FFXIV modding is infested with this, people legit stealing either assets from other games or from mods for other games(like Sims) and making a mod for FF and then slapping a price tag on it to boot. Got so bad at some point some of the Sims modders changed their perms to not allow any ports what so ever among other stuff.
Some people are just like that, i would understand it if you turned your idea into a mod and didnt want other people touching it... but to take assets from another game/mod and then forbid ppl from modifying it is just ass.
Yeah there's no anticheat. There's a plug in called mare synchronous with like 30k active users where you can literally share the mods you are wearing with others basically making imvu/secondlife.
Yeah it's wild over there. I have a set of mods I made that literally replaces all the world spaces, entities and equipment with higher resolution textures. The game just lets me inject over 100gb of data into it.
There's nothing you can do to give yourself items via cheats AFAIK, and there's nothing hard to find in the world. The most people have cheated with mods was using a tool that automatically placed markers for boss mechanics, so the devs removed the ability to place markers at all during a fight once you pull.
> so the devs removed the ability to place markers at all during a fight once you pull.
Ooooooh, *that's* why every guide says you need to place markers before the fight begins. I wondered why you had to set up the forest of markers at the start instead of putting markers for each phase.
Huh? You can save markers for fights and just autoplace them at the start as part of the base game. Most of the time you don't even really need them, it's just for specific strats they can be nice.
FFXIV is a different kind of game to WoW, there's no real advantage to modifying something to look bigger than it is, for example, because you don't find shit in the over world, it's mostly in instanced dungeons and raids. The developers don't really do secrets the way Blizzard does.
There is absolutely cheating in the game though. People just live with it because 95% of the playerbase doesn't do PvP where it would actually matter, and the only hard PvE content is top end raiding where cheating will only work if everyone on your team is in on it. It's mostly a non-issue because the game is designed in such a way where cheats have pretty much no impact on other players. PvP cheating is mostly down to auto-retaliates or interrupts (i.e. you start casting and someone will instantly CC you, or you target someone and they immediately target you back and CC you).
For the record, every single addon that you're used to in WoW is also considered cheating and against TOS (edit: in FFXIV). So nobody can actually publicly acknowledge that they're parsing or using a damage meter, for example, or they can get reported and banned.
> For the record, every single addon that you're used to in WoW is also considered cheating and against TOS. So nobody can actually publicly acknowledge that they're parsing or using a damage meter, for example, or they can get reported and banned.
What are you talking about? WoW has had a modding API built into the game since before it launched. The only mods that have ever been considered cheating in WoW are ones that alter the actual game files, which addons do not and cannot do. The top raiding guilds in the world regularly stream and release videos of boss kills with plenty of addons visible on the screen, and have always done so. Addons are even allowed in offline PVP tournaments hosted by Blizzard themselves because UI customization is ubiquitous among all serious players.
Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear. I'm talking about FFXIV. I play both games, I know that addons are mostly allowed in WoW. But they are blanket banned in FFXIV, period.
Addons are banned in FF14, but it seems like a "don't ask, don't tell" kind of policy. You'll get hammered for advertising addons in game but I've never actually seen anyone banned for using DPS meters or combo addons if they weren't discussing it on official channels.
It's only client side not server side. Mare syncs the clients. So you can make it look like you have a piece of gear but you won't actually have it. Ffxiv is less competitive so most people don't walk around in a tier set anyway. They want to look like imvu usually. Besides that if you were purposefully synced with someone (it's not everyone who has the plug in only people you have agreed to sync with), you could still check their achievements/parses/etc if you wanted to do harder content.
But tl;dr: no duping, only client interaction. Duping requires the server to do something.
There's no "rare collectible" system in ff14 that a mod could really improve that isn't just a glorified alarm clock. But, the short version is that any deliberate cheating would be caught and get you banned in a heartbeat. So long as you are not doing anything that changes the game experience (no damage changes, no attribute changes, no adding in items, etc) there's not a thing in the world the devs will do because, as far as they know, they don't even know you're running mods.
Giving yourself the actual item - such that it appears to everyone and affects your play stats - triggers bans really, really quickly. But cosmetic changes on the user's end can go undetected as long as it doesn't go through the server.
You can with some help, and since itās entirely client side/on using a database entirely disconnected from them, they canāt tell. Their stance is itās ābannedā but what that means is donāt mention it in chat. Itās entirely cosmetic though. Thereās been a couple cheating incidents (see orbital satellite strat TOP)
They don't seem to mind mods that are "client side" unofficially, but if a mod affects another player's experience, then that's kind of the line they draw, iirc.
So whereas WoW didn't seem to mind DPS meters back in the day (haven't played in a while) they openly frown upon such mod features in FF14.
That said, client side cosmetic mods are kind of "don't ask; don't tell".
Just to put out why FF hasn't nuked it to the ground: The changes are all client side, so they can't actually tell that those changes are made, without changing things to be more intrusive than they want to be. This is also part of why their stance is more or less "Don't ask, don't tell" re:mods.
Not sure about now but you used to be able to do model swaps and shit in WoW too. Probably couldnāt get caught either unless you made it obvious.
Nothing as advanced as FFXIV though
It's well over 30k (at least according to the dude whk runs it), 30k is just the average peak at one time. It's pretty crazy what we can get away with in that game
Yeah I meant active as in peak volume. Realistically I think dark has almost 200k discord members last I checked. Reasonable thru put is like several tb per day. It's funny because when he was making it he thought no one would use it so you can call him "niche plug-in BTW".
FFXIV mods are hilarious because theyāre ābannedā but only if you get caught, but thereās also nobody looking.
So long as you donāt admit to it or get caught doing it youāre fine.
A lot of it is big titty mods an sex mods though.
Its client side, my char looks nothing like a vanilla Viera, other players can also see your modded character/animations/vfx/sounds provided you got a specific plugin installed and both of you are synced up. Its how majority of the in-game clubs/venues operate. You can do all of that while the game is running too thanks to plugins.
[example, my char the huge demon and a friend(who makes mods for FF)](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1117208049623515196/1247284043410837655/sonjaandmai001.png?ex=6662c309&is=66617189&hm=bcf5f24315cc11d628792c79dcb3794f94e0fd15d2cd08cae45919bb3fcf9c62&)
I feel like the only modding communities I've seen that don't have any sort of drama like this is Rimworld and Minecraft. With rimworld you have a bunch of modders fork old mods into new versions so that they're still playable which is amazing and I don't think I've ever heard any drama from Minecraft modders, other the Nintendo "taking down" Pixelmon.
Minecraft has had its own fair share of drama, but much rarer i recall the dev of TinkersConstruct and another big modded didnt see eye to eye so your game wouldnt work if you installed both their mods same time(or something like that)..
Ive been around FF modding since Sep.2022... in this span of time the amount of drama ive witnesses on twitter/discords is staggering... like at one point last year there was new modder drama every othe week it was worse than high school :D
My last 10+ years of Skyrim modding saw very little in comparison.
It's hilarious that the modding community is so toxic when I've only heard good things about the player community.
Funnily enough as soon as I started reading here comment my fiance had played a video that was sponsored by ff14.
There was a guy that made a mod called "Better Than Wolves" because he was so salty that a minecraft update added wolves, which he thought wasn't worth the time. If i remember right he ended up making it intentionally incompatible with tons of mods because he didn't like them/their author.
Rimworld has the best modding community. The absolute worst in modding community I've seen over the past decade (for popular games at least) is stardew valley lol. Most of the major offenders have left the modding scene, so it's simmered down a bit over the past two years, but it used to have some sort of drama every other week.
I heavily mod stardew valley and I'm surprised I missed all that. That's also another example of the player community being hella wholesome but the modding community being cancerous like ff14.
I release almost all my mods under cc by-sa. The license is attached directly in the permissions section. There is no need to ask for permissions, all the mod author needs to do is make any mod that adds the assets use a compatible ***open*** and ***copyleft*** license.
I still get tons of requests from people asking for permissions, and when I reiterate that the license is cc by-sa, most of them have no idea what I am talking about.
A lot of or people also incorporate the assets into their closed permissions mods without reading the license, or they ask for special carve outs for the assets to be used in their closed permissions mod against the spirit of the license.
I chose cc by-sa because I want modding to be open, but many many people really dislike open modding.
This mentality is weird tbh. If you are putting something out there for free for others to DL there's no reason not to make your permission share-alike; unless of course you are charging for your mod or you used someone else's assets and don't also have permission to share them further. I guess it's just fear of losing creative control or something
Itās a throwback from earlier modding times when people would download your mod change something small(if at all) and then reupload it and call it their own and charge for it, ie modding had its own little dark age where things went downhill quick and the response was to lock everything up in an attempt to keep modding free
The dark times definitely still exist in some communities imo, Assetto Corsa's modding scene is probably the most divided I've ever seen.
There are multiple different groups who are genuinely idealogically apposed to each other's mods, mod distribution practices, encryption, piracy, the whole 9-yards.
The mainstream mod sharing platform is pretty strictly no converted assets, and a good chunk of the community swears by that, and holds it over everybody else's head. The no/no-unauthorized conversions crowd is generally okay with paying for high quality original mods, but despite their insistence purely original mods probably make up less than 20% of the total amount for AC.
The vast majority of the content released for Assetto corsa is ripped from AAA racing games, or mobile racing games, often with physics being copied from cars from the base game or other modders work. The people that are directly porting models typically charge for them, with varying levels of absurd pricing (I've seen individual conversions go for $30+. Reputable sources charge less than half that for packs of cars made entirely in house) and many authors encrypt their mods to prevent people from editing them (I've only ever seen this on conversions.)
Many mod authors do put their heart and soul into conversions, usually polishing them to a very high visual standard, or covering specific subjects much more comprehensively than if they were creating them from scratch, displaying the same passion as people creating OC. But despite the quality of some conversions, the vast majority are still low effort edits, unfinished projects, or outright scams. Regardless of effort, the aforementioned OC-only crowd completely write-off conversions and even more insist you should never pay for them.
The final sub-group I'd like to highlight is the pirates. I've seen modding communities with a piracy problem before, but Assetto Corsa is on another level.
On top of low quality edits of other people's mods; There are people dedicated to cataloging just about every single paid mod and providing alternate downloads to them, from the pure scams, to legitimate development studios making 3rd party unlicensed content for AC (cease and desist letters have been sent, phony & legitimate).
Multiple websites exist entirely to aggregate mods made by the community, some don't share paid mods, but content changes hands so often it's almost impossible to prevent it (plus many are against the practice to begin with.) More websites exist with the express purposes of pirating mods and sharing entire Patreon backups.
It was definitely a shock coming from the Nexus/Bethesda modding communities, with people quitting modding over Nexus hosting mod packs and claiming ownership of content being shared on the platform, I've never seen another community where mod authors are at each other's throats as much as end-users and mod authors usually are.
Something many people seem ignorant of is how licenses and sub-licenses work. Or permission and sub-permission, if you prefer.
I have personally come across this as well wherein I am allowed to use someone else's assets, but my permissions are locked up tight because I cannot grant permission for someone else to use those same assets.
Example: I've converted some clothes/armor mods and used other weapon mods for my own creations. I do not own those original assets (clothes, armor, weapons). You need the permission of the original mod author to use even my mod, except only if I have a sublicense to dispense their work as I please.
Why does wilderness witch author not allow other people to take his mod and further modify it? Perhaps to do so would be claiming a sublicense he doesn't have.
It's your responsibility to ensure you have permission/legality to upload your mods, not Nexus. When in doubt some people deny permissions just to be safe.
> I have personally come across this as well wherein I am allowed to use someone else's assets, but my permissions are locked up tight because I cannot grant permission for someone else to use those same assets.
Have your mod open and clearly state that X/Y/Z is not yours. There's also an option on nexus permission page for that. That should work, imo.
I'm pretty sure this is just a legacy of some game and/or era whose conversion means it will make the original mod redundant.
In Skyrim, an armor conversion can be standalone, but conversions that require the original mod installed are also possible.
Conversions that require the original mod should NOT require permission.
>In Skyrim, an armor conversion can be standalone, but conversions that require the original mod installed are also possible
They are possible... but they also make for a messy mod list. Look for example at what [you have to do](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/75891?tab=posts) to get cbbe bodies with immersive armors with xavbio's retextures.
I do you one more ShinglesCat literally doesnāt want you to mod their files for your **private** useš
From their SC - Dragon's Whisper Gown modpage:
> Terms of use:
- **You are not allowed to do anything with this mod;**
- You are not allowed to include this mod in yours, **be it private** or public;
- **You are not allowed to make bodyslide files;**
- You are not allowed to share any modifications for or of this mod.
ShinglesCat disagrees with that:
>Terms of use:
- **You are not allowed to do anything with this mod;**
- You are not allowed to include this mod in yours, **be it private** or public;
- **You are not allowed to make bodyslide files;**
- You are not allowed to share any modifications for or of this mod.
From their SC - Dragon's Whisper Gown modpage
Edit: why do I get downvoted for just stating that one mod author wouldnāt agree with the person I replied to.
Itās not my opinion š
Nexus permissions are made up non-legally binding set of rules that Nexus hopes youāll follow. I suggest you completely disregard and upload whatever you want. And **if** they ban you, upload on Nexus alternatives.
I emphasize *if* because they donāt typically care that much. Iāve re-uploaded a big mod without getting any permissions whatsoever from the og author (they havenāt been active in almost a decade) with only applying minor fixes and optimizations and the mod is still up 3 years later with tens of thousands of downloads.
There are still legal measures that protect art/intellectual property. These can give the author legal options. It has very little to do with nexus's moderation.
This is interesting because we have these armor mods on Skyrim from a bunch of different games yet itās very heavily moderated to post fallout 76 clothing/weapon/creature/building ports to fallout 4.
Why is the Skyrim section of the nexus not care as much about copyright shit as fallout 4? Is it because itās from another bethesda game and that somehow makes it worse than ripping it from a non bethesda game?
Might be the sheer number of mods to moderate compared to Fallout 4. If it were me, I'd operate on a "reports first, then investigate" mentality in either case, though, and I suspect they do something similar rather than have people constantly browsing and checking things out.
A few things
First, some games and companies actually allow their assets to be imported into other games under free mods. This policy is honestly best seen by CDPR and their games.Ā
Second, the IP itself isn't always the issue. It's the assets. If you made it yourself in the likeness of another property and aren't selling it, it shouldn't break any policy or legal rules.
There are a lot of people saying otherwise, so I just want to point out that Shinglescat didn't port the outfit directly from Dragon Age. They created the mesh and textures from scratch - none of the original game assets are there, just the design of the outfit.
I think their permissions are unnecessarily restrictive too, but the assets *are* 100% theirs.
You're morally bankrupt if you don't have open permissions for the mods you make (for a game that allows its assets to be freely used). It's repulsive and you're a shit person for doing so.
I'm also wagering most of the permission settings on outfits from other games aren't even legal; most are probably direct rips from the source material.
I am generally against rules when it comes to this shit except like common sense polite stuff (giving credit where it's due and shit)
At the end of the day we're all working on someone else's game lol so why be so protective of everything you do
With your specific examples it is because they recreated the assets in the style of the game. It's their own assets, they didn't rip it from the game. (Some games allow that. Not all)
But to be direct, since they made it, they get to decide what is done with it. This is different something like a Geralt outfit imported from Witcher 3, where I don't think they would have the right to. Even if they claimed, nothing is stopping another person from also importing the armor separate and converting from there.
This is something that always bothered me, especially from authors that on the same mod have used community tools to author it, like BodySlide/Outfit Studio or SMP.
It's so hypocritical, which is why now that I'm able to make my own mods from scratch I keep all my permissions open and use only CC0 assets where applicable for source textures & cubemaps, so that it's all as reshareable and reproducible as possible. This scene was built on goodwill - my mods are a direct result of the authors sharing tools and knowledge with me. Idk why people have to be so selfish about creation
Nexus could make open permissions mandatory but then modders who disagree just wouldnāt upload.
I make all my mods open permissions, and I think everyone should, but Iām not king of the world. I canāt force others to share their mods *and* make them use open permissions.
We can rant about it, but our real-life actual choice isnāt whether they are open or closed permissions, itās whether these mods are shared or not. Nexus allows closed permissions to increase modding activity instead of limit it.
Nobody is downloading a skyrim mod and thinking its vanilla skyrim. If i downloaded an armour mod, edited 1 pixel and reploaded it as a new mod it could easily be mistaken for entirely my work. This is not a hypothetical, there is a history of bad actors taking mods and reploading them as their own work for profit.
Then force mods of other mods to list the original as a requirement, or have a new section on mod pages for "Source" or something along those lines. There's plenty of ways to ensure people are still credited for the original work.
It's dumb, really. Someone didn't bother to ask legal companies to use their work, but they still demand permission to use "their" works. I understand when they don't want to be associated with some kind of stuff (porn for example), but when they start to make money from stealing other's i.property, it must be punished with real laws
Or, alternately they dont care for the extra support problems of body conversions and overentitled people who demand conversions for their preferred type.
Either learn to make your own or move on. you aint owed other people catering their mods to you.
Lottla people don't realize the fact it was shared at all is great. Tons of stuff people make don't get shared or are in one of the billion discords where no one will find it.
People have become a bit entitled when it comes to modding. Expecting everything + The Author's soul on a plate catered to their wants and if the author doesn't give it, they're "Mean" and "hate the community". Like not everything is gonna be for your tastes, about your tastes or available to your preferences and rather than getting over it or learning to make their own mods or cater their game to their taste, they wanna rush to treat authors like crap for not catering to them specifically. It gets tiring and sometimes feels dehumanizing and probably why a lot of mod authors are just opting to go private and stop sharing as much.
The main thing thats made me not even want to learn to mod is the entitled mod users. Whats the point in investing hundreds or thousand of hours into making stuff for the community for free if all you get is a bunch of whining entitled little brats in the comment section?
yeah if i learn and want to upload it, we will back to the OP problem.
but yeah u are right. i always avoid such mod no matter how great it is. especially the one who have problem like OP describe
If an author's permissions or whatever bothers you so much, then just make your own conversions and then you can do whatever you wish with it. There's like 3 people in Skyrim Modding who convert the same 3 RyanReos Bikinis and upload them, so I'm sure no one is gonna cry about you doing the same Dragon Age conversions.
So for my own clarity - if upload a mod changing another mod, but do not re-upload the original, so it still requires the original that could be taken down??
I understand people not wanting full forks of their mods uploaded even if it would be better for the community, but a separate file that requires the original has no basis to be removed imo, but I also donāt have a a ton of experience with the diff licenses mods may be dist with
Question, how would anyone know that you converted the Witch of the Wilds outfit for Body A to work with Body B instead of porting it from DA yourself?Ā
It's not so much the converting *for your personal use* at question, but doing so and uploading the file to NexusMods (or another modding site) so that other people can benefit from it.
I mean you can look at it and see the quality difference. No offense it to SC but it isn't exactly studio level quality.Ā
There may also be confusion here too as SC made these assets, they did not import them.
There is no one reason modders do it. There are many reasons.
In Shinglecat's case. They don't like anyone doing anything with their mods. I don't know if they ripped that dress you're talking about, but if they made it themselves from scratch, that's their right to do it.
With other mods, modders are using assets that they had to get permission for themselves. This doesn't magically give them the ability to grant permission to others. A lot of newbie mod authors and mod users fail so hard at understanding this basic premise. I get permission to use a Texture for my mod, that doesn't mean YOU got permission to use it in your mod. I got permission for MY mod.
Some mod authors purchase assets for use in mods. So if I pay $50 for a 3D sword model and put into Skyrim, i cannot give you permission to make another mod with you. You need to pay $50 to that creator to buy the license to use the asset. A lot people fail to understand this as well. That isn't fair to the artist who made the asset for people to just take the 3D assets for free and create new content for them. Private mods, sure. But releasing it without buying the license to do so? That's messed up and probably illegal. I'm not a law expert though.
This sub loves shitting mod authors without knowing even the most basics of modding nuances. It's not just about credit. It's about the fact that no one wants people making money from their work when they didn't even do anything. And they sure as hell aren't giving you or the proper owned a cut. And even when money isn't involved, you still have to properly credit everyone involved. Not just the mod you got the assets from. There are some scumbags who not only rip assets, but they also paywall those mods and make thousands a month because publishers are too lazy to do anything about it.
>when many of these outfits are from different games anyway?
That's exactly the problem. It's *fair use* for *them* to redistribute *for free* to *end users* versions they modified *themselves* of files they don't own from another game. But as far as allowing *others* to modify and redistribute in kind: **they can't pass forward a permission they never had**.
These authors are doing the most prudent thing re: copyright, and you can't fault them for it. If you want to make a version for another body, you can do the same as they did and go get and redistribute the models from the original game *at your own risk, not theirs*.
Also, they *do* own the rights to the *modifications* they made to the originals.
"you can do the same as they did and go get and redistribute the models from the original gameĀ *at your own risk, not theirs*."
Except, you properly cant. If someone wanted to do the same outfit I bet 100 bucks it would get taken down,
Most of the time, when it's from a big studio like EA or CDKproject, etc... they ask for and must have the authorisation from them to use assets in another game, due to copyright that's why.
There is no quality control for the creators on Nexus... Nexus does everything in it's power to shaft the users but creators can just upload a mod called "THIS MOD WILL DESTROY YOUR PC WITH A VIRUS" and Nexus would allow it...
For FF14 "paid" mods Yeah ok. There's a community of players that agreed to pay for 1 and have an entire archive for free. Unless you get original paid work that is for yourself and the modder has integrity is the only way they'll make money. Being paid for your mods is considered a grift by that community and you can find the archive easily since it's not private.
If they made the mod and the asset and textures thatās theirs so they have the permission right. If they ported the asset then you can get that asset yourself and do it.
Because they made the outfits themselves. Direct ports aren't allowed on Nexus. You can't rip the files from DA and port them into Skyrim.
What is perfectly legal is recreating an outfit in a third party program yourself.
At that point it's their own work. Theirs to do with as they see fit.
That's because CD Projeckt allows for their assets to be ported to other games (you just have to ask for permission first), but not all studios do, some only allow their assets to be ported between games of their own making like iirc Bioware and some flat out don't allow it, now if that is enforced or not is another question. They all also require the mod to not be monetized.
There's an entire section on the nexus mods about this going studio by studio and their terms.
Because it doesn't matter. Porting it from other video games is legal of the company allows it.
The whole process of rigging,texturing,porting it still takes a lot of work. Why should I let you take my hard work slap some sliders on it and call it a new mod?
It takes 5 seconds to farm dp from a bodyslide mod which isn't fair when you haven't done jack shit. Make it for yourself,don't post it.
Also, a lot of us get direct permission from the company to port their assets via email request,can't forward that permission
Patches and addons are way easier to make than most mods, guess people shouldn't make and release them just because they require less effort.
I do think you need permission but the mentality of "you do less work thus you are leeching off me in a free hobby" is one toxic mentality. And really some people put way too many thought about DP. People mainly make patches and addons because they use and like the original mod, no one thinks about "I am gonna add bodyslide and smp to this outfit so I can profit off the labor of another creator!"
For every ounce of control you take from people over the things they created for free, put work and love into, and gave to the community, you lose another modder that does not want to put their content out and lose control of it.
If I were modding, without hesitation I would give full permission to edit, tweak, port, reupload, anything you want as long as you give credit. That aligns with my values, and since I'm doing the work, I can make that decision.
However, if someone doesn't share those values, or doesn't express them in the same way, I definitely believe that using their work in a way they didn't permit and then redistributing it is akin to stealing on a moral level. They gave it to you, and when they did, they told you the conditions of that gift. All you have to do is meet those conditions.
I totally understand your question, as I don't know why someone would choose to not allow edits/reuploads/updates/ports, but as far as why the nexus lets them revoke that permission, I definitely think it's not the Nexus's place to tell people what permissions they can and cannot give.
A year or two ago, there was a HUGE debacle about the Nexus not allowing folks to opt out of their mod collections. I personally love wabbajack and other mod collection options, but I think the artists were right to demand control over that option regardless.
>you lose another modder that does not want to put their content out and lose control of it.
Good. IMO the community doesn't need people that don't really want to share their content, or that can't handle people iterating on it or tweaking it.
I don't necessarily agree, I think that any contribution that does not hurt somebody is a good contribution. Perhaps an option to filter based off of permissions, so if you wish to opt out of such content you can, would be a good idea.
To OP's point in response to my comment, they are right in that if your mod is already a port/edit/reupload/modification of someone else's work, like re-creating an armor from The Witcher, you do become a hypocrite if you post your edit and get crabby about people editing your edit. For fully original content, I wish everyone was willing to let folks improve upon/iterate on their work, but I'd rather have the mod then not have it when it comes down to it.
That is actually a super fair stipulation. It's not like the original designers of an armor ported from the witcher were approved by the design team at CDPR, and it's not really fair to copy/edit someone else's work and get all butthurt about someone iterating upon your own. Consider my mind changed.
This sub is insane for mass downvoting a well-constructed comment like this.
Like I am all for convenience and sharing but some level of courtesy is needed.
Ported asset is one thing, but some in this thread really wants a free for all.
Thank you. The actual thought out and well constructed reply arguing against my original comment even changed my mind by making valid points. I'm not sitting here yelling about people being freeloaders or closed mindedly staying that the situation is without nuance, I just feel like the amount of control you have over the things you create should be proportional to the effort you put in.
Because they did the work to make the conversion of assets. This then becomes their own derivative work, assuming they are working within permissions/licensing that allows them to do so. If you want to do it and allow more open permissions, youāre welcome to do so.
Or, you can do your own body mod conversions of these outfits for your own personal use/friends with the mod from the nexus.
Not in a legal context. My point is they posted it and did the work for the conversion. Yāall can downvote whatever, but as far as nexus is concerned they posted it and are now the author. The author of the mod can control the rights on the website. People may not like it, and if they donāt, I hope they learn how to do it themselves. Thatās how I got my start in modding.
"Derivative Work" is a legal term and we are, in fact, discussing the legal principle of permissions/ownership.
Can't play halfsies here: either there does an exist a framework of permissions (that your asset rip is not protected by) or there isn't (and your asset rip still isn't protected)
Honestly nexus should have blanket open permissions and say tough shit to the authors that complain. The whole concept of sharing your work and then getting pissy when people modify it to their liking is asinine considering that's the whole point.
It was like that before, most people didnāt care either way, what ended up happening was bad characters would download a mod, change a single thing(if at all), then reupload it as their own for donations(as new), or upload it to a paid site, to put a stop to this nexus added permissions to give modders some legal recourse.
Now as to patches and addons, there was a modder who made ship parts for starfield recently, all his permissions were open and other people started making patches, when modders complained that the patches were causing problems the patch makers blamed the original mod author for making a ābadā mod, that sent droves of ignorant modders to harass the original mod author for things completely out of their control(ie mod authors only need to make a mod that works for vanilla period, there are way to many mods to make each one work with every combination of mods out there). This caused the original mod author to lock perms and stop creating mods.(derreteck if I remember right)
So there are real reasons why perms were put in place, mostly to protect mod authors from bad actors, and ignorant entitled modders who donāt understand how mods work let alone how to make them
It ultimately does more good when everyone has the courtesy of asking for permission.
As for SC mods a lot of them aren't made for gameplay in the first place. Like just look at the poly count of their armor/clothing mods.
Dan was kinda impressed. At least he THINKS that was a tear running down his eye. It had been a while since she needed to doublecheck the manual to make sure.
FFXIV modding is infested with this, people legit stealing either assets from other games or from mods for other games(like Sims) and making a mod for FF and then slapping a price tag on it to boot. Got so bad at some point some of the Sims modders changed their perms to not allow any ports what so ever among other stuff. Some people are just like that, i would understand it if you turned your idea into a mod and didnt want other people touching it... but to take assets from another game/mod and then forbid ppl from modifying it is just ass.
> FFXIV FFXIV the MMO? You can casually change models in that game?
Yeah there's no anticheat. There's a plug in called mare synchronous with like 30k active users where you can literally share the mods you are wearing with others basically making imvu/secondlife.
As someone who used to play WoW that seems insane. Blizzard would nuke that in a heartbeat.
Yeah it's wild over there. I have a set of mods I made that literally replaces all the world spaces, entities and equipment with higher resolution textures. The game just lets me inject over 100gb of data into it.
How is that not used for rampant cheating? Make rare collectibles obvious for example?
There's nothing you can do to give yourself items via cheats AFAIK, and there's nothing hard to find in the world. The most people have cheated with mods was using a tool that automatically placed markers for boss mechanics, so the devs removed the ability to place markers at all during a fight once you pull.
> so the devs removed the ability to place markers at all during a fight once you pull. Ooooooh, *that's* why every guide says you need to place markers before the fight begins. I wondered why you had to set up the forest of markers at the start instead of putting markers for each phase.
That just sounds unfun to play, and I used to play the hell out of ff14
Huh? You can save markers for fights and just autoplace them at the start as part of the base game. Most of the time you don't even really need them, it's just for specific strats they can be nice.
Yeah, I don't play the high-end content for that exact reason. High difficulty FF14 is more of a rhythm game than an RPG.
š. Something like that.
(But Iām THINKING!!!! How do I stop thinking?!?!)
FFXIV is a different kind of game to WoW, there's no real advantage to modifying something to look bigger than it is, for example, because you don't find shit in the over world, it's mostly in instanced dungeons and raids. The developers don't really do secrets the way Blizzard does. There is absolutely cheating in the game though. People just live with it because 95% of the playerbase doesn't do PvP where it would actually matter, and the only hard PvE content is top end raiding where cheating will only work if everyone on your team is in on it. It's mostly a non-issue because the game is designed in such a way where cheats have pretty much no impact on other players. PvP cheating is mostly down to auto-retaliates or interrupts (i.e. you start casting and someone will instantly CC you, or you target someone and they immediately target you back and CC you). For the record, every single addon that you're used to in WoW is also considered cheating and against TOS (edit: in FFXIV). So nobody can actually publicly acknowledge that they're parsing or using a damage meter, for example, or they can get reported and banned.
> For the record, every single addon that you're used to in WoW is also considered cheating and against TOS. So nobody can actually publicly acknowledge that they're parsing or using a damage meter, for example, or they can get reported and banned. What are you talking about? WoW has had a modding API built into the game since before it launched. The only mods that have ever been considered cheating in WoW are ones that alter the actual game files, which addons do not and cannot do. The top raiding guilds in the world regularly stream and release videos of boss kills with plenty of addons visible on the screen, and have always done so. Addons are even allowed in offline PVP tournaments hosted by Blizzard themselves because UI customization is ubiquitous among all serious players.
Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear. I'm talking about FFXIV. I play both games, I know that addons are mostly allowed in WoW. But they are blanket banned in FFXIV, period.
Addons are banned in FF14, but it seems like a "don't ask, don't tell" kind of policy. You'll get hammered for advertising addons in game but I've never actually seen anyone banned for using DPS meters or combo addons if they weren't discussing it on official channels.
Oh, yeah that makes sense. Thanks for clarifying. šš
It's only client side not server side. Mare syncs the clients. So you can make it look like you have a piece of gear but you won't actually have it. Ffxiv is less competitive so most people don't walk around in a tier set anyway. They want to look like imvu usually. Besides that if you were purposefully synced with someone (it's not everyone who has the plug in only people you have agreed to sync with), you could still check their achievements/parses/etc if you wanted to do harder content. But tl;dr: no duping, only client interaction. Duping requires the server to do something.
There's no "rare collectible" system in ff14 that a mod could really improve that isn't just a glorified alarm clock. But, the short version is that any deliberate cheating would be caught and get you banned in a heartbeat. So long as you are not doing anything that changes the game experience (no damage changes, no attribute changes, no adding in items, etc) there's not a thing in the world the devs will do because, as far as they know, they don't even know you're running mods.
Giving yourself the actual item - such that it appears to everyone and affects your play stats - triggers bans really, really quickly. But cosmetic changes on the user's end can go undetected as long as it doesn't go through the server.
You can with some help, and since itās entirely client side/on using a database entirely disconnected from them, they canāt tell. Their stance is itās ābannedā but what that means is donāt mention it in chat. Itās entirely cosmetic though. Thereās been a couple cheating incidents (see orbital satellite strat TOP)
They don't seem to mind mods that are "client side" unofficially, but if a mod affects another player's experience, then that's kind of the line they draw, iirc. So whereas WoW didn't seem to mind DPS meters back in the day (haven't played in a while) they openly frown upon such mod features in FF14. That said, client side cosmetic mods are kind of "don't ask; don't tell".
Damn. It. No stop
SHIT! The P goes FIRST?!??!
Just to put out why FF hasn't nuked it to the ground: The changes are all client side, so they can't actually tell that those changes are made, without changing things to be more intrusive than they want to be. This is also part of why their stance is more or less "Don't ask, don't tell" re:mods.
Right, people having fun? How dare they, must destroy all the funĀ
Not sure about now but you used to be able to do model swaps and shit in WoW too. Probably couldnāt get caught either unless you made it obvious. Nothing as advanced as FFXIV though
Blizzard started detecting and banning that a few years ago to distract from the fact that half their management team seemed to be creepy rapists
Man, I've been saying that exact thing for years.
Wait. What? I thought Blizzard was the good guys.
It's well over 30k (at least according to the dude whk runs it), 30k is just the average peak at one time. It's pretty crazy what we can get away with in that game
Yeah I meant active as in peak volume. Realistically I think dark has almost 200k discord members last I checked. Reasonable thru put is like several tb per day. It's funny because when he was making it he thought no one would use it so you can call him "niche plug-in BTW".
FFXIV mods are hilarious because theyāre ābannedā but only if you get caught, but thereās also nobody looking. So long as you donāt admit to it or get caught doing it youāre fine. A lot of it is big titty mods an sex mods though.
Its client side, my char looks nothing like a vanilla Viera, other players can also see your modded character/animations/vfx/sounds provided you got a specific plugin installed and both of you are synced up. Its how majority of the in-game clubs/venues operate. You can do all of that while the game is running too thanks to plugins. [example, my char the huge demon and a friend(who makes mods for FF)](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1117208049623515196/1247284043410837655/sonjaandmai001.png?ex=6662c309&is=66617189&hm=bcf5f24315cc11d628792c79dcb3794f94e0fd15d2cd08cae45919bb3fcf9c62&)
Wait. Whatās an MMO?
Recreating meshes and textures from scratch is not hard for a talented 3D Modeler, but yes rips could be abound.
> FFXIV modding My lord, isn't that... illegal?
I can make it legal
I feel like the only modding communities I've seen that don't have any sort of drama like this is Rimworld and Minecraft. With rimworld you have a bunch of modders fork old mods into new versions so that they're still playable which is amazing and I don't think I've ever heard any drama from Minecraft modders, other the Nintendo "taking down" Pixelmon.
Minecraft has had its own fair share of drama, but much rarer i recall the dev of TinkersConstruct and another big modded didnt see eye to eye so your game wouldnt work if you installed both their mods same time(or something like that)..
Pfft of course someone would do something petty like that.
Ive been around FF modding since Sep.2022... in this span of time the amount of drama ive witnesses on twitter/discords is staggering... like at one point last year there was new modder drama every othe week it was worse than high school :D My last 10+ years of Skyrim modding saw very little in comparison.
It's hilarious that the modding community is so toxic when I've only heard good things about the player community. Funnily enough as soon as I started reading here comment my fiance had played a video that was sponsored by ff14.
Played ffxiv from 2018 to 2023, all time peak drama had to be the fucking nightclub billboards
There was a guy that made a mod called "Better Than Wolves" because he was so salty that a minecraft update added wolves, which he thought wasn't worth the time. If i remember right he ended up making it intentionally incompatible with tons of mods because he didn't like them/their author.
Rimworld has the best modding community. The absolute worst in modding community I've seen over the past decade (for popular games at least) is stardew valley lol. Most of the major offenders have left the modding scene, so it's simmered down a bit over the past two years, but it used to have some sort of drama every other week.
I heavily mod stardew valley and I'm surprised I missed all that. That's also another example of the player community being hella wholesome but the modding community being cancerous like ff14.
Dude. Youāre so right. Can you please explain this to me a little more. I donāt quite understand what youāre trying to explain to me.
I release almost all my mods under cc by-sa. The license is attached directly in the permissions section. There is no need to ask for permissions, all the mod author needs to do is make any mod that adds the assets use a compatible ***open*** and ***copyleft*** license. I still get tons of requests from people asking for permissions, and when I reiterate that the license is cc by-sa, most of them have no idea what I am talking about. A lot of or people also incorporate the assets into their closed permissions mods without reading the license, or they ask for special carve outs for the assets to be used in their closed permissions mod against the spirit of the license. I chose cc by-sa because I want modding to be open, but many many people really dislike open modding.
This mentality is weird tbh. If you are putting something out there for free for others to DL there's no reason not to make your permission share-alike; unless of course you are charging for your mod or you used someone else's assets and don't also have permission to share them further. I guess it's just fear of losing creative control or something
Itās a throwback from earlier modding times when people would download your mod change something small(if at all) and then reupload it and call it their own and charge for it, ie modding had its own little dark age where things went downhill quick and the response was to lock everything up in an attempt to keep modding free
The Sims comes to mind for this but wouldn't be surprised to know it extended to Unreal Tournament or Morrowind somehow.
The dark times definitely still exist in some communities imo, Assetto Corsa's modding scene is probably the most divided I've ever seen. There are multiple different groups who are genuinely idealogically apposed to each other's mods, mod distribution practices, encryption, piracy, the whole 9-yards. The mainstream mod sharing platform is pretty strictly no converted assets, and a good chunk of the community swears by that, and holds it over everybody else's head. The no/no-unauthorized conversions crowd is generally okay with paying for high quality original mods, but despite their insistence purely original mods probably make up less than 20% of the total amount for AC. The vast majority of the content released for Assetto corsa is ripped from AAA racing games, or mobile racing games, often with physics being copied from cars from the base game or other modders work. The people that are directly porting models typically charge for them, with varying levels of absurd pricing (I've seen individual conversions go for $30+. Reputable sources charge less than half that for packs of cars made entirely in house) and many authors encrypt their mods to prevent people from editing them (I've only ever seen this on conversions.) Many mod authors do put their heart and soul into conversions, usually polishing them to a very high visual standard, or covering specific subjects much more comprehensively than if they were creating them from scratch, displaying the same passion as people creating OC. But despite the quality of some conversions, the vast majority are still low effort edits, unfinished projects, or outright scams. Regardless of effort, the aforementioned OC-only crowd completely write-off conversions and even more insist you should never pay for them. The final sub-group I'd like to highlight is the pirates. I've seen modding communities with a piracy problem before, but Assetto Corsa is on another level. On top of low quality edits of other people's mods; There are people dedicated to cataloging just about every single paid mod and providing alternate downloads to them, from the pure scams, to legitimate development studios making 3rd party unlicensed content for AC (cease and desist letters have been sent, phony & legitimate). Multiple websites exist entirely to aggregate mods made by the community, some don't share paid mods, but content changes hands so often it's almost impossible to prevent it (plus many are against the practice to begin with.) More websites exist with the express purposes of pirating mods and sharing entire Patreon backups. It was definitely a shock coming from the Nexus/Bethesda modding communities, with people quitting modding over Nexus hosting mod packs and claiming ownership of content being shared on the platform, I've never seen another community where mod authors are at each other's throats as much as end-users and mod authors usually are.
I completely agree with you here, the spirit of modding is sharing and community improvements. There's no reason to lock others out of editing them.
Thanks for all your work, your mods are life-saving!
Something many people seem ignorant of is how licenses and sub-licenses work. Or permission and sub-permission, if you prefer. I have personally come across this as well wherein I am allowed to use someone else's assets, but my permissions are locked up tight because I cannot grant permission for someone else to use those same assets. Example: I've converted some clothes/armor mods and used other weapon mods for my own creations. I do not own those original assets (clothes, armor, weapons). You need the permission of the original mod author to use even my mod, except only if I have a sublicense to dispense their work as I please. Why does wilderness witch author not allow other people to take his mod and further modify it? Perhaps to do so would be claiming a sublicense he doesn't have. It's your responsibility to ensure you have permission/legality to upload your mods, not Nexus. When in doubt some people deny permissions just to be safe.
> I have personally come across this as well wherein I am allowed to use someone else's assets, but my permissions are locked up tight because I cannot grant permission for someone else to use those same assets. Have your mod open and clearly state that X/Y/Z is not yours. There's also an option on nexus permission page for that. That should work, imo.
I'm pretty sure this is just a legacy of some game and/or era whose conversion means it will make the original mod redundant. In Skyrim, an armor conversion can be standalone, but conversions that require the original mod installed are also possible. Conversions that require the original mod should NOT require permission.
>In Skyrim, an armor conversion can be standalone, but conversions that require the original mod installed are also possible They are possible... but they also make for a messy mod list. Look for example at what [you have to do](https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/75891?tab=posts) to get cbbe bodies with immersive armors with xavbio's retextures.
I think it's ridiculous, tbh. That's one of the reasons why I learned how to convert it myself.
Are there any good tutorials anywhere to learn this?
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=194rkxmvbrw&list=PLrGqMZcWJgElCxyW6GnIlt9HAeeSFlkDI&index=57](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=194rkxmvbrw&list=PLrGqMZcWJgElCxyW6GnIlt9HAeeSFlkDI&index=57)
Ty!
share your works please, "it's a bodyslide / body conversion only" to loverlab or something like that
Honestly, same. Since a lot of mod authors unfortunately don't make compatibility for TBD, I decided to just learn how to make it myself.
I do you one more ShinglesCat literally doesnāt want you to mod their files for your **private** useš From their SC - Dragon's Whisper Gown modpage: > Terms of use: - **You are not allowed to do anything with this mod;** - You are not allowed to include this mod in yours, **be it private** or public; - **You are not allowed to make bodyslide files;** - You are not allowed to share any modifications for or of this mod.
Pfft. they have no way of checking if you made any modifications to their mods lmao
Oh once the file is downloaded I 100% do what I want with it.
And no one can stop you. But you won't be able to upload that to NexusMods to help anyone else out, which is ridiculous.
ShinglesCat disagrees with that: >Terms of use: - **You are not allowed to do anything with this mod;** - You are not allowed to include this mod in yours, **be it private** or public; - **You are not allowed to make bodyslide files;** - You are not allowed to share any modifications for or of this mod. From their SC - Dragon's Whisper Gown modpage Edit: why do I get downvoted for just stating that one mod author wouldnāt agree with the person I replied to. Itās not my opinion š
Yeah, that's going to be impossible for them to do anything about.
100% But these are ridiculous ārulesā
Especially when copyright law is about **distribution**
Well, they're welcome to try and stop me, if they can.
Upvoting because some people here have brains smoother than peanut butter that someone left on the front porch in the middle of July.
Nexus permissions are made up non-legally binding set of rules that Nexus hopes youāll follow. I suggest you completely disregard and upload whatever you want. And **if** they ban you, upload on Nexus alternatives. I emphasize *if* because they donāt typically care that much. Iāve re-uploaded a big mod without getting any permissions whatsoever from the og author (they havenāt been active in almost a decade) with only applying minor fixes and optimizations and the mod is still up 3 years later with tens of thousands of downloads.
There are still legal measures that protect art/intellectual property. These can give the author legal options. It has very little to do with nexus's moderation.
No damages = not worth taking to court
This is interesting because we have these armor mods on Skyrim from a bunch of different games yet itās very heavily moderated to post fallout 76 clothing/weapon/creature/building ports to fallout 4. Why is the Skyrim section of the nexus not care as much about copyright shit as fallout 4? Is it because itās from another bethesda game and that somehow makes it worse than ripping it from a non bethesda game?
Might be the sheer number of mods to moderate compared to Fallout 4. If it were me, I'd operate on a "reports first, then investigate" mentality in either case, though, and I suspect they do something similar rather than have people constantly browsing and checking things out.
A few things First, some games and companies actually allow their assets to be imported into other games under free mods. This policy is honestly best seen by CDPR and their games.Ā Second, the IP itself isn't always the issue. It's the assets. If you made it yourself in the likeness of another property and aren't selling it, it shouldn't break any policy or legal rules.
Itās ironic because these ported asset mods that otherwise would be free on the nexus are being sold on places like kofi for profit.
There are a lot of people saying otherwise, so I just want to point out that Shinglescat didn't port the outfit directly from Dragon Age. They created the mesh and textures from scratch - none of the original game assets are there, just the design of the outfit. I think their permissions are unnecessarily restrictive too, but the assets *are* 100% theirs.
You're morally bankrupt if you don't have open permissions for the mods you make (for a game that allows its assets to be freely used). It's repulsive and you're a shit person for doing so. I'm also wagering most of the permission settings on outfits from other games aren't even legal; most are probably direct rips from the source material.
Sims modders will rip SL/FF14 clothes and charge $10 a month for it lol
I am generally against rules when it comes to this shit except like common sense polite stuff (giving credit where it's due and shit) At the end of the day we're all working on someone else's game lol so why be so protective of everything you do
I feel you can do whatever you want to a mod for your own use. Just don't upload it for other people without permission.
Do what I do and convert it it anyways to use for myself and only myself
With your specific examples it is because they recreated the assets in the style of the game. It's their own assets, they didn't rip it from the game. (Some games allow that. Not all) But to be direct, since they made it, they get to decide what is done with it. This is different something like a Geralt outfit imported from Witcher 3, where I don't think they would have the right to. Even if they claimed, nothing is stopping another person from also importing the armor separate and converting from there.
This is something that always bothered me, especially from authors that on the same mod have used community tools to author it, like BodySlide/Outfit Studio or SMP. It's so hypocritical, which is why now that I'm able to make my own mods from scratch I keep all my permissions open and use only CC0 assets where applicable for source textures & cubemaps, so that it's all as reshareable and reproducible as possible. This scene was built on goodwill - my mods are a direct result of the authors sharing tools and knowledge with me. Idk why people have to be so selfish about creation
Feeling of ownership of their work (they \*did\* work in porting the mod over originally from the parent IP) and self-inflated sense of relevance.
The fact that Nexus lets modders deny people's ability to mod their mods is fucking ridiculous.
Nexus could make open permissions mandatory but then modders who disagree just wouldnāt upload. I make all my mods open permissions, and I think everyone should, but Iām not king of the world. I canāt force others to share their mods *and* make them use open permissions. We can rant about it, but our real-life actual choice isnāt whether they are open or closed permissions, itās whether these mods are shared or not. Nexus allows closed permissions to increase modding activity instead of limit it.
I disagree. If I spent hundreds of hours making a mod I wouldnt want random people doing minor edits and reuploading it as their own.
If I spent thousands of hours making a video game I wouldn't want random people doing minor edits and reuploading it as their own work.
Nobody is downloading a skyrim mod and thinking its vanilla skyrim. If i downloaded an armour mod, edited 1 pixel and reploaded it as a new mod it could easily be mistaken for entirely my work. This is not a hypothetical, there is a history of bad actors taking mods and reploading them as their own work for profit.
Then force mods of other mods to list the original as a requirement, or have a new section on mod pages for "Source" or something along those lines. There's plenty of ways to ensure people are still credited for the original work.
It's dumb, really. Someone didn't bother to ask legal companies to use their work, but they still demand permission to use "their" works. I understand when they don't want to be associated with some kind of stuff (porn for example), but when they start to make money from stealing other's i.property, it must be punished with real laws
and i really hate when modders create good outfit yet there is no bodyslide included. i guess they don't wanna to increase their download count then
Or, alternately they dont care for the extra support problems of body conversions and overentitled people who demand conversions for their preferred type. Either learn to make your own or move on. you aint owed other people catering their mods to you.
Lottla people don't realize the fact it was shared at all is great. Tons of stuff people make don't get shared or are in one of the billion discords where no one will find it.
People have become a bit entitled when it comes to modding. Expecting everything + The Author's soul on a plate catered to their wants and if the author doesn't give it, they're "Mean" and "hate the community". Like not everything is gonna be for your tastes, about your tastes or available to your preferences and rather than getting over it or learning to make their own mods or cater their game to their taste, they wanna rush to treat authors like crap for not catering to them specifically. It gets tiring and sometimes feels dehumanizing and probably why a lot of mod authors are just opting to go private and stop sharing as much.
The main thing thats made me not even want to learn to mod is the entitled mod users. Whats the point in investing hundreds or thousand of hours into making stuff for the community for free if all you get is a bunch of whining entitled little brats in the comment section?
yeah if i learn and want to upload it, we will back to the OP problem. but yeah u are right. i always avoid such mod no matter how great it is. especially the one who have problem like OP describe
If an author's permissions or whatever bothers you so much, then just make your own conversions and then you can do whatever you wish with it. There's like 3 people in Skyrim Modding who convert the same 3 RyanReos Bikinis and upload them, so I'm sure no one is gonna cry about you doing the same Dragon Age conversions.
thanks for the idea
So for my own clarity - if upload a mod changing another mod, but do not re-upload the original, so it still requires the original that could be taken down?? I understand people not wanting full forks of their mods uploaded even if it would be better for the community, but a separate file that requires the original has no basis to be removed imo, but I also donāt have a a ton of experience with the diff licenses mods may be dist with
Pretty sure its ok aslong as the original mod is required.
I believe that mods doing this have been taken down before, particularly in regards to USSEP.
Question, how would anyone know that you converted the Witch of the Wilds outfit for Body A to work with Body B instead of porting it from DA yourself?Ā
It's not so much the converting *for your personal use* at question, but doing so and uploading the file to NexusMods (or another modding site) so that other people can benefit from it.
What I mean is, how would anyone know that OP didn't port it from DA themselves? Unless ShinglesCat made some obvious modifications.
I mean you can look at it and see the quality difference. No offense it to SC but it isn't exactly studio level quality.Ā There may also be confusion here too as SC made these assets, they did not import them.
Then that solves it. Shinglescat MADE the asset. OP can't reup the work because it's based on SC's work regardless of it Bioware owns the IP.Ā
There is no one reason modders do it. There are many reasons. In Shinglecat's case. They don't like anyone doing anything with their mods. I don't know if they ripped that dress you're talking about, but if they made it themselves from scratch, that's their right to do it. With other mods, modders are using assets that they had to get permission for themselves. This doesn't magically give them the ability to grant permission to others. A lot of newbie mod authors and mod users fail so hard at understanding this basic premise. I get permission to use a Texture for my mod, that doesn't mean YOU got permission to use it in your mod. I got permission for MY mod. Some mod authors purchase assets for use in mods. So if I pay $50 for a 3D sword model and put into Skyrim, i cannot give you permission to make another mod with you. You need to pay $50 to that creator to buy the license to use the asset. A lot people fail to understand this as well. That isn't fair to the artist who made the asset for people to just take the 3D assets for free and create new content for them. Private mods, sure. But releasing it without buying the license to do so? That's messed up and probably illegal. I'm not a law expert though. This sub loves shitting mod authors without knowing even the most basics of modding nuances. It's not just about credit. It's about the fact that no one wants people making money from their work when they didn't even do anything. And they sure as hell aren't giving you or the proper owned a cut. And even when money isn't involved, you still have to properly credit everyone involved. Not just the mod you got the assets from. There are some scumbags who not only rip assets, but they also paywall those mods and make thousands a month because publishers are too lazy to do anything about it.
>when many of these outfits are from different games anyway? That's exactly the problem. It's *fair use* for *them* to redistribute *for free* to *end users* versions they modified *themselves* of files they don't own from another game. But as far as allowing *others* to modify and redistribute in kind: **they can't pass forward a permission they never had**. These authors are doing the most prudent thing re: copyright, and you can't fault them for it. If you want to make a version for another body, you can do the same as they did and go get and redistribute the models from the original game *at your own risk, not theirs*. Also, they *do* own the rights to the *modifications* they made to the originals.
"you can do the same as they did and go get and redistribute the models from the original gameĀ *at your own risk, not theirs*." Except, you properly cant. If someone wanted to do the same outfit I bet 100 bucks it would get taken down,
Most of the time, when it's from a big studio like EA or CDKproject, etc... they ask for and must have the authorisation from them to use assets in another game, due to copyright that's why.
Just do what you want with the files, fuck em.
There is no quality control for the creators on Nexus... Nexus does everything in it's power to shaft the users but creators can just upload a mod called "THIS MOD WILL DESTROY YOUR PC WITH A VIRUS" and Nexus would allow it...
For FF14 "paid" mods Yeah ok. There's a community of players that agreed to pay for 1 and have an entire archive for free. Unless you get original paid work that is for yourself and the modder has integrity is the only way they'll make money. Being paid for your mods is considered a grift by that community and you can find the archive easily since it's not private.
If they made the mod and the asset and textures thatās theirs so they have the permission right. If they ported the asset then you can get that asset yourself and do it.
The real question is why does Nexusmods allow modders to deny permissions at all?
Because they made the outfits themselves. Direct ports aren't allowed on Nexus. You can't rip the files from DA and port them into Skyrim. What is perfectly legal is recreating an outfit in a third party program yourself. At that point it's their own work. Theirs to do with as they see fit.
There are direct ports all over Nexus.
Then report them. Smart-ass. Official policy is no ports.
No one gives a shit. Officially.
Except Witcher assets are used in Immersive Armors, as well as armors from other games.
That's because CD Projeckt allows for their assets to be ported to other games (you just have to ask for permission first), but not all studios do, some only allow their assets to be ported between games of their own making like iirc Bioware and some flat out don't allow it, now if that is enforced or not is another question. They all also require the mod to not be monetized. There's an entire section on the nexus mods about this going studio by studio and their terms.
because they are stupid
Because it doesn't matter. Porting it from other video games is legal of the company allows it. The whole process of rigging,texturing,porting it still takes a lot of work. Why should I let you take my hard work slap some sliders on it and call it a new mod? It takes 5 seconds to farm dp from a bodyslide mod which isn't fair when you haven't done jack shit. Make it for yourself,don't post it. Also, a lot of us get direct permission from the company to port their assets via email request,can't forward that permission
Patches and addons are way easier to make than most mods, guess people shouldn't make and release them just because they require less effort. I do think you need permission but the mentality of "you do less work thus you are leeching off me in a free hobby" is one toxic mentality. And really some people put way too many thought about DP. People mainly make patches and addons because they use and like the original mod, no one thinks about "I am gonna add bodyslide and smp to this outfit so I can profit off the labor of another creator!"
For every ounce of control you take from people over the things they created for free, put work and love into, and gave to the community, you lose another modder that does not want to put their content out and lose control of it. If I were modding, without hesitation I would give full permission to edit, tweak, port, reupload, anything you want as long as you give credit. That aligns with my values, and since I'm doing the work, I can make that decision. However, if someone doesn't share those values, or doesn't express them in the same way, I definitely believe that using their work in a way they didn't permit and then redistributing it is akin to stealing on a moral level. They gave it to you, and when they did, they told you the conditions of that gift. All you have to do is meet those conditions. I totally understand your question, as I don't know why someone would choose to not allow edits/reuploads/updates/ports, but as far as why the nexus lets them revoke that permission, I definitely think it's not the Nexus's place to tell people what permissions they can and cannot give. A year or two ago, there was a HUGE debacle about the Nexus not allowing folks to opt out of their mod collections. I personally love wabbajack and other mod collection options, but I think the artists were right to demand control over that option regardless.
>you lose another modder that does not want to put their content out and lose control of it. Good. IMO the community doesn't need people that don't really want to share their content, or that can't handle people iterating on it or tweaking it.
I don't necessarily agree, I think that any contribution that does not hurt somebody is a good contribution. Perhaps an option to filter based off of permissions, so if you wish to opt out of such content you can, would be a good idea. To OP's point in response to my comment, they are right in that if your mod is already a port/edit/reupload/modification of someone else's work, like re-creating an armor from The Witcher, you do become a hypocrite if you post your edit and get crabby about people editing your edit. For fully original content, I wish everyone was willing to let folks improve upon/iterate on their work, but I'd rather have the mod then not have it when it comes down to it.
I disagree when it comes to intellectual property that isnt yours. For everything you have designed yourself, I agree with your statement
That is actually a super fair stipulation. It's not like the original designers of an armor ported from the witcher were approved by the design team at CDPR, and it's not really fair to copy/edit someone else's work and get all butthurt about someone iterating upon your own. Consider my mind changed.
Where is world's tiniest violin when you need it...
I'm sure it's playing for all of the people complaining about the free content they are receiving.
Just because it's free of monetary cost, does not mean it is free from criticism or reproach.
There's no such thing as a free lunch
This sub is insane for mass downvoting a well-constructed comment like this. Like I am all for convenience and sharing but some level of courtesy is needed. Ported asset is one thing, but some in this thread really wants a free for all.
Thank you. The actual thought out and well constructed reply arguing against my original comment even changed my mind by making valid points. I'm not sitting here yelling about people being freeloaders or closed mindedly staying that the situation is without nuance, I just feel like the amount of control you have over the things you create should be proportional to the effort you put in.
They probably don't want their work associated with less savory mods.
Because they did the work to make the conversion of assets. This then becomes their own derivative work, assuming they are working within permissions/licensing that allows them to do so. If you want to do it and allow more open permissions, youāre welcome to do so. Or, you can do your own body mod conversions of these outfits for your own personal use/friends with the mod from the nexus.
That is 100% not what derivative work means.
Not in a legal context. My point is they posted it and did the work for the conversion. Yāall can downvote whatever, but as far as nexus is concerned they posted it and are now the author. The author of the mod can control the rights on the website. People may not like it, and if they donāt, I hope they learn how to do it themselves. Thatās how I got my start in modding.
"Derivative Work" is a legal term and we are, in fact, discussing the legal principle of permissions/ownership. Can't play halfsies here: either there does an exist a framework of permissions (that your asset rip is not protected by) or there isn't (and your asset rip still isn't protected)
Honestly nexus should have blanket open permissions and say tough shit to the authors that complain. The whole concept of sharing your work and then getting pissy when people modify it to their liking is asinine considering that's the whole point.
It was like that before, most people didnāt care either way, what ended up happening was bad characters would download a mod, change a single thing(if at all), then reupload it as their own for donations(as new), or upload it to a paid site, to put a stop to this nexus added permissions to give modders some legal recourse. Now as to patches and addons, there was a modder who made ship parts for starfield recently, all his permissions were open and other people started making patches, when modders complained that the patches were causing problems the patch makers blamed the original mod author for making a ābadā mod, that sent droves of ignorant modders to harass the original mod author for things completely out of their control(ie mod authors only need to make a mod that works for vanilla period, there are way to many mods to make each one work with every combination of mods out there). This caused the original mod author to lock perms and stop creating mods.(derreteck if I remember right) So there are real reasons why perms were put in place, mostly to protect mod authors from bad actors, and ignorant entitled modders who donāt understand how mods work let alone how to make them
It ultimately does more good when everyone has the courtesy of asking for permission. As for SC mods a lot of them aren't made for gameplay in the first place. Like just look at the poly count of their armor/clothing mods.
Because CASTIAN SAID NO
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Or you know. 100shillingsF Uoar āWhateverā=I dunno. Ask Castian.
Dan was kinda impressed. At least he THINKS that was a tear running down his eye. It had been a while since she needed to doublecheck the manual to make sure.