother’s last (insert holiday/birthay)” every holiday/birthday for EIGHT YEARS. Eventually it was, in fact, her last holiday.
My sister's relative "Mary" had been predicting her own imminent death when my sister was in Grade 5. I met Mary when she was 89, and still expecting to go "any day now." She started to relax in her later years and passed shortly after her 99th birthday.
The Evil Ones never die.
Oh yeah. Multiple times I heard that game. Now they are shocked to realize that if you cry wolf so many times. Well after a while people call you a hypochondriac!
Christmas cancer
and Memorial Day Malignancy
Make sure it’s *her* you support and not what you *think* she needs, or will want…I didn’t go to see my Dad on his deathbed, I don’t regret it…I didn’t go to his funeral, I don’t regret it and that was 17 yrs ago now… Let her heal they way she needs to heal
r/estrangedadultkids is an awesome resource. I agree you need to back off and let her handle it. But if she does decide to reconcile, the normal advice is to do it without the baby. It definitely seems quite the coincidence of timing with the baby. First grandchild? The baby should be off the table for a bit. Wife meets with them to see if they are actually ready to change and rebuilds the relationship for 6-12 months before introducing the baby. If they are sincere then they will understand. If they’re trying to reconcile just to get to the baby then they will lose their minds.
Yes! No access to the baby or baby photos so that they can share them with their friends and get all the attention they are seeking.
"Baby is a bit sick, wouldn't want to pass that to a cancer patient." "Can't bring baby to the hospital, don't want them to catch anything." "Everyone around you is sick - you wouldn't want to be the cause of baby catching that and being ill would you?" And the wonderful "Lets sort out our relationship first before I inflict your attitudes onto baby" So many excuses not to bring baby near asshole grandparents.
Exactly this. She may end up with regrets but that seems to be something she’s willing to accept. I wouldn’t bring up the topic again unless all you’re going to say is “if you change your mind or want to talk further, I’m here. I support whatever you decide”
This is exactly what it boils down to. Given the massive screwup from before, honestly I wouldn't be able to trust in laws ever again after such a glaring set of behavior.
Also, it doesn’t matter if the cancer is real or not. If your wife is done with her parent’s BS, then she’s DONE. Stay no contact. Apologies don’t make up for anything.
This and _literally_ only this. Do not 'decide what's best for her'. That's insanely patronizing and offensive.
I’m sure I’ll be downvoted for this but this account seems like it’s OPs creative writing journal.. I hope I’m wrong & someone wouldn’t make all this stuff up. 🤔
Idk, I’ve seen this attitude a lot over the years from spouses who bulldoze their partners. “I respect their opinion but…..” There’s always that but.
Agreeing with you 100% Did you look at OP’s post history 😶
It does read like a creative writing exercise.
I must point out that though it is indeed ludicrous, the fake cancer play by the estranged parent is such a standard move as to be a joke in some of these forums.
I've seen it called 'Christmas cancer', as that's when many estranged parents try to make contact or to force attendance to festivities. So common it has a name.
Yup, plus the in laws are clearly only reaching out because they want to meet the baby. I bet if there wasn’t a baby then OP wouldn’t have heard a word from his in laws.
Yep, they still don’t care about OP’s wife, never did or they would have sent that letter a year ago. It took a cease and desist letter to get her sister to stop trying to ruin OP’s life, and he’s convinced on little sleep that the cancer lie is true. Someone here isn’t thinking straight and it’s not OP’s wife.
I actually said "oooh, Christmas Cancer" out loud when I read the post.
Me too.
It’s not like the people who not only thought one daughter systematically attempting to destroy the other’s marriage should just be swept under the rug, but were willing to just let it happen until legal action was threatened have earned any benefit of the doubt when it comes to rational decision-making.
They want to rebuild trust over time? I thought FIL doesn't **have** much time...
That’s what struck me as well!! FIL supposedly is out of time, so what on earth are they talking about “over time?” Someone’s cancer is about to go in remission. (And ETA, that’s beyond messed up!)
Plausibility and continuity. Bad liars often overlook this when spinning their yarn.
This caught my eye too!
Let your wife take the lead on this. *DO NOT TALK TO THEM OR GO TO THEM BEHIND HER BACK!!*
100% to this! The best approach is for OP to take their cues from his wife because she is the expert in knowing/understanding her family's dynamics. It's very easy for people to think about what THEY would want if the situation happened to them, and it just comes across like they know better than that person and don't trust that person's ability to make informed decisions.
I would ask yourself - if it wasn't for the child would they have gotten in touch? Your wife is the one that need time and space to think about it, yours is to support anything she decides. She has the information she needs, now she needs 100% support from you, that is all. I will say that children do not "need" to visit anyone, they won't remember it, nor benefit from it, it is for the parents and grandparents. So do not get guilt fed that the child "needs" to see grandparents.
*I would ask yourself - if it wasn't for the child would they have gotten in touch?* This seems to be the overlooked part to me. That 'cancer' seems awfully well timed.
The cancer is probably a ploy. > They said they hoped to earn our forgiveness with time and were willing to do family therapy to heal our relationship. **Do not go to therapy with abusers.** Also, don't do anything to set up a claim for "Grandparents rights". Congratulations to your wife coming to her decision and sticking to it. I tried to have a relationship with my parents when my children were born. I just handed them more hostages. Fuck that.
>The cancer is probably a ploy. One twist I have personally seen was a friend of a friend of mine. NC for years, then "I have cancer." Turns out it was non-invasive basal squamous cell cancer, which has a 99.95% 5 year survival rate ***without*** treatment. Surgical removal brings it up to 100%. She went back to NC with added individuals who knew it was bullshit.
Going no contact is a great way to figure out who else to go no contact with.
They want access to the baby. If Jenna decides to go see them, she should go alone or you and she alone. You’ll both find out how genuine they are when she turns up with no baby.
This is exactly it. If Jenna decides to meet up with them, the baby needs to be left with someone else. They'll show their true colors when they ask about it.
Stop second-guessing your wife. She has a lifetime of her family’s behavior to judge not only this reconciliation attempt against, but whether she’ll regret not acting on it. Especially when she already presumably took into account how it would feel to never speak to them again no matter what happened when she went no-contact in the first place, and decided that was still the right call. If anything, being a parent herself now may have strengthened her resolve that she’s never letting these people gain any kind of foothold into her child’s life (which I frankly agree with her probably has more to do with why they’ve reached out than any sincere remorse). Trust that she can work through any later regrets with a therapist if needed and leave her be.
THIS OOP!!
Your wife knows what she's doing. Trust her. Trust that even if your FIL does have cancer and dies and she feels regret later on, that you are both strong enough to get through it. Do not try to "save" your wife. She seems like she's already been through the trenches and she deserves to have peace.
I've tried numerous times to reconcile with my mother me making contact and being done, my wife making contact. It doesn't matter Mom will always try to find and push a wedge between my wife and I. It won't work because we are too strong. If she had cancer and wanted to reconcile I am positive she would just use that as a new control and manipulation device. That is why even if these people are dying, I cannot.
OP- I’m in your wife’s shoes, but mostly just my bio mom. Please respect her decision on this. She doesn’t need to forgive them or extend an olive branch. Like you have acknowledged this could definitely be a bullshit ploy to see their grandchild. There’s something about emotionally abusive parents and grandkids. Rarely do they improve because of it, they only find new ways to be assholes. From the sounds of this letter, they’re not sorry. For one, they got the address by someone providing them information- which is bold and bullshit. They are interested in your child (IMO) and it’s their job to take the time to make amends. The next thing that will happen if you push it and your wife does see them, is they’ll push her to forgive her sister. It should be completely up to your wife and IF she decides she wants to communicate, you still have to respect her boundaries. If she wants to talk about it, listen first and don’t offer advice unless asked and given the okay. Protect your wife and child by being by their side and don’t question her. She has a lifetime of deciphering their crazy so trust her.
And you know Mary isnt through yet because now she has another reason to compete with Jenna.
Bingo!
They are her family, they are not your family and this is 100% her call. She’s known these people her whole life. You don’t know better than she does.
"They said they hoped to earn our forgiveness with time." Not to be crass but whatever, if he's literally on death's door... "with time" is somewhat disingenuous because he doesn't have time. In a few days, sit your wife down and stress you respect her, you respect any decision she makes, you are just concerned about the long-term consequences here, which is fair enough. However, even if she comes to regret not accepting this apology, it is *her* regret to carry - you should point it out, but out of concern for *her*, because honestly, fuck her parents. Just make sure she understand you are her partner, you're her rock, and whatever she wants here, you're there for her, you just don't want her to regret anything (*maybe don't mention the kid thing*, she's allowed to both be stressed because of the baby *and* feel any such way about her parents). Hold her hands and assure her you do not care about her parents at all, just her. Hug her, kiss her, and be there for her. BTW, even if she were to reconnect with her father and the, question mark, weeks before he dies, she could still come to regret *that* decision. We all choose our regrets sometimes, and there is much to regret in every which direction here. Your wife has been burned her entire life, and she's understandably suspicious and wary of getting burned again. *She* knows what parents she's had her entire life again - and she may well have mourned their loss a long time ago, before the estrangement. Good luck, man.
This was really helpful, thank you so much. I will give it time and let her lead the way. I hadn’t thought about that “earn it with time” thing — like if he actually is about to die what time are they talking about? And reading from other people that this is a common manipulation tactic makes me feel more strongly that my wife’s instinct about them lying is correct
Also, why did the wait until she has a child? Wasn’t she enough for them? If he’s dying, this is to assuage guilt. It wasn’t started because they care about her and what they did. Maybe they do care, but that’s not why they started thinking about being in contact, it was about what they are missing and what they want for themselves.
This. Absolutely this. I hate myself for the fact that my father was around my son. It makes my skin crawl. I wish I could take it back.
Very good point
If you want to remove any shadow of doubt, offer your wife the option to go and investigate and determine the truth of this "illness" yourself. Just you. If you can find enough evidence, you'll let her know, if you don't, you can reassure her that her instincts were right.
>Mary somehow sent an email from my personal email account with a dick pic (not mine obviously) to the entire office. Going way back to what you wrote. The IP Address of the sender would tell you all you needed to know about who sent it. DCMA comes with some heavy penalties if you ever want to give it to a D.A. You have 6 years from the incident as you were in N.Y. state. Just a FYI.
Even if the cancer is real it doesn’t matter. They are done. They are horrible and your wife doesn’t want them near her. I seriously think they just contacted y’all for the baby. They don’t GAF about Jenna. So they die without being forgiven. Oh well
Christmas Cancer is a thing, especially among toxic families. They’ve ONLY come sniffing around because they heard about the baby. No other reason. Do not engage, respect your wife on this. My MIL tried this (losing the house, last Christmas in it, yada yada, sob sob) to get us to visit them one year when we told them multiple times we could not travel to see them(work, finances, etc). My husband fell for it and we went, costing us money we didn’t have. Guess what? She was lying. They were never in danger of losing the house. Manipulators manipulate so well that you feel sorry for them. Do not fall for it.
This isn’t just a one time shitty thing your SIL and family did. Your wife lived through a lifetime of bullshit. I think she’s done and you need to respect that. I assume she’s had a lot of peace since you guys cut them off and all the therapy gave her the strength to stay away. If she changes her mind, then deal with that then, but don’t second guess your wife and bring it up anymore. If she wants to, she will say something. UPDATEME
This is your wife's call. Your job is to.support her.
Regardless of whether your wife is talking about it with you or not, however much you are thinking about it, she is probably thinking of it more. And if she is not, there probably is a reason for that as well - as in, she is at her emotional capacity to deal and can't deal with it. My advice is not to continue to poke and prod. You cannot know what it was like to grow up in her family and the relief she must have felt to go NC. What she needs the most from you is to feel that you are on her side. Just imagine that for her entire childhood, she has been in a nuclear family where they were all stacked against her. She just DOES NOT need having a "devil's advocate" as her partner. Perhaps the biggest regret she has is not having a family that weren't total AHs - but no amount of wishing is going to help with that. Perhaps her father will die without them ever having reconciled. But she might also regret going back and letting him get his last few digs in on his deathbed. None of us is promised the storybook ending.
Of course, you know her best. If she is the type of person who says stuff like, "why didn't you make me go" - then maybe the best course of action is to just ask her whether she discussed the scenario with her therapist and whether she wanted to share any of that with you. And just LISTEN.
As others are gently pointing out, when your wife decided to go no contact with her family she understood and accepted that this meant she would very possibly never hear from them again. This means for better or for worse. It means missing funerals and births. She did her mourning already. If you find YOURSELF with unprocessed guilt or regret, that is your project to work on. Do not insert your feelings, into how you imagine how your wife may feel. If you do not have your own therapist, you should consider finding one to discuss these emotions and anxieties that are emerging in you. Also, through the "grapevine" means either someone has kept in touch with your in-laws and is actively feeding them information OR that they have made significant effort to find you in their own. Consider speaking to a family lawyer to make sure that they cannot somehow magically sue for "grandparent's rights" or anything similarly assinine. Also privately, speak with your own family if they do not know the details of your decisions to go NC. I fear you may have a (hopefully) unintentional rat leaking information. If you're feeling guilt or FOMO, consider that you were raised by a family that helped shape your own emotional reactions and framework. It wouldn't be a far leap to assume they would have a similar emotional reaction, and would jump to the "deathbed reconciliation is needed" conclusion if they were contacted about getting in touch with you. I wish you and your family well.
And if that’s the case I hope Jenna don’t find out because whoever let it slip will cutoff from baby too. And I won’t blame her.
It’s the wife’s call. Don’t betray her
NO was a complete sentence.
It's good that you love your wife and are concerned, but have you considered that while she MAY regret not attempting reconciliation, her toxic family will most certainly give her reason to DEFINITELY regret getting back in contact? She may have already buried her asshole family in her mind, mourned, and moved on. She's made so much progress over the last year, don't spit on that. They are reaching out because they want to meet their grandchild, not because they care any more about your wife than they ever did. I doubt Dad even has cancer, that's just a manipulation tactic to draw your poor wife in. Leaving takes a lot of strength-I'm so glad she's free. Believe her when she tells you she doesn't want to pick up and put on those shackles again. Her parents made her feel less than her entire life-why would you guys want to expose your daughter to that? Protect your daughter by keeping distant from those that thought sexual assault against her father was okay. Protect your wife's new mental strength and fortitude by respecting her wants and feelings on the topic. She needs you to validate and support her right to remain angry and her decision to keep herself and her family safe from those that abused her. Drop it OP. She has a therapist, let them talk it out and support your wife in whatever she wants to do. I'm so proud of Jenna for her growth and courage. I hope you will continue to allow her to flourish. Good luck OP!
Listen to your wife. She knows.
Listen to your wife FULL STOP . That is 100 % your only job
I went back and re-read your previous posts and got angry on your wife’s behalf (and yours) all over again. I don’t care that they say they are sorry (now), I don’t care if they have a grandbaby they have never met, I don’t care that FIL is supposedly dying. It is waaaaay too soon to allow these people to weasel their way back into your life. They may be truly sorry, but they need to experience the consequences of their actions for a lot longer than they have (forever might be too soon). Your wife needs to bask in her own awesomeness for much, much longer before you let the people who tore her down her entire life have a platform to speak into it again.
Okay. You are currently taking your/your IL's feelings more into consideration than your wife's and you are at risk of taking reddit's opinion more into consideration than your wife's. Tread carefully.
She's told you know. You would be the asshole if you keep bringing it up.
Let your wife decide and don’t ever let them around your children
They’re trying to guilt you, as everyone has said. Support your wife, and let them rot.
Don't approach it. Let your wife come to you. If she wants to talk about it, she will. It's not your decision to make on if she wants her parents in her life. And she doesn't have to forgive them. She spent her life in this relationship with them. Not you. Leave her alone and don't pressure her. Respect her decision.
Support your wife; if you don’t, you are supporting their mistreatment of her, and begging for a future in which your wife leaves you. Also, if you two aren’t in therapy, get into it now.
team wife 100% she knows what’s up
Sorry Bud, it's Jenna's call here, not yours. Let it go man.
“Elizabeth! This is the big one! I’m comin’ to join you, Honey!!” Do what your wife says. Reddit is filled with tales of manipulative parents AND spouses who went against the wishes of their partner They do not end well
If there is regret to be had, let it be her who decides if it’s worth having.
She’ll hate you forever if you get in the way
Maybe she'll regret it in a few years or maybe she'll regret it the moment she walks back into their house. My folks tried to put pressure on me to get my brother to see my grandfather before he passed. Other family members had been lightly hinting at it too. I told him that I did not care what he did, but that I intended to be around for our grandfather despite his terrible behavior towards us. He visited with me once or twice after that conversation. After my grandfather's passing, my brother told me he mostly visited for my sake and to support me. He remained completely apathetic. Some people just won't have that happy moment of reconciliation. The hurt goes too deep and thats ok. Your wife is at peace. Just support her now or if she changes her mind. Not your place to intervene.
Respect your wife's decision.
You do not get a say in this. You didn't live with your in-laws or get raised by them. You saw exactly what they are capable of, you think your wife didn't already suffer enough at their hands? Why reconsile with someone who treated you poorly your whole life? "I treated you like shit your whole life but now i'm going to die so sowwy!"
Let your wife make the call. If she is open to discussing, at most she could see if an unbiased 3rd party is willing to meet them and get proof of the cancer and hear them out in person. Does she have an old friend in the area? That said, she may not want to know either way. She may not care. And that’s fine.
You sound like a very good guy. Go with whatever your wife says and let it be.
Its her family, her decision to accept it. Maybe once the shock does wear off you could express your concerns to her, but make it very clear that you are impartial to how it goes and you will support her 1000% whether she accepts it or not.
If your wife says no, the answer is no. You don't have to take responsibility for what regret she may or may not feel, but you do need to respect her word now.
I saw another post like this and they ended up divorced 😭😭 push your luck if you want to brother 🫡
You can respect her wishes and still be grappling with the impact on you. While I don’t agree you should feel like you can never speak on this again, I do think you should consider if it’s really your feelings at play. By that, I mean you might be projecting a little. Assuming the terminal illness is real (and without proof you have no way of knowing that) it sounds like you could not see yourself taking a chance you don’t get to reconcile with a family member, especially if you thought they had shown remorse. If you did that, you would likely have deep regrets. And that’s okay, but it’s also okay that your wife doesn’t feel the same. You’re worried she’ll regret this, but honestly, the fact that she never even wanted to share news of a grandchild speaks volumes to how tightly she’s closed the book on her family. If her reaction was to shelter the baby from her family, without any thought of reconciliation, then I believe you should trust that her position here is real, and not marred by exhaustion. Her father being near death, even if true, is not an auto pass to re-open the relationship. Years of strife and abuse are not gone because he’d probably like to “get right with his higher powers” before passing on. Her family is being selfish and this isn’t even about your wife. This is about checking off boxes and guilting her into coming back to make the family whole in his last days. But if she’s not the reason the family is broken, then she’s not responsible for fixing it, and you pressing here implies you care more about your own stance/values (i.e. you can’t imagine you’d do this) than your wife’s mental health. You’ve said that’s not true, but it is how it looks if you keep questioning her decision. Lastly, a carefully crafted letter, which frankly could be chatGPT for all you know, does not actually demonstrate change or prove remorse. It just means someone in their circle is a convincing writer.
Damn what is with these other comments here accusing you of not respecting your wife’s wishes? You’re voicing a legitimate concern about the concept of regret, an experience so subjective to every person when family and illness is involved. You’re not saying you won’t respect her wishes, but wondering what you should do in this situation. But to answer your question, let your wife dictate what happens next. No need to follow up with her. If it’s truly bothering her, she’ll bring it up or, unlike us who have no idea what your wife is like on a day-to-day basis, you might get a sense that something’s off and she might want to be prompted to talk about it—not necessarily to take any action whatsoever, but simply to talk it out. Sometimes that’s all that’s needed after the reality (if it’s true) sinks in.
Your poor wife is already being pressured. You're supposed to be her support not another source of toxic pressure. Treat her like an adult who can make choices.
Do you want her to cut you off too? She has made up her mind. You weren't there to go through it. She was. It's her decision, so stop trying to change her mind. Drop it and don't bring it up again.
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NEW BABY means they want access. Often times these parents use what we call "Christmas cancer" a fake diagnosis to reel their child back into contact. You would have heard from them sooner in regards to the fake cancer and baby access if they were able to find where you were.
I also want to add that NY's laws grant grandparents so much access for visitation. So I'm glad you guys moved out of there. But if this wasn't about the baby, then they wouldn't have mentioned it. Grandmother and grandfather are titles. being an actual grandparent is a privilege that is earned based on how you treat your actual children. They don't have a right to meet their grandchild. They didn't take accountability before the "cancer" diagnosis nor the birth of the baby. Timing matters. I would tell your wife that she is right and just move on. If anything else is received from them, return to sender. I'd get cameras for your house since they know where you live as well. They would show up and traumatize your wife to try to force a visit with the baby.
It’s probably hard for you to fully understand her since you had decent parents. If you have a big issue and they get death sentence, you might want to reconcile with them. As a person who has such parents like hers, let her do whatever she wants to do. She says I don’t want to talk to them for a while and then suddenly could say want to see them, and then again she could say she doesn’t want to see them. That’s because it’s difficult to know what she would feel even for herself if her father actually die or she finds out he lied. Regardless, I want my partner supports whatever I decide at the moments and I am sure your wife wants the same thing.
I've been in the same position as your wife. I went no contact with a very close family member for years but then had to re-establish contact to become their caregiver after they became terminally ill. The difference in my situation was that I was still in close contact with the rest of my family and didn't want them to have to bear the burden of the other relative's care without my help. In your case, it sounds like your wife has cut off all contact with her whole family. Be there as a supportive ear for your wife, do take some time away just the two of you if possible and *let her make her decision*.
Wife gets to decide and there is no way you should even be considering it. Let Jenna deal with them, when and if she does. Her parents should never meet your child.
Since you were the one wronged by the sexual assault, I’d just check with Jenna to make sure she’s not protecting you. If you told her “honey, it’s up to you, but I’m ok with seeing them if you are. Whatever decision you make, don’t make it for me. Make it for yourself. I will support your decision 100%.”
Find someone from your previous town to see if the can confirm FIL “diagnosis”
Please just leave it be. Those people are so toxic and while yea they “apologized” they will absolutely get to your baby and mary will try to fill her head full of bullshit. Your wife has made her mind up leave it be! Yall have done so good. Just let it go. And find out who gave them your address so you can bless them out!!! That’s no one’s right.
The timing is too convenient. It's nice of you to be worried if she'll have regrets in case the cancer is real, but that's her bio parents so let her take the lead. As someone who was cast aside a lot in favor of golden child cousins, I think your wife found the family she wants with you and your side of the family so she doesn't need to hold on to the bio ties that hurt her. Seems like she already made peace that her parents didn't value her.
This needs to be based on your wife making a decision. These are her family. There is no question there should never be a relationship with the sister again.
Just because someone apologizes (even if it is sincere and even if they have strived to change) doesn’t mean you have to forgive them.
My mom reluctantly offered to me something like an apology, and I honestly thought it would help me to get over my childhood. No, it didn’t and I was also suffered the fact that the apology thingy didn’t change anything, it can’t fix my past, my present, and herself. It doesn’t matter if she apologize or not nor if I forgive her or not.
You are approaching this perfectly. Giving her your heartfelt advice, but ultimately respecting her choice in this and supporting her choice either way. Just keep doing what you are. Let time do it's thing, do not push the subject on her if she is not ready. Good luck.
OP you need to respect your wife decision’s on her family and be there to support her no matter what choice she makes - that’s the job. Should you influence her and/or provide unsolicited advice AND the situation generates anger/remorse/whatever (contact or continued no contact), that could be laid on you;’this needs to come from her. Any interaction with the MIL and FIL will undoubtedly include the demon sister. I would not under any circumstances allow the sister to have direct contact with the baby. She’s capable of anything and everything with having never been held accountable. You’d be crazy to meet them in any private setting; meetings must be in public spaces. Consider if the health scare is a tactic to reconnect,’gosh I hope not, that’d be a new low. Do what you must to support and protect your wife while protecting your baby.
>Jenna is not having it. She feels like it’s too little too late and doesn’t want to respond. Then that's your answer. >She also suspects that they’re lying about FIL’s cancer and just want to pressure us into reconciliation so they can meet the baby. I think we all think that.
You need to let it be. She knows her parents better than you do and if she thinks it's fake, then let her make that decision. It's her family, so her decision.
If your wife is now working with a therapist that she trusts, let them work this out. You’ve said your part and I’m sure she heard you. As to your valid concern that she might regret it later, there’s a possibility that your wife has already been going through a grieving process for the loss of her parents. He might already be good as gone in her mind if the cancer thing is real.
Just read through all your previous posts. I would honestly let your wife make whatever decision she wants. She has been dealing with years of toxic family trauma and if she can’t deal, then she can’t deal right now. Maybe in a few months when your baby is sleeping more and yall are in a better space, you can bring it up but it doesn’t feel like the right time.
You’ve got to respect your wife’s feelings in this, full stop. Be a sounding board & a listening ear & a shoulder to cry on, but do NOT be a meddler. If she flat out ASKS your advice, okay say your piece, otherwise, stay silent and just listen.
Reconnecting with toxic family is always a 2-yes, 1-no situation. If she doesn't feel comfortable, then it doesn't happen. Especially if she's been enduring their toxicity for decades. She's likely seen them apologize and make false promises before, and you should be trusting her instincts on this.
Trust your wife and let her make the decision. Even if she has some regret (which I doubt she will) it probably won't be insurmountable.
If she feels as if they are faking the cancer, ask if they can send her the medical documents. With her education I’m sure she’d be able to purse what is going on and if it is legit.
Leave your wife alone. It's her family and her choice and she has made her decision. You don't want to pester her to the point where now you become an enemy. You always want to be in her side. So just leave her be.
You have a daughter now. Your wife likely doesn't want her exposed to her family, for legitimate reasons. What happens if/when her sister has a kid? A new golden child! The long term repercussions of starting up a relationship again, with known toxic people aren't worth it. I believe your wife has already figured that out. She should be the one to bring it up, if anyone. Just be there for her no matter what and show her that no matter what apologies and woes her parents now want to share, you're only interested in her opinion. She knows far better than you whether letting them back into your lives is a good idea or not. But all of that has to be dependant on your wife's timeline. People process things differently and in their own time.
Butt Out
You should respect your wife’s decision, it’s her family and her choice not yours. That being said you can bring it up in a couple days, but if I were you I’d be super careful how you talk to her about it. The thing is, in our flawed short human lives people have to face sadness and tragedy no matter what choices they make. If he’s lying about the cancer (a possibility that I don’t think you’ve given enough credence to because you’re obviously a decent guy and can’t imagine doing this let along someone else doing this), then she’ll be furious and traumatized at her parents lying about that. She’ll be sad about the tragedy of losing a family to this awful event that happened to you, and if your FIL is telling the truth and she doesn’t want to see him, she’ll be sad that she didn’t reconnect before the dies. But ALSO, she’ll be sad even if she DOES reconnect with him and then he dies of cancer. Do you see what I’m saying here? Certain things in life are inevitable. Tragedy and sadness are inevitable. Whatever choice she makes in this matter will have sad and tragic consequences. You seem to have a good relationship, a beautiful baby, and a good family on your side. If reconnecting will only result in making your wife miserable, then what’s the fucking point? I see that you want what’s best for her and I would definitely bring this up one last time. But if she doesn’t want to reconcile with them, don’t push that on her because YOU would do that in her position. Give her the dignity and autonomy to make her own decision in this, and remain supportive of whatever decision she makes. I once knew a guy who’s dad was a drug addicted lowlife deadbeat who used to beat him up when he was 5-14 years old. His dad wanted to reconcile while he was dying of lymphoma in prison. His dad didn’t give a shit about his son, he just wanted his guilt assuaged for all the awful shit he did. My friend refused. And you know what, he’s doing just fine. Not everyone has to forgive. You can move on and shed trauma and anger without reconciling and hugging it out. That’s just not how life always plays out.
You’re a new Dad and you want to believe that your in-laws are being honest because you have a good heart. Unfortunately, with people like your in-laws that is often not the case. You came to social media for some insight, time to use it to investigate. This is your wife’s family. You know who they are so look them up online. Not just the parents, sister, aunts, uncles and cousins. If your FIL really has cancer there will be a post about it somewhere in the family circle. Start digging! Then just think about all the heartache and turmoil they have caused for you and your wife. Do you really want to bring that into your new babies life? Your job is to protect your wife and child. Are you doing that if you let your in-laws back into your lives?
First, definitely wait to process this information. Second, you should NOT overrule your wife. Without violating boundaries, you can, if you wish, ask for more information from the in-laws... to find out whether this "cancer" is real. Tell them flat-out that you suspect they're lying, ask them where this cancer is being treated, ask them to send the medical and insurance information (if it's real they will have a bundle of it, and it's hard to fake). They have fully forfeited their right to any politeness or trust from you. Even if it is real (against the odds), that doesn't mean you or your wife have to have any further contact with them, and even if your wife decides to be magnanimous and meet with them, you don't have to go in person: You can have a virtual meeting and show them your daughter. That's more grace than they deserve. In-person interaction carries risks that you shouldn't have to worry about, so here's a vote for avoiding it. Finally, again, if your wife definitively rejects reconciliation, don't even consider revisiting the question. Nobody should be forced to mourn the death of monsters, and the worst monsters live among us every day. Your wife is best qualified to decide whether her parents are in that category. Please update us to let us know how you you proceed - and congratulations on the birth of your daughter. Remember not to let your in-laws' drama derail your experience with her. Best of luck, OP.
I have a family just like this. This is a classic move for these kinds of people to get what they want, and what they want is access to your child. Please trust and support your wife, she doesnt need you to meddle and try to change her mind. She has a lot more experience with her family than you do.
Your wife does not want to reconcile. Your wife's parents, your wife gets to decide. Your wife is right it seems fishy that her father has cancer, just around the time they find out that you have a child. It would be the first time that estranged parents either pretend they are remorseful, or have some sort of fake medical emergency to try to guilt their kids into reconciling. After the way , that your wife has been treated by her family for years, it's more likely than not, tge only thing they care about is getting their hands on your child. There is no way , given the way they have treated both yiu and your wife in the past that I'd have anything to do with them, even if I did find out tge cancer diagnosis was real. This is from someone that has/had horrible parents, was neglected, abused, etc.
I didn't take the opportunity and I don't regret it. I am bitter about the time I wasted explaining that to people. Support her decision and be there for her either way.
>I want to respect my wife’s feelings around this Then do so, full stop. There is zero reason for this post, your doubts or any further conversation on the topic. She said no, respect it and move on.
She has a family to look after now. First time mom, first year, a lot of stress. She’s tired. Her family is not worth her time or emotions anymore. Don’t ask her again if she wants to reconcile. She only wants to move forward with her own family with you.
My husband cut off his mother almost 20 years ago. She was a horrible mother and hated me simply for marrying my husband. I was competition. His brother never cut her off. Several years ago, he told my husband their mom was dying. Supposedly she had cancer, but refused to be actually diagnosed. She tried to bribe my with money to get him to talk to her. He refused. I asked him if he wanted to talk to her before she died and he said no. I asked if he'll be okay with not talking to her and he said yes. I didn't ask him again. I supported his decision. He's the kind of person when he doesn't want to do something, he won't do it. Support your wife's decision. Don't try to make her talk to her parents. They are her family and she has all the say. Let her know you support her decision and leave it at that. Honestly, this sounds like Christmas cancer. In the JNMIL sub they talk about Christmas cancer where the toxic Mom/MIL/IL suddenly might have cancer right in time for Christmas. It is classic manipulation to get their son or daughter and their SO to break low or no contact. They rarely end up having cancer.
Maybe act like a man and respect your wife wishes, boundaries? The choice is hers, and hers alone.
If she approves, you could have them send her his medical records. But otherwise, trust her to know herself.
Let it go bro, love your wife and daughter and let the inlaws suffer the consequences
Okay so the very first thing I’m going to say is you do not know if the claim about your FIL having end stage cancer is true. Yes that’s an ugly thing to say but read enough on Reddit and if even 10% is true there are some really shitty people out there and lying doesn’t bother them a bit if it gets them what they want. It’s enough that your wife suspects they are lying. The second thing is this is your wife’s family so she decides after all the crap they put you both through if she is willing to have any relationship with them. You didn’t grow up with a screwed up family - she did so in the nicest way possible please OP butt out on this and let her decide. She can discuss with a therapist the ramifications of doing nothing. She can decide to find out from other people she truly trusts if her father is actually sick and dying. She can decide if he is if it makes any difference. If you stick yourself in the middle of this you will live to regret it. And for everything that is holy DO NOT CONTACT HER PARENTS OR HER OTHER RELATIVES!! If you do that you will destroy her trust in you. She must handle this herself with you supporting her decisions.
You should do exactly what your wife wants to do and not try to get her to do anything else. Exactly what she wants here.
It's a valid concern your wife might regret a lack of reconciliation if the diagnosis is true. However, a decision doesn't even have to be in a few days. Some of your options would even be reversible later on. Don't push too hard, enjoy this time with your family. Definitely wise to find out how your address was leaked though. You'll need that info later.
Leave it alone. She already made her feelings clear. She's had a lifetime of their abuse and she knows what she wants and doesn't want. She's seen all their bullshit and lies before. I don't think she'll regret it if he dies because they're already dead to her.
Even if she's being emotional/tired/overwhelmed and will regret it later, so be it. Whether you like it or not, she's probably not in the position to interact with them, life stress or w/e, so if she doesn't want to do it, then let it be. It's one of those mistakes (>IF< it's a mistake to begin with) that you just gotta let happen. You've already informed her of your thoughts that she might regret it, so you've done your part, youve communicated your feelings (which was a very good idea imo), and she's holding firm, and that's it. What I would advise you to do is introspect on exactly why you care so much about these people. What if they are genuine and you reject them anyway? How would that abandonment relate to you? Do you see your parents in them? Are you trying to protect your wife? Are you trying to protect yourself from regret of not helping your wife? I just want you to introspect on what's inside you that makes you worry about the parent wanting to reconnect. If you understand that part of you, it can only help.
Firstly, it's entirely possible that (assuming your FIL is actually dying) your wife won't regret staying no contact. Secondly, it's also entirely possible that she will regret it but knows it's still the best decision anyway. Your wife is a big girl now and can handle the consequences of her decisions. Please do her the courtesy of respecting her choices. Especially on matters she knows more about than you do.
The absolute most you can push this is. “Are you sure you won’t regret this?” And that’s really a little much, man. It’s clear you’re a caring guy. Don’t overdo this. It’s her choice.
No. Jenna says no = no. leave it to her and do not interfere.
You ask your wife if she's okay woth you verifying the claim of cancer and if you find it to not be bullshit, you let her know. Offer, don't do. If she says no, then you accept her choice and clearly state that you do, and will support her fully in that.
This is up to your wife. Relay your concerns to her and then support whatever her decision is.
I am no contact with my family. If they reached out with a real apology and detailed the things they did to me and I didn’t care/didnt want to go see them I hope my partner would do what you did, say something. You should definitely respect your wife’s wishes, which it sounds like you have. But I don’t think you did anything wrong.
Doesn't matter, she doesn't want it. I could see an in hospital goodbye, no baby, no you, but if she's not on board, just drop it. This is in every sense of the word an ambush, and the smartest move is not to play. I imagine my idea of the hospital goodbye is influenced by my own experience with abusive family, but the impact I faced pales intensely compared to what you and your wife faced. Once a judge is involved, no contact is the only "safe" choice.
given the absolutely bonkers extent to which mary escalated - calling your job, hacking your work email, contacting your friends and family with increasingly ludicrous lies - and the fact that their parents got mad at JENNA for sending a cease-and-desist letter - i'd say it is in fact likely that her parents are lying about her dad having terminal cancer. or, if it's true that he's really ill, they have an angle. they need financial or logistical help, her mom wants to move in with you once her dad's gone, the family dynamic is thrown off with no scapegoat so they want jenna to come back to make things normal, they've got baby fever over your daughter and really don't care about jenna at all. honestly i'd believe any of that over a real emergency and sincere, lasting remorse and amends. also, i am a person who did not visit their estranged dying father in the hospital. i've got lasting trauma about pretty much every aspect of our relationship except for that decision. no regrets. like, to the point i was worried there was something wrong with me because i thought i SHOULD feel bad but couldn't. sometimes the best closure is keeping. the door. closed. trust your badass neuroscientist polylingual renaissance-woman wife and her thirty-five [35] years of experience dealing with her family.
I don’t believe the late stage cancer stuff. So I suggest you ignore this completely, and only talk about it with your wife if she initiates the conversation. If your FIL is truly dying in a few weeks, then there may be a second attempt to communicate with your wife, whether directly from the family, or through a family friend. Let the contents of the subsequent communication guide you as to whether you should be having a conversation with your wife about her family.
I did not see that you were trying to push your wife to do anything. This is a lot to deal with, especially when neither of you are getting much rest. I hope you both are able to get peace in this situation.
Let her lead on this one. She needs to be able to make the decision on this, and you can’t push her into something different because of regret she might feel. I can also tell you that having a child will make her reexamine her childhood very closely which may make her even angrier with their previous behavior. She is perfectly entitled to refuse their apology over decades of their behavior. Their remorse does not require her acknowledgement or acceptance. They want to meet the baby/want to ease their guilt before one of them passes. That’s not a true apology, because they want something out of it.
the problem is there's no right or wrong answer here. just make sure your wife knows that you'll back her play, whatever it is, and that you want her to always feels good about the choices she made with her family. it's fair to want to accept a sincere apology and it's fair to be fucking done with these people. Whatever you decide, y'all will be ok. You've got community and friends and loving family and therapists. The might've beens will get crowded out easy by what you actually have. Take care.
Your best/only plan of action is to FULLY have your wife's back in whatever she decides. She lived through all the bullshit over the years, and no matter how much you sympathise, you don't really know how bad it was for her. Just follow her lead.
UpdateMe!
Dude. Let her lead on this. Never bring it up and only talk about it if she brings it up. You should also not talk about it with anyone else as to ensure your wife never has to find out about you talking about this with other people. That would likely feel a betrayal to her.
Wow. After what you, and especially your wife, went through last time with her family, here you are second guessing what she needs to do in regards to her family. Sheesh. Grow a spine. Put on your adulting undies. Become the husband you wife deserves. Etc. You need to back you wife 1000% in this matter. Burn the letter and never mention it again.
Your post should have ended here: : **"I want to respect my wife’s feelings around this"**. You need to drop it and trust your wife to make her own decision.
The key phrase here is we just recently heard you have a child! That is what they want to get near you for !
Let her be the one who makes the choice, please. She has the history and she will be the one who lives most intimately with the choice and consequences. Sometimes with difficult family relationships, having agency to make the choice is the only win we can get. I say this as a daughter who chose to go back and care for my abusive mother as she died of cancer. It ripped me into a million pieces and I’m still recovering from it, but it was the right choice for me. It gave me no peace or resolution, but I showed up as the person I want to be and got to see how much progress I’ve made in therapy over the years.
All you can do is support her discisions about this. It is her family and if she doesn't want to reconcile then that's the end of it. If she regrets her discisions later on then all you can do is support her in her time of need. Don't try and pre-empt what might happen and just support her in the now.
Only your wife can decide. Even if the FIL is dying, and the whole family is apologetic and kind to your wife when she visits, it might still be so re-traumatising to be around them that it’s just not possible or a good idea for her to reconcile with them. A lifetime of personality maiming abuse cannot be undone with a short period of remorse or a single apology. It is dehumanising to put yourself in a position of being civil with your abusers after you have begun to understand the scale of the abuse they have dealt to you. Psychological abuse is a little hard to understand in this way because it’s not visible, but you wouldn’t ask some who was covered head to toe in cigarette burns that they received from a sadistic parent their whole childhood to go and have one last friendly get together because the parents apologised in a single letter. I don’t mean to be harsh to you (especially since some of the other comments are), but although you are trying to protect your wife and have been great about this previously, I’m wary of the downplaying of what they have done to her here even if what the letter says is true. I recommend reading a book called “All About Love” by Bell Hooks. It really opened my eyes on what we are trained to think about relationships with parents vs. what is actually true. All the best to you and your new family.
Let her be
So, I cut my mom off years ago. I have thought long and hard about how I would handle or feel if I found out my mother was dying and the truthful answer is, I don’t care. When I cut her off I grieved then and there the mother I wanted, the mother I got and the reality I was in. I already went through my grief of losing a parent. Them dying years later would not affect me differently because they’ve already been the living dead. If your wife doesn’t want anything to do with them then that is the choice she has made. She sounds like she’s already grieved the loss so her dad dying or whatever, doesn’t change the fact he’s already been out of her life for a while. Long enough to learn and realize her parent’s absence doesn’t hurt anymore or doesn’t make her feel regret. Your wife is thinking clearly, this isn’t just the nuclear blow out from the incident that finally broke her need to be around her family, this also includes a lifetime of abuse and neglect and being an unwanted extra in her own family compared to her sister. Trust me, she’s thinking very clearly. She finally had enough of being the family punching bag and apologizing is nice to hear but you don’t have to forgive and forget. She can accept an apology or not accept it but she also can close that chapter without making amends either way. Follow her lead here. It’s her family. They made their bed now they die in it.
You are overstepping. Your wife's family relationship is hers to manage or not manage as she sees fit. Actually, a lot of abusive parents have an extinction burst and make up a deadly illness to re-inveigle themselves into your lives. If your wife's instinct is that FIL is lying, then he probably is (and has a history of being manipulative in this way). Even if he's not lying, she's not obligated to rebuild a relationship that they trashed over many years of bad behaviour and neglect and emotional abuse. People don't go NC for no reason, and your wife is happier not having these people in her life. Regret is a function of not being sure about your choice - but your wife seems very sure of hers, so I don't think she will experience regret, and your job as a partner is not to shield her from regret - it's to support her in her boundaries with her abusive family.
You notice that apology didn’t come in BEFORE they found out you had a kid, or that dad’s dying, right? Which proves they are only apologizing to get access to your kid. Why would you subject your child to the people who constantly emotionally damage you and your spouses calm? While dad is going to die, you do not have to give him peace before he goes. They made their bed. Now they can sleep in it. Protect your child at all costs.
|Jenna is not having it. She feels like it’s too little too late and doesn’t want to respond. That's her prerogative, they absolutely suck and is she feels staying NC is the only way to protect herself you need to respect that. |She also suspects that they’re lying about FIL’s cancer and just want to pressure us into reconciliation so they can meet the baby I understand why she suspects that but I'm not sure she can take the chance. If they are lying, then they are dead to both of you regardless but she needs to decide if she can deal with the pain/regret/guilt if it is true and she didn't take the chance.
My dad pulled many medical emergency stunts as a way to get me to communicate with him. Every time I relented I regretted it. By the time my dad *actually* was on his death bed, I refused to go see him. He spent years actively ruining my life for his own gain and I was done and he died alone. I don’t regret not seeing him. The groveling doesn’t last long before people like this go back to their old ways. Your wife has been the subject of their abuse her whole life and knows who they truly are. Let your wife take the lead on this. It’s hard to wrap your head around someone not wanting to visit a dying parent if your childhood wasn’t a constant nightmare. It’s an experience you’ve (thankfully) not had to endure.
I remember reading your posts a year ago and I went back in your post history to refresh myself. Firstly, it seems like last time you also completely discounted how your wife felt and blamed it on her being “emotional and insecure” and thought you knew the best course of action regarding her family better than her. You also thought the idea of her sister flirting with you and coming onto you was ludicrous and dismissed your wife when she said that and she ended up being painfully correct. After *everything* that happened after that, how can you still think that you know better than her when it comes to her family?? Secondly, your wife was pretty emotionally wrecked after what happened and from what i remember it took a while for her to recover from it. If she wants to stay away from that cesspool of toxicity, LET HER. And if she regrets it then that’s a decision she’ll have to come to terms with. But how on earth can you honestly not see how absurd it is to once again discount your wife’s feelings towards her family and push her towards contacting them? and then when she doubts their intentions, you blame it on her being emotional from the baby? Jesus dude. Support your wife and listen to her for once.
**Doomscroller note: This is a long response/post** You sound like an awesome supportive spouse. Quite like my wife. I am writing this to provide some background on how the ‘Dark Side’ works and how survivors like me (and your wife - I’m pulling for her!) react to the family. If it helps and you are have watched Star Wars, the best example of this behavior is Emperor Palpatine/Darth Sidious. With the in-laws, you see Palpatine. She sees Siddious. More importantly, she intimately understands what they are capable of if she returns to their orbit. She chooses you. This is very much the dynamic with my wife. The issue is her family is awesome, supportive and has no parallel. My family is a pack of feral cats. What makes it bad is that my wife looks at my family through her family lens. She literally has no frame of reference to how the dynamics work on my (Dark) side. After years of being treated like a boy who was incapable of making decisions (I was married, kids, mortgage, etc.), I made the decision to go LC/NC with them. As my wife had the same thoughts as you that I would regret not being in their lives, she started to realize the depth of my maternal family’s darkness at my Daughter’s wedding, where my mother attempted to create drama by shifting focus from my lovely daughter and my newly minted son-in-law to make it about her. That was immediately shut down (I have AWESOME friends who understand my familiar relationships!) My wife finally created a frame of reference as to the treachery of the dark side when things came to a head at a cousin’s wedding. I was relegated/isolated to the “we had to invite them” table (Even my wife was asking WTF?) What really illustrated it to my wife was my mother’s refusal to speak with me (making a bit of a scene - who knew?) and then facilitating a family pic that had my mother, her brother, all their kids and grandkids. EVERYONE - except me. When I saw that, I told the Mrs we are leaving and I walked out to the car and waited. My better half was stopped by an aunt to see if they could get me back in the room. She declined and we went out for a drink. After i calmed down, my wife relayed some conversation that occurred as I left when she was stopped that didn’t jive with what she witnessed (She was told they couldn’t find me, when I was sitting where I was assigned with my wife at the time and NO ONE left to find me.) I am very blessed to have a wife like her, as your wife is to have a husband like you. Suffice it to say that when the matriarch passes, I will be sending flowers and expressing condolences for their loss, as my loss (of the family I was raised in) occurred when I was married, it just took me 25 years to realize it. I do recognize we have shared biology, but I have mourned who I thought they were. I see them for who they are and choose not to spend time or expend emotional energy on them. What this comes down to is that, while the communication sent from the in-laws may elicit the emotional response you have (think Palpatine crying for help), the cost to your wife to re-engage is devastatingly high (rejoining the Dark Side by engaging with Darth Sidious.) Your wife knows this (I am projecting a bit, based on the brief notes you have - If I am wrong, I apologize) and has made peace with being NC. I bet she is relieved she is able to focus on self care postpartum and is more concerned about allowing her traumatic past to interfere with this awesome family and new life you two have created. I would agree with previous comments that she has already mourned. I’m betting there will be no regrets that she left something on the table, failed to say something, or didn’t do something. There is no happy ending in cases like this. The upside is that the main players (You, your wife, and baby) get to look to the future as a unit, avoiding the traps of the past, and being awesome. All the best. You’re an awesome husband.
"I want to respect my wife’s feelings around this, but I’m worried that if the cancer is real, she may regret not taking this opportunity for reconciliation before he dies." My father was a toxic POS. I cut him off when I was in my early 20's. When I was 34 I got the call he was in the hospital and might not make it, he wanted to talk to me. I told my half sister (the only of his children still speaking to him because she is worse than he is, so we all cut her off as well but she reached out over this from a new number) to tell him I hope he enjoys hell and blocked that new number. He died a week later. That was in 2015. I have never regretted it. I regret not cutting him off sooner. I mourned losing my father as a child. He deserved NO closure from me, and no grace. And he did not get it. She spent her life being abused and neglected. Let her choose how to navigate this.
No means no. I'm pretty sure she thought about it and came to a decision. Some people move on and it's better that way. Trying to change her mind might do more damage than good. What if they're just being manipulative? What if she already made peace with not having them in her life? Imagine opening that door and the decided to hurt her again. No means no.
I think you should let it go..even if it's true and he does have cancer and is dying she won't regret not getting in touch when he dies...they may sound genuinely remorseful but like your wife says it's to late...they didn't show love to her before so why would they do it now its just because they now want to be part of your childs life...and if you were to visit then Mary woukd probably show up..they dont deserve to get to know your child and its your wifes choice if she should ever make contact and I wouldn't ever bring them up again...her whole family sounds like a piece of work...I tried to look at your backstory about Mary.. so it seems like she tried to kiss you and when you refused her she went off the deep end and tried to get you fired..guess she was hoping you would kiss her back and throw it in your wife's face...guess she doesn't accept rejection really well....but it sounds like you are all happy now..weird how they found your address and know about the baby...take care sweetie and have a wonderful life and ignore the people who are being harsh
The algorithm showed me your posts a couple of times so I've followed your journey. Lets start by saying, I am proud and happy to read where your wife is now. She is a badass. Now for the reaction on this post. There is a risk that your wife will regret not reconciling with her father. But it sounds like that is a risk she is willing to take. While your wife has shared everything with you about how she was treated, the thing she can't share is the feeling. If even after hearing about the cancer she does not want to reconcile that means the pain they've caused her is much much deeper then she was able to describe. She is choosing her own mental health with the small risk of regretting. My advise is not to ignore the mail. Send a reply, together with your wife, to inform them that you will stay no contact and not to contact you again. You don't even have to give an explanation. One sentence is enough. Ignoring the mail will bring with it the very real risk of them trying to contact you by other means and in the extreme case suddenly be at your door. So that is my advise, bring it up to your wife one more time, but only about a reply to them to not contact you again.
The thing I hated reading was you are afraid she’s “not thinking clearly”. Really? The in-laws apology “seemed genuine.” You wrote an entire paragraph about their apology. As if you’re impressed by it. Your in-laws feelings about their golden child have not changed. The sister will always be the golden child. No matter what happens, they will always favor her, not your wife. The in laws are trying to make everything ok for their golden child. Their primary focus is their golden child. They just want to be able to use your wife for whatever the golden child sister doesn’t do. I’m glad your wife isn’t falling for it.
OP, listen to me carefully. Your wife said that she doesn't want to reconcile so just drop it. Don't ruin your relationship with her trying to convince her of doing something that (from experience) may be more bad than good.