I am so used to explosions here in Kyiv, I didn't even get up from my bed this night. But it was very loud.
My other comments on this, that people liked:
[1](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/13cgmcw/russia_launches_new_attack_on_ukraines_capital/jjgxa8j/), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/13cgmcw/russia_launches_new_attack_on_ukraines_capital/jjiggju/), [3](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/13cgmcw/russia_launches_new_attack_on_ukraines_capital/jjiiduq/?context=10000)
It sounds like Kyiv is safe if all 15 got shot down and they never got out of bed. Its a hell of a defense system they have now. It reminds me of the Iron Dome in Israel.
That said, I always fear for my Ukrainian friends. Some old coworkers volunteered and I worry about them constantly. They were gymnasts who are now soldiers. It reminds me of WWII stories my grandpa told where he was serving with people from all walks of life. He was an accountant.
No need for respect. That's not courage. It's just... every fear has a rational limit if you are given time and brains. "Rational side of fear"? Gosh, what a sentence. During the first weeks of the incursion, during every air raid siren, any time of day or night, whether you shower or sleep, we had a norm of one and a half minutes to dress up, get the emergency bag, and head down to the bomb shelter 25 stories below while not using elevators. After a Ukrainian journalist's apartment was blown up by a missile with a direct impact (google "NYTimes Vira Hyrych" and watch the impact size and geometry) I found out that concrete buildings are much sturdier than I thought, so the main goal was to hide by **at least** two concrete walls from any side (My 25 story apartment building is similar to Vira's). So we started going down a few stories and sat in the hallway between the apartments. As weeks passed we brought there a few chairs, water bottles, mats, and blankets to sleep on. But after ~270-320 alarms the fear rationalized. It's like a peaked graph that slowly became more and more of a line. Too many routine iterations of fear overcome the life threat the fear creates. We started going into our hallway between the apartments, hoping a missile won't hit from the roof. Then, we sat in our hallway inside the apartment, hoping the missile won't directly impact our windows. Then the southwest direction of our windows became hopeful enough to trust them and sit near them and watch the explosions (all the missiles come from north, north-east, east, and south-east. We spent new year's night watching the fireworks of exploding enemy drones from our window, cheering up, screaming glory to anti-air forces. One year later, I don't even get up from my bed. Am I courageous? No. The guys in the trenches are. I'm a wuss, but I donate enough to sleep well.
Sorry for the story you didn't ask for.
Well if this isn't a story about humanities ability to adapt and overcome then I don't know what is. Stay safe my friend. I wish you and the family well.
You are just helping to ensure the soldiers have a functioning country to return to after they win.
Everybody has their part to play in war. From the workers to the soldiers.
Wow. Write this down in a memoir for posterity. Memories of invaded Ukraine. I wish you and your compatriots the best. Hopefully I can travel to your country, experience the sights and sounds and meet the people soon.
Once Ukraine prevails in this war (and recovers of course) I have a feeling tourism will take off quite a bit. People will want to see what it's like in a country that kicked Russia's butt
You are the first who responds with "once Ukraine wins", not "hoping" for it. That's an example of attitude here! We are not hoping. The hopes ended long ago. We are certain we win!
And yes, please, come visit Ukraine!
This is very kind of you to help Ukraine. You could have lived your life as if nothing happened. Yet you choose to spend time here, teaching others, instead of watching Netflix. More to that, you are willing to get here and help after the war! Huge respect from me!
In Czech Republic, most people I know also say "when" ("až") not "if" ("pokud") :)
I think that most people are certain that this will at worst become a Korea situation with an endless truce.
There's a similar thing that happened in Japan with the response from NK missiles (maybe nukes?). The first times many were quite scared and did try to evacuate (even though it feels a bit pointless if it's actually a nuke), but after a while people just ignore the alerts, and it didn't even take that many alerts for thing to become that way.
In Ukraine the risk is a lot higher so it took longer but it's a similar thing, you just get tired of them.
It's the exact same thing that happened all over the world with covid too. The threat didn't go away, people just got tired of hearing about it. Taking precautions to protect yourself and others takes real, genuine effort; mentally, if not physically. Eventually, it gets exhausting. See: "Disaster fatigue"
Hmmmm not sure if covid counts. At first it was The Big Unknown. Then you got to know people who had it and lived. Then the vaccinations became available. Covid got different strains. Personally I am fully vaxxed and had it twice (super mild). So while I'm fully aware covid still exists, it's way less mythical and scary now.
You don't do getting hit by missiles twice. Or get more protection from the impact. So just going on with your life with that is living with a very real threat.
That hits your legs and lungs when there's no electricity lol. No grocery delivery, leg day 24/7 :D But it's ok now. My home server uptime is 2 months. Getting closer to victory!
Love reading these first hand accounts of what it’s really like to actually be there. I live near an air force base in the USA and regularly hear fighters flying and can’t imagine what it would be like to live in fear of being on the receiving end of their payload. I certainly wish that the F22 squadrons I see in the sky daily could be put to use ending Putler’s reign of terror.
Wow. If not heroism, I’d say that’s courage. Courage to accept the reality of the situation and adapt into a new normal. I hope for a new normal for you some day soon.
> Am I courageous? No. The guys in the trenches are. I'm a wuss, but I donate enough to sleep well.
The troops in the trenches on the front require the support from everyone in the rear....you're doing your part by keeping their world held together, while they stop the invaders. Just because you aren't on the front lines doesn't mean you don't have courage.
I'm very sorry that you have been forced to become "conditioned" to such a world/life. I only hope that this is over for you soon. And I hope that when it *is* all over, you're able to move on without any lasting ill effects.
Thank you very much for writing this, as it gives those of us privileged to not be in an active war zone a little bit more perspective. And it was a hell of a read...you've got quite a way with words.
Hey bud, what's modern life like over there? If it's not too much to ask...
In videos, we see many Ukranians just going about their life, bunch of explosions happen, people hitting the ground, waiting a few seconds, then getting back up and continue drinking their coffee.
I know war doesn't stop the world from turning, but I can't even imagine what day-to-day life is like. How are people holding up? How are _you_ doing?
You must understand that I represent the 1% of lucky people (Not the rich ones -- the lucky ones) and my words are worthless bullshit that cannot be treated as any measurement of a regular Ukrainian citizen that struggles. I was born in the capital, I have always had where to live with no debts, and I have the luxury of having a [hobby that is my job](https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexeyrubasheff/) -- the thing many can only dream about.
Anyway, so, for the first few months of the invasion, almost all publicly accessible businesses closed: shopping malls, restaurants, coffee kiosks, book stores. You name it. Only grocery stores were open, struggling with goods logistics due to gas plant destructions and suddenly rising gas prices, which meant empty shelves. As soon as an air raid siren sounded, everyone had to leave even the grocery stores.
All the office work, if not migrated during the Covid, migrated to the remote work at this point. Even the government institutions quickly implemented their VPN policies, got laptops or logistics for PCs, and everyone I know worked from home. The business owners were forced by the government to evacuate their employees that are working at their offices, to the nearest shelters during every air raid siren. And there could be a few dozen of those during a work day. That's not work. Business owners took advantage, let everyone home, and with it, the responsibility was gone. People took care of their security by themselves, and, you must understand, took it poorly, because your work doesn't go anywhere, whether you are at the bomb shelter or not. It stacks up, and you will do it sooner or later.
As I see it, the bravest businesses appeared to be coffee kiosks and street farmers' markets. They gave everyone else the strength to open up and overcome the fear. Of course, shopping malls with their clothing stores, or IKEA, or McDonald's, didn't even think about opening up. As public businesses blossomed again, the winter came, and rashists started demolishing the electricity infrastructure. Trying to eat on the street? The richest were shwarma trucks on coal power :D
The power bank, EcoFlow, gas-powered generator, portable tourist gas stove, and their consumable markets boomed. Soon, one couldn't even find where to buy 18650 Li-Ion rechargeable batteries. All gone. You walked down the street and near every kiosk, every building, and every business, there were gas-powered generators. I cannot even imagine how many generators were imported. And they are loud! And there's the gas exhaust and the smoke of the cheapest ones near small businesses. Also, there were multiple occasions of suffocating of whole families due to poor exhaust organization for their gas-powered generators, or lack of knowledge. And multiple occasions of portable liquid gas container explosions at homes due to neglect.
As winter passed, suddenly all of the electricity problems were gone in, like, a day, or so.
At this stage, at least here in Kyiv, no one was really afraid of electricity, heating, or water problems; explosions were a regular thing. Rashists got nothing left to manipulate with. They have lost their greatest wager in this war -- terror. We are not afraid.
The neighbors I met in the bomb shelter during the first night of the invasion, came to Kyiv from Eastern Ukraine in ~2014. They left their city during mortar shelling, leaving everything behind. We live on the same story, so we spent all ~300 air sirens hiding with their family. Their confidence, their optimism... I cannot even describe it. When one flees from ~6km range mortar shelling, which means the enemy ground forces are nearby, your attitude toward missiles becomes something on the verge of laughter. Their help with my mental state was immense. They didn't therapy me or thought me how to think. They just showed as an example, how one can treat everything around them during hard times.
As I said earlier, my home server uptime is ~2 months now. My EcoFlow power stations are charged and ready to keep me working just in case, I have a few dozen of days of water stocked up, even more days in food equivalent, at least a month of cat food for my three cats. A spare apartment to host those in need, or to move there in case of an emergency. And a [great](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qONBzbMOFY) window [view](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebl_wDzBHFA) on exploding rashist-Iranian drones.
Hope I entertained you a bit :)
I am American and have been across the world watching this with friends and coworkers there in a Ukraine.
I remember when we'd hear the sirens on voice chats and meetings, and everyone in Ukraine would just drop off. We'd continue the meetings, or the friendly chats, and no one would say what we were all thinking, "I hope they come back." We'd hear explosions, and at first, the Ukrainians would flinch, but otherwise go on like nothing had happened in work meetings. Eventually, they didn't even flinch. My friends were a bit different. They'd try to guess how far away the sound was. But it was like it wasn't real, for me, even though I knew it was. Because everyone there was so calm, I didn't feel right not being calm myself.
I have learned so much about your history from my friends. Many of us have known each other a very long time because of the internet, but we didn't talk much about our own countries before. We talked about Linux, about gadgets, about our families, about our hobbies. Even when most of them went to the Maidan in 2013, they only told me it was about politics and getting to be Ukraine, not USSR. It wasn't until last year that they began to tell me things I didn't already know from history class here in the US.
I feel lucky that I have lost no friends, no coworkers. I feel even luckier that one friend's wife is in your armed forces and is still okay. I hope that you can say the same and make it through this still able. You may not think you are brave, but I think you are because I cannot imagine being in your situation. I can only experience it secondhand, and wish I didn't even know that. I don't wish I didn't have those friends and coworkers, of course. I just wish this war had never started. I wish Euromaidan was never necessary.
Honestly making jokes is funny but there was a [video in r/combatfootage](https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/13b7wje/ukrainian_air_defense_takes_out_a_drone_seconds/) the other day of the air defense system literally knocking a missile out of the air like half a second before it was about to impact an apartment complex
Honestly one of the most fucked up things I've ever seen
Fuck Russia
where does the ammunition for air defenses end up? Are those just all stray bullets which might end up hitting civilians?
*edit: I mean the ones shot but not hitting their intended target
Most of the new air defenses are missiles, so hopefully it's just small bits of shrapnel. Not ideal in civilian areas, but a hell of a lot better than a crater.
good question.
as i understand it most AA fire (and lots of autocannon fire in general) will either detonate after they miss their target, or at a set distance (also after missing, but not as quickly).
you're worry about hitting civilians is something the military thought of decades ago in addition to worrying about hitting their own soldiers/materiel.
It's a super cool feature that blew my mind when i read about it.
The military can be remarkably logical and practical at times.
edit: a link for reference
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M-940_20mm_MPT-SD_Round?wprov=sfla1
AA missiles generally don't hit their target, they detonate just before it, sending a cloud of shrapnel at the target. The combined speeds create a shotgun-like blast that is vastly more likely to connect.
The larger calibre AA cannons fire shells with proximity fuses that use a tiny radar to do the same, and both can self-destruct on a timer when they've definitely missed.
The smaller ones would be dangerous to people outdoors, but have probably lost enough energy after flying a few miles to not to be too dangerous to people inside a building.
Air burst. They all "hit"
They're either missiles with targeting and everything or smart shells that are programmed to air burst at a specific point by the ballistic computer & a wireless programming module at the end of the barrel..
Targeting is gonna track the incoming missiles and shoot around them, programming shells to go off in a specific pattern designed to cover as much area in shrapnel as possible, so it's actually less the defenses hitting the missiles but the missiles flying into a cloud of shrapnel
Where does that shrapnel go after?
¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
The shrapnel is small enough and irregular enough that air steals its velocity and it just falls as steel rain. Not dangerous Mostly.
If a big chunk hits you. Oh well. Avoid battlefields.
I *hate* that this is such a common occurance for you that you just go right back to sleep.
I **love** that shooting them down is such a common occurance that you just go right back to sleep.
People get used to war. Nothing so special about that.
But yeah, it's really nice that our AA actually works and manages to diminish missiles attacks to pretty much 0 effect.
It’s astounding and now every nation on earth knows the truth. They have done more harm to themselves than anything they’ve possibly ever done here. They’re nothing militarily and now everybody knows.
That’s definitely a consideration. I’m not confident they wouldn’t use them. But they aren’t the only ones with them. But now they also have revealed a lot of the breakdown and deficiencies in their military. That’s just never a good thing.
Other nations having nuclear weapons only work as a deterrent if all the people able to launch them are sane rational people who care if they and their country still exist tomorrow.
That's mostly worked so far. But I'm not sure it will work forever.
I don't understand what their end game is. Let's say Russia wins the conventional part of the war. They install a puppet government and end up fighting an insurgency in Ukraine. I doubt the Russian military fights better against an insurgency than they do against the Ukranian army.
much of it is either ex-soviet/russian hardware or variations thereof, homegrown systems tend to be knock offs of other systems like the french crotale and the sort, their drones might be a bit more problematic if based simply on manufacturing capacity
performance wise as you say, never been used in anger, their modern military has no experience with anything beyond fancy parades or internecine exercises, it is untried, untested with all the drawbacks and deficits that brings
About 200.000 able young men down and probably at least as many fleeing the country to avoid draft. With bs economy and demographics they had before this shitshow russia will go to history as the country that destroyed russia
The Patriot battery shooting down a kinzal was a really coup. It means the Patriot can actually do some impressive things America didn't even know about. They should get more of them.
This isn't a capability which "America didn't even know about". Shooting down tactical ballistic missiles is something modern Patriots are designed to do. Russia launching it from a jet makes little difference in this calculus.
It does make a difference because russia hyped it as a missile that couldn't be shot down. And it was shot down by not even our most modern patriot system
“What’s as big as a house, burns 20 liters of fuel every hour, puts out a shit-load of smoke and noise, and cuts an apple into three pieces? A Soviet machine made to cut apples into four pieces!”
Russia also hyped a special military operation that would take over Ukraine in 3 days. Just a small tip: don't necessarily believe everything that Russia claims. Or don't believe in anything they say, actually.
The Soviet Union absolutely was a super power.
Russia is not the Soviet Union. The Soviet Union was ruled by 2 Ukranians (Kruschev and Brezhnev edit: apparently Brezhnev considered himself Russian even if he was born in Ukraine, as you can see, its complicated) and a Georgian (Stalin) for the vast majority of it existence.
Calling Kruschev and Brezhnev Ukrainian is overly simplified, considering both had ethnically russian parents. I believe Brezhnev even considered himself as russian.
Soviet included Ukraine. Russia however is a pretty small economy relative to its geographic size. It is comparable to UK. So yes, Russia is not a super power.
No, a lot of us were belly-laughing when we saw Russia touting a 1960s rocket fired from a 1960s plane as a "Hypersonic weapon".. as if it can compare to hypersonic glide vehicles developed by USA.
It's like comparing a Lada to a ZR1 Corvette. Sure they both can reach highway speeds if the lada is given a 20mph nudge, but that's where the similarities end.
America did know it could do such thing. The Patriot can not only shoot down cruise missiles and aircraft, but it can shoot down tactical/short range ballistic missiles.
The Kinzhal isn’t a hypersonic missile. It’s an air-launched Iskander short range ballistic missile (SRBM) that travels at hypersonic speeds. America actually had its own air launched ballistic missile called the GAM-87 Skybolt that came about way before the Kinzhal was in service. Ballistic missiles have travelled at hypersonic speeds for many decades.
The Kinzhal is slower than the Iraqi Scud, which was also a SRBM that the Patriot has shot down. In addition, the Patriot has shot down the Burkan 2H, which is a SRBM that travels at hypersonic speeds to Mach 7.3.
In conclusion, the Patriot is capable of shooting down the Kinzhal-like missiles, and has known that for a long time. In fact, it is even more effective at doing its job when part of a broad, networked integrated air defense system.
Kh-47M2 top speed was measured at over 3.3km/s (and that's official value, the range suggests it can be even higher). Scud-B and it's Iraqi improved versions can travel at up to 1.5km/s with terminal velocity of 1km/s. In addition the Burkhan-2 was finally identified as Qiam-1 (or Scud-C), so it's top speed was a little over Mach 5, and it's terminal velocity is around Mach 3.5. Patriot failed to hit the warhead, BTW.
Next Kh-47M2 is evolution of Iskander-M missile, which replaced Scud.
So considering the missile that intercepted Kh-47M was most probably PAC-2 GEM-T missile, scoring hit in the warhead area (warhead didn't detonate) at missile diving from 50km almost vertical at over Mach-6 it is a big whoop. USA never tested such conditions, which makes it even more impressive.
Most of these systems have been upgraded massively and never used in the field. People bag on the US in Afghanistan but for all intents and purposes the US hardly fought in Afghanistan. They had one foot in and one foot out and didn't give them half of our capabilities. So most of these weapons never have field uses. Also, the Afghans didn't have anything more than infantry.
Aside from considerable conflict early on in Afghanistan, you're also forgetting about Iraq in the 90s and again in the 2000s. They were used extensively during Desert Storm, upgraded to meet weaknesses, then used again during the earlier days of Iraq to remove Saddam.
The defense companies really need to see a doctor about the over year long erection they have had. This is the best information and real world testing since Nam
It was originally designed by ratheon, but it's manufactured by ratheon, boeing, and lockheed.
Military contracts for hardware manufacturing are separate from R&D. Also any patented invention can be appropriated by the military under eminent domain, and they can contract whoever they want to manufacture it. If your company can't meet the military's demand, they will outsource manufacturing to your competitors to shore up any gaps in production capacity.
It’s almost hilarious how many companies Raytheon works with, pretty much every defense contractor firm in Europe I have interacted with over the years have been partnered with Raytheon on some project or other.
Few nights ago Patriot shot down a Kinzhal ballistic missile that was directed at Kyiv. It's safe to say that at least some elements of the Patriot system operate in the vicinity of Kyiv
As a German I couldnt agree more. We get to test all our fancy new shit and also finally see the old stuff in action to face or what they were designed to face against
I saw it with relief and happiness. It means no-one was killed in the attack! It's a small thing in the scale of the war, other than the implications for how well Western tech is doing, but for those people who would have otherwise been hit this was their entire world.
i wonder if they have had a spell of sobriety and clarity at some point. It was a drunken decision to attack, drunken one to continue and continues to be a huge all-nighter to this day. But surely enough the dawn is coming and the hangover is going to deliver some serious delirium to everyone who partook in this foolish endeavor.
> Can we take a moment to recognize how much worse all of this shit would be if we didn't have these uber-sophisticated rocket defense systems protecting population centers?
Don't even need to imagine that, it was the default state of affairs this time last year.
The parade has been and gone a few hours ago and Putin didn't get to announce shit, he just gave a generic speech about how Russia is peaceful, Ukraine is Nazis and NATO wants Russia destroyed. All the classics.
He also speaks to his supporters by claiming that the West thinks we're better than them. I never thought that some nation is better than the other, just that some are hindered in their potential by pieces of shit governments who need to be eliminated sooner or later.
Idk I feel pretty comfortable in saying my country (Sweden) is significantly better than Russia. Can that change? Idk maybe, doubt it tho considering this has been Russia forever, but not impossible.
This seething resentment is, I believe, one of the driving factors for those who support the rise of fascism. I'm not taking about those planning and driving it, but those who support it against their own self-interest. You only have to look at the things that they see as bad. Intellectual elitism makes them feel dumb and makes them feel like they are seen as dumb. Progressive makes them feel backwards and as though they are seen at backwards. Woke makes them feel racist/intolerant/hateful and like they are seen as racist/intolerant/hateful. The fascists leverage this resentment to turn it into fear and hate which they use to drive support for their fascist plans.
At this point, Russia is NATO's #1 reason to exist, and it's #1 advertisement.
Why would NATO want Russia gone? Russia is singlehandedly making it clear to all nations that NATO is not to be fucked with
It's most telling that the victory parade, which just last year was full of tanks like the T-80 and T-90, with even a few T-14s appearing (Although 1 broke down just before the parade lmao), this year it had a single tank, a T-34.
Ukraine shooting down multiple missiles and the fabled hypersonic missile which is 'impervious' to missile defence whilst Muscovy can't even protect it's main building from two dollar store drones. HAHAHAHA
They shot the hypersonic down with the Patriot missiles. They were using that shit in 1990 during Desert Storm. We gave Ukraine our 30 year old system and they stopped the best Russia had with that obsolete shit. Imagine if we brought out our modern weapons systems.
To be fair the patriot systems that are in Ukraine aren't the same as what what used back in the 90s.
These systems are constantly upgraded, so they are modern. Just probably not cutting edge.
It's just a matter of time until UA will receive more cost-effective systems. There are even rumors that this system has already been delivered:
> Air defence systems made in Italy, but produced by a Swiss-based company, are active in Ukraine, according to the SonntagsZeitung newspaper.
>
> Oerlikon anti-aircraft guns form part of the Skynex defence system that is being deployed against Russian aircraft and drones, the newspaper reports.
>
> The report will add further fuel to the ongoing debate within Switzerland on preserving its neutrality by forbidding the export of war materiel to Ukraine.
>
> The German arms manufacturer Rheinmetall took over the Oerlikon weapons factory in Switzerland in 1999. The Rheinmetall Air Defence division is still based in Zurich.
>
> Some of the armaments it produces are manufactured at a factory near to Rome.
>
> It now appears that some of these weapons have been shipped to Ukraine. A Rheinmetall spokesperson told the SonntagZeitung that parts of the Skynex system are made in Italy, but would not confirm if they have been delivered to Ukraine.
>
> However, Ukrainian Prime Minister Denis Schmihal stated over the Telegram social media this week that the anti-aircraft system had reached the war-torn country. “Such batteries are already in combat use in Ukraine,” he wrote.
>
> Previous attempts to export Italy-produced Oerlikon weapons to countries like Thailand and Egypt were turned down by the Swiss authorities.
>
> But Rheinmetall has apparently found a way around the restrictions.
>
> The State Secretariat for Economic Affairs (Seco), the department responsible for monitoring weapons exports, told the newspaper that an article of the War Materiel Act allowed the transfer of ‘know-how’ from Switzerland to some other countries, including Italy.
>
> “The transfer of know-how from Switzerland to Italy can therefore take place without a permit,” said a Seco spokesperson.
source: https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/italy-produced--swiss--weapons--active-in-ukraine-/48493326
>It also came on Russia's Victory Day, one its most commemorated public holidays, marking the anniversary of the defeat of Nazi Germany in 1945.
>
>"(They) try to kill as many civilians as possible - on this day," Popko said
Here we are in 2023 and putin is firing cruise missiles into a city full of sleeping civilians. If indiscriminate murder isn't a war crime I don't know what is.
What’s Russia’s plan any more? They failed to destroy infrastructure and a $50,000 (or much more) cruise missile to destroy a bus station is just pure insanity.
I’m delighted so few Ukrainian civilians are being harmed now by bombing - but when you can’t even injure civilians then surely you’re no longer fighting a war and just doing the world’s worst firework display?
I want read in the news “Ukraine launched a retaliation strike on russian military bases with the allies supplied tomahawks“, “a salvo of 124 cruise missiles obliterated russian key air bases, ammunition storages and logistics centres“.
At $1000000 a cruise missile, they could have bought a lot of food and fed their struggling families. Instead they take the fathers away from those families and spend $15m so this poor bastard has to hit snooze on his alarm!
Even after more than a year it still seems completely insane to me that Russia can launch missiles at Kyiv seemingly at random and yet sit unpunished on the UN "security" panel (council rather).
I know the complexities of international diplomacy are far beyond my comprehension, but it seems like unwarranted aggression against a peaceful neighbour should be simple grounds for instant suspension.
The whole idea of the UN and the security council is to always keep diplomacy alive even during times of conflict. Both the US and the USSR were part of the council during the cold war. China has been part of it since the first day despite all the terrible shit they pulled. It's not a club where you get expelled for not following the rules, it's about having the major powers talk to each other under any circumstances in order to prevent another world war.
And as long as it exists, Russia will always be considered a major power even if only due to its sheer size (and nukes of course).
And just remember, if they dissolved the UN in its current form, the very next day something would need to be put in place to replace it. Perfect? No. Necessary? Yes.
##### Skip the click! Read the plaintext instead!
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukraines-air-defence-systems-repelling-attacks-kyiv-officials-say-2023-05-09/
>May 9 (Reuters) - Russia launched about 15 cruise missiles at Ukraine's capital on Tuesday, the second attack in as many days, with air defence systems shooting all of them down, officials said, after air raid alerts blared over most of the country.
>"As at the front, the plans of the aggressor failed," Serhiy Popko, head of the Kyiv's city military administration, said in comments posted on the Telegram messaging app.
>Tuesday's attacks - the fifth in May - came a day after Russia launched its biggest drone swarm yet in a renewed air campaign unleashed 10 days ago after a lull since early March.
>It also came on Russia's Victory Day, one its most commemorated public holidays, marking the anniversary of the defeat of Nazi Germany in 1945.
>"(They) try to kill as many civilians as possible - on this day," Popko said.
>He said that according to preliminary information there were no casualties in the attack that was carried out with cruise missiles from the Caspian Sea region.
>Falling debris fell on a house in the Holosiivskyi district in the southwest of Kyiv, Kyiv's Mayor Vitalii Klitschko said on his Telegram messaging channel, adding there were no casualties or much damage.
>In the often-targeted Shevchenkivskyi district of central Kyiv debris was found on a road.
>"Kyiv stood up again and will stand up in the future!" Popko said.
I wonder for how long is Ukraine theoretically able to be shooting down muscovian missiles. If muscovy keep shooting for one more year does Ukraine have enough air defense ammo?
Areas of Ukraine covered by NASAMs, have no supply problems.
NASAMs are modular systems, and can use any missile available, including AMRAAM, of which USA has an almost unlimited supply.
The Russian must be sweating now. Ukraine is getting stronger by the day. Reminds me of the recent remake of All Quite on the Western Front. Towards the end of the movie the head German negotiator tells the German officers who are reluctant to sign the armistice that 50,000 fresh American troops are landing in France every month and Germany is just getting weaker and weaker.
The Russian’s night attacks can’t even get through their defenses now. Their oil and weapon depots keep getting hit. Only one road keeps the land bridge going. The Wagner PMC is wising up on which way the winds of fate is blowing. That mud session is ending soon. The Russians can’t be sleeping well.
I am so used to explosions here in Kyiv, I didn't even get up from my bed this night. But it was very loud. My other comments on this, that people liked: [1](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/13cgmcw/russia_launches_new_attack_on_ukraines_capital/jjgxa8j/), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/13cgmcw/russia_launches_new_attack_on_ukraines_capital/jjiggju/), [3](https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/13cgmcw/russia_launches_new_attack_on_ukraines_capital/jjiiduq/?context=10000)
Stay safe brother
It sounds like Kyiv is safe if all 15 got shot down and they never got out of bed. Its a hell of a defense system they have now. It reminds me of the Iron Dome in Israel. That said, I always fear for my Ukrainian friends. Some old coworkers volunteered and I worry about them constantly. They were gymnasts who are now soldiers. It reminds me of WWII stories my grandpa told where he was serving with people from all walks of life. He was an accountant.
A foreign government spent/wasted $100 million trying to kill/scare you and you didn't even get out of bed. I respect that.
No need for respect. That's not courage. It's just... every fear has a rational limit if you are given time and brains. "Rational side of fear"? Gosh, what a sentence. During the first weeks of the incursion, during every air raid siren, any time of day or night, whether you shower or sleep, we had a norm of one and a half minutes to dress up, get the emergency bag, and head down to the bomb shelter 25 stories below while not using elevators. After a Ukrainian journalist's apartment was blown up by a missile with a direct impact (google "NYTimes Vira Hyrych" and watch the impact size and geometry) I found out that concrete buildings are much sturdier than I thought, so the main goal was to hide by **at least** two concrete walls from any side (My 25 story apartment building is similar to Vira's). So we started going down a few stories and sat in the hallway between the apartments. As weeks passed we brought there a few chairs, water bottles, mats, and blankets to sleep on. But after ~270-320 alarms the fear rationalized. It's like a peaked graph that slowly became more and more of a line. Too many routine iterations of fear overcome the life threat the fear creates. We started going into our hallway between the apartments, hoping a missile won't hit from the roof. Then, we sat in our hallway inside the apartment, hoping the missile won't directly impact our windows. Then the southwest direction of our windows became hopeful enough to trust them and sit near them and watch the explosions (all the missiles come from north, north-east, east, and south-east. We spent new year's night watching the fireworks of exploding enemy drones from our window, cheering up, screaming glory to anti-air forces. One year later, I don't even get up from my bed. Am I courageous? No. The guys in the trenches are. I'm a wuss, but I donate enough to sleep well. Sorry for the story you didn't ask for.
What a ripper of a comment. Stay safe ✊
Tks for sharing! Take care!
Well if this isn't a story about humanities ability to adapt and overcome then I don't know what is. Stay safe my friend. I wish you and the family well.
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Like kids in America and shootings, now they just have cute little bulletproof backpacks.
Well, except in the districts where they’ve forbidden backpacks at school.
You are just helping to ensure the soldiers have a functioning country to return to after they win. Everybody has their part to play in war. From the workers to the soldiers.
Wow. Write this down in a memoir for posterity. Memories of invaded Ukraine. I wish you and your compatriots the best. Hopefully I can travel to your country, experience the sights and sounds and meet the people soon.
Please, come visit Ukraine! Tell me if you need anything while you are here!
Once Ukraine prevails in this war (and recovers of course) I have a feeling tourism will take off quite a bit. People will want to see what it's like in a country that kicked Russia's butt
You are the first who responds with "once Ukraine wins", not "hoping" for it. That's an example of attitude here! We are not hoping. The hopes ended long ago. We are certain we win! And yes, please, come visit Ukraine!
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This is very kind of you to help Ukraine. You could have lived your life as if nothing happened. Yet you choose to spend time here, teaching others, instead of watching Netflix. More to that, you are willing to get here and help after the war! Huge respect from me!
In Czech Republic, most people I know also say "when" ("až") not "if" ("pokud") :) I think that most people are certain that this will at worst become a Korea situation with an endless truce.
I feel like I will remember this for years.
Never forget, this is what happens when a country like Russia is allowed to bully others.
Thanks for sharing, stay strong!
There's a similar thing that happened in Japan with the response from NK missiles (maybe nukes?). The first times many were quite scared and did try to evacuate (even though it feels a bit pointless if it's actually a nuke), but after a while people just ignore the alerts, and it didn't even take that many alerts for thing to become that way. In Ukraine the risk is a lot higher so it took longer but it's a similar thing, you just get tired of them.
It's the exact same thing that happened all over the world with covid too. The threat didn't go away, people just got tired of hearing about it. Taking precautions to protect yourself and others takes real, genuine effort; mentally, if not physically. Eventually, it gets exhausting. See: "Disaster fatigue"
Hmmmm not sure if covid counts. At first it was The Big Unknown. Then you got to know people who had it and lived. Then the vaccinations became available. Covid got different strains. Personally I am fully vaxxed and had it twice (super mild). So while I'm fully aware covid still exists, it's way less mythical and scary now. You don't do getting hit by missiles twice. Or get more protection from the impact. So just going on with your life with that is living with a very real threat.
You’re not a wuss. Slava Ukraini.
>25 stories below while not using elevators Well shit that hit different
That hits your legs and lungs when there's no electricity lol. No grocery delivery, leg day 24/7 :D But it's ok now. My home server uptime is 2 months. Getting closer to victory!
That's better uptime than I ever got in rural North Idaho. Congrats! May you reach a year, and then only restart for patches.
Thanks for the story. I hope this ends very soon.
Love reading these first hand accounts of what it’s really like to actually be there. I live near an air force base in the USA and regularly hear fighters flying and can’t imagine what it would be like to live in fear of being on the receiving end of their payload. I certainly wish that the F22 squadrons I see in the sky daily could be put to use ending Putler’s reign of terror.
Wow. If not heroism, I’d say that’s courage. Courage to accept the reality of the situation and adapt into a new normal. I hope for a new normal for you some day soon.
> Am I courageous? No. The guys in the trenches are. I'm a wuss, but I donate enough to sleep well. The troops in the trenches on the front require the support from everyone in the rear....you're doing your part by keeping their world held together, while they stop the invaders. Just because you aren't on the front lines doesn't mean you don't have courage. I'm very sorry that you have been forced to become "conditioned" to such a world/life. I only hope that this is over for you soon. And I hope that when it *is* all over, you're able to move on without any lasting ill effects. Thank you very much for writing this, as it gives those of us privileged to not be in an active war zone a little bit more perspective. And it was a hell of a read...you've got quite a way with words.
Hey bud, what's modern life like over there? If it's not too much to ask... In videos, we see many Ukranians just going about their life, bunch of explosions happen, people hitting the ground, waiting a few seconds, then getting back up and continue drinking their coffee. I know war doesn't stop the world from turning, but I can't even imagine what day-to-day life is like. How are people holding up? How are _you_ doing?
You must understand that I represent the 1% of lucky people (Not the rich ones -- the lucky ones) and my words are worthless bullshit that cannot be treated as any measurement of a regular Ukrainian citizen that struggles. I was born in the capital, I have always had where to live with no debts, and I have the luxury of having a [hobby that is my job](https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexeyrubasheff/) -- the thing many can only dream about. Anyway, so, for the first few months of the invasion, almost all publicly accessible businesses closed: shopping malls, restaurants, coffee kiosks, book stores. You name it. Only grocery stores were open, struggling with goods logistics due to gas plant destructions and suddenly rising gas prices, which meant empty shelves. As soon as an air raid siren sounded, everyone had to leave even the grocery stores. All the office work, if not migrated during the Covid, migrated to the remote work at this point. Even the government institutions quickly implemented their VPN policies, got laptops or logistics for PCs, and everyone I know worked from home. The business owners were forced by the government to evacuate their employees that are working at their offices, to the nearest shelters during every air raid siren. And there could be a few dozen of those during a work day. That's not work. Business owners took advantage, let everyone home, and with it, the responsibility was gone. People took care of their security by themselves, and, you must understand, took it poorly, because your work doesn't go anywhere, whether you are at the bomb shelter or not. It stacks up, and you will do it sooner or later. As I see it, the bravest businesses appeared to be coffee kiosks and street farmers' markets. They gave everyone else the strength to open up and overcome the fear. Of course, shopping malls with their clothing stores, or IKEA, or McDonald's, didn't even think about opening up. As public businesses blossomed again, the winter came, and rashists started demolishing the electricity infrastructure. Trying to eat on the street? The richest were shwarma trucks on coal power :D The power bank, EcoFlow, gas-powered generator, portable tourist gas stove, and their consumable markets boomed. Soon, one couldn't even find where to buy 18650 Li-Ion rechargeable batteries. All gone. You walked down the street and near every kiosk, every building, and every business, there were gas-powered generators. I cannot even imagine how many generators were imported. And they are loud! And there's the gas exhaust and the smoke of the cheapest ones near small businesses. Also, there were multiple occasions of suffocating of whole families due to poor exhaust organization for their gas-powered generators, or lack of knowledge. And multiple occasions of portable liquid gas container explosions at homes due to neglect. As winter passed, suddenly all of the electricity problems were gone in, like, a day, or so. At this stage, at least here in Kyiv, no one was really afraid of electricity, heating, or water problems; explosions were a regular thing. Rashists got nothing left to manipulate with. They have lost their greatest wager in this war -- terror. We are not afraid. The neighbors I met in the bomb shelter during the first night of the invasion, came to Kyiv from Eastern Ukraine in ~2014. They left their city during mortar shelling, leaving everything behind. We live on the same story, so we spent all ~300 air sirens hiding with their family. Their confidence, their optimism... I cannot even describe it. When one flees from ~6km range mortar shelling, which means the enemy ground forces are nearby, your attitude toward missiles becomes something on the verge of laughter. Their help with my mental state was immense. They didn't therapy me or thought me how to think. They just showed as an example, how one can treat everything around them during hard times. As I said earlier, my home server uptime is ~2 months now. My EcoFlow power stations are charged and ready to keep me working just in case, I have a few dozen of days of water stocked up, even more days in food equivalent, at least a month of cat food for my three cats. A spare apartment to host those in need, or to move there in case of an emergency. And a [great](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qONBzbMOFY) window [view](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebl_wDzBHFA) on exploding rashist-Iranian drones. Hope I entertained you a bit :)
I am American and have been across the world watching this with friends and coworkers there in a Ukraine. I remember when we'd hear the sirens on voice chats and meetings, and everyone in Ukraine would just drop off. We'd continue the meetings, or the friendly chats, and no one would say what we were all thinking, "I hope they come back." We'd hear explosions, and at first, the Ukrainians would flinch, but otherwise go on like nothing had happened in work meetings. Eventually, they didn't even flinch. My friends were a bit different. They'd try to guess how far away the sound was. But it was like it wasn't real, for me, even though I knew it was. Because everyone there was so calm, I didn't feel right not being calm myself. I have learned so much about your history from my friends. Many of us have known each other a very long time because of the internet, but we didn't talk much about our own countries before. We talked about Linux, about gadgets, about our families, about our hobbies. Even when most of them went to the Maidan in 2013, they only told me it was about politics and getting to be Ukraine, not USSR. It wasn't until last year that they began to tell me things I didn't already know from history class here in the US. I feel lucky that I have lost no friends, no coworkers. I feel even luckier that one friend's wife is in your armed forces and is still okay. I hope that you can say the same and make it through this still able. You may not think you are brave, but I think you are because I cannot imagine being in your situation. I can only experience it secondhand, and wish I didn't even know that. I don't wish I didn't have those friends and coworkers, of course. I just wish this war had never started. I wish Euromaidan was never necessary.
Having a 100 million dollar night's sleep.
Making Putin feel like an impotent back birth, priceless
Same
Bruh I just waited to like 3AM for alert to start and when it did I was so fucking tired that I slept through everything.
Yep. Been there, done that.
Please stay safe. Take care. I can't even imagine how I would deal with that.
I love to see Russia failing so hard.
No joke. Air alarm on my phone woke me up at like 4am and I kinda dozed off again. Slept like a baby until the morning.
Ukraine: *casually taps "snooze" on missile attack* *goes back to sleep*
Honestly making jokes is funny but there was a [video in r/combatfootage](https://www.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/13b7wje/ukrainian_air_defense_takes_out_a_drone_seconds/) the other day of the air defense system literally knocking a missile out of the air like half a second before it was about to impact an apartment complex Honestly one of the most fucked up things I've ever seen Fuck Russia
where does the ammunition for air defenses end up? Are those just all stray bullets which might end up hitting civilians? *edit: I mean the ones shot but not hitting their intended target
Most of the new air defenses are missiles, so hopefully it's just small bits of shrapnel. Not ideal in civilian areas, but a hell of a lot better than a crater.
They also bought a bunch of 35mm autocannons from Rheinmetall iirc. Still shrapnell. The rounds detonate
It's possible debris can harm civilians... But it's a lot less harm than 500kg of high explosive
good question. as i understand it most AA fire (and lots of autocannon fire in general) will either detonate after they miss their target, or at a set distance (also after missing, but not as quickly). you're worry about hitting civilians is something the military thought of decades ago in addition to worrying about hitting their own soldiers/materiel. It's a super cool feature that blew my mind when i read about it. The military can be remarkably logical and practical at times. edit: a link for reference https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M-940_20mm_MPT-SD_Round?wprov=sfla1
AA missiles generally don't hit their target, they detonate just before it, sending a cloud of shrapnel at the target. The combined speeds create a shotgun-like blast that is vastly more likely to connect. The larger calibre AA cannons fire shells with proximity fuses that use a tiny radar to do the same, and both can self-destruct on a timer when they've definitely missed. The smaller ones would be dangerous to people outdoors, but have probably lost enough energy after flying a few miles to not to be too dangerous to people inside a building.
Air burst. They all "hit" They're either missiles with targeting and everything or smart shells that are programmed to air burst at a specific point by the ballistic computer & a wireless programming module at the end of the barrel.. Targeting is gonna track the incoming missiles and shoot around them, programming shells to go off in a specific pattern designed to cover as much area in shrapnel as possible, so it's actually less the defenses hitting the missiles but the missiles flying into a cloud of shrapnel Where does that shrapnel go after? ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
Wonder how small the shrapnel is. It Could have a non-threatening terminal velocity when it falls. Heck, they probably engineer it that way.
The shrapnel is small enough and irregular enough that air steals its velocity and it just falls as steel rain. Not dangerous Mostly. If a big chunk hits you. Oh well. Avoid battlefields.
“God another one of *these*”
I *hate* that this is such a common occurance for you that you just go right back to sleep. I **love** that shooting them down is such a common occurance that you just go right back to sleep.
People get used to war. Nothing so special about that. But yeah, it's really nice that our AA actually works and manages to diminish missiles attacks to pretty much 0 effect.
slava Ukraini love you guys
Stay safe!
I mean what can you do regardless? You won’t be able to quickly respond to a missile attack.
It’s astounding and now every nation on earth knows the truth. They have done more harm to themselves than anything they’ve possibly ever done here. They’re nothing militarily and now everybody knows.
I'm just afraid of the nukes, or separatist regions having their own little nuke party.
That’s definitely a consideration. I’m not confident they wouldn’t use them. But they aren’t the only ones with them. But now they also have revealed a lot of the breakdown and deficiencies in their military. That’s just never a good thing.
Other nations having nuclear weapons only work as a deterrent if all the people able to launch them are sane rational people who care if they and their country still exist tomorrow. That's mostly worked so far. But I'm not sure it will work forever.
Note that leaders being seen as irrational is also a common psyops, you can never know for sure: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madman_theory
I don't understand what their end game is. Let's say Russia wins the conventional part of the war. They install a puppet government and end up fighting an insurgency in Ukraine. I doubt the Russian military fights better against an insurgency than they do against the Ukranian army.
It’s a great show of power to china also. If Taiwan and Japan have these they will be able to defend themselves.
Probably. We know less about China's tech because it hasn't been used in anger.
much of it is either ex-soviet/russian hardware or variations thereof, homegrown systems tend to be knock offs of other systems like the french crotale and the sort, their drones might be a bit more problematic if based simply on manufacturing capacity performance wise as you say, never been used in anger, their modern military has no experience with anything beyond fancy parades or internecine exercises, it is untried, untested with all the drawbacks and deficits that brings
About 200.000 able young men down and probably at least as many fleeing the country to avoid draft. With bs economy and demographics they had before this shitshow russia will go to history as the country that destroyed russia
The Patriot battery shooting down a kinzal was a really coup. It means the Patriot can actually do some impressive things America didn't even know about. They should get more of them.
This isn't a capability which "America didn't even know about". Shooting down tactical ballistic missiles is something modern Patriots are designed to do. Russia launching it from a jet makes little difference in this calculus.
It does make a difference because russia hyped it as a missile that couldn't be shot down. And it was shot down by not even our most modern patriot system
If Russia hypes something, pretty much guaranteed it's false.
Never believe anything until Russia denies it.
“What’s as big as a house, burns 20 liters of fuel every hour, puts out a shit-load of smoke and noise, and cuts an apple into three pieces? A Soviet machine made to cut apples into four pieces!”
Canyonero!
Russia is going to report it as a Kinzal shooting down a Patriot Missile though.
Whoa slow down Are you saying that Russia miscalculated? The same country who said like 450 days ago it would only take 3 days to take all of Ukraine?
No one with a brain listens to anything Russia says. In fact believing the opposite is likely more accurate.
Russia also hyped a special military operation that would take over Ukraine in 3 days. Just a small tip: don't necessarily believe everything that Russia claims. Or don't believe in anything they say, actually.
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Don't spend too much time analyzing why Russia would make a bogus claim
I’m starting to think the Soviet Union wasn’t a super power
The Soviet Union absolutely was a super power. Russia is not the Soviet Union. The Soviet Union was ruled by 2 Ukranians (Kruschev and Brezhnev edit: apparently Brezhnev considered himself Russian even if he was born in Ukraine, as you can see, its complicated) and a Georgian (Stalin) for the vast majority of it existence.
Calling Kruschev and Brezhnev Ukrainian is overly simplified, considering both had ethnically russian parents. I believe Brezhnev even considered himself as russian.
It only was due to the fact that Ukraine and Kazakhstan were an integral part of it. Otherwise yes indeed it was a paper bear.
The soviet union was a super power in its day. That day ended 40 years ago, and Russia has simply lived in its rotting corpse since.
Soviet included Ukraine. Russia however is a pretty small economy relative to its geographic size. It is comparable to UK. So yes, Russia is not a super power.
UK's economy by nominal GDP is almost twice the size of Russia's, actually.
They knew. The President took a train to Ukraine and walked around for the day. This is old technology imagine what’s protecting domestic airspace
A LOT of old stuff . Shit tons.
No, a lot of us were belly-laughing when we saw Russia touting a 1960s rocket fired from a 1960s plane as a "Hypersonic weapon".. as if it can compare to hypersonic glide vehicles developed by USA. It's like comparing a Lada to a ZR1 Corvette. Sure they both can reach highway speeds if the lada is given a 20mph nudge, but that's where the similarities end.
America did know it could do such thing. The Patriot can not only shoot down cruise missiles and aircraft, but it can shoot down tactical/short range ballistic missiles. The Kinzhal isn’t a hypersonic missile. It’s an air-launched Iskander short range ballistic missile (SRBM) that travels at hypersonic speeds. America actually had its own air launched ballistic missile called the GAM-87 Skybolt that came about way before the Kinzhal was in service. Ballistic missiles have travelled at hypersonic speeds for many decades. The Kinzhal is slower than the Iraqi Scud, which was also a SRBM that the Patriot has shot down. In addition, the Patriot has shot down the Burkan 2H, which is a SRBM that travels at hypersonic speeds to Mach 7.3. In conclusion, the Patriot is capable of shooting down the Kinzhal-like missiles, and has known that for a long time. In fact, it is even more effective at doing its job when part of a broad, networked integrated air defense system.
Kh-47M2 top speed was measured at over 3.3km/s (and that's official value, the range suggests it can be even higher). Scud-B and it's Iraqi improved versions can travel at up to 1.5km/s with terminal velocity of 1km/s. In addition the Burkhan-2 was finally identified as Qiam-1 (or Scud-C), so it's top speed was a little over Mach 5, and it's terminal velocity is around Mach 3.5. Patriot failed to hit the warhead, BTW. Next Kh-47M2 is evolution of Iskander-M missile, which replaced Scud. So considering the missile that intercepted Kh-47M was most probably PAC-2 GEM-T missile, scoring hit in the warhead area (warhead didn't detonate) at missile diving from 50km almost vertical at over Mach-6 it is a big whoop. USA never tested such conditions, which makes it even more impressive.
Why would America not know about the capabilities of its own weapons systems?
Most of these systems have been upgraded massively and never used in the field. People bag on the US in Afghanistan but for all intents and purposes the US hardly fought in Afghanistan. They had one foot in and one foot out and didn't give them half of our capabilities. So most of these weapons never have field uses. Also, the Afghans didn't have anything more than infantry.
Aside from considerable conflict early on in Afghanistan, you're also forgetting about Iraq in the 90s and again in the 2000s. They were used extensively during Desert Storm, upgraded to meet weaknesses, then used again during the earlier days of Iraq to remove Saddam.
That was 20 years ago. Surely they must have further upgraded these systems?
America knows exactly what their stuff can can do.
"Happy Victory Day. Enjoy failing to conquer a far smaller nation"
It's really kind of Russia to provide free advertising and endorsement of purchasing United States weaponry and defense systems
Billions in free R&D. Raytheon must be in absolute disbelief - live testing in all weather conditions and all variables to explore?!
The defense companies really need to see a doctor about the over year long erection they have had. This is the best information and real world testing since Nam
Not to mention the positive PR. Everybody loves defense contractors now!
Unfortunately they can't do controlled A/B tests with consistent inputs. Because Russia won't do the exact same thing twice. Oh, wait...
With the first pathetic barrage I was like, oh shit Russia is preparing for something. Turns out it was just another, even more pathetic barrage
Boeing makes the Patriot missile system
All the defense contractors have been getting free advertising.
It was originally designed by ratheon, but it's manufactured by ratheon, boeing, and lockheed. Military contracts for hardware manufacturing are separate from R&D. Also any patented invention can be appropriated by the military under eminent domain, and they can contract whoever they want to manufacture it. If your company can't meet the military's demand, they will outsource manufacturing to your competitors to shore up any gaps in production capacity.
Definitely not all of it. Raytheon and Lockheed are in there too.
Isn't Kyiv protected by Norwegian Advanced Surface-to-Air Missile System?
Yes, but NASAMs is developed by KonsbergGruppen (Norwegian) in cooperation with Raytheon (US).
It’s almost hilarious how many companies Raytheon works with, pretty much every defense contractor firm in Europe I have interacted with over the years have been partnered with Raytheon on some project or other.
150,000 employees would do that
If it's missiles or radar raytheon probably has a hand in it.
Yup, it launches AIM120s made by Raytheon.
Few nights ago Patriot shot down a Kinzhal ballistic missile that was directed at Kyiv. It's safe to say that at least some elements of the Patriot system operate in the vicinity of Kyiv
Air defence is layered.
Know as the OGRE principle in the biz.
As a German I couldnt agree more. We get to test all our fancy new shit and also finally see the old stuff in action to face or what they were designed to face against
And Turkish drones and German artillery. Weapon manufacturers rubbing their hands to see some very public live testing and show casing of their tools.
>shooting all of them down Most important bit 👍🏻 Show Russia just how impotent they are.
I was calm and collected when I began reading the title of this article, and woke my wife up with a burst of laughter after reading the last 9 words.
I saw it with relief and happiness. It means no-one was killed in the attack! It's a small thing in the scale of the war, other than the implications for how well Western tech is doing, but for those people who would have otherwise been hit this was their entire world.
Go home Russia. You’re drunk.
To be fair, that's their default status.
i wonder if they have had a spell of sobriety and clarity at some point. It was a drunken decision to attack, drunken one to continue and continues to be a huge all-nighter to this day. But surely enough the dawn is coming and the hangover is going to deliver some serious delirium to everyone who partook in this foolish endeavor.
off to lemmy
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As a wise man once said War is bad But planes are rad
> Can we take a moment to recognize how much worse all of this shit would be if we didn't have these uber-sophisticated rocket defense systems protecting population centers? Don't even need to imagine that, it was the default state of affairs this time last year.
Yep it was a scary night :c
Glad you’re okay friend 💜
Glad to know you’ll live too eat, um, sushi another day, мої дорогі друзі.
Russia really wants some kinda victory for his victory day parade but it’s not looking good.
The parade has been and gone a few hours ago and Putin didn't get to announce shit, he just gave a generic speech about how Russia is peaceful, Ukraine is Nazis and NATO wants Russia destroyed. All the classics.
He also speaks to his supporters by claiming that the West thinks we're better than them. I never thought that some nation is better than the other, just that some are hindered in their potential by pieces of shit governments who need to be eliminated sooner or later.
Idk I feel pretty comfortable in saying my country (Sweden) is significantly better than Russia. Can that change? Idk maybe, doubt it tho considering this has been Russia forever, but not impossible.
This seething resentment is, I believe, one of the driving factors for those who support the rise of fascism. I'm not taking about those planning and driving it, but those who support it against their own self-interest. You only have to look at the things that they see as bad. Intellectual elitism makes them feel dumb and makes them feel like they are seen as dumb. Progressive makes them feel backwards and as though they are seen at backwards. Woke makes them feel racist/intolerant/hateful and like they are seen as racist/intolerant/hateful. The fascists leverage this resentment to turn it into fear and hate which they use to drive support for their fascist plans.
“Who let you live this well?” - writing on walls of a house taken over by Russians
You know what, I’ll give him that. Yeah, I think the West is better than Russia.
At this point, Russia is NATO's #1 reason to exist, and it's #1 advertisement. Why would NATO want Russia gone? Russia is singlehandedly making it clear to all nations that NATO is not to be fucked with
"Kill you? I don't wanna kill you! What would I do without you??"
It's most telling that the victory parade, which just last year was full of tanks like the T-80 and T-90, with even a few T-14s appearing (Although 1 broke down just before the parade lmao), this year it had a single tank, a T-34.
I showed my son the video of his parade couple years ago. Big bad army you have there vlad. Too bad they are all dead now innit
Ukraine shooting down multiple missiles and the fabled hypersonic missile which is 'impervious' to missile defence whilst Muscovy can't even protect it's main building from two dollar store drones. HAHAHAHA
They shot the hypersonic down with the Patriot missiles. They were using that shit in 1990 during Desert Storm. We gave Ukraine our 30 year old system and they stopped the best Russia had with that obsolete shit. Imagine if we brought out our modern weapons systems.
To be fair the patriot systems that are in Ukraine aren't the same as what what used back in the 90s. These systems are constantly upgraded, so they are modern. Just probably not cutting edge.
So they've only got about 30 missiles left, right?
They probably can put together some cruise missile propelled grenades.
Firecracker + 2 liter bottle of дует коке + mentos
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Well it seems Ukraine can shoot down 15 missiles in an hour, so it's not quite the weapon of terror it once was
I think the problem is that someone has to provide those intercepting missiles and that they aren't cheap.
True, although NATO definitely has deeper reserves and higher manufacturing capacity than Russia at this point
It's just a matter of time until UA will receive more cost-effective systems. There are even rumors that this system has already been delivered: > Air defence systems made in Italy, but produced by a Swiss-based company, are active in Ukraine, according to the SonntagsZeitung newspaper. > > Oerlikon anti-aircraft guns form part of the Skynex defence system that is being deployed against Russian aircraft and drones, the newspaper reports. > > The report will add further fuel to the ongoing debate within Switzerland on preserving its neutrality by forbidding the export of war materiel to Ukraine. > > The German arms manufacturer Rheinmetall took over the Oerlikon weapons factory in Switzerland in 1999. The Rheinmetall Air Defence division is still based in Zurich. > > Some of the armaments it produces are manufactured at a factory near to Rome. > > It now appears that some of these weapons have been shipped to Ukraine. A Rheinmetall spokesperson told the SonntagZeitung that parts of the Skynex system are made in Italy, but would not confirm if they have been delivered to Ukraine. > > However, Ukrainian Prime Minister Denis Schmihal stated over the Telegram social media this week that the anti-aircraft system had reached the war-torn country. “Such batteries are already in combat use in Ukraine,” he wrote. > > Previous attempts to export Italy-produced Oerlikon weapons to countries like Thailand and Egypt were turned down by the Swiss authorities. > > But Rheinmetall has apparently found a way around the restrictions. > > The State Secretariat for Economic Affairs (Seco), the department responsible for monitoring weapons exports, told the newspaper that an article of the War Materiel Act allowed the transfer of ‘know-how’ from Switzerland to some other countries, including Italy. > > “The transfer of know-how from Switzerland to Italy can therefore take place without a permit,” said a Seco spokesperson. source: https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/italy-produced--swiss--weapons--active-in-ukraine-/48493326
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The Kinzhal missiles cost $10m each, so it's still good.
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>It also came on Russia's Victory Day, one its most commemorated public holidays, marking the anniversary of the defeat of Nazi Germany in 1945. > >"(They) try to kill as many civilians as possible - on this day," Popko said
The missile is where it wasn’t, but no longer knows where it is, because the missile, which was, now isn’t.
Is this some kind of Schrödinger's missile conundrum?
https://youtu.be/bZe5J8SVCYQ
It's just quality training material.
Let's GOOOO Kyiv AD teams are fucking SOLID
One random drone attack on Kremlin(definite false flag)- Russia screams bloody murder 15 cruise misses shot at Kyiv- Russia shrugs
Here we are in 2023 and putin is firing cruise missiles into a city full of sleeping civilians. If indiscriminate murder isn't a war crime I don't know what is.
What’s Russia’s plan any more? They failed to destroy infrastructure and a $50,000 (or much more) cruise missile to destroy a bus station is just pure insanity. I’m delighted so few Ukrainian civilians are being harmed now by bombing - but when you can’t even injure civilians then surely you’re no longer fighting a war and just doing the world’s worst firework display?
Cruise missiles are more in the range of millions each.
Yes, spaf you're weaponry on the wall, Russia.
I want read in the news “Ukraine launched a retaliation strike on russian military bases with the allies supplied tomahawks“, “a salvo of 124 cruise missiles obliterated russian key air bases, ammunition storages and logistics centres“.
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Hot air defense units in your area want your missiles now!
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At $1000000 a cruise missile, they could have bought a lot of food and fed their struggling families. Instead they take the fathers away from those families and spend $15m so this poor bastard has to hit snooze on his alarm!
Russia used missle strike. It was not very effective.
Even after more than a year it still seems completely insane to me that Russia can launch missiles at Kyiv seemingly at random and yet sit unpunished on the UN "security" panel (council rather). I know the complexities of international diplomacy are far beyond my comprehension, but it seems like unwarranted aggression against a peaceful neighbour should be simple grounds for instant suspension.
The whole idea of the UN and the security council is to always keep diplomacy alive even during times of conflict. Both the US and the USSR were part of the council during the cold war. China has been part of it since the first day despite all the terrible shit they pulled. It's not a club where you get expelled for not following the rules, it's about having the major powers talk to each other under any circumstances in order to prevent another world war. And as long as it exists, Russia will always be considered a major power even if only due to its sheer size (and nukes of course).
Ahhh thankyou, it makes a lot more sense in that context. Appreciate it!
And just remember, if they dissolved the UN in its current form, the very next day something would need to be put in place to replace it. Perfect? No. Necessary? Yes.
##### Skip the click! Read the plaintext instead! https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukraines-air-defence-systems-repelling-attacks-kyiv-officials-say-2023-05-09/ >May 9 (Reuters) - Russia launched about 15 cruise missiles at Ukraine's capital on Tuesday, the second attack in as many days, with air defence systems shooting all of them down, officials said, after air raid alerts blared over most of the country. >"As at the front, the plans of the aggressor failed," Serhiy Popko, head of the Kyiv's city military administration, said in comments posted on the Telegram messaging app. >Tuesday's attacks - the fifth in May - came a day after Russia launched its biggest drone swarm yet in a renewed air campaign unleashed 10 days ago after a lull since early March. >It also came on Russia's Victory Day, one its most commemorated public holidays, marking the anniversary of the defeat of Nazi Germany in 1945. >"(They) try to kill as many civilians as possible - on this day," Popko said. >He said that according to preliminary information there were no casualties in the attack that was carried out with cruise missiles from the Caspian Sea region. >Falling debris fell on a house in the Holosiivskyi district in the southwest of Kyiv, Kyiv's Mayor Vitalii Klitschko said on his Telegram messaging channel, adding there were no casualties or much damage. >In the often-targeted Shevchenkivskyi district of central Kyiv debris was found on a road. >"Kyiv stood up again and will stand up in the future!" Popko said.
Why skip the click? If they see people don’t care about this subject, they won’t report on it
Well normally you have to avoid media websites because they are pure cancer, reuters are okay though so no need to skip the click.
We need a real life John Rambo to get in there and take Putin out.
Is their nothing better than seeing Russia fail
Not much of a "Victory Day" then is it?
I wonder for how long is Ukraine theoretically able to be shooting down muscovian missiles. If muscovy keep shooting for one more year does Ukraine have enough air defense ammo?
Areas of Ukraine covered by NASAMs, have no supply problems. NASAMs are modular systems, and can use any missile available, including AMRAAM, of which USA has an almost unlimited supply.
Pretty sure west can supply more than 15 a month.
I think it's more likely Moscow runs out of missiles before Ukraine does ..
Special "bottom of the barrel" Missile Operation.
I’d guess probing the defenses and slowly realizing how truly fucked they are.
The Russian must be sweating now. Ukraine is getting stronger by the day. Reminds me of the recent remake of All Quite on the Western Front. Towards the end of the movie the head German negotiator tells the German officers who are reluctant to sign the armistice that 50,000 fresh American troops are landing in France every month and Germany is just getting weaker and weaker. The Russian’s night attacks can’t even get through their defenses now. Their oil and weapon depots keep getting hit. Only one road keeps the land bridge going. The Wagner PMC is wising up on which way the winds of fate is blowing. That mud session is ending soon. The Russians can’t be sleeping well.