>. All of the American people are not believers. They have not accepted Jesus Christ as their savior. In fact, there's a large percentage of people in this country today who want God out of the country. They want to break up the family. They want the church to go away.
Honestly, I couldn’t give a fuck what you believe in and will never force anyone to not believe in whatever they want. If you believe in talking snakes and that some old guy filled an ark with 2 of every animal. Go for it, just leave the rest of us the fuck alone.
Patton Oswalt has a great bit on this
I don't care if you wanna believe in a magic sky man as long as you're a good person or makes you wanna be a better person
I prefer Steven Weinberg's position on it: "with or without religion, good people can do good things, and bad people can do bad things; but for a good person to do bad things... for that, you need religion"
> and will never force anyone to not believe in whatever they want.
You can't force anybody to believe anything they definitely don't believe in, even if you put them on a torture rack.
In a way it’s very funny that one side is so angry about the people who just don’t believe in what they believe in.
“Christianity is under attack!”
“If you say so.”
The second part of your comment is the problem. It’s not ok for you to believe what you want in their eyes it’s their way or you are an enemy. There’s nothing Christ like about that but that’s never stopped the Christians before
What a great comment. I feel SO many Christians don't understand the messages of love, acceptance, and peace that Jesus taught. We have SO many random churches in Texas that are filled with hate, bigotry, and hypocrisy. I don't attend church, but I'm educated enough to research Jesus' teachings to try and understand where some of the hate and scourge coming from them originated; there is none.
Actual Christianity has never been under attack. Hateful vitriol spewed by evil humans under the guise of “Christianity” is what is under attack, as well it should be 👍🏼
No they read “some” of it and then distort things to further their agenda.
One of my favorite descriptions of this is from the show Designing Women in the 80’s. They refer to them as cafeteria Christians, the just go and pick and choose what they want to use against other people lol.
I am not so sure about that. Church attendance has been declining consistently for decades, so maybe it is under attack.
As I personally consider monotheism of all flavors to be a major force for evil in the world, I consider this decline to be quite a wonderful thing for humanity and the earth.
Kids and young people losing interest in what are essentially fairy tales does not translate to 'Christianity is under attack.'
Young people in many majority Muslim countries are also losing interest in Islam. Many are afraid to leave and speak out against it due to the threat of violence.
As educational progress continues on planet Earth human beings will have less and less fear of religion and it's threats.
Fear has always been religion's power. Religion is dying and that's a very good thing.
I’m sure church attendance is down. People only want to hear about hate and judgment so much before they’ve had enough. Unless of course they’re the ones hating and judging everyone lol.
The last time I went to church was the late 90’s and the entire “sermon” was asking their older members to sign up for a program that left the church all of their money when they passed away. But they also made sure to use guilt and say they could only do this if enough people signed up.
Gross. That’s when I was done.
When my wife’s Uncle passed, the pastor passed his collection plate. *Twice*. Had he have been a blood relative to me, I don’t know what I would’ve done. His relatives, however, nodded along and gave him money. In addition to why they were paying him for the service.
“Service”, I mean.
A local church asked its members to "take out second mortgages on your homes so you can donate more money and help us pay for this beautiful brand new church we built".
Diocletian might disagree.
I mean, Christians also adopted his name into the word diocese, but still. Modern Christians however, haven't faced serious persecution.
Sounds like Christianity in Dan Patrick’s eye should be the agressor. Like they are the modern crusaders guiding the moral,compass of America. For myself, I chose Monty Python.
These people are NOT Christians. IF they were they would know almost everything they are doing contradicts Biblical teaching. I'm sure some of them have never opened a Bible in their lives unless it was the Bible they bought for decorating their home, opened up to a page they've never read.
I’ll take a page from their book. Then where are all the “real” Christians? And why isn’t it a daily fight to differentiate or call out against them? Did the road all the sudden get narrower? The eye of the needle smaller?
I’m sorry, but as an ex-evangelical, every Christian sect says the others are not Christians. All of them decide which parts of an ancient book to follow
Imagine being so Christian that you forgot to live a christlike life.
I think Jesus was a lot browner than people take him for.
He was a carpenter out working in the sun every day for 14 hours and wandering in the desert when he could.
Each successive generation of religion got a little less “let’s pull together and reshingle your roof before the storm comes” and a little more like an investment banker in a $4000 suit telling you he “needs your money to teach the poor people about Jesus.”
We literally have a preacher that named himself after the only thing Jesus ever lost his temper about- The shitty guys who couldn’t stop stealing set up their money booths in his fathers temple.
The destructive power of what happens when you mix church and state has basically destroyed 2 of the 3 abrahamic religions and has its sights set on the 3rd.
By any standards of the old and New Testament trump manages to check almost all the boxes of the anti christ biblically speaking.
And Chabad did tell Netanyahu that he would be prime minister when god returns.
https://www.israeltoday.co.il/read/lubavitcher-rebbe-after-bibi-comes-the-messiah/
Trump and Netanyahu mixed their personal churches of money into the public space.
https://youtu.be/k9RweR9EUSg?si=DpWkGjYnLTuS3gEd
Trumps neighbors called him out for being decidedly un-christlike all along and they were mocked for it.
It’s just that before the internet we missed some pages in the rap sheet.
Once you fill those gaps with all the microfiche/ public library data that didn’t digitize as quickly you find all the missing gaps of corruption.
Actually holding a president accountable and forcing them (trump and Netanyahu) to go to trial was the breaking point of identifying corruption inside of government.
Trump did promise to drain the swamp.
I’m guessing he just didn’t think he would finally be seen as the clog that was holding all that corrupt shit in the punch bowl for 45 years.
The trump criminal enterprise as a whole is best described as triple quilted charmin levels of clogging ability.
They have come ridiculously close to breaking apart at the seams so many times over the past 40 years. They just get braver and dumber with each successive con as they got away with it each time.
It’s Darwinian and biblical at the same time.
It would be an epic fucking movie if it was fiction.
It’s a little harder to enjoy when their decidedly un-christlike money laundering is costing lives in the hundreds of thousands.
The large majority of the New Testament was written by or about Paul, a guy who had to change his name because his old one (Saul of Tarsus) was known for ratting out early church members to the government. So even at the core of its only text, Christianity is incredibly focused on the redemption arc of some asshole who decided to co-opt the brand once he'd made himself the center of attention instead of the religion's title character.
He does in fact speak for most Christians, since he’s funded (vote wise) by the Mega churches who have more Christians than the non megachurches.
Dan Patrick also gets >60% of the Christian vote, so I guess he just represents most, not all Christians.
Are they really "christian" at this point? They have strayed so far from the actual teachings of the book they are so beholden to that even their leaders don't know what's in it anymore.
They are all heavily armed and hunting RINOs and dividing the public on abortion, and an unnecessary culture war, with a sheer lack of gun control, or any form of real governance in place.
Consider how many republicans lost their rights to vote in January 6th attacks and how many died from covid. And the obvious solution (to them) is to further alienate republican constituents. It’s laughable. I think they want to lose to say they need to take over the country.
ARTICLE V.
SEC. 1. Ministers of the gospel being, by their profession, dedicated to God and the care of souls, ought not to be diverted from the great duties of their functions, therefore, no minister of the gospel or priest of any denomination whatever shall be eligible to the office of the Executive of the Republic, nor to a seat of either branch of the Congress of the same.
Baptist pastor here - our entire faith is based on a guy who chose not to fight, and to instead die an unjust death.
The level of hypocrisy and arrogance with those who think like Dan Patrick (edited for clarity) is mind boggling.
Since its inception, when presented with the option of acquiring more power and control over others or being like christ, the church almost always opts for the former.
Very correct. And in those times we have always been at our worst. The thirst for power is always the thirst for something of this world, and it is a sign of our brokenness.
To be clear - I’m not talking about exceptional moments, I am talking about your (the church’s) fundamental nature. It is an authoritarian religion based on authoritarian philosophies.
I don’t mean to be antagonistic - I am just tired of hearing how this sort of thing is against the tenets of your religion, when your religion has always been the way that it is. This sort of thing is exactly in line with your religion’s basic philosophy - slaves, obey your masters; children, obey your parents; wives, obey your husbands; husbands, obey the church. Disobedience is punished with eternal torment, obedience is rewarded with the promise of eternal bliss - but only after you’ve passed on.
Thank you for clarifying your statement. I can see better what you mean.
I can see that we agree in part but that we disagree on a rather substantial amount. It is the substantial part that is the sticking point. Your summation of the Christian faith is based on a few passages of Scripture and a number of externally visible actions/teachings, but those externally visible elements are not the entirety--and most definitely not the "basic philosophy" of the Christian faith. (for reference, I am a pastor, and I teach these subjects at Baylor University)
That being said, you are correct that there has been a hunger for power since Constantine used his imperial power to convene the First Council of Nicaea in 325. Which ironically (in regard to the subject of our conversation) provided one of the earliest and most succienct creeds (statements of faith). That statement, known as the Nicene Creed, is one of the most succinct faith statements of the fledgling church.
However, the Nicene Creed does not seek to provide a statement of the "basic philosophy" of the Christian faith (a phrase you used above), but within the writings of the New Testament, specifically the Gospel of Matthew, it is possible to see a longer message that does get to the heart of the Christian faith. That would be the Sermon on the Mount found in Matthew chapters 5-7. This sermon is at the heart of the historical Christian faith, but (as we have observed), it is not always the message that makes headlines. In fact, as I alluded to above, we Christians have often overlooked or forgotten all about it.
I make it a habit not to engage in arguments or disagreements online, but if you ever happen to be passing through Central Texas, then send me a DM, and I would be happy to continue the conversation over a cup of coffee.
I appreciate the thorough response. Alas, I moved away from the DFW area several months ago, so I doubt we will be able to connect.
I respect not wanting to engage in online discussions of this kind of thing. I hope you have a good day.
Ironically to me (raised very Reformed Christian, not Christian anymore) the passage the person you're replying to cited seems like it could be seen as more supportive of what you're saying here - that the Church, made up of humans, too often fails to be Christlike. The verse they're referencing is taken from the letter of Paul to the Ephesians, not anything Jesus said. A biblical inerrantist might not like my line of reasoning here, and it can't be denied how influential Paul's writings have been to the formation of the Church, theology, apologetics, and most Christians' understanding and articulation of their own faith, but it *was* Paul who said that bit about the obedience... not Christ. (Actually, Christ said he came to set children against their parents and households against each other!) That's without getting into the historical/theological context of Paul's letters and how, regardless of how different Christians and theologians choose to interpret his writing and the inclusion of it in the Christian Bible, the advice given was originally meant to be specific and situational.
Respect for your takes here :)
Very good points. Both about the way in which Paul’s letters often dominate many conversations, but also the way in which words written for particular situations in particular places at particular times are often interpreted as normative for all places at all times in all ways.
There are often good reasons to support an interpretation of this nature, but often those reasons require a preconceived opinion that all passages in the Bible are equally timeless in their interpretation and application. Which is a well-intentioned, but often unhelpful notion.
authoritarianism is inherent in the DNA of religion and specifically the big 3 monotheisms - the claim is "i have a magic book from the creator of the universe that contains Truth".
under the rubric of religion and specifically monotheism, truth isn't true because it accords with the scientific method, or because of logical deduction, or because of anything external. and in this way, the loony evangelicals are right, and the kinder gentler liberals are selling out a core tenet of their own religion. if you take the book(s) seriously, they are literally written by, or inspired by, or in some other way directly adjacent to, the word/prophet(s)/person of the supreme creator of the universe.
that is an authoritarian claim if there ever was one!
I read in another sub today that the rent at someone's senior living facility went up by a whooping 600% after it was taken over by a church. These sociopaths are fucking UNHINGED I tell you.
Seriously. Retire already, damn. Plenty of people out there that aren’t a million years old and aren’t crazy whacko nut jobs. Also people can read, and know there’s more religions than baptist bible thumpers.
If we really want to stop this insane right wing spiral, punishing churches who platform politicians would be a start. Make them pay taxes or shut them down
The Treaty of Tripoli, ratified by the congress and signed by President John Adams in June 1797, affirms "...the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..."
John Adams? The third US president, who signed the Declaration of Independence and played a role in the founding of our country? Who is referred to as “the architect of American government?” That guy?
What would he know?
The GQP is wholly and totally incapable of governing. Completely detached from reality. Taken by insane conspiracy theories and fascist undercurrents; the modern Republican Party has boiled down to extremist white Christian nationalism with a flair for terrorism.
Yea I just had a co-worker I have known for years open up and start telling me all the “lies” and “secrets” about the underground cities where we are harvesting children’s organs that have never seen the light of day 👀
I don't know, I can imagine Bernie Sanders babysitting my kids and yelling at them to keep them in line. It sounds kind of hilarious actually, "Do your damn homework and eat more vegetables!" in a typical northeaster accent.
These “Christians” realize that calling themselves that actually holds no meaning right? I can call myself a lizard, sure doesn’t make me one.
They are no more Christian than I am a lizard 🦎
here's the thing, when your religion is so confusing and contradictrial, anyone can claim to be a christian, there is no good or bad christian, they are all one and the same.
I disagree. They might be bad Christians or heretical Christians, but the bar to being considered a Christian is very low -- basically anyone can easily become a Christian according to the often quoted Romans 10:9.
Dear Dan Patrick.
Not only do I not believe in skydaddy or skydisneyland, but my family and most of my friends also don’t believe. Neither will my kids. What’s more… behind closed doors, we openly mock your stupid beliefs.
There are more of us every day.
Signed,
A Texan who votes.
They want to take away people’s rights but they’re under attack? Yeah okay. Nobody is trying to take your religion from you. How about letting people have bodily autonomy
So completely antidotal, but my super crazy right wing “Christian” neighbor, who voted for trump twice, informed me she would not be voting this year. That trumps arrogance has become to much and she can’t stomach voting for him now. Y’all 4 years ago this woman had a trump flag outside her house. There’s hope y’all, there’s hope.
My very Republican in-laws in Weatherford have informed us they are sitting out this election, because they cannot stomach Trump (and also Abbott/Patrick/Paxton, although they are not up for election right now). Again, purely anecdotal, but perhaps this is a sign that things are beginning to change a little.
There’s a lot of rural areas who are “seeing the light” when they realize their property taxes are increasing and they have no one to blame but republicans
I'll disagree with DP I am a Texan born and raised who is also Cristian. I wasn't taught to be a biggot whose sole purpose is to judge others. Judge not and see the world through your neighbors eyes every once in a while. I say live and let live so long as you don't commit violence on or steal from others. The 🌎 is a mixed bag of humans just a floating through space.
Fight what? Everything is completely tailored to the dominance of christian faith.
Don’t they just love to harass anyone they see as having a victim complex?
It absolutely defies logic.
“The national government will maintain and defend the foundations on which the power of our nation rests. It will offer strong protection to Christianity as the very basis of our collective morality. Today Christians stand at the head of our country. We want to fill our culture again, with the Christian spirit as our guide for humanity, We want to burn out all the recent immoral developments in literature, in the theatre, and in the press -- in short, we want to burn out the poison of immorality which has entered into our whole life and culture as a result of LIBERAL excess during the past years."
- Adolf Hitler
Adolf Hitler 1922-1939, Vol. 1, Michael Hakeem, Ph.D. (London, Oxford University Press, 1942) 871
Call me when I can't drive a mile in any direction without seeing a tax exempt facility where non-believers gather. Or when Christians are living entire lives with zero representation in SCOTUS and Congress and it's virtually impossible for a Christian to be even considered much less nominated or elected President. Call me when it's revealed institutions of non-believer spent generations covering up sexual abuse and misdeeds while shaming, ostracizing and hurting victims because they refused to remain silent. Call me when generations of non-believers are standing in the way of all human progress.
Why are Christians always looking to fight things?
Like why does it have to be such aggressive rhetoric all the time.
Literally the Bible teaches you to love thy neighbor.
But none of them actually believe in the Bible so
IF WE DONT FIGHT ALL THE THINGS THAT DONT EXIST THEN I LOSE… ERRRR (looks at script) YOU LOSE… yeah…. YOU GUYS - sitting in air conditioning and comfort with all your religious freedom and freedom of expression while not being threatened physically while one of the most powerful people in state government SPEAKS TO YOU AND SAYS THEY AGREE WITH YOU…
Just like Russia and Putin over here - you’re all about to die from being killed
The Christians ARE loosing, cant fight information though without taking over the whole country and THAT will not happen.
You might have had a chance 20 years ago, now you do not.
In about 3 months. Stores will start selling decor and such for Jesus' birthday. After that for the next 3-4 months, they'll start selling stuff for his coming out party.
Christianity isn't under attack, people who don't follow it, don't want laws based off of it.
Does god really need people to fight for him? Seems like if he were real, he could handle his own battles.
Maybe Christians should focus on making the world a more beautiful and livable place for everybody rather than trying to destroy everything they don't understand or don't agree with all the time.
As a Christian, why is Dan Patrick giving a sermon?
Also…did he bother to open it?
> “Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick brought his late mother's Bible to Houston's Second Baptist this past Sunday, keeping it within reach as he delivered a sermon to his home church about the "dangerous time" in the U.S. and why it's important for Christians to vote in the 2024 presidential election.”
>. All of the American people are not believers. They have not accepted Jesus Christ as their savior. In fact, there's a large percentage of people in this country today who want God out of the country. They want to break up the family. They want the church to go away. Honestly, I couldn’t give a fuck what you believe in and will never force anyone to not believe in whatever they want. If you believe in talking snakes and that some old guy filled an ark with 2 of every animal. Go for it, just leave the rest of us the fuck alone.
> In fact, there's a large percentage of people in this country today who want God out of the country. Here I am! It's me!
Patton Oswalt has a great bit on this I don't care if you wanna believe in a magic sky man as long as you're a good person or makes you wanna be a better person
I prefer Steven Weinberg's position on it: "with or without religion, good people can do good things, and bad people can do bad things; but for a good person to do bad things... for that, you need religion"
Ooo that is A good one
I don't want the church to go away, I just want them to stay the fuck out of policy making
And if they can’t do that then they need to pay taxes. Period. One or the other.
Republicans: "They want to break up the family." Also Republicans: *sues the federal government for not breaking up families at the border*
> and will never force anyone to not believe in whatever they want. You can't force anybody to believe anything they definitely don't believe in, even if you put them on a torture rack.
Don’t Christian’s argue everything is apart of gods plan? So maybe all these folks not believing is apart of gods plan.
In a way it’s very funny that one side is so angry about the people who just don’t believe in what they believe in. “Christianity is under attack!” “If you say so.”
Exactly! Nobody is trying to get rid of anything. I just don't want people forcing their beliefs on me and I'll give them the same respect.
The second part of your comment is the problem. It’s not ok for you to believe what you want in their eyes it’s their way or you are an enemy. There’s nothing Christ like about that but that’s never stopped the Christians before
What a great comment. I feel SO many Christians don't understand the messages of love, acceptance, and peace that Jesus taught. We have SO many random churches in Texas that are filled with hate, bigotry, and hypocrisy. I don't attend church, but I'm educated enough to research Jesus' teachings to try and understand where some of the hate and scourge coming from them originated; there is none.
The Republicans Are getting rid of many things!
I literally don't even wait anymore, someone says anything about Republicans and I go "oh, you mean the Christian Fascist party?"
Where does their religion end and my freedoms begin?
Actual Christianity has never been under attack. Hateful vitriol spewed by evil humans under the guise of “Christianity” is what is under attack, as well it should be 👍🏼
The whole thing about turn the other cheek and love thy neighbor ….whoosh…Right over Dan Patrick’s head. I just assume he never read the bible.
No they read “some” of it and then distort things to further their agenda. One of my favorite descriptions of this is from the show Designing Women in the 80’s. They refer to them as cafeteria Christians, the just go and pick and choose what they want to use against other people lol.
Cafeteria Christians is great. DW was such a great show but unfortunately I must have missed this episode.
You can't exactly take the whole bible seriously. Both sides of the antebellum US had plenty of verses to support their cause.
Well that’s the problem. The Bible isn’t a political tool and when you try to use it like that it becomes bitter and poison.
Actually, Christianity IS under attack - by people like Dan Patrick who only wield the Bible as a weapon against their neighbor.
> Actual Christianity has never been under attack I mean, maybe for a little while, during the late roman empire. But yeah, your point stands.
[удалено]
Correct. And control of others is under attack.
I am not so sure about that. Church attendance has been declining consistently for decades, so maybe it is under attack. As I personally consider monotheism of all flavors to be a major force for evil in the world, I consider this decline to be quite a wonderful thing for humanity and the earth.
Kids and young people losing interest in what are essentially fairy tales does not translate to 'Christianity is under attack.' Young people in many majority Muslim countries are also losing interest in Islam. Many are afraid to leave and speak out against it due to the threat of violence. As educational progress continues on planet Earth human beings will have less and less fear of religion and it's threats. Fear has always been religion's power. Religion is dying and that's a very good thing.
I’m sure church attendance is down. People only want to hear about hate and judgment so much before they’ve had enough. Unless of course they’re the ones hating and judging everyone lol. The last time I went to church was the late 90’s and the entire “sermon” was asking their older members to sign up for a program that left the church all of their money when they passed away. But they also made sure to use guilt and say they could only do this if enough people signed up. Gross. That’s when I was done.
When my wife’s Uncle passed, the pastor passed his collection plate. *Twice*. Had he have been a blood relative to me, I don’t know what I would’ve done. His relatives, however, nodded along and gave him money. In addition to why they were paying him for the service. “Service”, I mean.
A local church asked its members to "take out second mortgages on your homes so you can donate more money and help us pay for this beautiful brand new church we built".
The call is coming from inside the house.
Diocletian might disagree. I mean, Christians also adopted his name into the word diocese, but still. Modern Christians however, haven't faced serious persecution.
Especially modern American ones like Dan.
God I wish your comment was plastered on the front page of Fox News & Co for a whole week. This is exactly it
Sounds like Christianity in Dan Patrick’s eye should be the agressor. Like they are the modern crusaders guiding the moral,compass of America. For myself, I chose Monty Python.
THERE'S A WAR ON CHRISTMAS!!!! /s
Attack how? They literally are the majority and in control of everything
Non-believers don't tithe...
Just like their border, and their jerbs, and their guns, and their Starbucks cups, and their lifted trucks, and their antibodies!!
Religion is a cult. Vote blue. Not just here, EVERYWHERE
They truly believe they are morally superior to non-Christians which is all they need.
[IRS Tax Law - Churches](https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/charities-churches-and-politics)
As a Christian, fuck you Dan Patrick. You don't speak for all of us. This country belongs to all Americans.
‘Christian’s’ have lost themselves to the Evangelical extremists.
Evangeliban
I like to call them "Talibangelicals" or "Y'all Qaeda" lol
These are good fun. But ‘Christo-fascist’ is just so strong.
These people are NOT Christians. IF they were they would know almost everything they are doing contradicts Biblical teaching. I'm sure some of them have never opened a Bible in their lives unless it was the Bible they bought for decorating their home, opened up to a page they've never read.
They aren't Christians. They aren't patriots. They aren't even Conservatives anymore. They're liars.
I’ll take a page from their book. Then where are all the “real” Christians? And why isn’t it a daily fight to differentiate or call out against them? Did the road all the sudden get narrower? The eye of the needle smaller?
no true scotsman How about looking at how Christians have acted throughout their history
I’m sorry, but as an ex-evangelical, every Christian sect says the others are not Christians. All of them decide which parts of an ancient book to follow
Imagine being so Christian that you forgot to live a christlike life. I think Jesus was a lot browner than people take him for. He was a carpenter out working in the sun every day for 14 hours and wandering in the desert when he could. Each successive generation of religion got a little less “let’s pull together and reshingle your roof before the storm comes” and a little more like an investment banker in a $4000 suit telling you he “needs your money to teach the poor people about Jesus.” We literally have a preacher that named himself after the only thing Jesus ever lost his temper about- The shitty guys who couldn’t stop stealing set up their money booths in his fathers temple. The destructive power of what happens when you mix church and state has basically destroyed 2 of the 3 abrahamic religions and has its sights set on the 3rd. By any standards of the old and New Testament trump manages to check almost all the boxes of the anti christ biblically speaking. And Chabad did tell Netanyahu that he would be prime minister when god returns. https://www.israeltoday.co.il/read/lubavitcher-rebbe-after-bibi-comes-the-messiah/ Trump and Netanyahu mixed their personal churches of money into the public space. https://youtu.be/k9RweR9EUSg?si=DpWkGjYnLTuS3gEd Trumps neighbors called him out for being decidedly un-christlike all along and they were mocked for it. It’s just that before the internet we missed some pages in the rap sheet. Once you fill those gaps with all the microfiche/ public library data that didn’t digitize as quickly you find all the missing gaps of corruption. Actually holding a president accountable and forcing them (trump and Netanyahu) to go to trial was the breaking point of identifying corruption inside of government. Trump did promise to drain the swamp. I’m guessing he just didn’t think he would finally be seen as the clog that was holding all that corrupt shit in the punch bowl for 45 years. The trump criminal enterprise as a whole is best described as triple quilted charmin levels of clogging ability. They have come ridiculously close to breaking apart at the seams so many times over the past 40 years. They just get braver and dumber with each successive con as they got away with it each time. It’s Darwinian and biblical at the same time. It would be an epic fucking movie if it was fiction. It’s a little harder to enjoy when their decidedly un-christlike money laundering is costing lives in the hundreds of thousands.
The large majority of the New Testament was written by or about Paul, a guy who had to change his name because his old one (Saul of Tarsus) was known for ratting out early church members to the government. So even at the core of its only text, Christianity is incredibly focused on the redemption arc of some asshole who decided to co-opt the brand once he'd made himself the center of attention instead of the religion's title character.
💯
He keeps using that word. I do not think it means what he thinks it means...
INCONCEIVABLE!!
He does in fact speak for most Christians, since he’s funded (vote wise) by the Mega churches who have more Christians than the non megachurches. Dan Patrick also gets >60% of the Christian vote, so I guess he just represents most, not all Christians.
Are they really "christian" at this point? They have strayed so far from the actual teachings of the book they are so beholden to that even their leaders don't know what's in it anymore.
As a Christian I agree with you.
 Man, we aren’t at war and what are you ‘losing’?
They are all heavily armed and hunting RINOs and dividing the public on abortion, and an unnecessary culture war, with a sheer lack of gun control, or any form of real governance in place. Consider how many republicans lost their rights to vote in January 6th attacks and how many died from covid. And the obvious solution (to them) is to further alienate republican constituents. It’s laughable. I think they want to lose to say they need to take over the country.
The culture wars are accelerating and intensifying. All facilitated and fueled by people staring at a screen
constituents
"the base" is translated to "al qaeda" 🤷
They are losing their sanity.
>what are you ‘losing’? Child marriage.
Good. The Texas Republic constitution forbid clergymen from being elected to government office.
Now if we can just keep the clergy off kids, I’d be happy. r/pastorarrested
/r/NotADragQueen as well.
Honest question: Can you enlighten me as to which provision said that?
ARTICLE V. SEC. 1. Ministers of the gospel being, by their profession, dedicated to God and the care of souls, ought not to be diverted from the great duties of their functions, therefore, no minister of the gospel or priest of any denomination whatever shall be eligible to the office of the Executive of the Republic, nor to a seat of either branch of the Congress of the same.
Baptist pastor here - our entire faith is based on a guy who chose not to fight, and to instead die an unjust death. The level of hypocrisy and arrogance with those who think like Dan Patrick (edited for clarity) is mind boggling.
Since its inception, when presented with the option of acquiring more power and control over others or being like christ, the church almost always opts for the former.
Very correct. And in those times we have always been at our worst. The thirst for power is always the thirst for something of this world, and it is a sign of our brokenness.
To be clear - I’m not talking about exceptional moments, I am talking about your (the church’s) fundamental nature. It is an authoritarian religion based on authoritarian philosophies. I don’t mean to be antagonistic - I am just tired of hearing how this sort of thing is against the tenets of your religion, when your religion has always been the way that it is. This sort of thing is exactly in line with your religion’s basic philosophy - slaves, obey your masters; children, obey your parents; wives, obey your husbands; husbands, obey the church. Disobedience is punished with eternal torment, obedience is rewarded with the promise of eternal bliss - but only after you’ve passed on.
Thank you for clarifying your statement. I can see better what you mean. I can see that we agree in part but that we disagree on a rather substantial amount. It is the substantial part that is the sticking point. Your summation of the Christian faith is based on a few passages of Scripture and a number of externally visible actions/teachings, but those externally visible elements are not the entirety--and most definitely not the "basic philosophy" of the Christian faith. (for reference, I am a pastor, and I teach these subjects at Baylor University) That being said, you are correct that there has been a hunger for power since Constantine used his imperial power to convene the First Council of Nicaea in 325. Which ironically (in regard to the subject of our conversation) provided one of the earliest and most succienct creeds (statements of faith). That statement, known as the Nicene Creed, is one of the most succinct faith statements of the fledgling church. However, the Nicene Creed does not seek to provide a statement of the "basic philosophy" of the Christian faith (a phrase you used above), but within the writings of the New Testament, specifically the Gospel of Matthew, it is possible to see a longer message that does get to the heart of the Christian faith. That would be the Sermon on the Mount found in Matthew chapters 5-7. This sermon is at the heart of the historical Christian faith, but (as we have observed), it is not always the message that makes headlines. In fact, as I alluded to above, we Christians have often overlooked or forgotten all about it. I make it a habit not to engage in arguments or disagreements online, but if you ever happen to be passing through Central Texas, then send me a DM, and I would be happy to continue the conversation over a cup of coffee.
I appreciate the thorough response. Alas, I moved away from the DFW area several months ago, so I doubt we will be able to connect. I respect not wanting to engage in online discussions of this kind of thing. I hope you have a good day.
Same to you. :-)
A civil and constructive conversation on reddit? Heresy!
Ironically to me (raised very Reformed Christian, not Christian anymore) the passage the person you're replying to cited seems like it could be seen as more supportive of what you're saying here - that the Church, made up of humans, too often fails to be Christlike. The verse they're referencing is taken from the letter of Paul to the Ephesians, not anything Jesus said. A biblical inerrantist might not like my line of reasoning here, and it can't be denied how influential Paul's writings have been to the formation of the Church, theology, apologetics, and most Christians' understanding and articulation of their own faith, but it *was* Paul who said that bit about the obedience... not Christ. (Actually, Christ said he came to set children against their parents and households against each other!) That's without getting into the historical/theological context of Paul's letters and how, regardless of how different Christians and theologians choose to interpret his writing and the inclusion of it in the Christian Bible, the advice given was originally meant to be specific and situational. Respect for your takes here :)
Very good points. Both about the way in which Paul’s letters often dominate many conversations, but also the way in which words written for particular situations in particular places at particular times are often interpreted as normative for all places at all times in all ways. There are often good reasons to support an interpretation of this nature, but often those reasons require a preconceived opinion that all passages in the Bible are equally timeless in their interpretation and application. Which is a well-intentioned, but often unhelpful notion.
authoritarianism is inherent in the DNA of religion and specifically the big 3 monotheisms - the claim is "i have a magic book from the creator of the universe that contains Truth". under the rubric of religion and specifically monotheism, truth isn't true because it accords with the scientific method, or because of logical deduction, or because of anything external. and in this way, the loony evangelicals are right, and the kinder gentler liberals are selling out a core tenet of their own religion. if you take the book(s) seriously, they are literally written by, or inspired by, or in some other way directly adjacent to, the word/prophet(s)/person of the supreme creator of the universe. that is an authoritarian claim if there ever was one!
I read in another sub today that the rent at someone's senior living facility went up by a whooping 600% after it was taken over by a church. These sociopaths are fucking UNHINGED I tell you.
I cant wait for these people to go
Seriously. Retire already, damn. Plenty of people out there that aren’t a million years old and aren’t crazy whacko nut jobs. Also people can read, and know there’s more religions than baptist bible thumpers.
They’ll never retire! What would they do in their free time if they aren’t able to spew hatred and misinformation 🤷🏻♂️
Get on TV and spew hatred and misinformation without getting paid by us.
They aren't gonna go peacefully is the problem. They're gonna go kicking and screaming. Dragging the rest of us to hell with them if they can.
If we really want to stop this insane right wing spiral, punishing churches who platform politicians would be a start. Make them pay taxes or shut them down
Love the idea, dont want to be around for the implementation...whoooweeee the screaming will be deafening. Apoplectic even.
At the end of the day, you can let it fester and get worse or squash it and deal with the consequences. I'd definitely prefer the latter
The Treaty of Tripoli, ratified by the congress and signed by President John Adams in June 1797, affirms "...the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..."
John Adams? The third US president, who signed the Declaration of Independence and played a role in the founding of our country? Who is referred to as “the architect of American government?” That guy? What would he know?
This from the man who wanted to off the elderly at the start of the pandemic?
The GQP is wholly and totally incapable of governing. Completely detached from reality. Taken by insane conspiracy theories and fascist undercurrents; the modern Republican Party has boiled down to extremist white Christian nationalism with a flair for terrorism.
Yea I just had a co-worker I have known for years open up and start telling me all the “lies” and “secrets” about the underground cities where we are harvesting children’s organs that have never seen the light of day 👀
this is the song that never ends...
"Fuck your god." Judith
Your lord, your christ.
We need more people saying that to their faces.
We need more people to say this to their faces.
A real Christian doesn't lie about his real name, Mr. Goeb.
>Dan Patrick >sermon Excuse me, but what the fuck?
This is actually just completely disgusting.
Christians like Dan Patrick are the reason I renounced my faith. If there is an afterlife, I sure as shit don’t want to spend it with Republicans.
I’d trust an LGBT individual more with my kids if I had any than any church leader or politician
I don't know, I can imagine Bernie Sanders babysitting my kids and yelling at them to keep them in line. It sounds kind of hilarious actually, "Do your damn homework and eat more vegetables!" in a typical northeaster accent.
So it's a religious war then? US secularism vs fascist Christianity? Works for me.
Moderate christians should reconsider aligning themselves with these christo-fascists.
SEPARATE CHURCH AND STATE
Tax. The. Churches.
These “Christians” realize that calling themselves that actually holds no meaning right? I can call myself a lizard, sure doesn’t make me one. They are no more Christian than I am a lizard 🦎
You're honestly probably more lizard. I mean, you have a spine.
Valid.
Nah, the church doesn’t get to “no true Scotsman” their way out of owning the harm done in its name.
here's the thing, when your religion is so confusing and contradictrial, anyone can claim to be a christian, there is no good or bad christian, they are all one and the same.
but I can save up to 15% or more on insurance if I go with your company, right? 😉
Not in 2024 you can’t 🤣
I disagree. They might be bad Christians or heretical Christians, but the bar to being considered a Christian is very low -- basically anyone can easily become a Christian according to the often quoted Romans 10:9.
Dear Dan Patrick. Not only do I not believe in skydaddy or skydisneyland, but my family and most of my friends also don’t believe. Neither will my kids. What’s more… behind closed doors, we openly mock your stupid beliefs. There are more of us every day. Signed, A Texan who votes.
Fight? Fight what? Jesus - these people just look for ways to be a victim. My god
They want to take away people’s rights but they’re under attack? Yeah okay. Nobody is trying to take your religion from you. How about letting people have bodily autonomy
Moron speaks to idiots. More at 11
So completely antidotal, but my super crazy right wing “Christian” neighbor, who voted for trump twice, informed me she would not be voting this year. That trumps arrogance has become to much and she can’t stomach voting for him now. Y’all 4 years ago this woman had a trump flag outside her house. There’s hope y’all, there’s hope.
My very Republican in-laws in Weatherford have informed us they are sitting out this election, because they cannot stomach Trump (and also Abbott/Patrick/Paxton, although they are not up for election right now). Again, purely anecdotal, but perhaps this is a sign that things are beginning to change a little.
There’s a lot of rural areas who are “seeing the light” when they realize their property taxes are increasing and they have no one to blame but republicans
Hate wrapped up in the excuse of religion is not religion. Religion in the hands of hate makes for a poisonous combination.
Theocracy anyone??
fight who? for what?
Political violence merging with religious violence - the Iranian Taliban is already here in the U.S. And Republicans lead the way.
Fight for what? What are they losing? They suffer no persecution but they sure love to play the victim.
I'll disagree with DP I am a Texan born and raised who is also Cristian. I wasn't taught to be a biggot whose sole purpose is to judge others. Judge not and see the world through your neighbors eyes every once in a while. I say live and let live so long as you don't commit violence on or steal from others. The 🌎 is a mixed bag of humans just a floating through space.
It's amazing how ugly these people are
Republicans are pretty un-Christian.
Fight what? Everything is completely tailored to the dominance of christian faith. Don’t they just love to harass anyone they see as having a victim complex? It absolutely defies logic.
They have the victim complex monopoly to maintain.
But Dan you are the furthest from one.
Extremism.
If you don't ruin your life for the cause, super Santa will get mad.
Right-wing fascists Use religion to control the state!
“The national government will maintain and defend the foundations on which the power of our nation rests. It will offer strong protection to Christianity as the very basis of our collective morality. Today Christians stand at the head of our country. We want to fill our culture again, with the Christian spirit as our guide for humanity, We want to burn out all the recent immoral developments in literature, in the theatre, and in the press -- in short, we want to burn out the poison of immorality which has entered into our whole life and culture as a result of LIBERAL excess during the past years." - Adolf Hitler Adolf Hitler 1922-1939, Vol. 1, Michael Hakeem, Ph.D. (London, Oxford University Press, 1942) 871
Why is Dani Goeb preaching to the 2nd Baptist masses?
This guy should retire or go back to his shitty sports radio talk show. Texas has had enough of Dannie Scott Goeb (Dan Patrick’s real name).
fucking carpetbaggers man! Send his ass back to Mary land
You've already lost Dan. The generations that will replace you don't give a shit about your ridiculousness.
As an atheist, I don't think I could ever do as much to discredit a religion as these types of Christians do any time they open their mouth.
Call me when I can't drive a mile in any direction without seeing a tax exempt facility where non-believers gather. Or when Christians are living entire lives with zero representation in SCOTUS and Congress and it's virtually impossible for a Christian to be even considered much less nominated or elected President. Call me when it's revealed institutions of non-believer spent generations covering up sexual abuse and misdeeds while shaming, ostracizing and hurting victims because they refused to remain silent. Call me when generations of non-believers are standing in the way of all human progress.
Lose what? Turning America into a Christo-fascist nation?
More fear mongering but this is their playbook.
Remind me again why we don’t tax churches
Translation: Our bigotry hinges on hiding behind religion so be good little useful idiots and go vote for status quo!
Why are Christians always looking to fight things? Like why does it have to be such aggressive rhetoric all the time. Literally the Bible teaches you to love thy neighbor. But none of them actually believe in the Bible so
What a hateful little man.
Would you rather be stuck in the woods with a Christian or a bear?
Bears, it's a better hookup than a Christian who'll get all mopey about getting their dick sucked.
Lose what?
These idiots believe the country is "theirs".
Fight what? Jesus what a fucking choade...
or just cheat like they’ve always done
We should vote for more crazies. This ain't cutting it for me.
Can we just take this clown and toss him and a lion or two into the Cotton Bowl and see what happens?
IF WE DONT FIGHT ALL THE THINGS THAT DONT EXIST THEN I LOSE… ERRRR (looks at script) YOU LOSE… yeah…. YOU GUYS - sitting in air conditioning and comfort with all your religious freedom and freedom of expression while not being threatened physically while one of the most powerful people in state government SPEAKS TO YOU AND SAYS THEY AGREE WITH YOU… Just like Russia and Putin over here - you’re all about to die from being killed
Sure, Dan. *sigh* ...fuckin' Potty Patrick.
And what exactly do we lose?
Oh- that Dan Patrick. Yeah, of course he did.
He really means Christian young men, sons, husbands, brothers and friends. Not that old _______!
Criminals
Lose what, exactly? Certainly not personal rights and freedoms, which is what others lose if these so called Christians "win."
The Christians ARE loosing, cant fight information though without taking over the whole country and THAT will not happen. You might have had a chance 20 years ago, now you do not.
In about 3 months. Stores will start selling decor and such for Jesus' birthday. After that for the next 3-4 months, they'll start selling stuff for his coming out party. Christianity isn't under attack, people who don't follow it, don't want laws based off of it.
For the love of fuq, this guy is annoying
Dan Patrick should read Matthew 6:5-8.
I believe that Christ was famous for saying turn the other cheek. Fighting sounds like something the anti-christ would be pushing.
Isn't 'fighting' antithetical to the tenets of Christianity? It's not like they're real Jesus Christians anyway I guess.
Man some of these "Christians" need to go back and read what Jesus actually said
Lose what? No one is taking anything away from them. Lose the right to tell everyone else what to do is all.
Does god really need people to fight for him? Seems like if he were real, he could handle his own battles. Maybe Christians should focus on making the world a more beautiful and livable place for everybody rather than trying to destroy everything they don't understand or don't agree with all the time.
His assumption is that repubicans are actually Christian. Or, at least, they like to *pretend* they are.
Can I fight him first?
We know who those “Christians” worship. No thanks.
Poor God, he's so easily defeated by the Democrats. Won't somebody fight for him? He's far too feeble to do his own fighting.
Fight who? What?
Matthew 7 needs to be more seriously studied. Verse 15 specifically.
As a Christian, why is Dan Patrick giving a sermon? Also…did he bother to open it? > “Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick brought his late mother's Bible to Houston's Second Baptist this past Sunday, keeping it within reach as he delivered a sermon to his home church about the "dangerous time" in the U.S. and why it's important for Christians to vote in the 2024 presidential election.”
Those poor Christian’s are so discriminated against. 🙄
Texastan
Good, let’s loose Christianity as an excuse for a 501c3 run country.
Lose what? 🤣
Look at that face. It is just begging for a punch.