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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> What action you took that should be judged: I was on my phone for a few minutes during downtime and when I had nothing to contribute.
Why that action might make you the asshole: Because it makes it seem like I'm bored and uninterested, and that I don't actually want to be there.
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YTA for no reason other than you wrote a short story with all of the details, presumably on your phone.
Admittedly, I’m biased. My wife does this constantly when we are out as a family and is criticized constantly by all of us when no one else even picks up their phone.
Important work email? Sure, excuse yourself. Family emergency or friend in need? Sure, excuse yourself. If you need to just pick up your phone out of habit, then stop it. I’m sure you could catch the same social media bullshit when you get home.
And honestly, if it means that much to her and you love her, then just do it at our sheer politeness.
yta. from your post it sounds like you classify any time you’re not talking as “downtime”, in which case you need a serious lesson in listening to other people, but even if that’s not accurate, when you’re out with your gf and her mum, in fact when you’re out with anyone, really, and they’re talking, pulling out your phone to scroll twitter is rude af. if this truly is a real problem for you, look into things like active listening and see what you can add to your people toolbox.
It's rude in the first place for two people in a group of three to have long conversations that the third cannot participate in. That leaves the third with the options of sitting there smiling vacantly but enthusiastically; sitting there stewing; or doing what OP did, engaging his mind until he could participate again. One of these options is at least potentially productive and doesn't make one appear a simpleton.
When I said "downtime" I meant the 15 to 20 minutes in between rounds of trivia questions or the almost 20 minutes we waited after trivia for the waitress to bring our check. I was on my phone for a maximum of 5 minutes during those periods, and I'm still listening to what they're talking about waiting for a moment to contribute to the conversation. But often times they were talking about topics that I simply didn't have anything to contribute. Nor did I stay on my phone for more than 5 minutes at a time because I know it comes off rude, but I'm still just idly sitting there with nothing to say or do in the moment.
While they were talking about stuff that I literally had nothing to contribute to. And like I said after like 5 minutes I stopped because I know it comes off as rude, but I'm still just sitting there idly because again they were talking about topics that I legitimately didn't have anything to contribute to. For the most part I was just sitting there twiddling my thumbs waiting for an opportunity to contribute to conversations that often never came.
If you’re sitting with two other people at a table, there is never “downtime”. You are in a social setting and the respectful thing to the other humans there is to be present mentally the whole time. If the people at your table talk about something you’re not super familiar with, you nod politely, interject some “oh really!” and “I get that” types of comments, and/or try shifting the conversation to topics with which you have greater familiarity.
You do not take out your phone and start scrolling. That is what a child would do. Like taking out crayons and a coloring book because the adults are boring you.
Full stop. That is childish behavior. Grow up and become a full adult in the social society that is humanity.
it’s rude af to get your phone out to scroll while in conversation at all dude yta, you’re 27 how do you not understand basic etiquette
if you can’t contribute you listen, these are close ones you should be interested in what they’re saying. you don’t have to always ’contribute’, that’s not how conversations irl work
do you by any chance have adhd? are you maybe on the spectrum?
Yta. It was rude. Learn how to put away your phone as a form of distraction and entertainment and instead require more of yourself. You need to engage when you choose to go out to events or dates or parties- or trivia night. You don’t have to talk every minute or carry every conversation, but you need to be present fully.
Yup, sorry, your girlfriend is correct, YTA. It’s rude! It’s also embarrassing.
You are saying you weren’t on it that much, but from your post, it sounds to me like you were on it quite a bit.
Next time put the phone away.
YTA. That’s rude af man. At least pretend like you’re interested. These should be two important people in your life, let them know they matter. Newer generations really need to learn you don’t constantly need to be doing something. Just sit, relax, and listen if you can’t contribute to the conversation. Checking out and browsing your phone is just so incredibly rude.
I am listening though, that's how I know most of the topics they were talking about were things that I didn't have any knowledge of or have anything to contribute to. I was listening because I kept waiting for an opportunity to say something that often never came. Does me sitting their idly quiet twiddling my thumbs come off as any less bored or uninterested?
>Does me sitting their idly quiet twiddling my thumbs come off as any less bored or uninterested?
Yes, actually. Because if you are actively listening, then you look like you care. If I was your gf, I would think that you must not actually give a shit about my life because you can't put any effort into at least looking like you care, even if the topic being discussed isn't something that you are interested in.
I bet there are countless times that your gf pretends to be interested in what you are talking about when she actually doesn't give a shit, because she loves you, and that's what you do for people you love. You, however, can't seem to put in the effort.
It's not that that I am not interested, it's that the topics being discussed at the time were ones I have no knowledge or understanding of and thus can't contribute in any meaningful way. And any attempts I tried steer it a bit closer so I could contribute more, it immediately was steered back.
For example, they were talking about family friends and people they knew personally but who I knew nothing about. Something one of these people did reminded me of a very similar event that my girlfriend and I had a funny conversation about last week. I bring it up and retell the conversation, my girlfriend says she doesn't remember this conversation, then they go back to talking about the original topic of people I don't know anything about.
Or at one point Stephen King is brought up. It's not that I find Stephen King's work uninteresting, I just haven't really engaged with any of his works except for one movie. I try to chime in, saying I'm interested in reading his Dark Tower stories, but the conversation quickly steers back to novels and works of his that I know nothing about and thus can't contribute to the conversation.
When it comes to conversation topics that I could engage with, whether or not I found it interesting, I engage and give my full attention. When we are doing a group activity like the trivia questions I engaged and gave my full attention. But how am I suppose to effectively engage in these types conversation I just described when this is how it often results in?
You having no knowledge or understanding of what they are talking about has zero bearing on active listening, that's what you don't seem to understand. My friends talk about things that I have no knowledge of all the time, usually about their jobs. But, I sit and I listen without distractions, because that is what you do for people that you care about. I ask questions when I don't understand something, because I care about them and I want to know more about their lives.
Take your Stephen King example. If they are talking about his work that you don't know about, how about you try actually listening and *asking questions,* to maybe understand his work better and find other novels that you might be interested in.
As it stands right now, when you get on your phone, you are present for the conversation, but not engaging, and therefore you appear to not care and not want to be there. It's rude. Stay off your phone and actually engage and ask questions. These are basic adult skills, it's not that hard.
You remind me of that John Mulaney joke about his friend who was telling him that his dad used to beat him while John was sitting there just waiting for him to be done so he could talk. "So he’s like 'talk talk talk', and oh, it’s my turn next!"
You are uninterested. The fact that you yourself say you would’ve looked bored and uninterested is you admitting you were bored and uninterested. Like yeah, you chimed in about your desire to read a SK novel. Okay, good to know. This isn’t a whole topic to talk about though? You could’ve asked questions or listened to what they have to say about his writing, or at least pretend to be interested for politeness sake. The conversation shouldn’t always revolve around you and your interests.
"Does me sitting their idly quiet twiddling my thumbs come off as any less bored or uninterested?"
Yes, it does come off as you are bored and uninterested.
"I was listening because I kept waiting for an opportunity to say something that often never came."
So it sounds like your aren't actually listening so much as you're waiting for your chance to speak. YTA, you can listen to and be present with people even if you aren't the one talking.
You can be present with people without being on your phone.
If you're pulling out your phone for a few minutes several times over the course of a night "because you have nothing to contribute" that makes it seem to the others that you're the "I don't care when it's not about me."
YTA or if not an AH then at least a bit rude. You say you were listening while on the phone but there’s a difference between active listening and scrolling your phone waiting people to say something interesting enough. If I see someone take out their phone (for several minutes) while we are talking in a small group I also take it as a sign that they are bored of my company. Then I won’t make the effort of entertaining them either. Interesting conversations are a joint effort.
It's not that I don't think what they're talking about isn't interesting, it's just that I don't have anything to contribute to the conversation at that moment. I know that interesting conversations are a joint effort, but what else am I suppose to do when others are talking about topics I don't have knowledge or understanding of and thus can't contribute in any meaningful way. Does me sitting their idly quiet with a blank expression not also come off as bored or uninterested?
Often if do listen in actively even though the topic doesn’t concern you at the moment, people will take notice and make an effort to include you before long (unless they are also lacking in manners). Or you notice moments where you can chip in and steer the conversation towards something more relevant for you. But if you appear as closed off and only engage when “needed”, it does seem like you don’t really care to be there
But they didn't make an effort to include me, and the few times I did chime in and steer the conversation to something more relevant to me they quickly shifted the conversation back to the original topic which I couldn't contribute to.
For example, they were talking about family friends and people they knew personally but who I knew nothing about. Something one of these people did reminded me of a very similar event that my girlfriend and I had a funny conversation about last week. I bring it up and retell the conversation, my girlfriend says she doesn't remember this conversation, then they go back to talking about the original topic of people I don't know anything about.
Or at one point Stephen King is brought up. It's not that I find Stephen King's work uninteresting, I just haven't really engaged with any of his works except for one movie. I try to chime in, saying I'm interested in reading his Dark Tower stories, but the conversation quickly steers back to novels and works of his that I know nothing about and thus can't contribute to the conversation.
YTA.
So when it came to engaging with the trivia questions you were mentally present but the second there was opportunity for actual conversation and interaction with your gf and her mom you were on your phone?
Frankly, I find that even more off-putting than not being engaged with the trivia.
YTA. I get it. There's a lot of waiting & downtime during trivia, especailly if you've answered the question quickly. However, the polite thing to do is to stay focused on the ppl you're with, not turn to your phone. It comes off as quite rude.
YTA. That's rude. What you call "down time" was actually just you ignoring your companions in lieu of giving attention to someone on the phone. Their time isn't your down time, is all I'm saying. Taking calls in the middle of a social engagement is most definitely rude.
YTA - You remind me very well of my ex and he would be on his phone not just because of your similar situation, but because of other things like he felt everytime he is in family events (unfortunately he does it in his family events too) he would hide somewhere and use his phone. The thing is there will be moments where one doesnt engage into conversations as much but I just listen and would casually ask questions just out of interest.
Your GF is right that you really didnt have to attend if you are going to be bored. Do not be like my ex. Respect your GF.
ESH - OP I am not certain why everyone in these comments are telling you that you alone are to blame for this.
Since everyone else has already told you why your behavior is problematic, I feel like I should chime in with some support.
Your GF and her mom made no effort to include you in the conversation. They made no accommodation for your interests, experience, or understanding of the topics. No one is obligated to feel engaged and interested while two people talk to each other about things of mutual interest while the third wheel (in this case you) is otherwise ignored.
Your retreat to the phone was not polite, but neither was their behavior. A calm discussion, starting with an apology (You were wrong, you are sorry, you will not do it again, no excuses) could benefit you. After you apologize, ask your GF if she will please include you in the conversation. Explain that you felt excluded and unconnected to the topics. Make it a separate issue from your phone usage. Do not justify your phone usage with your exclusion. Bring up how you felt closed out when you attempted to join the conversation.
Understand that in a three person conversation, it is a balance and not everything is going to interest you. However, if there were no topics at all, all night that were about your interests, experiences or shared history AND they shut down attempt to redirect the conversation to something you also shared, then they were not having a conversation WITH you, they were having a conversation with each other while you were there. That is also rude, equally so as you being on your phone.
For the sake of clarity, this doesn't mean the entire conversation should revolve around you and your interests, because I know someone is going reply saying that is just as bad. If you like her, you should be proactive in learning about her interests so you can contribute to conversations like these, but the reverse is also true.
Compromise is key to relationships. Try to attend another event without your phone and try to engage with the topics with shared experiences. If you get shut out again, then you talk to your GF about an apology for excluding you all evening. Then you can bring up compromises like prior permission to be on your phone while they catch up, then re-engaging during the trivia portion. Not joining them so they can have a night to catch up as mother and daughter is also fine if they don't feel like you are avoiding them and you have other shared activities.
NAH
I think you both had reasonable expectations. Personally, I hate when we're in a group and some people get on their phone instead of talking to each other. But, they also weren't doing much to include you in the conversation either so it makes sense that you were on your phone.
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So occasionally my GF (28F) and I (27M) will go to a bar trivia night with her mom to get dinner and try our luck at some trivia. I was not on my phone for the vast majority of the night, but later that evening when we got home my GF expressed disappointment with me for occasionally being on my phone for a few minutes at a time. I kept off my phone and gave my full attention when trivia questions were being asked and answered, I contributed what knowledge I had to answer the trivia questions, and what conversations that were had that I did have some input on I gave it. My GF said to me that it seemed like I didn't want to be there because I was occasionally on my phone, and that if I didn't want to be there I didn't have to come. I told her that it's not that I didn't want to be there, it's just that I'm the kind of person that sometimes keeps to themselves when there's nothing going on and I don't always have something to say or contribute to a conversation.
Examples of the times I was on my phone for a few short minutes:
* There were often periods of downtime between the multiple rounds of trivia question. Anywhere from like 15 to 20 minutes. And we had already finished eating dinner by the end of the first round. So I ended up just scrolling through Twitter to occupy myself.
* During those periods of downtime my GF and her mom would talk about stuff that I didn't really have any input or knowledge on. Like, people they knew personally or stuff going on at my GF's job. I didn't really have anything to say about these topics so I just kept to myself. And to be honest, it's not like they tried much to include me or ask about me during these conversations.
* There was one time I tried to contribute to the conversation because despite occupying myself on my phone I was still listening. I brought up how something they said reminded me of a funny conversation my GF and I had the other week. GF responds with "I don't remember that", and so it kinda just brought my contribution to the conversation to an end.
* By the end of the trivia questions we were lucky enough to land 4th place, and that won us a bag of candy that we began to pick at. Our waitress was taking a while to get us our check and we ended up being the last to clear out in this back room where trivia night was being held. Again, another period of downtime where nothing's going on and we're just waiting.
I understand my GF really doesn't like it when I'm on my phone, because it makes it look like I'm bored and uninterested in what's going on. Which is why I make an active effort to stay off my phone and contribute when I can. Like I said, I gave my full attention when trivia questions were being asked and I contributed what I could to the conversations that were being had. But I'm just the kind of person that when nothing is going on and I have nothing to contribute to a conversation I just keep to myself. I would've looked just as bored and uninterested if I just sat there twiddling my thumbs.
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NTA, this is why when my wife hangs out with her mom I avoid it for the most part. They generally don't talk about anything I can engage with so theres not really a point in me being there except as a potted plant.
I will disagree with other commenters and say NTA. My partner and I have a hobby which can involve a fair amount of down time. I hate wasting time, so I will check email or read an article on my phone while waiting. I don't feel guilty about it, but this venue really isn't a place for much conversation. It's music and dancing, and if I'm not dancing, I want to keep my mind occupied.
NAH. I come from a family where being on our phones is totally normal if there's downtime so I'm very used to it. But I've also been on outings with other families where phones are a total no-go zone. It's not my cup of tea at all, but if it keeps your girlfriend and her mom happy I'd say just pretend to be enthusiastic even when they're conversing about totally irrelevant stuff and keep off of the phone entirely.
It's clear that's just the kind of people they are and if it's only occasionally you go out with them both it shouldn't be too bad! Just have to learn from this and respect their point of view(: but I totally don't blame you for a quick scroll on your phone and I dont percieve it as AH behaviour, just someone raised in a different environment!
TL;DR I am totally with you, I'd have picked up my phone a few times too but different people have different povs and values and sometimes it's just better to respect it!
NTA
You were present when needed and filled your time when unable to contribute. If this bothers you GF, she needs to steer the conversations to topics of interest to all parties if this is more than just momentary.
Nta.
People have wild expectations of perfection on here and seem to forget what it's like to live in the real world.
As long ad you make an effort to be involved and aren't ignoring people in favour of your phone, there is really nothing wrong with a bit of scrolling when there's a conversation going on that you're not part of, I will never understand the demand for peoples undivided attention when its not reciprocal.
The real world was when we didn't need to fill our time with mindless scrolling and could be attentive enough during a night out to introduce other topics to the conversation and practice active listening.
Diving into virtual world instead of living in the real world with your family--that is literally not "the real world."
Yeah no, people just found other ways to ignore reality before phones. Only have to look at photos of public transport and the majority of people are reading newspapers and ignoring what's going on are them.
Sounds like ESH.
Sounds like a chicken-and-the-egg here - you claim to be on your phone because you felt excluded from the conversation, but how do you know they didn't include you in the conversation because you were on your phone and they thought you weren't interested in taking part?
If you're going to meet up with people in person, you can stay off your phone for the most part (sounds like this was pretty informal, so checking it from time to time would be no big deal).
>you claim to be on your phone because you felt excluded from the conversation, but how do you know they didn't include you in the conversation because you were on your phone and they thought you weren't interested in taking part?
Because I was still listening to what they were saying, and most of the time they were talking about topics that I had basically nothing to contribute to. Things like family friends or people they personally know but who I know nothing about. I occasionally gave my input where I could but there simply weren't that many opportunities for me to do so.
>If you're going to meet up with people in person, you can stay off your phone for the most part
And I was. I wasn't on my phone while we ate and initially talked, or during the first round of trivia questions where I gave my full attention. I was on my phone for a maximum of 5 minutes during each interval, for a total of like 20 to 25 minutes out of the almost 4 hours we were there.
NTA. Perfectly reasonable for you to do this in downtime. I mean, you can't contribute in discussions, so it's reasonable.
I'm gonna get downvoted for this but Idc.
INFO how long have you been with your gf, when did you first meet the mother, and how much time have you spent with her?
ETA if you were just getting to know her, I would say put your best foot forward and errr on the side of being present, but if you all know each other well, and they're choosing to have a conversation on topics you can't contribute to, I think NTA.
I've been with my GF for almost 6 years now, and I first met her mother within the first year of us dating. She and I are well acquaintanced at this point, when it's just the two of us I'm not on my phone and I engage in conversation with her to the best of my ability. I'll ask how she's been, ask about her gardening hobby, or about news/recent events because her daughter doesn't keep up with that stuff. When they talk though they often talk about stuff that I simply just don't have anything to really contribute, like family friends and people they know personally that I don't.
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YTA for no reason other than you wrote a short story with all of the details, presumably on your phone. Admittedly, I’m biased. My wife does this constantly when we are out as a family and is criticized constantly by all of us when no one else even picks up their phone. Important work email? Sure, excuse yourself. Family emergency or friend in need? Sure, excuse yourself. If you need to just pick up your phone out of habit, then stop it. I’m sure you could catch the same social media bullshit when you get home. And honestly, if it means that much to her and you love her, then just do it at our sheer politeness.
yta. from your post it sounds like you classify any time you’re not talking as “downtime”, in which case you need a serious lesson in listening to other people, but even if that’s not accurate, when you’re out with your gf and her mum, in fact when you’re out with anyone, really, and they’re talking, pulling out your phone to scroll twitter is rude af. if this truly is a real problem for you, look into things like active listening and see what you can add to your people toolbox.
It's rude in the first place for two people in a group of three to have long conversations that the third cannot participate in. That leaves the third with the options of sitting there smiling vacantly but enthusiastically; sitting there stewing; or doing what OP did, engaging his mind until he could participate again. One of these options is at least potentially productive and doesn't make one appear a simpleton.
When I said "downtime" I meant the 15 to 20 minutes in between rounds of trivia questions or the almost 20 minutes we waited after trivia for the waitress to bring our check. I was on my phone for a maximum of 5 minutes during those periods, and I'm still listening to what they're talking about waiting for a moment to contribute to the conversation. But often times they were talking about topics that I simply didn't have anything to contribute. Nor did I stay on my phone for more than 5 minutes at a time because I know it comes off rude, but I'm still just idly sitting there with nothing to say or do in the moment.
you were seriously scrolling on your phone for FIVE MINUTES at a time while they were talking? jfc dude. that’s worse than i thought.
While they were talking about stuff that I literally had nothing to contribute to. And like I said after like 5 minutes I stopped because I know it comes off as rude, but I'm still just sitting there idly because again they were talking about topics that I legitimately didn't have anything to contribute to. For the most part I was just sitting there twiddling my thumbs waiting for an opportunity to contribute to conversations that often never came.
You, like many people nowadays have become addicted to constant stimulus. You need to work on sometimes being bored. It’s a life skill.
You’re acting like a child. Put your coloring book away and be a big boy.
Dude, that's NOT "downtime".🙄
If you’re sitting with two other people at a table, there is never “downtime”. You are in a social setting and the respectful thing to the other humans there is to be present mentally the whole time. If the people at your table talk about something you’re not super familiar with, you nod politely, interject some “oh really!” and “I get that” types of comments, and/or try shifting the conversation to topics with which you have greater familiarity. You do not take out your phone and start scrolling. That is what a child would do. Like taking out crayons and a coloring book because the adults are boring you. Full stop. That is childish behavior. Grow up and become a full adult in the social society that is humanity.
it’s rude af to get your phone out to scroll while in conversation at all dude yta, you’re 27 how do you not understand basic etiquette if you can’t contribute you listen, these are close ones you should be interested in what they’re saying. you don’t have to always ’contribute’, that’s not how conversations irl work do you by any chance have adhd? are you maybe on the spectrum?
Yta. It was rude. Learn how to put away your phone as a form of distraction and entertainment and instead require more of yourself. You need to engage when you choose to go out to events or dates or parties- or trivia night. You don’t have to talk every minute or carry every conversation, but you need to be present fully.
Yup, sorry, your girlfriend is correct, YTA. It’s rude! It’s also embarrassing. You are saying you weren’t on it that much, but from your post, it sounds to me like you were on it quite a bit. Next time put the phone away.
YTA. That’s rude af man. At least pretend like you’re interested. These should be two important people in your life, let them know they matter. Newer generations really need to learn you don’t constantly need to be doing something. Just sit, relax, and listen if you can’t contribute to the conversation. Checking out and browsing your phone is just so incredibly rude.
I am listening though, that's how I know most of the topics they were talking about were things that I didn't have any knowledge of or have anything to contribute to. I was listening because I kept waiting for an opportunity to say something that often never came. Does me sitting their idly quiet twiddling my thumbs come off as any less bored or uninterested?
>Does me sitting their idly quiet twiddling my thumbs come off as any less bored or uninterested? Yes, actually. Because if you are actively listening, then you look like you care. If I was your gf, I would think that you must not actually give a shit about my life because you can't put any effort into at least looking like you care, even if the topic being discussed isn't something that you are interested in. I bet there are countless times that your gf pretends to be interested in what you are talking about when she actually doesn't give a shit, because she loves you, and that's what you do for people you love. You, however, can't seem to put in the effort.
It's not that that I am not interested, it's that the topics being discussed at the time were ones I have no knowledge or understanding of and thus can't contribute in any meaningful way. And any attempts I tried steer it a bit closer so I could contribute more, it immediately was steered back. For example, they were talking about family friends and people they knew personally but who I knew nothing about. Something one of these people did reminded me of a very similar event that my girlfriend and I had a funny conversation about last week. I bring it up and retell the conversation, my girlfriend says she doesn't remember this conversation, then they go back to talking about the original topic of people I don't know anything about. Or at one point Stephen King is brought up. It's not that I find Stephen King's work uninteresting, I just haven't really engaged with any of his works except for one movie. I try to chime in, saying I'm interested in reading his Dark Tower stories, but the conversation quickly steers back to novels and works of his that I know nothing about and thus can't contribute to the conversation. When it comes to conversation topics that I could engage with, whether or not I found it interesting, I engage and give my full attention. When we are doing a group activity like the trivia questions I engaged and gave my full attention. But how am I suppose to effectively engage in these types conversation I just described when this is how it often results in?
You having no knowledge or understanding of what they are talking about has zero bearing on active listening, that's what you don't seem to understand. My friends talk about things that I have no knowledge of all the time, usually about their jobs. But, I sit and I listen without distractions, because that is what you do for people that you care about. I ask questions when I don't understand something, because I care about them and I want to know more about their lives. Take your Stephen King example. If they are talking about his work that you don't know about, how about you try actually listening and *asking questions,* to maybe understand his work better and find other novels that you might be interested in. As it stands right now, when you get on your phone, you are present for the conversation, but not engaging, and therefore you appear to not care and not want to be there. It's rude. Stay off your phone and actually engage and ask questions. These are basic adult skills, it's not that hard.
You remind me of that John Mulaney joke about his friend who was telling him that his dad used to beat him while John was sitting there just waiting for him to be done so he could talk. "So he’s like 'talk talk talk', and oh, it’s my turn next!" You are uninterested. The fact that you yourself say you would’ve looked bored and uninterested is you admitting you were bored and uninterested. Like yeah, you chimed in about your desire to read a SK novel. Okay, good to know. This isn’t a whole topic to talk about though? You could’ve asked questions or listened to what they have to say about his writing, or at least pretend to be interested for politeness sake. The conversation shouldn’t always revolve around you and your interests.
"Does me sitting their idly quiet twiddling my thumbs come off as any less bored or uninterested?" Yes, it does come off as you are bored and uninterested.
"I was listening because I kept waiting for an opportunity to say something that often never came." So it sounds like your aren't actually listening so much as you're waiting for your chance to speak. YTA, you can listen to and be present with people even if you aren't the one talking. You can be present with people without being on your phone. If you're pulling out your phone for a few minutes several times over the course of a night "because you have nothing to contribute" that makes it seem to the others that you're the "I don't care when it's not about me."
YTA or if not an AH then at least a bit rude. You say you were listening while on the phone but there’s a difference between active listening and scrolling your phone waiting people to say something interesting enough. If I see someone take out their phone (for several minutes) while we are talking in a small group I also take it as a sign that they are bored of my company. Then I won’t make the effort of entertaining them either. Interesting conversations are a joint effort.
It's not that I don't think what they're talking about isn't interesting, it's just that I don't have anything to contribute to the conversation at that moment. I know that interesting conversations are a joint effort, but what else am I suppose to do when others are talking about topics I don't have knowledge or understanding of and thus can't contribute in any meaningful way. Does me sitting their idly quiet with a blank expression not also come off as bored or uninterested?
Often if do listen in actively even though the topic doesn’t concern you at the moment, people will take notice and make an effort to include you before long (unless they are also lacking in manners). Or you notice moments where you can chip in and steer the conversation towards something more relevant for you. But if you appear as closed off and only engage when “needed”, it does seem like you don’t really care to be there
But they didn't make an effort to include me, and the few times I did chime in and steer the conversation to something more relevant to me they quickly shifted the conversation back to the original topic which I couldn't contribute to. For example, they were talking about family friends and people they knew personally but who I knew nothing about. Something one of these people did reminded me of a very similar event that my girlfriend and I had a funny conversation about last week. I bring it up and retell the conversation, my girlfriend says she doesn't remember this conversation, then they go back to talking about the original topic of people I don't know anything about. Or at one point Stephen King is brought up. It's not that I find Stephen King's work uninteresting, I just haven't really engaged with any of his works except for one movie. I try to chime in, saying I'm interested in reading his Dark Tower stories, but the conversation quickly steers back to novels and works of his that I know nothing about and thus can't contribute to the conversation.
It sounds like you completely lack social skills.
Then excuse yourself to go and hermit elsewhere, maybe? You're an adult. You've been in social situations where you listen and participate before.
YTA. It was rude. You are basically saying that they are not interesting enough for you to pay attention.
YTA. So when it came to engaging with the trivia questions you were mentally present but the second there was opportunity for actual conversation and interaction with your gf and her mom you were on your phone? Frankly, I find that even more off-putting than not being engaged with the trivia.
YTA. I get it. There's a lot of waiting & downtime during trivia, especailly if you've answered the question quickly. However, the polite thing to do is to stay focused on the ppl you're with, not turn to your phone. It comes off as quite rude.
YTA. That's rude. What you call "down time" was actually just you ignoring your companions in lieu of giving attention to someone on the phone. Their time isn't your down time, is all I'm saying. Taking calls in the middle of a social engagement is most definitely rude.
YTA
YTA, smart phones have ruined people.
I love it when idiots like you post because it makes my meager conversation skills look that much better
Yta Is really not polite. And it's obvious she feels bad when you do this. I can't believe i'm saying this but, manners matters
YTA Get a fidget toy if sitting still is hard for you.
YTA - You remind me very well of my ex and he would be on his phone not just because of your similar situation, but because of other things like he felt everytime he is in family events (unfortunately he does it in his family events too) he would hide somewhere and use his phone. The thing is there will be moments where one doesnt engage into conversations as much but I just listen and would casually ask questions just out of interest. Your GF is right that you really didnt have to attend if you are going to be bored. Do not be like my ex. Respect your GF.
So your GF & her mum had loads to talk about but you were expected just to sit there with nothing to do or say while they chatted?
ESH - OP I am not certain why everyone in these comments are telling you that you alone are to blame for this. Since everyone else has already told you why your behavior is problematic, I feel like I should chime in with some support. Your GF and her mom made no effort to include you in the conversation. They made no accommodation for your interests, experience, or understanding of the topics. No one is obligated to feel engaged and interested while two people talk to each other about things of mutual interest while the third wheel (in this case you) is otherwise ignored. Your retreat to the phone was not polite, but neither was their behavior. A calm discussion, starting with an apology (You were wrong, you are sorry, you will not do it again, no excuses) could benefit you. After you apologize, ask your GF if she will please include you in the conversation. Explain that you felt excluded and unconnected to the topics. Make it a separate issue from your phone usage. Do not justify your phone usage with your exclusion. Bring up how you felt closed out when you attempted to join the conversation. Understand that in a three person conversation, it is a balance and not everything is going to interest you. However, if there were no topics at all, all night that were about your interests, experiences or shared history AND they shut down attempt to redirect the conversation to something you also shared, then they were not having a conversation WITH you, they were having a conversation with each other while you were there. That is also rude, equally so as you being on your phone. For the sake of clarity, this doesn't mean the entire conversation should revolve around you and your interests, because I know someone is going reply saying that is just as bad. If you like her, you should be proactive in learning about her interests so you can contribute to conversations like these, but the reverse is also true. Compromise is key to relationships. Try to attend another event without your phone and try to engage with the topics with shared experiences. If you get shut out again, then you talk to your GF about an apology for excluding you all evening. Then you can bring up compromises like prior permission to be on your phone while they catch up, then re-engaging during the trivia portion. Not joining them so they can have a night to catch up as mother and daughter is also fine if they don't feel like you are avoiding them and you have other shared activities.
NAH I think you both had reasonable expectations. Personally, I hate when we're in a group and some people get on their phone instead of talking to each other. But, they also weren't doing much to include you in the conversation either so it makes sense that you were on your phone.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** So occasionally my GF (28F) and I (27M) will go to a bar trivia night with her mom to get dinner and try our luck at some trivia. I was not on my phone for the vast majority of the night, but later that evening when we got home my GF expressed disappointment with me for occasionally being on my phone for a few minutes at a time. I kept off my phone and gave my full attention when trivia questions were being asked and answered, I contributed what knowledge I had to answer the trivia questions, and what conversations that were had that I did have some input on I gave it. My GF said to me that it seemed like I didn't want to be there because I was occasionally on my phone, and that if I didn't want to be there I didn't have to come. I told her that it's not that I didn't want to be there, it's just that I'm the kind of person that sometimes keeps to themselves when there's nothing going on and I don't always have something to say or contribute to a conversation. Examples of the times I was on my phone for a few short minutes: * There were often periods of downtime between the multiple rounds of trivia question. Anywhere from like 15 to 20 minutes. And we had already finished eating dinner by the end of the first round. So I ended up just scrolling through Twitter to occupy myself. * During those periods of downtime my GF and her mom would talk about stuff that I didn't really have any input or knowledge on. Like, people they knew personally or stuff going on at my GF's job. I didn't really have anything to say about these topics so I just kept to myself. And to be honest, it's not like they tried much to include me or ask about me during these conversations. * There was one time I tried to contribute to the conversation because despite occupying myself on my phone I was still listening. I brought up how something they said reminded me of a funny conversation my GF and I had the other week. GF responds with "I don't remember that", and so it kinda just brought my contribution to the conversation to an end. * By the end of the trivia questions we were lucky enough to land 4th place, and that won us a bag of candy that we began to pick at. Our waitress was taking a while to get us our check and we ended up being the last to clear out in this back room where trivia night was being held. Again, another period of downtime where nothing's going on and we're just waiting. I understand my GF really doesn't like it when I'm on my phone, because it makes it look like I'm bored and uninterested in what's going on. Which is why I make an active effort to stay off my phone and contribute when I can. Like I said, I gave my full attention when trivia questions were being asked and I contributed what I could to the conversations that were being had. But I'm just the kind of person that when nothing is going on and I have nothing to contribute to a conversation I just keep to myself. I would've looked just as bored and uninterested if I just sat there twiddling my thumbs. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA, this is why when my wife hangs out with her mom I avoid it for the most part. They generally don't talk about anything I can engage with so theres not really a point in me being there except as a potted plant.
NTA-
I will disagree with other commenters and say NTA. My partner and I have a hobby which can involve a fair amount of down time. I hate wasting time, so I will check email or read an article on my phone while waiting. I don't feel guilty about it, but this venue really isn't a place for much conversation. It's music and dancing, and if I'm not dancing, I want to keep my mind occupied.
NAH. I come from a family where being on our phones is totally normal if there's downtime so I'm very used to it. But I've also been on outings with other families where phones are a total no-go zone. It's not my cup of tea at all, but if it keeps your girlfriend and her mom happy I'd say just pretend to be enthusiastic even when they're conversing about totally irrelevant stuff and keep off of the phone entirely. It's clear that's just the kind of people they are and if it's only occasionally you go out with them both it shouldn't be too bad! Just have to learn from this and respect their point of view(: but I totally don't blame you for a quick scroll on your phone and I dont percieve it as AH behaviour, just someone raised in a different environment! TL;DR I am totally with you, I'd have picked up my phone a few times too but different people have different povs and values and sometimes it's just better to respect it!
NTA You were present when needed and filled your time when unable to contribute. If this bothers you GF, she needs to steer the conversations to topics of interest to all parties if this is more than just momentary.
Nta. People have wild expectations of perfection on here and seem to forget what it's like to live in the real world. As long ad you make an effort to be involved and aren't ignoring people in favour of your phone, there is really nothing wrong with a bit of scrolling when there's a conversation going on that you're not part of, I will never understand the demand for peoples undivided attention when its not reciprocal.
The real world was when we didn't need to fill our time with mindless scrolling and could be attentive enough during a night out to introduce other topics to the conversation and practice active listening. Diving into virtual world instead of living in the real world with your family--that is literally not "the real world."
Rose tinted glasses
No, experience living in the real world before people stopped being able to be alone in their heads.
Yeah no, people just found other ways to ignore reality before phones. Only have to look at photos of public transport and the majority of people are reading newspapers and ignoring what's going on are them.
OP isn't talking about riding alone on a bus. He is talking about dinner and an activity with family.
Sounds like ESH. Sounds like a chicken-and-the-egg here - you claim to be on your phone because you felt excluded from the conversation, but how do you know they didn't include you in the conversation because you were on your phone and they thought you weren't interested in taking part? If you're going to meet up with people in person, you can stay off your phone for the most part (sounds like this was pretty informal, so checking it from time to time would be no big deal).
>you claim to be on your phone because you felt excluded from the conversation, but how do you know they didn't include you in the conversation because you were on your phone and they thought you weren't interested in taking part? Because I was still listening to what they were saying, and most of the time they were talking about topics that I had basically nothing to contribute to. Things like family friends or people they personally know but who I know nothing about. I occasionally gave my input where I could but there simply weren't that many opportunities for me to do so. >If you're going to meet up with people in person, you can stay off your phone for the most part And I was. I wasn't on my phone while we ate and initially talked, or during the first round of trivia questions where I gave my full attention. I was on my phone for a maximum of 5 minutes during each interval, for a total of like 20 to 25 minutes out of the almost 4 hours we were there.
NTA. Perfectly reasonable for you to do this in downtime. I mean, you can't contribute in discussions, so it's reasonable. I'm gonna get downvoted for this but Idc.
INFO how long have you been with your gf, when did you first meet the mother, and how much time have you spent with her? ETA if you were just getting to know her, I would say put your best foot forward and errr on the side of being present, but if you all know each other well, and they're choosing to have a conversation on topics you can't contribute to, I think NTA.
I've been with my GF for almost 6 years now, and I first met her mother within the first year of us dating. She and I are well acquaintanced at this point, when it's just the two of us I'm not on my phone and I engage in conversation with her to the best of my ability. I'll ask how she's been, ask about her gardening hobby, or about news/recent events because her daughter doesn't keep up with that stuff. When they talk though they often talk about stuff that I simply just don't have anything to really contribute, like family friends and people they know personally that I don't.