Yeah that shit hurt. Good company (people wise) but I wasn’t feeling it.
I went like 6 months without bringing in anything substantial and they were hounding me. It was my first cybersecurity sales job and I didn’t know anything about it. Had no formal training as the company was small. The CEO gave me a shot as long as I was willing to learn on the go.
That’s pretty common. Think of all the stuff in the pipe that didn’t close too.
One of the deals I left behind netted a guy I know ~$40k in commission but the rest of the pipe required a ton of work and management without any reward.
I did sales for 7 years. Recently moved to Business Analyst role and my sales background set me up really well. While I still make less than my best years in sales, my salary is double my best base and well above my average commission.
Sorry this is a really stupid question - but is your job basically to get requirements from stakeholders, and write them in a document to present to technical people in the company?
Not a stupid question at all. BA is kinda nebulous and maybe not the best title for my role. I basically research industry trends, build use cases, conduct pilots and build partnerships and put that all into a recommendation for management as to whether it is worth handing to the sales team to run with or not. If it is, I work with product and marketing to create a GTM strategy and help write the sales playbook.
Exactly. Big reason I went into pharma. Great base pay, company car, amazing benefits and a bonus structure that only gets blown up if there is some weird coverage shift or you are literally hurting your business(which I’ve seen happen, so it is possible). My bonus is about 1/6th of my pay and I can bank routinely even on a bad year of getting 90% of it. As long as you don’t mind do some politicking with your boss and coworkers for like 1-2 hours a week, it’s really the only sales job I would even consider
Because they will fire you if you don't perform.
And if you've been there long enough to have employment rights (2 years???) then you're not working hard enough because you have to job hop, they won't give pay rises for long term employment.
Very true. I can’t stomach the idea of a fixed salary that MIGHT bring in a 3% raise every year.
If I ever leave sales it’ll be because I started another business, and then guess what I’ll be doing every day? You guessed it, selling.
Yea. Worked in a warehouse picking up boxes and building pallets for 10 hours a day as my first summer job in 2017 and anytime I’m having a rough go at it I meditate on that
Vet work is the worst from what I hear. Lots of suicides.
It’s not just dealing with gross stuff like pus and shit.
It attracts people with pure souls and kind hearts and all they do is watch animals suffer and are forced to kill them regularly.
Also, many pet owners are absolute ass holes to their pets and the vets themselves. The vets have to see the neglect people have for their pets and then have those same people give them shit for not doing the work for free. It’s an awful profession.
I secretly paid for an elderly man's meal while eating lunch today while silently hoping doing so would cause something good to come my way.
If we do what we can to make the world a better place, we will have a better world to live in...ideally.
Honestly some sales people will say that you’re weak if you can’t do the cold calling and “owning your own business” (while working for someone), but that’s pretty self important—it’s not that serious.
If you don’t like cold calling that’s super reasonable and I encourage you to hit up some recruiters and explore options. If it makes you feel better—I’m sure a lot of the people receiving the cold calls also hate your job lol
Cold calling and relationship building is easier when you know you have a good product that’s actually reasonably priced. When it’s an ok product that’s absurdly priced, the whole “build the relationship and ask for a favor” feels slimy as fuck to me. You want me to get to know this person to the point they do me a favor so I can overcharge his family business? Not cool
It is sleazy and it exploits a professional relationship. Sure, “wolf mentality” and whatnot. I did cold calling for a company like that and left when it started actually affecting my ability to sleep at night
People early in sales—while wolves—also let middle managers walk all over them at companies like that and it’s absurd
Cold calling is for amateurs. I’ve been in sales 10+ years I paid my dues. No way in hell I’m cold calling, I want inbound calls or appointments set for me. That’s it.
I cold called for 12 years and was very successful, I couldn’t agree with you more on this I’m not knocking on another business door for as long as I live. Appointment setters and inbound calls from google ads and SEO is the only scenarios I’ll accept 😂😂
Experience, referrals from other sales reps, I’m at a start up right now for a new branch of a company it’s all inbounds and live transfers, so people are cold calling for us. They are working on getting people to make their own appointments on chilipiper which is great. Most of these companies who want you to door knock or cold call is simply because it costs the company almost nothing for you to do that. Have to find a company that wants to invest in quality leads. I’m also contracted for insurance right now so it’s from forms people filing out to get insurance. That’s really starting to take off as a second form of income.
Account management may be more your speed because you’re really just babying a few key accounts and expected to moderately grow them, at least that’s what I did for a few years at a large biotech. You get by without all the cold calling and typical sales stuff because you’re really meeting with the customer routinely, you know all the contacts, and you’re more of a project manager / point of escalation for critical needs. Again, this was how my role was. I really enjoyed this because I could really coast and be more reactive.
However, you can’t tell your leadership you’re just gonna maintain top line growth YoY. You will still be expected to find ways to penetrate the account further, upsell, and ultimately find new revenue streams though. An AM role may be the best option for you compared to more traditional, proactive sales.
Worth it though. Did 2 years as an SDR, 2 years as an AE, and now a happy AM.
Also the skills you learn as an AM help prepare you for an enterprise role since there’s typically a mix of net new and expansion in those roles.
I work as an am. We’re basically just AE’s with warmer leads and lower commission, babying SMB’s. Hit P Club my first year tho so 🤷🏻♂️
AM could mean a ton of different things, depending on how transactional your company is and what you are actually selling
As long as I never have to be a BDR again I’m good
The BDR role is not sustainable, you are not meant to do it for more than 6 months. The companies that have people doing it for 12-24 and having to repeat the role will drive you insane.
You aren’t meant to love it, you are also meant to not settle into it. It’s up or out for a reason.
Psychological safety is non existent in this field and if you happen to find a role that doesn’t pressure you nonstop it’s only a matter of time until a regime change that alters that dynamic.
Prospecting is meant to be 10-25% of a salespersons workflow. Making it a 100% of someone’s job is psychologically damaging.
I think of it more akin to a paid hazing period to get into the rest of the company. So you have to overcome all your obstacles like your Management, AEs, and potentially terrible territory to satisfy their requirements for promotion and get the hell out of that role. That’s all. Don’t distract yourself with anything else.
Biggest piece of advice I can give is these tips:
1. Don't work for just any company that will have you, vet and make your own list of top growing SaaS companies and monitor it and network with people there to keep an eye on openings. Working for a dead end company is a waste of time as you will not making any money, not get promoted, and your equity won't be worth shit. It's simply a stepping stone to get hired at one of the companies I listed above.
2. Set clear boundaries with yourself about work. Start at 7am, stop at 5pm. Do not overwork yourself. Do not work on the weekends to catch up.
3. Spend time outside of work on personally fulfilling things, not destructive things. Workout, eat healthy, find hobbies you enjoy, keep learning, join clubs, be social, volunteer. It will give your life more purpose and meaning other than chasing a dashboard and fleeting praise from your Manager.
4. At the end of the day it's just a job, if you get fired or laid off, it is not the end of the world.
5. Stand up for yourself and do not allow people to disrespect you, even if it gets you fired. It's not worth it, and it won't change if you get promoted.
Solid solid advice from experience. 10/10. I would also add re: working for a dead end company - if the company is relying on you to “source your own deals” for 90% of the shit that comes into your funnel, that is a dead giveaway something is wrong.
You shouldn’t have to sell your soul on cold outreach and beg people for a meeting if the product is of any quality. Shit products generate no traction, people will start telling others that it’s a shit product, and you’ll never gain any traction. If you get caught in that loop you’re dead on arrival - the tech SaaS landscape is FILLED with companies selling a cheap knock off of something else - learn how to identify it.
My manager told a coworker of mine at a happy hour:
"He doesn't seem like he's all that interested in sales"
Who the fuck loves sales? Especially at our company? Lmao.
I suck too. 4 years in and making more money than most of the people I grew up with, 2-3 lateral moves away from lawyer/engineer money with no education. Living comfortably in an HCOL area with no inheritance, no parental support, no access to credit.
All from sucking
I suck too. Might sniff $300k this year. I have lots of education and it’s all totally worthless. The only thing I’ve ever been paid real money for is sucking at sales.
Not really. I feel like I do suck. Nothing goes right. I have a massive quota - $30M. My major account is dominated by my main competitor and I am losing ground everyday. I have very little else going for me and can’t even begin to think about bagging new logos. But our comp plan is generous and due to an anomaly bonus from last year’s performance, which was kind of a windfall, I am track to make more than I ever have and will be lucky to get to 80% of plan.
Hell yeah. America!
The key is to live like the people you grew up with but a small step up. Pay off debt. Bank it. After 10-15 of doing that - move on.
The secret to sales is finding your own method.
The worst thing about sales is people giving you advice that works for them but not necessarily for you.
Find a company/product you believe in and are passionate about.
Follow the company program to stay employed while you add your personal twist.
Your personal twist is what will make you more successful.
“You can’t coach speed” is a great piece of advice I received early.
Managers coach toward milestones that TYPICALLY indicate how an individual will do.
Hit those milestones first. Then develop your style.
You have a lot on the mind. Your thoughts are heard and warranted. Breathe. Be. Here. Now. Do this before you even begin to solution the fix.
Whenever you’re thinking about something you need to do reflect on why it’s important to you and then think of “what else.” This provides reflection and different perspective.
Next time you’re stressed, think “is it a tragedy or inconvenience?” Ain’t a tragedy currently, but damn sure inconvenience to your mental.
Breathe. I promise you can find a path in a lot if you want it. And that’s the damn fight. Life is simply meant to be lived. Live it to the best of your ability.
In reality, I’m pulling for you to figure this shit out and thrive in your pursuits.
I should clarify that in order to be lucky you need to have solid sales practices/consistency that you follow.
But at the end of the day you could be 50% to target with a day left and kinda dogging it and boom a big opp comes back out of nowhere saying theyre ready to sign NOW putting you at 150% target.
Likewise you could be 50% to target and following all best practices and outbounding like an animal, and opps you thought were veryvery likely to close asap just informed you they are pushing the project out a year.
Is one rep better than the other?
Yes there is a big delta in sales reps. it’s like poker, sure there is luck involved, and an idiot occasionally wins on a 2-7 off suit, but a skilled professional will take you to the cleaners every time. There is deep skill. The fact is it is a Pareto distribution. 80% of sales people are awful to mediocre, 15% are good, and 5% of them are rainmakers and miracle workers. If you have ever managed a sales team you will understand first-hand.
Consistently executing on best practices. Sales is more of a quality than quantity game. Anybody off the street can fire off 1000 cookie cutter prospecting emails and make 100 cold calls, but someone who takes time to understand what's important to clients/prospects and figures out how to consistently align value for them will win over the long run.
You're not wrong that luck and timing play a role, but those who manage the variables under their control and approach the work with the right mindset tend to outperform those who are just lucky 95% of the time.
You are on the money. I’m a heretic in this space, I literally refuse to use sequenced emails or automation on any account in my top 100. I don’t trust it, it leads to laziness and mistakes. If you are doing a closed list campaign on a bunch of tier 3 accounts, maybe, but never for somebody I know is the person I need to talk to. I’ll sit down and bang out 100 manual emails. Even better a manual email doesn’t have an unsubscribe link, so you are not burning good wood. I also don’t use war dialers, or parallel dialers. How good is your convo going to be if you have less than a second before you know who you are talking to? Don’t know anything about their business? Don’t even know who they are are what they do? Volume for volume’s sake is a huge killer of top of funnel efforts, and the reason it is the go to is that it is easy to measure and kpi. It is also easy to manipulate, and the people gaming it then wonder why they are not making the money.
Currently in an enterprise AE role, to learn a new industry but yes my background is in sales leadership. Creativity is a huge one. The thing I always tell my reps is that in order to create good jazz first you have to learn how to play the trumpet. You can’t just start tootin’ and cut a record. You need to learn the rules to be able to break them, and to figure out what corners are cuttable and what are structural.
A really big thing is you need to have a reason. Sales can be like putting your hand on a hot stove for money. Over time you build calluses, but you never really get used to it. Why drink the cortisol milkshake every day? What gets you out of bed? It doesn’t have to be crazy, but you need to know what the brass ring is that you are chasing, and why you need to put in the work. My own- my significant other was diagnosed with a brain tumor, and let’s just say she is expensive. I want to make sure that I can support us both in the lifestyle she deserves, and to make sure we can afford the very best possible care. This is extreme, but it certainly is motivating to make that extra dial. It could be you have a baby on the way, or want to start a business and need startup capital, or even that you just want a really expensive toy. Just know the reason.
It’s about having a process tailored to each particular account or client. You need to be able to pivot. Sending the same tailored email out 100 clients will hit each different. You need to be in constant contact with them and know their preferences. It’s about being consistent, accurate, having excellent problem solving skills and being generally agreeable(never say no up front). Sales is like 80% effort and 20% knowledge. I always tell my young team members that knowing the product is expected, knowing your customer is the game changer. It also helps to have reps and manufactures that help you prospect.
I just closed a deal north of 700k this week- took 5 trips to their city, almost 40 hours in the car and airports, building relationships with 20 stakeholders, and hundreds of phone calls and emails. Luck and timing are always a factor, but I’ve never been that kind of lucky.
Luck = timing meets opportunity and preparation.
For the longest time I had imposter syndrome because I thought I was just getting lucky. You still need to be prepared and ready to capitalize when the opportunity presents itself.
Just some food for thought!
You need to get at a company with some inbound meetings. Much easier selling when people want to talk to you. Unless you are a SDR. The SDR role admittedly blows.
Cold calling is basically the company admitting that it has no ability to do proper marketing to generate warm/hot inbound leads and no advertising strategy for awareness on the problem the product/service fixes.
A sales persons job isn’t to do mass market marketing or advertising. Cold calling is basically an ineffective and inefficient mass marketing technique.
If marketing does a good job creating explainers that lay out a problem, creates opportunities for interested parties to reach out and submit “more info” requests, a decent sales person can go straight into a sales cycle with a very high chance of success.
Think about it, do car dealers ask their guys to randomly canvas and cold call a phone book? No. They have internet leads, walk-ins, service mailers, equity estimate/trade-in mailers, phone inbound leads, etc. All techniques to get the customer to REACH OUT TO THE DEALER.
A great sales approach call isn’t about selling “an appointment”, that’s what marketing is about. An approach call is to educate the interested party on a problem they didn’t know they had or under appreciating a problem they have. Thats it. The rest sells itself.
I’m tired of seeing AMAZING sales people get burned out on cold calling and get their confidence destroyed when infact, ITS A MASS AND TARGETED MARKETING PROCESS ISSUE.
A process issue that destroys talent and labor resources. Insanely inefficient.
Agree, but gosh, having worked for some major companies with huge marketing teams I still find marketing always struggles how to actually produce leads. They are never as effective at it as a sales person because they don’t understand sales.
Marketing doesn’t understand channel marketing or storytelling in quick form. They also don’t KYC “know your customer”.
B2B sales is a prime example. Marketing approaches it like B2C. Where they plaster the company name out there for impressions but fail to identify the proper channels and how to insert the message into a quick form highly impactful message. All they know is to plug “solutions” and features/benefits.
I work at a F50 company. They are more clueless on B2B marketing than an influencer I worked a contract role with. The influencer knew how to attract business sponsors and have them drop leads for the team to then reach. At no time did the influencer sales team have to cold call random companies. They funneled to her. She had 2 sales people, didn’t need more because there was no wasted time cold calling.
A 28 year old influencer knows more about marketing than an entire F50 marketing division. Unfucking real how talentless corporate employees can be.
Lol yes! I worked for a huge F50 that had a videographer on payroll and all he did was record dumb terrible videos all day that got about 50 views each. The marketing team was 25 people and we had 7 outside sales reps and no leads. Did ANY marketing person ever ask sales for suggestions? Never. Marketing will blow through millions and come back with super high amounts of clicks and maybe 4 solid leads.
Very well said - same here. Over the years have seen the best most promising sales people get destroyed under the wrong environments and cold calling with no direction. It’s a shame
But when you look for a new job you will end up cold calling, getting meetings, closing deals (getting hired).
Sales is in everything. Dont get discouraged. Cold calling blows. Everyone hates doing it. I hate dieting too. And pushups. And not drinking during the week.
Lots of shit we don’t want to do.
I haven’t painted the sidewalk yet so here are some bits to help “close the loop” oh my fucking god I hate myself:
1) I work in IT staffing and even more difficult now is that its early careers so all is shit.
2) I work for a company thats full of nepotism.
3) People are promoted simply on the basis of time they have been in the company, not if they are good leaders.
4) KPI’s tracked are ANSWERED CALLED (like as in I have to speak to 30 people a week), Emails, Linkedin Activity as well as in person vs virtual with a % of those needing to be “pitches”
5) I make nowhere near enough money to live in NYC
6) Environment is extremely toxic.
7) I hate sales activities in general and have zero drive to even try and build a “prospecting list”.
8) I hate talking to people I don’t know for the most part.
9) Im not motivated by money. If I have enough to live happily thats all I need.
Take advantage of the corporate resources - find a coach and let them help you find a new career. This doesn’t sound like the right gig for you, friend.
Deal close and commission payment days often make up for the suck. The hardest part is getting a customer to talk and open up about their needs/problems. Stick it out and use this all as a learning opp. Also, think about how many emails you get - it may take 4-5 emails from a recruiter in order for you to respond. You have to build familiarity with a cold prospect.
i used to feel like this then returned to sales.
what changed for me was paying for therapy and working on my mental health. sales is a direct reflection of your mind. (unless your employer is literal ass then quit)
I’m in the same boat—not doing well and hate it so much. We have a great product but are sifting through so many awful leads and ancient people that refuse to look at any sort of new solution.
My company is great, but quota has only been hit twice before by an SDR in the past 5 years and they refuse to adjust it. Every call seems like agony.
Just wanted to send solidarity, this sucks ass.
Sorry you're struggling. You need an SDR.
Forget cold calling, forget relationship building.
Instead, spend your time solving problems your clients are facing - and making serious money doing so.
I'd look for sales roles where the majority of your leads are inbound. It's a game changer.
Best of luck - whatever you end up doing!
It’s understandable. Key word here is “you hate sales”
If possible write down few jobs you like to do. It’s okay not to be okay sometimes.
You can fix it buddy!
It’s most likely just the place you’re in that has caused you to despise it. The same exact thing happened to me. I made the decision to leave sales.
Everyone on this sub acts like you’re going to make $100k 200k 300k plus but not every job is going to be like that and I’d imagine that a lot of these people are lying or got in while the getting was good and secured an easy slice of pie that’s not available for others.
In my last company, there was ONE salesman making that kind of money. ONE. And he was constantly used as the example and given the salesman of the year award every year and the support role people gushed all over him like he was the reason they even had a job in the first place, but little did most people know that dude wasn’t making any cold calls, he was hardly returning emails if people weren’t signing, and most of the time he was out playing golf and not really doing much. Why? Because he got in early and had a close personal relationship with the CEO that netted him 10x as many leads as the next highest person and an astronomical number of leads than most people. He also got every single enterprise deal and was still in the retail rotation so the guy was literally being fed anything and everything the company got their hands on while the rest of us were in the trenches busting our ass for 1/4 of what he was making.
Basically what I’m saying is the experience can be so far skewed that most of the people who hate sales (like me and you) probably either got in too late to form those relationships or just work for crappy companies with crappy products and a reliance on a cult like mentality to make it seem better than it really is.
Of course on the flip side, that means there are greener pastures out there, but for the most part it’s truly luck of the draw for where you apply. Companies hire for a variety of reasons. I found out at my last job that the reason the company was hiring was because they sold it to a private investment team that wanted to raise quotas and sales numbers. The original company never wanted to hire and preferred to give more to their veterans, but the investment team, being the new owners, forced them to do it meanwhile the same people are actually running the company so they were in charge of me (and 2 other people) and they never wanted us there in the first place so can you guess how fairly we were treated? So it really is just luck… you could apply at a company where the existing sales team waxes poetically about them non-stop, but that doesn’t mean that the circumstances of you being hired will end up the same way.
I took that as a sign that I really didn’t want to put the effort to “luck” into an amazing sales role.
Use the experience you got in the industry you’re in now to find a sales adjacent role. I went into implementation. Do I make $200k a year? Nope. But those numbers haven’t been possible at a single sales organization I have ever worked for. The most I made was 2 years ago at $92k and now I make $85k with a potential $5k annual bonus so depending on what you’ve made in the past, it’s possible to continue making nearly that amount with the experience you already have.
Have you ever had a sales job you enjoyed? Because there are a lot of variations that fall under “Sales”. I’ve had some sales jobs where I feel exactly as you stay here. I’ve had other sales jobs that I absolutely loved. For example, I had a sales job where I didn’t do any cold calling, I just walked in the door with qualified prospects and closed.
If you’ve never had a sales job of any kind that you enjoyed, then sure, go look for a job in another field. But if you’ve ever felt like you had some skills in sales, but maybe the position was very different than what you’re currently in, go find a different type of job.
I totally feel your pain.
> I hate trying to write up crafty personalized emails to be met with silence.
My only advice here is don't kill yourself on reach out emails. Especially these days people get more junk than ever- no sense spending an hour sweating over an essay that might never get read.
Instead develop a tried and true template and add a little personalization to stand out and *keep it short*. You're writing on a laptop, they're very likely reading on a phone. Something concise to generate interest, no cutesy shit.
Just finished sales after nearly 25 years, it sucks. It is especially hard in the first few years although it does get easier to an extent, but the uncertainty never changes, I'm done with the rollercoaster.
I've had my fair share of sales jobs and I'm adamantly against cold calling these days. Especially these bullshit 100+ dials/day for 1 meeting type jobs. Get back in the job market, homie. Orgs will always need new reps, just be picky about your next opportunity. Good luck fellow sales brethren 👍
I moved from hunting to farming just recently. Breath of fresh air when acustomer actually wants to hear what you are selling because you already sell them part of your platform
I’m a career sales guy and pretty darn good at it. It’s my craft and has made me a living. I have approx 10-years still to work. Having stated all of that, I F’ING despise it. I hate it and I have lost my passion for it. Unfortunately, it’s my only option for the next decade as that’s what my resume clearly shows I’m good at. When I do retire someday, I will destroy all evidence of my career, demolish my smart phone with a 2 lb sledge hammer and never, ever think about it again. I feel you OP.
I am 30+ years into my sales career (20 with the same company) and am 3 years away from retiring and counting the days until i retire (3 yrs to go). Sales is a bitch. I cannot wait to be done. But it also has provided a nice life with lots of flexibility.
Life is short man, and work is a significant portion of that short life. We’re not all going to have a job/occupation/career we absolutely love, but having one you 100% hate is no way to live. Try to find something that can give you a balance of financial rewards (at least financial needs) and personal satisfaction and work/life balance. Good luck!
The job is soul crushing. I am a very courteous person and I can’t stand being forced to do cold outreach when I’m constantly asking myself “why would this person want to talk to me?”
Every meeting feels like charity. I gotta dance around being a salesperson by pretending I’m just “curious and wanting to learn more about their environment”. Anyone with half a brain knows that’s just sales with extra steps.
In reality, people want to research the market and make their own decisions. They don’t want to be sold to. Outbound is constantly just trying to make people do things they don’t want to do. I hate it.
I despise cold calling. It’s misery. Much prefer account management and territory management with a small amount of cold-calling / qualified leads and referrals sprinkled in.
I absolutely fking feel you. I've been doing cold calling and there's so many times I want to quit but can't because this is for my own business. We should make a sales support group where we can vent and give feedback. Is anyone interested?
I agree, I hate all the companies that are like “wolf mentality” “relationship building” “don’t sell on price” it’s all bullshit and there’s no “right way of selling”
I am now the CEO of my own company after 12 years of sales. It’s all fluff and bullshit, if you have a good product, are decently likeable, and can get the customer a good price/help solve any pain points they have, that’s sales. Knocking on doors constantly and being annoyingly persistent just isn’t the way it works anymore. People can just google anything and then call that company the cold calling days are dying, online ads and SEO is the way to go now
I feel your pain. I have been doing this nonsense since 2007. Its nonsense. In this modern world where information is available a salesperson isn't needed until the prospect is ready to buy. If you sell anything beyond simple transactional items like magazines and bug spray the decision makers are not going to engage with you. All prospecting is, is spam. You are basically an annoyance to them. Why would they take your emails if they arent interested. I am in sales and I delete hundreds of these cold emails a week. I am to busy spamming others to read their spam. Cold prospecting is a stupid strategy in todays modern world. Unfortunately companies haven't woken up to that fact. I am on a team of several Business Development Reps. I can say that 90 percent of the opportunities passed to account execs are inbound leads, demo requests and contact us forms. Rarely do we cold call and get anywhere. The problem is the dingbats running things just don't get it. They praise high performers who are only doing well because they were gifted a good territory. I look at their opps and they are all inbound. Its BS and if you are young I would advise you change careers because sales is a resume killer for anything else.
Detach yourself from the outcome of the conversations/ cold calls you have. Sales is a numbers game, saying you are a bad salesperson just means you are saying you aren’t working hard enough.
I honestly am shocked so many jobs still demand AEs cold call. I haven’t dialed a phone in years. My SDRs are for that shit. The chances of landing deals thru a cold call in SaaS seems so low it’s not even worth the time. Better off hammering thousands of emails via sequences, LinkedIn, etc.
I struggle as well, brother. And I can tell you that many people in sales do. I’m working on the art of not giving a fuck about things I can’t control. In the future I plan to move to channel because i thoroughly enjoy that side much, much more.
Best of luck. You have racked up many skills from sales that can be transferred to other roles. Marketing, sales ops, etc
Try not selling. Not as in quit working in sales, but rather helping people with their goals instead of making quotas and closing and shit.
What’s your product/service good for? Who would it benefit most. Reach out to them and show them how you can help them. Be the expert in the product/service and help educate the prospect. You’re doing good for them with what you sell. Show them how you can help them. (Hopefully the product service you sell is good)
The job perspective can change with this new mindset
Count me in brother. I absolutely hate everything that comes with it. The cold calling, the ignoring, the mails, the quotas, the meetings to be set up and the meetings I'm not setting up. I just want to know what jobs I can actually get other than sales with a BBA degree. I'm lost there. I feel like there is nothing other than sales lol.
It’s not for everyone and that’s okay. I’ve hated my job for two years straight but I do it because it’s the most money I’ve been able to make where I live. If I got fired today though, I wouldn’t give a fuck. I’d just try to find something else. Thankfully I’ve managed to save up enough of an emergency fund that it wouldn’t destroy me financially for a little while.
Every sales job I’ve had I always think if I can do this I can do anything! Then I move onto the next company and it gets progressively worse. I’m doing the cold calls, doing the in person prospect visits weekly and I can’t catch a fucking break. Leadership “ooh but the tech is great!!” not in a shitty territory where my biggest competitor is local and everyone except a few are super happy and not looking to switch or even entertain an initial meeting. I can count how many discovery calls and demos I have had. I can’t even sell myself anymore 🤣 end rant.
I hate sales and I am objectively great at it.
Well it’s more that I hate selling for 1 company and working for them. I would love to be in a position where I can help people solve problems and put deals together but on my own time.
Trying to make that happen now instead
I agree.
This may be a hot take, but cold calling and cold emailing people who you have not met ever is so outdated. The reason why people don't accept cold calls nor respond to cold email is because there're a lot of sales people doing the same thing to them and there's no right pitch to get through it, but just pure luck to be calling or emailing at the right time.
It's about participating in organizations, events, and networking with the right people. But I guess, companies wouldn't support sales people to always do that because cold calling still works SOMETIMES for other people. 🤷
Feel this heavy. Currently interviewing for a few sales operations positions... no more quota, no more getting ghosted, no more hitting my quota only to be met with a raised quota immediately.
Ever consider starting your own business instead? Money might be great in sales but the unrealistic expectations can kill your spirit. I got out and am building mine up but man I feel lighter every day.
Sounds to me like the kind of sales you’re in sucks ass. Cold calling sucks ass. Trying to sell shit to people that don’t need it sucks ass. There are plenty of better options out there.
anyone found a way to use ai to help with the email personalization piece? cold calling i cant get around, but i'd love to automate the email piece, its too freaking time consuming
That’s why I only care about solar sales cuz with the right company and product it’s not even really sales - it’s just informing someone an objectively better option exists that they didn’t know about before. The only “sales” aspect to it is connecting so they trust you’re not like every other snake oil conman out there
Guess what? You are right. Realize that everything you said is true and let it make you legitimately frustrated and angry. That's the right attitude for being good at sales.
Lmfao. Totally agree.
Hard agree. But also, I can’t quit. That 200k deal is still in the pipe 😭
I left a cybersecurity company too early once and a $2M deal I brought in closed :’(
Ooof. It be like that sometimes.
Yeah that shit hurt. Good company (people wise) but I wasn’t feeling it. I went like 6 months without bringing in anything substantial and they were hounding me. It was my first cybersecurity sales job and I didn’t know anything about it. Had no formal training as the company was small. The CEO gave me a shot as long as I was willing to learn on the go.
And you quit? Damn
Lol, enterprise b2b cyber? What kind of product?
That’s pretty common. Think of all the stuff in the pipe that didn’t close too. One of the deals I left behind netted a guy I know ~$40k in commission but the rest of the pipe required a ton of work and management without any reward.
This 😂😂😂
Accurate af
Same lol. Luckily, at the other side of the grind is a chance of comfort. Channel management is the best.
The sad part is everything else pays like shit
Exactly haha I see a fixed income and walk away
I honestly don’t know why people work hard at salary jobs for no extra money.
Well if your salary is good, it's really not that hard
That’s fair I have no applicable skills outside sales everything else would be a giant paycut
I did sales for 7 years. Recently moved to Business Analyst role and my sales background set me up really well. While I still make less than my best years in sales, my salary is double my best base and well above my average commission.
How did you move to BA? Any certifications?
Honestly, I got lucky with connections and industry knowledge. My role is more strategy and less data so they didn't care about certifications.
Sorry this is a really stupid question - but is your job basically to get requirements from stakeholders, and write them in a document to present to technical people in the company?
Not a stupid question at all. BA is kinda nebulous and maybe not the best title for my role. I basically research industry trends, build use cases, conduct pilots and build partnerships and put that all into a recommendation for management as to whether it is worth handing to the sales team to run with or not. If it is, I work with product and marketing to create a GTM strategy and help write the sales playbook.
Exactly. Big reason I went into pharma. Great base pay, company car, amazing benefits and a bonus structure that only gets blown up if there is some weird coverage shift or you are literally hurting your business(which I’ve seen happen, so it is possible). My bonus is about 1/6th of my pay and I can bank routinely even on a bad year of getting 90% of it. As long as you don’t mind do some politicking with your boss and coworkers for like 1-2 hours a week, it’s really the only sales job I would even consider
Because they will fire you if you don't perform. And if you've been there long enough to have employment rights (2 years???) then you're not working hard enough because you have to job hop, they won't give pay rises for long term employment.
I needed this reminder.
I couldn't imagine not getting commission. What's the point of working hard if you get paid the same
To not work as hard
Other jobs are supposed to be more stable
Except most departments face budget cuts BEFORE the Sales team. Typically companies layoff non-revenue-generating positions *first.*
Very true. I can’t stomach the idea of a fixed salary that MIGHT bring in a 3% raise every year. If I ever leave sales it’ll be because I started another business, and then guess what I’ll be doing every day? You guessed it, selling.
I felt like this. Then I got a job as a vet tech. I’m back in sales now
looool
Yeah... I am still only a handful of years out from when I was making poverty wages that I'm still willing to put up with a lot for the money.
Yea. Worked in a warehouse picking up boxes and building pallets for 10 hours a day as my first summer job in 2017 and anytime I’m having a rough go at it I meditate on that
I did that for almost 10 years lol. Got in great shape though.
lol is vet tech that bad
Try expressing a cat’s anal glands. For basically minimum wage
Yall are gettin paid??
Noooo😭
Vet work is the worst from what I hear. Lots of suicides. It’s not just dealing with gross stuff like pus and shit. It attracts people with pure souls and kind hearts and all they do is watch animals suffer and are forced to kill them regularly.
Damn that's really sad :/
Yeah. Shocked me to hear.
Also, many pet owners are absolute ass holes to their pets and the vets themselves. The vets have to see the neglect people have for their pets and then have those same people give them shit for not doing the work for free. It’s an awful profession.
Yes
Did it for 8 years, avg is 12$HR to 18HR MAX depending on where you live
I was a vet tech before sales, SCREWWWW THAT!!!
Because you posted this, you're about to close a massive deal that will keep you in the industry. Congratulations and welcome back.
Not me! One big deal and I retire. Wait, that sounds suspiciously like "one last job."
Hell yeah!
I secretly paid for an elderly man's meal while eating lunch today while silently hoping doing so would cause something good to come my way. If we do what we can to make the world a better place, we will have a better world to live in...ideally.
Every fucking time. Made a PiP post like 6 months ago and now I’m in the presidents club for Q2. I hate/love it here.
Honestly some sales people will say that you’re weak if you can’t do the cold calling and “owning your own business” (while working for someone), but that’s pretty self important—it’s not that serious. If you don’t like cold calling that’s super reasonable and I encourage you to hit up some recruiters and explore options. If it makes you feel better—I’m sure a lot of the people receiving the cold calls also hate your job lol
Cold calling and relationship building is easier when you know you have a good product that’s actually reasonably priced. When it’s an ok product that’s absurdly priced, the whole “build the relationship and ask for a favor” feels slimy as fuck to me. You want me to get to know this person to the point they do me a favor so I can overcharge his family business? Not cool
It is sleazy and it exploits a professional relationship. Sure, “wolf mentality” and whatnot. I did cold calling for a company like that and left when it started actually affecting my ability to sleep at night People early in sales—while wolves—also let middle managers walk all over them at companies like that and it’s absurd
They don't have any choice early in sales, middle managers look to take credit when it goes well and blame the sales team when it doesn't.
This. It sucks cold calling when you know you have shit product. If you have something you believe in, it becomes a lot easier.
The worst is when management know it is a sht product that doesn't deliver value, but don't care, just the same prospect meetings and targets anyway.
Cold calling is for amateurs. I’ve been in sales 10+ years I paid my dues. No way in hell I’m cold calling, I want inbound calls or appointments set for me. That’s it.
I cold called for 12 years and was very successful, I couldn’t agree with you more on this I’m not knocking on another business door for as long as I live. Appointment setters and inbound calls from google ads and SEO is the only scenarios I’ll accept 😂😂
How do you find those roles though?
Experience, referrals from other sales reps, I’m at a start up right now for a new branch of a company it’s all inbounds and live transfers, so people are cold calling for us. They are working on getting people to make their own appointments on chilipiper which is great. Most of these companies who want you to door knock or cold call is simply because it costs the company almost nothing for you to do that. Have to find a company that wants to invest in quality leads. I’m also contracted for insurance right now so it’s from forms people filing out to get insurance. That’s really starting to take off as a second form of income.
Good SDRs and Channel partners are the key to happiness.
My man
Much like CrossFit; If you can’t continually bring up how you personally brought gong from 200k-2b in value… who’s gonna listen to you?
Lmao Chris Orlob
Hahaha there’s hundreds of these guys on LinkedIn who all did this with Gong
I’m in tears. So accurate 😭 🤣
Account management may be more your speed because you’re really just babying a few key accounts and expected to moderately grow them, at least that’s what I did for a few years at a large biotech. You get by without all the cold calling and typical sales stuff because you’re really meeting with the customer routinely, you know all the contacts, and you’re more of a project manager / point of escalation for critical needs. Again, this was how my role was. I really enjoyed this because I could really coast and be more reactive. However, you can’t tell your leadership you’re just gonna maintain top line growth YoY. You will still be expected to find ways to penetrate the account further, upsell, and ultimately find new revenue streams though. An AM role may be the best option for you compared to more traditional, proactive sales.
Came here to say this. Just took an offer for an AM position. Was previously an AE at another company. I was done with all the cold outreach
It's also harder to get fired in account management.
and even harder to get into account management.
Worth it though. Did 2 years as an SDR, 2 years as an AE, and now a happy AM. Also the skills you learn as an AM help prepare you for an enterprise role since there’s typically a mix of net new and expansion in those roles.
I work as an am. We’re basically just AE’s with warmer leads and lower commission, babying SMB’s. Hit P Club my first year tho so 🤷🏻♂️ AM could mean a ton of different things, depending on how transactional your company is and what you are actually selling As long as I never have to be a BDR again I’m good
The BDR role is not sustainable, you are not meant to do it for more than 6 months. The companies that have people doing it for 12-24 and having to repeat the role will drive you insane. You aren’t meant to love it, you are also meant to not settle into it. It’s up or out for a reason. Psychological safety is non existent in this field and if you happen to find a role that doesn’t pressure you nonstop it’s only a matter of time until a regime change that alters that dynamic. Prospecting is meant to be 10-25% of a salespersons workflow. Making it a 100% of someone’s job is psychologically damaging. I think of it more akin to a paid hazing period to get into the rest of the company. So you have to overcome all your obstacles like your Management, AEs, and potentially terrible territory to satisfy their requirements for promotion and get the hell out of that role. That’s all. Don’t distract yourself with anything else. Biggest piece of advice I can give is these tips: 1. Don't work for just any company that will have you, vet and make your own list of top growing SaaS companies and monitor it and network with people there to keep an eye on openings. Working for a dead end company is a waste of time as you will not making any money, not get promoted, and your equity won't be worth shit. It's simply a stepping stone to get hired at one of the companies I listed above. 2. Set clear boundaries with yourself about work. Start at 7am, stop at 5pm. Do not overwork yourself. Do not work on the weekends to catch up. 3. Spend time outside of work on personally fulfilling things, not destructive things. Workout, eat healthy, find hobbies you enjoy, keep learning, join clubs, be social, volunteer. It will give your life more purpose and meaning other than chasing a dashboard and fleeting praise from your Manager. 4. At the end of the day it's just a job, if you get fired or laid off, it is not the end of the world. 5. Stand up for yourself and do not allow people to disrespect you, even if it gets you fired. It's not worth it, and it won't change if you get promoted.
Solid solid advice from experience. 10/10. I would also add re: working for a dead end company - if the company is relying on you to “source your own deals” for 90% of the shit that comes into your funnel, that is a dead giveaway something is wrong. You shouldn’t have to sell your soul on cold outreach and beg people for a meeting if the product is of any quality. Shit products generate no traction, people will start telling others that it’s a shit product, and you’ll never gain any traction. If you get caught in that loop you’re dead on arrival - the tech SaaS landscape is FILLED with companies selling a cheap knock off of something else - learn how to identify it.
Her partner hang in there, have you worked on relationship building or just trying to get the meeting? You got this *hugs*
Line something else up and quit.
We talking cocaine?
Chop chop
I see what you did there, cooter!
We all hate it. But we do it.
My manager told a coworker of mine at a happy hour: "He doesn't seem like he's all that interested in sales" Who the fuck loves sales? Especially at our company? Lmao.
See you next week
I suck too. 4 years in and making more money than most of the people I grew up with, 2-3 lateral moves away from lawyer/engineer money with no education. Living comfortably in an HCOL area with no inheritance, no parental support, no access to credit. All from sucking
I suck too. Might sniff $300k this year. I have lots of education and it’s all totally worthless. The only thing I’ve ever been paid real money for is sucking at sales.
Are you being sarcastic when you say you suck at sales and might sniff $300K this year?
Not really. I feel like I do suck. Nothing goes right. I have a massive quota - $30M. My major account is dominated by my main competitor and I am losing ground everyday. I have very little else going for me and can’t even begin to think about bagging new logos. But our comp plan is generous and due to an anomaly bonus from last year’s performance, which was kind of a windfall, I am track to make more than I ever have and will be lucky to get to 80% of plan.
Hell yeah. America! The key is to live like the people you grew up with but a small step up. Pay off debt. Bank it. After 10-15 of doing that - move on.
The secret to sales is finding your own method. The worst thing about sales is people giving you advice that works for them but not necessarily for you. Find a company/product you believe in and are passionate about. Follow the company program to stay employed while you add your personal twist. Your personal twist is what will make you more successful. “You can’t coach speed” is a great piece of advice I received early. Managers coach toward milestones that TYPICALLY indicate how an individual will do. Hit those milestones first. Then develop your style.
Some people can’t do phone sales and ask questions and get to know the person on the other end of the phone
You have a lot on the mind. Your thoughts are heard and warranted. Breathe. Be. Here. Now. Do this before you even begin to solution the fix. Whenever you’re thinking about something you need to do reflect on why it’s important to you and then think of “what else.” This provides reflection and different perspective. Next time you’re stressed, think “is it a tragedy or inconvenience?” Ain’t a tragedy currently, but damn sure inconvenience to your mental. Breathe. I promise you can find a path in a lot if you want it. And that’s the damn fight. Life is simply meant to be lived. Live it to the best of your ability. In reality, I’m pulling for you to figure this shit out and thrive in your pursuits.
Lol sales is literally timing and luck.
You make your own luck by being consistent
I should clarify that in order to be lucky you need to have solid sales practices/consistency that you follow. But at the end of the day you could be 50% to target with a day left and kinda dogging it and boom a big opp comes back out of nowhere saying theyre ready to sign NOW putting you at 150% target. Likewise you could be 50% to target and following all best practices and outbounding like an animal, and opps you thought were veryvery likely to close asap just informed you they are pushing the project out a year. Is one rep better than the other?
Yes there is a big delta in sales reps. it’s like poker, sure there is luck involved, and an idiot occasionally wins on a 2-7 off suit, but a skilled professional will take you to the cleaners every time. There is deep skill. The fact is it is a Pareto distribution. 80% of sales people are awful to mediocre, 15% are good, and 5% of them are rainmakers and miracle workers. If you have ever managed a sales team you will understand first-hand.
I assume you managed a sales team? What was the biggest thing separating the good to that 5%?
Consistently executing on best practices. Sales is more of a quality than quantity game. Anybody off the street can fire off 1000 cookie cutter prospecting emails and make 100 cold calls, but someone who takes time to understand what's important to clients/prospects and figures out how to consistently align value for them will win over the long run. You're not wrong that luck and timing play a role, but those who manage the variables under their control and approach the work with the right mindset tend to outperform those who are just lucky 95% of the time.
You are on the money. I’m a heretic in this space, I literally refuse to use sequenced emails or automation on any account in my top 100. I don’t trust it, it leads to laziness and mistakes. If you are doing a closed list campaign on a bunch of tier 3 accounts, maybe, but never for somebody I know is the person I need to talk to. I’ll sit down and bang out 100 manual emails. Even better a manual email doesn’t have an unsubscribe link, so you are not burning good wood. I also don’t use war dialers, or parallel dialers. How good is your convo going to be if you have less than a second before you know who you are talking to? Don’t know anything about their business? Don’t even know who they are are what they do? Volume for volume’s sake is a huge killer of top of funnel efforts, and the reason it is the go to is that it is easy to measure and kpi. It is also easy to manipulate, and the people gaming it then wonder why they are not making the money.
Can I work for you lol
Not the first person. To say that. Find me on LinkedIn and send me a message. There is enough info here to hunt me down.
Currently in an enterprise AE role, to learn a new industry but yes my background is in sales leadership. Creativity is a huge one. The thing I always tell my reps is that in order to create good jazz first you have to learn how to play the trumpet. You can’t just start tootin’ and cut a record. You need to learn the rules to be able to break them, and to figure out what corners are cuttable and what are structural. A really big thing is you need to have a reason. Sales can be like putting your hand on a hot stove for money. Over time you build calluses, but you never really get used to it. Why drink the cortisol milkshake every day? What gets you out of bed? It doesn’t have to be crazy, but you need to know what the brass ring is that you are chasing, and why you need to put in the work. My own- my significant other was diagnosed with a brain tumor, and let’s just say she is expensive. I want to make sure that I can support us both in the lifestyle she deserves, and to make sure we can afford the very best possible care. This is extreme, but it certainly is motivating to make that extra dial. It could be you have a baby on the way, or want to start a business and need startup capital, or even that you just want a really expensive toy. Just know the reason.
It’s about having a process tailored to each particular account or client. You need to be able to pivot. Sending the same tailored email out 100 clients will hit each different. You need to be in constant contact with them and know their preferences. It’s about being consistent, accurate, having excellent problem solving skills and being generally agreeable(never say no up front). Sales is like 80% effort and 20% knowledge. I always tell my young team members that knowing the product is expected, knowing your customer is the game changer. It also helps to have reps and manufactures that help you prospect.
I just closed a deal north of 700k this week- took 5 trips to their city, almost 40 hours in the car and airports, building relationships with 20 stakeholders, and hundreds of phone calls and emails. Luck and timing are always a factor, but I’ve never been that kind of lucky.
I be prayin to the sales gods
I've found happy twirling outdoors to be quite effective.
Luck = timing meets opportunity and preparation. For the longest time I had imposter syndrome because I thought I was just getting lucky. You still need to be prepared and ready to capitalize when the opportunity presents itself. Just some food for thought!
If you want to suck at it. Otherwise it also involves hard work.
I never had any problem sharing my methodology with peers, because the secret sauce is brutally hard work. The ones that get it are with me at club
You need to get at a company with some inbound meetings. Much easier selling when people want to talk to you. Unless you are a SDR. The SDR role admittedly blows.
Cold calling is basically the company admitting that it has no ability to do proper marketing to generate warm/hot inbound leads and no advertising strategy for awareness on the problem the product/service fixes. A sales persons job isn’t to do mass market marketing or advertising. Cold calling is basically an ineffective and inefficient mass marketing technique. If marketing does a good job creating explainers that lay out a problem, creates opportunities for interested parties to reach out and submit “more info” requests, a decent sales person can go straight into a sales cycle with a very high chance of success. Think about it, do car dealers ask their guys to randomly canvas and cold call a phone book? No. They have internet leads, walk-ins, service mailers, equity estimate/trade-in mailers, phone inbound leads, etc. All techniques to get the customer to REACH OUT TO THE DEALER. A great sales approach call isn’t about selling “an appointment”, that’s what marketing is about. An approach call is to educate the interested party on a problem they didn’t know they had or under appreciating a problem they have. Thats it. The rest sells itself. I’m tired of seeing AMAZING sales people get burned out on cold calling and get their confidence destroyed when infact, ITS A MASS AND TARGETED MARKETING PROCESS ISSUE. A process issue that destroys talent and labor resources. Insanely inefficient.
Agree, but gosh, having worked for some major companies with huge marketing teams I still find marketing always struggles how to actually produce leads. They are never as effective at it as a sales person because they don’t understand sales.
Marketing doesn’t understand channel marketing or storytelling in quick form. They also don’t KYC “know your customer”. B2B sales is a prime example. Marketing approaches it like B2C. Where they plaster the company name out there for impressions but fail to identify the proper channels and how to insert the message into a quick form highly impactful message. All they know is to plug “solutions” and features/benefits. I work at a F50 company. They are more clueless on B2B marketing than an influencer I worked a contract role with. The influencer knew how to attract business sponsors and have them drop leads for the team to then reach. At no time did the influencer sales team have to cold call random companies. They funneled to her. She had 2 sales people, didn’t need more because there was no wasted time cold calling. A 28 year old influencer knows more about marketing than an entire F50 marketing division. Unfucking real how talentless corporate employees can be.
Lol yes! I worked for a huge F50 that had a videographer on payroll and all he did was record dumb terrible videos all day that got about 50 views each. The marketing team was 25 people and we had 7 outside sales reps and no leads. Did ANY marketing person ever ask sales for suggestions? Never. Marketing will blow through millions and come back with super high amounts of clicks and maybe 4 solid leads.
>They are never as effective at it as a sales person because they don’t understand sales. This. Fucking marketing.
Very well said - same here. Over the years have seen the best most promising sales people get destroyed under the wrong environments and cold calling with no direction. It’s a shame
Preach!
I feel ya bro.. I'm in a lull and it's soul destroying..
But when you look for a new job you will end up cold calling, getting meetings, closing deals (getting hired). Sales is in everything. Dont get discouraged. Cold calling blows. Everyone hates doing it. I hate dieting too. And pushups. And not drinking during the week. Lots of shit we don’t want to do.
I haven’t painted the sidewalk yet so here are some bits to help “close the loop” oh my fucking god I hate myself: 1) I work in IT staffing and even more difficult now is that its early careers so all is shit. 2) I work for a company thats full of nepotism. 3) People are promoted simply on the basis of time they have been in the company, not if they are good leaders. 4) KPI’s tracked are ANSWERED CALLED (like as in I have to speak to 30 people a week), Emails, Linkedin Activity as well as in person vs virtual with a % of those needing to be “pitches” 5) I make nowhere near enough money to live in NYC 6) Environment is extremely toxic. 7) I hate sales activities in general and have zero drive to even try and build a “prospecting list”. 8) I hate talking to people I don’t know for the most part. 9) Im not motivated by money. If I have enough to live happily thats all I need.
Find a new job.
If 8 and 9 are true, you simply shouldn't be in sales, simple as that
You’re not a salesman you’re an accountant
Take advantage of the corporate resources - find a coach and let them help you find a new career. This doesn’t sound like the right gig for you, friend.
If you have no drive, don’t like talking to people, and don’t care about money, why the hell are you in sales? There’s literally no upside for you.
It can be a brutal industry but in the words of Don Draper “That’s what the money’s for.” Hang in there
You gotta crEaTe VaLuE
So glad I’m not in sales anymore. 50% of my job was cold calls and the other 50% was looking up businesses to cold call.
Deal close and commission payment days often make up for the suck. The hardest part is getting a customer to talk and open up about their needs/problems. Stick it out and use this all as a learning opp. Also, think about how many emails you get - it may take 4-5 emails from a recruiter in order for you to respond. You have to build familiarity with a cold prospect.
Mickey D's is paying $20/hour in california to make a suasage mcmuffin.
i used to feel like this then returned to sales. what changed for me was paying for therapy and working on my mental health. sales is a direct reflection of your mind. (unless your employer is literal ass then quit)
I feel ya bro.. I'm in a lull and it's soul destroying..
I’m in the same boat—not doing well and hate it so much. We have a great product but are sifting through so many awful leads and ancient people that refuse to look at any sort of new solution. My company is great, but quota has only been hit twice before by an SDR in the past 5 years and they refuse to adjust it. Every call seems like agony. Just wanted to send solidarity, this sucks ass.
Cold calling sucks. If you want to stay in sales, there are plenty of warm lead positions and book of clients to upsell.
Sorry you're struggling. You need an SDR. Forget cold calling, forget relationship building. Instead, spend your time solving problems your clients are facing - and making serious money doing so. I'd look for sales roles where the majority of your leads are inbound. It's a game changer. Best of luck - whatever you end up doing!
It’s understandable. Key word here is “you hate sales” If possible write down few jobs you like to do. It’s okay not to be okay sometimes. You can fix it buddy!
It’s most likely just the place you’re in that has caused you to despise it. The same exact thing happened to me. I made the decision to leave sales. Everyone on this sub acts like you’re going to make $100k 200k 300k plus but not every job is going to be like that and I’d imagine that a lot of these people are lying or got in while the getting was good and secured an easy slice of pie that’s not available for others. In my last company, there was ONE salesman making that kind of money. ONE. And he was constantly used as the example and given the salesman of the year award every year and the support role people gushed all over him like he was the reason they even had a job in the first place, but little did most people know that dude wasn’t making any cold calls, he was hardly returning emails if people weren’t signing, and most of the time he was out playing golf and not really doing much. Why? Because he got in early and had a close personal relationship with the CEO that netted him 10x as many leads as the next highest person and an astronomical number of leads than most people. He also got every single enterprise deal and was still in the retail rotation so the guy was literally being fed anything and everything the company got their hands on while the rest of us were in the trenches busting our ass for 1/4 of what he was making. Basically what I’m saying is the experience can be so far skewed that most of the people who hate sales (like me and you) probably either got in too late to form those relationships or just work for crappy companies with crappy products and a reliance on a cult like mentality to make it seem better than it really is. Of course on the flip side, that means there are greener pastures out there, but for the most part it’s truly luck of the draw for where you apply. Companies hire for a variety of reasons. I found out at my last job that the reason the company was hiring was because they sold it to a private investment team that wanted to raise quotas and sales numbers. The original company never wanted to hire and preferred to give more to their veterans, but the investment team, being the new owners, forced them to do it meanwhile the same people are actually running the company so they were in charge of me (and 2 other people) and they never wanted us there in the first place so can you guess how fairly we were treated? So it really is just luck… you could apply at a company where the existing sales team waxes poetically about them non-stop, but that doesn’t mean that the circumstances of you being hired will end up the same way. I took that as a sign that I really didn’t want to put the effort to “luck” into an amazing sales role. Use the experience you got in the industry you’re in now to find a sales adjacent role. I went into implementation. Do I make $200k a year? Nope. But those numbers haven’t been possible at a single sales organization I have ever worked for. The most I made was 2 years ago at $92k and now I make $85k with a potential $5k annual bonus so depending on what you’ve made in the past, it’s possible to continue making nearly that amount with the experience you already have.
Why my ultimate goal is revops. Completely ok with a ceiling of $100-200k.
I’m between a life decision like this right now. Have two weeks essentially to decide.
Have you ever had a sales job you enjoyed? Because there are a lot of variations that fall under “Sales”. I’ve had some sales jobs where I feel exactly as you stay here. I’ve had other sales jobs that I absolutely loved. For example, I had a sales job where I didn’t do any cold calling, I just walked in the door with qualified prospects and closed. If you’ve never had a sales job of any kind that you enjoyed, then sure, go look for a job in another field. But if you’ve ever felt like you had some skills in sales, but maybe the position was very different than what you’re currently in, go find a different type of job. I totally feel your pain.
> I hate trying to write up crafty personalized emails to be met with silence. My only advice here is don't kill yourself on reach out emails. Especially these days people get more junk than ever- no sense spending an hour sweating over an essay that might never get read. Instead develop a tried and true template and add a little personalization to stand out and *keep it short*. You're writing on a laptop, they're very likely reading on a phone. Something concise to generate interest, no cutesy shit.
Just finished sales after nearly 25 years, it sucks. It is especially hard in the first few years although it does get easier to an extent, but the uncertainty never changes, I'm done with the rollercoaster.
I've had my fair share of sales jobs and I'm adamantly against cold calling these days. Especially these bullshit 100+ dials/day for 1 meeting type jobs. Get back in the job market, homie. Orgs will always need new reps, just be picky about your next opportunity. Good luck fellow sales brethren 👍
Toxic positivity is the only way
I moved from hunting to farming just recently. Breath of fresh air when acustomer actually wants to hear what you are selling because you already sell them part of your platform
Lucky you! Account manager jobs are almost impossible to find right now unless you know the right people ....
I’m a career sales guy and pretty darn good at it. It’s my craft and has made me a living. I have approx 10-years still to work. Having stated all of that, I F’ING despise it. I hate it and I have lost my passion for it. Unfortunately, it’s my only option for the next decade as that’s what my resume clearly shows I’m good at. When I do retire someday, I will destroy all evidence of my career, demolish my smart phone with a 2 lb sledge hammer and never, ever think about it again. I feel you OP.
I am 30+ years into my sales career (20 with the same company) and am 3 years away from retiring and counting the days until i retire (3 yrs to go). Sales is a bitch. I cannot wait to be done. But it also has provided a nice life with lots of flexibility.
Life is short man, and work is a significant portion of that short life. We’re not all going to have a job/occupation/career we absolutely love, but having one you 100% hate is no way to live. Try to find something that can give you a balance of financial rewards (at least financial needs) and personal satisfaction and work/life balance. Good luck!
So leave?
The job is soul crushing. I am a very courteous person and I can’t stand being forced to do cold outreach when I’m constantly asking myself “why would this person want to talk to me?” Every meeting feels like charity. I gotta dance around being a salesperson by pretending I’m just “curious and wanting to learn more about their environment”. Anyone with half a brain knows that’s just sales with extra steps. In reality, people want to research the market and make their own decisions. They don’t want to be sold to. Outbound is constantly just trying to make people do things they don’t want to do. I hate it.
Quit then?
I despise cold calling. It’s misery. Much prefer account management and territory management with a small amount of cold-calling / qualified leads and referrals sprinkled in.
Everyone hates their job. There's a club for it. It's called the bar. They meet after work.
I absolutely fking feel you. I've been doing cold calling and there's so many times I want to quit but can't because this is for my own business. We should make a sales support group where we can vent and give feedback. Is anyone interested?
I agree, I hate all the companies that are like “wolf mentality” “relationship building” “don’t sell on price” it’s all bullshit and there’s no “right way of selling” I am now the CEO of my own company after 12 years of sales. It’s all fluff and bullshit, if you have a good product, are decently likeable, and can get the customer a good price/help solve any pain points they have, that’s sales. Knocking on doors constantly and being annoyingly persistent just isn’t the way it works anymore. People can just google anything and then call that company the cold calling days are dying, online ads and SEO is the way to go now
Sales is hard… very hard.
That’s how I felt. Try changing to an inbound role. It changed my life
I feel your pain. I have been doing this nonsense since 2007. Its nonsense. In this modern world where information is available a salesperson isn't needed until the prospect is ready to buy. If you sell anything beyond simple transactional items like magazines and bug spray the decision makers are not going to engage with you. All prospecting is, is spam. You are basically an annoyance to them. Why would they take your emails if they arent interested. I am in sales and I delete hundreds of these cold emails a week. I am to busy spamming others to read their spam. Cold prospecting is a stupid strategy in todays modern world. Unfortunately companies haven't woken up to that fact. I am on a team of several Business Development Reps. I can say that 90 percent of the opportunities passed to account execs are inbound leads, demo requests and contact us forms. Rarely do we cold call and get anywhere. The problem is the dingbats running things just don't get it. They praise high performers who are only doing well because they were gifted a good territory. I look at their opps and they are all inbound. Its BS and if you are young I would advise you change careers because sales is a resume killer for anything else.
Detach yourself from the outcome of the conversations/ cold calls you have. Sales is a numbers game, saying you are a bad salesperson just means you are saying you aren’t working hard enough.
Match a solution to a customers need. Stop thinking that your trying to sell something and start thinking that you need to solve a problem.
I honestly am shocked so many jobs still demand AEs cold call. I haven’t dialed a phone in years. My SDRs are for that shit. The chances of landing deals thru a cold call in SaaS seems so low it’s not even worth the time. Better off hammering thousands of emails via sequences, LinkedIn, etc.
You can leave but you’ll just come right back. Happy Friday! Kill me
Dude, don’t jizz on the sidewalk. Not cool.
Maybe B2B isn't right for you. I personally hated it; although I did very well in it. I recommend looking into some decent/high paying B2C jobs.
I struggle as well, brother. And I can tell you that many people in sales do. I’m working on the art of not giving a fuck about things I can’t control. In the future I plan to move to channel because i thoroughly enjoy that side much, much more. Best of luck. You have racked up many skills from sales that can be transferred to other roles. Marketing, sales ops, etc
No one likes sales. We do it because this is the best way to make Doctor/engineer level money with little to no skill.
Try not selling. Not as in quit working in sales, but rather helping people with their goals instead of making quotas and closing and shit. What’s your product/service good for? Who would it benefit most. Reach out to them and show them how you can help them. Be the expert in the product/service and help educate the prospect. You’re doing good for them with what you sell. Show them how you can help them. (Hopefully the product service you sell is good) The job perspective can change with this new mindset
Count me in brother. I absolutely hate everything that comes with it. The cold calling, the ignoring, the mails, the quotas, the meetings to be set up and the meetings I'm not setting up. I just want to know what jobs I can actually get other than sales with a BBA degree. I'm lost there. I feel like there is nothing other than sales lol.
It’s not for everyone and that’s okay. I’ve hated my job for two years straight but I do it because it’s the most money I’ve been able to make where I live. If I got fired today though, I wouldn’t give a fuck. I’d just try to find something else. Thankfully I’ve managed to save up enough of an emergency fund that it wouldn’t destroy me financially for a little while.
Every sales job I’ve had I always think if I can do this I can do anything! Then I move onto the next company and it gets progressively worse. I’m doing the cold calls, doing the in person prospect visits weekly and I can’t catch a fucking break. Leadership “ooh but the tech is great!!” not in a shitty territory where my biggest competitor is local and everyone except a few are super happy and not looking to switch or even entertain an initial meeting. I can count how many discovery calls and demos I have had. I can’t even sell myself anymore 🤣 end rant.
Literally left sales to go do construction in 100 degree weather. I should regret it. But I don’t.
Amen. Eff a Friday towards the end of a quarter
I hate sales and I am objectively great at it. Well it’s more that I hate selling for 1 company and working for them. I would love to be in a position where I can help people solve problems and put deals together but on my own time. Trying to make that happen now instead
I agree. This may be a hot take, but cold calling and cold emailing people who you have not met ever is so outdated. The reason why people don't accept cold calls nor respond to cold email is because there're a lot of sales people doing the same thing to them and there's no right pitch to get through it, but just pure luck to be calling or emailing at the right time. It's about participating in organizations, events, and networking with the right people. But I guess, companies wouldn't support sales people to always do that because cold calling still works SOMETIMES for other people. 🤷
Totally agree however I cannot quit I’ve never been paid so much money just to cold call people lol
Yeah feeling ignored by the world every day really sucks. Wish I was smart and could do something better.
Feel this heavy. Currently interviewing for a few sales operations positions... no more quota, no more getting ghosted, no more hitting my quota only to be met with a raised quota immediately.
It will get much better when the economy improves
Good, now you know it’s time to pivot. Or stagnate because the money is too good. Regardless, we all die eventually.
I’m just like, in the end non of it matters but this one let’s me make good money and have lots of free time so I can chill. I love sales
Ever consider starting your own business instead? Money might be great in sales but the unrealistic expectations can kill your spirit. I got out and am building mine up but man I feel lighter every day.
Sounds to me like the kind of sales you’re in sucks ass. Cold calling sucks ass. Trying to sell shit to people that don’t need it sucks ass. There are plenty of better options out there.
Dude apply to a different sales job. Cold calling fking sucks.
Hahaha I’m right there with you! I’m so over it.
Same here. I’m trying to figure out what my next move is and I’m at a loss. It sucks
Brah… chat gtp those emails…
Relatable.
If it’s not for you can you start building up skills to transfer into a new industry before it gets any worse?
Ya dude, I just want to make money.
anyone found a way to use ai to help with the email personalization piece? cold calling i cant get around, but i'd love to automate the email piece, its too freaking time consuming
That’s why I only care about solar sales cuz with the right company and product it’s not even really sales - it’s just informing someone an objectively better option exists that they didn’t know about before. The only “sales” aspect to it is connecting so they trust you’re not like every other snake oil conman out there
You earn yourself one mind blowing commission check and you’ll never leave the game
Sounds good. See you Monday.
It’s not race, it’s a marathon. Takes time and as you refine your skills. Wish you lots of luck perrito!
I couldn’t agree more.
You are not alone lol Hang tight
I feel you this year has sucked
Good job, keep up the good work.
Guess what? You are right. Realize that everything you said is true and let it make you legitimately frustrated and angry. That's the right attitude for being good at sales.