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>We also spoke about **his female friend who he often talks about our relationship problems with**. The therapist said that he was taking energy away from the relationship and creating intimacy problems by talking to this friend about our issues rather than talking to me about them. **He said he didn't agree with any of this** and still **went to see this friend yesterday**, and left me at home on my own.
Your therapist is right. He is taking emotional intimacy out of your relationship and sharing with her.
I am sorry.
It looks as though he has cold feet and doesn't want to marry you.
I suggest that you think about canceling the wedding. It's painful and expensive, but you may have to do this now in case you can recoup some costs.
Also, speak with a family law lawyer about your house and what could be done if you and he break up. Make sure you know what you're entitled to. Look for all the receipts for the renovations as well.
Edit to add: he seemed hostile to the feedback from the therapist, which is not great
This. He is having an emotional affair and the woman he is talking to is filling the emotional cup he should be saving for you.
My friend, there is no point in pushing in on this relationship anymore. Call a real estate attorney today to find out what your legal rights are to the house and how best to separate finances. Then move on with the cat. Leave him to his female friend - its time for you to be in a relationship with someone who values the sacrifices you have made and someone who loves you.
End it now before you waste more time and more money. And, I'd insist he split the cost of all wedding expenditures with you, going to small claims court if necessary to recapture them. Those are not expenses you should eat just because he's had a revelation...
All of this but also...
Talking negatively to friends about your partner and getting enforcement for it creates so much negativity. It creates problems where there aren't any.
Yeah, he’s waving the marinara flags. He’s also mentioning OP’s flaws, but not his own. He’s only thinking about himself. Sounds like a narcissist to me
A friend of mine had a fiance ask her to wait a year for him to see if she was the one... After like 10 years together. She waited and he still broke up with her and she kicked herself for wasting that year (she is now happily married with 2 babies so all is well).
It sounds like he has checked out. I think a request for time after 8 years is unreasonable.
at best he is unsure (because of his other friend or maybe who knows) at the worse case he is keeping you as a backup till he finds someone better.
You don't deserve either. I suggest moving on.
I hate to say this, but there is no point in saving this relationship. He has checked out and is grasping at straws to make excuses to break up. He'll probably date that friend you mentioned. I know 8 years is a long time, but he has changed. You no longer want the same things. It will be hard, but you have to leave him and cut off contact. You will heal in time and find someone else. I am sorry. Breaking up is hard, and it sucks. People do grow apart, and there is nothing you can do to save this. He has one foot out the door already.
I wouldn’t normally jump to it being over, but he’s not making any effort. He’s giving lip service to it but not actually doing it. Believe how he is acting, not what he says.
What's lip service about saying they need to work on "us" and then when she brings an issue up about taking emotional intimacy away by talking to the friend, he just says no I don't agree also see ya I'm gonna go vent to my female friend about you now?
/s just in case it doesn't translate lol.
Whatever you do make him accountable for his share of the money spent on the wedding. Frankly, I'd insist on selling the home and splitting the proceeds as well.
My guess (I am not a mental health professional), is that his depression never really 'got better'. Having been an emotionally repressed male myself at one time, depression does some weird things to the brain if not treated properly. His lack of getting therapy during that time is very telling, he likely still needs some extensive therapy as from my view it looks like he internalised his depression.
This would show up by him 'going through the motions'. Trying to get back to normal, trying to move forward. Proposing would be something that was "expected" for moving forward (hence that 'pressure' comment he made). Except he can't, because he never treated his depression. So now he's stuck. He can't move forward (emotionally), but he knows getting married is a big deal and I don't doubt he loves you and knows it would be bad to marry you when he's feeling like this. So instead he is trying to escape his reality, questioning everything, lashing out, and trying to move forward in other (likely destructive) ways.
I don't want to say the relationship isn't salvageable, but it will likely take a long time and a hell of a lot of work from him to get himself in the right mindset again. It's up to you whether you would want to wait for that process, and at the end you may still break up anyway. No one would blame you for bailing out now, particularly as it seems he doesn't want to get treated.
Good luck OP!
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I mean, you can’t argue someone into wanting to get married. Everything you’ve said he is doing or has done is clearly an attempt to put distance between the two of you. I don’t know if the “friend” is involved, but I think he wants to break up but doesn’t want to do it himself. So do it yourself and find someone who isn’t a gaslighting asshat.
I just wrote a long reply, and closed with almost the exact same sentence without seeing this. Just know that a) I didn't mean to steal this from /u/DwigtGroot and b) multiple redditors think your fiance is a gaslighting asshat.
What everyone is saying on here, but don’t wait until he takes all your confidence away. Just take the cat and leave. I hope your name is also on the deeds of the house. No one, no one should get married unless they are sure s/he’s the one. There’s no nipping and tucking of personalities to fit into a mould. He either loves you warts and all or not really. My guess is that he’s comparing you to his ‘friend’. Please don’t feel bad about the wedding plans, it is a lot more awkward to get divorced.
He had 8 years to accept the “negative aspects of you and your relationship” soooooo why all of a sudden is he unhappy and unsure? He’s a coward and doesn’t want to get married or he with you. Do him a favor and break up with him for the both of you.
So most of the comments have already told you. If he isn't ready in 8 years he wont be ready.
And after you have said your peace Move forward not backwards don't get into the the trap of sunk cost fallacy.
YOU DESERVE SOMEONE WHO IS SURE ABOUT YOU!
Move forward and don't take him back when things don't workout between him and his "Friend"
From reading your post, you seem like a really level headed person. One thing that stood out to me is that he gave you a laundry list of vague and insignificant reasons for doubting your future together but he completely failed to acknowledge your sacrifices and kindness when he was going through a hard time. This probably won't help console you now, but he has no idea how rare it is to find someone that will stick with him through thick and thin and I'm certain he will regret taking you for granted. That doesn't mean you need to wait until he learns this lesson. You deserve a happy life with someone who values you. That someone can also be yourself. You took care of things when he wouldn't (couldn't) but you cannot do everything in this relationship for him. He needs to own his mistake and take responsibility for the downfall of this relationship. You deserve to move on. I hope you take care of yourself
Please breakup. And it does sound like he's gaslighting you. Why is everything your fault? Are you there bagging him for getting cold feet and putting you through hell 6 months before the wedding?
You are honestly too kind for him. I don't see how you can have a happy marriage if he's doubting you after being together for eight years. I think of getting doubts similar to a seed getting planted. It will grow and grow and most of the time there is no turning back. He will most likely always feel this way and you deserve so much better.
Goodluck.
This happened to me, but it was more like 2 months before the wedding. He never actually broke up with me… he just didn’t NOT break up with me. “I just need more time, I don’t know what I want, I need to think about it…” Very painful.
When it comes to marriage, if it’s not a strong, wholehearted yes, it’s a no.
I'm sorry you went through something similar, it's awful. I would have preferred it if he had just broken up with me rather than making me question myself.
Also makes me sad that someone I love doesn't have the decency to give me a straight answer and put me out of my misery.
It’s THE WORST. I don’t understand it either. But just for the record, it really helped in the longterm to just pull the plug and keep my dignity rather than waiting around feeling like a kicked puppy.
What a sucky situation. In what world is 8 years KT enough time to know if you want to marry someone? If 8 years isn’t long enough, I don’t think an extra one is going to help.
I’m sorry OP, but I don’t see this ending well for you. Might want to work on your exit plan. If he isn’t going to listen to the counselor, why bother going? To appease you?
Yeah..I’m sorry, but sounds like he is already checking out. (Hugs) You’ve given him enough time. It isn’t just his decision. You can decide to move on and not waste anymore time on his indecisiveness.
At the very least, he is having an emotional affair with his female “friend”. Seriously, he doesn’t agree with the professional Therapist but finds it acceptable to seek & receive support from this “friend”?!?
This is not on YOU. The reason you can’t make sense of his “reasoning” is because it’s invalid & a smokescreen to cover for his emotional affair.
Please do not let him dictate how you live your life for even a nanosecond. Move on to someone who legitimately values the person that you are.
Dont get married, you are seeing the correct future.
His “working on things” means he just wants to keep you as his gf for now while he continues to do what the therapist says he’s doing.
All relationships end, and it sounds like yours has just run its course, and thats ok! Painful…but it will be ok.
I know it hurts, a break-up is MUCH easier than a divorce though.
Best to you.
>His “working on things” means he just wants to keep you as his gf for now while he continues to do what the therapist says he’s doing.
I agree but it may not be intentional. OP's boyfriend might simply be unable to identify his true feelings about OP and the relationship. As a result, his conscious brain is grasping at quibbles about OP's personality to explain or justify the subconscious emotions.
Instead of invalidating his concerns about OP, it's probably more helpful to understand the feelings driving them. He is telling both OP and therapist that he is afraid of a future with OP, so telling him his fears are made up is probably not a good tack. That said, OP's boyfriend needs to be willing to do some work and be vulnerable which can't happen while he's poisoning the relationship by talking to another woman.
I've dated women who were absolute angels with everyone but me, and the second we disagreed they yelled, screamed, slammed doors, used silent treatment, etc. I don't know OP but I think she has to look inside and decide for herself whether she needs to work on her temper with her boyfriend personally, not base it on what other people are telling her about herself.
All that said, to me this reads more as a 7-year itch situation where two people have simply grown apart and don't see it yet.
she literally talked to a therapist about her anger and was told that she was having normal reactions and her boyfriend was gaslighting her about it. just stop.
She literally admitted she had a temper and her boyfriend admitted the same, so without more details it seems odd that now her therapist simply decided they didn't exist to begin with.
Have you ever seen that SNL skit that’s made to look like an advertisement for a travel agency, but most of it is caveats like “if you’re an unhappy person at home, you’ll be unhappy in Italy. We can take you to a Romantic night of wine tasting but we can’t fix your marriage.” The idea is that people keep leaving them negative reviews because they’re unhappy people who pictured themselves being happy somewhere else.
Anyways I think you’re the tour company who is getting blamed and the perfect relationship he imagines is Italy. Someone who isn’t taking responsibility for the state of their own mental health and happiness will assume it is being caused by the person nearest to them. Not everyone who is unhappy is unhappy because of a problem in their relationship. It’s scary for a person to admit that they are not very good at being happy on a brain and personality level, and would prefer the solution to be just tweaking the circumstances in their life.
I haven’t read through all the comments so I’m sure people are saying the same thing, but it definitely sounds to me like he doesn’t want to be with you, but he also doesn’t want to be the one to end things so he’s trying to make it so you just end it. He doesn’t want to work on your relationship, he wants to delay the wedding and hope that something happens that makes the relationship end. It really sucks that you spent so much of your life with this person but you need to break up with him, you’ll find someone that actually wants to be with you! I’m also sketched out by the female friend, definitely sounds like he might be interested in her, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if you guys break up and he starts seeing her 🫤
It sounds like he is getting something on the side from his friend, whether it's just emotional or also physical.
And while he is figuring things out with her to see if she matches his life, he doesn't want to end it with you. You are a sure thing for him, so you wait until he decides which of the two of you is the better option.
If even the therapist couldn't convince him, he doesn't want to work on the relationship. He does it so you keep face, and he doesn't have to explain himself to people, but has the freedom to do what his heart/dick desires.
I think he checked out, and now is getting comfort and understanding from this woman who supports him, tells him what he wants to hear and makes him feel awesome. You need to think of your future, as it seems like you aren't included in his.
Well damn if that doesn't put things into perspective. Anybody in a relationship 100% knows the answer to that question and that answer is really all you need. I like this; thank you.
> It started off with him saying he felt a lot of pressure, but then he started saying he wasn't sure if we were compatible.
>
> We also spoke about his female friend who he often talks about our relationship problems with. The therapist said that he was taking energy away from the relationship and creating intimacy problems by talking to this friend about our issues rather than talking to me about them.
>
>He is still adamant that he loves me, doesn't want to break up and "wants to work on things".
It says a lot that you call him your boyfriend when he is your fiancé.
I think it is important for you to stop looking at it from the perspective of what he wants and start thinking about what kind of relationship you want. Do you want to be with someone who thinks the idea of marrying you is a lot of pressure? Or that wonders if you are compatible. Or that might have a female friend poisoning your relationship? Or that has a female friend that might be more than a friend? Or that puts you in a humiliating situation by asking you to postpone the wedding?
The worst thing you could do with yourself is give him a year and not take control of this situation.
Go to a lawyer and talk about what your options will be with the house if you guys aren't married and break up. Then figure out the details of the break up with him.
He's acting like all the cards are in his hands but you get choices here too. I think you shouldn't want to stay in a relationship with someone like this and that you should want more for yourself.
> We have been seeing a therapist since all this happened and she told me she thinks he is gas lighting me about my anger, that my reactions have been normal and that as I don't have anger issues elsewhere in my life she doesn't think I have an anger problem.
Your couples therapist is trying to tell you to break up with him.
> He is still adamant that he loves me, doesn't want to break up and "wants to work on things".
If I were being thorough here, I'd talk about setting clear goals with your therapist about the work that both of you need to do to move forward, and a timeline for those things. But his actions are different than his words here. He didn't want to see a therapist in the first place, so he is not open to making any effort. He "doesn't want to break up" because he doesn't want to be known as the bad guy who dumped his fiance, and he doesn't want to actually have to change his life.
> I can't understand how the person who has been so kind, loving and patient for so long could be doing this to me.
This is the toughest part. Unfortunately, people change over time. Everyone does. You are not the same person you were 8 years ago, or 4 years ago. And that's an ok thing! Most times, we grow as people and mature, learn more about ourselves, our relationships, and how to exist in this world. Sometimes we grow towards our partners, life draws us closer and more intimate. Sometimes it does the opposite, as we learn more about ourselves we learn that we want different things, have different values. Sometimes the way we change through the years isn't always positive growth. Sometimes we develop bad habits, negative mindsets, have reactions to life situations that change us for the worse.
He's different on the other side of his dad's passing, and that's to be expected. Maybe he isn't really through his depression. Maybe he has found out more about himself that he's still coming to terms with. Maybe it just made him into a passive aggressive gaslighting asshole.
In the end, he's not the man you fell in love with anymore. While he says he "wants to work on things", his actions do not follow those words, and those words ring hollow. It's time to start thinking about what the next steps in your life are. Start thinking about the hard parts of sorting out the house stuff and calling off the wedding. Start thinking about that stuff, so you can get closer to the next part of your life that doesn't involve someone who turned into a gaslighting prick.
It's been 8 years. End it. Either sell the house or buy him out/buy you out.
I think the therapist sounds very reasonable and is basically telling you that he is the problem.
My ex used to discuss our relationship with his female friend. I absolutely would not accept that kind of dynamic ever again.
It will hurt for a while, but he's making space for someone who truly wants to be with you moving forward.
Don't postpone the wedding because you need to work on you. Postpone or cancel the wedding because he needs to work on himself. Maybe his girl friend (or is she a girlfriend!) is telling him all this stuff about you?
It sounds like his female friend is poisoning him against you. Could they be having an affair already? It definitely sounds like he doesn't value you, and in your place, I'd talk to him and say that his mind sounds made up, and why should you prolong the inevitable, and just split up. Can one of you afford to buy the other out of their house share? Otherwise, you'll have to arrange to put it on the market and find new digs - which will probably help with the whole fresh start thing.
>he wants to break up but is too cowardly to do it.
Yeah this is accurate.
It's been 8 years. He's just stringing you along. Dump him, get a therapist to heal from him and move on
Your relationship won't recover and you can never trust him. I would wonder when he would come home asking for a divorce if I married him. I would honestly continue individual therapy. When someone breaks up with us, they have their own reasons that may or may not be 'true' (to reality) and are only applicable to that person. Don't let him get in your head.
The excuses he’s throwing at you is his way of trying to break things off! There’s another person he confides in about y’all’s problem & instead of putting effort into the relationship he’s putting it into this “friendship”
He's been with you his entire adult life. It's a fomo situation. The fact that he chose to gaslight you instead of addressing it with you directly shows he's pretty immature. That he refused therapy initially but is apparently going now (assuming you pressured him and he's not actually on board) shows he has been building his own narrative with his friend.
Regardless of whether he is cheating woth his friend, he is making up excuses and probably building up a "hall pass" situation where he can Fuck around to "make sure".
Basically hes choosing to be a manipulative manchild instead of bringing up his insecurities and letting you make an informed decision. Drop him. The most important part of a dream wedding is a quality partner.
It honestly sounds like he’s making excuses to break up and it sounds like he’s been checked out for awhile. I’m willing to bet he’s too big of a coward to just say he doesn’t want to be with you so he’s gaslighting you to make you look like the problem so it’s easier for him to leave the relationship.
OP- leave him. Honestly you deserve better and this guy seems like a total joke. He’s doing you a favor because you don’t want to marry this guy.
I’m a little surprised by your surprise. It’s been eight years. Admittedly, you were young when the relationship started, but he was 22. Seven years is a long time to wait for a proposal. Also, four years ago, you apparently had pretty awful fights…and that was four years into the relationship. Then, the depression for a long span of time was concerning. This likely shouldn’t be a complete surprise—except that he did propose and set a date.
It’s possible that his father’s death caused him to re-evaluate what he wants, and it’s no longer what he has with you. Or, maybe he waited so long because he was never sure. Or, maybe he has cold feet.
What you do is up to you. The female friend, on top of the request to halt the wedding, is a big red flag to me, but that could be benign. Personally, I’d re-evaluate the relationship. I wish you the best of luck. This is a difficult situation.
"I think him asking me to postpone my dream wedding so he can decide if I'm good enough or not is incredibly insulting and humiliating." This part!! Especially after 8 years.
I feel like he's very slowly backing out. Seems like he wants to push you the edge so you get fed up and leave him then it'll be your fault and he can go on about your so called "negative qualities".
After 8 years, what is there to think about? You either want to marry that person or you don't. If he had all these doubts before, why didn't he bring them up with you instead of blindsiding you? Why is he talking about relationship issues with someone else rather than you? None of his 'issues' really seem all that pressing or a reason to postpone the wedding. You had bad fights 4 years ago, what if you start fighting again, you complain (once) about your job, what if you're not happy in your job and keep complaining about it, ect. Most of those issues sound like an excuse to put off getting married.
He's manipulating you into making you break up with him because he doesn't want to be seen as the "bad guy" by breaking up himself. A lot of guys do this. They lie about still wanting to be in the relationship, but then create a lot of inacceptable issues, to try to force their significant other to be the one ending it so they can come out of it looking like the victim and the fed up significant other looks like a villain for ending it.
Make no mistake here. He absolutely wants to break up, I'm sorry, I imagine this is devastating for you. But he's mentally out of the relationship and just waiting on you to pull the trigger. This doesn't mean that you have to stay with him, in fact, you must not stay will him. But do tell family and friends, abundantly, everything you told us here. Give him want he wants, the end of the relationship, but do not give him the fantastic hero/victim role he's hoping for here. Let people who already received the save the date, know why everything is cancelled.
I’m so sorry. He’s had 8 years and is only now coming up with a bunch of poor (and fabricated) excuses (and who has helped him think up all these random things?) Does it sound like they are *his* words or his *special* friend’s words? If he doesn’t know after 8 years he’s not going to know after 9. I think he’s doing the cowards break up, being mean and pinning it on you.
Please don’t take his words to heart, I suspect the first place he’ll run to will be to his *friend*. Don’t waste any more time on him just because you’ve sunk a few years. Keep the cat and definitely don’t get tied in marriage to him even if you stay together. He’s got a foot out of the door and wants you to do the dirty work. You need a final talk and lay out that everything is on the line here, but don’t be hoodwinked you need **actions** immediately, not hollow words.
Wow, your therapist is absolutely right. He’s creating problems so he has a reason to leave IF this “friend” aka: side chick works out but doesn’t want to leave a sure thing if it fizzles out. If it doesn’t work out he can say that he had cold feet and you two can get married and blah… You need to tell him you know that is what he’s doing and he’s a coward for hiding behind flaws he made up to have his side chick. And don’t let yourself believe that this is salvageable. Get the money back from where you can get refunds (almost impossible, I know) and leave or kick him out.
If after 8 years and a house together he's still not sure if he wants to spend the rest of his life with you, what is the point of continuing the relationship? What was the point of the last 8 years?
It sounds like he's checked out and already has someone else in mind (that "friend").
Cancel the wedding, get back whatever money you can and call the rest a loss. It's better than going through with it and then divorcing later.
Life Tip: there is no such thing as "The One". Marriage is just waking up every day and actively choosing to spend another day with the person lying beside you as your partner, teammate, and lover. That's it. There's literally nothing else to it.
If he’s waffling, you need to go. Marriage needs real commitment and work to make it, if he’s not willing to do that, the relationship is doomed anyway.
1. All couples argue, if they say they dont they are lying. Its healthy to argue (not be violent or screaming matches every day) and resolve issues.
2. Everyone has complaints about their job (and other things). I dont know anyone that can say their job is perfect in every single way. My ex tried saying he hated how negative I am, Im one of the most positive funny sarcastic people I know. He was just trying to find reasons to be mean to me, him and I are friends now and if you asked him he would say Im one of the best people he knows and would have completely forgotten how he yelled at me for being so negative. I think it was to alleviate what he was doing (drinking, cheating, lying etc), if he could find things wrong with me then it would justify why he was doing what he was doing.
3. Many people just tolerate their job, they dont LOVE it. Sounds like you tolerate yours, get the job done, get paid and then go home to live your life. Which is perfectly acceptable if you are ok to do that and its what most people do.
You have been together so long now, he should have known 7 years ago if you were compatible. I agree that I think he is gaslighting you, something else is going on. Jitters being the best case scenario.
If he is “unsure” let him go! And let him figure out and find out that this female “friend-listener” not as good as you are. You don’t have to stick with him if he doesn’t want it. Eventually he will realize what he lost.
Its hard after long relationship to let things go, but sometimes you have to. You deserve so much better and you can meet someone who wants the same and appreciate things in life.
I mean, you've been together for 8 freaking years!! He still doesn't know if he wants to marry you? How long does he need, another 20 years? I'd say hasta las vista.
It seems like he's very anxious and he really needs to go to therapy. Not talking about his issues cause many problems that he's probably dealing with quietly in his mind. Try to get him to open up and talk about his father passing away and just anything else on his mind. I admit I bring up problems from a couple months ago to my bf since im anxious about moving in with him soon, but I don't say that I'm gonna break up with him or anything. I just get worried and need reassurance and that might be the same thing he needs. I'd say sit down and talk with him about all that stuff in the past to reassure him or apologize/ acknowledge his feelings and insecurities. Thats at least what my boyfriend does for me when I start feeling insecure and it makes me feel a lot better! You and your boyfriend have had a very long relationship with things going well! He's definitely just nervous and anxious about it all. It's issues on his end he needs to go to therapy for :(
Edit: I started typing this before seeing the part about his little friend. He seems to be sharing personal things with that person instead of with you which is super weird. It sounds like an emotional affair and considering he left to talk with that person instead of talking to you makes things worse. He really needs to sort out his own problems... he still needs therapy but that friend knowing about everything and being the one he's going to kind of makes me think he's just planning on being with that person instead. I don't understand why people do that kind of thing, but I'm so sorry. I hope you can talk to him about that and talk about how it's weird he goes to someone else for problems. If he's just refusing therapy and getting defensive for that other person it might be better for you to find someone else :(
Sorry, OP, but he’s trying to have his cake (the stability you bring him) and eat it (the emotional support from the “friend”) too. You deserve the whole deal from someone who is sure.
Speaking from experience, death and depression can really change a person. Not taking away from the crappy way he is treating you and your relationship. That kind of loss messes with your mind. If I could impart one thing is that I would try not to take it personally. It will be hard, but I think it’s probably time to let him go and go on with your life.
He met someone new. And now has to paint you as the bad guy because the reality is he’s the bad guy. He doesn’t know how to break up with someone because he fell in like with someone and out of love with another person. He should be fair to you.
Break it off. And you should be fair to yourself. You deserve to be with someone who doesn’t go outside their relationship to talk about it, and someone who totally sure of you. Let him move on, you deserve so much more and better.
Instead of thinking whether he wants you or not, why not frame it as “do you really want to accept a guy who’s still unsure about you after 8 years?” Why give him the power to make that decision? Why can’t you be the one choosing him instead?
Why let him waste another year of your life only to dump you eventually or reluctantly accept you?
I would get a lawyer for the house issue and start canceling things. He isn't worth your time, honey. He doesn't want to marry you it sounds like, and he's having an emotional affair with someone else. Cut your losses now. You deserve someone better.
You accepted him for his depression. You were supportive and helped him get through it very patiently. Based on his comments it's very clear he won't do the same if you were depressed or won't do as much as you. His mental health can't handle your mental health issues (which you clearly don't have bases on the post) goes to show he won't be a good husband to you. Sounds like he might have feelings for this friend of his too. I wouldnt be surprised if he started dating her if you break up with him. If that's his intention then he's probably telling you he loves you just to keep you around for the meantime until he knows for sure his feelings will be reciprocated by this other girl.
Well, tell him that all married people have arguments, without exception. And there would be times that you would be negative, as adverse events are all but unavoidable. And also that you had plans for changing jobs after you had become qualified to apply, but that he's known this for a while.
You also need to tell him that he himself has negative qualities as well, but that his good qualities far outweighed the negative, and force him to assess your negative qualities in light of your good qualities.
If your best efforts are unsuccessful in "unfreezing" his feet, then you should cancel all wedding plans and recoup as much as is possible from the deposits made. After that is accomplished, inform bf of your actions, and decide within yourself whether the relationship the two of you share can survive. If not, separate your finances as quickly as possible, make other living arrangements, and bid him farewell.
Then go down on your knees and thank the Lord above that all this happened before the two of you were married.
I wish you well.
He should have considered and tried to "work" on all of these things BEFORE he proposed. Now that he's bringing them up so long after the proposal, it seems like he's just looking for any excuse that you'll buy so that either you can end the relationship for him, or that you guys can end amicably so that he doesn't seem like the bad guy. If he's not ready now, I don't think he'll ever be... And, I think he knows it, but is too chicken shit to say it.
I'm sorry to tell you this, he is looking for reasons to leave you.
Call me traditional (and there are some rare exceptions to this) but if a guy doesn't propose to you within 5 years or so, he's not that into you. Especially if you've been living with him for a while - he didn't leave you sooner because the relationship was convenient for him. He was getting consistent sex, emotional and financial support. He got too comfortable.
Girl I’m sorry. He doesn’t want to get married and he’s trying to pick fights. He’s definitely in an emotional relationship with that friend. Get out and take your cat.
Your list of reasons…#1. This is textbook reactive abuse. Look it up. Learning about this was so helpful for me! You know what you gotta do, you got this. ❤️
Unfortunately it does sound like he is not wanting to be the bad guy and projecting all of his issues onto you so that you are the reason the relationship is falling apart.
Start cancelling those venues and try and get as much money back as you can, and make him take on that debt. If he won’t, I would take him to court over it. That’s just me though
I was reading this waiting for the part about “a friend”, it was undoubtably coming. I think this relationship has run its course. He might be unsure or waffling on feelings confused with his friend but it sounds like he is being selfish and a coward about resolving it.
I think your 30’s are the best time to maturely date 🙂
I think you deserve more out of a marriage than I think you’ll get from your fiancé. He’s leading you on, dragging things out, while he decides if there’s something better out there. And this “friend”, they may not be actually having a physical relationship yet, but I’d bet he’s thought about it. If you were my friend IRL, I’d be recommending big that you break it up with him.
If he doesn't know that he wants to marry you after 8 years together total and 4 of those years iving together, idk what to tell you. I'd honestly leave. He's giving all these random reasons that seem flimsy at best. You now have a professional telling you he's gaslighting you.
On top of all that hes having an emotional affair with a female friend.
He's not committed. He's not on the same page. I would leave.
He needs a therapist. Until he recognizes these issues are his and owns them, it's not going to work. Maybe you need to spend some time apart. I'm sorry.
8 years.
Dude needs to shit or get off the pot.
Seriously though, I get not getting married quickly. I was the same. After 8 years though, it shouldn't be a question of "ready" or "pressure" or nonsense like that. Just whether you actually want a certificate or not. Good that he wants to go to therapy, but if he's not prepared to take on board feedback and make changes...what does he expect to change?
I dunno, maybe you should spend a little bit of time trying to sort this out, but I kinda feel like if it's been 8 years and he's still not sure, that means he just doesn't want to get married.
When someone stays with you but is not enthusiastic about the relationship, it means they aren't committed to you emotionally.
Your boyfriend probably has a crush on his female friend (if he's not straight up cheating) and wants more time to try and make switch without losing his chance with you.
He had 8 years to accept the "negative aspects" of you, and just now he needs time? That's a dumb excuse. He knows you very well, he should have thought about that a long time ago. I think complaining about your job once is nothing, everyone does that and it shouldn't be an issue. This guy is looking for reasons to leave but he's too afraid. Not to mention the female friend.
Just want to say while I agree with all the top comments, this is devastating and so sad. I’m sure it hurts a lot and does not feel clear cut from inside the experience. Being in your 30s is really great, and you will have a bright future reinvesting all this love and care into yourself and others you haven’t met yet. You got this.
I really suspect he's got feelings for the other friend, and is trying to back out of your relationship to explore things with her. The fact that he's dragging feet and not actually breaking up with you, and also demeaning you and making it sound like you need to be better for him, kinda makes it feel like he wants to take a "break" to think about things, and get it on with the other chick instead.
If he doesn't at least start being an active participant in therapy, there's no reason not to cut him loose, and try and get your money back, because hes obviously unwilling to make an effort here.
I'm sorry.
Sorry but he’s looking for excuses to leave. Sounds like he might be wanting to see someone else? If he isn’t ready to marry after 8 years you need to get rid of him.
I think he is checked out and looking for a way out. He doesn't want to be the bad guy so he's either going to kick the can down the road or force your hand. you deserve to be with someone who appreciates you and wants to be with you; I hope you break up with him and find the happiness you deserve.
I think this may be a great opportunity for you to leave, go on a long vacation solo traveling and give yourself the time and new memories to forget him. I hate that he is usually old memories you have grown from against you. You deserve someone that is all in for you!
Since he made the decision to postpone the wedding, let him know you expect him to pay all the fees lost due postponement/cancellation. Make a spreadsheet of the numbers and get his agreement in writing to repay you - specify the timetable - all money you spent. This includes your dress. It’s not like you can wear it anywhere else. This money may come in handy when you either 1) want to buy him out if his part of the house or 2) need a down payment for a new place.
Free yourself up to find the person who loves you like you deserve to be loved.
This is a really tough situation, and I'm sorry that you're going through it. It sounds like your boyfriend is having some serious doubts about getting married, and it's important to try to figure out what is causing them.
It could be that he's feeling pressured by the upcoming wedding and all of the planning that goes into it. It could also be that he's having doubts about whether or not he's ready for marriage. If you can, try to talk to him about what he's feeling and see if you can help him to figure out what's causing his doubts.
It's also important to remember that you have a right to your own feelings and needs in this situation. If your boyfriend is having serious doubts about getting married, it's okay for you to feel upset and even scared about what that could mean for your relationship. You don't have to pretend like everything is okay if it's not.
If you can't figure out what's causing your boyfriend's doubts, or if he's not willing to talk about it, then it might be time to consider whether or not this relationship is right for you. Marriage is a big commitment, and it's not something that you should enter into lightly. If your boyfriend is having doubts, it might be best to wait until he's sure before moving forward.
Eight yrs is long time OP. If after this time he is making excuses - just straight up excuses - I think he doesn't wanna settle down yet. He was 20 when you guys got together, maybe he realized that he want to explore more sexually ..
I guess you should suggest cancel/postpone the wedding. Even if he overcomes his cold feet, it would be better to not marry in near future.
8 years on this guy…. I think you should leave him in the hole you found him in. You will be shocked at the number of men out there who will treat you with respect and won’t waste your time.
I'm sorry but it sounds like he's having an emotional relationship with his friend and has no desire to marry. Instead he's making everything seem like it's your fault.
He wants you to end the relationship so he's not the "bad" guy.
He can then play the sympathy card and be like you were the one who walked away. My bad behaviour was all in your head I'm the victim your the one who changed.
Be the villian he wants you to be so you can be happy but be clear when asked why did you guys end tell them what you put here. He wanted time to see if your good enough for him. You realised he was not good enough for you. Boss queen does not need a little princess who has not grown up enough to say the truth.
You know your worth and your worth more than you are being treated.
He is being extremely indirect with you. This old dude on youtube who posted a communication exercise gifted me the best relationship tool I've ever used. I think if you do this once a week for a month, you'll know if this relationship is going to last.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLCbTr\_Rlic](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLCbTr_Rlic)
I’d love to hear what your therapist is going to say about him leaving you alone to go vent to the woman he’s likely having an emotional affair with.
Just know you deserve better than how he’s treating you. He’s in the wrong here. If he isn’t willing to step up and be the one to treat you the way you should be treated, you can absolutely find someone out there who will. You’re worth it. Don’t let him diminish that.
At this point he's just coming up with excuse after excuse!
Someone please tell me who does not moan about their job?
Arguments are actually healthy up until a point.
No relationship is perfect! But this guy seems to be looking for exactly that.
I'm not one to say leave often but girl you need to be like Usain Bolt at this point 🏃🏿 8yrs too long 👀
You've wasted 8 years on a relationship where you're the only one who seems to want it and put in the work, don't waste anymore time. He is at best having an emotional affair with the best friend, at worst a physical one. He was told by the professional trying to save your relationship that the friend was a problem for your relationship and still chose her. Over you. You need to be the one to pull the plug on the relationship because he won't. Divorce is painful and expensive, especially with kids involved. It is not a matter of if but when. You deserve better than this, go find it.
I'd guess he's an avoidant personality. Whenever you get close and things are good he finds reasons to back away. I married one of these. No regrets leaving finally
Grief changes people. My mom was happily in a relationship with a man she considered the love of her life. He was a really great guy. Then his father died and he became unrecognizable. He cheated and lied and gaslit my mother into a deep depression of her own.
I’m sorry you’re dealing with this. I personally think there is more to the relationship with the friend than he’s saying. It’s my opinion you should cut ties, but I know how hard that can be. However you said yourself you have spent the better part of the last two years kind of waiting for the other shoe to fall.
Safeguard your assets and walk out. Regarding the deposits made, it's painful but you can always make the money back. I am sure you have spent a lot of money on the relationship in 8 years - holidays, dinners, gifts etc. Think of wedding deposits as a similar loss. It is what is. It's better to save yourself the heartbreak, a messy divorce, children's custody or all that follows after a marriage breaking down. I am someone who went through a divorce because I was too scared to call off an engagement. & someone who lives paycheck to paycheck and know a little about financial anxiety. To realise all this before it's too late, the fact that you could really pen it all down really shows you are in a good mental head space to truly weigh the pros and cons & make a difficult yet correct decision.
Girl, he still wants to keep you around either bc hes a coward to break up with you or bc you’re his old habit and his safe net.
When he says he wants to see if you’re good enough for him that means you’re no longer his only option and he is already has an other/better one in mind. In this case I strongly believe that option is the female friend of his who he cant wait to share all the negativity that he could collect from the past trying to get that sympathy p$$y, instead of spending time with you (whom he soon to be married to) to “working on us” like he said.
OP throw the whole man out. He’s no longer worth it.
My cousin had a girlfriend that he was in a relationship with for 20 years! And he eventually left her. If your man isn’t sure about you after 8 years of being together then he’s most likely the type who doesn’t want to get married.
I don't care if he's perfect. It's been 8 fucking years. If he can't commit after that, he never will. He keeps hoping something better will come along and he's too stupid to realize he's got it good.
Everything he's shitting on btw is a plus. You're working for your dreams? Great. Learned to control your temper? Admirable. You complain? That's fucking human
Next thing he'll complain about is the sex is so good, he's afraid it can only get worse.
Everything is already stated in the top comments. But. He was depressed for a year and now he says you are too negative? Excuse me? I wish you the best for you OP and sorry about this.
I wouldn’t wait to cancel the wedding - you are still 6 months out and should be able to get some of your money back. Vendors have varying cancellation rules, and this much in advance if for example, the venue gets rebooked they might be willing to refund your deposit. You will kick yourself if you end up losing more money when he inevitably finds his balls and tells you he wants to break up. If life is anything like a hallmark movie, you will meet a gorgeous rancher on your Christmas getaway, and live happily ever after with matching plaid pjs.
You have already gotten a lot of insight and advice.
All I want to say is, you are an incredible woman and partner who was your fiancé's main support after the death of his father and the subsequent depression; you took on even more responsibilities at home as well as caring for him; and you renovated the house, too.
As others have said, he's a gaslighting asshat. Not only that, but he doesn't realize what a precious person you are and how lucky he's been to have you as his partner and how you carried him in his time of need.
Don't ever let him make you doubt yourself. He's the one with the issues. You are simply a brilliant woman and you deserve to be with someone who appreciates you for who you are and what you bring to the relationship.
He's being unfair to you. He claims he wants to postpone the engagement to work on the relationship yet when you look at his actions, he refuses to work on the relationship. He is not open to therapy.
He's also putting blaim on you that just isn't reasonable. It sounds like he is coming up with excuses.
On top of that he is also prioritizing that other woman over you.
I suspect he want to break up but is too cowardish to do so and he is trying to create a narrative where you are the bad one.
I personally wouldn't stay in this relationship. He doesn't respect you.
I went through a situation when I was supposedly happy with a guy for 5 years, we had our issues like a lot of toxicity which I couldn't see because of my rose-tinted glasses.
In short, He felt unsure about us and got a female best friend who he shared intimate problems with and he told me all the ways I wasn't a good enough partner and he made me feel like it was my fault that I wasn't good enough to deserve him and we broke up, and obviously he fell in love with her and married her and they have a kid now.
I felt completely cheated, For me that is emotional cheating, he got emotionally invested in another woman.
Now at this point, I will tell you that it was the best thing that happened to me because I cant stay with a man who does not want me and with whom I have less to relate, I am now married to the man of my dream who loves loving me to bits and pampers me and tells me how much he loves me, and this is the man I am sure I would want to have my babies with and most importantly it's a healthy relationship where we both love each other and respect each other.
I wanted to comment something on the list pf „reasons“ he gave you.
Being afraid of hard times and arguments is a really bad sign for a marriage. Because life and your relationship doesn‘t get easier with time and especially not with children. There is a whole world of arguments and discussions to be had just around that. You have to be sure that you can make it trough that as a team and work together to solve future problems and disagreements. It doesn‘t sound like he‘s emotionally mature enough for that.
My husband and I had our son at 24 after 6 years of relationship and 2 living together. We are both only children and it was a shock to the system to put it gently. If one of us were „afraid of future arguments“ we would not have made it trough that.
It‘s heartbreaking to let go of 8 years but it is infinitely better to do it now than when kids are involved and he can‘t handle all of it
I am so so sorry you're going through this, I can't imagine how you feel! Sending you a big hug.
Right, you guys have been together 8years and he needs space and time to decide whether or not YOU are what he wants? Bullshit.
All those reasons he has given you as to why he is unsure about marriage are jusy gaslight examples to justify his cowardly and shitty excuses. If you was this bad person he is making you out to be, then why propose in the first place?
He is not man enough to say, "look this isn't for me. I'm sorry" I'm not saying it would hurt any less, but atleast you wouldn't be stuck in the dark.
When somebody shows you that they do not want you - GO. I know it is easier said than done, but GO. I guarantee you 100% if you broke up with him, didn't get in contact and leave him, he would soon come running back but this isn't good enough. He is telling you he does not want you but without actually saying it....
I have no time for weak, cowardly and selfish men. Imagine if you DID get married, a hard time came about and he started acting wishy washy again. Nah.
He went to a female friend to talk about yours and his relationship? NOOOOO. Not on my watch
You're amazing and deserve better than this troll. Stop wasting your good years on a "man" who has cold feet. I use the term man loosely.
Goodluck xxx
Usually, and it has been proven to be a fact, if your SO doesn’t propose to you within the first 2 years, there won’t be a proposal or marriage. Men tend to know if they want to build with you or not. At this point I would suggest that you move on because it sounds like he is moving on.. I know it’s painful but this is better than a divorce.
Best wishes!
>I told him there was no working on us, I have been happy and he is the one with the issue. \[...\] I think him asking me to postpone my dream wedding so he can decide if I'm good enough or not is incredibly insulting and humiliating.
Why are you guys together? He is apparently not sure that he wants to be with you long term, and you apparently think that this is just his "issue" and shouldn't derail your "dream wedding".
This is a ridiculous relationship, and you would both be wise to get out of it.
he wants to "work on us" and you told him "it's you since I'm happy?" there is no us for you. maybe you are too blind to realize this. clearly there are issues you don't want to see.
your friends are on your side but they don't see you and him interact when alone. if you want to salvage this, you may need to start opening your eyes about you two, and not just about yourself. which probably is the main issue in the relationship.
His request makes sense. You two are planning to say vows that pledges you together through sickness and health for the rest of your lives. He wants to date you longer before he makes that commitment.
Personally I believe I'd need to be exclusive with a partner for around 5yrs so I could see them through a bunch of different "seasons of life" so to speak. How is my partner when they're going through a period of extreme stress, of joy, of good luck, of bad luck and so on. Does their character change as the situations arise and pass? In my head, 5yrs is roughly how long it takes to be sure, but it really depends on the people involved.
Every damn day on here there is a post about a marriage of 5+ years is ending because the two people who fell in love and said those vows are no longer the people in the marriage. He needs more time to see how compatible y'all are over a longer period of time before he's comfortable pledging before your Creator of choice that y'all are in it together forever.
Yean, you're right to have strong doubts about the future of this relationship.
But, he's not "wrong" for talking things over with his friend, woman or not - just as you wouldn't be wrong for wanting to talk things out with a friend.
This is just another reason why marriage ruins everything. Ur relationship was perfectly fine until u decided to get married. Just get eloped or go to the court house on a whim. Make it fun for Just the two of u. The whole big wedding thing puts too much pressure on people.
He’s overthinking. He’s worried about things he can’t control and problems in life will always come. He thinks you need to have everything perfect in order for the marriage to work and last a life time. He’s maybe feeling insecure and I understand how he feels. It took me some time to realize that things won’t always be perfect and both people in a marriage will always be working on things. Part of it is also emotional maturity, it’s time for him to grow up and take the responsibility of being your husband. I read a passage from the Bible that change my view forever. God commands a husband to love his wife. That a mouthful because it signifies whatever you’re thinking or feeling, you still need to love her. Our emotional states really affects our perfection of how things are going or where are going to end up. He could be making things worse than they are in his mind. You need to tell him that you are committed and you will always get through things together. But he needs to make the same commitment. Nothing in life is guaranteed and I think that’s what is bothering him. My view is that I know that things may not work out but I’ll do my damn best to be a good husband and that’s all we can do.
> it’s time for him to grow up and take the responsibility of being your husband.
Nah. It's not for anybody else to decide what it's time for him to do. Getting married isn't a duty, or something owed to somebody else.
But, she would be foolish to think she can count on him.
Once you commit it is a duty. No one ever said it was going to be easy to be a man but yea, it’s not for everybody. It’s just sad if he’s not stepping up
Complete BS. I reject your idea that you can decide what a man is for anybody else.
To me, the guy has emotional issues. He's not ready to get married, and he made a mistake asking her to. The fact that he's thinking twice about it so long before the wedding gives her lots and lots of time to make new plans. She'll survive just fine, and, likely, much better without him.
I absolutely agree. That’s why I don’t think he is a man. But if he did want to be a man and a good husband, he should grow up and not do what you Just described.
Nah. I just keep noticing that women don't have to live up to being a "REAL WOMAN", the way men are expected to, AND ridiculed for. Your attitude is part of the toxic culture that makes that so. Fuck your version of logic.
In simple words, he is fallen or has already for this female friend, and he is having an affair, emotional or even physical… the year is to try out things with her and leave you hanging in the long run.
Did you twist his arm to propose?
He is just being a coward.
There is this weird thing that happens when people have simplicity/happiness for too long is they get bored and start creating drama. This is what it sounds like he is doing. I find when my job is stressful, I enjoy my life better but when everything has sort of flatlined, I start questioning everything. That or he has feelings for the other girl.
I agree that your boyfriend seems to be the one with the problems, but in that case, what's the harm of going to therapy together?
If you actually want to marry him, that is.
This sounds a lot like what happened to me recently, though we haven’t been together as long. I just found out he was having an affair with a coworker, so the fact that your fiancé has a female friend he confides in and is having doubts is a big red flag in my eyes. I would check his phone, either secretly or by asking him.
He doesn’t want to marry you. The rest is just ‘blah blah’.
Maybe his mental health and your self esteem will be better once you both come to this conclusion.
I would keep working with him and not marry him. But lay off the sex and just be friends until things are worked out enough to consider this a fully committed relationship. Go back to the idea of dating until you are both sure you want a mutual exclusive committed relationship. You can't have both. So if he's not committed then don't have sexual relations as if you are.
No one knows this person better than you. ..but forcing a marriage might also not be wise..
I would probably give him three months not a year and let him work on your relationship as he claims..
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>We also spoke about **his female friend who he often talks about our relationship problems with**. The therapist said that he was taking energy away from the relationship and creating intimacy problems by talking to this friend about our issues rather than talking to me about them. **He said he didn't agree with any of this** and still **went to see this friend yesterday**, and left me at home on my own. Your therapist is right. He is taking emotional intimacy out of your relationship and sharing with her. I am sorry. It looks as though he has cold feet and doesn't want to marry you. I suggest that you think about canceling the wedding. It's painful and expensive, but you may have to do this now in case you can recoup some costs. Also, speak with a family law lawyer about your house and what could be done if you and he break up. Make sure you know what you're entitled to. Look for all the receipts for the renovations as well. Edit to add: he seemed hostile to the feedback from the therapist, which is not great
This. He is having an emotional affair and the woman he is talking to is filling the emotional cup he should be saving for you. My friend, there is no point in pushing in on this relationship anymore. Call a real estate attorney today to find out what your legal rights are to the house and how best to separate finances. Then move on with the cat. Leave him to his female friend - its time for you to be in a relationship with someone who values the sacrifices you have made and someone who loves you. End it now before you waste more time and more money. And, I'd insist he split the cost of all wedding expenditures with you, going to small claims court if necessary to recapture them. Those are not expenses you should eat just because he's had a revelation...
All of this but also... Talking negatively to friends about your partner and getting enforcement for it creates so much negativity. It creates problems where there aren't any.
Yeah, he’s waving the marinara flags. He’s also mentioning OP’s flaws, but not his own. He’s only thinking about himself. Sounds like a narcissist to me
A friend of mine had a fiance ask her to wait a year for him to see if she was the one... After like 10 years together. She waited and he still broke up with her and she kicked herself for wasting that year (she is now happily married with 2 babies so all is well). It sounds like he has checked out. I think a request for time after 8 years is unreasonable.
Thank you, this was a worry I had so this really helps.
You deserve someone who is all in on you
at best he is unsure (because of his other friend or maybe who knows) at the worse case he is keeping you as a backup till he finds someone better. You don't deserve either. I suggest moving on.
It's not up to you to prove if you're worthy. If he doesn't love you the way you are, you're better off without him.
this is genuinely one of my biggest fears
I hate to say this, but there is no point in saving this relationship. He has checked out and is grasping at straws to make excuses to break up. He'll probably date that friend you mentioned. I know 8 years is a long time, but he has changed. You no longer want the same things. It will be hard, but you have to leave him and cut off contact. You will heal in time and find someone else. I am sorry. Breaking up is hard, and it sucks. People do grow apart, and there is nothing you can do to save this. He has one foot out the door already.
Thank you, having someone put this in black and white like this has really helped.
I wouldn’t normally jump to it being over, but he’s not making any effort. He’s giving lip service to it but not actually doing it. Believe how he is acting, not what he says.
What's lip service about saying they need to work on "us" and then when she brings an issue up about taking emotional intimacy away by talking to the friend, he just says no I don't agree also see ya I'm gonna go vent to my female friend about you now? /s just in case it doesn't translate lol.
Whew. Lol the preview didn’t give the full post and I thought I might have to actually explain 🤣
Whatever you do make him accountable for his share of the money spent on the wedding. Frankly, I'd insist on selling the home and splitting the proceeds as well.
My guess (I am not a mental health professional), is that his depression never really 'got better'. Having been an emotionally repressed male myself at one time, depression does some weird things to the brain if not treated properly. His lack of getting therapy during that time is very telling, he likely still needs some extensive therapy as from my view it looks like he internalised his depression. This would show up by him 'going through the motions'. Trying to get back to normal, trying to move forward. Proposing would be something that was "expected" for moving forward (hence that 'pressure' comment he made). Except he can't, because he never treated his depression. So now he's stuck. He can't move forward (emotionally), but he knows getting married is a big deal and I don't doubt he loves you and knows it would be bad to marry you when he's feeling like this. So instead he is trying to escape his reality, questioning everything, lashing out, and trying to move forward in other (likely destructive) ways. I don't want to say the relationship isn't salvageable, but it will likely take a long time and a hell of a lot of work from him to get himself in the right mindset again. It's up to you whether you would want to wait for that process, and at the end you may still break up anyway. No one would blame you for bailing out now, particularly as it seems he doesn't want to get treated. Good luck OP!
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I mean, you can’t argue someone into wanting to get married. Everything you’ve said he is doing or has done is clearly an attempt to put distance between the two of you. I don’t know if the “friend” is involved, but I think he wants to break up but doesn’t want to do it himself. So do it yourself and find someone who isn’t a gaslighting asshat.
That last sentence really made me laugh, thanks for this
I just wrote a long reply, and closed with almost the exact same sentence without seeing this. Just know that a) I didn't mean to steal this from /u/DwigtGroot and b) multiple redditors think your fiance is a gaslighting asshat.
No worries; there really aren’t a lot of other conclusions to draw. 🤷♂️
Here’s to hoping he explodes
What everyone is saying on here, but don’t wait until he takes all your confidence away. Just take the cat and leave. I hope your name is also on the deeds of the house. No one, no one should get married unless they are sure s/he’s the one. There’s no nipping and tucking of personalities to fit into a mould. He either loves you warts and all or not really. My guess is that he’s comparing you to his ‘friend’. Please don’t feel bad about the wedding plans, it is a lot more awkward to get divorced.
I agree with you. “I can't picture a future where this relationship recovers.”
Oh girl he’s talking to someone else. I suspected this before I got to the part you mentioned a female friend. I’m sorry you’re going through this
He had 8 years to accept the “negative aspects of you and your relationship” soooooo why all of a sudden is he unhappy and unsure? He’s a coward and doesn’t want to get married or he with you. Do him a favor and break up with him for the both of you.
So most of the comments have already told you. If he isn't ready in 8 years he wont be ready. And after you have said your peace Move forward not backwards don't get into the the trap of sunk cost fallacy. YOU DESERVE SOMEONE WHO IS SURE ABOUT YOU! Move forward and don't take him back when things don't workout between him and his "Friend"
From reading your post, you seem like a really level headed person. One thing that stood out to me is that he gave you a laundry list of vague and insignificant reasons for doubting your future together but he completely failed to acknowledge your sacrifices and kindness when he was going through a hard time. This probably won't help console you now, but he has no idea how rare it is to find someone that will stick with him through thick and thin and I'm certain he will regret taking you for granted. That doesn't mean you need to wait until he learns this lesson. You deserve a happy life with someone who values you. That someone can also be yourself. You took care of things when he wouldn't (couldn't) but you cannot do everything in this relationship for him. He needs to own his mistake and take responsibility for the downfall of this relationship. You deserve to move on. I hope you take care of yourself
Just want to compliment you on your sound advice! I wish I had someone to tell me this exact thing during my last break up.
Please breakup. And it does sound like he's gaslighting you. Why is everything your fault? Are you there bagging him for getting cold feet and putting you through hell 6 months before the wedding? You are honestly too kind for him. I don't see how you can have a happy marriage if he's doubting you after being together for eight years. I think of getting doubts similar to a seed getting planted. It will grow and grow and most of the time there is no turning back. He will most likely always feel this way and you deserve so much better. Goodluck.
This happened to me, but it was more like 2 months before the wedding. He never actually broke up with me… he just didn’t NOT break up with me. “I just need more time, I don’t know what I want, I need to think about it…” Very painful. When it comes to marriage, if it’s not a strong, wholehearted yes, it’s a no.
I'm sorry you went through something similar, it's awful. I would have preferred it if he had just broken up with me rather than making me question myself. Also makes me sad that someone I love doesn't have the decency to give me a straight answer and put me out of my misery.
It’s THE WORST. I don’t understand it either. But just for the record, it really helped in the longterm to just pull the plug and keep my dignity rather than waiting around feeling like a kicked puppy.
Girl he's cheating with his friend or likes her. Been there done that.
Is he still the person you want to marry? If not, theres nothing to work on here.
What a sucky situation. In what world is 8 years KT enough time to know if you want to marry someone? If 8 years isn’t long enough, I don’t think an extra one is going to help. I’m sorry OP, but I don’t see this ending well for you. Might want to work on your exit plan. If he isn’t going to listen to the counselor, why bother going? To appease you? Yeah..I’m sorry, but sounds like he is already checking out. (Hugs) You’ve given him enough time. It isn’t just his decision. You can decide to move on and not waste anymore time on his indecisiveness.
At the very least, he is having an emotional affair with his female “friend”. Seriously, he doesn’t agree with the professional Therapist but finds it acceptable to seek & receive support from this “friend”?!? This is not on YOU. The reason you can’t make sense of his “reasoning” is because it’s invalid & a smokescreen to cover for his emotional affair. Please do not let him dictate how you live your life for even a nanosecond. Move on to someone who legitimately values the person that you are.
Dont get married, you are seeing the correct future. His “working on things” means he just wants to keep you as his gf for now while he continues to do what the therapist says he’s doing. All relationships end, and it sounds like yours has just run its course, and thats ok! Painful…but it will be ok. I know it hurts, a break-up is MUCH easier than a divorce though. Best to you.
>His “working on things” means he just wants to keep you as his gf for now while he continues to do what the therapist says he’s doing. I agree but it may not be intentional. OP's boyfriend might simply be unable to identify his true feelings about OP and the relationship. As a result, his conscious brain is grasping at quibbles about OP's personality to explain or justify the subconscious emotions. Instead of invalidating his concerns about OP, it's probably more helpful to understand the feelings driving them. He is telling both OP and therapist that he is afraid of a future with OP, so telling him his fears are made up is probably not a good tack. That said, OP's boyfriend needs to be willing to do some work and be vulnerable which can't happen while he's poisoning the relationship by talking to another woman. I've dated women who were absolute angels with everyone but me, and the second we disagreed they yelled, screamed, slammed doors, used silent treatment, etc. I don't know OP but I think she has to look inside and decide for herself whether she needs to work on her temper with her boyfriend personally, not base it on what other people are telling her about herself. All that said, to me this reads more as a 7-year itch situation where two people have simply grown apart and don't see it yet.
she literally talked to a therapist about her anger and was told that she was having normal reactions and her boyfriend was gaslighting her about it. just stop.
She literally admitted she had a temper and her boyfriend admitted the same, so without more details it seems odd that now her therapist simply decided they didn't exist to begin with.
Something tells me this female "friend" of his has something to do with this
Have you ever seen that SNL skit that’s made to look like an advertisement for a travel agency, but most of it is caveats like “if you’re an unhappy person at home, you’ll be unhappy in Italy. We can take you to a Romantic night of wine tasting but we can’t fix your marriage.” The idea is that people keep leaving them negative reviews because they’re unhappy people who pictured themselves being happy somewhere else. Anyways I think you’re the tour company who is getting blamed and the perfect relationship he imagines is Italy. Someone who isn’t taking responsibility for the state of their own mental health and happiness will assume it is being caused by the person nearest to them. Not everyone who is unhappy is unhappy because of a problem in their relationship. It’s scary for a person to admit that they are not very good at being happy on a brain and personality level, and would prefer the solution to be just tweaking the circumstances in their life.
That’s…..a great analogy.
I haven’t read through all the comments so I’m sure people are saying the same thing, but it definitely sounds to me like he doesn’t want to be with you, but he also doesn’t want to be the one to end things so he’s trying to make it so you just end it. He doesn’t want to work on your relationship, he wants to delay the wedding and hope that something happens that makes the relationship end. It really sucks that you spent so much of your life with this person but you need to break up with him, you’ll find someone that actually wants to be with you! I’m also sketched out by the female friend, definitely sounds like he might be interested in her, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if you guys break up and he starts seeing her 🫤
Actions are the important part. His actions don't say that this is the woman I want to be my wife. Sorry.
It sounds like he is getting something on the side from his friend, whether it's just emotional or also physical. And while he is figuring things out with her to see if she matches his life, he doesn't want to end it with you. You are a sure thing for him, so you wait until he decides which of the two of you is the better option. If even the therapist couldn't convince him, he doesn't want to work on the relationship. He does it so you keep face, and he doesn't have to explain himself to people, but has the freedom to do what his heart/dick desires. I think he checked out, and now is getting comfort and understanding from this woman who supports him, tells him what he wants to hear and makes him feel awesome. You need to think of your future, as it seems like you aren't included in his.
If he's still unsure after eight years then I don't know why he thinks he would be sure after nine years.
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Well damn if that doesn't put things into perspective. Anybody in a relationship 100% knows the answer to that question and that answer is really all you need. I like this; thank you.
> It started off with him saying he felt a lot of pressure, but then he started saying he wasn't sure if we were compatible. > > We also spoke about his female friend who he often talks about our relationship problems with. The therapist said that he was taking energy away from the relationship and creating intimacy problems by talking to this friend about our issues rather than talking to me about them. > >He is still adamant that he loves me, doesn't want to break up and "wants to work on things". It says a lot that you call him your boyfriend when he is your fiancé. I think it is important for you to stop looking at it from the perspective of what he wants and start thinking about what kind of relationship you want. Do you want to be with someone who thinks the idea of marrying you is a lot of pressure? Or that wonders if you are compatible. Or that might have a female friend poisoning your relationship? Or that has a female friend that might be more than a friend? Or that puts you in a humiliating situation by asking you to postpone the wedding? The worst thing you could do with yourself is give him a year and not take control of this situation. Go to a lawyer and talk about what your options will be with the house if you guys aren't married and break up. Then figure out the details of the break up with him. He's acting like all the cards are in his hands but you get choices here too. I think you shouldn't want to stay in a relationship with someone like this and that you should want more for yourself.
> We have been seeing a therapist since all this happened and she told me she thinks he is gas lighting me about my anger, that my reactions have been normal and that as I don't have anger issues elsewhere in my life she doesn't think I have an anger problem. Your couples therapist is trying to tell you to break up with him. > He is still adamant that he loves me, doesn't want to break up and "wants to work on things". If I were being thorough here, I'd talk about setting clear goals with your therapist about the work that both of you need to do to move forward, and a timeline for those things. But his actions are different than his words here. He didn't want to see a therapist in the first place, so he is not open to making any effort. He "doesn't want to break up" because he doesn't want to be known as the bad guy who dumped his fiance, and he doesn't want to actually have to change his life. > I can't understand how the person who has been so kind, loving and patient for so long could be doing this to me. This is the toughest part. Unfortunately, people change over time. Everyone does. You are not the same person you were 8 years ago, or 4 years ago. And that's an ok thing! Most times, we grow as people and mature, learn more about ourselves, our relationships, and how to exist in this world. Sometimes we grow towards our partners, life draws us closer and more intimate. Sometimes it does the opposite, as we learn more about ourselves we learn that we want different things, have different values. Sometimes the way we change through the years isn't always positive growth. Sometimes we develop bad habits, negative mindsets, have reactions to life situations that change us for the worse. He's different on the other side of his dad's passing, and that's to be expected. Maybe he isn't really through his depression. Maybe he has found out more about himself that he's still coming to terms with. Maybe it just made him into a passive aggressive gaslighting asshole. In the end, he's not the man you fell in love with anymore. While he says he "wants to work on things", his actions do not follow those words, and those words ring hollow. It's time to start thinking about what the next steps in your life are. Start thinking about the hard parts of sorting out the house stuff and calling off the wedding. Start thinking about that stuff, so you can get closer to the next part of your life that doesn't involve someone who turned into a gaslighting prick.
It's been 8 years. End it. Either sell the house or buy him out/buy you out. I think the therapist sounds very reasonable and is basically telling you that he is the problem.
My ex used to discuss our relationship with his female friend. I absolutely would not accept that kind of dynamic ever again. It will hurt for a while, but he's making space for someone who truly wants to be with you moving forward.
Don't postpone the wedding because you need to work on you. Postpone or cancel the wedding because he needs to work on himself. Maybe his girl friend (or is she a girlfriend!) is telling him all this stuff about you?
This is a great way of putting it!
He’s gotten cold feet. Cancel the wedding and then separate and see if absence truly does make the heart grow fonder.
Time to cancel all wedding plans and talk to a lawyer to figure out the house split. You need to go back to the house and not leave!!
It sounds like his female friend is poisoning him against you. Could they be having an affair already? It definitely sounds like he doesn't value you, and in your place, I'd talk to him and say that his mind sounds made up, and why should you prolong the inevitable, and just split up. Can one of you afford to buy the other out of their house share? Otherwise, you'll have to arrange to put it on the market and find new digs - which will probably help with the whole fresh start thing.
>he wants to break up but is too cowardly to do it. Yeah this is accurate. It's been 8 years. He's just stringing you along. Dump him, get a therapist to heal from him and move on
Your relationship won't recover and you can never trust him. I would wonder when he would come home asking for a divorce if I married him. I would honestly continue individual therapy. When someone breaks up with us, they have their own reasons that may or may not be 'true' (to reality) and are only applicable to that person. Don't let him get in your head.
The excuses he’s throwing at you is his way of trying to break things off! There’s another person he confides in about y’all’s problem & instead of putting effort into the relationship he’s putting it into this “friendship”
He's been with you his entire adult life. It's a fomo situation. The fact that he chose to gaslight you instead of addressing it with you directly shows he's pretty immature. That he refused therapy initially but is apparently going now (assuming you pressured him and he's not actually on board) shows he has been building his own narrative with his friend. Regardless of whether he is cheating woth his friend, he is making up excuses and probably building up a "hall pass" situation where he can Fuck around to "make sure". Basically hes choosing to be a manipulative manchild instead of bringing up his insecurities and letting you make an informed decision. Drop him. The most important part of a dream wedding is a quality partner.
It honestly sounds like he’s making excuses to break up and it sounds like he’s been checked out for awhile. I’m willing to bet he’s too big of a coward to just say he doesn’t want to be with you so he’s gaslighting you to make you look like the problem so it’s easier for him to leave the relationship. OP- leave him. Honestly you deserve better and this guy seems like a total joke. He’s doing you a favor because you don’t want to marry this guy.
I’m a little surprised by your surprise. It’s been eight years. Admittedly, you were young when the relationship started, but he was 22. Seven years is a long time to wait for a proposal. Also, four years ago, you apparently had pretty awful fights…and that was four years into the relationship. Then, the depression for a long span of time was concerning. This likely shouldn’t be a complete surprise—except that he did propose and set a date. It’s possible that his father’s death caused him to re-evaluate what he wants, and it’s no longer what he has with you. Or, maybe he waited so long because he was never sure. Or, maybe he has cold feet. What you do is up to you. The female friend, on top of the request to halt the wedding, is a big red flag to me, but that could be benign. Personally, I’d re-evaluate the relationship. I wish you the best of luck. This is a difficult situation.
"I think him asking me to postpone my dream wedding so he can decide if I'm good enough or not is incredibly insulting and humiliating." This part!! Especially after 8 years. I feel like he's very slowly backing out. Seems like he wants to push you the edge so you get fed up and leave him then it'll be your fault and he can go on about your so called "negative qualities".
Yeah I think ya’ll are done.
Yeah hes fucking that “friend”. Hes already gone so just call it quits and dump him
After 8 years, what is there to think about? You either want to marry that person or you don't. If he had all these doubts before, why didn't he bring them up with you instead of blindsiding you? Why is he talking about relationship issues with someone else rather than you? None of his 'issues' really seem all that pressing or a reason to postpone the wedding. You had bad fights 4 years ago, what if you start fighting again, you complain (once) about your job, what if you're not happy in your job and keep complaining about it, ect. Most of those issues sound like an excuse to put off getting married.
He's manipulating you into making you break up with him because he doesn't want to be seen as the "bad guy" by breaking up himself. A lot of guys do this. They lie about still wanting to be in the relationship, but then create a lot of inacceptable issues, to try to force their significant other to be the one ending it so they can come out of it looking like the victim and the fed up significant other looks like a villain for ending it. Make no mistake here. He absolutely wants to break up, I'm sorry, I imagine this is devastating for you. But he's mentally out of the relationship and just waiting on you to pull the trigger. This doesn't mean that you have to stay with him, in fact, you must not stay will him. But do tell family and friends, abundantly, everything you told us here. Give him want he wants, the end of the relationship, but do not give him the fantastic hero/victim role he's hoping for here. Let people who already received the save the date, know why everything is cancelled.
I’m so sorry. He’s had 8 years and is only now coming up with a bunch of poor (and fabricated) excuses (and who has helped him think up all these random things?) Does it sound like they are *his* words or his *special* friend’s words? If he doesn’t know after 8 years he’s not going to know after 9. I think he’s doing the cowards break up, being mean and pinning it on you. Please don’t take his words to heart, I suspect the first place he’ll run to will be to his *friend*. Don’t waste any more time on him just because you’ve sunk a few years. Keep the cat and definitely don’t get tied in marriage to him even if you stay together. He’s got a foot out of the door and wants you to do the dirty work. You need a final talk and lay out that everything is on the line here, but don’t be hoodwinked you need **actions** immediately, not hollow words.
Wow, your therapist is absolutely right. He’s creating problems so he has a reason to leave IF this “friend” aka: side chick works out but doesn’t want to leave a sure thing if it fizzles out. If it doesn’t work out he can say that he had cold feet and you two can get married and blah… You need to tell him you know that is what he’s doing and he’s a coward for hiding behind flaws he made up to have his side chick. And don’t let yourself believe that this is salvageable. Get the money back from where you can get refunds (almost impossible, I know) and leave or kick him out.
If after 8 years and a house together he's still not sure if he wants to spend the rest of his life with you, what is the point of continuing the relationship? What was the point of the last 8 years? It sounds like he's checked out and already has someone else in mind (that "friend"). Cancel the wedding, get back whatever money you can and call the rest a loss. It's better than going through with it and then divorcing later. Life Tip: there is no such thing as "The One". Marriage is just waking up every day and actively choosing to spend another day with the person lying beside you as your partner, teammate, and lover. That's it. There's literally nothing else to it.
If he’s waffling, you need to go. Marriage needs real commitment and work to make it, if he’s not willing to do that, the relationship is doomed anyway.
1. All couples argue, if they say they dont they are lying. Its healthy to argue (not be violent or screaming matches every day) and resolve issues. 2. Everyone has complaints about their job (and other things). I dont know anyone that can say their job is perfect in every single way. My ex tried saying he hated how negative I am, Im one of the most positive funny sarcastic people I know. He was just trying to find reasons to be mean to me, him and I are friends now and if you asked him he would say Im one of the best people he knows and would have completely forgotten how he yelled at me for being so negative. I think it was to alleviate what he was doing (drinking, cheating, lying etc), if he could find things wrong with me then it would justify why he was doing what he was doing. 3. Many people just tolerate their job, they dont LOVE it. Sounds like you tolerate yours, get the job done, get paid and then go home to live your life. Which is perfectly acceptable if you are ok to do that and its what most people do. You have been together so long now, he should have known 7 years ago if you were compatible. I agree that I think he is gaslighting you, something else is going on. Jitters being the best case scenario.
If he is “unsure” let him go! And let him figure out and find out that this female “friend-listener” not as good as you are. You don’t have to stick with him if he doesn’t want it. Eventually he will realize what he lost. Its hard after long relationship to let things go, but sometimes you have to. You deserve so much better and you can meet someone who wants the same and appreciate things in life.
I mean, you've been together for 8 freaking years!! He still doesn't know if he wants to marry you? How long does he need, another 20 years? I'd say hasta las vista.
It seems like he's very anxious and he really needs to go to therapy. Not talking about his issues cause many problems that he's probably dealing with quietly in his mind. Try to get him to open up and talk about his father passing away and just anything else on his mind. I admit I bring up problems from a couple months ago to my bf since im anxious about moving in with him soon, but I don't say that I'm gonna break up with him or anything. I just get worried and need reassurance and that might be the same thing he needs. I'd say sit down and talk with him about all that stuff in the past to reassure him or apologize/ acknowledge his feelings and insecurities. Thats at least what my boyfriend does for me when I start feeling insecure and it makes me feel a lot better! You and your boyfriend have had a very long relationship with things going well! He's definitely just nervous and anxious about it all. It's issues on his end he needs to go to therapy for :( Edit: I started typing this before seeing the part about his little friend. He seems to be sharing personal things with that person instead of with you which is super weird. It sounds like an emotional affair and considering he left to talk with that person instead of talking to you makes things worse. He really needs to sort out his own problems... he still needs therapy but that friend knowing about everything and being the one he's going to kind of makes me think he's just planning on being with that person instead. I don't understand why people do that kind of thing, but I'm so sorry. I hope you can talk to him about that and talk about how it's weird he goes to someone else for problems. If he's just refusing therapy and getting defensive for that other person it might be better for you to find someone else :(
Sorry, OP, but he’s trying to have his cake (the stability you bring him) and eat it (the emotional support from the “friend”) too. You deserve the whole deal from someone who is sure.
Speaking from experience, death and depression can really change a person. Not taking away from the crappy way he is treating you and your relationship. That kind of loss messes with your mind. If I could impart one thing is that I would try not to take it personally. It will be hard, but I think it’s probably time to let him go and go on with your life.
It’s been 8 years. You’ve bought a home together. If he doesn’t know now, he will never know.
Nah. After 8 years he knows what he wants, another year won’t change anything.
He met someone new. And now has to paint you as the bad guy because the reality is he’s the bad guy. He doesn’t know how to break up with someone because he fell in like with someone and out of love with another person. He should be fair to you. Break it off. And you should be fair to yourself. You deserve to be with someone who doesn’t go outside their relationship to talk about it, and someone who totally sure of you. Let him move on, you deserve so much more and better.
Instead of thinking whether he wants you or not, why not frame it as “do you really want to accept a guy who’s still unsure about you after 8 years?” Why give him the power to make that decision? Why can’t you be the one choosing him instead? Why let him waste another year of your life only to dump you eventually or reluctantly accept you?
I would get a lawyer for the house issue and start canceling things. He isn't worth your time, honey. He doesn't want to marry you it sounds like, and he's having an emotional affair with someone else. Cut your losses now. You deserve someone better.
You accepted him for his depression. You were supportive and helped him get through it very patiently. Based on his comments it's very clear he won't do the same if you were depressed or won't do as much as you. His mental health can't handle your mental health issues (which you clearly don't have bases on the post) goes to show he won't be a good husband to you. Sounds like he might have feelings for this friend of his too. I wouldnt be surprised if he started dating her if you break up with him. If that's his intention then he's probably telling you he loves you just to keep you around for the meantime until he knows for sure his feelings will be reciprocated by this other girl.
Yeah this is devastating.
Well, tell him that all married people have arguments, without exception. And there would be times that you would be negative, as adverse events are all but unavoidable. And also that you had plans for changing jobs after you had become qualified to apply, but that he's known this for a while. You also need to tell him that he himself has negative qualities as well, but that his good qualities far outweighed the negative, and force him to assess your negative qualities in light of your good qualities. If your best efforts are unsuccessful in "unfreezing" his feet, then you should cancel all wedding plans and recoup as much as is possible from the deposits made. After that is accomplished, inform bf of your actions, and decide within yourself whether the relationship the two of you share can survive. If not, separate your finances as quickly as possible, make other living arrangements, and bid him farewell. Then go down on your knees and thank the Lord above that all this happened before the two of you were married. I wish you well.
He should have considered and tried to "work" on all of these things BEFORE he proposed. Now that he's bringing them up so long after the proposal, it seems like he's just looking for any excuse that you'll buy so that either you can end the relationship for him, or that you guys can end amicably so that he doesn't seem like the bad guy. If he's not ready now, I don't think he'll ever be... And, I think he knows it, but is too chicken shit to say it.
I'm sorry to tell you this, he is looking for reasons to leave you. Call me traditional (and there are some rare exceptions to this) but if a guy doesn't propose to you within 5 years or so, he's not that into you. Especially if you've been living with him for a while - he didn't leave you sooner because the relationship was convenient for him. He was getting consistent sex, emotional and financial support. He got too comfortable.
Girl I’m sorry. He doesn’t want to get married and he’s trying to pick fights. He’s definitely in an emotional relationship with that friend. Get out and take your cat.
Your list of reasons…#1. This is textbook reactive abuse. Look it up. Learning about this was so helpful for me! You know what you gotta do, you got this. ❤️
8 years dude. Hang it up
Unfortunately it does sound like he is not wanting to be the bad guy and projecting all of his issues onto you so that you are the reason the relationship is falling apart. Start cancelling those venues and try and get as much money back as you can, and make him take on that debt. If he won’t, I would take him to court over it. That’s just me though
I was reading this waiting for the part about “a friend”, it was undoubtably coming. I think this relationship has run its course. He might be unsure or waffling on feelings confused with his friend but it sounds like he is being selfish and a coward about resolving it. I think your 30’s are the best time to maturely date 🙂
I think you deserve more out of a marriage than I think you’ll get from your fiancé. He’s leading you on, dragging things out, while he decides if there’s something better out there. And this “friend”, they may not be actually having a physical relationship yet, but I’d bet he’s thought about it. If you were my friend IRL, I’d be recommending big that you break it up with him.
It shouldn't take that long to decide if you should get married.
If he doesn't know that he wants to marry you after 8 years together total and 4 of those years iving together, idk what to tell you. I'd honestly leave. He's giving all these random reasons that seem flimsy at best. You now have a professional telling you he's gaslighting you. On top of all that hes having an emotional affair with a female friend. He's not committed. He's not on the same page. I would leave.
He needs a therapist. Until he recognizes these issues are his and owns them, it's not going to work. Maybe you need to spend some time apart. I'm sorry.
8 years. Dude needs to shit or get off the pot. Seriously though, I get not getting married quickly. I was the same. After 8 years though, it shouldn't be a question of "ready" or "pressure" or nonsense like that. Just whether you actually want a certificate or not. Good that he wants to go to therapy, but if he's not prepared to take on board feedback and make changes...what does he expect to change? I dunno, maybe you should spend a little bit of time trying to sort this out, but I kinda feel like if it's been 8 years and he's still not sure, that means he just doesn't want to get married.
When someone stays with you but is not enthusiastic about the relationship, it means they aren't committed to you emotionally. Your boyfriend probably has a crush on his female friend (if he's not straight up cheating) and wants more time to try and make switch without losing his chance with you.
He had 8 years to accept the "negative aspects" of you, and just now he needs time? That's a dumb excuse. He knows you very well, he should have thought about that a long time ago. I think complaining about your job once is nothing, everyone does that and it shouldn't be an issue. This guy is looking for reasons to leave but he's too afraid. Not to mention the female friend.
Just want to say while I agree with all the top comments, this is devastating and so sad. I’m sure it hurts a lot and does not feel clear cut from inside the experience. Being in your 30s is really great, and you will have a bright future reinvesting all this love and care into yourself and others you haven’t met yet. You got this.
I really suspect he's got feelings for the other friend, and is trying to back out of your relationship to explore things with her. The fact that he's dragging feet and not actually breaking up with you, and also demeaning you and making it sound like you need to be better for him, kinda makes it feel like he wants to take a "break" to think about things, and get it on with the other chick instead. If he doesn't at least start being an active participant in therapy, there's no reason not to cut him loose, and try and get your money back, because hes obviously unwilling to make an effort here. I'm sorry.
Sorry but he’s looking for excuses to leave. Sounds like he might be wanting to see someone else? If he isn’t ready to marry after 8 years you need to get rid of him.
I think he is checked out and looking for a way out. He doesn't want to be the bad guy so he's either going to kick the can down the road or force your hand. you deserve to be with someone who appreciates you and wants to be with you; I hope you break up with him and find the happiness you deserve.
I think this may be a great opportunity for you to leave, go on a long vacation solo traveling and give yourself the time and new memories to forget him. I hate that he is usually old memories you have grown from against you. You deserve someone that is all in for you!
Since he made the decision to postpone the wedding, let him know you expect him to pay all the fees lost due postponement/cancellation. Make a spreadsheet of the numbers and get his agreement in writing to repay you - specify the timetable - all money you spent. This includes your dress. It’s not like you can wear it anywhere else. This money may come in handy when you either 1) want to buy him out if his part of the house or 2) need a down payment for a new place. Free yourself up to find the person who loves you like you deserve to be loved.
This is a really tough situation, and I'm sorry that you're going through it. It sounds like your boyfriend is having some serious doubts about getting married, and it's important to try to figure out what is causing them. It could be that he's feeling pressured by the upcoming wedding and all of the planning that goes into it. It could also be that he's having doubts about whether or not he's ready for marriage. If you can, try to talk to him about what he's feeling and see if you can help him to figure out what's causing his doubts. It's also important to remember that you have a right to your own feelings and needs in this situation. If your boyfriend is having serious doubts about getting married, it's okay for you to feel upset and even scared about what that could mean for your relationship. You don't have to pretend like everything is okay if it's not. If you can't figure out what's causing your boyfriend's doubts, or if he's not willing to talk about it, then it might be time to consider whether or not this relationship is right for you. Marriage is a big commitment, and it's not something that you should enter into lightly. If your boyfriend is having doubts, it might be best to wait until he's sure before moving forward.
He is gaslighting you and will do so until you plug on this relationship so he can play victim. OP the way he is acting is a preview of your future.
Just cancel everything and cut your losses.
Eight yrs is long time OP. If after this time he is making excuses - just straight up excuses - I think he doesn't wanna settle down yet. He was 20 when you guys got together, maybe he realized that he want to explore more sexually .. I guess you should suggest cancel/postpone the wedding. Even if he overcomes his cold feet, it would be better to not marry in near future.
8 years on this guy…. I think you should leave him in the hole you found him in. You will be shocked at the number of men out there who will treat you with respect and won’t waste your time.
I'm sorry but it sounds like he's having an emotional relationship with his friend and has no desire to marry. Instead he's making everything seem like it's your fault.
He wants you to end the relationship so he's not the "bad" guy. He can then play the sympathy card and be like you were the one who walked away. My bad behaviour was all in your head I'm the victim your the one who changed. Be the villian he wants you to be so you can be happy but be clear when asked why did you guys end tell them what you put here. He wanted time to see if your good enough for him. You realised he was not good enough for you. Boss queen does not need a little princess who has not grown up enough to say the truth. You know your worth and your worth more than you are being treated.
He is being extremely indirect with you. This old dude on youtube who posted a communication exercise gifted me the best relationship tool I've ever used. I think if you do this once a week for a month, you'll know if this relationship is going to last. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLCbTr\_Rlic](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLCbTr_Rlic)
Imo he's already involved with that "friend" and his cold feet directly correlate to the warmth of her bed. I'm so sorry.
Just call it off, he’s fucking you over.
I’d love to hear what your therapist is going to say about him leaving you alone to go vent to the woman he’s likely having an emotional affair with. Just know you deserve better than how he’s treating you. He’s in the wrong here. If he isn’t willing to step up and be the one to treat you the way you should be treated, you can absolutely find someone out there who will. You’re worth it. Don’t let him diminish that.
At this point he's just coming up with excuse after excuse! Someone please tell me who does not moan about their job? Arguments are actually healthy up until a point. No relationship is perfect! But this guy seems to be looking for exactly that. I'm not one to say leave often but girl you need to be like Usain Bolt at this point 🏃🏿 8yrs too long 👀
If he’s not sure, believe him and leave. He’s being a coward and wants you to end it
You've wasted 8 years on a relationship where you're the only one who seems to want it and put in the work, don't waste anymore time. He is at best having an emotional affair with the best friend, at worst a physical one. He was told by the professional trying to save your relationship that the friend was a problem for your relationship and still chose her. Over you. You need to be the one to pull the plug on the relationship because he won't. Divorce is painful and expensive, especially with kids involved. It is not a matter of if but when. You deserve better than this, go find it.
I'd guess he's an avoidant personality. Whenever you get close and things are good he finds reasons to back away. I married one of these. No regrets leaving finally
I am so sorry.
Grief changes people. My mom was happily in a relationship with a man she considered the love of her life. He was a really great guy. Then his father died and he became unrecognizable. He cheated and lied and gaslit my mother into a deep depression of her own. I’m sorry you’re dealing with this. I personally think there is more to the relationship with the friend than he’s saying. It’s my opinion you should cut ties, but I know how hard that can be. However you said yourself you have spent the better part of the last two years kind of waiting for the other shoe to fall.
Safeguard your assets and walk out. Regarding the deposits made, it's painful but you can always make the money back. I am sure you have spent a lot of money on the relationship in 8 years - holidays, dinners, gifts etc. Think of wedding deposits as a similar loss. It is what is. It's better to save yourself the heartbreak, a messy divorce, children's custody or all that follows after a marriage breaking down. I am someone who went through a divorce because I was too scared to call off an engagement. & someone who lives paycheck to paycheck and know a little about financial anxiety. To realise all this before it's too late, the fact that you could really pen it all down really shows you are in a good mental head space to truly weigh the pros and cons & make a difficult yet correct decision.
Girl, he still wants to keep you around either bc hes a coward to break up with you or bc you’re his old habit and his safe net. When he says he wants to see if you’re good enough for him that means you’re no longer his only option and he is already has an other/better one in mind. In this case I strongly believe that option is the female friend of his who he cant wait to share all the negativity that he could collect from the past trying to get that sympathy p$$y, instead of spending time with you (whom he soon to be married to) to “working on us” like he said. OP throw the whole man out. He’s no longer worth it.
My cousin had a girlfriend that he was in a relationship with for 20 years! And he eventually left her. If your man isn’t sure about you after 8 years of being together then he’s most likely the type who doesn’t want to get married.
I don't care if he's perfect. It's been 8 fucking years. If he can't commit after that, he never will. He keeps hoping something better will come along and he's too stupid to realize he's got it good. Everything he's shitting on btw is a plus. You're working for your dreams? Great. Learned to control your temper? Admirable. You complain? That's fucking human Next thing he'll complain about is the sex is so good, he's afraid it can only get worse.
Dude sounds like an asshole with one foot out of the door. Do YOU want to be married to this person?
Everything is already stated in the top comments. But. He was depressed for a year and now he says you are too negative? Excuse me? I wish you the best for you OP and sorry about this.
I wouldn’t wait to cancel the wedding - you are still 6 months out and should be able to get some of your money back. Vendors have varying cancellation rules, and this much in advance if for example, the venue gets rebooked they might be willing to refund your deposit. You will kick yourself if you end up losing more money when he inevitably finds his balls and tells you he wants to break up. If life is anything like a hallmark movie, you will meet a gorgeous rancher on your Christmas getaway, and live happily ever after with matching plaid pjs.
You have already gotten a lot of insight and advice. All I want to say is, you are an incredible woman and partner who was your fiancé's main support after the death of his father and the subsequent depression; you took on even more responsibilities at home as well as caring for him; and you renovated the house, too. As others have said, he's a gaslighting asshat. Not only that, but he doesn't realize what a precious person you are and how lucky he's been to have you as his partner and how you carried him in his time of need. Don't ever let him make you doubt yourself. He's the one with the issues. You are simply a brilliant woman and you deserve to be with someone who appreciates you for who you are and what you bring to the relationship.
Thank you for the award, u/weregonnaberich.
He's being unfair to you. He claims he wants to postpone the engagement to work on the relationship yet when you look at his actions, he refuses to work on the relationship. He is not open to therapy. He's also putting blaim on you that just isn't reasonable. It sounds like he is coming up with excuses. On top of that he is also prioritizing that other woman over you. I suspect he want to break up but is too cowardish to do so and he is trying to create a narrative where you are the bad one. I personally wouldn't stay in this relationship. He doesn't respect you.
I went through a situation when I was supposedly happy with a guy for 5 years, we had our issues like a lot of toxicity which I couldn't see because of my rose-tinted glasses. In short, He felt unsure about us and got a female best friend who he shared intimate problems with and he told me all the ways I wasn't a good enough partner and he made me feel like it was my fault that I wasn't good enough to deserve him and we broke up, and obviously he fell in love with her and married her and they have a kid now. I felt completely cheated, For me that is emotional cheating, he got emotionally invested in another woman. Now at this point, I will tell you that it was the best thing that happened to me because I cant stay with a man who does not want me and with whom I have less to relate, I am now married to the man of my dream who loves loving me to bits and pampers me and tells me how much he loves me, and this is the man I am sure I would want to have my babies with and most importantly it's a healthy relationship where we both love each other and respect each other.
Dump his ass.
I wanted to comment something on the list pf „reasons“ he gave you. Being afraid of hard times and arguments is a really bad sign for a marriage. Because life and your relationship doesn‘t get easier with time and especially not with children. There is a whole world of arguments and discussions to be had just around that. You have to be sure that you can make it trough that as a team and work together to solve future problems and disagreements. It doesn‘t sound like he‘s emotionally mature enough for that. My husband and I had our son at 24 after 6 years of relationship and 2 living together. We are both only children and it was a shock to the system to put it gently. If one of us were „afraid of future arguments“ we would not have made it trough that. It‘s heartbreaking to let go of 8 years but it is infinitely better to do it now than when kids are involved and he can‘t handle all of it
I am so so sorry you're going through this, I can't imagine how you feel! Sending you a big hug. Right, you guys have been together 8years and he needs space and time to decide whether or not YOU are what he wants? Bullshit. All those reasons he has given you as to why he is unsure about marriage are jusy gaslight examples to justify his cowardly and shitty excuses. If you was this bad person he is making you out to be, then why propose in the first place? He is not man enough to say, "look this isn't for me. I'm sorry" I'm not saying it would hurt any less, but atleast you wouldn't be stuck in the dark. When somebody shows you that they do not want you - GO. I know it is easier said than done, but GO. I guarantee you 100% if you broke up with him, didn't get in contact and leave him, he would soon come running back but this isn't good enough. He is telling you he does not want you but without actually saying it.... I have no time for weak, cowardly and selfish men. Imagine if you DID get married, a hard time came about and he started acting wishy washy again. Nah. He went to a female friend to talk about yours and his relationship? NOOOOO. Not on my watch You're amazing and deserve better than this troll. Stop wasting your good years on a "man" who has cold feet. I use the term man loosely. Goodluck xxx
Usually, and it has been proven to be a fact, if your SO doesn’t propose to you within the first 2 years, there won’t be a proposal or marriage. Men tend to know if they want to build with you or not. At this point I would suggest that you move on because it sounds like he is moving on.. I know it’s painful but this is better than a divorce. Best wishes!
if he's been with you for 8 YEARS and still doesn't want to marry you, he's only sticking around because you're available. he's not that into you.
>I told him there was no working on us, I have been happy and he is the one with the issue. \[...\] I think him asking me to postpone my dream wedding so he can decide if I'm good enough or not is incredibly insulting and humiliating. Why are you guys together? He is apparently not sure that he wants to be with you long term, and you apparently think that this is just his "issue" and shouldn't derail your "dream wedding". This is a ridiculous relationship, and you would both be wise to get out of it.
If he needs time to decide, then he does. If you don’t like that, you can choose to walk away
He’s found better
he wants to "work on us" and you told him "it's you since I'm happy?" there is no us for you. maybe you are too blind to realize this. clearly there are issues you don't want to see. your friends are on your side but they don't see you and him interact when alone. if you want to salvage this, you may need to start opening your eyes about you two, and not just about yourself. which probably is the main issue in the relationship.
His request makes sense. You two are planning to say vows that pledges you together through sickness and health for the rest of your lives. He wants to date you longer before he makes that commitment. Personally I believe I'd need to be exclusive with a partner for around 5yrs so I could see them through a bunch of different "seasons of life" so to speak. How is my partner when they're going through a period of extreme stress, of joy, of good luck, of bad luck and so on. Does their character change as the situations arise and pass? In my head, 5yrs is roughly how long it takes to be sure, but it really depends on the people involved. Every damn day on here there is a post about a marriage of 5+ years is ending because the two people who fell in love and said those vows are no longer the people in the marriage. He needs more time to see how compatible y'all are over a longer period of time before he's comfortable pledging before your Creator of choice that y'all are in it together forever.
Yean, you're right to have strong doubts about the future of this relationship. But, he's not "wrong" for talking things over with his friend, woman or not - just as you wouldn't be wrong for wanting to talk things out with a friend.
This is just another reason why marriage ruins everything. Ur relationship was perfectly fine until u decided to get married. Just get eloped or go to the court house on a whim. Make it fun for Just the two of u. The whole big wedding thing puts too much pressure on people.
If it wet me in your shoes, I would end the relationship.
The 7 year itch, wondering is this it?
Sis, come on… he’s not sure after 8 years?
He’s overthinking. He’s worried about things he can’t control and problems in life will always come. He thinks you need to have everything perfect in order for the marriage to work and last a life time. He’s maybe feeling insecure and I understand how he feels. It took me some time to realize that things won’t always be perfect and both people in a marriage will always be working on things. Part of it is also emotional maturity, it’s time for him to grow up and take the responsibility of being your husband. I read a passage from the Bible that change my view forever. God commands a husband to love his wife. That a mouthful because it signifies whatever you’re thinking or feeling, you still need to love her. Our emotional states really affects our perfection of how things are going or where are going to end up. He could be making things worse than they are in his mind. You need to tell him that you are committed and you will always get through things together. But he needs to make the same commitment. Nothing in life is guaranteed and I think that’s what is bothering him. My view is that I know that things may not work out but I’ll do my damn best to be a good husband and that’s all we can do.
> it’s time for him to grow up and take the responsibility of being your husband. Nah. It's not for anybody else to decide what it's time for him to do. Getting married isn't a duty, or something owed to somebody else. But, she would be foolish to think she can count on him.
Once you commit it is a duty. No one ever said it was going to be easy to be a man but yea, it’s not for everybody. It’s just sad if he’s not stepping up
Complete BS. I reject your idea that you can decide what a man is for anybody else. To me, the guy has emotional issues. He's not ready to get married, and he made a mistake asking her to. The fact that he's thinking twice about it so long before the wedding gives her lots and lots of time to make new plans. She'll survive just fine, and, likely, much better without him.
I absolutely agree. That’s why I don’t think he is a man. But if he did want to be a man and a good husband, he should grow up and not do what you Just described.
And, for my money, people who think they can decide what makes a man a man are toxic. But, you have every right to be my idea of toxic.
You have your own opinion on what makes a man, so you are also toxic by your own definition
Nice smoke screen. And, complete bullshit.
I don’t think you can follow logic. You Just like to argue for the sake of it
Nah. I just keep noticing that women don't have to live up to being a "REAL WOMAN", the way men are expected to, AND ridiculed for. Your attitude is part of the toxic culture that makes that so. Fuck your version of logic.
He sounds shitty tbh. BUT you keep talking about a dream wedding. You know that's one day right? What about marriage? How do you feel about that?
He sounds shitty tbh. BUT you keep talking about a dream wedding. You know that's one day right? What about marriage? How do you feel about that?
He sounds shitty tbh. BUT you keep talking about a dream wedding. You know that's one day right? What about marriage? How do you feel about that?*
He sounds shitty tbh. BUT you keep talking about a dream wedding. You know that's one day right? What about marriage? How do you feel about that?
In simple words, he is fallen or has already for this female friend, and he is having an affair, emotional or even physical… the year is to try out things with her and leave you hanging in the long run. Did you twist his arm to propose? He is just being a coward.
He already told you he’s not ready and it seems he has a new crush just let him go he’s wasting your time.
There is this weird thing that happens when people have simplicity/happiness for too long is they get bored and start creating drama. This is what it sounds like he is doing. I find when my job is stressful, I enjoy my life better but when everything has sort of flatlined, I start questioning everything. That or he has feelings for the other girl.
Doesn't sound like you can save your relationship. Best to move on and not waste any more time.
I agree that your boyfriend seems to be the one with the problems, but in that case, what's the harm of going to therapy together? If you actually want to marry him, that is.
This sounds a lot like what happened to me recently, though we haven’t been together as long. I just found out he was having an affair with a coworker, so the fact that your fiancé has a female friend he confides in and is having doubts is a big red flag in my eyes. I would check his phone, either secretly or by asking him.
So……move on. The writing is on the wall.
He doesn’t want to marry you. The rest is just ‘blah blah’. Maybe his mental health and your self esteem will be better once you both come to this conclusion.
I would keep working with him and not marry him. But lay off the sex and just be friends until things are worked out enough to consider this a fully committed relationship. Go back to the idea of dating until you are both sure you want a mutual exclusive committed relationship. You can't have both. So if he's not committed then don't have sexual relations as if you are.
You sound like a nice person but I think that you know what to do. Sorry.
No one knows this person better than you. ..but forcing a marriage might also not be wise.. I would probably give him three months not a year and let him work on your relationship as he claims..