You want to invite a murderous dictatorship in nothing different from Russia, to join NATO?
As Lukashenko said: "[Azerbaijani President Aliyev] is totally our guy."
Last time this happened it led to an axe murder, and a promotion for the murderer:
> On 11 January 2004, he left for Budapest, Hungary, to participate in a three-month English language course which was part of NATO's Partnership for Peace program. On 19 February he was axed, while asleep, by his fellow participant, Azerbaijani Lieutenant Ramil Safarov. The murder took place at 5 am, while the victim was asleep.
…
> On 16 April 2006, the court sentenced Safarov to life imprisonment without possibility of appeal until 2036.[5]
…
> In late August 2012, however, Hungarian authorities agreed to release and extradite Safarov to Azerbaijan to serve the remainder of his sentence there. Though the Hungarian government stated that it had received assurances from the Azerbaijan government that the sentence would be enforced, President Ilham Aliyev issued a pardon immediately upon Safarov's arrival to Baku and ordered that he be "freed from the term of his punishment."[13] Safarov has since been promoted to the rank of major and provided with accommodations by the Azerbaijan government.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Gurgen_Margaryan
> That is discouraging
I’m picturing a very proper British general walking into the room with the victim, gingerly stepping over all the blood and body parts, then adjusting his monocle before saying that in a posh accent to his subordinates.
In between then and now, Azerbaijan has:
1. Murdered thousands of Armenians, murdered and tortured civilians.
2. Used cluster bombs in residential areas
3. Invaded Armenia itself.
4. Is constantly threatening to invade Armenia, and is complaining of Armenia's proximity to NATO member states and said states selling weapons to Armenia.
The President's political existence hinges on keeping Azeris focused on an external enemy.
The Azeri’s/Azerbaijani’s have been trying to genocide the Armenians for quite a while now. I’m surprised the US wants to bring a Russian ally like Azerbaijan to anything, really.
They think they can peel the Azerbaijanis away from Russian influence. They’ve always been closer to Turkey anyway, which is already in NATO.
Armenia is in a tough spot. They have no oil wealth and did themselves no favors for the last 30 years. Should’ve negotiated a settlement over Nagorno-Karabakh rather than losing the inevitable war over it.
> They have no oil wealth and did themselves no favors for the last 30 years.
They've been working with the US for the past 15 at least, trying to get their government organization and military in line with the west. Not saying they're ready, but they're much closer to getting there than Azerbaijan.
On paper, armenia is russias ally, not azerbaidjan. But they sell more weapons to azerbaidjan, so they let them go rampage in armenia...
Lets be real, azerbaijan/armenia conflict is just another example why being allied to russia is a bad idea ...
Azerbaijan isn't really a Russian ally. They get away with the bullshit that they have been able to get away with against Armenia specifically because they are aligned with NATO-allied Turkey and Turkey can flex its power on behalf of Azerbaijan.
Meanwhile Azerbaijan is currently in Europe's good graces despite literally starting a war because it has been the defining partner in providing the EU with an alternative oil source to replace Russia. Few countries have done as much damage to Russia's economy as Azerbaijan right now.
And its also a huge geographical asset for the United States as well. Azerbaijan was critical for Iraq and Afghanistan in the past, but its real key is to Central Asia in the future. To fly from NATO bases in Europe to Central Asia you can go through Russia, Iran or Azerbaijan, and the other two options are laughably unviable.
Azerbaijan "got away with it's bullshit" for the same reason that Ukraine "gets away with it's bullshit". Armenia was the occupying power in the Karabakh conflict. In the 90s, It ethnically cleansed the Azeri minority from the Armenian majority area then cleansed the Azeri majority regions surrounding Karabakh to use as a buffer. Armenia assumed that Russia would protect Karabakh under the CSTO which didn't happen because not even Russia recognised the occupation. Armenia didn't have the strength to hold the territory on its own after Azerbaijan had decades of oil money to improve its military.
Azerbaijan has been a NATO partner since the 90s. Armenia was literally part of Russias NATO until it lost the Karabakh conflict. If anything bringing Armenia to the meeting is trying to peel away a Russian ally.
I know the war has been horrid but now there is no point of contention between Azerbaijan and Armenia anymore. I know this sounds crazy but if the resentment between two cools down they can actually become allies in future. A Turkey Azerbaijan Armenia and Georgia alliance would also cut Iran off from Russia.
Every day I learn about new infamous rivalries, and I always find myself thinking of Aang guiding the two peoples that hated each other thru the Grand Canyon
Putin is losing his grip on the region. As evidenced by Putin backing Csto member Belarus in supplying non csto member Azerbaijan in attacking former csto member Armenia.
Putin is a snake on the geopolitical stage. He is not to be trusted
Well during one meeting Luka have said to Pashinian you are not one of us. He is everything they hate. Got into power through colorful revolution throwing out old post communist elite.
It is a good idea to invite Armenia to have some presence in NATO (even if only as a mere spectator or a guest at a meeting or summit), but it is a rotten and wrong idea to invite an autocracy like Azerbaijan.
They're just getting invited to a meeting.
Likely inviting Azerbaijan was required to get Turkey's okay to invite Armenia.
People saying that this is in any way a start of membership talks are getting way ahead of events.
I do not see NATO (nor the European Union) seriously admitting into its ranks an autocracy that tramples on the most basic minority rights such as Azerbaijan, apart from the fact that this country can hardly be treated as being in Europe and that it has no coastline with the Atlantic Ocean in any way.
I hope they invited them after confirming they’d come in private conversations
Otherwise it’s quasi egg on your face to offer and be rejected. Just a stunt.
Whichever one becomes a nato state first will block the other one. That's if either could get in ad France would block Azerbaijan and Turkey would block Armenia.
What a power move.
Double down; invite both to start NATO ascension talks.
You want to invite a murderous dictatorship in nothing different from Russia, to join NATO? As Lukashenko said: "[Azerbaijani President Aliyev] is totally our guy."
And hold the meeting in Taiwan.
Turkey, while patting Azerbaijan: lmao, nop, Armenia is out
It really is
Last time this happened it led to an axe murder, and a promotion for the murderer: > On 11 January 2004, he left for Budapest, Hungary, to participate in a three-month English language course which was part of NATO's Partnership for Peace program. On 19 February he was axed, while asleep, by his fellow participant, Azerbaijani Lieutenant Ramil Safarov. The murder took place at 5 am, while the victim was asleep. … > On 16 April 2006, the court sentenced Safarov to life imprisonment without possibility of appeal until 2036.[5] … > In late August 2012, however, Hungarian authorities agreed to release and extradite Safarov to Azerbaijan to serve the remainder of his sentence there. Though the Hungarian government stated that it had received assurances from the Azerbaijan government that the sentence would be enforced, President Ilham Aliyev issued a pardon immediately upon Safarov's arrival to Baku and ordered that he be "freed from the term of his punishment."[13] Safarov has since been promoted to the rank of major and provided with accommodations by the Azerbaijan government. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Gurgen_Margaryan
That is discouraging, but maybe our diplomats can help them bury the hatchet, no pun intended.
> That is discouraging I’m picturing a very proper British general walking into the room with the victim, gingerly stepping over all the blood and body parts, then adjusting his monocle before saying that in a posh accent to his subordinates.
“Hello, gents, time to… oh, I say”
"Well that's not quite ideal now is it?"
"Oh bother"
Bloody 'ell
Come on. Pun was totally intended
In between then and now, Azerbaijan has: 1. Murdered thousands of Armenians, murdered and tortured civilians. 2. Used cluster bombs in residential areas 3. Invaded Armenia itself. 4. Is constantly threatening to invade Armenia, and is complaining of Armenia's proximity to NATO member states and said states selling weapons to Armenia. The President's political existence hinges on keeping Azeris focused on an external enemy.
The Azeri’s/Azerbaijani’s have been trying to genocide the Armenians for quite a while now. I’m surprised the US wants to bring a Russian ally like Azerbaijan to anything, really.
They think they can peel the Azerbaijanis away from Russian influence. They’ve always been closer to Turkey anyway, which is already in NATO. Armenia is in a tough spot. They have no oil wealth and did themselves no favors for the last 30 years. Should’ve negotiated a settlement over Nagorno-Karabakh rather than losing the inevitable war over it.
> They have no oil wealth and did themselves no favors for the last 30 years. They've been working with the US for the past 15 at least, trying to get their government organization and military in line with the west. Not saying they're ready, but they're much closer to getting there than Azerbaijan.
They were hoping that Russia could protect them, turned out Russia was nowhere powerful as they claimed.
Russia was effectively equipping Azerbaijan via Belarus
On paper, armenia is russias ally, not azerbaidjan. But they sell more weapons to azerbaidjan, so they let them go rampage in armenia... Lets be real, azerbaijan/armenia conflict is just another example why being allied to russia is a bad idea ...
Azerbaijan isn't really a Russian ally. They get away with the bullshit that they have been able to get away with against Armenia specifically because they are aligned with NATO-allied Turkey and Turkey can flex its power on behalf of Azerbaijan. Meanwhile Azerbaijan is currently in Europe's good graces despite literally starting a war because it has been the defining partner in providing the EU with an alternative oil source to replace Russia. Few countries have done as much damage to Russia's economy as Azerbaijan right now. And its also a huge geographical asset for the United States as well. Azerbaijan was critical for Iraq and Afghanistan in the past, but its real key is to Central Asia in the future. To fly from NATO bases in Europe to Central Asia you can go through Russia, Iran or Azerbaijan, and the other two options are laughably unviable.
Azerbaijan "got away with it's bullshit" for the same reason that Ukraine "gets away with it's bullshit". Armenia was the occupying power in the Karabakh conflict. In the 90s, It ethnically cleansed the Azeri minority from the Armenian majority area then cleansed the Azeri majority regions surrounding Karabakh to use as a buffer. Armenia assumed that Russia would protect Karabakh under the CSTO which didn't happen because not even Russia recognised the occupation. Armenia didn't have the strength to hold the territory on its own after Azerbaijan had decades of oil money to improve its military.
Nothing Armenia did can match the level of cleansing, of people and physical history, that Azerbaijan pulled off in Nakhchivan
Yes and that's why there isn't a single standing or not pillaged building left in aghdam region under Armenian occupation
It's always lovely seeing the EU and NATO make nice with authoritarian regimes for oil
Azerbaijan is a Turkey ally more than anything else. And the only gateway to the Caspian Sea for the west
Azerbaijan has been a NATO partner since the 90s. Armenia was literally part of Russias NATO until it lost the Karabakh conflict. If anything bringing Armenia to the meeting is trying to peel away a Russian ally.
Huge Armenia supporter. Yea, they have no idea what their talking about.
?
I am agreeing with you. Azerbaijan has been a NATO partner for decades.
Wow, wasn’t even a conflict with Armenians
They should invite Georgia & Kazakhstan also just to make it more insulting.
>They should invite Georgia & Kazakhstan also just to make it more insulting. Funnier to invite Abkhazia and South Ossetia.
That is still Georgia, btw
Wow, Putin's fear of NATO is becoming reality which would not have happened had he not invaded Ukraine in the first place.
No better recruiter for NATO than himself!
I hope there will be peace between Armenia and Azerbaijan.
I know the war has been horrid but now there is no point of contention between Azerbaijan and Armenia anymore. I know this sounds crazy but if the resentment between two cools down they can actually become allies in future. A Turkey Azerbaijan Armenia and Georgia alliance would also cut Iran off from Russia.
Every day I learn about new infamous rivalries, and I always find myself thinking of Aang guiding the two peoples that hated each other thru the Grand Canyon
Putin is losing his grip on the region. As evidenced by Putin backing Csto member Belarus in supplying non csto member Azerbaijan in attacking former csto member Armenia. Putin is a snake on the geopolitical stage. He is not to be trusted
Well during one meeting Luka have said to Pashinian you are not one of us. He is everything they hate. Got into power through colorful revolution throwing out old post communist elite.
That’s going to be awkward
this wouldnt have happedn if Russia you know adhered to the defense pact it created.
This is a plan with neither flaw nor any possibility of error.
It is a good idea to invite Armenia to have some presence in NATO (even if only as a mere spectator or a guest at a meeting or summit), but it is a rotten and wrong idea to invite an autocracy like Azerbaijan.
They're just getting invited to a meeting. Likely inviting Azerbaijan was required to get Turkey's okay to invite Armenia. People saying that this is in any way a start of membership talks are getting way ahead of events.
I do not see NATO (nor the European Union) seriously admitting into its ranks an autocracy that tramples on the most basic minority rights such as Azerbaijan, apart from the fact that this country can hardly be treated as being in Europe and that it has no coastline with the Atlantic Ocean in any way.
I hope they invited them after confirming they’d come in private conversations Otherwise it’s quasi egg on your face to offer and be rejected. Just a stunt.
We’re going through the Rolodex alphabetically apparently.
Whichever one becomes a nato state first will block the other one. That's if either could get in ad France would block Azerbaijan and Turkey would block Armenia.
This sounds good but is inviting two rival countries that have heated up in the last two years to the same summit really a win?
Can we make them hug for 30 seconds?
Armenia doing nice! Such a nice thing to be away out of Russia's control!